Housing and Land Use Committee (2025-2027) - Regular Meeting

Mm-hmm. Thank you.

Thanks, Paul.

Will the Disaster Recovery International Affairs and Planning Committee come to order? The time is now 9.04. If everyone can please silence their cell phones or other noise-making devices, that will help our cause. Members, in accordance with the Sunshine Law, if you are not in the council chambers, please identify by name who, if anyone, is in the room, vehicle, or workspace with you today. Minors do not need to be identified. Also, please see the last page of the agenda for information on meeting connectivity. My name is Tamara Poulton, and I'll be your chair for today's DRIP committee meeting. Our committee vice chair, Nohe Uu Hajin, should be joining us shortly, so she's excused at this time. We have with us in the chamber today, Councilmember Kawanoe Batangan, And also in the chamber, we have Council Member Tom Cook. Aloha kakahiaka.

Aloha kakahiaka, Chair. It's good to be back, and I'm looking forward to today's meeting.

Do you need somebody to help enable your camera? Oh, okay. There you go. And next up, we have Council Member Gabe Johnson. Aloha kakahiaka.

Aloha and good morning, Chair, council members, community members. There's no testifiers here at the Lanaihe District Office. I'm alone on my side of the office with a snoring doggy here and ready to work. Thank you.

Thank you. Next up, we have Council Chair Alice Lee. Aloha kakahiaka.

Aloha kakahiaka, Chair. I'm here alone in my workspace with my little cat menagerie. If you're going to Israel, you might want to learn to say makawe, Mako Wei is an informal greeting over there. Looking forward to your meeting. Thank you.

Thank you. Next up, we have Council Member Keani Rawlings-Fernandez, Mako Wei, and aloha kakahiaka.

Aloha kakahiaka, Chair. Aloha kakahiaka kākou. Mai molokai nui ahina. I'm at my private residence alone. There are no testifiers at the Molokai District Office. Mahalo, Chair.

Thank you. Next up, we have Council Member Shane Sinenti.

Aloha kakahi. Aloha po'a kahi kakou. Makahi kina here at my home office. I'm here by myself. There's no testifiers in Hanachan.

Thank you. And last but not least, we have Council Member Sugimura Makowe and aloha kakahi a kā.

Makowe and good morning, everybody. Looking forward to a productive meeting in the Council Chambers.

Thank you. This meeting of the Disaster Recovery, International Affairs and Planning Committee of the Maui County Council is located on the traditional Aina of Kanakawewi, who never ceded their sovereignty to the United States. We recognize that Her Majesty Queen Liliuokalani yielded the Hawaiian Kingdom to the U.S. in duress under threat of violence to avoid the bloodshed of her people. We further recognize that Hawaii remains an illegally occupied nation state by the U.S., as documented in a 2021 scholarly article for the National Lawyers Guild Review by Andrew Reed, adjunct professor of law at the University of Denver's Durham College of Law. Generations of kanaka maoli and their knowledge systems have sustainably cared for Hawaii and continue to do so. We are grateful to occupy this space and learn the ways in which we can contribute. As a committee, we seek to support the various strategies that the indigenous people of Hawaii are using to protect their land and their communities and commit to dedicating time and resources to working in solidarity. From the administration, the Department of Planning, we have Planning Director Jackie Takakura and Senior Planner Karen Koncovich. From the Department of Public Works, we'll have Public Works Director Jordan Molina. From the Department of Environmental Management, we'll have Senior Civil Engineer Scott Rollins. From the Department of Fire and Public Safety, we'll have Deputy Fire Chief Gadjibin Fujioka and CIP Coordinator Michael Arsuni. From the Department of Housing, we will have Director of Housing, Remi Mitchell. From the Department of Human Concerns, we have Director of Human Concerns, Margaret Willis. From the Department of Management, we have Executive Assistant, Noah Jackson. From the Department of OEV Resources, we'll have Deputy Director, Kekai Robinson. From the Department of Parks and Recreation, CIP Coordinator, Bill Frampton. From the Department of Transportation, we'll have CIP Coordinator, Julia Meinhart. From the Department of Water Supply, we'll have Engineering Program Manager James Jensen, and from Corporation Council, we'll have Deputy Corporation Councils Nahulu Nunakawa and Michael Hopper. Other resources we have are Daniel Kanahele, South Maui CPAC Vice Chair, and Dick Mayer, Professor, retired emeritus. Members, without objection, I will designate Mr. Kanahele as a resource person under Rule 18A of the Rules of the Council, due to their knowledge and expertise as a South Maui Community Plan Advisory Committee member. I will also designate Mr. Mayor as a resource person under Rule 18A of the Rules of the Council due to their knowledge and expertise as a retired University of Hawaii economics professor. We also have- No objection. Thank you. No objection. We also have DRIP Committee staff with us this morning. Oh, sorry. And also Vernon Kalanikau, a CPAC member as well, as a Rural 18A resource. Thank you. For DRIP Committee staff, we have Senior Legislative Analyst James Krueger, as well as Legislative Analyst Jarrett Pasquale and Ryan Ramirez, Senior Committee Secretary Yvette Boutellier, Assistant Clerk Ryan Ramirez, and Ambassador of Aloha Brian Martins. We have one item on today's agenda, DIP 25, Bill 108, 2026 South Maui Community Plan Update. We will take testimony after opening remarks and presentations. To get us ready and in the mood to dive back into the South Maui Community Plan, we have the draft South Maui vision statement, which reads as follows. South Maui's beaches, coastal waters, and wetlands are restored and thriving with affordable housing close to good jobs and a variety of transportation options, including safe walking and biking paths, lined with trees. The region's businesses, parks and neighborhoods are connected, maintaining the small town lifestyle. Cultural resources are protected and celebrated, enhancing South Maui's sense of place. Is Mr. Mayor on? I think we're ready for his presentation.

Yes, sure. He's online.

Okay. Good morning, Council Members. If I could get the PowerPoint. I'm going to be using a PowerPoint to go through the presentation. It may seem strange that I'm an upcountry resident talking about South Maui, but my background in South Maui goes back to when i was on the maui planning commission in 1971 through 73 and was involved in the approval of the wailea resort project back then and also a year later in 74 involved in the uh seibu project in mckenna when they bought the land from ulapalakua ranch and i was involved in the reviewing the the very first i think environmental impact statement in hawaii uh for south maui I'll be going through a few maps and diagrams and I'd like to just share some of the highlights of what I'm trying to do. One of the things about the plan that is a problem and going to be a big problem, I think, is that there are no unit counts. Nowhere in the plan do I see the number of housing units that will be established in the plan. and this becomes a problem obviously because the number of people and the number of housing units greatly impact all the infrastructure needs and whatever last week you heard in the kihei residents talking about some of the frustrations they're already having in south maui and uh very concerned about some of the additions that the plan may uh produce The de facto population is something I'll get into a little bit later, but that's the number of people actually in South Maui at any one time, not the residents, but the residents plus visitors, et cetera. So what are going to be the impacts? And then an important element missing in the plan is a good financial plan, which is required in Maui County Code 2.8B70F. where there's a financial element that's required. And finances is not just where you're going to be spending the money, but where the money is coming from and whether you have a viable plan will depend on whether the resources are there to implement the plan. And there is a list of projects and actions to be taken, but many, many of them, as you'll see, are to be determined. The numbers are not there, so we don't know what the costs will be. Next item. This is a map of what you'll be getting into in Chapter 3, the growth areas. And I'd just like to quickly go through them, and then I'm going to review them in more detail. You'll see, starting on the left, with the Hawaiian homelands, the 400 units that will be there in Kamalani. Then the North Kihei Mauka area has about 2,000 units. And these numbers that I'm giving you are either in environmental documents that they may have written or best estimates the area in north kihei mauka is very similar to what maui lani has in terms of area and also function just like maui lani has a commercial area a large residential area some schools etc the north kihei mauka is about the same size maui lani has about 2 000 units so that's where that number comes from it will be comparable to that area and then just below that You'll see what was formerly called the Mega Mall site or Pilani Promenade, which would be a small town center with about 600 units. To the right of that is the high school and then Lepoa. Lepoa is scheduled for 1,250 units, but it also has 2 million square feet of commercial and industrial things that will have to be accounted for in terms of impacts. Moving further south, you'll see the lead core, the Honolulu, formerly Wailea 670 units, and then, of course, the attempt to convert the golf course into a residential community, and then McKenna to the south. Next slide. This is a look at North Kiai, and you'll see here there are four major projects listed here, the Hawaiian Homelands, the Kihei North 2000, the Mega Mall, and the Lepoa. That's a total down at the bottom there. You'll see over 4,000 units that are potentially going to be in the plan that will be putting a lot of traffic onto Pi'ilani Highway. There's a possibility of getting a road link from the North Kihei Mauka area over to the Veterans Highway. But it's only a two-lane road and it's not funded in the plan. So right now, all of these units, the 4,000 plus units, all would be put as an impact on Peelani Highway.

