Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Exactly. Everybody setde looks like we have a good turnout. Uh welcome to the town of Can Commission agenda. Uh this is April 7th, 2026. Um and the first thing I'm going to do is approve the minutes from the last meeting. Are there any audits, changes, comments, questions from anybody up here on the commission? See it? I have a move. So move to accept the minutes. Second. Second from Sean. All in favor of approval. That's what this mean. Are approved. You want to mention that?

Yeah. Well, before we get started, uh a quick order for the uh good of us all, I hope. Uh if you plan to speak, please sign in and the list is up here at the beginning as you walk in. And while I'm going to put a stopwatch on anybody, we we try to keep uh comments to five minutes. Uh as you can imagine, if everybody here starts to go too long, we'll be here all night. So, please keep your comments succinct into 5 minutes. And uh with that, we'll get started.

The first item on the agenda under old business is PLC26-07 L Ro plan minor subdivision, block lot 827N 338. The town did receive a formal request from the applicant to table the um the item on the agenda until the January 2nd, 2026 meeting um to address comments from the town engineer and to uh seek a variance request. So that will not be heard at this meeting. Did you say January? I'm I apologize. June.

Yes. Two months until June until the June meeting. Thank you. Okay. Uh, did I hit it on that? I think that we need to accept a formal motion. Anna, can you confirm that it's requesting the table? Okay. We just need to sign. Okay. Which we have. So, we can move on.

Okay. Let's move on to new business listed on the agenda, which is item number four. Uh, the new business. PLC26-09 North Park Boat House Playground combined preliminary and final land development block lot 946A 187. Is there a presentation on what's going to be done? Hi. Please state your name and who you're with. Yep. Uh I'm Hillary Garnish. I'm with the Alageney County Parks Department. Should I move this down?

Can you hear me better? Um, I'll say that again. I'm Hillilary Garnish with the Alageney County Parks Department. Um, so we're working to renovate a playground. Um, the existing one was built in the late 90s. So, as you can imagine, it's due for an update. Um, just a little context for the site. It's located near the, uh, North Park Boat House. Um, it's has an ADA compliant flush restroom nearby and a connection to a half mile paved ADA accessible trail along Tennis Court Road there. Um, can go to the next slide. So, um, couple shelters nearby, uh, ample parking. Um, and you can see that trail marked there as I mentioned. Uh, next slide. So, um, some issues on site. Uh, a lot of the equipment is broken, deteriorated. Um, the site is kind of chronically muddy and wet. Um, there are some old rusted storm water pipes on site, clogged catch basins, etc. Um, parking bays are also pretty short at the playground itself, so we'd like to make those a little wider to accommodate uh, vans or trucks more easily. Um so next slide we'll have our site plan which apologize it's a little difficult to see on the screen there but um we're proposing some storm water management improvements replacing three catch basins um associated storm water pipe. Um tying in new under drain system across the playground area. Um we'll have a uh slit drainage system across the event lawn there. Um it's pretty soupy most of the time, but they like to have some events there sometimes. So that would help. Um managed release uh

concept by a retention swale to treat all that storm water. Um, we're also expanding the parking, uh, as I mentioned before, adding four accessible parking spaces and 33, uh, angled parking spaces in the, um, the boat house side of the parking there. Um, this includes an ADA compliant walkway to the playground as well. Um, we'll also be removing some trees. Uh, but most are in decline or have roots that are growing into the playground equipment. So, doing any work in that area would kind of cause the trees to decline further and be dangerous. Um, and some of them are already in dangerous condition. So, um, we're removing as few as we can. Um, we're proposing 17 canopy trees and 18 ornamental trees to replace. um in the playground itself and also adjacent to the parking. Um and many mature shade trees, oaks, and maples will be preserved on site as well. Um in addition, uh we'll have some native shrub grass and perennial plantings in the bio retention basin. Um so for the playground itself, um we'll have ADA compliant sidewalks and setting throughout. Um we're installing compent equipment mostly from their Robinia line um which uses sustainable black locust. So uh nature inspired play equipment that matches the um the wooded setting of the site. Um we're doing a boat shift theme to match kind of the boat house setting. So that should be fun. Um the equipment includes some inclusive elements and swings, carousels, uh also within the larger structures. Um there will also be a double zipline

which will be fun so kids can race each other on the zipline. Um and we'll be using primarily a playground grass forever. So it's like an artificial turf for the um safety fall surface as well as some uh playground mulch. But that's in summary. Uh I have a couple slides of some uh illustrative images as well uh that component prepared to give an idea of what they'll look like. So this is uh mostly two to five age equipment. So um got kind of a spellbound check uh small boat and the 5 to 12 equipment. You can see the large ship double zip line. Um what they call the super frisbee, that orange uh ring structure there, some uh accessible inclusive carousels. Uh and the walkways throughout. Thank you.

Just one question before we open it up. Uh what's the general timing of this for completion? Yeah. Um so we are hoping to advertise this week, this Thursday. Um and then begin construction um as early as late June. Thanks. Thank you. Um you want to say it's not that easy. Sorry. No, that's all right.

You want to comment? Well, primarily reading the engineers's comments, there were quite a few concerns about documentation at least regarding storm water and erosion and sedimentation control.

Yeah, I would say um on RNA, thanks to land development comments were things that can be easily addressed and they have a plan for. Um, I'd say mainly the main item as you mentioned would be just ensuring that with the revisions we receive, there's no additional storm water management features that are added that are going to adjust the site that are going to change anything. We do feel that they have the area to address those comments down there. It's just we haven't received um at this time responses to show that full compliance with some of the rate requirements. Um and then some technical um operation for how the specific system that they have to use here is typically installed

which would all be comments that would be go towards um construction and things you'd be looking at as we go along. That's correct. Yeah. It could potentially impact some of the constructability I would say of what's planned right now versus what may be slightly changed in the revis. So there may need to be revisions to the plan based on the documentation they provide if there is sufficient space for on this plan for storm water management potentially. Yeah, there there is a chance for revisions to the storm water that is shown. I was reading else the comments um the potential for a 105 permit

and is that incorporated in your construction plan? Yeah. Um, we're working with KU resources on the storm water design right now. Um, we just had a meeting with them this morning, uh, to address and discuss some of Mir's comments. Um, so they'll be working through that and should have a more detailed response to those items maybe next week. Yeah. And that specific comment was in regards to the outfalls that would be going directly into the stream. Right. There is um the comments indicated there wasn't a wetlands deline delineation report. Does is there wetlands on um this parcel that you know of

to my knowledge? No. In our um area of disturbance um KU resources is working on that as well. Um they have someone certified to um identify wetlands and they'll be going out on site to um confirm that you Okay. So yeah, we'll be pursuing yes that delineation. Okay. If needed. Any other comments from up here? Um we can open it up for public comment if there is any. Yes. Please come up. State your name. Wait a second. Ellen Wright.

Okay. Um, I was at the site last week and then I was at it today and it looks like six trees have already been taken down and so I was somewhat I didn't think the pro it had been approved yet. So I wondered why the six trees had been taken down prior to approval. Um, so that was my comment. Thank you. Do you answer to that?

Um, yes. So, we had been talking um with our park superintendent about park superintendent about the plans upcoming. Um there were some trees that were in dangerous condition. So, um they wanted to mobilize as soon as they could to get that taken care of. So, this activity was done in conjunction with the park superintendent.

Um yes. And additionally, I I will add that um you know, tree removal and land development approvals are not um subject to the same requirements. Um like if a property owner removes trees and follows the uh you know the state requirements for tree removal, it doesn't necessarily have to tie to a land development. Um it may just have been that there, you know, if the park had to remove a number of trees, um it doesn't necessarily impact uh anything other than the existing conditions that would have been shown on this plan. Okay. Thank you.

The boat house can get very crowded and um sometimes the parking is very tough there. And I wasn't sure if I heard that the parking was going to be expanded or if there were going to be 33 sites of parking added. And it's kind of sad to see all the impermeable surface right next to the um lake. Uh I can address that. So, um, we are adding 33 spaces, but, um, we're only adding about 11 ft of asphalt there. So, um, that'll include, uh, an ADA accessible path along the front of the parking. Um, so people parking there can get to the playground. Um, and we'll also be adding a row of trees, um, canopy and ornamental trees along that parking. Um, so hopefully that will help kind of buffer the view to asphalt. Um, unfortunately because it is a very popular site, um, and there isn't a lot of mass transit options to get there, um, parking is a necessity, but I understand your concern.

