Housing, Urban Development and Zoning - Regular Meeting

Close captioning.

Good morning everybody. My name is Sandra Long, conditional use hearing officer for the city of St. Louis. My colleague Deborah McLemore and I will be conducting today's scheduled hearings on applications for conditional use permits. We are recording these hearings as a permanent record. We ask that you remain on mute if you are not giving testimony. If you're calling in by phone, it is star six to mute and unmute. If multiple people are sharing a screen, we ask that only one person speak at a time and please restrain from side conversation during an individual's testimony. These requests are made so we can accurately record the information and hear from those giving testimony. When each address is called by the hearing secretary, I ask that the applicant, our representative, indicate you are present. I will then ask you to state your name and your address for the record. After a time of questions with the applicant, I will call for testimony and any persons in favor of the application. Then I will ask for testimony from any persons in opposition to the application. Following today's hearing, our office will make a recommendation Following today's hearing, our office will make a recommendation to the board of public service, which is a separate department here at the city. They will make the final determination as no decisions will be made here today. Therefore, you are welcome to leave or stay on the call and listen. The board of public service will notify the applicant by mail regarding the findings of our your conditional use permit. Deborah, will you please read the first case? 4539 Michigan AHO-137-26 zone B two family dweller District W three.

Do I have anybody here for 4539 Michigan? Yes. Can I get your name and a mailing address, please? Becca Armor, 4539 Michigan Avenue. You want to explain what you're doing here? I'm trying to open my cottage bakery um and I'm going to sell gluten-free pastries and baked goods um at farmers markets. You have prior experience as a baker?

Yes, I've been um in the food industry for 10 years. Will everything be done inside your home? Yes. Will you be storing goods at your home? Yeah. Where will you store them at? Um in the fridge, freezer, or um on a on a rack that I have in the kitchen. Okay. Will you be storing any storing any cookware or packaging materials at your home? Yes. Will you have anybody helping you run your business?

No, not really. Okay. What days of the week will you be selling? Do you have a set schedule? Not really. Tuesdays and Saturdays over the summer and then any other pop-up markets that come my way. Okay. Well, you take outside orders except from the farmers market. Maybe I might do custom orders and deliver. Okay. How will you notify the um customers of their orders? Uh either email or Instagram. Okay. So customers will never come to your house. No.

How are you going to advertise? again Instagram and um word of mouth. Okay. Are you going to do any shipping of goods? No. Okay. Have you had a health department inspection? No. These have you reached out to your alderman or neighborhood association? Yes, both. Okay. I have a letter of support from your alderman. I don't think I have anything from your nasal care association. Okay. So, okay. These are questions we ask everybody. Will the use be detrimental to the public health, safety, morals, or general welfare?

No. Will the use cause serious injury to the neighboring property by hindering use or reducing our impairment property value? No. Is there anything else you'd like to add? I don't think so. Okay. Thank you for your testimony. Thank you. Is there anybody here in support of this application that would like to speak? I'd like to speak. Okay. Can I get your name and mailing address? Uh, yeah. It's Nate Lindsay, 3400 Marramac. What would you like to add?

Um, so I represent downtown or I represent Dutchtown Main Streets and I do know that Miss Armor contacted um, uh, one of our committees and reached out to talk to us about her business. Um, uh, I thought we got a letter in to you guys, but if we didn't, I can put on the record here that Dutchtown Main Streets is in support of this application. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Is there anybody else here in support of this application that would like to speak? Is there anybody opposed to this application that would like to speak?

Okay, we'll call this hearing heard. Deborah, will you please read the next case? 617 South Broadway, AOP 132 34-6, zone F, Neighborhood Commercial District, Ward One. Do I have anybody here from Perhat Lumber Company? Yep, we're here. Yes. Okay. Can I get a name and mailing address of the person that's going to testify? Uh, Carlo Per hat. mailing address 5649 Butler Hill Road, St. Louis, Missouri 63128.

Okay. Do you want to explain what you're doing here? Uh, my dad had this lumber yard since 1982. He bought it from Benel Meyers. Uh, then it slowly turned into architectural salvage. The address though was uh 6023 and uh we're still at 6023. We just want to include 6017. So, are you expanding the lumber yard? Yeah. Yeah.

Um, how big is the space approximately with both addresses? the AC uh it's a so 6017 is less than a quarter acre and then 6023 is uh three 3/4 of an acre less than okay what types of items are you selling uh statuary architectural salvage uh rod iron clay roofing materials where will you get your inventory from Nowadays, most of it's imported. A lot of from buildings.

Yeah. And then some of it's salvage from demolition companies. Okay. Are you going to bring items into the store that need repair work? No. No. And you've been doing this for how long? 1982. 82. Oh, he's Yeah. No. 82. 82. Yeah. And what are your days and hours of operation? Uh 9:00 a.m. to 5:30 p.m. Monday through Friday. And then Saturday it's just 10 till 5. Are you closed Sunday? Yeah.

Okay. How many employees do you have? It's just uh family. It's just my mother, me, and my dad. Okay. Yeah. Do you have off streetet parking? parking lot. Yeah. Yeah. On the front there's five spaces. Do you have an area off the street for shipping and receiving? Yes. No. Something that doesn't block traffic? No. Do you have a commercial dumpster? Yes. Okay.

And do you have um stuff outside the store that you're displaying? outside of the store. Yes. Uh, no. Everything's inside. Yeah. Are you going to post any signs? Uh, just the the business sign. It's already out there on 6017. I mean 6023 already has a business sign. Well, if you post any more signs, make sure you get them permitted. Okay. Okay, I will. So, have you reached out to your alderman or neighborhood association? Yeah, she said she'd send a letter of support. So, I haven't received anything. Okay.

So, did she send it to you? Uh, no. I didn't get on my email. I just had text message about it. I could send text messages. She said she'll get all the I could send a screenshot of the text message. Let me um put the email in the chat and you can send it there. Okay. All right. It's zoning at staint louis-more.gov. Okay. Go. Um, okay. These are questions we ask everybody. Will the use be detrimental to the public health, safety, morals, or general welfare? No. Will

the use cause serious injury to the neighboring property by hindering use or reducing our parent property value? No. Is there anything else you'd like to add? Uh, nothing. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Is there anybody else in support of this application that would like to speak? Yeah. Uh, my father's here next to me. Okay. Can I get your name and mailing address? My uh name is Carlo Perhhat Senior and my address is 5821 Butler Hill Road, St. Louis, Missouri 63128. What would you like to add, sir?