Next slide.

Now looking at the other end of Kihei, at the other end of the Piilani cul-de-sac. Piilani should really be looked at as a cul-de-sac, a very long, 8, 10-mile-long dead-end road. And at that end, you have Lead Corps, and these numbers are coming directly from their documents. Lead Corps is proposing 975 units. Honua has already been approved at $1,150 total. Then the golf course conversion, Mr. Chan wants to convert one of the golf courses at Wailea to 900 residential units. And finally we get over to McKenna where there are several projects there. Up above MOCA, you see the McKenna Estates. Those are 72 lots that have already been approved. Those are ag lots and did not have to go through the normal zoning because they're agricultural lots. But there are 72 of those units that are going to be put up, the 36 main units and the farm dwellings on those units, on the ag lots. And then McKenna MOCA, The EIS process has been, the environmental impact statement process has been gone through, and they are going to have 652 plus. And then you have in the lower right-hand corner, the H2 project, which has already been approved with 53. That gives a total down at the south end of South Maui of over 3,000, or actually around 3,800 total units. Next slide. So I put those into a graph that will perhaps help us understand what the impacts will be. And this is something you'll be able to come back to and refer to when you go through chapter three. And then now you'll be going into chapter four to see what the cost will be. And you see a black line in the middle of that page. It separates two different groups. The ones above the black line, numbers one through seven, are ones that have for the most part all been entitled already. They need some entitlements, but most of them are probably going to be going through. And that represents a total already approved 4,500 units. And then moving over to the right side there, uh you'll see various water and other uh impacts on cars etc and the number of housing units the blind below the line black line are ones that this plan would potentially add to the 4 500 units and that's roughly 3 500 more and there are three major product projects in that category the north key mauka the mega former muggy mall site, which is called Pete Lonnie Promenade, and also Chan's golf course conversion. Those are 3,500 additional units that would be added by this plan. Total, down at the very bottom, 8,000 potential units. You've heard that number used. Now, these numbers do not even include Ohana units, the people who already own property may want to add to their properties. It does not include, for example, the Kraus project in central Kihei, which would have a large number of those near the Safeway store, and many, many other projects in South Maui. Next slide. Let's take a look at the top. This is the ones above the black line. These are ones, for the most part, that you can do very little about, but you do have to account for the impacts of those projects. And what I've done on the right side there, as you go over, let's just take the Lepoa R&T Park, the second one down, 1,250 units. They indicate there that there's going to be a hotel there and potentially 2 million square feet of commercial industrial, those that will obviously generate a lot of traffic. Then they claim the water use will be around 800,000 gallons per day for commercial and hotel use. You can ask your staff whether that's a reasonable number or not, but that's the number that's being used right now. now there's no way to know exactly how many cars will be done uh many people say oh it's rough you should always account for roughly two cars per unit i've said let's let's tone that down a little bit because some of them will be single family homes single person homes so i use 1.5 cars per unit so all the numbers in that potential added cars are based on one and a half cars per unit So that would put, looking at the bottom there, 6,800 additional vehicles on the road, assuming that most vehicles are used two or three times a day for various trips to schools, pick up kids, go shopping, go to work, et cetera. We're talking about a lot of trips being generated Nowhere in the plan does it indicate what the traffic volumes will be in addition to what exists today. And some people have used the word paralysis or parking lot to describe Pilani Highway and obviously the South Maui Road, which has been threatened by flooding. And then to the right, something that I know you're all concerned about is housing. I've done what I think is the best estimate of what Affordable housing can be expected from each of these projects. Some of them have listed their housing units, some have not. And you'll see there a full range of, for example, the North Kihei, the very top line, is the Hawaiian homelands. That'll be 400 units. That'll be all affordable. Then the next one down is Lapua, which I think has a requirement of somewhere between 20 to 25 units. uh etc so i put down there the total affordable which means that the residue the remainder will be unaffordable in the sense that there'll be market price and probably going for well over a million dollars each most of those will be going to people who will be moving to maui so the question the council has to ask is to what degree do you have an obligation to provide housing for people who will be moving here, and many of those will be second homes. And particularly down in Wailea Makena, for example, the LIDCOR project and the Makena Mauka project, both in their environmental impact statements, try to make it look like they'll have minimum impacts on traffic And they say very clearly that somewhere around 90% of their homes will be for second home owners. People moving here will be second home, and therefore they try to say that there'll be not much traffic impact from their projects. But that's not true when the second home market is full during Christmas time, January, February, and then in the summer, July, August, when those second homes are all occupied and the traffic will be intense. Next slide. These are the projects that you potentially do not have to include in the plan. You could go ahead and say, let's not go ahead right now. This is supposed to be a 20-year plan. And you could easily say, we do not have to put it in the plan now. It can come back for a review after 10 years as required by law. that we'll look and see whether we still need these three projects to be added because they put a lot of additional, in addition to the 4,000 plus already entitled, pressure on South Maui. Next slide. This is a summary, again, go back to the slide I showed before. This is a summary of all the, go back. Drop one down. Thank you. Those are all the potential units. And I would hope that you would keep this list in mind and maybe use, if you find that their numbers are wrong, please get the correct numbers. What you'll notice is that the, and I'm gonna go back to the water one, the total water at the very bottom there in yellow is six million gallons a day is what they claim. but that doesn't always include all the irrigation water on golf courses and other amenities, et cetera. So we have to figure out what the total water capacity, and then what we need to do is to balance it against the supply of water. Next slide. Here I've tried to describe some of the impacts, and I mentioned the de facto population at the beginning, And this is important so you know how many people need to be taken care of. And it goes for all kinds of things. For example, the residents, they say, is about 27,000. The visitors, around 26,000, 27,000. workers on an average day, around 11, 12,000 workers in South Maui. And then you have second homeowners who aren't really visitors because they do have a residency around Maui. If you add that total up, you're probably coming in the area somewhere between 50 and 70,000, 50 to 70,000 people at any one time. So you have to make sure there's enough water for them, wastewater, road capacity, intersection capacity, and all the other amenities and needs that a large population would need. Because even though the workers do not live down there, they do traffic, they use the toilets, they have wastewater, they may be taking care of the swimming pools, etc. Going down, we need to look also at the peak de facto population, not just the average, but the peak as well. Finally, I would wish the plan would have done a better study on water. There is no analysis done in the plan of the gallons per day versus the sustainable yield in the Kama'oli aquifer. And that's for both potable water and irrigation water. That's something that you should be asking the planning department and water department to give you. And then you go down the list there and other infrastructure. Now, one thing that's not also included, they will give you a list of infrastructure projects, but they make no mention that once you build these infrastructure projects, they have to be maintained and repair and will have enormous impacts on the county budget. On the right-hand side, I've indicated some of the concerns and things that impacts that might be taking place there that need to be accounted for. And it even goes down in the lower right-hand corner with schools, et cetera, even though the schools are not your responsibility, there's no mention of how much increased schools and whether it's even possible to get the state to fund it. Right now, the state is going to be building a school at Waikapu Country Town, two schools, an intermediate school and an elementary school. Will there be a school that will be able to take the population that this plan would allow? Next slide. That's only one more. This is a page that I put together to help you understand the costs that the plan has. You'll see on the left-hand column the page number in the plan. And then you see the dollar amounts and where the dollar amounts are going to be coming from, at least according to the plan. Some are going to be county finance, state finance. Some are going to be combination of county and state. The largest one, one of the largest ones is the county, state, and federal finance. which is 267. Is it reasonable to get that money? Does the county have the money to provide all these things? Unfortunately, of the 145 items that are listed in the list, only 80 of them have actual dollar amounts. So there are 50 where there is no dollar amount, just says to be determined. I would ask you to have the planning department go back with a good pen and find out uh exactly what those to be determined costs might be even if they can't say exactly they should be able to say six million to ten million or some number that will give you an approximation of what the impacts on the county budget will be in the future and 15 items on the right there are not not applicable in other words they say that there's no dollar amount because in most cases they just think staff in the departments are actually going to take care of that particular item And lastly, those numbers are all $2,022 amounts. You should be asking the planning department to get updated things. It's five years. As you know, the county budget itself has gone from seven or 800 million up to 1.5. It's practically doubled in the last five years. And so these numbers are all gross underestimates of the impacts that the county will have to finance the plan. Next slide. I want to wish you all the best in your efforts and I hope that you'll be able to produce a plan that will meet the needs and provide for what South Maui community deserves. Glad to answer any questions.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. If you can write down your questions until after we have public testimony. I'd like to also mention that another resource that we have is Director Mark Takamori from the Department of Transportation, and I'd like to welcome Committee Vice Chair Nohe Uu Hodgins. Aloha kakahiaka and makeo.