Okay, thank you. Thank you for the questions. Thank you for the answers. Any others? Uh, do we have enough information to move or should we Where are we? Yeah, sorry. That's just I'm sorry, one more question for you. Yeah. So, and I asked Ke asked with the the timing of this um do you is your intent to um advertise this without the existing without permits in hand?

Uh yes. So we are um our permits are um in progress in review right now. Um if we need to postpone or um delay construction in order to um make changes to the design um to meet permit requirements, then we will do so. Uh we will not begin construction without having those permits approved. Um but um you know if we need to delay uh advertisement if we are notified of any uh substantial changes to the design then we will do so. Um but our experience and um expectation is that there won't be any significant changes that we can't either adjust in field or um make a change order addendum etc. Did you think you needed to get a 105 perman?

Uh, we were not aware of that. I'll just share with you my experience with North Park projects. You'd see this bruise right here. Okay. But 105 permit is a um is can be very challenging and timing wise can be very challenging. Okay. So, I don't know if there's an avenue if it didn't seem to be clear they needed one. It was investigated. It's Yeah. So, we want them to reach out to determine if one is necessary through the Alageney County Conservation District. Can we clarify for everybody what a 105 permit is?

105 permit is when you are um it's required through the PAT whenever you are impacting a waterway. So, in this case, there's outfalls that are into North Park Lake. So, we just want to receive one way or another from them. Um, sometimes, you know, they may say that it's associated with the storm water feature, but in this case, there were two outfalls. So, we do anticipate that the conservation district may require a chapter 105 permit uh to be obtained just to make sure that the avenues uh for the protection of the waterway at that location are being followed during construction.

Okay, back to my question. I'm not sure with as many open questions as we have if we're ready to even move forward with the motion uh or if this should be delayed until we have more answers to some of the questions and some other issues. Um Kelly, if I could just pose a question to you. Yeah. Um in your opinion, do the comments that you have in the engineering letter, are any of them significant enough

that would um not allow for the applicant to address those prior to a review by the town council? I do believe that the applicant could resubmit and we could review. I do not believe they're substantial enough to create kind of a full re-review or redevelopment of the site. I think we could get that addressed before the next council meeting, but it would be potentially a revised plan from what we see here.

Yeah, there potentially might be a change or two related to the storm water and how you know water is going to be either conveyed to that location or maybe small additional facility needs to be added. There is a chance for that. Um I don't foresee it being a large change um just given the size of the the structure that is there that they're putting in above ground. Um so I don't think it's going to be a large leg lift on our part to get the review completed. However, there might be some slight changes from what you see today to what would be presented at council. So, and let me ask those changes would be related. What you're looking at or your assessment is that the changes would be related specifically to the storm water um management facilities andor erosion control. Not really changing the layout necessarily of the development plan.

Correct. The only layout related comments was basically we wanted to get a clear understanding of how the existing removal of vegetation and the proposed vegetation plan was going to meet the ordinance. We feel that they had uh adequate vegetation shown. However, that wasn't clear. So there might be some slight changes to really just the vegetation. The only other site related comment was just for the protection of ped of pedestrians uh where the angled parking stalls would abut up to the trail. Um, every other site comment will be related to kind of the storm water functions of the site itself, not related to the playground equipment, not related to the ADA accessible paths or parking.

The delineation comment is potentially impacted if if there are any features found during the delication. Potentially, if there is a wetland that is identified within the area, um, most of it is a redevelopment of kind of the existing site, but if they if they do locate something, it may cause a slight alteration to where a pad could be. That is a good point.

I don't know whether that's enough to move forward or not. I'm in a quandry.

Recommendation is that the planning commission makes a recommendation for approval. Um, typically whenever there are these type of developments that come in, there's always going to be a number of storm water review that goes back and forth between our engineer and the applicant's engineer. Um this being that our engineer is giving a recommendation that they believe that all of the comments can be addressed. Um and at the end of the day uh the planning commission is making a recommendation to the town council who ultimately um are making the decision on the impacts. Um so if you know my recommendation from staff would be to um you know with a with a comment of addressing all uh comments in the March 31st um letter from gateway any of subsequent uh leather that would comment. Can we just make the distinction that this particular development is small in terms of area disturbed and that the storm water comments are not extensive from the engineer

um and that um the engineer has feels that they have enough information or would be able to have enough information for the town and there would be and and there would be another review that the town engineer would handle that the town council would receive prior to any type of review of this application. May if there were to be such a mass revision as it to say they were to identify wetland as the pads, it would come back. Yeah. Okay. That really was the wetland issue was probably my biggest concern. Was kind of going to be my question to you. Yeah. Do you want to come back or do you want to wait until you get all the information mailed out?

Uh I I feel pretty confident that we can proceed. um on our current schedule. Um from past projects, we have you know proceeded with a similar um permits in process. Um the changes I don't think will affect the um playground layout as we've discussed with our uh engineers working on the storm water design. Uh we may not even need the chapter 105 although we are looking into that thoroughly just to make sure we cover all our bases. So, um, we also have an allowance in case we need to add storm water, uh, management work based on feedback from our permit reviews. Um, so that should cover any changes that we need to account for post bidding. Um, so yeah.

All right. Well, quick comment. So, I I that's a great project gets played down there. This is a great project. It's going to be super when it's done. Thanks. Um but the devil's in the details. Yes. And particularly with the introduction of the 105 that and I appreciate being forthright was not anticipated and that my experience that that can lead to other things. So I'm I'm just not really ready to go forward on my own without information back on what the permit implications would be. the NPDS that those will happen but the 105 that brings in different stakeholders that you haven't included before

and um I'm just a bit would be concerned without doing our due diligence without that involvement of that stakeholder. Well, I'm going to throw that back to you, Kelly. Uh do you think that a 105 issue is significant enough? it would still come back to us if if if it if if it caused such a change in the in the plan that we would come back here anyway. So

say so I think you know the conservation district's at least going to see this MPDS permit. So um if they submit the you know the chapter 105 GP for approval as well it should go through that same mechanism and I think this would stay with the conservation district rather than getting elevated to the D. So I do think that um it could be feasible and if there are any changes related to that it is going to be something substantial that they would need to come back or

Okay. Well, uh, understanding your concern, uh, I I think we should, uh, look for a motion, uh, and can I get a motion, uh, to recommend town council approve PLC26-07, the Lar Ro, excuse me, I'm in the wrong section. Uh, I'll start over. Uh, a motion to recommend town council approve PLC2609 North Park Boat House playground combined preliminary and final land development block lot 946A187. Can I have such a motion?

With with all of the caveats that we have spoken uh about we typically have on every um resolution the engineers Yeah. comments all be addressed. Absolutely. And there are, you're right, there are always some open comments, but they be addressed before this get officially approved. But, uh, what we're trying to do is move it forward down the line. So, can we have such a motion? So, so move shel second. Second. Second, Chelsea. All in favor? I I opposed. I approved. Thank you.

Thank you. Uh the next item on the agenda is uh PLC26-11 zoning map amendment request North Alagy School District Block Route 716F-34. Do we have a presentation? Welcome. Please state your name. Yeah, my name is Craig Bishop. I'm with HRG and I'll be pre presenting uh this evening on behalf of North Alagini School District. This is you present. That is me. Yes.