Well, I would like to add I bought a business in 1982 and we recycle lumber, we recycle brick, we recycle architectial stuff and then my son added statues, but our main goal was recycled stuff, you know, like uh coping tile, bricks and some lumber, stuff like that. whatever doors and stuff like that. All doors from all houses and other things from all houses. We've been doing this since 82. So everything be okay. We don't have any. So I know we don't have any complaints. Everything be okay. We got a I got a uh email from all the ladies supporting us. It was okay. She came by and look at the look at stuff. And our stuff is not open like open open. It's very con concealed. You really got to get in to see stuff. You don't see much from outside. Do you want to send that email to me? Have your son send that email?

Of course. Of course. She sent it to me and him. He want to send it to you right now. Thank you. Okay. Thank you so much. You're welcome. Um Kristen, I see you have your hand up. Did you want to speak? Yes, ma'am. Um just want to reiterate. Sorry. Name and mailing address. Uh Christian Bishop, 4152 Juniata. Go ahead. Um, just reiterating the alderman's support for this. Uh, we do have a letter of support. I don't know if it made it over to you, but I will make sure you get that by the end of the meeting. Thank you, Kristen. Of course. Thank you.

Is there anybody else here in that would like to speak in support of this application? Is there anybody that would like to speak in opposition to this application? Okay, we'll call this hearing heard. Thank you. Deborah, will you please read the next case? 4631 Morgan Court, AOP 1297925, zone F neighborhood commercial district special use District W 2. Do I have anybody here for the come up bar and Lounge? Yes, ma'am.

Yes, ma'am. Can I get the owner um a name and mailing address, please? Alicia Smith, 3718 Bravo Avenue. Would you like to explain what you're doing here? Yes. So, um it used to be um a bar um but I'm turning it into a hookah lounge. Um it's more for subtle vibes and um kind of like family and friend oriented. Um, I'm not trying to do much. Uh, I'm just really trying to reopen the building.

I have a few questions for you. How big is the lounge going to be? Um, I don't know the exact square footage. That's okay. Do you know how many people it'll hold? Yes, it'll hold uh 45 to 50 people. Okay. How many employees do you anticipate having? Um six. Six. We have enough off street parking spaces for employees and customers. Do you have off street parking? Yes. How many spaces do you have approximately? Um approximately 20 20 spaces.

Okay. What will your days and hours of operation be? Um, Monday through Sunday and what hours? Um, 12 to 1:00 a.m. 12 12:00 p.m. to 1:00 a.m. Yes, ma'am. Okay. Will you have any cooking? No. Will you sell liquor? Yes. Is it full package liquor? Yes. Okay. Will you be selling anything else like um tobacco products and things like that? No. Okay. So, chips like stuff like that.

I'm sorry. Go ahead. I cut you off. I'm sorry. Maybe um maybe like chips um here and there, like small bags of chips. Okay. So, I'm going to read this drug paraphernalia um item to you. Okay. So, you can't sell any of these unless you want to. You're going to have to talk to me about it now. Okay. Okay.

There shall be no sale of items that can be used or are intended for use as drug paraphernia as defined in ordinance 68404 are its successor ordinances. Included but not limited to food scales, glass tubes, disposable ladders with pop off tops, steel scrubbing pads and screens, rolling papers, ephedin or pseudoephedin, diet supplements, sleep aids, bath salts or other substitutes for illegal drugs. In addition, there shall be no sale of cigars or cigarillas commonly used or adapted for use involving a controlled substance. Examples of which include, but are not limited to the following: Billies, Dutch Masters, White Al, Swisser Sweets, Splitterillos, Backwoods, Alima, or Garcia Vega. Do you plan on selling any of those items, ma'am?

I ma'am. Okay. Do you have access to a commercial dumpster? Yes, ma'am. Do you have a loading area for receiving goods that's not blocking the street? Yes, ma'am. Will you post signs around the building? Yes, I do have a sign permit. Okay. And how many exits does the lounge have? The ex I have uh three exits. Okay. Is it handicap accessible? Yes. where you have a patio.

Yes. Well, I'm not currently. I'm um working with uh the landlords to uh submit the backyard over the summer. Okay. So, you do want a patio? Yes. Is it separate from the parking lot? Yes. Okay. Will you have any music outside? No. Very good. Do you have a walk up window or drive-thru? No. Okay. Have you reached out to your alderman or neighborhood association?

Yes, I've reached out to alderman Tom Odinberg. Um I've left several emails and phone calls and I have been up to city hall and left a message with his clerk. I have not received a response. Okay. So, these are questions we ask everybody. Will the use be detrimental to the public health, safety, morals, or general welfare? No. Will the use cause serious injury to the neighboring property by hindering use or reducing our impairing property values? No. Is there anything else you'd like to add? Um, no. Okay. Thank you for your testimony.

Is there anybody in support of this application that would like to speak? Yes. Can I get a name and mailing address, please? William T. Stevenson, 3111 Morgan Ford Road, apartment 2, St. Louis, Missouri 63116. And what would you like to add, sir?

Yes. I just I usually walk through the area and uh drive past and I saw the sign and I just like to give support for the this place. Okay, thank you very much. Is there anybody else in support of this application that would like to speak? Is there anybody opposed to this application that would like to speak? Yes. Yes.

Um I think we'll have no Yes. Okay. Can you spell your last name, please? P is a Paul. A J A Z E P O V I C. And spell your first name, please. Mea. M as a Mary. E V L I D A. Okay. And can I get a mailing address for you? Uh 5421 Gra Avenue. Okay.

St. Louis, Missouri 63116. Okay. Do you want to go ahead with your testimony? Well, I'm I'm owner of that building, Alicia's renting from me. So, back in December, we did sign, you know, the contract and everything. And I have business also in the city. So I'm here to support her, you know, because she's really passionate about that and she want to open that and bring a little more, you know, money to the city actually. So that's why I'm here, you know. So far, can you hear me? Yes, I can hear you.

