Police Retirement Pension Board - Regular Meeting

Good afternoon. I'd like to call this meeting to order. It's 1.09 p.m. on March 12th.

I haven't received a call from Dave. I texted him and emailed him. Don't know what happened. Okay. So he's not here to present. Okay.

Yes.

Yoli, just so you know, there's a microphone there in front of you, so make sure you're just talking into that, please.

Okay.

Perfect, thank you. All right. So let's go ahead and skip then. We'll go to item number three, public comments. I don't see anybody here, so I think we're good to move forward from public comments. So item number four is the attorney's report.

Like okay, there you go. Good afternoon, everybody. So we're not just recording on the video, but are we also doing audio and video? I wasn't sure. Okay. So I don't know if you have to look at the camera or not, because I like to look at you guys. So I'm going to summarize our conversation from the last meeting. So the last meeting, we learned that our audit had not been prepared yet. And remember that our audit is done by the town. So we're a constituent part of the town audit. We don't have our own audit. So we discussed the fact that, you know, in a perfect world, our audit would have been done earlier, and there's a timing issue because the state of Florida needs our state report. We can't do our state report until our audit is completed. So at the last meeting, you authorized me to send out an RFP to other auditors, not saying that we would hire an auditor, but at least we'd have preparation to do an auditor if we wanted. And some cities, I pointed out, have their own audit for the pension board and other cities like us don't have our own audit because we're part of the city's audit so we're saving money by using the city auditor so this was about options so in the interim i've spoken to the auditor and i have good news about where the town's audit is And the explanation that I received, this is as of today, is that the town's audit has been completed and we're part of that audit. So I'm not sure if it's gonna be emailed out today. There was a possibility it might be emailed out, but I have not yet seen it. But the good news is that the audit's completed. So that means that assuming it does go out today, then that can be used. And I'm looking at the Doug and I'm looking at Yolanda that the state report can be finalized once that audit is completed. So that's good news. So the other thing I talked with the auditor about is so that's the audit, which is last year's audit.

Let me ask you, how late are we at this point?

at this point with the state so that's an excellent question so there are several different parts of the process so technically under state law the audit is due by march and this would have been march of last year right often the audits aren't submitted until depending upon the cities april may june and hopefully tallahassee even though that's a technical deadline of march Tallahassee, I won't say they don't care, but there are no consequences until they start releasing the money. So they will not release the money until they have approved their state report, and generally the state doesn't release the money until July, and likely they haven't released the money until August. So that's where the rubber hits the road. You want to make sure you start getting your money in July, and if not, if you're not approved, this is another part of the answer, if you're not approved by September 30th, And sometimes that happens. If you're not approved by September 30th, you obviously haven't gotten your money yet. But then the employer has to show that as a receivable. And the city then has to show you interest and put that into the account as if you had been approved. And that creates an issue for the audits because that's a footnote disclosure and you're late. Not meaning you.

Okay. Okay. Let me summarize. Right now we're one year late. Okay, the state usually gives you a little slack, and many people get it in by, let's say, summer. If you don't get it in by September, there are other things that come into play, including interest accrued and things like that that start to make things complicated. And then the whole thing just gets more and more complicated, because then you're looking for your money, then you're looking for your interest, and it gets worse and worse and worse. We're a year over at this point, and we have been for how many years in a row?

So I don't know how many years in a row, but this is not the first time.

I would say every year since I've been here, and that's four years, because we talk about it every single year. And it's an issue every single year. And it's an issue for three, four, five, six meetings in a row every year. This is not good.

