16 Budget and Finance Committee - Regular Meeting

Welcome back to the Budget Finance Economic Development Committee. Today is a recess meeting from last week. And it is now, what time is it, 10:17. My name is Yuki Lei Sugimura. I'm the chair of this committee. And this meeting is being conducted in accordance with the Sunshine Law. As a reminder, when your name is called, if you're not in chambers, please identify who is with you, and minors do not need to be identified. Good morning. Vice chair Batangan.

Aloha, Kakayaka, chair members.

Aloha. Good morning. Member Cook.

Aloha, chair.

Aloha. Member Johnson. Good to see you here.

Aloha, chair, council members, committee members. I just got off the ferry,

and I'm

here and ready to work. Thank you.

Good. Thank you for being here. Cheerlea, good morning. Good morning. Member Paul Tan.

Aloha. Shimming live and direct from the council chambers.

Good morning. Member Ramos Fernandez.

Aloha. I'm I'm at my private residence alone. Wanted to be there. Wouldn't let me be. So

Wow. Thank you. Yeah. It it takes so

much Two planes are down right now, so it's, like, it's really bad for everyone if the schedule schedule's messed up.

We empathize with you based upon our experience of Molokai, and you do this often. And I keep on thinking about the kupuna who must be impacted with medical appointments off island. It's just endless. Right?

Thank you. Stressful.

Yeah. Stressful. Thank you. Member Sanancy. There. Here.

Here at my home office. I'm here by myself, and there's no testifiers in on a chair.

Okay. Good morning. Member, Oo Hajens, good morning.

Good morning, chair. I'm at my private residence, and I do have one adult male with me, William Paul Hutchins, my husband.

Oh, nice. Good morning. Assisting us with today's meeting are the BFED committee staff. Thank you very much for working hard and over the weekend. Our invited resource persons from the administrations include budget director as well as deputy corporation counsel Wigglesworth.

Please see the last page of today's agenda for meeting connect information on meeting connectivity. Thank you. Members for attending today's beef at committee meeting will consider we will continue discussion discussing the one item on the agenda, which is beef at one approving fiscal year twenty seven budget for the county of Maui As a reminder, oral testimony was closed on April 24, but written testimony will continue to be accepted. The following members this meeting is to discuss any corrections as needed. Following our discussion, we will review the general budget provisions, revisit bill 76, and then take action on budget bills 57, 56, fifty seven fifty eight fifty nine sixty and resolutions 26 dash 63.

First staff are there any corrections.

Thank you staff doesn't have any numerical numerical corrections to to report to the committee at this time. However, there are several matters that we identified that we wanted to review with the committee and see if the committee wanted to make motions on. Please do. The first one is on page eight of the budget bill relating to the fringe benefits the the county wide fringe benefits. So this one is just for staff's fringe benefit calculation.

Staff has already incorporated a reduction. So that's already in your exhibit ones to the fringe benefits based on the cuts that the committee made to A account. But staff also included some extra fringe that was identified for positions that were in police and public works last year. So staff just wanted to report that to the committee and wanted to confirm that the committee was okay included those in the fringe benefits calculation and maybe if the committee could consider a motion to accept that.

Thank you. Member Paulson.

I move to accept the fringe cuts that correspond to the council teen cuts of fiscal year '26 for fire or police and public works.

Second,

thank you. Motion may be member Paul ten second by chair Lee. Any further discussion.

Yes, asked staff to do this, but I guess they didn't make a formal motion.

Thank you all in favor raise your hand say aye. Aye. Nine ayes motion carries. Okay next.

Chair this next one is on page 13 of the budget bill. It's for two grants under the Office of Recovery Program. Council member Patonga made a request to include conditions relating to the J. Walter Cameron Center West Maui and Aikane O'Maui Inc. And so those conditions were just to basically describe what the grants are for basically based on MD3 but there wasn't a formal motion to incorporate those conditions and I think that's because staff needed some time to work out what those conditions would be.