Good morning, Chair. Good morning, everyone. I'm at my private residence. My husband is home right now, William, but he's actually on his way out to Napa to hopefully fix his car soon. But other than that, I'll be home by myself. Thank you.

Thank you. Did we have Corporation Council, were they online to give a slight presentation about what's or explanation about what's required of us of the financial plan beyond what Dick Mayer had presented?

Hi, Chair. Michael Hopper here. I didn't know if you wanted that now. If you give me a moment, I can maybe look at that or maybe do that after testimony. But I can discuss that, but I didn't know you would have us do that before testimony.

So I can get that ready to discuss.

Thanks.

Sure. And then I just wanted to provide some updates from where we left off on Friday before we get into testimony. There had been some complaints in testimony that it was difficult to follow along. And so I just wanted to make mention that staff separated all of the attachments in meeting details for folks that wanted to access them. So if you look in the meeting details for today's committee meeting, um attachment one is separated out and labeled as uh granicus number four attachment two is five and so on and so forth so a lot of the attachments that had previously been grouped under one attachment and still is because we didn't take that one down also are reposted um individually. So if members of the audience want to try and find a specific attachment, they can go on to the meeting details and find the corresponding number like Today we will be going with attachment 3C, which is number 8 on Granicus. So that was extra work from our committee staff to make things more easy for the viewing public to find. The committee has so far completed its review and amendments to Section 2.5 and closed out Section 2. There were several outstanding policies in Section 2 that the committee can revisit at a later point. I didn't insist on people working through the weekend to get those up to par. So the attachments for today, would be granicus number eight, which is the 3C matrix from attachment 3C, and granicus number 16, which is attachment 10B, the matrix on South Maui community plan alignment with general plan policies. Also, granicus item number 24 is the crosswalk that says what attachments correspond to which sections, Appendix H, which was called out, is in your South Maui Community Plan draft booklet in the back. And if the grant case items are slow to load, you can also find all attachments individually on southmaui.wearemaui.org homepage under the Transmittal and Related Attachments tab. As a reminder, the main motion as amended recommending passage on first reading of Bill 108 carries over from last week's meeting. Is there any opening remarks as we head into Section 4 from the Department of Planning or Department of OEV Resources?

Thank you, Chair. This is Jackie from the Department of Planning. No comments right now, but we are heading over and we'll see you in person shortly.

Oh, awesome. Thank you. And to the point about a fiscal plan, I did see that Goal 2.1.3 talks kind of about a fiscal plan, but it looks like it was deleted at the CPAC level. So, I mean, you guys... did seem to try to make a fiscal plan there, because that was a planning department proposal, but I'm not sure why it was deleted at the CPAC level, so I don't want to put all the blame on you guys for not putting together any kind of fiscal plan. Department of OEV Resources, any opening remarks?

Sorry, Chair. I don't believe OEV Resources is on at this time. They'll be joining a bit later, around 10 o'clock.

Oh, okay. We will now move on to public testimony for DRIP 25. Written testimony is encouraged and can be submitted via the e-comment link at maui-county.us backslash agendas. Testifiers wanting to provide oral testimony should join the online meeting via the Microsoft Teams link printed on today's agenda. or call in to the phone number, which is also on today's agenda. For individuals wishing to testify via Teams, please raise your hand by clicking on the Raise Your Hand button near the top right of your screen. For those calling in, please follow the prompts via phone. Staff will add names to the testifier list in the order testifiers sign up or raise their hands. For those on Teams, staff will lower your hand once your name is added. Staff will then call the name you're logged in under or the last four digits of your phone number when it is your time to testify. At that time, staff will also enable your microphone and video. Please ensure your name on Microsoft Teams appears as the name you prefer to be referred to as or as anonymous if you wish to testify anonymously. If you are in person, please notify staff that you would like to testify anonymously. Otherwise, please state your name for the record at the beginning of your testimony. Oral testimony is limited to three minutes. If you are still testifying beyond that time, I will kindly ask you to complete your testimony. Once you're done testifying or if you do not wish to testify, you can also view the meeting on Akaku Channel 53. Facebook Live or MauiCounty.us Backlash Agendas. At this time, we will call on testifiers wishing to testify on DRIP 25.

Thank you, Chair. Our first testifier is Johan Law, followed by caller 4945.

Good morning, Johanna Wall. I'm testifying on my own behalf and I'm a huge fan of Dick Mayer, but I have some different views from him on some of the things he addressed.

Oh, we just lost your sound for some reason. We could hear you up until you said you're a big fan of Dick Mayer, but you have some differences.

Can you hear me now? Yes. So the first thing is the financing. I'm not sure a plan, it's not a list of things that you have to pay for. I think that's the point of having different priorities and stuff like that. You would look at the plan and then try to get funding for different things. It's looking into the future by definition. It's not setting a budget is my point, I guess. Another thing is the... population and all the impacts. One thing to keep in mind is that there's a lot of vacant housing in South Maui. And I think that's the way it's always gonna be. I don't think it's correct to assume that if you add a certain amount of units, you're gonna get that much population. But another thing is that like population growth. So if 2000 people leave, if 2000 locals or transplants leave and 2000 people move in, that's zero, right? So I think just to keep up with people wanting to stay or moving back, you need a lot of housing built just for that. So it's never like, you know, and this is a thing that happens in a lot of places, like the city of Austin is losing people as it's gaining people, and the result is like a lot of schools because of gentrification, the families move out. and young wealthy people move in and the schools are underpopulated so there's a lot of complexity to this stuff um with the water like i mean that's probably the number one issue i guess but there's a lot of opportunities too and what i learned working on the act 217 wastewater overlay project is that r1 and r2 water is like a big opportunity where if you replace a lot of the potable water being used for irrigation with that recycled water you can uh you can you basically get water that you can use for for housing and there's equity issues and i know like the native hawaiian rights are prioritized for farming and stuff like that but there's opportunity i guess is my main point and the same goes for traffic um you know you're not just adding cars to the road you could be removing cars like if people can live close to where they work like especially in Waialea, like the traffic is people going to and from Kahului. So if more people can live closer, that can reduce traffic. So there's a lot of things like that where, you know, from an economist perspective, I can see like, you know, you're looking at numbers and things like that, but there's kind of like a more holistic planning and geographic perspective as well. So thank you.

Thank you so much. Members, any questions for the testifier? Seeing none, thank you for your testimony. Brian, can you call the next testifier?

Thank you, Chair. Our next testifier is caller number 4945, followed by Greg Wilski.

Staff, has 4945 been enabled? Okay, go ahead, testifier 4945.

Aloha, this is Jesse Laws. Do you read me? Yes. Okay, sorry about that. Couple extra seconds of everybody's time in the day. Usually that doesn't happen and let the teleprompter, they don't cut it on until right when they call the testifier, then it says I got on mute and then silence for about two or three seconds and then it's... And he can't hear you. And then he said, go ahead, set the fire. So more waste of time, but I guess that's what, um, it's what y'all get paid for. I got the same old grumble. I appreciate everybody coming in and coming on time and going to work this morning. Um, I guess you're, I guess y'all are there. I can't see anybody. I hear tomorrow. I guess you're in the chamber there and, uh, I appreciate everybody that's been participating. I wish there was more testifiers, but I guess the certain lawyers in the county don't like testifiers being there. They only like people who present their point of views on the South Mali community plan. So if anybody could remind them, we work for the people and not the other way around. And let me know when the bell goes off. I didn't set my timer, but I'm pretty sure I can burn out my three minutes with this rumbling about stuff. Hopefully, I'm going to tune in at 10 o'clock, and I have 75% of my phone, so hopefully I can hang in there until the OEV resources people get there. I'm pretty much going all in on the Hawaiian stuff because the American government is kind of letting us down now, and First thing I heard Mr. Mayor say was gonna cost a lot of money. So I'm wondering why. And I would suggest that all the money that's been spent on these lawyers to keep people out and persecute people and then take them to court and spend more millions of dollars like Christopher Salem case and my case where they're keeping me away from the building and all they get is three minutes to participate. I suggest you guys spend the equal time equal money and time on doing good stuff for the community instead of making it harder for people to live. Especially the, I'm rebeccing my mainstay to recycle. You're gonna spend tens of thousands of dollars on lawyers, keep people out of the building there. And I see the extra security guys loitering around the front there and at your cell phones and talking story with each other. And I suggest you spend it on the three-can plan that Kelly King was, I'm sure it was not all her idea, but yeah, so you got to see where I'm going with this. Recycling and key hay is very, very important. And I don't see why they didn't have the money for it before. So, I mean, they spent some money on some, I hear the bell, I hear the bell. I'll spend some money on recycling and get the pre-can plan going again. And I heard you, Chair Paulton, say that we can't tell who to vote for, or you can't tell people who to vote for.