So I'm not disagreeing with anything from what you said, but I want to give good news and I want to put it in perspective. So the good news is that the audit I'm told, and remember, it's not an auditor that works for us, it's the auditor that works for the village, assured me today that it's done and it's going to be sent out so we can move ahead. So what's the next question? What's the follow-up that I asked? And I asked, well, if the audit's been approved for this year, what about the coming year audit, which is the year that we're currently in? Because that's last year. So the answer is that now that they have momentum, they're thinking that they should be moving ahead pretty quickly. And I asked the following question. And in about a week or now, I'm going to follow up. And I asked the question, which is, if the board were to do an RFP, if we were to hire, and I'm giving you the update that I did not spend the money sending out an RFP, because I realized that, and this is what I'm summarizing for everybody, that even if we did have auditors sitting in the room, the auditors can't do anything unless they get the data from the city. And that's what the holdup has been. The issue has been, and I don't know the specifics, but there's been turnover at the village. There's been turnover with regard to certain positions in the city and unless that data is given to the auditor, the auditor can't do anything. So we could have had a whole team of auditors here that wouldn't have done anything. So in a week from now, the village's auditor is going to speak with him. We're going to follow up and see where we are for the current year's audit. And I'm going to want potentially the chair to sit in on that conversation and the chair and I can talk to the auditor about the pros and cons of hiring our own auditor. But what it boils down to is even if we have our own auditor, there's nothing they can do unless they get the data. So it's getting a data issue and I'm wondering if our administrator and the, our two administrators can speak to that about where they are on the data side and what they've heard. But what it boils down to is, again, even if we spent the money to hire our own auditor, it really boils down to getting data and whether or not we think that this current year Things should move quicker and more smoothly. And I'm to understand that now that there are new people in place with regard to a new finance director and filling vacancies, I'm told that things should move a lot smoother this year. But I can have that conversation with the chair in about a week with the village's auditor because we are part of the village's audit. Does that make sense to everybody?

There is, they did hire new auditors for the city. I heard at the last council meeting they introduced themselves.

So the auditor is CBiz, which is a big firm. And CBiz, this is more detail than you need, purchased Markham. So CBiz has brought together auditors from around the state. It's a very well-respected firm, and we work with them with other clients in other cities. So we've got a good relationship, and I expect good things. So that's the high-level attorney's report. Are there any other questions about the audit? And I think we can put on the next agenda a continuation of where are we for this year's audit, because this is last year. And I look forward to that call with the auditor and with the chair, so we'll figure something out. So let me also give a high level summary about other items. So the quick answer is this time of year I give attorneys reports talking about Tallahassee and where we are with the Florida legislature, which is in session. So the good news is there are no bills that relate to pensions, Chapter 175, 185, or Chapter 112. As far as I know, things are pretty quiet right now, which is what you want. You want a quick attorney's report. So I don't have any action for you today, which is a good thing because some of my other boards, from time to time, we have long attorney's reports, and that's the last thing you want. So from my perspective, things are quiet, and that's a perfect segue to an investment report, which may not be quiet. But with that said, are there any other questions for the attorney's report?

Thank you for your work.

And Dave, I'm going to tell you that this is recorded audio and visual. And as trustees know, don't speak over each other. And that's sometimes hard to do when we want to ask you questions. But because we're recorded and I'm going to turn off my microphone, just be aware you have to press your buttons, everybody. Thank you.

Dave, I'd ask if you could just either come up here or if you would go to the podium. It's up to you. Up here is perfectly fine. Before we go to that, though, Yoli, I'm going to ask you just for the purposes of proper order here, if you could call roll just so we can document who's here.

Absolutely. Trustee Kuhn?

Present.

Trustee Magoo's not president trustee mountain president trustee Reynolds here just the bargain here.

