Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Here.

I am here. Um, I will entertain a motion to excuse those two fine young or fine young young individuals. Feel like I should be the one to make that motion. I'll entertain one. I'll make that motion. If we're calling down, I'll make the motion. All in favor say I. I. So be it. Uh I will also entertain a motion to approve tonight's agenda. Any discussion? All in favor say I. I. Oh, wait. Is there support? Sport.

All in favor say I.

I. All oppose the same. The agenda is approved. Okay. We have two uh minutes from September 8th and September 15. I think we can uh take a motion to approve both of these minutes from these previous meetings. I will entertain that motion. Is there support? Any discussion? All in favor say I. I all oppose the same. Those two minutes are approved. Okay. At this time, I'd like to open it up to anybody uh in the public for items not on the agenda, any concerns that you might have that's that are going around or that you have questions about. Uh if you do come up, please state your name and address.

My name is Jody Horton. I live soon told me that this was also a time address it on the thing that I'm concerned about. We will get to that. I'll let you speak uh during that time. Do you want me to wait? Let's wait for that. This is my first official planning meeting. So, welcome.

Uh so, under Yeah, old business was a notice public hearing. So we can uh we can address your comments on 1401 West Main when we get to that point on the which will be very shortly. We'll give the uh the people a chance to explain and then any comments. Okay. Thank you. Any other uh comments of things not on the agenda tonight? Any concerns? Okay, I close that public comment section. Now, old business 1401 West Main. Andy, so briefly, can you explain what is going on?

Yep. So, this is the Tommy's car wash that was approved by the planning commission in August, we realized after you guys had made that decision that uh so that is a special use in the C3 district and we did not notice properly for public hearing. So, we basically had to re to renotice it to follow the requirements of the zoning ordinance. So basically are just going to reconsider the same item. Um that's why the our staff report from August on this was included in your planning commission packets. They haven't made any changes to the site other than um they added the requested landscaping which we do have. I don't know if you're prepared to talk about that. I know it sounded like you were sort of maybe prepared to but if you want to address that briefly otherwise that's really all this is. It's not um We need to make sure that we're following the ordinance correctly and following process. So that's why we renoticed it. So if um Mr. Ho Yes. If you can come up and just maybe quickly go over the update to the landscaping plan that um you guys made based on your requirements at August. Um then we can accept public comments on the application.

Yeah. Good evening everyone. My name is Chuck We are the civil engineer planner and survey for this project as was summarized as my understanding as well is last time discussed however so I'm here tonight on behalf of Steve Whitty the uh civil engineer on the project he downloaded me a little on the situation. I'm going to be here tonight already some new business. So that's why I'm here. He explained to me that uh there was some additional landscaping uh that was required to happen. I want to say that. So my understanding is that was intended to be adequate for what was discussed for the additional landscaping needed on the site. I don't know that there were any other sites site plan changes uh made to the project. Um but we're here tonight to uh listen for any comments that you might have or any comments from the public and um if any changes are necessary going forward to consider those.

Thank you. We pretty much approved everything besides the landscaping thing. It's good to see that that change. I appreciate that.

Yes, that's correct. So, in so the meeting was on August 11th, you approved it with um six conditions um seven conditions. Um basically, so they're pretty much the standard conditions. So, um pay their fees, comply with requirements of the other city departments. um other state federal statutes. Um any signage must meet the requirements of chapter 20. No sign in the clear vision area. Lighting needs to comply with your lighting standards. Then the seventh condition was that they need to provide an updated landscaping plan that includes green space or landscaping along the eastern property lines behind the back fields.

So if you look on the plan that's on the screen there on the east side, which is the right side of the site adjacent to that parking lot that's right next door. It's kind of hard to see, but there's like a series of they just look like dots that go up and down on the plan right on that property line. That's what you're uh that's what he's referring to as the as the landscaping that you asked for. Okay.

Yeah. And so, but basically, if you guys were didn't want you, you wanted kind of something there to sort of help more cleanly delineate the property boundary and things like that. And so, that's what they have returned. Um, otherwise the landscaping plan is unchanged. The only observation I would make, and this isn't something we have to spend a lot of time on, is that there is a tree right to the very south of your sign on Main Street right up against the sidewalk. That's probably in the 25 foot clear vision corner. So, you'd have to move it a little bit. Otherwise, everything is the same and everything is fine as far as the site plan and landscaping is concerned. Um so with that, Mr. Chairman, we will need to um open the public hearing and accept any public comment. Um this is a notice public hearing. So if there is a concern that is brought up by by the public or if there's anything further that you know you want to have them address, you can do that. So don't feel like you just stuck accepting what was done previously. If you need to modify something to u make the plan work better, you can do that within reason. Um so don't think that we have to totally ignore you know

so the motion that we made August we have to remake another motion yes that that would be best yes okay so at this point site plan site plan special use

with the same conditions and again if you want to so you could probably delete that seventh one if you're comfortable with the landscaping that's been provided now and of course if you want to add to that for any reason um you can do that as Okay. Thank you. So, right now I'll open it up to the public for any comments or concerns. once again. I do not have the pulse, but I have not talked to anybody that's excited about car washes in a two mile stretch seems a little excessive, but I understand that the property is for sale. But I was wondering if there's any way we could put a caveat or something in there that says that for some reason went out of business every day. Um then he can do something to cover that they want to go out of business or something but just have that big red building. I have only been in for five years so I but I've heard stories about car wash that was on the corner I think where Walgreens is nowhere

for years. So that's just my cent.