Um so tonight um we're here uh requesting your recommendation for a uh zoning map amendment uh to parcel 716F34. Matt, if you could go to the next next slide. Great. And so just to give you a little bit of context uh where this subject parcel is. So in red on the that's shown there on the screen is the existing parcel for People's Elementary School which is zoned uh special district. And then there in blue is the subject parcel that uh North Aligated School District currently owns that is zoned moderate density uh neighborhood. And uh the school district is uh requesting this zoning map as part of an overall improvements that they're looking at uh for this uh People's Elementary School campus to make the entrance uh safer. And as part of that, we'll need to reszone this parcel and consolidate and there'll be further land development uh submissions on that. So if you go to the next slide, Matt. Um this slide here is just show showing our uh survey plat plot plan uh that was submitted with our application. Um and just for context again, that uh subject parcel is highlighted there in blue. And if you go to the next slide, Matt, I actually have that enlarged. Thanks. Um, so this is just an enlargement of the survey plot plan. Again, just showing in blue the subject parcel that the school district is looking to to reszone. Um, and you can see there we're showing the existing uh buildings that are on the parcel. Uh, some of the surrounding parcels there

with with the existing uh residential um buildings on those parcels. And just to give everybody little context of where this parcel sits, uh they're playing north uh of that lot that's highlighted in blue is the is a 33 ft strip that is the current uh entrance to the elementary school. Go to the next slide, Matt. Um so this here is the existing Mac town of Macanless zoning map. And there in red uh the red circle there is the the location of of where uh the subject parcel uh is located. Go one more. Um and this slide here is showing uh the existing map there uh on the left uh with the current zoning of that parcel uh as RM which is moderate density neighborhood. And then we would be uh we're requesting to reszone that parcel to SD special district to align and be consistent with the current uh zoning of the people's elementary school. Um and then I also have u Brandon from the school district and I also have legal counsel me legal counsel Jason with the school district as well to answer uh any questions that you may have.

Okay. Is is the intent with uh acquiring this this parcel and then um uh changing the zoning is is it to just raise the structure to improve sight lines at the entrance or is it to move adjust the entrance and and widen it onto the the new parcel. So we can get more into the details of this at the future meetings. Yeah, the intent is to improve that that entrance to make it safer uh for access for drop off e entry exit. So by consolidating this parcel is is giving them more room uh to do that.

You do realize that you would need to have a minimum of 15 ft buffer on either side. So you really only have 78 ft to work in. Have you um had conversations with the adjoining property owner that will now be adjacent to an SD district? Uh I I have not. I don't know if the school district has they may have reached out to them. I'm not sure what sort of conversations that they've had. Well, they're adjacent to it. They would have been in the back anyway and they should have been notified I believe with this, right? Did you We're all public hearings, not blank. Yeah. Just realize hearing hearing that would be after this meeting.

Other comments from the panel? Yeah. None up here. Um let's open it up if there's any public comment concerning this activity. Doesn't sound like it. I don't see anybody moving. Okay, please do state your name.

Hi, Ly Blackman. Um, the comment that I'll make on behalf of the public is that most people who are looking for People's Elementary drive right by. It's such a narrow lane to even get back to the school and it's very difficult for buses and other people as they're trying to come in, go out. It it is it's a safety hazard really is what it is. I hate to say something like that publicly, but that was the real reason behind purchasing this uh tract of land. And so by being able to um I heard you ask the question and no one can ever predict the future till it's done, but I would say that uh we're we're looking to not have the house be there and then we would have a a better sighteline and make it much safer for all of our students and the community. So thank you. Thank you. Any other comments? All right, I think we're ready for a motion. Uh, could I ask for a motion to recommend the town council approve PLC 26-11 zoning map amendment request North Alageney School District block lot 716F-34?

So moved. Thank you. Who did it come from? Sean and second. All right. All in favor of the motion. I I opposed. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Good luck on your project.

Next item. Item number six on the agenda is PLC C. Excuse me. PLC 26-10, Harmony Nano Plan, Preliminary Subdivision of Land Development, Block Lot 943G 172, 943G175, 943G224 and 943G239 and a presentation. Looks like you're ready to go.

Hello everyone. My name is Katrina Harmel with Sheffller & Company. I'm the engineer for the applicant, Don Pole of Pole Construction, Inc. Um, for the uh diagram that's up today, I actually do have some copies I can share with you if you would like. Let me keep one. Thank you. So this property is actually a conglomeration of four properties um as shown here. Uh one of them was a home property um for a house that was built in 1939. Uh the plan is to develop this 8.58 acres after it's been consolidated to um allow for 11 single family homes plus the one uh existing home that would be renovated. Uh the plan is also to have a public road Harmony Manor. Uh it's approximately 480 lineal feet. It would extend from Woodland what was actually a deadend Woodland Road um at Harmony. It's actually the driveway of the existing home so that would continue to be used. Um public utilities, water and sewer are proposed. Uh we actually uh have communicated with uh United States Postal Service and the regional manager

said that um curbside mailboxes would be fine. Mailbox cluster was not needed. Um because it's only 12 homes. Uh storm water management is proposed to control the site impervious surface. Um there will be three underground tanks, a rain garden and a storm water pond. Uh this will be proposed to meet the town's ordinances and state regulations. Uh the increase in impervious area is less than 17%. Uh with the house it will be 20%. Uh just to give you some perspective, uh each lot has the maximum lot coverage of 40%. So for the entire site, uh we're well under the imperous area that's allowed per zoning ordinance. Um today for the for the board uh based on the town engineer comments uh we did make some adjustments to the plans and you probably can see a few. Uh the retaining wall was removed. Therefore the culde-sac was pulled back another 80 ft or so and one lot was um was taken away from the design. So originally we had 13 which would be 12 + 1. Now we have 11 new single family homes and one existing home to be renovated. Um also we sent today the geotechnical report, the wetland report and the uh chapter 105 GP7 uh minor road crossing uh permit for driveway for the driveway for lot 7.

I'm sorry. Did you say you submitted them today? We did we did with this color rendering just so that you so that we could say that we have this on file that we've sent it to you for you to to you for you to review. So it's the geotechnical report, the wetland report and the uh GP7 permit along with this color rendering. Yeah, we didn't receive it today. Yeah, I have it in my file. We haven't had a chance to get through everything. I can appreciate that.

Right. We have not submitted a uh response to all of the comments uh made by the town engineer. Um but we were hoping to go over a few of the comments. Um if that's all right. Um

one so the zoning comments uh they were pretty straightforward. All were addressed. Um, we just wanted confirmation on if Harmony Drive and Bell Crest Place uh are considered secondary streets. And if that is the case, then um then we understand the setback. It it would change from a 40 foot rear yard setback to a 30 foot um frontage secondary street setback. So, we just wanted to be able to confirm that. Um, also for plan of recording condents, those have all been addressed except that we need to change the Harmony Drive and Belrest Place to private.

Can I just ask again? I'm sorry to interrupt, but no, they've been addressed, but we haven't seen it yet.

That is correct. That's what I said. Yes, what I said earlier is that I I just wanted to let you know we have been addressing them. Um, but we have not submitted a full package at this time yet. Um, land development comments were about 75% through those comments. There are few that we'd like to discuss with you and um grading comments are 90% complete. Uh geotech report uh was provided to provide s some stability um analysis that was on a few of the comments that we received. Um storm water management is about 50% complete at this time. Um as we are uh working to update the calculations based on reducing the sizes and now redirecting water in different ways. Um the adjoining landowner notification letters have been prepared but once we've figured out that the plan is set, we will then issue those notification letters, update them as needed. Um for the grading comments, there are only two left. That's the Westview water letter and the construction cost estimate. We did receive the Alageney County review letter today and it had one comment uh regarding lot 9 and that revision has been made that you haven't seen yet, but it is actually shown on this color rendering it

for now. Okay. Well, uh issues. Yeah. uh we want to address any of those uh that we know enough about to even ask. It's kind of hard when we have a totally different plan than I didn't know whether Kelly had anything that was like glaring or

No, I say I mean I do appreciate the the revisions that were made on here to remove the retaining wall. Um I think that's great. And now what they're showing here appears to meet the intent of the zoning ordinance in regards to the lot standard sizes. So, I would say it's definitely a forward um movement in relation to meeting kind of the zoning code at this time or the plan. So, I do appreciate the the changes that were made there and all the storm water and erosion control and all of that. The five pages of comments are still in play because you haven't seen any additions for this plan.