Thank you for your testimony. If members have any questions, seeing none, thank you for your testimony. Brian, can you call the next testifier?

Thank you, Chair. Our next testifier is Greg Rilski, followed by Albert Perez. I'll enable his.

Mr. Rilski, is he enabled on our end? Okay, go ahead.

Hello. There we go. Hello, Deputy Committee. I just want to say, first off, I didn't realize how involved all of these planning meetings are. So thank you guys all for being so diligent and going through all this. I just really have two things I want to highlight since I recently found out that it is in the planning committees or the community plans where the short-term rental housing numbers get set. so considering everything that's going on with our the questionable housing we have i just hope that part of uh this plan is going to be an opportunity to increase that number to help offset all of the uh all the other things that are going on uh then the other thing i just want to comment on is As a survivor of the Lahaina fire, getting out is really important. I can't think of anything more important than getting out. I lost everything, but I got out. So with that in mind, I know during the YLA 670 project, it was like, oh, we need to widen the road down there. But I honestly lost track of how that got done. um how that didn't happen so i'm just hoping that uh you know you're adding potentially a bunch of housing that before any of that can even get built you know the the the evacuation routes the um water necessary for any fire mitigation all that stuff gets done that the clearing of fellow lands, maybe it gets part of this and that everyone is kind of held accountable. So that's all I have. I know you guys have been very busy. I'm glad I was able to jump in here at some point and just put a little bit of, of, uh, of contribution. And thank you all very much. This concludes my testimony.

Thank you members. Any questions for the testifier? Seeing none. Thank you for your testimony. Right.

Thank you, Chair. Our next testifier is Albert Perez, followed by Kay Anderson.

Good morning, Chair Paulton, members of the committee. Happy Monday. It's Albert Perez again, Maui Tomorrow. Yeah, I just wanna comment on what's required to be in community plans by code, whether people agree with it or not. And just as a preliminary statement, I'll point out that the language in the county charter and in Maui County Code, Chapter 2.80 regarding community plan requirements is mandatory, not permissive, and the Council is required to ensure that the community plans meet those criteria, specifically 2.80 .070. There's a long list of things that are required. The Charter also says that the Commission makes recommendations and the Council is who can approve and create the ordinances um specifically section 8-8.5 of the charter says that maui county code 2.80b is binding on the council's ordinances council also has investigatory power so it need not just accept the draft but could look into potential impacts of proposed community plan provisions as well as modify those provisions and I'm just gonna quickly, which time do I have left, Chair? I'm flipping through screens on my computer. One minute, okay. So if you look at section 2.80B.070 paragraph E, it says, each community plan must contain. And then it lists 16 different things. And then F is the implementation program. And that gets to what Dick Mayer was talking about, a capital improvement element and a financial element. And as his PowerPoint said, the financial element shall describe a fiscally sound financial program for identified actions and capital improvements. So it has to be fiscally sound and there should be a fiscal impact analysis. As I testified previously, it's not just the cost of constructing the infrastructure, it's the cost of operating infrastructure. And a simple example would be if you have a certain budget for your roads, and then you double the size of your area, the size of your roads and your maintenance and operating budget is gonna double most likely. roughly. Um, and I'll stop there. But I would look at those items. Um, and Mahalo for your work.

Thank you members. Any questions for the testifier? Seeing none. Thank you for your testimony.

Thank you, Chair. Our next testifier is Kay Anderson.

Has Ms. Anderson been enabled on our end? Ms. Anderson, it's your turn to testify. If you can unmute yourself and begin your testimony.

Ms. Anderson, if you joined online via Microsoft Teams, if you go to the upper right corner, there's a microphone icon that you can click to unmute yourself.

Thank you. I wasn't doing it that way. Anyhow. Aloha, Chair Palten and members. I hadn't planned on testifying today, but after that wonderful presentation from Dick Mayer, I decided to go ahead and testify. Earlier last week, I did testify about the financial requirements that this plan had to provide, and I second both Mr. Mayor and Albert on that. That's not the main reason I'm testifying. I want to discuss growth plans for this project. I want to refer to the minutes of the Planning Commission on March 4th, 2025. I highlighted a couple of areas. The minutes are rather long. And this is what a section that Dr. Dicos stated in those minutes. It says, okay, on page 23, at the end of second paragraph, there's language based on population forecasting for the plan area. The population may increase between 3,700 and 600 new residents over the planned timeframe. seems it would make sense to also add the forecast data for how many new homes would be needed in that timeframe. So I would, I guess, would strongly oppose adding language at the end of that paragraph, too, that states South Mallee forecasts needed for 817 new homes over the next 20 years in reference to South Mallee plan forecast paper, page 22. I would like to actually be able to see that forecast paper. Is that something that's easily readable or available for the public? So it goes on and on. And basically what is in that paper is that the growth plan was those two numbers. It was the, I've lost it. 3,700 to 6,100 new residents and 800 to 1,700 new homes. And 8,000 homes were not included in this plan. It's a South Maui plan forecast paper that they actually had someone complete for their work in putting together this plan. They ended up with having 8,000. So I would ask that you follow Dick Mayer's suggestion and include the approximately 4,500 homes that are already in the pipeline and approved or partially approved and stop there. Right now, we only have infrastructure available for our current... people that are here not the additional 4 500 homes so we cannot uh cannot even sustain the additional 3 500 homes that have not been approved so stop at 4 500 take those 3 500 and add it to the next south maui community plan mahalo for your time thank you members any questions for the testifier

Seeing none, thank you for your testimony, staff.

Thank you, Chair. Our next host of fire is Kayla Loedeker here in the chamber.

Aloha, Chair. Kayla Whitaker testifying on workforce housing policies addressing my written testimony. First, mahalo for reviewing that last week and taking it seriously and making changes to 2.225. I want to offer a friendly reality check on the remaining issues with 2.2, 18, 19, and 26 when you return to those. I draft residential workforce housing agreements for my job and negotiating that takes months, sometimes a year, because its terms have to comply with Chapter 2.96, The housing director, corporation council check that, so do I. If a project has its own ordinance, like a project district ordinance, the agreement has to comply with that too. Then it's signed and recorded. And that's just one piece of what it takes to build housing on Maui. Nowhere in that process do we look at the community plan, and Director Mitchell told you why. His job is to look at 2.96. Mr. Hopper explained correctly that compliance with the community plan is decided on who grants discretionary permits, usually the planning commission, sometimes other entities. So here's the problem. Discretionary approvals sometimes come before the housing agreement, sometimes after, and many projects need more than one discretionary approval. So this is why the community plan cannot conflict with chapter 2.96. Imagine if a project has a recorded agreement that fully complies with chapter 2.96. Then the project goes in for discretionary approval and the planning commission decides it doesn't comply with policies 2.2, 18 or 19. What happens to that recorded agreement? Is it void? Must it be renegotiated? I don't know, and I suspect no one in this room does. And adding to the extent practicable doesn't fix it. Director Takakura explained that the phrase puts the burden on the applicant. If the approving body finds the burden wasn't met, we're in the same place. Sorting out what that means when the community plan and Chapter 2.96 conflict leads to more legal fees for the county and for the applicant. That increases the house of causing and delays housing for months, and families cannot wait. Policy 2.226 has a related problem. It has a new preference written into the community plan that's not in Chapter 2.96. Member Johnson pointed out the right model. Bill 40, which he drafted, puts the residency ranking into the code, which is why it applies to every project. So I have two requests. Please change required to encourage in policies 2.2, 18 and 19, and please move policy 2.2, 26 to the implementation section as an action for council's review of chapter 2.96. You can do everything the community asked for here, just needs to go through the right process so that chapter 2.96 uses the right words and it doesn't conflict with the community plan so we don't end up in a legal quandary that costs time and money. Thank you.

Thank you for your testimony. I like the cost of causing part. Member Sugiwara.

Thank you. So can you repeat that last part so we can unscramble what you're saying?