So if it's okay staff would like to just read out what the conditions are and see if the committee wanted to incorporate them. So for the first one for the grant to J. Walter Cameron Center West Maui the condition would be funds must be used to initiate the planning and predevelopment for Cameron Center West Maui to ensure that when a build ready site is available, the Cameron Center has a clear plan, a shared vision, and a fundable concept ready for design and construction. And the condition for an 'Aikane O'Maui Inc. Would be funds must be used for cultural education, cultural monitoring activities, and support for the county's West Maui rebuilding efforts, including the development of the Royal Complex Master Plan.

Thank you

chair. I move to adopt that language into budget ordinance.

Thank you. Second by member Cook. Motion made by member Watangan second by member Cook. Favor, raise your hand, say aye.

Chair. Chair.

You have discussion? Member Roland Fernandez.

Oh, hello. I just wanted I don't remember discussing this, so I just wanted to confirm with member Batonga that these conditions were the organizations, Cameron Center and were consulted before we add these conditions to them.

Oh, I don't know if the organizations were consulted, but when we were having discussions on the Office of Recovery, I asked for a description of what those two grants were gonna be for and asked that OCS and the budget office staff work together to craft the language. So I cannot speak to whether or the organizations have been consulted, but I do know that the 9th Floor and our staff have worked to create language that would describe what the proposed grants to the organizations would be for.

Okay. Mahalo for that. I I did receive confirmation from budget director that office of recovery was worked with. I think that means they, office of recovery, confirmed this condition with the organizations. And if that's not correct, please text me budget director. Mahalo. I I I am willing to vote for this at this time.

Okay. Alright. Any other discussion? Seeing none. All in favor, raise your hand say aye. Aye. Members say okay. Nine ayes motion carries. Next.

Chair this next one is on page 52 of appendix a part two relating to the Hawaiian Cultural Restoration Revolving Fund. So at on Friday's meeting or the Friday part of this meeting, rather, the committee recommended passage of Bill 63 CD one to move forward with renaming the fund. Staff just wanted to. Report to the committee if it wanted to make a motion to name the fund and appendix a part two to match that.

So moved. Thank you. Member and Paul to second by Chair Lee. Discussion?

Did amend the name of the fund in the bill but not the name of the fund in appendix. So that was an

oversight. Okay. Did I hear another voice? Member Ramos Fernandez.

Oh, how

was your back? So when we made the main motion to adopt this bill, I asked about amending it, and the amendment was a recommendation that was made the night before. So in the future, although budget session allows for informal motions to be made at different times, I think it would be better procedurally for us to make the main motion and the appropriate amendments to that main motion at that time. Mahalochar.

Thank you. Any more discussion? Seeing none, all in favor, favor raise your hand and say aye. Aye. Motion carries. Next.

Chair, this next one, it's more just to confirm intent. It's for pages twenty six and twenty eight of appendix B, the clean copy. This is relating to the Lena East farmer market exemption. We just wanted to confirm that the committee is okay. So the motion was to incorporate it as an asterisk under the table to include the exemption language there.

But after reviewing and that table's on page 28 of the Appendix B, clean version. But staff wanted to confirm if the committee would be okay instead the instead of including it as an asterisk under the table that we instead included on page 26 where it says see table 13.04A point one zero zero and 13.04A point one three zero, which is the tables that the asterisks affect. If we can put the language there instead rather than an asterisk to more clearly indicate that, you know, there's these fees except that the Lanai's farmer market you know that exemption applies.

So moved.

Oh you don't want to see okay you're fine. Motion made by member John.

But is there more by staff?

Chair apologies I think if the committee wants to do it by motion that's fine but I think for this one we do want to report that council member Johnson recused himself on when the motion was originally made So if a motion does move forward, might be he might want to consider that.

I think member Rollins Fernandez made the motion, but

I would draw my motion.

Okay.

All right. So we will start again. I need motion and a second. Member. Member Paulton.

So moved.

Member Paulton.

I'll second.

Second by Member Batongen. All in favor say aye. And I think there's a one recuse. So it's eight ayes, one recuse, which is Member Johnson. Thank you.

Thank you chair and the last one is just if the committee would be willing to consider a motion to allow staff to any revisions made by the committee to bills 55 to make conforming amendments to Bills fifty six and fifty seven, the capital program bill and the bond bill. And then the other bills as well, but I don't think the other bills were affected. I think it's only fifty six and fifty seven, but just in case.