Good it all right. Let's see. I have no light, but I hear myself, so I think I'm mic'd, right? All right. Good afternoon, everybody. Sorry for being tardy. I had a meeting in Coral Gables run over this morning, but I did want to make this meeting in person. So my agenda today, obviously, is to give you a market update. And quite frankly, with the policies coming out of Washington, it's a little bit hard to know whether to zig or zag in here. But things are progressing along here. So I'm going to give you a little update, let you know where We stand through December and that's our official report and then maybe a little commentary and I think we have a discussion coming up on how meetings might be handled going forward given the fact that we're now meeting separately from the general board and so we'll cover that. um so just looking at the december report bottom line you know returns are flat and if you go back to where we were during the quarter we had a series of economic numbers which were suggesting continued and it's modestly accelerating strength in the economy and this was uh we just got through a round of of corporate earnings announcements And this was very positive for equity investors, and it was very negative for bond investors. We had some inflation numbers come out. We suggested that the Fed is getting closer to the 2% target, but that that last 1% is going to be really tough, really sticky. So we ended up the period, if you go to page three of the report, with a pretty good rally in equities. And again, this is part of the election rally, right? The perception that the Trump administration was going to be pro-business. This was positively received. So the S&P 500 through December, It was up 2.5%, that's a decent month. And what happened in fixed income was quite the opposite, right? Because everyone was thinking, oh, okay, the Fed is done now. Chair Powell actually came out and said, we're going to be on hold for a while. and because of the underlying strength. So as a result of that, the bond market sold off in a major way. So your total return for your bond portfolio using the index was down 3%. So the price depreciation was greater than the coupon that you earned in interest income during that period. So that was pretty significant. So between the two allocations, roughly 60, 40 or so, they kind of canceled each other out. But we ended up with slightly negative returns on the year. So those are the big events and the things that impacted Ural's portfolio most significantly. Now, Let me just take you to the returns page. And if you go to page 16, this is where we were as of December. And if you follow with me on the top line there, you know, as I said, for all practical purposes, you know, flat, you were down 0.65% for the first month of the, excuse me, first quarter of the fiscal year. Now, looking back year over year for periods end of December, a lot of people use that. They don't use the public fund, you know, September year end. The fund performed extremely well. You were up close to 14%, 13.94%. We were able to add an additional 1% above and beyond your policy benchmark. That's a big number. So the results for that period were very strong. If you look down, keep going down the line items there, you get to the Boston equity. uh they were up 16.9 percent as a value manager that was pretty big they outperformed their benchmark uh by 14 which was up 14 so that was a nice value add and then of course for the year since we completely switched out of the active all spring growth manager portfolio we went into the fidelity large cap growth index fund That fund continued for this period to outperform, you know, most of the managers. And so you got you got all the AI stock performance and everything that goes with it. So the index was up, obviously completely in line with the actual. Russell 1000 growth index. So for the fiscal year, stocks were the big contributor. Growth stocks were a massive contributor. And with the changes we made, you ended up capturing pretty much all of that for the year. We also had allocations to MidCap in the index fund. And as you guys are aware from previous discussions, Mid-cap stocks have kind of lagged the large cup area, but they were still positive for the fiscal year up close to 14%. Internationally, we're indexed there as well. Modest appreciation for the year. And for the quarter, international took a worse beating with, you know, possibly expectations of tariffs maybe and things to come at this juncture. You know, we really weren't quite sure what was going to transpire. But international stocks were down more than domestic. And then last but not least, drag down to page 17. And there's the results. Your bond manager was able to save a little bit more principal, declining a little bit less than the index. But nevertheless, for the quarter, there's that negative part of the bond portfolio, and that declined 2.81%. So if you go to page 18, Here's the cash flow for the quarter. So if you follow with me on the top line, the fund opened up with $39.7 million. We had contributions coming in totaling $1.3 million. Distributions going out largely for benefit payments totaled $421,000. Our investment management fees totaled $22,000. And other line item expenses, we just pull everything off in generic form off the custodial statement. Those were $47,000. And our return on investment, we aggregate the income. minus the depreciation for this period, and we come up with a $250,000 loss, and that gave us an ending market value of $40,304,141.

So any questions on the... What is our return for the year? What is our return for the fiscal year, or for the calendar year last year?

Yeah, that was for the calendar year.

What percentage is that?

percentage return, so that was just under 14%. That's not bad. Yeah, that was very good. And you actually.

I mean, we had a very diversified portfolio with some real winners, but then the bond portfolio didn't give us anything. And the international portfolio didn't give us anything. So we acted like we should have acted, which is a well-diversified portfolio in a good market.