Yeah, I had to do it fast enough to get in in three minutes. So there's three policies I'm concerned about now. You fixed some of them. 2.2, 18 and 19, which says where the housing has to go to the practicable. And then 2.2, 26 adds a new preference, which is genealogical ties. These policies may be good. That's not my point. My point is if they conflict in any way with chapter 2.96, we're kind of left in a legal issues because the housing director won't look at the community plan. And when the discretionary agency looks at the community plan and says, well, it doesn't comply, then I don't know what happens to my recorded housing agreement. So I think one way to fix that is to take out the word require, I also have other options in my written testimony on how to fix that or move it to Chapter 2.96 where it belongs. Again, it may be good policy. It just needs to go in the right place. Okay.

Thank you. Member Rawlings-Fernandez?

Mahalo, Chair. Aloha, Mr. Whitaker. Mahalo for you. Mahalo for your testimony. I guess I wanted to clarify one part of your testimony where you framed your client Wailea 670 was trying to provide housing to community. Your client is trying to profit over Aina by building luxury housing and complying with whatever requirements our county code demands of developers wanting to build luxury housing to profit. So I guess in that framing, if it wasn't required by law, your clients would not build workforce housing, right?

I'm all for workforce housing. I'm all for Chapter 2.96. It should be a requirement for developers. And I have more than one client. That's just one of the clients I draft workforce housing agreements for. I draft them for multiple clients. And so my point is not to make a policy argument on what should be in Chapter 2.96 or the community plan. I just want it in the right place. So I support affordable housing. I think it should be a requirement placed on developers. My job is to help the developers comply. And I just want that process to be easy.

Mahalo, Keola. I know you do. I'm saying your clients don't necessarily do. Mahalo.

I hear you.

Any further questions for the testifier? I had one. When you said if the housing department approved the discretionary permit and then signed off on a residential housing agreement, and then the project went through, say, the planning commission or planning department, and then at that point they would check for compliance with the community plan, would the to the extent practicable section come into play because you already have a residency workforce housing agreement? So the to the extent practicable could be, well, we already have a residential workforce housing agreement with this as it's stated, and it's based on the I guess all the things in the agreement. So to the extent practicable, it's not practicable anymore.

That's a great reasoning and I hope that would be the result. But what I heard Director Takekura say when you were talking about what does to the extent practicable mean, and I think she's right. It means that the applicant has the burden of making that showing. And so the commission may decide after a housing agreement is recorded that they didn't place the housing in the right place according to 2.218, for example. And then I don't know where we are. The agreement's recorded. And so that's the difficulty I'm dealing with of what the legal problems could be created. And Mr. Hopper is a great attorney. I learned a lot from him. He's probably one of your best in that department. And what makes him a great attorney is he won't tell you what to do. He won't tell you what policies to do. He'll tell you whether it's legal or not. So you need to push a little bit and ask him, practically speaking, what happens in these situations. And I think that might help guide what's happening here. Again, you can do exactly what the community has asked for. It just needs to be done in the right place so we don't end up in in legal issues where we have to wait months, maybe file a request to the court to try to figure this out. We don't wanna end up there. We wanna make this as simple as possible so housing can get built faster.

And then the other question I had was in regards to 2.2.26, which you think should be in the implementation for goal 2.2. But it says encourage, So the encouraging is the implementation or why could it not be as a policy?

Encourage is helpful there. But practically speaking, when the director of housing is creating the housing agreement that lists how we're going to prioritize applicants for affordable housing, The director's not gonna look to the community plan, because that's not their job. That's the job of the discretionary agency, be it the planning commission, public works director, or the department. So I'm not sure if it has the effect that it should have.

Whether it's in policy or implementation, or only if it's in policy?

If it's in policy and says encourage, that creates fewer legal issues. but I'm not sure how that gets into the housing agreement, if that makes sense. So the housing agreement is where it indicates how you're gonna preference applicants for affordable housing. So you give a preference, for example, for somebody who is a resident of Maui County, right? That goes into your housing agreement because that's in chapter 2.96. What 2.226 does, it adds another layer of genealogical ties. That might be a good policy, it's just in the wrong spot.

So not necessarily in section four, but maybe in 2.96 or something?

Yeah, exactly. But your testimony was saying put it in implementation, but... Well, I guess what I meant there was action and action for later.

Oh, okay.

Not implementation.

Okay.

All right. An action for a later consideration on Chapter 2.96.

Oh, not Section 4. You meant implementation as in an action, not implementation in terms of Section 4, implementation section.

Correct. I misspoke. I meant an action for Council to take up.

Got it. Thank you. Seeing no further questions, Mr. Ramirez, can you call the next testifier?

Thank you, Chair. Our next testifier is James Langford.

Aloha, Chair Paupin. Aloha, DRIP Committee. I hope you all are well. It's popping up on my phone from you guys. You know, amazing testimony today and presentation, and ideally that galvanizes how the money flow and the time spent by you folks and your staff to deal with projected capital from income that doesn't serve the existing community in terms of if you look at it as an audit. So the time and money that our drip committee staff and the amazing workers over there and all that, when you calculate that in an audit and you look at the money and time spent to acquire services and capital from outside entities, It puts you folks in a situation where by definition the voice of the public is being removed to cover capital needs and things that perhaps weren't completed for whatever reasons. Now in the South Maui plan, I started trying to testify about South Maui, and my experience was less than desirable. I ended up being attacked for calling out drug and human trafficking at the 175 East Lapua when the state was running it. And the state still keeps an open case against me in order to silence, you know, my testimony. And I've been unable to work since July. I'm sorry, since June 12th as a result of these open cases that are based on nothing, you know. So that type of targeting whistleblowers and things you see in other cases uh cars and uh and the other guy uh so i'm trying to you know my intention has always been to enlighten you know uh and provide truth to the community so that you folks aren't pressured you know like by the majority which is The landowners who didn't take care of the land before the wildfires or the floods. So it's the same people you know now. so to sum up like it it's been very difficult trying to get the truth out about drug trafficking and human trafficking in south kihei and that needs to be looked at in these plans because it affects capital flow and draws money away from the local folks into this external money to cover tracks of ponzi's previous defined ponzi schemes in rico so a lot of this is in my book institutional murder And I'm really looking forward to working with you folks so that we can bring this to clarity once and for all. Thank you, and I love you guys, and I hope every day is blessed for you.

Thank you so much for your testimony. Members, any questions for the testifier? Seeing none, thank you. Ryan?

Thank you, Chair. There's currently no one else signed up to testify. This will be a last call for public testimony. Chair, I do see one person here, Robert Bentz. If you can give me a second to activate his microphone. Thank you. You may begin your testimony.

Aloha, Chair, Council, fellow citizens. I'm sorry, I don't have my camera working. I would just want to echo the excellent testimony of Professor Mayer. He's very conservative and he is very good at those numbers. There's so much problems with listening to pro-development attorneys And everybody is an attorney. They have their opinion on what the law is. And I don't know about the staff attorneys, but no attorney is going to be perfectly balanced. Somebody is going to have a little bit of a balance one way or the other. And the representatives of developments such as YLA 670, obviously they're not going to... on any of this to be binding law, but the community plan is where the communities have the most input and the most interaction and it should definitely govern the way the community is shaped and not just be worded in such a way where it's just a suggestion and it pretty much waters down all those community hard work. There is so much development already in Kihei. And it's crazy to watch them from up country see so much new lights popping on all the time. So it's very dangerous with the flooding. We gotta address the wetlands and the evacuation routes. I do agree with Chair Lee that The Coulee community is still against having a road and all the development that that would bring to a country. But there are several ranch roads that are already capable of emergency evacuations so just kind of keeping the country country supporting agriculture supporting conservation shoreline wetlands there's jobs and that too not just having all our jobs for development and if there is development it should be for escape routes all thank you mr bentz members any questions for the testifier

Seeing none, thank you for your testimony.

Thank you, Chair. This will be a last call for public testimony. If anyone would like to testify, please use the raise your hand feature on Teams or by doing so, calling in by using star five. This will be last call. Three, two, one. Chair, seeing none, no one else wishes or indicates they wish to testify.

Thank you, members. Any objection with closing public testimony and continuing to accept oral testimony into the record? Thank you. Members, since we do have Director Mitchell online at this time, Director Mitchell, you're online, right?

I am, Chair. One moment, let me just shift gears for a second, please. Sure.

Yes, I'm here.