Thank you. It's hard to tell McDonald's not to use the yellow. So, it's uh any other public comment concerning this item? to approve this property right there. It's not like something enhance the value of our property.

Thank you, Steve. Any other public comments concerning uh 1401 West M. Okay, then I'm going to close the public hearing and discussion. I like the uh landscaping. It's going to break up that park that I was in today. Yeah, I was in there this afternoon looking at it. I'm like, this is a lot of ashalt, but any other discussion about the site plan? I can we take that motion? Can we take number seven off um or just leave it as is? we can take it off because this is a this is going to be the approval that of controls if you were to approve it. So because in this landscaping plan so if anything I would I would replace condition 7 um it requires landscaping along the eastern property boundary um to just say that the applicant shall modify the landscaping plan to ensure that no signage or something.

Yeah. Well, so there no trees are within the clear vision area. That's my only concern about that that tree down there. I mean, that's it's fine otherwise. And like I don't because there's a lot of rightway right right away there. It's probably not going to be a visual issue, but the ordinance requirement is what it is. And so I'd prefer to have that move to the uh to the east or maybe to the north. I mean, I don't know. They can figure it out.

Well, so they can't there can't be any obstructions taller than like three or four feet within that little triangle there. So I would just rather have it move completely. The sign is probably just outside of it. And if I had to guess, the tree is probably just inside of it. So there might be some utility issues there that dictate where it goes and again it's not a I wouldn't make a big fuss out of it but I think I would just modify that seventh condition to say to say that. Um and then with respect to the comments um from the public so I've I haven't seen something where you know we require someone to like repaint everything if they go out of business. I mean that's just not something that I' I've come across. um understand the sentiment, but I don't I don't know that's if that's something that I'd feel comfortable requiring in approval like this. So, again, I get it, but So, and we want any business to just thrive. Um, so can you read those seven conditions?

Yes. So, so conditions are

so I think you could just do one motion like you've done normally. So you just have motion to approve both the special end use permit and the site plan um for this application with the following conditions which would be number one prior to the issu issuance of any city permits the applicant shall application permit reimburseable escrow and other fees related to the request. Number two the applicant shall comply with any requirements from the area fire department city department of public works city engineer or other approving agencies. Number three, the applicant shall continually comply with all applicable ordinances, codes, and requirements of the city of l. Number four, the proposed special entities shall comply with all applicable federal, state, and local requirements and copies of all applicable permits shall be submitted to the city. Number five, all signage must meet the standards listed in chapter 20 of the zoning ordinance. No sign may be placed in the 25 foot clear vision area and this area shall be illustrated on the site plan. Number six, all outdoor lighting must comply with the standards as provided in section 4.24 of the zoning ordinance. Phototric planning shall be provided that demonstrates compliance with the zoning ordinance. And then number seven would be modified now to state that the applicant shall modify the landscaping plan to ensure that no trees are within the clear vision area.

Any comments, concerns on those conditions? Go ahead and make that motion to accept the site planning special. Do I need to say the whole motion? Uh the special to approve the special land use with the site plan with the seven conditions and the site plan. Approve the site plan and the special land use with those seven conditions.

Any more discussion on this? Sue, can you give me a roll call vote, please? Yes. Yes. Congratulations. Uh, moving on to new business, 119 Lincoln Lake Road, uh, site plan review. Um, Andy, do you want to summarize that and then I'll ask someone up and uh yes, talk about it.

Yep. So, this is um the parcel. We talked about it not too long ago. That is um my computer to catch up here. Um here go. So, we're so right on the the uh souththeast corner of Lincoln Lake and Chattam. So, this is a property that you saw a couple three months ago for a reasonzoning request. If you recall, they asked to reszone to the mixeduse district. That was recommended for approval to the city council and they accepted that recommendation and did approve the reszoning. So this property is now owned mixed use. Um so what they are proposing is to convert so there's a building on the site and they're proposing to convert that building into a seven unit multif family residential building. And so the building footprint is staying the same. took to add a parking lot on the north side of that building there to accommodate um the residents. Um and so I guess that's kind of the the the quick version of what's proposed here. I think I'll let the applicant either builder or the applicant's engineer come up here and kind of present in greater detail what is proposed here and then we can walk through some of the observations from our staff report. Chuck, please come up and uh give us a summary and kind of explain what you think. Um but now the developer here seems to be an ideal spot. mention in the staff reporting this area as

more area. So creating some of that sort of residential density in this area seems to be a good fit for this site. Uh so therefore uh it was resist so everything seems to fall in line for this site. It seems to seems to be a good fit. Um with respect to kind of dimensional standards because it is a existing building a lot of those don't baked in to the site. However we did the appropriate amount of That's really the most substantial site change that you're going to see on the site. So you'll see that we have adequate parking to meet the standard. We have the handicap spot as well site building. Um we've added landscaping along Cadam Street and there's a couple trees at the entry to the site west side as well. Um, so we think that this is a a site plan that kind of beautifies the site that has been underutilized the last several years. We think that this is a good fit for the site. We had support from the planning commission previously. So we're here tonight to just kind of talk specific. I know there's questions about screening and exterior lighting. We can talk about that a little bit as well. Certainly follow up that are necessary. Uh so with that, we'll be here to answer any questions as you guys go through some of the Thank you.