Okay. I'm sorry. Yeah, it was so, you know, that's why I'm here, you know, so far we are in this business together since December. Everything's going smoothly. So that's why I asked her and you know if she need any support and I'll you know I told her I'll be here. So that's my statement. So if you have any questions. Thank you. And to be clear you're in support of this application. Right. Okay. Okay. Is there anybody else here in support of this application? Miss. Yes sir. Ma'am. Yes.

Yeah. Uh, I' I've went there a couple of times and I don't see any problems. Uh, I have stayed there till about 1:00 and and I have not seen any beer. They don't carry any bottles or anything trying to say. Are they open? No, ma'am. Okay. Okay. Thank you, sir. No. Okay. We're going to move on to the next person. So, is there anybody here in opposition that would like to speak? I am. Okay. David, can I get your Can I get a name and mailing address for you?

Sure. David Oddinger, O TT I N Ger and 5223 Grab. I am currently president of the Bivo SID and um administrator for the Bivo Sud.

And what would you like to add? Well, um, in talking to residents in the neighborhood, um, now they, she stated there would be no music outside. Um, but we're actually neighbors are opposed to the patio out back because of the noise. it's is a res backs up to a residential uh uh neighborhood and um in citing other businesses within the Bivo uh community improvement district such as uh heavy anchor or the loading zone there's no backyard um patios allowed. I mean, the front is certainly a business area and uh that would probably be restricted, but I think music outdoors uh would be detrimental to the um uh neighborhood. Also, um she stated she had parking for 20 uh parking spots, and I really don't see knowing the property, uh I know the neighborhood, I don't see uh uh 20 parking places. Uh so, I think it would be uh there must be need to be something else. whether it's across the street uh established, but there certainly it's a carer is a carer and there just isn't parking available there.

Okay. Thank you. Can I respond to that? No, not yet. Okay. Okay. Is there anybody else in opposition to this application? Yes, I am. Okay. Kath, is that Kathy? Kathy Hull. Okay. HL 4301 Ganet ma'am to the state office I'm going to mute you Melba okay go ahead Kathy

uh I live across the street from uh on gamut from the hookah bar with my husband and my son we've been there 40 years there's been a bar there most of the time we've lived here and generally the problems, if any are few. I'm not opposed to having a bar operate inside there now, but I am opposed to the outside seating on a patio, and I've submitted signatures from neighbors who agree with me to the building secretary.

We uh we have Beo Mill about three blocks away from us. They have out they have music and people sitting outside and the noise carries three blocks to our house. Uh my concern is that the noise from uh people in the backyard and the door opening and closing and musing coming out from out from indoors coming outside and the noise of the people sitting there till 1:00 in the morning will be a disturbance to us. Our bedroom's right across the street from this. Okay. Thank you, Kathy. Is there anybody else opposed to this application that would like to speak?

Yeah. Uh, husband of Kathy, Tim Everheart. T I M Everheart. Eb H A R DT. What would you like to add, sir? 430. What would I like to add? Oh, sorry. Give me your mailing address. 4301 Ganet 63116. And what would you like to have?

It's just inappropriate to have a party in the backyard all the time in a residential area. The front of the building's one thing, but the back faces other nothing but residences in all directions. And you can imagine that if uh if it is alcohol fueled until 1:00, who wants to live next to a party in their backyard? And this would be right across the street from any number of residences, not commercial. So, okay. Thank you, sir. Is there anybody else opposed to this application that would like to speak?

Mvita, did you want to come back and address or at Felicia one of you? Yes. Um, so Mr. David, um I wanted to start with your comment. Um I have been trying to contact you actually Felicia. Yes. Talk to me. Okay.

Oh, I'm sorry. Um yes. So um back to what Mr. David was saying. Um I have tried to contact him um for about uh two months now. Um I have not received a um a response. I have a cell phone number for 7952529 and an email for info at bb umnstl.com. Um, I've emailed and called several times and I have not got a response. Um, but as far as parking, I am in agreeance with and I have a letter of agreeance, but I am in agreeance with the um, Morgan Ford Market across the street to use their lot for parking. Um, so that is not taken from the neighborhood. Um, and that could be that I will have that sent in. Um, and also um, the backyard that's not a guarantee. That's why I really didn't want to say, that's why I said not right now. It's something I'm communicating with the landlords because they said they want to submit the backyard. Um, but it's something that I can work with with you guys as far as that. Um, I don't have to use the backyard. Um, it is it has grass and a bunch of different things back there at the moment. Um, I just want to use the building itself. And noise. I can always um cancel out noise as far as people being outdoors and making noise and um disturbing the neighborhood. I have walked around the neighborhood to the neighbors and I do have over um 102 signatures um stating that they are fine with me operating. Um and uh as well as Kathy, um we've spoken um and I've talked to her about the noise and being in the backyard and she has stated to me that that she does not want um loud commotion outside of her home and I told her I could work with her as far as that. Um other than that,

um I feel like I can bring um a lot of generation generational use over there. Um, I have supported the community in different ways. Um, and the Morgan for market has agreed that I will bring more money to them and the neighborhood. Um, I've donated to them and another business down the street. It's a new um, blackowned business that could Okay, Alicia, we were just coming back in rebuttal to what you were talking about. So, um, I'm going to need that parking agreement sent to me. And if you want to submit those signatures, you need to submit those to me as well. I put the email in the chat.

And what you may get a you may end up with a condition that you can't have outside seating. Okay. And I'm perfectly fine with that. Okay. Did I say something? No, we're we're done now. Oh, okay. All right. We're going to call this hearing heard. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Have a nice day. Deborah, will you please read the next case? 5610 Delmore Boulevard, ALP12883-25H Area Commercial District, W 10.

Do I have anybody here for 5610 Delmare Boulevard, Blue Diamond Adult Daycare? Yes, ma'am. Can I get a name and mailing address for you, please? Dia Thomas, 5610 Delmore. And it's bright diamond. It's not blue diamond. Oh, okay. Let me fix that. That's Do you um do you want to explain what you're doing here today? We're doing an adult daycare center.

What are the age ranges of the adults plan to keep? So we would do um elderly people from 60 and older and then we will also accept um disabled kids that's coming out of high school and they leave um high school at 22. So we will start to take them take them at 23 and older. Okay. 23 and older. How many adults do you plan on caring for? 10. Where would they come from? Um, referrals. Yeah, basically referrals.