Oh, calling on Director Mitchell, Mr. Mayor. I was wondering if you could address comments made in the testimony regarding 2.2.18, 19, and maybe even 2.2.26. We did hear you say that you would not be reviewing the community plan in creating a residential workforce housing agreement. and that would be under the purview of the Planning Department through potentially the Planning Commission. Do you foresee the same type of legal challenges if you have already committed to a residential workforce housing agreement And then a planning commission review comes in and asserts, based on the community plan policy, that the spread of affordable housing or location is not correct, that it would not meet the community plan policies, even with verbiage that says to the extent practicable.

uh thank you chair for the question and good morning members um i think mr whitaker has identified a real potential challenge it is conceivable that even after a developer has attempted to demonstrate that compliance with 2218 or 2219 is not practicable that a conclusion could be made otherwise that then puts the developer in a conflict of compliance with what has already been recorded in the residential workforce housing agreement and in the community plan policy. It is a potential problem, but I appreciate Mr. Whitaker's careful threading of the needle in not taking a position on the policy, but instead recommending that the policy can be better put in the code, if that is the intent, and one can avoid the potential problem. So on 2.2.18 and 2.2.19, it appears Mr. Whitaker's offered a... reasonable solution if the body wishes to entertain that and it also highlights for me quite frankly a little bit of a disconnect in how we the Department of Housing and the Department of Planning exercise our duties under the charter where one is looking at the code and not looking at community plan, the others looking at the community plan, and at different times. That, to me, is a bigger structural challenge and one that we should figure out how to address so that we don't have the potential conflict that Mr. Whitaker referred to. So that's my response on the draft policy 2218 and 2219. And then on 2226, If my recollection serves me, that policy says, encourage affordable housing residency preference programs to prioritize current residents of South Maui or those employed in South Maui, in particular residents with generational ties to the area. And I just want to remind us all that I seem to recall Mr. Harper indicating that he wanted an opportunity to touch base some of his colleagues to discuss how to frame residency preferences and potentially frame them in the code. And I would encourage us to probably go down that path because ultimately we do need to develop a good residency preference policy. I think it's better put in the code, but it's gonna need a very rigorous legal scrub. So on 2226, I do agree that that is better in the code and that we should take some time to develop that more robustly. Did that answer the two questions, Chair?

Yes, thank you. Mr Whitaker's suggestion was to change required to encourage and then we could be okay because um not necessarily would um the county pivot or that the county could require the developer to pivot even if there is a residential workforce housing agreement, but then it goes before planning commission and they have the required language and it could cause a legal issue is what you're seeing with require, but encourage would be better.

I think it could. I mean, it's a reasonable hypothetical where you could see a situation where Notwithstanding our earlier interpretation, I think it was on Friday or Thursday, I've lost track of my days here, where we said, if you have required, to the extent practical, you have a relief valve, you have an opportunity to not be in a position of compulsion. to do it. But what Mr. Whitaker is saying is, well, not exactly, because if it says require, if they say impractical, you could still have a scenario where another body says, notwithstanding what the developer said, it is practical, and now you have the conflict. And so it's just wiser, I think, to not be in that situation, move the language to encourage and consider moving the policy to the code so we're all clear.

Okay, so for now, let's mark 2.2.18, 2.2.19 and 2.2.26 also for revisits. Towards the end, we can stew on that. verbal dialogue for a few weeks, I guess. Thank you.

Thank you, Chair.

Okay. Corporation Council, did you want to give us the fiscal legal analysis before we jump into Section 4?

Hi, Chair. I think it's up to you. A lot's been discussed. I've tried to follow a lot this morning, so I can talk about a variety of issues if you like. But if you want me to get into, I mean, it sounds like, I just want to be clear on the question, is it sounds like you're looking at under 280B, what's required by the community plans as far as the It looks like this implementation program, which includes capital improvement elements, financial elements, and an implementation schedule is what's sort of being questioned here. And whether the plan meets the minimum requirements for that is sort of the pending question. I just want to make sure I have that.

Yeah, that's sort of the pending question. I guess it's come under fire from testifiers as well as our presenter. My recollection was some of the items in West Maui Community Plan were TBD or NA as well. And we didn't seem to have an issue with that. At that time, we wanted to put everything that the community had wanted in the community plan, even if we didn't have the most accurate, up-to-date, exact estimates or numbers for the potential if it came about to have some implementing actions and in light of the fire burning Lahainatown, I guess I'm sort of happy that we did that because as the CDBGDR and programmatic money came in, we could look to the community plan kind of to our wish list. So wondering about our own lawyers, Corporation Council analysis, if what we have now we need to do more work to become in compliance with 2.80B.070, or if you're comfortable with where it's at, that it complies.

Okay, Chair, there's a few I think the relevant terms in 07. Oh, there's a few there's 07. Oh, a and it states in part each community plan must include implementing actions that clearly identify priorities, timelines, estimated costs, and the county department accountable for the completion of the implementing actions. And then in 07-0 subsection F, that describes sort of the implementation program. And it looks like that's how the department really put, you know, they put in an implementation schedule that deals with a variety of these issues, the capital improvement element, the financial element, and the implementation schedule. I'll note a few things. One, it does state that financial element shall describe a fiscally sound financial program for identified actions and capital improvements preparation of the county's annual operating budget and capital improvement program respectively developed pursuant to 3.04030 and 3.04040 of this code. shall implement the community plans to the extent practicable. And then there's also notes on the capital improvement element and then the implementation schedule. The implementation schedule, that's F3, says the implementation schedule shall identify and numerically prioritize specific actions, the implementation actions, commencement and completion dates, the lead implementation agency, the estimated implementation cost, and the anticipated funding source or sources. I think the shortest answer to your question is it's ultimately up to the council if this list you have is sufficient for the purposes of the ordinance. I do believe this would meet the minimum requirements of the ordinance, but a lot of this is subject to, you know, is the council okay with this or do you want to tell the department to go back with more precision or to hire somebody who could maybe estimate these with more precision to if this is not adequate um there are uh you know the the numerically prioritize um you know you have high medium number one high uh you know different priorities you don't have from one to whatever the last number would be um but you know this is uh this is a way of prioritizing um And then the lead agencies are identified, the funding sources are sort of broadly stated, and the cost is estimated. A couple of relevant things. One is... This is an ordinance, and so you have the legislative discretion to pass that ordinance. In the future, as stated, the council is supposed to be implementing these programs to the extent practicable, and I think that's a nod to the fact that you are not really ever able to require a future council to put given things in its budget. Future councils are going to have to review that and implement this to the extent practicable. So I do think this would meet the minimum requirements. I think the council has adopted plans with similar items, but I think ultimately it is up to the council if it believes that this is not adequate, if you need either more information or you want to, come up with a more finite amount of funds and cut off the items that you believe you can't meet. I think that would be an acceptable approach, but I cannot say that the current approach would be illegal or violative of the code, because the code does give a fair amount of discretion, I think as it would have to, because again, you're adopting an ordinance The plan is adopted by ordinance that is a legislative act by the council. You have the implementation requirements, but you do have some discretion in determining whether that's adequate or not. So I think that's where I would leave it at that point. Certainly, if you're dissatisfied with how this has been done or you want to have it redone, That's at the discretion of council, and you could say, look, we're not going to going to pass this ordinance unless certain things are done to more, you know, to look at this with more specificity. I would note you're estimating costs over a 20 year implementation period. so i'm not sure how you could um be absolutely sure that those costs are correct certainly without actually going out for bid would you know if a lot of those costs were correct as you know as the council sees this every year um so uh you'd have those issues and coming up with uh you know to make the most uh realistic budget as possible so again i think this is within the council's discretion i i can't say that the current um proposal would violate the code. But I think, again, this is sort of up to the council what precise items you want to see in here and if this is lacking, what additional information you would want put in the plan.

Okay, thank you. And for the language of fiscally sound financial program, I did see a policy 2.1.3 as it was originally proposed support adoption of mechanisms to fund transportation improvements. Such as special special districts increasing car rental surcharges for visitors and traffic impact fees. So new projects pay their fair share of the transportation system improvement. But it was deleted at the sea pack level. So that's one way that, um. the revenue could have been generated, but the Community Plan Advisory Committee did not want that as a policy. So it's okay that there aren't policies on how to generate the revenue that would have paid for the infrastructure improvements if the Community Plan Advisory Committee themselves deleted it, right?

I mean, you don't necessarily have to have every revenue generating item in the plan. You could adopt the traffic impact fee ordinance, whether or not it's in the plan. You may want to have it in the plan as supportive, but the council can and certainly has adopted ordinances, taxation policies, things like that that aren't all in the plan. But practically speaking, yes, I think that if you're looking at the estimated cost of the plan, thinking about how that's going to be paid for is something that 280B does want you to take a look at. But as far as the precise numbers and wording, I think that's still up to the council.

Okay. And then the impact fees are already a part of existing ordinance in that like when we're adopting this ordinance, we have to go look at the existing ordinances about the impact fees and change all the Kihei Makena verbiage to South Maui Community Plan. So to that extent, those are already in the code, right? The impact fees.