So moved. Okay. Member Paulsen, second by Chair Lee. All in favor, raise your hands.

Discussion.

Oh, sorry. Member of Ramos Fernandez.

Mister Kruger, do you not wanna include the lapse bill? I I don't know if that was affected, but just in case.

Oh, yes. If if we can maybe just to be safe to include 58, 59, and 60. I don't think they were affected, but but, yeah, maybe just to be safe.

What about 76?

I think 76 it might have been the other way around if with 76 if it's moving forward or not or etcetera then amendments may be needed to the appendix B.

So we're going to discuss it as part of this.

Okay I'll accept the first part of the bills what he said is a friendly.

Okay so in discussion then is fifty six fifty five fifty six fifty seven fifty eight fifty nine sixty is a whole list. Is that correct?

Yes. Yes, chair. Okay.

All in favor. Any more discussion? All in favor, raise Aye. Okay. Nine ayes motion carries.

Chair that that's it for staff's quote unquote corrections.

Thank

you. Renaming Hawaiian cultural.

Oh.

We

did that.

Okay. Okay. General budget. Anything else on this. That's it. General budget provisions. Members, as stated, our discussion on the general budget provisions last week. As a reminder, you can find the documents showing the changes between fiscal year 2726 and '27 on Granicus one twenty. First on page 35, general budget provisions. I move to amend rule 19 subsection H by restoring the fiscal year twenty six language requiring the managing director to include certain information on each CIP in the quarterly CIP report.

Need a second. Thank you. Second motion made by myself and seconded by Chair Lee. Okay. The budget director said this change was inadvertent. Discussion? None. K. Fair. Member Rollins Fernandez.

So are you talking about the general budget provisions Yes. That's the item one Let me finish. Granicus item one twenty? Yes. What section?

19. I moved to amend rule 19 subsection ace h.

Oh, it's not you said rule. That's why.

It is.

You mean section? Section 19?

Okay. Section. Subsection h. Correct.

Subsection h.

Any other discussions?

So that's the proposal that is currently there, subsection h on page four.

Yes.

I can support that. Okay. Good.

So director said this change was inadvertent. Any other discussions before the vote? All in favor raise your hand. Say aye. Nine ayes. Motion carries.

Chair, I think it's eight. I think member Palton's. It needs to be excused.

Okay. Eight member Palton excused. All right. Does anyone else have amendments to the general budget provisions? Refer to Peter for any comments or questions. Mr. Hanano.

No comments. Just one clarification question. So on the last one that you did share, so you're just general budget provisions. Because I think the document on Granicus is kind of the reverse. I mean, it's not in format.

I mean, it is for showing the differences from last year to this year. But actually, the language that is stricken is the one that's actually going to be added.

The language that's stricken is being added.

Right. And the one that's underlying is going to be deleted. Okay. It's kind of opposite. I just want to make sure that that was clarified. Thank you. Okay.

Any other discussion? Member Batang, Chair Lee.

Should we ask the administration since it's difficult to strike the language that we had in the proposed to include language that provides more reporting, more timely reporting. I I don't have the language right now, but should we consider that at some point? I mean, we still have first reading.

Okay. So you wanna you wanna take up further details at first reading and we do.

Yeah. I wasn't sure if you were going to bring it up since it was discussed briefly last week. But we were told it would impact the budget significantly if we tried to do that. So I was trying to think of additional language that wouldn't have any consequences to the budget.

Okay. So we can defer this until the

So

we'll take this up first. I think it's June 15. No. What day is first reading? I'm sorry. May. May 15. Alright. Now bill 76 on the water system development fees. Members on Friday, we recommended referral to bill of bills 76 to the y committee. At this time, I move to reconsider this referral of bill 76. Member Cook, second by Shirley. Thank you. There will not be enough time for the y committee to consider this bill in time for it to pass second reading before the start of fiscal year twenty seven. I'd like for us to consider passing this bill instead.

And if council member Cook, which I think you did say at the last meeting, is agreeable, the White Committee can discuss it under rule 7B before the bill is considered on second reading.

May I speak to this?

Yes.

So I'm in agreement with this because of the time passing it today and having a 7B. I encourage everybody to look at the rates and fees for the water department at The various things. Many of them are going up. A few of them are going down. A lot of it is like for materials, which if you look at like brass valves and brass anything and everything's going up.