How many employees will you have on staff? Um, max is four. Okay. Will any of the adults need medical attention? Um, no. So, no nurse on staff. What if somebody needs medication? You said medication. Yeah. So, one of the staff member will be a nurse. Okay. And what are your days and hours of operation? Monday through Friday, 8:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. Will you provide transportation? Yes, ma'am. Do you have a van?

Not right now, but I'm in the process of getting one. Okay. What kind of activities will they do?

We will do arts and craft. We have exercising little equipment in here for them. We have video games. We have um a computer station, a iPad station. And is the building handicap accessible? Sorry. Is that building handicap accessible? Did we lose you? It's like she's hung up. We'll give her a minute. See if she comes back or not.

There you good. Okay. We stopped at Where did we stop at? Is your building handicapped accessible? Yes, ma'am. Okay. Are you going to provide meals? Yes, ma'am. Will you have a commercial kitchen or are you just going to have it catered? A caterer. Okay. Do you have access to a commercial dumpster? Yes. Have you had any health or safety inspections done yet? Yes. Safety, not health inspection. Okay. Okay. Are you going to post any sign?

Um, no. I have display on the window. That's it. Okay. Anything on the window even will have to be permitted through the city. Anything that advertises. Okay. Okay. Have you reached out to your alderman or neighborhood association? Yes. So, I think I have a letter of support from the alderman. A letter of support from the neighborhood association. Okay. So, these are questions we ask everybody. Will the use be detrimental to the public health, safety, morals, or general welfare? No, ma'am. Will the use cause serious injury to neighboring property by hindering use or reducing our parent property value?

No, ma'am. Is there anything else you'd like to add? No, ma'am. Okay. Thank you for your testimony. Thank you. Is there anybody here in support of this application that would like to speak? Is there anybody opposed to this application that would like to speak? Okay, we'll call this hearing heard. Thank you. Thank you. Deborah, will you please read the next case?

4661 Virginia AOP1366-26 zone F neighborhood commercial district and uh Dutchtown special use District 14. Do I have anybody here the owner for Virginia Market? It's star six to unmute

say are you there?

Hello. Can I get your name and a mailing address? My name Ashimawi uh 4661 Virginia Avenue uh Santos Majority 6311. Will you spell your name, please? I'm sorry. Will you spell your name? Spell my name. Yes. Yes. S A I D. A O S H E M I S A Wii.

Okay. Thank you. You want to explain what you're doing here today about your business? Yes, ma'am. Uh I'm trying to open the bag again. Uh the older Italian got some problem with the with the tax or or whatever and I have a problem with him over the the rain. So I kick him out by the order of the the court. Now uh I want to open uh the the store for myself. I'm the owner of the building. Okay. Uh I want to open it as a convenience store. Okay.

Uh and and cook cooking the chicken wings or all this stuff. Uh that's all that's all I want. I want to do it. So, you want you're the owner of the building and you want to open up with cooking with chicken wings. Yes. Yes. As convenience store uh chips and soda and candy uh and Yeah. That that's that kind of stuff and juice that kind How big is your building? Uh, 12 uh square feet.

1,200 square ft. Okay. Are you going to sell any alcohol? No. Are you going to sell any fresh fruit? Uh, yes. Okay. I'm pretty sure that's part of the Dutch town SID SUD is you have to sell fresh fruit first. Do you have an ATM or vending machine outside? No. No. Okay. Will you have any other uses in the building besides a convenience store? You said you're going to do cooking. Are you going to do anything else? Yeah. No.

What are your days and hours of operation? The operation is 7 days a week from 8 to 8 except the Sunday from uh 9 to 6. Okay. How many employees will you have? I got three with me. Three. Okay. Are you going to store anything outside? No. Do you have any parking that's not on the street? No. No.

Okay. Do you have an area for shipping and receiving that doesn't block the alley or the street? No. Okay. Do you have exterior lighting and surveillance cameras installed? Yes, ma'am. Will you make them available for law enforcement if needed? Yes. Okay. Do you have access to a commercial dumpster? Yes. Yes.

Okay. I'm going to read the drug paraphernalia condition to you and you tell me now if you want to sell any of these things. Okay. There shall be no sale of items that can be used or are intended for use as drug paraphernalia as defined in ordinance 68404 or its successor ordinances including but not limited to food scales, glass tubes, disposable ladders with pop off tops, steel scrubbing pads and screens, rolling papers, ephedin or pseudoephedin, diet supplements, sleep aids, bath salts or other substitutes for illegal drugs. In addition, there shall be no sale of cigars or cigarillos commonly used or adapted for use involving a controlled substance. Examples of which include but are not limited to the following phillies, Dutch Masters, White, Swisser, Sweets, Splitterillos, Backwoods, Optima, or Garcia Vega. Are you going to sell any of those items?

No. And I believe in the be or in the Dutchtown SUV you cannot sell tobacco products either. Are you going to sell? I can't you cannot sell cigarettes. Either cigarettes. It's like Newport or Marbor or cigarettes. I do believe in the Dutchtown SUD you cannot sell cigarettes or tobacco products. is no cigarettes. We'll talk. Yeah. No cigarettes.

No cigarettes. Okay. Will you install signs outside? Yes. Yes. Okay. Make sure you get permits from the city for those. Have you reached out to your neighborhood association or older person for their support? Yes. all them.

Okay, these are I've got letters of opposition not from the alderman but from the neighborhood association and a few different people. I haven't received anything from the alderman. Okay, these are questions we ask everybody. Will the use be detrimental to the public health safe public health safety rules or general welfare? Will the use cause serious injury to the neighboring property by hindering use or reducing our impairment property values? No. No.

Is there anything else you'd like to add? as u I mean uh I'm going to open the the store uh to help to the neighborhood. Okay. And uh uh because I'm uh old old man like uh 65. So I want to make it like retirement for myself. Okay. Uh that's that's what I want to say. Okay. Thank you for your testimony. You're welcome.

Is there anybody here in support of this application that would like to speak? Is there anybody opposed to this application that would like to speak? Yes.

Okay. If you could raise your hand up and that way I'll know who Just raise your hand up and the it'll like this and it'll show me. There you go. It should give me a hand raise. Hi. Okay. First, we're going to start with Darius Redmond. Darius.