Yes, you did. And as a result of the, we've had these conversations before We are running a higher allocation to equity here than the average allocation looking across peer groups. We can do that here. We're well funded. It's a relatively young plan. So we're running, I don't want to say a lot higher equity, but modestly higher equity exposure. So in periods like we just went through, we would expect this program to form better than our peer group. And for another comparison, if you look at the one year number, you see the four in parentheses, you all actually finished in the top fourth percentile, meaning 96% of the other trustees out there would rather be looking at your report than their report. So your relative standing, it was outstanding year. So yeah, things worked out pretty well for that year despite all the volatility. So that brings me to the asset allocation discussion. And if we go to page 12 recall one of our, or actually two of our strategies here were to continue to overweight domestic equity. We've been doing that over time. That's the best returning area. And we think over time, the probabilities of getting good returns versus bad returns, you know it's way beneficial uh to maintain that overweight uh that worked through december 31st obviously generating the bulk of the returns and uh we were also very concerned about what was going on in the fixed income markets with all the volatility so we elected or recommended we hold a little bit higher cash than usual because remember when we first implemented this uh cash was paying us and u.s treasury uh money market was paying us right around five percent and as of the close of december uh with short rates coming down with the fed cuts the yield on that treasury portfolio was down around 4.1 percent but even at 4.1 percent it's still accretive you know nice return towards achieving the actual required rate of return And we were able to avoid the big losses in the bond market with that portion there. Now, at the last meeting, we talked about that green triangle is getting pretty close to the outer bands. So I was hoping and I think we were all hoping to be able to come to this meeting. And so it's time to rebalance. But with the market performance to date, I haven't had the opportunity yet to see what is going on today. But, you know, we're pretty much looking at a 10% market correction in domestic equities any way through today. So that's going to move that green triangle obviously closer to center. long-term target and we did fortunately have a bit of a bond market rally, which will provide some offset for the decline in equities, but it's not going to be obviously a 100 percent offset. So unfortunately, what's transpired to date, I can't make a rebalancing, obviously can't make a rebalancing recommendation today. So my bottom line recommendation for the asset allocation is, you know, we stay the course. We're within policy. We got a little extra opportunity cash. You know, let's just stay the course here and see where things work out. So, any questions on the allocation or any part of the returns?

Well, it's certainly not a time to increase our exposure to international, I don't think.

Yeah, I think a neutral policy in here is the best course. You know, fortunately, and I'll just get you to reference page 19 for a quick additional point. You know, last year, if you look at the top line there, and this is fiscal years, right? So last year, we had a huge year. We were up 25.32%. The year prior to that, we were up 13.4%. Let's... Obviously, we have to consider the Fed interest rate hike tantrum in 22 that wiped everybody out. But then in 21, we were at 22%. And in 2020, we were up 9.38%. So the actuary is obviously using, I think, the five-year smooth, right? So we're still in really, really good shape here because of the five year, very massive returns that this portfolio has generated. So, you know, obviously the jury's out on this year. You know, we're still young and, you know, we'll just have to see, you know, how the various policies that are very much in play right now. We'll have to see how everything pans out. But one thing's for certain, over the short term, investors and corporations don't like uncertainty. It makes it hard to plan your business, and especially if you have any kind of international involvement. And investors across the spectrum, us included, we don't like volatility either. So that's why we're seeing some stress in the equity markets right now. But too soon to call that one. But suffice to say, this has been pretty close to a full 10% market correction. The average stock in the S&P is down, I think the number was 20%. That's the average return, but the net return for the index is somewhere down around 10%. Now, historically speaking, this constitutes a normal, if I can put it that way, market correction. It's around these levels that one might consider investing any liquid available cash. But again, what's going on, it's different every time, right? What's going on this time is definitely different. So that's why I would recommend that we stick with the neutrality policy and not do anything to the allocation right now. So that's my report.

Go ahead. Through the chair. So Dave, this time of year, there are lots of pension board meetings. I had one this morning. You had one earlier this morning. So I have no investment expertise, as you know, but this is a question that I think many boards are asking when we've got events sort of similar to what you described when you had COVID and You know, people ask this question when there are other market hiccups. People ask the following question, which is, you know, we're an institutional investor and we've got a long-term funding policy, but why can't we just put in the chips and take a breather and see what happens? So to the extent that people are asking you that question these days, what is the answer for long-term investors if there is an answer in terms of volatility and things that we can't control?