Also the water service fee, which is the source transmission and storage aspect of it. My conversations with the water department over the last year, there is going to be a significant increase over the next few years. And that's. It's a consequence of basically having water rates held really low for a period of time through inflation. The fact that we have as a body encouraged and allowed the Department of Water Supply to advocate for purchasing private water systems and expanding to have a more municipal island service instead of private water providers has a cost factor.

So anyway, I am excited about having the 7B, and I'm asking you folks to pass it on first reading because we don't have time. We'll have the 7B. I'll tell you when soon. And then we'll you'll be fully informed when we pass it on a second reading.

Okay. Any other questions or discussion? Seeing none. All right. Thank you very much. Yeah, I will. Yeah. So I'm gonna we need to vote on the. We're gonna withdraw the motion from. Reconsideration for us. What are reconsideration is what we're doing now? All in favor say aye of what our actions were. Chair Lee. Okay. Nine eyes on the reconsideration.

Okay. So we're going to recommend passage with on first reading today on bill seven seventy six incorporating any non substantive revisions. All in favor say aye. Oh hello. Okay. I will withdraw the referral motion and move to recommend passage on first reading on Bill 76 incorporating any non substantive revisions. Thank you. Member Johnson. I need a second. Who did?

Oh, Nohe. Sorry, Nohe. I didn't see you. Member Oh Jin second. Okay. Any more discussion? If not, all in favor, say aye. Aye. Nine ayes motion carries. Chair Lee and Member Palton. Okay. Okay. Nine ayes motion carries. Okay. Okay. So we passed it. Anything else on that? Alright. So now we're at the end. Passage and referrals on bills.

Members, the chair will entertain a motion to recommend passage on first reading, incorporating changes voted on in committee and non substantive revisions of Bill 55 CD one twenty six twenty twenty six, which is a budget bill. Bill 56 CD one twenty twenty six, capital program bill. Bill 57 CD one twenty twenty six, bond authorization bill. Bill 56 CD one twenty twenty six, lapse bond bill. Bill 59 CD one, a bill for an ordinance authorizing the mayor of the county of Maui to enter into an intergovernmental agreement for a loan from the state of Hawaii water pollution control revolving fund for various wastewater projects.

Fiscal year twenty seven budget ordinance and bill 60 CD one, a bill for an ordinance authorizing the mayor of the county of Maui to enter into an intergovernmental agreement for a loan from the state of Hawaii water pollution control revolving fund for various water supply projects fiscal year twenty seven budget ordinance and adoption of resolutions. 26 dash 63 adopting the fuel tax rates for the county of Maui effective 07/01/2026 incorporating any non substantive revisions. Any motion?

Chair. Just for clarification. I think. I didn't hear 58. Think you might have said 56 again. I just want to make sure

that we're talking about eight lapsed bond bill.

Right. Okay. Thank you.

Thanks for listening.

So moved.

Okay. Was it? Member Oh Jin is their second? Thank you. Member Batonggan second. Any discussion?

Member Palton? Question for corp council. Me, member Johnson and member on gun recused ourselves on individual things. Just checking how we do it now when it's the overall. We're okay to vote on the overall.

Yes. Okay.

That's the guidance I

got. K.

Chair.

Member oh,

I'm sorry. Thank you. For the record, I also recused myself, and so I just want court counsel. Thank you, member Palton, for asking that question That is okay for all of us who accused ourselves, and I know that's what your intention was. But just to make it super clear, I'm okay as well. Okay. Thank you.

Okay. So we got clearance from corp council. Any more discussion on this? If not, all in favor say aye. Nine ayes, motion carries. Hurry. All right. End of meeting, corrections. We are done. Thank you for attending today's meetings and for all your hard work throughout the past several weeks. It is now 10:43 and this budget finance economic development committee is now adjourned.

Oh oh. One side note reminder still waiting for some white papers but just just letting you guys know. Okay.

Staff, yeah. All members Senansi. Thank you.

Thank you, Jim. This was inquiring about any changes to the weekly schedule.

Oh, what is your question?

The this week's schedule would be Thursday for public hearing. K.