Yeah, correct. And I can verify as well. So, the GP7, they did receive that approval from the conservation district. So, we have that in hand. and they're still working through their NPDS permit um here. That'll obviously take a while um for a project of the size. So, that is still ongoing. Um but we do have received or we have received a geotech report um today. So, we're going to get that uh in review here on our end. Um I do believe they're requesting or will request a waiver for the slopes. Um I think the plan had some 2 to one fill slopes. The ordinance standard is a 3 to1 minimum. So I think the intent is to um as we review that geotech report I think it probably the report is showing that it can meet a two to one. So we will review that um and provide an opinion on that the next meeting. So just a note on on that specific item um that I do see forthcoming

and from this plan it looks like they have provided or they will be providing in the revision slopes um on the parcel. you can see with

and I I like to just for the uh just for the because we have a number of people here uh that for this item um just to explain the process a little bit the planning commission typically at the 30 days prior to the meeting is receives applications from applicants. Um then our engineer the town engineer gateway goes through and provides a review whether that the staff and the planning commission then reviews and the developer reviews. Um typically uh you know whenever there's an item that has many comments um there's a lot of back and forth between the engineers and subsequent reviews. So, um, a lot of the information that Trina has mentioned tonight, uh, has not been reviewed by the planning commission, has not been completely reviewed by our town engineer or town staff. Um, I believe that it was, you know, Katrina's, uh, you know, the in Don's method here was to come and open the this item up for comments from the commission and from the engineer and from the public. Um, and just just to make sure that, you know, everyone was kind of on the same page of what the process is for the review of these items.

We we were hoping to work through just a couple of those comments tonight because they they would probably be asked again in a planning commission setting, but I'll let you tell me when we can do that. Uh, you want to try to do a couple of them? Yeah, I'm open for that. We'll see how this goes. Well, that's a that's a question. That's an easy that's an easy one. I think you could probably tell me if it needs to be a 30 or 40 foot setback. It's with it being private roads. Um we weren't completely certain what the setback would be.

Um our so our our code defines uh public and private streets. Um and that you know the secondary street notifies that if it's abudding any type of rightway or street that would be considered a a street. Okay. Um from from what from what our my interpretation of our definition of of streets and secondary pronounage would be. So that would be a front. Okay. Thank you. Just wanted to confirmation make sure we're on the right path. Yeah I'd agree that. Uh the other um comment is about the um POC public the public recreation open space requirement.

Yes. Yes. So um it seems that there are some natural uh habitats that could be a part of that and the minimum for this site is 12,000 square feet. um in the area of the wetland which is kind of that circle well more like elliptical uh next to the pond that dark green area that is the wetland. It's on the um it's on the north end between lot 7 and 8. So we were wanting to just discuss with you as as far as like a PC uh standpoint what would you um like to see in this area? We'd like to dedicate some of this area, but also make sure that we're keeping the lots at their correct size and and everything. Um, do you have any um I guess maybe any comments about that area being a part of the POC?

Um, I mean, I can start on my end. There's a few things to to pay attention to in the code with with how this pros area is written. And basically this area is supposed to be a a common open space that is written into the um the recorded plan as a space that's just used by residents. It can be accessed by residents and it can serve the need for the community at hand here. So as Katrina mentioned, natural areas are something that uh can be used. Um, so I would say there is a requirement that the pros has to have a minimum of 50 ft of frontage along a public or private road um or an easement to basically get residents from the public street to it. So since this area doesn't directly above the right of way. Um that's one thing I would keep in mind on you know how you're going to send people to that area off of that lot seven driveway for example. Mhm.

Um, but there's different, you know, things that could be. Some areas a playground may be appropriate. Some areas it could be like just a natural area to walk through. That's it. Thank things. Yeah. So, um there's no clear defined um kind of you have to do this. It's it's kind of a how is what they're proposing going to meet the needs of the community that could live here. And it's a reasonable question on the applicant's part. If they dedicate that green area, how do you still maintain the lot with the lot frontage? Yes, because there there is setback requirements as well to the wetland for that one lot. Yeah, that's correct.

There is access. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Go ahead. No, it's still going to be a question.

Yes, it's going to be a question. Yes. So, we just wanted to put it out there and and get some some thoughts on it and have your all's communication on it moving forward. Uh, you know, there there is furniture from Belrest Place, which is a private street and the notch out in the bottom north um corner is is unusable uh rightway area. Um, we were thinking maybe an access there, but also an access from the culdesac as well. I I think we could actually provide um an area that will work from the culde-sac and you could meander down and to bell crest place. That would be the plan. Okay. That section of Belrest, is it public or private?

It is private. And does do these parcels have the right of access to it? I don't know the answer to that. Mhm. Um, we do have a tree survey in progress. I just wanted to let you know it takes some time to identify trees.

Um, for this, uh, I guess maybe the one I want to bring up is the sidewalk and private streets, Harmony Drive and Belfrest. So, we we think we want to request a modification, but at the same time, um, you know, I'm not sure if there's any fees associated with this sidewalk. Um we we've looked at how you would even put a sidewalk on a street that is is a gravel road and on the other um bell crest place because it it becomes a right of way but then it it disappears like the road isn't there anymore. So there would literally be a sidewalk in the woods um on that side and then just abudding the gravel road would be difficult. So, I wanted to get your input and information on this of what our options are.

Well, I'll just speak for myself, but we are uh as a as a community, we have put a lot of emphasis on sidewalks. Uh, and we would like to see them. That's why they're written into the codes and they are given some prominence. Uh it would take a fair amount to for us to agree to not have sidewalks. Uh I'm not saying it's impossible, but it would be it would take a lot of convincing at least from my standpoint and anybody else can speak up as they see the same.

I think it's a reasonable question on Belfast. If they don't have any right to access it, how would they put sidewalks in or right away? I so I agree with all of that to be investigated. And ju and just to be clear there there's approximately 900 lineal feet of sidewalk um that's been installed. It's probably a little more than that because I didn't count the culde-sac, but around the new public road. So there actually is some sidewalk included in that new road in in the road that you're going to build into the culde-sac. Yeah. Well, no, it's it's from it's from um Harmony Road.

Yes. All the way into the subdivision. If you see there are two um there are two gray areas that are about 5t wide on either side. There's a grass area. It's the road, a grass area, and then sidewalks. So that loops around the roads about 480 lineal feet. So probably roughly 900 lineal feet of additional sidewalk is being added to the community and it could be used by the public because it will be a public street. Agreed. My comment stands it takes some convincing. Understood.

Okay. Um, we just also wanted to ask another question about the 25% existing slopes and disturbance. Uh, lot seven home. Uh, you can't see it on there, but we we did do a a slope analysis and lot seven home and art of the pond is in that 25% or steeper slopes. and we have uh a geotechnical stability analysis provided and wanted to know if that would suffice for meeting that regulation.

U yeah we'll have to review what's in the geotech report and see if it's addressed in there and how it's discussed and that could meet the intent. Okay, so that's an option. Yeah. Okay. Well, what you're showing is basically a flat flat easy for me to say a flat pad for the resident. So, you're not building specifically on the slope. It would be the driveway that we'd be looking at. Correct. The driveway is fine, actually. Um, it's where the house is located. We would be impacting existing 25% slopes and we would be reducing them to flat, but at the same time, we're still impacting those. So, we we had an analysis done uh ACA provided that analysis.

Yeah. And the way that section of the code reads um is you can't disturb a slope greater than 25% unless a registered professional engineer has determined that propos that the proposed development is safe and suitable for the site's condition. So it is a review that needs to be completed to assess that specific slope stability study there that point. So, so one of the things with with that engineer report or analysis on that is what are the risks that are being introduced and what are the mitigations, right? That's really the key. It's not just a Yeah, it's okay. I'm the engineer that won't that won't fly. Yeah. There's a lot more to it than there is.

Yeah. there's a factor of safety that plays into that when you're um impacting um so you know and the soils conditions which they did uh conduct borings out there as well. So we've had a lot of stuff already evaluated sitewise. Okay. Um, I think the only the only other one I have on my list, which I think is not a problem, is that lots three, seven, and eight are two and a half times deeper. So, we would request a modification. I just wanted to make sure that we were okay and didn't have any further comments on that.

Yes. So, just to shed a little bit of light on this specific um requirement, we did have a section or excuse me, a comment on this in the land development section. Comment 22.

Thank you. Comment 22 under the land development section. Um so, there's a requirement in the ordinance. The goal of this is to basically not create lots that are really long and skinny. So, that threshold is that the lots um need to meet a 2.5 times the width at the front setback lines um to the length. So in this case there's some um lots there's three lots specifically that we noted we take the average length of the um specific lots themselves rather than like a a very short segment if it's in a regular lot shape for example. So you basically compare the length at the um average um average length excuse me of the lot of the site and then you look at the width at that building setback. So in this case, there's some that are exceeding that 2.5 um times ratio. So they will be requesting a waiver to exceed that for those three lots.