Okay, we'll move on to Daniel.

Thank you. Um, my name is Can I get your name and mail? Okay. Name and mail and address, please. My name is Daniel Romano. I live at 3221 Palaski Street. Um, and this address is very close to the uh location in question. Is there anything else you need before I speak? No, that's that's okay. Go ahead and start.

Um, I am very close uh to this location. It is a block maybe a block and a half away. When I first heard that a um you know a small uh corner shop was going to open uh in this food desert, I was supportive. And then I talked to my neighbors about uh this location. They said that um the same man who owns it ran it uh until uh 2023. and they talked of uh a nightmarish situation with drug use sales and overdoses in the vicinity, gunfire, including automatic weapons multiple times, someone being shot, um you know, uh prostitution, and this is right next to a daycare. Now, I did not see this personally uh as I am, as far as I know,

because you just moved.

Yeah, because I moved here uh after the store had closed. Um as far as I'm aware, um the owner of the store has made no um attempt to talk to neighbors in this Dutchtown neighborhood to reassure them that this situation will be different this time. How can we trust him with such a record? I'm sure the other people that will speak to me have some of them have lived here and will, you know, testify that these things did happen. I am strongly opposed to this until he makes an attempt to talk to the neighbors and come up with a plan to make sure this doesn't happen again and that if there are complaints, we have access to the owner directly through phone or other ways of contacting and uh you know so I am strongly opposed uh to this application right now. Thank you very much. Thank you for your testimony. See, I have Nate Lindsay. Can I get your name and mail and address?

Yes. So, it's 3400 Marramac. And for the record, can I get your name? Uh, Nate Lindsay. What would you like to add?

Um, so, um, I'm the past president of Dutchtown Main Streets. I now represent them as their attorney. I handle our vacancy litigation and uh nuisance cases within the neighborhood. The board previously denied the same application from the same applicant and nothing has changed. The store has a documented history of drug trafficking, loitering, gunfire, and multiple nuisance designations that drove out neighboring businesses and resulted in vacancy on this block. Since the store closed in 2023, Dutchtown Main Streets and its partners have transitioned more than a dozen vacant properties in the Virginia Avenue area to productive use. Reopening this operation would undermine years of coordinated revitalization investment that the city itself has supported. A conditional use permit is a discretionary grant, not a right. And the standard for approval requires a showing of changed circumstances. If the same exact application has already been denied, which is the case here, there are no change circumstances, which is why the application should again be denied. We would respectfully urge that the board deny the application.

Thank you. Um, I have Janice. Can I get your name and mailing address, please? Okay, sorry. I was trying to take myself off a mute. Um, it's it's 4655 Virginia Avenue and then my last name is Ross. R O SS. Can I get your first name, too, please? Oh, I'm sorry. It's Janice J A That's okay. Go ahead. I'm trying to step a little bit to the side. I know you can hear these kids. Um, Janice J A N I S E. Okay. What would you like to add?

And then um I am calling there's there should be someone else on here from the daycare, but I'm calling um as one of the representatives from Brighter Futures Daycare. So, we're right next door to the proposed location for the corner store. This is I'm not sure maybe hearing number six or something that we've listened in on um um in opposition on all of them to the opening of the store. Um, I am going to send you a letter of opposition as well. I have it open, but I never actually sent it. So, I do apologize for that. I got your email from the thing. So, I'll send that over to you. But just the the really quickly my list of things that we have concerns with is security. I know last time they spoke something about maybe fixing cell phones, selling liquor, tobacco. Um, even the banter you just had with um with the owner about if it's you're even supposed to sell tobacco um has me a little bit curious because if you've already said you're not going to sell it, then why are you even questioning if you're allowed to sell it is an issue for me. Um it also sounded like when you were speaking with him, questioning him, someone was probably alongside of him spoon feeding him answers. Um that's concerning. If you're the owner, you should already know all of the answers. Um, if it's your business, I still have concerns with not necessarily the actual ownership, but the ties to all of the previous owners and um, attempts to open that. So, it's concerning me. No one has spoken to us. Of course, um, I guess they're not obligated to, but we're right next door. No one has um, spoken to us about any of our concerns. Same thing about the gun um the the guns being brandished and things like that. Um we've had a few issues with them recently about parking on our lot in the back. Um just just very concerned and and in opposition to the store um in the actual intentions for the community. So I'll be brief and

I'll just I'll just leave it at that and I'll send you that letter shortly. Thank you. Okay. Thank you, Janice. Next up, I think I have Emma. Can I get your name and mailing address for the record? Hi. Sorry. uh Emma Burroughs and it is 3316 Itasa directly across the street from um the proposed location. What would you like to add now?

Um I moved here in 2024. So when I moved here uh that store was already closed. However, I've spoken with multiple neighbors directly beside me. Specifically the couple with two young girls at 3314 who plan to write an email. Um, and I've heard just the horror stories that uh arose from this corner store previously, and it makes me really nervous. Um, I am in strong opposition to it opening under this ownership. Uh, they've made no effort to reach out to me despite being right across the street. I'm a very friendly person. I wave at people anytime I see them parking and nobody has even really acknowledged me. Um, so in addition to that, just some things that were mentioned already on this uh this call. They mentioned that they don't have any parking um and that there's no way not to block the alley. Uh that does directly impact my ability to park on my own street. We frequently do park right over there. Um it is directly across from my my house and I do have a roommate. Um I will also say that we already have issues with people blocking my alley. Um, and if there's more traffic there that I have more concerns with that. Um, and in regard to all of the previous history of gun violence, drug trafficking, um, there are two bus stops that let off right at that corner. Um, with both, I believe, either elementary or, uh, middle school children. Um, so there's two bus stops that let off right at that corner. Uh, and then adding on to what, uh, I was believe it was Janice said, um, the back and forth about no tobacco products is concerning to me. Um, I heard you, Sandra, mention that there were no rolling papers, cigars, cigarellas to be

sold, and I'm not confident based on that back and forth that uh, the owner is fully understanding what their rules and regulations are. Thank you. Thank Thank you. Next up, I have Darius Redmond. Hi, Sandra. It's actually Alderman Shane Conn. Oh, Darius is my legislative assistant. He's bald and we're out