Andy, will you take us through this site plan review?

Yes. So um just a few overall um because the site is on mixed use to building his existing um Mr. Hoy is right most of these site plan requirements don't mean they apply but if they were not met for some reason it would be a legally non-conforming buildings it would be allowed to continue. Now that being said the site is on mixed use so most of the setbacks are zero anyways. Uh we don't we want typically if this were a new construction, we would want this to be close to the street and designed to be a walkable type of project. Um and so I think they by utilizing the existing building on the site. Um and I believe, correct me if I'm wrong, this is a twostory building and you're going to be like inserting a or adding a third floor in into it, right? Okay. Um, so because, you know, they're kind of working within the confines of of the building, adding a floor, um, it's it's doing a lot of what we like to see in that district. Anyways, um, so most of those setbacks and things like that don't apply. If we were to just kind of walk through some of the other comments in our um, report here. So, with respect to landscaping, um the biggest thing to to notice here is that in your zoning ordinance, you do have requirements for um Austrian parking lot landscaping. Our only real area of concern here is on this northern property line. Um during the public hearing to reszone the property there, there's a property owner who lives up here on the there's an empty lot and then there's a house one lot north of that. Um, and there was some some concern there about like headlights and things like that that might shine into their windows, particularly during the winter months when there's not a lot of vegetation or before anything grows up. Um, so we do call your attention to um whatever can be done or maybe uh Mr. Hoy can sort of answer that question for the planning commission just to kind of see um how that's going to work and ensuring that we're not going to be having

headlights going into that that property owner's house. if we can if we can avoid it. Um, other comments here. So, uh, we'll have wall-mounted lights on the building, which is fine. The only comment there is that they have to be fully cut off fixtures. Um, if there aren't going to be any light poles in the parking lot, that's absolutely fine. We would just want to make sure that there's not any light transpassing onto adjacent properties. we have cut off sort of dark dark sky compliant fixtures which which is what you have required for quite a long time. It's not hard to do just making sure that they have the right type of fixture there. Um they had adequate parking in terms of quantity. So this is a multif family building with seven units that requires 14 parking spaces. They have uh proposed 16 parking spaces. Um similarly here uh they have two entrances, one on Lincoln Lake, one on Chadam for the parking lot. And then they also are proposing to connect to the sidewalk here on Lincoln Lake. One observation that we have more broadly about this site, which is kind of interesting, is that if you go um a block a full block to the east and two full blocks to the west, there are sidewalks on the south side of Chadam. this this site and the block that's directly I think to the west have no sidewalks on the south side of the street. Um, so I am I guess pointing out for your observation that you could solve part of this problem by having a sidewalk installed, you know, along the northern property boundary from having it connect from here and run all the way to stopping at this at this property line on the east side. That's going to be a sidewalk to nowhere temporarily, but that does solve about 25% of your sidewalk gap that you have

along that stretch of Chattam right now. So, that is something that we're pointing out as an observation. You can do that, do with that what you will. Any what is there an ordinance that says any kind? I I'll have to check. I don't remember off the top of my head. I don't think so. Um I know we do for some residences. Um and this has a sidewalk on one side. Um so I I can check on that and if you wanted to have that done as a condition of approval, I'm I'm fine with that. Um and sometimes too when there is when there's not a sidewalk to connect to, sometimes there's some flexibility there. And here there is not. But again, so you would have a sidewalk that starts here and then it connects here and then you can have it, you know, hit the street and it would connect to the rest of the of the sidewalk network. So it would be an improvement, but obviously, you know, we can't make them go like all the way right across the block to the to the east or anything like that. So um that's something we can get to that later I think but it's something that we kind of noted there for your just for your discussion. Okay. Um so for the dumpster I think it's in a good location here on the east side of the site. So, we would just want to see what's proposed for the enclosure materials. Uh, typically we like to see at a minimum of six foot um fence with a locking gate. Um, I think the over, you know, the site location is good. It's it's accessible. You can, you know, it's easy to walk to without having to parking lot or anything like that. Um, so the site is