Yeah, great question. And to one of the points in your question, you know, In institutional investing, by sticking to the long-term plan and rebalancing portfolios within parameters, and we've established a 5% rule. So if we exceed it, right, if that green diamond goes red and we get to the outside of that band, right, I come in and recommend rebalancing, take profits. And normally you would be allocating to the underperforming asset. In this case, we allocated to cash. um and conversely uh when the uh triangle goes red on the low end uh we would be coming in and recommending during you know what would be the worst of times and i'll take myself back personally to 2008 2009 where that triangle went red on the low side right And it was very hard to get clients in the midst of the financial crisis as it was rolling along to rebalance. But history, will have it consistently every cycle uh that's your cue uh you know the dollar cost average and get in and if you had done that your returns have been much much higher than they would have been if you had not not done anything so um we are institutional this program is invested in perpetuity right it is a pension so we strongly advocate staying with the plan that's been prescribed sometimes it's a good time to have a discussion make sure we're still comfortable with the plan i'm not suggesting making any changes to the plan in here i think we have a better than reasonable probability of achieving that long-term actuarial required rate of return assumption. That's our primary task. And to the extent that we can limit downside when it happens to ease the village budgeting from a contribution standpoint, I think we've been able to do that with this asset allocation over the years. So, you know, we don't want to be short-term. And I guess I would fall back on another institutional rule of investing, and that's that it's a little bit harder to stick by at this time. But if you look back over time, and I think we actually discussed this pre-election, I think I handed out a chart that shows the impact that elections have on equity markets, specifically going back 100 years. Basically, it doesn't matter what your political affiliation, who gets elected, if they get re-elected for another four years, or if there's a complete turnover. The strength of Your and my and the collective efforts in an open capitalist society that's as strong as the United States, capitalism prevails over all. So we are all going to do, corporations are all going to do what they need to do to survive, to make money, and to move forward in a positive way. So you can rain all kinds of stuff, policies, changes on our economy, and over time, overwhelmingly, you know, we're going to adjust, adapt, and this is the place to be and the place to invest money. So the capitalist system we have here, the investment process prevails over everything historically. A little more Interruptions this time perhaps a little more intrusive from a policy perspective if I can put it that way This time but again juries out. We don't know where or how far this is going but I would still fall back on you know, we're capitalists, we're going to move our money to where it's most efficient, and the way that we can capitalize our personal and individual situations, whether corporate or otherwise. So I think that makes a strong case for take a breath, you know, stay the course, and yeah, we'll get through this. Is that addressing the question, Adam?

Any other questions?

My only comment would be, I mean, it's only a 10% correction at this point. I mean, it's not unusual for that to happen. Right. If we were down 25%, well, everybody could be yelling and jumping up and down, but it's 10%.

Right. And it happened on two back-to-back record-setting years. So you never know what is going to be the trigger. But the odds were that something was going to interrupt the investment flow for this year. It is a correction. 10% is normal. People recalibrate. Your active investment managers are looking out there, recalibrating right now. And we move forward with all available information. And I would say, as I opened with, These changes are coming immediately on the heels of a very solidly based economy. The economy is fine right now. And inflation came down to the three-ish percent level. Employment is a wonderful picture right now. Everybody's employed. Consumer spending was good. Confidence was good. That's shifted negatively now. But this is coming on the heels of a solid base. Corporate earnings were very strong. So there's no economic reason or no fundamental investment reason to suggest that something bigger should take place or a bigger price adjustment. should take place given the solid base that we're currently working on.

Thank you. Any other questions?

Thank you.

Mr. West, thank you. Do you have anything else?

I guess the other item is administrative. So I know the board offered to allow me to attend via online in lieu of a fee increase since the plans are separated. And I assume we're probably going to stay that way. The plan?

Most likely, yes.

I'm already under pressure to renew our running engagement. I think our fee guarantee ran out a little while ago. So actually, I think I'm remiss in coming forward with a fee increase anyway. But I am under a little pressure upstairs to get everybody up to market. In the interest, obviously, you're interested in maintaining costs. I would be, I appreciate that offer as a way to keep expenses down. Obviously, there's travel, hotels, and everything involved for meetings, and that's all getting plugged into the grand equation up at the mothership here. But I will be happy to take that offer, assuming that is official. I'll take that back to the mothership and see what we can work out with that. I will say as a fiduciary, as an engaged fiduciary, my shop firmly believes that we are obligated to you to come to your quarterly meetings and make those one-on-one presentations. That's our operating philosophy. So this would be a departure from that. But I will take that back and see if we can get some consideration for that. So I appreciate that offer. We're obviously all trying to continue to work together here in a constructive way.