They did need correct the lot that was under sized apparently on this. Yes, number n lot number nine has been corrected. Well, we the uh culdeac back. We were able to maneuver it a little bit better. And are you addressing also, I'm assuming, the the engineers comment about a site analysis, site distance analysis at the roadway?

We actually have that art complete, just not in your hands yet. We we wanted to come tonight because we knew we had some outstanding questions and I much rather have this conversation and and and give you all a preview of what we're doing before we waste your time of having a another review when we may have to update it again. I I have a question. The the plan that you you handed us tonight is that uh at the storm water basin is that the emergency spillway is now discharging onto Belcross Place. Is that that is an access road. Okay. Yes. Yeah. So we actually are not showing all of the components of storm water on

the emergency way is still discharging towards the wetland. That is correct. As well as the uh principal spillway. Okay. Any other comments from up here before we open it up? Just a note on that Brest place that access that they're showing. So that section of Brest is private. So that would be something that would need to be um verified that is acceptable in order for the raw uh excuse me the raw construction entrance to the basin to be installed. Just a note on that.

And our other option could possibly be from lot seven and providing an easement. But you know if that private drive we we still have some work to do on our end too as far as if we can obtain an easement. Yeah. Okay. Should we open it up? All right. Uh, thank you. Thank you. Uh, let's open it up for public comment. And whoever wants to come up and if you just be cognizant of your time.

Yeah, I'm planning to step in. I'm a resident of Bellerest Road and I'm not in the way of progress or anything like that, but as a longtime resident, Bellerest is probably the busiest shortcut in McCandless and it is highly unsafe. Traffic is not being enforced. It is the Indie 500 uh in the morning for the high school kids. I've seen wrecks. No one uh wants to pull out head first. And has some consideration been given regarding Belfrest for for traffic impact? Is it traffic study?

Okay. Um I I don't know. I mean, obviously it hasn't been done yet, but uh to sure they have right of way to go over it. Well, just the increased traffic because anybody coming from the north is going to and and any kids that go to high school at NA. Speaking of sidewalks, there are no sidewalks. No. And you dare not stumble when you're walking your dog because they're doubling the speed limit. You're going to fall into a grill. And at what point do we consider, you know, jamming all these houses in and not looking at the traffic impact.

I I know we're early on in the process. It's something that shouldn't be gotten ahead of. comment. Just so everyone understands, this is a time for the public to provide comment. The commission's allowed to speak back to you if they choose to do so, but it's not a question and answer session. So, don't expect responses from them to every comment they obviously are free to do so, but they are not aspired to.

Well, I'm I'm required to make a comment for my own benefit and for all the residents there that seem to be bypassed by the township. No one's ever enforcing the speed limit. There are no sidewalks. I've never seen a cop pull anyone over there. I've requested to have the 25 mph flashing signs. They're not there. And no one's bringing it up right now. And I'll leave my comment right there.

Okay. But I think it's very important because it's a dangerous road and ultimately somebody's going to get hurt and the township is going to have liability. And I say this as an attorney. Thank you. Good evening. My name is Jack Merton. I live on Belfrest Road and Belfrest Place. I'm the corner property by the guardrail that everybody on the way to the high school hits when they come around the corner. Uh what I wanted to call to your attention tonight was it hasn't been mentioned here tonight. The six properties on Brest Place, which is where we live, where our access is to Belrest Place, are all supplied by wells. We don't have city water down there. And there's going to be apparently a great deal of excavation done and movement of property. And I want the developer to be aware of the fact that there may be an impact on our wells. The other side of that coin is if they're moving the property around like they just indicated that they were with respect to the slopes. We've had a lot of runoff problem on Belro's place and we've had to repair it many many times because it's a very steep slope from the top to the bottom and it's been washed out many times. Many times the Ingamore Fire Department has come up and pumped out our basements, not mine cuz I'm at the top of the hill, but the other ones down below. So that runoff issue has to be very carefully looked at. I think the last thing that I want to look at preliminarily was I didn't see any buffering or filtering freeze on the east side of the property. They have it along the perimeter for Bellerest Place and along Harmony, but nothing along Brest Road itself that the properties that back up on from Brest Road to this plant. So, I'd like them to look at that as well. And finally, it's a big deer habitat. Moving those deer out of there is going to move them onto our property. So, I'd like to make sure there's some kind of vegetation in this area that they're

proposing that would keep the deer at home rather than sending them on to us. I'm going to make a second to do a problem. I'm going to hire you myself. Thank you very much. And I'm right behind it.

Hi, Libby Blackburn. So, I actually had traffic study down for one of my things. I don't think anybody can decide on anything until there's a traffic study because there's a lot of problems. I know my neighbor uh did CPR on a person right on Belrest. It is very, very dangerous and I know there isn't access there, but he's exactly correct. Anybody who lives on this side of Belfast, all of those people will be driving on Belfast, regardless of if students going to high school or not. Everybody drives down there. I drive down there. That's that's how you get out that way. If you're going to Target, going to the high school, going to the Wexford Plats, anything. So any houses you add are adding drivers. And probably with this many houses, you're probably adding at least two drivers per house. Not to mention if they have a teenage child. So you are adding more traffic. Um I wanted to go over some of the other things. So as I look at the McCandless website, uh the zoning code is intended to guide future growth so forth. Um and it lists the code's been enacted with the community development objectives specified below. So here's your objectives. provide a pleasant, attractive, healthy, safe, convenient environment for living, working, shopping, education, and recreation. So, I I like that. Unfortunately, this doesn't do that. It actually hinders us in so many ways in what that says. So, safe. We're already discussing a million different safety problems with adding all of these houses. Um, and further down I'll talk about transportation

because that's one of your other points. But, uh, the safety of all of them coming out into that corner where it it is a neighborhood where a lot of people walk. It's actually a much more dangerous corner than you can tell as you look at the map. It's the streets are narrow when people go around. I mean, there's been plenty of people almost hit there. I talk about how I wanted people's to be safer when you're pulling in and pulling out. It's actually really a danger at these corners and they have a house there on the corner. I'm not sure if the people pulling out of there are going to be able to see well to pull on, let alone all of the people on the turn from Woodland and Harmony going back and forth. It's actually very very dangerous. So, I would not call it safe. the education. It It could absolutely cause us to have to do a whole redistricting, which I've been on the school board a long time. The biggest problem we ever have is when we have to redistrict. People hate to be redistricted. Ingamar Elementary is only so big. This plan would absolutely end up in Ingamar Elementary, which means we're going to have to move other people out of Ingamar Elementary. People really dislike redistricting and we definitely have a we we have a very limited amount of space at that elementary school. It's a small elementary school. Some of our class sizes are already at capacity. So, not room. We'd have to do redistricting. That's that's not going to be good. Uh as far as education, this would add at least 400,000. it would we would need to come up with $400 extra,000 is what the math turns out because many people think oh when you add houses it actually helps your taxes but it

doesn't. It costs us $23,58 per person per student per year. So if you do the math on that, if you figure out 1.7 students per household, which is the average for a house, then now we need to come up with another $400,000. So the education isn't isn't going better in that respect because the only taxes we're getting out of it is maybe $5,000 a house. I don't know until they're built, but it's not it's not the 46,000 you know, $1 and and some dollars that it's costing us per household. It's costing us that much per household and we're only getting five. So, so we're losing $41,000 per household on these housing plans. Next point, preserve and improve the natural environment. Well, I've already seen them cutting down a bunch of trees, so we know they aren't preserving the natural environment. Increase property values, employment opportunities, and economic base of the community. Well, it's not increasing property values for sure. The house next door has already put their house up for sale because they know their house value is going to go down hugely when this this plan gets put in. So, it's certainly not doing that. Next, provide safe, adequate, attractive housing for all stages of life. Um, I don't know. I I don't we don't know that one yet. um reduce losses from flooding. Well, I think that's going to be a big problem. And not only is Belrest Place on wells, very much of our neighborhood is on McCutch and Brandt. They're all on wells. It we need to do a lot more studies. And I would say that the developer, if things go wrong with their