good. We just want to make sure that the the enclosure for it is also acceptable. uh looks looks decent, things like that. Um uh there's also a fence proposed here from uh Chadam running south to this accessory building here that's kind of halfway through through the site. Again, fine with this. Just need to know the height, material, etc. for the fence. Otherwise, uh not a big issue there either. Um, so as far as the site plan review standards go, let's kind of walk through these briefly. So the these are found in section 18.06 of the zoning ordinance. Uh, you must consider these in your review of a site plan. These are not hard standards but considerations. Uh, the first one is that the site will not adversely affect the public health, safety or welfare. uses a structure shall be planned to take into account topography, size of the property, uses on addressing property and so forth. Um, you know, here I think this, you know, the the uses proposed and the structure itself is does take those things into account. This is a site that's been planned for this kind of a use. City has made a priority of, you know, looking for housing opportunities for residents within the city and this helps to accomplish that. Um, especially because it's only a couple blocks from downtown. It's a block off of Main Street. So, uh, we think it fits really well into the overall development pattern of of the city moving forward. Number two, safe, convenient, uncongested, and well- definfined vehicular and pedestrian circulation shall be provided for egress points within the site. Drive streets and other routes shall be designed to promote safe and efficient traffic operations. Uh, we think that's that's well accomplished here. Um, you know, two points of access here might not be necessary, but we do, you know, see some value there just to be able to kind of easily get in or out

from from the site. Sometimes with a with a parking lot only has 14 or 16 spaces in it. You know, two points of ingress in egress might be a little overkill. Um, but again, they have one on each street, so we're not overloading driveways in any certain specific location. And these aren't high traffic streets like main street or something like that where we be super concerned about turning movements with was going to be a fairly low volume uh low volume site. Number three, the arrangement of public or private vehicular and pedestrian connections shall be planned to provide a safe and efficient circulation system for traffic. So um as far as vehicles go, it's built into the grid. Um the site is so that's not really an issue here. the sidewalk we talked about earlier. So, um we certainly appreciate the sidewalk connection to the front door from the sidewalk and kind of from the parking lot. That's that's a that's a good design and thoughtful and so we appreciate that. Um again, we would point out the other sidewalk comments for your discussion moving forward. Number four, removal and alteration of natural features shall be restricted to those areas that are necessary to develop the site. Um here the site's developed basically it's we're not talking about you know clear cutting a bunch of trees or anything like that. So um that's not a concern. The landscaping that's been provided is adequate there and I think fits in well with with with the site because the site is own mixed use. Uh the standards are a bit different and they have provided the parking lot landscaping that um we would require for anybody else. And again, the one observation we have there just relates to what kind of screening you want to see on the north side of that property there. Number five, satisfactory assurance shall be provided that the requirements of all applicable ordinances, codes, and requirements of the city shall be met, which is a which

could be addressed as a condition of approval if you are inclined to approve this. And number five, the general purposes and spirit of this this ordinance, the zoning ordinance and the comprehensive plan of the city shall be maintained. Um so again here we're sort of in this you know limbo between the old master plan and the new master plan which is you know almost done. Um and the new plan which was the primary focus of our analysis here is that we have this uh corridor mixed use future land use designation um that seeks to be less car oriented and more people oriented. We want to make sure that development is walkable. Um, you know, we want to have the flexibility to be able to permit residential projects in certain areas, but knowing that Main Street is likely going to be largely commercial, I think here it works really well to have this site be only a block off of Main Street. So we have sort of this natural decrease in intensity of use going from main street then you have some commercial development then you'd have uh some multif family and then moving forward it transitions into a more traditional single family neighborhood. So uh we feel like the plan is the site plan here is consistent with the city's master plan. Um and and again overall I think this is a really good project that is a great reuse for this building. It's been sitting there for a while and I think it's going to be a significant improvement to this little little corner of the town. So, um, with that, we just have a handful of of questions or observations, landscaping, the fence and dumpster enclosure, and the sidewalk question. Otherwise, who would be comfortable with uh, planning commission approval of the plan tonight? Uh, subject to any any of your concerns or questions. Um, so with that, Mr. Mr. Chairman, I'll turn it back over to you and I'm happy to answer any questions as well. Okay. Thank you, Andy. Uh, any discussions?

I would have to check. Um, you know, certainly we have for, you know, commercial development and stuff like that on Main Street. We have often done that and just said you shall put in a sidewalk or if there's one there, we make sure that they connect the sidewalk to the building or or something like that. So, it's something that this planning commission has been very intentional about for a bunch of years now, making sure that um people have the ability to get around without having to be in a car. So, um that's one of the things why we pointed it out. And obviously, there's sidewalk on the north side of of of Chadam there. And you don't have to go too far to the east or the west to find or sidewalk. So, it kind of made sense to us that, you know, you might want to help fill that in. So I think it's it's a reasonable improvement to make just along that part that's you know continuous with their property.

Correct. I guess that the new master plan promotes walkability. I think I would like to see a sidewalk also on the north side. I think it makes sense to at least connect the sidewalk to that second drive. Yeah.

Okay. Those any more discussion? Yeah. I have a question. Um, on the back what looks to be the back side of the building, there's a little maybe concrete slab. Is that a second exit? Okay. I'm just wondering if there might be value in having a walkway from that to the parking lot for safety reasons. Um, I don't know, Mr. Fireman, if that's an emergency exit. Should there be I think any of the other ones show this little Yeah, I'm going to hit it back up. Yeah, it's just a little

right right here. There. Is that intended to be just like an emergency exit or an actual like daily exit? Okay. There's no sidewalk connecting the parking lot like up here. Okay. Just like a little right here you talking about? Yeah. Just Yeah. And then

yeah, if that's a main entrance to that unit and then ensure that it's well lit as well. I know we don't have an actual lighting plan right now, but ensure that that's lit as well, especially since it's on the backside and fully like enclosed with no visibility to anything. like a studio then kind of studio look.