canvasing the neighborhood at the moment. Um, so, you know, just some context here. Uh, my neighbors and I worked very hard and very closely to get uh a similar type business closed at that location a number of years ago. There was another uh attempt about a year or so ago to reopen the uh you know business as a convenience store. Um the person that uh was leasing that space as you know say had mentioned uh you know uh was not able to get the conditional use because of the opposition from neighbors and a large part of that opposition was because that person who was planning to operate at the time was doing so um illegally. They weren't pulling the appropriate permits for work being done. they had put, you know, signage posted that was contrary to the special use district requirements and uh, you know, ever since that, you know, application fell through, uh, I know say has reached out to my office. I was very clear with him and more recently uh, as recently as a week ago had my assistant uh, you know, tell him that I, you know, I very much need him to communicate with neighbors, which clearly has not happened. Um, you know, my support is predicated on, you know, the support of the community organizations that are doing the work in our community to make our community safer, stronger, and more vibrant. And, uh, you know, if he's not doing the work to do that, he can not count on my support. I did send an email uh, I think last week with the letter from Mount Pleasant indicating that I'm opposed to this as well. So, I don't know why that wouldn't be in your record, Sandra, but uh, I did send that over Um, I'll resend it though. But I I just want to make sure that, you know, I'm clear that, you know, just based off of the

testimony that I'm hearing today from the applicant, you know, it seems as though he's still in direct conflict with the the special use district requirements as well. Um, and if you're going to be doing business in our neighborhood, we want you to be familiar not only with the, you know, kind of, uh, rules to, you know, guide by, but also the community as well. And so, you know, I I firmly stand in opposition to this reopening at this point in time with the applicant, um, as I I very much believe that they have not done the adequate homework and consideration for opening up, you know, this type of business in our neighborhood. Would you be opening continuing this and seeing Hill reach out to the neighborhood?

I honestly Sandre at this point I I feel like there's some pretty serious trust issues here uh with you know say's not just the applicant but he's the owner of the building. He would he's been through this before with the prior applicants and you know this is it this is not a new conversation. So I I don't know if that's reparable or not. Uh but uh at at this point in time, you know, it's very apparent just by the number of neighbors who live or do business right next door to this property that he has not even had the, you know, time or consideration to reach out to them. Um you know, I I'm also a neighbor. I live over on 4600 block of Tennessee. So I'm literally like two and a half blocks away from this, you know, property. Uh I I I have to deal with it not only as the alderman but also as a neighbor when things go wrong there. And uh it's very frustrating when you know in particular the owner of the daycare center you know has not heard from them. Emma who lives caddy corner from this has not heard from him. Um, you know, Molly Rubman, who's on the line, I don't know if she's had a chance to testify yet, but, you know, she's just, you know, half a block down, has been very active in all of the previous conversations here. Uh, you know, there there's a pattern of behavior here. So, I can't say that a continuence is going to really change the uh trust issues at this point in time. Um, because it just seems to be a pattern of behavior.

Okay. Thank you, sir. Is there um let me see here. Michelle Ross up next.

Yes, I'm Michelle Ross. Um, 4657 Virginia Avenue. I am the owner of the daycare. Um, I am opposed to them opening. Not I have my reasons for the past the same as everyone else. But there are new issues to be addressed as well. Um, the unit above the store, he is the owner. It's a a onebedroom, maybe twobedroom, and it's six to seven occupants in the unit. Now, they're illegally dumping in our trash can. They're illegally parking on our parking lot. I believe he's running a um a car dealership out of the building as well because we have a lot of cars along the side of Itasa. And on our parking lot, it's our parking lot is a four p four vehicle car max. And a lot of times we're open to midnight and the teachers at night are calling me saying there are strange vehicles in the back. So of course I have to I'm also a resident of uh Dutchtown. So I have to come out and and investigate. Often it's is it's those who are living there, which I don't know if they're legally living there or not. Again, it's no bigger than a one or two bedroom and it's six occupants in there in and out. Uh they block the front of the daycare so the children can't get off the bus. We do have children that come from school on that corner that uh Molly was speaking of and we can't properly get our children in safely. The parents can't properly It's u a 15minute parking there just for the parents to be able to safely get their children in the building. But I often feel like I'm security of the neighborhood because I have to stop. Uh so much disrespectful behavior for you to be a ne next door neighbor. It's like there's no common

care for anyone else but their agenda. So I really would hope that uh you guys investigate them and do not open that store because it is a harm to our community. Our attendance has doubled since then because they're safe to build to bring their children, but yet we're still having issues. Thank you. That's all I have to add. Yes. Okay. Um I think I have Molly. Did you want to testify? May I get your name and mailing address, please?

Hi. Yeah, my name is Molly. M O L L Y. And my last name is Rebman. It's R E B as in boy MN and the address is 4722 Virginia Avenue, St. Louis, Missouri 63111.

What would you like to add, ma'am? Well, um, there there's testimony from me at all these hearings, so I'm not going to repeat the same things, but the one new thing since I have testified about this is I run a tattoo shop. I can see the front of that building from our storefront. My husband and I, uh, Wall-E, we own the shop, we own the building, we live upstairs, we are here all the time. Um, when the store closed, we started making plans for a block party. Um, which we did have our first in September. Uh, it's called Wild Times. It's public to everyone. We brought out almost 400 people uh to like a one-day event that had vendors on the street, food trucks, an art show, um, neighbors, people. It was It was amazing. Um, We plan to do it every year. Um, and we've opened, we are just doing more and more and more for the neighborhood. We have a huge mural that signifies that this is a bright, welcoming area. It actually says to slow down just because we want to do as much as we can to be like safe neighbors for families. Um, we would have never planned that event if that store was open. Um, when anytime this gets discussed, uh, people want food, people want a corner store. I I completely agree. I want food for my clients, for the other four people that work here. I want food for the neighbors, but I'm willing to sacrifice food until a safe ownership wants to open up food. Um, being an active neighbor isn't that hard. Um, it's actually the easiest thing you can do. A wave, a hello, hi, my name is whatever. We've owned this place for almost six years and I've never met Sed one time. I would have

gone into the store when it became super problematic, but to be honest, I was terrified. Um, one of the frequenting customers of theirs lives uh maybe still, I don't know, across the street from us and he literally threatened me with a gun once because I told his mom