Staff, can you comment?

Chair, apologies. There's there's no public hearing this Thursday. I think maybe on the calendar, there just might be, like, notice publications, but but there shouldn't be any hearings occurring Thursday. That there's a regularly scheduled council meeting on Friday.

Yes. Surely. Okay.

K.

So nothing nothing tomorrow, Wednesday, Thursday.

Okay. Yeah. We have no there.

Sorry, Chair. Thank you.

Go ahead.

Oh, yes. Confirming nothing else tomorrow because I still have an agenda meeting for 9AM. So that is going to be canceled since we finished our business today.

Yes. We have a meeting.

The BFED meeting that was scheduled for tomorrow is canceled because we're concluding our our business today. Correct?

Yeah. The both days was for, yeah, this discussion. Anything else? So I got a I got a text from mister Crowley asking about the rates for bed and breakfast, and I don't see any motions or changes the members wanted. Shirley?

Didn't you just adjourn this meeting?

No, we did. Well, I didn't get off, but you didn't get off. But it is getting there.

I guess if there's no good white paper, we could do that maybe. I don't know. Can when when is the deadline to accept it for shooting?

Yeah. Yeah.

And can at that time, we can still amend the rates as long as we balance the budget. Mhmm. Mhmm. So if there is junk white papers, we can give back some money.

Or make some cuts, I guess.

Yeah. Shirley. Shirley You can call in member Rollins first.

Okay. Member Rollins for that.

I would like staff to let us know the latest that we would be able to amend real property tax rates because my under my recollection is that we we can't change it at first reading. Like, once we set it, it's, like, pretty much done because of the timeline. But I know we made amendments to the timelines for the public hearings, etcetera. So I just I I'd like staff to confirm that.

Okay. I'm sorry. What oh, member Hanala mister Hanala.

Thank you, chair. Yes. So we did change the ordinance on real property. Tax. It's set and the notifications.

And so basically as long as we did the first notice and had the ten day period from the notice to this initial hearing overseeing the rates and the tears. Then I think from here on out, it's just like a regular resolution. So as long as we comply with Sunshine Law and as long as we're within the range of the previously posted tiers and rates, I think we're Okay. If we go outside of the range, then there's going be a problem because you've got to go back to step one and do the ten day notice.

So in short, you're saying that first reading is fine?

Yeah. So what I'm saying is as long as we comply with Sunshine Law as far as posting the final resolution, which I guess can be amended, I think we're Okay.

Okay. Mister Hanano. So when you say regular resolution, do you mean that we just need to pass it on one reading because we removed the requirement for the public hearing and all the timeline that it requires? So the the last opportunity to revise real property tax rates would be second reading. Mister Hanado.

Well, it is part of the ordinance too. So, you know, we have to make sure that we follow that as well. Even though we're setting it by resolute, it's still part of appendix B, which is part of the ordinance. So it requires two readings. And you can still be amended, but then you would have to, you know, waive was it rule 19 or whatever the rule is?

Yeah. Rule 19.

Right.

Okay. Because this is the first year that we're using the amended ordinance to to do this. So I just wanna make sure that we have very clear instructions since it's different than all past years.

Thank you. Shirley, you have a question.

I have a comment as soon as she stops writing. Because during, between now and first reading, we can be looking for $218,086.15 according to member Palton's calculations.

That was what If he can find that much money he can give Mr. Crowley his rates that he'd like.

Yes. Anyway that was the number we saw. Okay. So that can be done at first reading. Member Johnson.

Chair, if I'm hearing correctly, this is going to will be done here in committee and going on to first reading. So that takes us to the end. And, you know, I wanna thank everybody, all of my fellow council members. This was kinda smooth, you know? I really I I think, all of us working together, you know, I I I'm really proud. I'm really impressed. So thank you members. So a lot of you guys' proposals, you could hear it echoed or even initiated in the district meetings where people came out and told us what they wanted and looked at us. Really kind of delivered for the people. So once again, thank you.