wells, they should have to put in any contract that they're going to pay for something. If it if it impacted all of these people's wells, then there needs to be something because that's a substantial loss to people. Um provide necessary infrastructure for safe, adequate utilities and transportation. Well, one thing I know is that school buses can't go up culde-sacs. So, all of those kids, the 20 point, however many kids are going to be right down at that corner cuz that's where the school bus can get them. There's nothing safe about that corner already. I can just see 20 kids in that corner. It this is just a huge This is a fatality waiting to happen is what it is. This is really, really going to be very dangerous. Everything I do is about safety for kids and this isn't it. Um, provide recreational and community facilities. Well, there's a basketball court currently on that lot that I played on a million times. My kids have played there. Everything else, everybody has always played there. The Lowry's always let everybody play on the basketball court. It was really nice. Guess what? it's gone. So, we not only aren't providing recreational and community facilities, we're taking them away. Next, um accommodate reasonable community growth management. Well, I think we're all saying that that's not going well. Provide safe, adequate, attractive commercial, institutional, and industrial uses. Don't think so there either. Most of our neighborhood has acre lots. I would think low density would mean that they should at least have hack bakers. I don't think that's happening. I already heard about three of the lots aren't even going to have the right ratio. I mean, if they wanted to come up with a plan, maybe without that front corner

and maybe with combining several of the other ones, it might be something that I could foresee could be safe. I I can't I don't live on Belrest Place, so I'm not going to speak for them, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out they aren't giving them access to that private road. I I I can't see anything safe for the people who live there. And one thing I do know is they're all going to think, "Oh, why can't a school bus come up here and pick us up?" Well, they can't. They don't go up culde-sac because more times than once they can't get out. Um you can't leave the circle. We we are we do have like a five minute time about 8 minutes. So I just we just comments up.

Didn't see your jelly pin your comments. I just want that's just I I just see a lot of problems here and before anybody decides I think we definitely need the traffic study. We definitely need some asurances for the people with wells. And I certainly would think that they should draw something that covers all the problems before anybody decides on anything. Thank you very much. Want to take your time and I do have a question regarding the school district. Are you saying that the school district does not when they are looking at districtricting and population for schools does not look at the development potential of land. They only look at the existing.

Yes. this existing had one house owned by a family and it had four lots, then the most you would think would be on it would be four houses. I I'm sure that nobody would have thought that this would be sold and that they would be putting up all these houses. So, they do look at development potential.

They look at development potential, but they only look at it they don't even know that this is being I actually brought this up. They did not even realize that this is something that could happen here. Did not realize it. The the land that they look at is if there is um for instance uh Windwood is probably going to be sold that's over 20 acres. So they might notice something there, but that can't be turned into houses because they'd need a variance and they won't give it to them over there probably. But that's that's typical. Typically, they don't give people the ability to put in a bunch of houses. I I know the school district won't be for it because it cost us a huge amount of money. Like I said, it'll it'll we're going to have to come up with over 400,000 more and frankly, we may have to hire another teacher. I mean, it could be astronomical the tax dollars. Thank you.

Yes, sir. Mike Canoy. Um I live down at the bottom left corner bottom left corner where the um little notch is

and um our main term is the water. You know we we get all the water that comes down harrest place. We get the water that comes from that wetland. We've lost our driveway at least three times from from that. So I'm really concerned about where that water is going to go and the retention pond. Where does that drain to? Where where does that goes into wells or like Well, I don't say that. I'm worried about where that water is going to go in the ground because we do have a well. Um, and speaking of traffic, if you put Woodland Road into your GPS, believe it or not, it will send people down Belrest Place past the do not enter or do not the dead end sign through our driveway. That's the little curve in the bottom left. That's our driveway that connects Belress Place and Army Road. They'll go through there and then they drop harmony to the woodland. So, and I I don't know how to change GPS. I've tried anything. And uh and the main thing is it's you know the water issues. It scares us through tension pond makes me nervous. Um plus you guys are killing us here. This is my kids ma the trees in that place. So the our property value is going to really suffer. the the only benefit of living on two roads that aren't maintained is the privacy, you know, so we're losing that.

Thank you. My name is Susan Galbrath and I do live on Balrest Road. Drop that down a little. Thank you.

And I live on Belrest Road. I've lived there probably 40 plus years. our property, the our backyard, buts the property that was sold. My question was, well, I I'm not addressing it to you, but my concern was when the property was supposedly sold in the back, why weren't the residents on Belrest Place and Harmony notified? Because we use we own we have a fence in our backyard and we own so much on the other side of that fence the property that was supposedly sold. No one came and said, "Well, did you and the pegs or there were pegs there where we had it surveyed when we bought the house." Well, they're not there now. Why? So then again, I go out and I see all these things tied around trees right against our fence. Well, we own that property on the other side. Are they cutting down those trees that are tied off? What are they going to do? Nothing was ever a flyer. Nothing was ever put in our mailbox to let us know that anything was happening. We are not prepared for this. We were never told anything. I for one am very upset over it because like I said, we've lived there. We're residential. We're not, you know, it's not the traffic has gotten worse over the years since we've lived there. But and adding these 11

houses right below us, we'll have no privacy whatsoever. because our yard actually goes into where those houses are going to be built. And why does 11 houses in that small space from what I understand should be built there? You know, I don't get it. And it's own over a half acre. And it's just un I don't know. I just don't get it. I don't think it should be proper or should be right that they should be able to just said, "Hey, we're going to build 11 houses just because we want to, not because the residents are asking for it or thinking that it was a good idea." Nobody ever said came and said to us, "Well, what do you what do you think about it?" They don't. If they would have put a flyer in our mailbox and said, "Hey, look, we just bought the property behind you." Um, you have any questions, leave your phone number. We'll call you. No, we never got that either. So, I'm just concerned. Okay, we own some property on the other side of the fence. Do they take it because they want it? I want to know where those pegs went when we had our property surveyed 40 years ago. Thank you.

Thank you. Hi, my name's Kelly Hartman and I am on McCutchen Avenue. Um, I'm just a existing property owner like I my backyard will overlook this development. Um, the first thing I want to touch base on is the traffic at the corner where it comes out like that called like they come out onto Harmony and Woodland that I don't know if you've been there that that sharp turn. I mean, I've I've cut people off. People have cut me off. It's bad. Anybody can say that. And as Libby touched on all those kids standing at that corner, my daughter one year had her bus stop and it was at that corner. I don't know why they had me there. And I complained and complained and after they studied it, they moved her bus stop because that's a bad spot. It's And we have a lot of kids in our neighborhood that are just, you know, there's no bus stop there anymore for a reason. So that's the first thing I want to touch base on. The second, you know, have have you guys been to that neighborhood? Charming, larger lots, charming, unique homes. That is not what this is going to look like. It is not going to fit into the characteristic of Ingamar, the environment and the community that Ingamar has. I mean, it is the most charming neighborhood. That is going to be an eyesore in my opinion. And what kind of homes are going to be built? Standard, tall, they look the same down the street. That is not going to fit in our neighborhood. Um, as far as the buffering, I'd like to know what that is going to be. Is it

going to be trees? Is it going to be fences? Um, I had a couple other concerns. Just those up. I'm so sorry. Um, yeah, like those the the type of homes and the expected price point of these homes because I don't think that these homes are going to increase our value. It's probably going to decrease the value of our homes because they're just they're not going to fit in. I can't. And who are the targeted occupants? Are they firsttime buyers, empty nesters, uh, rentals? Um, the traffic and and timeline of construction like how long will the construction take? How long will this interfere with us? And then my final um comment was the construction truck traffic routes because again we've talked about how charming and the kids that ride bikes on these side streets. What where will that traffic come from? Those big large construction trucks, where will they come from? because these parents need to know that the these kids are so used to driving on these cute little roads and now they're all going to be interrupted. So that's just all I have to say. Thank you.

Thank you for your comments.

Whoops. Traffic see traffic is always a problem.