Okay. Any other discussions? You want to uh read those uh about the sidewalk? Yeah. So So you wanna So for the sidewalk, you want to add a section of sidewalk along the northern property line follow.

Yep. Um, and then we'll also add, we'll say from Lincoln Lake to the eastern property line. We also want a sidewalk connecting east building entrance to the walkway on the north side of the building. Okay. Um, so the only other things just that you didn't talk about would be the dumpster enclosure and the landscaping.

Yeah, I was going to say the landscaping there along Chatham I do think we need to make sure is like fully enclosed. Yeah, I pulled up and not that this property owner is in charge of like the landscaping of that property owner, but they don't have at least not the last Google map image, but they don't have any landscaping in front of their house to help block any of that light. So, um I do want to make sure that that I don't remember exactly how they have it worded, but those that shrubbery I think needs to be more intense than just where are you talking about this? No, along Chadam here. Yeah.

Yeah. They look smaller though. I I mean I don't know what you have intended for those. What do we have here? A screen hedge. I think you have it listed as here. Um yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of windows on that house though. Yeah. It is the side of their house. Yes. with three, four, five, six, seven, eight windows facing each other. So, I know, but I understand her concern. I understand her concern having

You're going to put some vegetation along that to help screen headlights that Okay. Um, yeah, our intent with that screening along Chap Street there was uh to meet the ordinance, but then also to be sensitive to neighboring problems. I'm not gonna be able to stand here and say that every bit of gonna be obscured. It's just the nature of what it is. I mean, ideally, somebody parks a car and they're done. It's a flash of light. I get that. Yeah.

So, we're they may back in those ones facing the building are probably going to be the first taken. But, but again, let's be honest, you know, our intent is to obscure that light as much as possible. And that's what we've done with this plan here. Um, but there may be some light infiltration. Yeah,

that's just the nature of it. That's where kind of their responsibility comes in. If they just have a big blank site with a bunch of windows, they have property to plant trees on their spacer and not to be funny, but curtains and landscaping on their property is something they can mitigate it as well. So, we both work together and again, our intent is to meet the ordinance and to go a little bit extra that, you know, that is a fairly intense uh row of hedges that we have planted there that should grow pretty robust. as much as possible. Okay. I just wanted to make sure they were taller than Yeah. Yeah. They made a little small, but it'll it'll create Great. Do you know the uh the fence on the east side? What the material is going to be made out of?

No, we kind of called it out generically. Accept those.

Do we really make that recommendation usually? Not normally. So, I mean, typically I mean, I'm guessing it'd be like a six foot either vinyl or privacy fence or a shadow box style thing or something. Um, we might have to and you might have to back off a little bit on the height when you get closer to the street just to meet the ordinance because we don't allow a sixoot fence to go all the way up to the street. So it might be something that starts out as like a four foot fence, then you step up to like a six foot fence when you get maybe 15 feet off the property line, but otherwise I we you're right, we typically don't get into privacy

dictating the detail, but we would want to say that it's going to be like a privacy fence and not just an open chain link fence or something like that. The whole point is to provide privacy. So we would wouldn't want something that's mostly transparent. that is specific as a privacy six foot fence along that

section. Makes sense. So we can say that the dumpster enclosure shall be made out of the same shall match. Okay. Any other concerns? Imagine there's only one unit up there.

It's not right against the brick wall. It's inset, is it? Yeah. I did I did see that too. Like short

I just have one quick question and I'm sorry this is just more of a curiosity than anything. Are the floor level ones going to be the ground level ones going to be handicap accessible? Yeah. Okay.

Awesome. Thank you. Can you review those several uh recommendations?

Yes. So, um we have the first four conditions are the same four that we put on everything that you just heard about. So, number one, um they can't do any work on the site until they get a building permit. Number two, they have to pay their fees. Um three, comply with requirements from the fire department, DPW, engineering, and and others. Four, um obtain all applicable permits and upon request for understanding the city. Number five, uh provide additional information on existing and proposed exterior lighting. I can add maybe for staff review so we can make sure that we're taking a look at that. So number six, applicant shall provide more information on the material for the dumpster enclosure. I think we can strike that one and we'll address that in a minute with the fence. So uh new number six currently labeled here as number seven would be a sidewalk shall be installed along the northern property boundary from Lincoln Lake to the eastern property line. Number seven, uh, which is number eight on my list, a sidewalk connecting the eastern building entrance to the walkway on the north side of the building shall be provided. And the last one, number nine on my list, number eight overall would be the applicant shall provide a sixoot privacy fence along the eastern property line. the dumpster enclosure shall match the style of fence. And then I think um I'm going to add so six foot privacy fence along the eastern property lines. I'm going to add meeting the zoning ordinance requirements. I'm going to do that because we can't extend a sixoot fence all the way to the street all the way north on Chad. they're going to have to either cut it a little bit short or

drop it down. Um, so we can work with them on that when the updated site plan comes in. But just just so you know, it's not going to be a full six feet going all the way all the way all all the way forward because that's how we're okay. Any other discussion? Do you want to specify that? Say do you want to specify that as a

I think just any kind of diffusing stuff. Once you get to about five to six feet, you know, so I mean most cars the headlights aren't that tall, but you know, some of the pickup trucks nowadays are like as tall as me. So you Okay. Once they grow up a little bit, I think it'll be it'll be fine. Okay. I will inter entertain a motion to accept this site plan with those conditions. Any Do I have support? Any more discussion? Okay. Voice vote, please. Sue.