Yeah, I don't see any issues with the Zoom, the TV right there in the corner. In the past, they've used it for Zoom to bring people in that are out of town or something like that. So I don't see an issue with it. We just would have to get with the village clerk's office to make sure that that's still accessible to us. But I don't have a problem with it as long as nobody else does. The only thing I would ask is, obviously... The paper reports are great. Maybe you can email them to us. Oh, absolutely. Or email them to you at the OLE so that way we can print them out and have them in hand as you talk.

Yeah, what we would do would be we'll FedEx or UPS, whatever, the hard books down to your administrator. And presumably you wouldn't mind distributing them. Oh, no, no problem. Yeah. Yeah. So I'll float that up the poll and see what we can do.

Perfect. Thank you.

Yeah trustee so I would add it is not uncommon that the pension boards will have people attend remotely so I do that myself all the time. The one thing I like to point out is that sometimes at least once a year to try to have someone in person so I might ask that question Dave if we were to decide to ask for one meeting in a year would it presumably be the September 30th meeting or maybe it doesn't matter so I welcome your thoughts on that and then if the board were to compare if we wanted to have you in person all the time what would the fee increase proposed look like as to how much we're saving by having you attend remotely

Yeah, there's no way we would accept less than once a year personal discussion. And to your point, Adam, that would appropriately, I think, be in conjunction with the actuary giving the valuation at your year end when we're all together reviewing the status of the program. so I think from my perspective that would be the expectation is the absolute minimum and that would be the date that we would we would be attending and yeah I can review everything else and show the fees both ways yeah if my Seniors, let me do that.

Well, we hope they do. Thank you. Anything else?

That's all I have.

Perfect. Any discussion, any more comments, questions? All right. Thanks, everyone. Thank you.

Thank you.

Let's move on to item number five, approval of the minutes. Did everybody have an opportunity to read the minutes? Any questions, any comments, discussion?

I wasn't at the January 7th meeting, and I'm listed as attendee.

Yep, that's going to have to get fixed.

Okay. We'll correct it.

Okay. For the record, that will be corrected. Any other discussion regarding the special? We'll do it one by one. A special meeting held January 7th. Can I get a motion?

I'll make a motion.

All right. Is there a second?

I'll second.

All in favor. I just make sure he's pressing the microphone so right now. All right, let's move on to the meeting the regular pension mean that we had on October 29th 2024. There will be an opportunity to review it. Yes, a discussion. Discussion.

All right, can you move to accept.

I got a motion to accept the minutes. Is there a second? I'll second. We got a second. All in favor? Aye.

Aye.

Perfect.

mr chair if i could so i just wanted to remind the administrator that we have a mayor who likes to pay attention which is a good thing and and stay informed so i want to just make sure that the administrator is sending the approved minutes to the city and to the mayor so the folks around the corner can look at the minutes as they as they see through it will do duly noted thank you all right number six can i get a a motion to

approve all of them together. Is there any other questions other than the one amendment from Yoli, which was item F. Sorry, I got the wrong one.

So moved. Okay. To ratify all of them with the correction in number F. Okay.

I got a motion to accept with the correction from item number F. I'll second. I got a second. All in favor?

Aye. Aye. Aye.

Aye. All right. Is there any new business? That's a first, I think. So no new business.

One quick second through the chair. Excuse my ignorance and not really knowing where I can find this, but in the process of becoming certified through CPPT, I know how important it is, and I heard you talk a lot about the policy, Mr. West, the investment policy. Where can I find that statement and all that information? Is that through you, Mr. West? We have a copy. Yeah, we have it. Outstanding. Yeah, I'd like to formally request a copy when you get a chance. Thank you.