Traffic's always Michael Couch. I live on Woodland Road. Uh, ditto Libby. Thank you. I would encourage everything that Libby brought up. We've been there for 40 years. I think this would be a travesty for our neighborhood in terms of its uh of the way Ingamar is and uh with this development. Um, you know, initially the the plan seemed to be illconceived and and poorly planned. I'm glad to hear that you're addressing some of the issues, but they're not addressing all of them. Uh, and I particularly the the size of the lots. Uh almost every lot in Incamar is over an acre. We're looking at puny little lots. I would not endorse changing the ratio of the the width to the size of the lots. I think that would be also just adding in u very low valued properties that would impact my uh my property values. So don't have much more to add beyond what everybody else is here. I just think it's an illconceived uh inappropriate and would like this not to not to proceed and we'll do everything I can to make sure that it doesn't. Thank you.

Thank you. Uh the other lady that almost had the accident.

Hi, my name is Cindy Dunahoo. My husband and I have lived on Woodland Road for 46 years. It's actually our starter home. Uh what I wanted to address concerns about traffic as Libby has and some of the others have is that although we live further up on Woodland, uh we foresee that there will be a lot of traffic coming from people trying to avoid the light on at the corner of uh Ingamar and Harmony Road by cutting in through the back streets to try and access the road that will extend at the end of Woodland there. Uh we have a lot of walkers. I've talked to people who go by my house as I'm doing yard work. We have people that come over from Willoughby, from beyond the church. We have tons of walkers and we always have and uh it's a danger to the pedestrians who are on the road if we add maybe 20 to 25 cars going in and out of that area. So, um, along with the size of the lot and the type of home that might be built there, we do have, uh, concerns as long-term residents of that area. So, thank you.

Thank you.

Hi, I'm Kim Garcia. I live on London Road and I'm just gonna um uh talk about the uh what is it the the traffic because let me tell you when you go straight down Harmony and you go past where the uh Coons is, they put a double line on that street. Why? Okay, why would they put a double line on that street? So, if you're coming up um and you're going through the light, you're coming to our street. There's no double line. Are you going to put a double line there? Cuz I will tell you, that's where the lady got killed and her dog when you put the double line in and then somebody made a turn where there was no stop sign and she got killed. So, you better think about the traffic this is going to cause. We've already had like they said, "Oh, somebody's going to get killed." We already had somebody get killed her and her dog. Okay, that's already happened. Have we haven't done any type of um you know checking out to see what the traffic's like in this area before you put these houses because in that in that area where that driveway is going to happen, you're going to have three you're going to have three ways. You're gonna put a red light because you're gonna need something there because those cars coming down Woodland Road, you know, we have a big slope and those bicycles, they just they just go so fast and they they turn around that bend where where that's going to be coming out. They turn on that bend. There's a big bush there. So, you can't see the kids coming around the bend. You can't see a car coming around the bend. You got So, then you're going to have this coming out. You're going to have people coming down Woodland Road to this intersection. And then you're going to have people coming up from the dirt

road. That's a three-way. There are no stop signs. There's no stop sign in that area. And when they come up from Harmony, they come fast. You've got cars. You've got trucks. And it's a dirt road. You have those people on both sides of that dirt road dropping all their brush into that road. You know, you need to check that out. Uh the people that lived in um this house, all their brush is that um road. And when the wind blows, where's it blowing? It's blowing into the road. So everybody's dropping their brush. And these people that live down there have to come up that private road. There's nobody maintaining that road for them. And you and what you're going to see you see is all these large uh tree branches. I mean, they're like they're stumps and they're in almost can be in the road. So you you got to check out this before that intersection. We've already had one woman killed for no reason and her dog. And people actually park right next to that house cuz they don't live here. They park at that intersection and they leave their car and they walk. And I'm like, why are you parking your car at this intersection? So, there are no signs that say no parking. There are no signs that said there's a speed limit of 25. We have to put our own signs out that say slow down. So, I mean, you could put a speed sign up. You could put some stop signs. So maybe that will help the next person from getting killed from, you know, cuz we all walk our dogs on the street. There are no sidewalks. So that's it.

Thank you.

Uh my name is Dan Garcia. I live on Woodland uh for 35 years. Uh my question is before those those were four separate parcels and on that county website all four of them were listed as harmony road. Then after the sale the last parcel the one that faces bell crest if you look on the county website now it's shown as a bell crest. So, I just wondered why they did that for that last parcel. So, perhaps for future access to Belfrest Place.

Just to clarify, uh you're talking about the parcel that's adjacent to Brest. Yes. Originally before the sale when the Lowry family owned that, all four of those lots were Harmony, but but now the last one is actually shows Belfrest on the county website. Is that lot seven or lot eight? Which in I don't know the number. It's the existing lot. So the existing lot down between seven and eight. It's the street. It's the lot that runs the only one that kind of runs parallel to that. The only frontage that it would have, right?

Uh well, it also has a small area along Harmony within existing conditions. So but that's where it sits in comparison to this plan or Yeah. My my assumption would be that that would have been under the county's purview for for changing that. Yeah. I was just wondering if they wanted it, you know, so a plan was in the future to start, you know, having have access to Belrest Place there. That would be county mapping just making an interpretation of what they think it could read as in the interim. That's not any indication of where access will be.

Okay. The other thing was it was did they plan on lights lighting in there? Cuz it's a nice quiet dark, you know. So, is there street lights you're talking about? Yeah, kind of street lights. I guess street lights. I know there's going to be lighting for the houses. If you have many houses, there's going to be a lot of lights on, but I I didn't know if there were planning. So, we haven't seen any plans for street lights. Okay. And that is going to be street lights. Of course, that's going to be uh how are they getting they're going to get city water for that plant? Like every I think everybody on Harmony is wellwater. I'm not positive, but I thought mostly in Harmony is wellwater, but

I believe the developer is in the process of u planning for acquiring the adequate utilities for this development. So, if there's going to be city water in there, do the other residents in Harmony, I wonder if they're they'll be able to access city water rather than be on a well. Okay. I I don't know the answer to that one. I probably would ask Westview Water to see if there's, you know, an option for that. It'll depend on where where properties are from, but typically you can reach out to West Water at any point, ask if what the cost would be They're going to ask you to tap in. They're going to feed for that. But also your lateral to that manufactive.

It's very expensive. And then just to sum it up, I don't want to see that many houses. If there were if there were less houses on bigger lots, I'd be I guess I'd be okay with it. And to the first gentleman was here, my daughter on Belfress. When my daughter was in high school, she did take out his mailbox. Statute of limitations is

My name is Jim Not. I live on the in Woodland. We have a stop sign there, a three-way stop that nobody honors it. So, if you're going to do a traffic study, I think you need to go all the way up the road as well because there's a lot of kids I walk my dog like they say and but they just don't honor this the stop sign at all in any direction. And I would think that if you're going to have that many parcels, that many houses, that many additional cars on that corner, cuz I'd walked around that corner and had to jump into somebody's property, it would need to be a stop. Not not because they're not live to be a stop light.

Thank you. Thank you. Any anyone else? I'm still okay.

Hi, I'm Chris Kennedy. I live on Woodland Road. Uh I I want to thank Gateway Engineers for their comments. Over 100 comments on the previous submission. I encouraged our elected officials, our appointed officials. The devil is in the details as he just walked out. Yeah. We we got to make sure that we understand that this new these new homes won't be detrimental to the existing homes. Otherwise, it's it's bad for everyone including the new homes except for maybe the developers going to make some money and then go away. Let's preserve the neighborhood at the same time trying to be progressive. Uh please adhere to the all the codes uh determine the minimum standards not ideal standards. So, please stick to your guns and let's make this beneficial for everyone.

Thank you.

Hey, my name is Nicole Jeffers. Uh, my husband and I live on Brandt Avenue Extension. Um, I just wanted to I don't have anything new to offer, but I do just want to reiterate that that corner is a disaster waiting to happen with or without new homes. Uh, I've almost hit someone there. Someone's almost hit me. I mean, it just happens. It's such a blind corner. Tell me corner because coming out of the culdeac harmony. Okay.

Yes. Uh, I'm teaching two teenagers to drive. And I told them, listen, you need to treat it like a stop sign, even there's not one there, because uh you when people are coming around the corner, it's just natural to cut it short. And so if you're coming straight from Woodland trying to make that right, whoever is making that other turn, you can't do it at the same time. So I just want to reiterate if there's kids there in the morning, just more cars there in general, it's a disaster waiting to happen with or without new homes. So that's all I really had to say. Thank you. Thank you.