we were over the gunfire and and that at that address they were housing a lot of the people that were going down there with full duffel bags but leaving with empty duffel bags. Um, and he threatened me with a gun. um since they've been closed uh and I haven't seen it any recently, but since they've been closed for about a year or two, um there is just a mysterious semi-truck that would park overnight next to their property. And I never went over there to investigate because it's not my business. But one night, the semi-truck parked in front of our building overnight, which to my knowledge is illegal for semi-truckss to park on these streets overnight. And so I asked him who he was, why that truck is always par parked over there, and he told me that he had an agreement with the owner of that property to stay in the um building at the back. And so then I started paying attention and and the Department of Transportation number on the side of that semi-truck would change often. And I don't have answers. I'm not a cook. Like I get nervous talking about this because I think they need to be investigated. And like clearly I've been threatened. So, it makes me nervous to speak out about this because I don't trust them at all. Um, the children of Dutchtown deserve better and no child deserves to grow up watching gang activity, going to a store that promotes it, and then leaving there with like unhealthy snacks. So, that's all I have to say.

Thank you, M. Is there anybody else that would like to testify in opposition to this application? Okay, we'll call this hearing heard. Thank you. Thank you all for coming out. Deborah, will you please read the next case?

2423. That's 225 North Spring AB587179. -25 zone C mult family dwelling district and zone F neighborhood commercial district ward 11. Do I have anybody here for 2423 to 25 North Spring National Negro Baseball Museum? Uh yes Harvey. Can I get a mailing address for you sir? Yes. 314 North Broadway number 507 St. Missouri 63102.

You want to um describe what you're planning to do here? Yeah. The Negro League Baseball Museum St. Louis will capture the history of the Negro League Baseball um in St. Louis. The history of it. Are you occupying the whole building? Yes. What kind of activities will be done inside the museum? Uh essentially um ex exhibits and uh just uh viewings of of memorabilia um and that's essentially it.

Will you ever have like special events and gatherings? Uh possibly. Yes. You probably need to get one night event permits for those if you do. Okay. How many people will the building hold? Do you have an occupancy load yet? Uh, no. We don't have an occupancy load um as of yet. We're taking one step at a time. Okay. Do you plan on do you know how many staff members you plan on hiring? Um right now we're contemplating between between 10 and 20. Okay. Will you host classes?

Uh possibly. Yes. Um community um instruction or for youth. Okay. Will the b will the building be handicap accessible? Yes.

Okay. And how many dedicated off- streetet parking spaces will you have? Um currently we are working with our architect to um clearly define how many dedicated spaces we have. But we do have parking um readily available adjacent to the building as well as um we own parcels um within 100 ft of the building. And there's also street parking. And we've also talked to uh uh the a church across the street and had a good healthy conversation about possibly u utilizing their apartments.

And what days and hours will you be operating? Um Monday through Friday. Um and also Saturday and Sunday um 9 to5. Um but on Sunday Yes ma'am. But um a on Sunday we may actually um uh we would operate after um service hours after church service hours. Okay. Wait. Do you plan on having a gift shop? Yes.

So have you reached out to your alderman and neighborhood association? I think I have a bunch of letters here. Uh yeah, we uh got letters of support from um our alderwoman, Laura Keys. We also uh got a letter of support from the North Grand Neighborhood Services. Uh we also got a letter of support from the Brickline North Community Development Corporation. We also um have the support but um just haven't secured our um well we did previously secure a letter of support from the Herbert Hoover Boys and Girls Club and um we um have been in direct communication with the city and um we've uh also had a meeting with um the Jeff Vanlude N Vanderloo Neighborhood Association on January 5th and thereafter we had a conversation with um uh Pastor Burke at um Azeriah Baptist Church um as well.

Okay. Thank you. These are questions we ask everybody. Will the use be detrimental to the public health, safety, morals, or general welfare? No. Will the use cause serious injury to the neighboring property by hindering use or reducing our parent property values? No. Is there anything else you'd like to add, sir? Uh we hope to invest in the community and um be good neighbors. Thank you very much for your testimony. Is there anybody here in support of this application that would like to speak? Yes, this is Carl Grace. Can I get a mailing address for you?

4332 Lindle Boulevard. Grace Group Architects. What would you like to add, sir? I just wanted to answer any technical questions that may arise. I noticed you mentioned about parking. We currently have four off- streetet parking spaces on the site and the building is designed for approximately 100 participants. Okay. Do you anticipate them having more parking? Uh we're in negotiations now with the owner.

Okay. Okay. Thank you, sir. Is there anybody else in favor of this application that would like to speak? Is there anybody opposed to this application that would like to speak?

Yes, ma'am. We have concerns. Yes, ma'am. Okay. Can I get your Can I get a name and mailing address for you, please? Yes, ma'am. My name is Miguel Alexander and my mail and address is P Box 6253, St. Louis, Missouri 63106. Okay. And what what are your concerns?

So the concerns is basically the Jeff Bandaloo area we are basically fending for ourselves. So my wife and and I are on two committees and one committee Jeff Vanderloo Neighborhood Association that's one that have not given support to this ideal of uh the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. However, it is important how it will be established. There are still issues with this project. For instance, parking arrangement, that's one. And then saying you are going to meet with the community is the other. And then you haven't met. And we did a survey with some community people members and half of them don't even know this thing exists. So to move forward there must be complete dialogue. We are just a phone call away. We're not hard to catch up with. So anytime you know it's a good time for us to talk. Thank you.

Thank you. Is there anybody else in opposition to this application that would like to speak? Hi. Yes, this is Oh, go ahead. I'm sorry, Miss Go ahead. Mrs. Alexander, can I get your name and mailing address, please? Yes. So, Mrs. Carla Alexander, our mailing address is PO Box 625 3, St. Louis, Missouri 63106. What would you like to add, ma'am?