Interesting thing is I asked Council Chair Lee, I said, Chair Lee, you've been on this council for many years. First year, how much was your budget? And she said 400,000. Mhmm. And then our new guy is at looking at a $1,600,000,000 budget. So, you know, I mean, I think we've come a long way, you know, and I I really am happy that that to see where with the direction our our body is going in. You know, nine council members, nine different ideas, nine heads, a hydra, a platypus, a Frankenstein,

a

Golem, or Voltron where we form up and and do, you know, superhero stuff. So I'm just really happy that, you know, we're at the end of this and for this section and look forward to working with you guys. Yeah. Thank you, Jack.

So true. You all are quite amazing. Right? And to put all your ideas together in behalf of the community. I think you all spoke loudly for your people.

I recognize and appreciate the hard work of everyone, but we do have one person that deserves an award for the

most

motions. Guess who that might be? TP. Yes, you're right. Tamara Palton. She made 88 motions and 83 passed. Wow. Wow.

And then give us the give give us the rest of the the data. The chat GPT data.

Okay. Well, I have to ask my grandson.

Interesting. Is amazing. Our artificial intelligence. Anything else members? Member Batongan.

Thank you chair. Can I ask that you repeat the number that would need to be cut in order to give Mister Crowley the rates that he had requested for just that?

$218,086.15. I believe he wanted to one it to 25. Of commercialize residential and tier two at 3.5. That, Chair Lee has the breakdown of the savings at tier one and tier two.

Thank you, Member Palton. So, I was moved by Mr. Crowley's testimony. I do think it was excessive to move up that one rate class that significantly. If all it takes is a reduction in 02/18 and some change for us to be able to do a reasonable increase to that tier bracket, I would be willing to take that from the allocation made to Kamalohia.

I don't know if it's something that you guys would want to take up now or if it's something that we want to just let the staff noodle on and then be able to bring the proposal forth on first reading for us to implement the changes. I'm comfortable taking it from one of my priorities.

So I will we'll talk about it and look for where the offset will be.

I just said where the offset would be would be in commercialized residential.

I know, I know. Well, that's what we're trying to save.

No, no, so

The 218,000 from Camp Malohi is what I'm talking about because they sounded like they needed that money.

But they have from '19?

They still have some appropriations from 2019 in their response to that was distributed to all of us in which I basically used as my white paper. And they they are working with the administration to draw down that funding, and, you know, there is 500,000 of new money put in. If we reduce the 500 to to, like, whatever, I think that'd be I I'd be open to giving them less than they had asked for.

Okay.

Chair, I see the budget director popping on now.

Budget director Milner.

Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Councilmembers. I did also just want to add to the conversation that as the body will recall, any excess from the RPT changes was put into the open space fund, ended up being around $108,000 So if you wanted to take that into consideration as well, it would reduce the amount that needed to be reduced from the Camp Malouvilla line item as well. Body. Thank you, chair.

Thank you. Thank you very much. So we'll take this up then and finalize all of this at at first reading. Yeah. Thank you. Any other discussion? I see none.

I guess Oh, sorry.

Oh, ahead.

So staff, as you prep amendment for our consideration at first reading, or maybe, I don't know if the body's willing to let you amend it now. I would prefer if we would take from any access elsewhere before we take from my priorities, but I'm willing. Thank you chair.

Okay. Thank you very much for

If you do the 108,000 out of open space.

So there'll be like

Thank you.

If 100 left.

No, no, no. The appropriation to Kamala here was 500,000. If we took the 02/18, that would be $3.89 $9.01 $3.85.

That's the also the 108,000 from open space.

Oh, inclusive of the 108,000.

Yeah, so that would be

That makes a lot more sense. Sorry, I was just reading it, not thinking, but yes.

So, we take the 500,000 minuteus the and then add the 108,000, that's what's left for Camp Maloulia.

So that would be my preference staff but you know. Okay.

We will do that. Yes. Member Cook.

I'm supportive of that. I just wanted to speak and really enjoyed working with everybody. I'm continually learning. And collaboration of this council for this budget year was definitely refreshing. I'm hoping that we can continue this through these challenging times we have. We have community plans. We have some other major legislation with financial impacts. I just look forward to working with you all over through this. You.

Great. Okay. Any other discussion? Seeing none. All right. Oh, yes. Staff. You look like you wanna say something. No. Okay. Then we can adjourn this meeting. You guys are fine. All right. This meeting is now adjourned.