Hi, I'm I'm Travis Cully. I live at 10:30 Woodland. Um, there's been a lot of great comments. I'm not going to waste the board's time obviously, but just one extra comment. I know there's going to be a lot of extra drivers due to these houses, but what we're also concerned about is the the third party drivers, the Amazons, the FedEx, the food delivery, and everything. Everybody in our neighborhood, we all respect that there's a ton of kids playing. I have two sons that I want to make sure that they're safe walking on these streets. But the third party drivers tend to really speed through these. We have a ton of blind spots. It's been hammered in this meeting, but that corner there is crazy. There's also a ton of blind spots that we've addressed um going up towards like my end up the street just because of bushes that have overgrown. Um so we just want to make sure that everybody's still blocking the neighborhood. Um we want to preserve the character of our neighborhood. Um I also one one unique thing about our neighborhood is that um I grew up on Woodland. I live five houses down from where I grew up. Um, my cousins all live up and down the street. We all went off to college to other places. We went we moved for work. We all came back like to Woodland. That's that's unheard of. It's because of the characteristic of that street. We have old trees. We have wide open spaces. Um, I don't blame anyone for wanting to build homes and and that's what America is about, owning a business, making money, and and I want people to realize the American dream of owning a home. I I I have no problem with people moving into our beautiful neighborhood, but we have to work on preserving the characteristic of the neighborhood. I know we want to increase the tax base with with more homes, with more people moving to the neighborhood, but if you look into perpetuity, if we lose the characteristic of our neighborhood, my sons aren't going to want to move back to Woodland like I did it. You know, all my cousins kids are not going to want to. So, I'm just asking the board just to be mindful of that when you do this. Um, that's it. My

voice is shaking. Sorry. Right. Thank you. Hi, I'm Rachel Shipper. This is Dominic Shipper. We both live on Woodland Road. Oh, you both do. That's

Travis's is my cousin. And I just I know a lot of people have mentioned the wells, but I wanted to get a little bit more specific about the requests. Um I think it would be a good idea to have a baseline study done of all the wells on Harmony, on Woodland, on Brandt, on McCuten. Um because I'd like to bring up the point that not only should not only should a baseline study be done but you know maybe 12 months after after the construction has been done to be sure that nothing the quality and the quantity of the water continues to persist. Also I'd like the asurances of what would happen if something happens to our wellwater during construction. Um, I think the only option would be to connect to Westby water, but that could take months. What happens in the interim? Um, our houses would be basically uninhabitable while while we're without water. So, thank you.

Thank you. Thank both of you.

Hi, my name is Terry Sabuko. live on Woodland. My family has lived there for 20 years. And I just want to reiterate what my neighbors have already said just with regards to safety, traffic, the size of the lots with regards to the rest of the neighborhood in terms of continuity. Um the Gateway report has a lot of deficiencies cited. All those need to be addressed and so the list goes on. So I just want to be in camaraderie with my with my with my neighbors. Thank you. Thank you. Anyone else?

Yes. What's that? Again, it the traffic has gotten so dense there really on Ingamar Road. If it's rush hourish, like four or five o'clock, uh if I want to go for a run in North Park with the traffic already, I cannot make a left on Brest to Ingamar. I have to make a right, go to 7-Eleven, go through the parking lot, and then go out. It's ridiculous. It's really gotten that bad. Okay. Your neighborhood is beautiful. You see me with my dogs all the time. That is a very dangerous curve right there. You really have to look out for it. Thank you. Anything else? Some good comments.

Yes, sir.

All right. David Sheper, I'll make a quick comment. Um, it's a really nice neighborhood. only been there for a couple years. Moved in, not from Pittsburgh. Um, it's kind of like a park. Kind of like there's so many people walking. I live, again, like my wife said, on Woodland Road, a lot of people walking down there. Traffic's not great if we can avoid it. We got kids on bikes. So, any others? Well, thank you. Some, as I said a minute ago, some some good comments. um they all get listened to uh and as you can see from gateway report uh they will be looking at a hundred or so uh different points all of many of which were already brought up not all but many were so thank you again anything else uh from up here before we move and I'm not sure we're clearly not ready to move uh for anything at the moment or Um, Anna, can you confirm that if it's the intent of the planning commission to have this application tabled, does that need to come from the applicant or do we need to make a motion or anything?

Not have to. So, we can table application at any time. The only thing we need to be cognizant guidelines um in this instance, I can imagine they be consent to a waiver if they worried about because otherwise you would recommend education. Right. Right. I would agree. I would agree. Uh, so yes, five minutes. Five minutes. Put a clock on that.

Okay, if I just say a few things for the record. Sure. Okay. So the um the abuing properties above there are 12 lots and I heard some comments about it doesn't fit the character. Um in that one area just along the top there are 12 lots and we have one two three four five lots. So it's fitting the natural character of the area. Um, we are proposing a lower density than what could be developed, but also the maximum cut on the lot is 20 ft and it's only in a small area so that we can get enough dirt to put over on the other side. So, the depth of cut is not like the depth of a water well cut and it's towards the front of the property. Um, any certain thing else that

No, I mean, you know, we we've developed six or seven plans at the time. I'm going to come up and speak. Yeah.

My name is Don P and you know, hearing some of the comments, um, you know, we've been developing property in the town of McCannis for 35 years. We developed a number of plans and um you know I take issue with the developers just there to make money and get out. I live in a townless have for 25 years you know develop Stone Brook Village, develop uh the arbors um you know a bunch of different communities. So, you know, our our intent is to make money. That's our business. But also to leave a, you know, beautiful piece of property when we're done. You know, we're going to take that house that was built in 1939. It was built by uh Otto Derry, the owners of Autodair, and we're going to renovate that house, and it's going to be an outstanding piece of property. It'll it'll be a gem when it's done. So that's all I wanted to say.

Thank you. Do you have any more questions for us? I do not. Okay. Thank you. Thank you.

Sorry, I'll be quick this time. Libby Blackburn, I think it's very unfair to compare these properties against the properties up behind them that aren't part of the neighborhood. They're on a totally different street that's not at all part of the neighborhood. We're talking about our neighborhood, which is where the street comes out to our neighborhood. It doesn't go up to Berrest. So, you need to look at our properties, which I know I have over an acre as do most of my neighbors. Are these even halfacre lots? I don't know. But that would be my question. How big are these? Because I can tell you they definitely don't match the the neighborhood. So, thank you. Thank you.

Where are we on? Um I believe they will be fine e next meeting. Yeah, I I would think so too. I would hope so. Yeah. Okay. Uh I think based on the comments that have made uh issues, outstanding issues yet to be decided issues. Uh uh I will ask for a motion to table this until the next meeting. Can I have that motion? Moved. And second, Mark. Second from Mark. Uh, all in favor of tableabling. I

I opposed. All right. Uh, you want to explain the tableabling? Mr. Paul probably already knows, but uh what happens when something is tabled?

Yeah. Um essentially, you know, whenever the Miss Valley's planning code has certain criteria for when uh the municipality has to hear items, uh typically when a developer comes in and there's a number of comments, they can either request the tableabling or the planning commission can uh table until the next meeting. Um so the notion that you deterred is the tableing um until the correct date. It'll be tableabling until the May 5th planning commission meeting. And you're all welcome to uh be back again or uh keep in keep in touch the best way you want to see how. Thank you all. Um as far as the agenda goes um time to make a motion for adjournment.

We have general public. Yeah. Is there I didn't present yours. I'm sorry. But is there anything that anybody wants to to bring up? We do still have a meeting that we're conducting. So, if you could keep comments to the the hallway or wait until we're done conducting meeting. Thank you. All right. No other comments about any other topics. You can you come up and state your name, please? My name is Brian Dley. I live on McCuchen Avenue. Is there a rendering in this process of a home that is good? There will be. There will be legit.

There's there's no requirements for a subdivision approval to show a rendering of what the buildings are. So there there's no requirements to do that. Um typically developers will at some point in the process I'd just like to see what it looks like if it was going to meet the characteristics of our of our neighborhood. Thanks. Thank you. Okay. Hearing no comments for a motion to adjurnn. Can I have a motion? So moved. So moved. Second. Second. John moved it and Shel seconded it. Uh all in favor of adjournment. Opposed. We are journed.

Yeah. I mean the codes are so behind