Okay. So, I just want to uh say the reason the Jeff Vanderloo Neighborhood Association has not officially given support to the project. Uh on February 16th, 2026, uh the chair of our association wrote on behalf of the association. He wrote, "Dear Mr. to Gen Harvey. Based on your email shown below dated January 12, 2026 regarding your next community event, the Jeff Vanderoo Neighborhood Association will be in a position to make a decision after your community event takes place. If you would like to collaborate with us on identifying an ideal location in the JVL for your venue, let us know. Following the community event, the association will determine whether a letter of support will be issued. So, I just want to say first and foremost, we are not trying to stop progress of the Negro Leagues baseball museum in our residential area. We have the history of James Kapa Bell who lived in the Jeff Vanderloo area. That would be a beautiful exhibit there. But what we are reporting is that the residents right across the street, down the street, around the corner, in close proximity, even neighbors and stakeholders in our ward did not even know about the project. Residents have asked certain questions like, "Will someone park in front of my home? Are the visitors going to, you know, where are they going to park?" And none of the questions like that have been addressed yet, leaving residents in the dark. We just been asking for solid answers. And I know you have to talk to

this person, that person, but we you have to come to the table with the residents and not leave them in the dark. And then we are reporting that there's a notice on the light pole, one light pole. And we believe that that meets the bare minimum legal requirement to notify residents to have a fair chance to participate. Therefore, the zoning section cannot hear all relevant testimony. Nor can the board of public service give a sound judgment whether a project is compatible with the neighborhood. But I just want to make it clear, the museum is a wonderful idea. Now lastly, we like to say historical wrongs keep being repeated. We are very disappointed, very disappointed that some leadership failed to guide Mr. Harvey through the process of meaningful community engagement. And we are very disappointed that some of our leaders with SLDC chose to submit letters of support before speaking with the residents. This undermines the voices of residents who will be most impacted. And see, we are still willing to work with Mr. Harvey so he can have a beautiful neighborhood engagement, get all those questions answered and then go from there. But we really feel that this needs to be done before this application is approved. Thank you.

Thank you. Is there anybody else that would like to speak in opposition to this application? Yes. Miss Owens, can I get your name and mail and address? Owens 4629 Lee Avenue. What was your first name? 63115. Yolanda. Y O L A N D A. Thank you. What would you like to add?

I would like to add this project sounds like an a very interesting and awesome project, but oftent times um the community is just left out. And what Miss Alexander said was almost everything I wanted to say. But I do want to add that when you place a museum hours 8 to 5 or whatever the hours are in the middle of a residential neighborhood, that is a detriment to parking, potential crime um and it actually takes away housing for um potential residents where where we just dealt with the tornado. And I agree that um the residents are being left off. I'm on the board for the Pinrose Neighborhood Association and the North Newstead Association and we did not even know about this. There has to be a better way to let the community know about these things and these things fall back on the community associations because when we have our monthly meetings or our meetings, then the residents are asking how did this slip through the crack and we didn't know because the information did not get out to us. So, parking is a huge um deterrent. Um the um taking away h potential housing for tornado impacted residents. Um that's another thing. We have so so much space on natural bridge where it's mostly businesses on Kings Highway. There are buildings everywhere. But just to stick it in the middle of a residential neighborhood, it's not fair to the community who has to um you know for parking and you know just people coming in and different people coming in and out of a a facility all day every day Monday through Saturday, Sunday. That's just not fair to the community. And there's so many other places like

Miss Alexander mentioned that a com this type of um facility can be placed. We have so many blighted properties in already areas that are zoned for like barber shops and beauty shops and stuff like that and there's no parking. It's just not it's just not feasible um at this time in my opinion. Thank you.

Thank you. Is there anybody else that would like to testify in opposition? Hi, I'm Father Mitch Doyan from St. Josephine Bakita Parish and and I'm not I don't I love the idea too and I'm not in opposition but I would make our parish we're right we're the church closest to the museum. We'd be happy to open up our parish hall for a community meeting if that would be helpful. Okay. Thank you. Are you the church that they talk to about parking? Um, well, we haven't had a formal conversation about it, but I I would be open to that conversation for sure.

Okay. Thank you. I think there's another little church maybe that they Yeah. Is there anybody else in opposition to this application that would like to speak? an old woman keys to she's joining. So, ML,

I was waiting to see if all the woman keys was joining or not. Okay. Um, so Mr. Harvey, are you open to continuing this and meeting with the neighborhood about It sounds like they're concerned about parking and you don't have their parking down yet.

I would like to actually I would like to um articulate that I did meet with the community at Devo Library previously. I've also met with the neighborhood association on January 5th as well as prior to that um there has have been notifications in the St. Louis Post Dispatch, the St. Louis Business Journal. Um there has been numerous um meetings and conversations and notice of the museum um in in over I'd say the course of three years now. Um in terms of parking, we have spoken to um Azeriah Baptist Church and they are um inclined to work with us for additional parking. But as of right, we do have um street parking available. We do have parking on the side of the building that um is is public as well and we um don't have a a parking issue. Um so uh we are open to having further dialogue with uh with the community as the project uh continues to move forward but we have actually had satisfied every uh requirement on the part of the city and in terms of notice to the community and in terms of speaking with Jeffanlau neighborhood association again we've spoken to them on more than one occasion we've addressed the um any parking concerns um we brought to their attention that we had spoken with um Azariah Baptist Church. We spoke to the pastor and again he is inclined to um offer um there a lot but we're going to negotiate further. Um so I I think that um you know further delay of of approval of this project would be um a disservice.

Okay. Thank you sir. Alwoman Keys, did you want to weigh in on this project?

Uh yes indeed I did. So, I have been working with Mr. Harvey for quite some time on this project to bring um a venue to uh the elevated 11th ward in the uh Jeff Andaloo area uh for quite some time. Uh this area, I grew up in this area. I grew up right at Aline between Grand and Spring. Uh I went to church right there at St. Terresa's which is now uh St. Joseph's of Akita. Um and so this area is a very depressed area has been for pretty much my lifetime. Um and to have this project um as well as there is a new housing uh project, four brand new houses have been been built right next door to where this project uh will be housed. Um and so I don't understand what the issue is. Mr. uh Harvey uh and his business partners have met every benchmark uh set for them. Uh and I have uh I I support this project fully. This is something for an African-American uh community that um is is needed. It's right down the street from the original hotel where the black baseball players had to stay. Um, and so it's it is a historic area uh that lends itself to having this venue uh right there. And so again, I am fully supportive.

Okay. Thank you, Alder. Is there anybody else that wants to speak about this application that hasn't spoken already? Okay, we'll call this meeting heard. Everybody have a great day. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.