I have a question also where can I find the information I know it's probably right there on the composition of this board and what are the regulations around it because I was asked I said I'm not sure pardon going to be the ordinances it's it's all spelled out in the ordinance and I know exactly what you want to tell where to look

The attorney can probably help us out with that one.

So, trustees, let me spend a minute speaking about that. And when I get back to the office, either tonight or tomorrow, I will send to the administrator, and she'll send to all of you, you know, she'll forward the email that I'm going to send. So, the composition of our ordinance, it comes from two places. It comes from the state statute, and it's also in our ordinance. So, what does the state statute say? And this is probably more than you're asking. So, the state statute, which is Chapter 185 Florida statutes, distinguishes between old boards and new boards. In other words, the old board's I don't like to say grandfather, but the grandfathered, grandparented boards can be exceptions. And then the newer boards have to use the following format. And we use that format. So that format is five trustees. So it's two who are elected by the members. Those are the member elected trustees. You have two that are appointed by the village or citizens of the village. And then you have a fifth trustee. Now these grandparented boards might have more than five, might have six or seven. Usually it's an odd number. But today you have to have five unless you're your grandfather, then you're not grandfathered. So that's why you have two that are elected to that are village appointees and the fifth chosen by the other four. So that's that's it's in the state statute and it's in the ordinance. Now there's some question about and I don't want to speak for the mayor or for others that you know, why is it there are three police officers sitting at the table

That was what I was asked.

Right. That's one of the questions. And the answer is A, it's a police pension board, but the two police officers, you know, by definition have to be police officers. And the fifth trustee, the only requirement for the fifth trustee is that the fifth member is chosen by the other four. So you need a majority vote to choose the fifth trustee. So, you know, it is not uncommon to have five police officers. I'm sorry, three police officers on a police board or three firefighters on a fire board. I have some cities where you get four or five police or fire on the boards. So that's the quick answer. And I will be happy to send both. I'll give you a link to the chapter 185 and I'll give you a link to the muni code and I'll paste it in there. And I'm happy if anyone is listening to have that same conversation. with anyone that wants to talk about board composition. And these are excellent questions for conferences, and that's why I encourage folks, go to the conferences, and that way you're not just listening to me, but you can see and talk to some of these other boards and see. And again, it's coming from our ordinance, and it's coming from the state statute. And if you were not, having that composition of five trustees, then Tallahassee would turn off the money, and no one ever wants to be in that position because I don't want to say it's free money, but it's intended for these plans that comply with the statute. So you don't have to comply with the statute, but if you want to get the premium taxes, you have to be in compliance.

So let me ask you something. So it's two appointed, two citizens appointed by the council, and there's one police officer appointed by the council.

The council can appoint whoever it wants on its appointments. And then the officers, by definition, you have to be members of the plan, two members of the plan, two village appointees, and then the fifth trustee. And the fifth trustee, I don't want to make light of it, but in some boards we've said the fifth trustee has to be, there are two requirements, you have to be a respirating, And you have to be warm-blooded. Above ground, right? So you can choose whoever you want as your fifth trustee. And the key to the fifth trustee is you want someone who's got familiarity with either pensions or with investments or with the department or someone that can attend the meetings and who can... Because you don't get paid to be on the board. So your fifth trustee is entirely up to you. And then some people will say, well, the village has to ratify that fifth member appointment. And the answer is that's true. Once the board makes its choice, the village doesn't have a choice. They can't say no on the fifth trustee. They're just ratifying that fifth member appointment. Does that make sense?

I'm a little unclear, but I want to catch you later, okay?

Well now's the time to clear it up on the record so if you what aren't you clear about. It's the time of this.

Okay to are appointed by the council correct. We have 5 trustees you have 2 of the account members are elected by the board.

No. No, they're elected by the union, the police union.

Oh, okay.

That's why I'm getting it wrong.

Two elected by the union. I never heard union. Okay.

Right. And I don't like to use the word union in this context because it's all of the police get the vote. Okay. The vast majority of them are union.

Okay.

That was basically a number.

Two are elected by the police. Two are appointed by the council. And then the fifth one is elected by the board before that's the city board got it.