Yes.

Yes. Congratulations. And moving on to new business. Uh the new union site plan. Andy, can you summarize what they're going to do? And then we'll call you up. Turn my mic back on. Right on the corner of um Hudson and Maine. I think everybody knows where it is. Um let me get my report up here. So o overall they're not proposing any huge changes to the site but certainly they're looking to make some improvements. Um so what this is as you know I mean this was approved I think originally uh a number of years ago like 2016 maybe.

Yeah I remember they've come across

come back several times with little changes here and there. Some of them they have gone forward with, others they've ended up changing course. So, it looks like what they're proposing to do here is um make some improvements to the west side of the building primarily. Um so, they're going to add they're going to have like uh some additional outdoor seating and outdoor outdoor gathering space and like kind of build like a little guess I want to call a courtyard. I mean, that's not quite the right term with um shipping containers in there. They're going to uh sort of seed and and live grass and a few trees and some of the open spaces that are there both on the um west side of the building and then also a little bit on the east side of the building that's adjacent to Hudson Street. Um so this is a amendment to the site plan. Um, breweries are a special use, but because the uses are really being affected here, um, we're just looking at at site plan adjustments. So, um, I guess with that, we can turn it over to Mr. Veling, who's here to you can talk in more detail about what his plans are and then we can go through our report.

Okay. Tyler, is it? Yeah, we should have met. We should have all met down there.

Yeah, we should. No, thank you for uh taking the time to listen tonight. And uh first I want to apologize that it's taken so long. Bothers me every day that it's not finished yet. So we're looking to get going and looking a little bit nicer over there and just finishing this space. Part of that idea was creating an outdoor area. Um from our feedback from our guests and everything else, they really being outside in that space. It's a unique opportunity that not a lot of the space is available. There's not a lot around it. So, it's kind of set up kind of good for us to be able to do that. And so we're just looking at utilizing that space making it looks like it feel together because we would have covered out there fans that kind of mainly just as having an outdoor bar and food truck

and then we're not really trying to create anything. We have a footprint out there right now. The same. Um, so we don't have a lot of observations on most of these things. Um, couple things that that we would point out. We're happy to see the improvements to landscaping. We It's not too late, but it's getting later in the year. So, I guess just in in terms of timing. Um, you know, we're fine with with what they have shown there for landscaping. It's primarily just grass, but they've got a couple of trees shown, I think, both on the east and west sides of that building. All of that is great. Um if it can't get done this year, we would uh require some kind of a performance guarantee to so so they can proceed, get everything built, and then we can, you know, be, you know, we'll know that it'll get planted in in the spring um when the weather is back to being cooperative again. Um otherwise, you know, we don't have a ton of changes here. It looks like Are you guys proposing a new sign on Hudson? Okay.

Um, so again, we have no problem with any of that. that that's all fine. Um you whatever sign they in in install there would probably want to do something that's a little bit lower profile. But of course, you know, the zoning ordinance allows for um for a couple of different kind of sign types. So that'll be up to them to decide what what what they want to do. But, you know, we agree, you know, everyone's been by there a bunch of times. There's a bunch of kind of scrubby brush and stuff right there on on that corner. So, it'll be great to have have that cleaned up, have some trees planted, some grass installed. Um, and we think it'll look a lot better. Um, so going through those site plan review criteria, same ones that that that we just did. Um, uses proposed will not affect the public health safety and welfare. Uh, the site shall be uh planned to take into account topography, the size of the property, uses on adjoining property, so on and so forth. Um, what they have now works in the C3 district. Um, you know, the outdoor seating and out outdoor gathering area, I think, is is is currently and would be in a logical spot, but you know, really where it makes the most sense. It's most protected from the noise and and and traffic and things like that. Um, the uh overall design of of of the site looks fine. you know, we don't have any details on what the containers would look like. So, um I don't we don't really legislate like colors or anything like that, but we you might want to add something to just sort of if they're going to have a a certain look to them or or or something like that that they just, you know, maintain a a nice appearance. Um

that would be preferable. Yes. Yep. Graffiti can be really cool though. Could do some graffiti storage containers. That'd be cool.