Well, I think there needs to be, you know, ways to, I mean, yeah, to the extent you have, you know, you've got a variety of different impact fees. To my knowledge, traffic impact fees are something that we still need to take some action to finally implement. But there's, yes, there's ordinances on that, on the traffic impact fees. But I don't believe we have, you know, a fee schedule where we're charging on those yet.

Okay, got it. Thank you. Members, do you have any other clarifying questions for Mr. Hopper in relationship to 2.80B.070 about the financial element and implementation schedule or a fiscally sound financial program? Not at this time. Okay. Mr. Hopper will be online with us. So if it does come up later on in the meeting, feel free. It's now 1030. That's enough discussion. Yeah. Or memberly.

Yes, I was wondering what was your plan today, like from now until lunch and then after lunch? What's your plan?

Oh, sure. Thank you for asking. My plan is to see if members want to recess first off. And then to jump into section four implementation and monitoring, we noted the revisits and we can revisit when we're ready close to the end. But section four implementation and monitoring monitoring starts on page 109, which is just like the title page. And to make our way through Section 4, we're gonna be also referencing Attachment 3C, which has the evolution of the implementing actions from their proposal with the department or other through to what ended up in the book. So we can have Mr. Ramirez flash those up on the screen when we get to it. We also have Appendix H, which is in your draft plan in the back. I think it's page... 176. I have cross referenced those on mine, so I won't have to be flipping back and forth and I can advise you on that. And then also, I think we have.

Excuse me, I meant for just today.

Yeah, we're just going to start with section four and see how we go along with it, how far we go along with it. We have also attachment 10b, which we can reference. It talks about how the implementing actions align with general plan policies and actions of the countywide policy plan and Maui Island plan.

I just wanted to check if you're gonna take up some of the revisits that we didn't finish on Friday because I have a doctor's appointment at 12 and so I'm trying to plan around you.

Yeah we can but I didn't make people work over the weekend on them so I figured nobody would be ready with their revised version of the revision yet.

So this is all new stuff today? New stuff today.

Unless anybody wants to work on a revision, I'm not prepared yet with my new verbiage or anything like that. So we would just be jumping into section four. I did get a message that public works may not be available today. So if we come into any implementing actions that require public works, we may just hold it off to the side to revisit during our review of section one. Those guys are very, very busy bees. So we'll come back to them when they are available. So with that being said, I thought I heard a kākou on the morning recess. Yes. Okay, it's 10.37. We'll return at 10.45 or whichever time we get quorum of members, whichever comes first. 10.45 or five members, cameras on. This meeting is in recess. Will the Disaster Recovery International Affairs and Planning Committee return to order? The time is now 10.52 and we're going to jump right into section four, starting on page 110 and 111. I have no recommendations for amendment planning. Did you want to give a little overview on how the implementing actions were decided upon or just get to it as we get to it if we have questions? What's your preference?

For the department draft of the implementing actions, we looked at the existing Kihei McKenna community plan and considered which action items still needed to be implemented or which were ongoing actions. And then the CPAC draft was decided by CPAC making recommendations. One distinct thing you will notice between the CPAC draft and the Maui Planning Commission draft is that CPAC added to implement or to develop to policies because we shouldn't just be studying the potential of it, we should also be implementing. And based on the plan implementation division's recommendation, the planning department recommended to separate that into two actions. So you'll see like the first one is undertake a study to determine the location and the second one says to develop the Kihei transit hub. So that's just to make it easier to track during implementation.

Thank you.

How many from the Kihei Makena Plan implementing actions were carried forward to the South Maui Community Plan? I'm not sure on that. Oh, okay. All right. Okay, members, any recommendations for amendment from the floor on either page 110 or 111? Seeing none, we can move forward to page 112 and 113. Members can especially review the bullet points on page 112. This was guiding to the CPAC, but I think it would work as well for us about things to consider, questions to consider. as creating, implementing actions and prioritizing them. I have no recommendations for amendment on either page 112 or 113.

Chair, this is Dick Mayer. Were you going to be giving the council members a chance to ask me questions?

Sure. Do the members have any questions for Mr. Mayor? Member Sinensi.

Thank you, Chair. Yeah, I just had a question about his presentation as far as his traffic numbers. Did he include any visitor traffic numbers with that?

I did not add any. I did not add any because the plan itself does not indicate any particular growth of tourism other than the fact that R&T Park, there's a hotel that's planned there, and there's also a hotel planned in the Crouse area that would add tourists. I did not include those in the numbers there, and that certainly would add visitors. Also, that's the main thing. I do want to make one comment about the argument, something that I said about the fiscally sound element, and I think that's important. um and that is a fiscally sound thing means both an accounting of the costs and developing the sources of revenue and i think you the the uh to make this plan viable in the future you need to have an analysis is there a financially viable source of of revenues at the county and state level to fund the things that you're putting into the plan and i think unless you have that, you will do something that's been done over and over again with all the previous plans in each of your districts where you have great plans and never get implemented. And I think you need to get an analysis done, and that's the major reason why all the community plans, all the efforts that go into it by the citizens, by council members, All are in vain because no one has ever done what is required by 2.70F, a good financially sound plan. And just saying that, oh, we can get some impact fees or we can get some traffic fees, it never gets done. And consequently, none of the plans ever get implemented. And that's a real problem. problem for our county and one of the frustrations for the residents i think you all know that and i would wish you would ask the plan department that they began the six years ago and they still have not developed a a stream of sources of revenue that you can use to finance the plan i wish you well in doing that and i hope that you will be able to get this otherwise it's like somebody designing a house and the architect puts a big house and no one ever talks about dollar amounts that's And that's what you're doing with this plan, is not considering the dollar revenue sources.

Hello, Mr. Mayor and Chair. I mean, I know that the MPO has a list of South Maui projects coming out, as well as each department has CIP projects for each of the districts, including South Maui. So not sure if those, I mean, we can access that information too, that has financial numbers for all of those CIP projects that are planned for South Maui. Thank you.

Yeah, but there's nothing in there about the wastewater, There's nothing on the water department. You don't have any financial numbers. The only one that's in the plan at all is traffic and none of the other infrastructure costs are indicated. And that will be a problem. I mean, yeah, you may solve the traffic problem, but if there's not enough water and you don't know where it's coming from, how much is it going to cost the county? How much is it going to cost the rate payers? All over the county, your residents, your voters are going to have increased water rates, wastewater rates. and many other things. So please, please do consider the source of the revenues to see whether this plan, and then set a precedent for all the community plans in each of your districts that will be financially viable.

Member Uuhajit?

Thank you, Chair, and thank you, Mr. Mayor, for your presentation and your comments. I was thinking when we were talking about the financial aspect of the plan, you know, 2025, 2026 dollars may look completely different in 10 years, so I appreciate that. I probably got in about midway to your presentation, but I appreciated your thorough overview of this plan, very in-depth. I know that Lippoa is proposing to reduce their commercial size. Did you take that into account when you were doing your graph?

I mentioned the original plan. I did not even indicate impacts from that commercial side. I only indicated that the residential portion of it, and I stayed away from any of the commercial. And that's not the only commercial one. There's several others. Right.

Right. I know I got in and you, well, you mentioned, I think, an amount of square foot. So I was just trying to see if, I couldn't tell you, I forget. I know they were just in the planning commission, but I was asking that to ask this. So I appreciated your 1.5 car per unit analysis. Did you have a, like a ratio, I guess, of cars per commercial space?

No, usually what's done with commercial things is they talk about the number of trips people have, not the number of cars. So in other words, certain types of stores, let's say a Safeway, will probably have a lot more traffic, let's say, than a hairdresser. Sure, okay. So you should be looking. And that's the sort of analysis that's needed. It isn't in the plan, none of that analysis there.

Okay. Thank you. I think that's the only few questions I have while listening to that. Thank you so much, Chair, and thank you, Mr. Mayor.

Thank you.

Thank you. Member Cook?

Thank you, Chair. So thank you, Mr. Mayor. I have two questions. The first one is as far as how would it be funded? Ballpark just says $600 million, CIP bonds, 30 years, 4%. The debt service would be about $34.5 million a year. And I looked at our real property tax records and non-owner occupied tier three properties in 2025 generated $162 million a year. the tier three portion of it was 66,664,000. 66,644,000. So my point is, I believe that we have the potential for real property tax in South Maui to be basically self-funded. That's the type of homes that you've been saying are the most extractive. So do you think that we have, looking at those numbers, do you feel that South Maui potentially has tax revenue to pay for our infrastructure that's required?

That's the analysis that exactly, you hit the nail on the head. It's exactly the analysis that needs to happen because there are no numbers on what will be the water need, not just traffic. But water, wastewater, you'll have additional county services, police, fire, all the... What do you think the ballpark number for that would be?