Any other new new business or questions. All right moving on to I don't rate administrator report.

I have a request from Salem Trust to have the signature authorization form signed by all the trustees and the administrators.

Doug, you want it?

Yeah. They like to have this yearly, and I know we're missing Trustee Maguth, but at the next meeting I'll get his signature. And then the item on summary plan description, I had a discussion with Dina. I know that we've talked about this. SPD, you and Dina had conversations, and she feels that we need to bring it up to date, including the ordinance that just passed extending the drop. So I can distribute the current copy to Dina if the board authorizes us so that she can update it.

What do you mean the current copy?

Well, we have a draft that was never approved by the board. And updates were done to that. But now that draft is outdated. So.

So you're going to sign this? Is that what you want?

So I would like for. Deena to come back with the SPD so we can solidify vote on it okay and get it hammered out so that way it's approved and it's official so if we can do that at the next meeting that'd be great okay because I think the only change is the eight-year drop

Correct. There were other questions there, but that I recall that you were going back and forth with different aspects of questions that the village had to, I guess, discuss. But what I'll do is I'll work with Tina, if you authorize us, ask her to bring it up to date and attend the next meeting.

Perfect. Thank you.

Great.

in terms of retirements refund if I can interrupt through the chair so I expect that our next meeting Dean is going to be here anyway right for the valuation correct so it's perfect timing so that way we can approve the valuation with Dean at the next meeting and we can discuss with her the SPD if there are any other questions and the key as the trustees have asked before is make sure that the SPD is in the packet so people can see it prior to the board meeting yes will do

And then in terms of retirement refund of contribution we have had none since the last meeting to report.

How far does that report go back to.

And our last meeting.

January 7th.

I wasn't at that meeting, but I'm going back to October.

We should have had at least one to know that too. It's at least one I think the other ones are officially gone yet. I think on the books are still here So you you have their names? Yes, Lazaro Morales He left January January to this year this year.

Yes, okay Right

Well, I don't have a record of processing. You mean terminated police officer, non-vested?

Non-vested employee should be getting a return. A refund of contribution, okay. So that should definitely be one, and there's another one right after who I think officially is still on the books as of today.

Okay, I haven't been notified.

Yeah, so we need to get you notified who does the notification HR Johnny lay yummy yummy.

Yeah yummy or Marcia Yeah, okay, so I'll check with them check with them please for Lazaro Morales.

Okay, and there'll be another one after that. Okay And then last item next meeting What do we how do we want to do this? And for the record, I prefer we do it now and stick to it, unlike we've had to do in the past where we had to reschedule it three times since everybody's here except for Dina and Martin. So...

It remains open if I'll be attending in person or not, but I would need to attend the next meeting to report back to you in person. Okay.

Dave I'm sorry if I can interrupt real quick do we know when the GE board meeting is because if the GE is in the morning it might make sense to do it in the afternoon after the GE meeting if that's possible?

Yeah or conversely I was going to say as another alternative I'm in Coral Gables every second Thursday of the month so if we were to meet that the second Wednesday AROUND THIS TIME IS GREAT. THIS MORNING WAS A LITTLE UNUSUAL FOR ME.

SO, YOLANDA, WHAT IS THE DATE, IF I COULD ASK?

IT'S THE LAST TUESDAY OF EVERY MONTH. SO IT WOULD BE APRIL 29 FOR GE. 28.

MONDAY?

You have it in April 28. Okay.

That was on the GE agenda.

So then it is April 28.

Okay, so.

So the last Monday of every month.

Mr. West, is it easier to do it on the 28th in the afternoon at 1 o'clock?

Yes.

So April 28th, 1 o'clock.

Does that sound... Yeah, it's a Monday.

No, but he's coming for the general pension meeting in the morning that day. Is everybody okay with April 28th? And I'm assuming Dina's coming that day, too. So then everybody should be good. So April 28th, 1 p.m. Shouldn't give them, yes. Let's hope it gives them enough time. So, okay, that's April 28th, 1 p.m. Perfect. All right. Any other comments, questions? No more reports? I can't get a motion to adjourn.

Second.

All in favor. Meeting adjourned.