Something compliment. Okay. Um uh number two, safe, convenient, uncongested and well- definfined vehicular and pedestrian circulation shall be provided. Um no real changes there. Um, you know, one of the things that we kind of struggle with with this site is there are some really wide driveways and access isn't access management isn't great just because there's a lot of room that's not, you know, turning movements and things like that are a bit difficult on the site. Um, they're not proposing to change anything and I'm not, you know, I I don't know that that you need to force them to to to do anything, but I would kind of point that out that it can be a challenging site, especially on the on the west side right in front of the building with the intersection being right there. If this were a new site, we'd probably just have to close that entire eastern driveway completely. um because the the turning with the light right there is not ideal from a from a planning and sort of traffic movement perspective. Um number three, the arrangement of private and public or private vehicular and pedestrian connections to existing plant streets is safe and efficient. Um there's no no changes there. Removal or alteration of natural features shall be restricted to those areas that are reasonably necessary to to develop the site. Again, no changes there. If anything, it's going to be a step in the right direction here. They'll be adding more vegetation back to the site, planting some trees. So, we don't have any any concerns with that. Um, again, we mentioned that they would need to provide a performance guarantee if they can't get things planted here about in the next few weeks at this point. Um, which is not hard to do. um they just have to get an estimate written up from a contractor and then the city would just accept like a letter of credit or cash or or bond of that amount plus a

little bit more just to make sure that it gets done next year. Um number five, satisfactory assurance shall be provided that requirements of the city shall be met which could be a condition of approval if you're inclined to approve the plan. Then number six, this uh relates to the consistency with the city's master plan. Um, and again, not a a lot of change there, but this is a commercial site located within a commercial area. Um, you know, with the changes proposed here and some of the improvements to the overall appearance of the site, you know, this can serve as kind of a nice, you know, gateway into the city, especially as you're coming in from the south. So, there's there's a lot of potential here for this property, and we're happy to see uh some improvements get get suggested here. So, um, with that, we did also um recommend Oh, yeah. One last thing. So, this isn't the flood plane district. I don't know how elevationwise where it's at. I think it's it's very minimally in the flood plane. Um, and so I don't know from a building code perspective there might be a a a requirement that those containers be, you know, attached or something has to be done with those. If there is a 100red-year flood, if there was on this property, I don't think we'd be talking about like, you know, four or five feet of water. we're talking about inches of water, but still uh we need to be cognizant of that. And if they're going to occupy, you know, volume, there's a certain amount, I think it's 200 cubic feet, where if you're taking up more space than that in the flood plane, you got to compensate for that elsewhere. I don't know that they would trigger that here. Um, but I would, I guess, suggest reach out to to Eagle or somebody to see if that's something to they would need to take into consideration here, if they would need to get a a permit from the state or anything like that. I don't think they would, but it's possible. And, you know, I want to make sure that we're covering all of our bases there. So, that was the only other other comment. Um, again, here's subject to some of the things we've talked about

tonight. I would be comfortable with an approval uh with with conditions as as suggested. Um, we had proposed I think 10 conditions here. Um, and we can go through those when you're ready. Um, otherwise, Mr. Chair, I'll turn it back over to you for questions or further discussion. Thank you, Andy. Uh, commissioners, any thoughts, concerns? Yeah, I was actually going to ask the area to the west is still additional parking besides what's on this plan, right? Because don't you still have more space that's like just unmarked parking?

It's marked. Uh so yes, this is the parking that's on this location. And then we also own building next door so we can figure out if we needed to. And we've already talked to in the building next door to their I think the dance studio I don't even think we spots our seating required right now and You know, I do think it will be more traffic, but we're not really adding more seats outside Okay, good question.

Oh, yeah. I like Is the food truck still going to be like a rotating mobile or are you planning on having the food truck be more permanent? Now, our intention is to out in the back. But, you know, just have something

mainly your own. Okay. I was kind of worried about pulling a food truck in over all this.

We're over it. Okay. And that's why consistency anything Andy, can you review those uh 10 conditions, correct?

Yep. So, uh some of these we can look at um a couple of these I don't know that we still need as we've kind of gone through this, but so number one, um no work on the site can be undertaken until the building permits been obtained. Number two, we have to pay their fees, uh application permit, escrow, and other fees related to the request. Number three, comply with all local standards and ordinances. Number four, obtain all obtain all required permits including signed permit upon request for copies to the city. Number five, comply with requirements of the fire department um city engineer. Uh number six, planning commission may require the applicant to address concerns and improvements relating to vehicular and or pedestrian circulation or parking. Um if you don't want to do anything with that, I think we can strike number six. Um, number seven. So, we just wrote, "The shipping container shall be painted and designed to be compatible with the existing brewy building in the surrounding area." I think that's consistent with what they're proposing. They're just in something that's compatible.

Okay.

Um, uh, number eight, comply with any requirements by the zoning enforcement officer, engineer, or others related to the flood plane overlay district. Number nine, signage shall comply with chapter 20 and shall be approved by the zoning enforcement officer prior to installation. So since we don't have um an actual, you know, sign permit or we wouldn't know exactly what's proposed in hand um they'll have to just pull a separate sign permit application following the approvals and Sue and I would take a look at it and make sure that it is appropriate in terms of its size and location and illumination and everything else. And then number 10, landscaping shall be installed. This is practicable. City shall require a performance guarantee if land if landscaping cannot be installed in 2025.

Any other conditions you wish to have on there? Yeah. They make a I don't want to call it, but they're a contained

probably would be plumbed in. contain. So they're made to shut and shut off and they're nice looking. They don't need to get Yeah, exactly. We don't want that. I don't want to deal with all that. Yeah, they would look nice and they would be discreet in it.

I'm sorry. I actually had one more question, too. So, thanks, Dave. Um, on your front elevation image, we've got maybe what looks like a plank, a walkway. Are you planning on having like an upper patio balcony or is that just to bring forward like the industrial look with the roof and the shipping container behind it? Actually, the the roof on the front of the building will be coming down the back of the pitch. So the ship container is going okay. Okay.

I know it's it looks like a gang way to the overhang over the food truck and I was just afraid we were going to have like a patio up there or something and we maybe needed to add some stipulations about that. No, it's just a different roof line. Okay. We have kind of some industrial trusses that tie in that way and just make it more open. Okay. I was just getting flashbacks to like that stairwell in the bob when they first opened and Okay. Thank you.

Okay. With those stipulations or recommendations, I will entertain a motion to approve this. Any support? Very good. Any more discussion? Okay. Sue, will you give me a voice vote, please? Yes. Yes. Congratulations.

Okay, let me get to the agenda again. Okay. uh staff report. Sue Andy, a couple things. So, uh the planning commission recommended um approval of the ordinance related to accessory dwelling units to the city council. The city council uh did not adopt that ordinance. Um, so I guess one of the questions for you, um, is that is that something that you want to revisit and make some additional modifications to some additional restrictions, you know, increase setbacks. Do you want to keep working on that or do you want to set it aside for now? So, um, if you commissioner Chambers could probably, you know, provide some additional

Can we, uh, go to next meeting when he's here? Maybe get some feedback. There wasn't a lot of feedback at the meeting. So, did we get any more insights beyond the few comments of the meeting? There were a few

um, you know, concerns about So, the way that we had that drafted was that if you know, if it was in like an accessory, if it was in a d matched accessory building like like over a garage or if it was it its own unit. It could it would have to have the same setbacks as an accessory building which is only like 3 ft. It's pretty pretty small. So, there were some concerns about that in particular. Um some other ones, you know, traffic and some of the other kind of things. I don't remember them off the top of my head, but that's something I think with um with some additional input and maybe being a little more restrictive than than was written in the first draft, that might be something that if we kind of take that back to the drawing board, rework it, send it back to them um for additional, you know, it it could perhaps, you know, get get passed through on a second pass in front of them. So, uh, you can defer that to next month's for discussion. Absolutely. It's fine with me. I

I was going to point out though, I mean, we're at a time, you know, it's ironic. We had that joint meeting that discussed the master plan and then right after that they voted no. But the master plan has 14 references to accessory dwelling units in it. So, it's probably a good time to reconcile if it's not something the city council is interested in. Why are we writing it into the master plan? It's all mentioned in favor of looking at an accessory drawing. Yeah, that's why I think we should maybe put it under old business for next month and have Marty give us a summary. Yeah. I mean, I didn't get the sense Yeah. I didn't get the sense that they were like totally rejecting the idea of ADUs. It was just that they

Yeah, it was just we didn't we didn't like this ordinance. But I I'm under the impression, and I could be wrong, that if we make some adjustments to that moving forward that, you know, we can get there. And the master plan doesn't suggest them in every residential category as well. So, it doesn't say they need to be in R1 through SR, which is what we proposed. You could actually narrow that to some of the larger residential properties potentially. I think it's worth revisiting, but I'd like to see I'd like to hear what Marty has to say.

Yeah, I'd like some more insight, I think, before we work more on it. I'd just hate to spend, you know, two or three more meetings on it if the city council's just a no.

Right. Um the other thing is that uh just as a reminder, I guess, so we had a uh the joint meeting on the master plan. Um, I'm hoping to receive some feedback from the city council on kind of what, if anything, they want to see adjusted in the master plan. Uh, the way the statute requires that the process to work is that if they're if they're going to require any changes, those have to be transmitted back to the planning commission. You have to hold a public hearing on that. So, um, I asked city council to have all of their comments to me by October 27th, I think, in a couple of weeks. So, we've scheduled a second public hearing on the master plan for the November meeting. So, that'll be back on your agenda. You've already recommended it to them once, but I'm I'm I'm predicting that we'll have uh some input from some of the council members about what they would want to see. So, we'll have something for you to look at and say this is what they want to see adjusted. And then you can go through them. We can kind of work on making any necessary changes before re-recommending adoption to them. at the November meeting with hopefully them adopting it then at their second November meeting.

So that's our November meeting is the public hearing not the council's correct. So this would be a planning commission public hearing number two by the master plan. Okay. And of course we would also get additional public input as well which is which can be helpful. And that's all I have. Very good. Uh, commissioners remarks for concerns. David Nicole, I'm good. I wanted to talk about the accessory. And he beat me. Thank you.

I have a question about the uh been smelling a lot of marijuana uh when going by some of the dispensaries. Okay, very good. Several times I've driven down Main Street like, "Oh my goodness, I know we put I know we put a lot of time into those filters and making sure they had appropriate filters and Okay, very good. Okay, if there are no other remarks, I will entertain a motion for German. Any support? And all in favor say I.

I. All oppose the same. This motion this meeting is adjourned.