I know we need to do an analysis, but $1.5 billion? I mean, right now what we're doing is trying to get, to me, relatively broad strokes as far as our direction. And I know that you're... So I guess we don't have the answers yet. My next question is the Kamaole Aquifer, is there a separation between the 600 foot elevation for South Maui and the 600 foot and above elevation for the Kamaole Aquifer? It's one aquifer, is that correct?

It's one aquifer. And I noticed that there was an attempt made to take water from the Hawaiian homelands, which is in the upcountry district. and transport it down into South Maui. And that, of course, would be illegal. It's against the upcountry community plan. And I'm sure there'll be a court case very quickly on taking that action. That's in the same aquifer. In other words, the Hawaiian homelands water is in the same, but the use of the water is needed in the upcountry area

good granted i know i'm familiar like upcountry the filters that are being replaced and uh there's a lot of a lot of activities upcountry which thankfully finally are going to substantially and uh increase the source for upcountry to start getting the upcountry water meter list addressed so anyway thank you for your work and i'll continue to look at this thank you thank you

Member Sugimura.

Yeah, thank you. Thank you, Mr. Mayor, and for your presentations. As you're going through everything and just listening to some of these questions from the members, whatever you presented, did you have it reviewed by a department or anyone before, or how did you get the compilation of information?

I did not send it to any of the departments, but I have presented a lot of that analysis at previous meetings at the Planning Commission, and at the and so i think the department has seen all of those numbers and i never got a call back from them saying anything was wrong okay so you checked with the department then oh yes i didn't check i didn't check the department i checked i presented those i think at the uh planning commission uh so the department saw it there i believe okay i'll check with the department just to make sure we have our numbers correct because valuable information thank you thank you

Any further questions for the resource? Member Johnson.

Thank you, Chair. You know, the idea of the funding being attached, I pulled up the Lanai Community Plan because that one's finished, and I wanted to see what they said about that, right? And it's very similar language on page 113 of the South Maui Community Plan. It says, it refers to another plan. It says the financial element described a fiscally sound financial program for identifying actions and capital improvements for the financial element referred to the Maui Island Plan, Chapter 10 Long Range Implementation Plan, Infrastructure Planning, and Financial Policy Framework, and it gives the page. so that's in the lanai community plan in the in this one it says on the bottom of page 113 it says more information about the financial elements is included in page 10.4 of the mip chapter 10 long range it refers the same thing uh long range implementation program infrastructure planning and finance finance policy framework it seems that both plans are trying to say when we implement that's when we talk about money but mr mayor you're saying Can you kind of clarify on that?

I have a problem. One of the things that happened, I'll go back to the Maui Island plan. I was vice chair of the Maui Island plan, GPAC. We worked through all that, and to make a long story short, the plan was adopted by the council in 2012, but it did not have an implementation chapter involved. So we went back and insisted that the plan would be incomplete if it didn't have any implementation. So then they worked on it. The council worked on it. In 2014, an implementation chapter was added. When they did that, the planning department then set up a section, a new division of the plan. They have the long range, the short range, et cetera. And then they added an implementation section to help implement the plans. Unfortunately, that... division was never given the proper staff to do the job. And then rather than implementing the plans, they then turned into a reporting agency. So each year you would get a report from the planning department indicating where the plans were, whether they were already completed, the various projects are not completed, et cetera. But nobody in the planning department had the responsibility to say, let's make sure the plans get implemented, that the money comes up, and that's if i could give one recommendation to the to this council it's not going to be in in the south maui plan but to create the power in the implementation division of the planning department to be proactive to have the authority to require all the other departments of the county to implement the community plans And they should have that authority to meet them once. They should be meeting once every month or every two months and saying, how are we doing on the South Maui plan or the upcountry plan or the Lanai plan? And how can we make sure that these plans get implemented? Where can we get the revenues? who's responsible so it becomes very proactive community plans should be a proactive document not one people check on am i meeting the requirements right okay well i'd like to hear from the planning department um how do you how is that uh page 10-4 of the maui island plan is it has that um

that what Mr. Mayor is saying, has it been not as proactive and just been reporting agency? It seems that this plan is referencing your chapter 10 long range implementation program, infrastructure planning and financial policy framework, that's a word. But how's that working for a director?

Director Takakura? Uh, thank you. Chair Bolton. Um, so council member Johnson regarding, um, implementation, as you know, uh, every year we send to the county council, the, um, status of all the, um, actions in the various plans. Um. We are responsible for the planning department's actions. We do check on the action status of the other departments, but we don't have the authority to force them to take those actions. However, I do want to add that In the capital improvement program, you know, you do have a six-year plan in there, and you also have the plan implementation division reviewing the budget, which includes the CIP, for consistency with the general plan. And so we do review that to make sure that these actions that the departments are proposing are consistent with the general plan document. So we have two different things, the implementation reports and then the review of the budget, which includes the CIP.

yeah does that answer your question sure do you think that there is like uh room to be i guess maybe more proactive in my mind we just did the um food security nutrition plan where we had a dashboard and the administration will have a dashboard say here's what we want to do and here's where we are in that achieving that goal is is that something that you would be able to consider to let everybody know this is where we're at, this is where we're trying to go, this is the current status, and update it, you know, really, you know, timely.

We had been looking at some various dashboards from vendors, but they were very, very expensive, and so we are still looking for how to do that. But the recent implementation report we sent you, we did revise it to be a lot easier to read in terms of accomplished, in process, ongoing, or not yet started, so it's kind of color-coded, and then you can kind of see... you know how many are in those various categories. So that's been a big improvement in my opinion in the last one because it's a lot easier to see the status of these different action items. Keep in mind there's 1,261 items in all the plans, so there's a lot for us to track.

It's a heavy lift. I totally understand that. Thank you, Director. Thank you, Chair.

Sure thing. Members, any further questions for our resource? Seeing none, do members have any objections on letting him continue about his day if he so chooses? Okay, thank you so much for your presentation, Mr. Mayor. If you have other things to do, you can certainly log off, but if you'd like to stay on, I don't think we have an objection. Member Sinensi.

Thank you, Chair. Just for disclosure, my nephew Keanu Lewis is here. It's his birthday today, but he's sick.

Oh, happy birthday and hope you feel better soon. Okay.

Thank you for giving me the opportunity. I will turn, I will log off.

Sure thing. Okay, where we left off, we were on pages 112 and 113. I didn't hear any members have any recommendations for amendments. So with that being said, we can move on to the meat and potatoes on page 114. Before we begin, I did have a question for planning. I was wondering about the ordering in this section. It's not from high to low, and it's not in the same order as Appendix H. Is there any rhyme or reason to the ordering of the implementing actions, or we just go with it?

This part was inherited, and the rhyme and reason is in somebody else's brain. But Appendix H is ordered by the ranking, and is how that was done, since it was not done at the CPAC officially, is it was done... We did a survey of the CPAC members who all ranked the... action items, and then that list ranking was based on the outcomes of that survey.

Okay, got it, got it. So no known rhyme or reason here. There could be a rhyme or reason, we just don't know what it is. Okay, got it, got it. At least we're clear. Okay, so starting off on page 114, we're looking at action 101A, which is in appendix H. It's listed as number 12, although there are two number 12s, so we'll call this one 12A in the priority of CIP infrastructure on page, or on appendix H. And... This is to one of those that Ms. Komkovic had previously mentioned. The first is to undertake a study to determine a location and then 101B or priority 12B is to then develop the Kihei Transit Hub interconnected with multimodal paths in the area. So one is a plan. The second part is a CIP. Both priority is medium. One is mid and the second is long. One lead agency is the Multimodal Planning Organization and the second is DOT. If we can make a note to include DOT in the acronyms and abbreviations, I did not see it there. And I'm wondering if by DOT we mean Maui County DOT or State DOT here. That would be Maui County DOT. Okay, so sometimes we put MDOT for Maui County DOT to not confuse ourselves with state DOT. Would that be a non-substantive revision, you think? Yeah, okay, so I'd like to non-substantively make this a MDOT and correspondingly add that to our acronyms and abbreviations as Maui County Department of Transportation. Maybe we can hear from Director Takamori if he's on the call about these, Member Batangan, this isn't your previous work, right? Did you have any guidance on if you are at this point recusing yourself on NPO stuff?

Thank you, Jer. So I was not planning to recuse myself on any of that. I don't have the... the formal guidance in front of me but essentially the board of ethics took the position that because the mpo is administratively attached to the county of maui department of transportation that i would still be considered a county employee and then there wouldn't be a conflict i just have to go look at the um guidance because there are restrictions on me using confidential information that i had learned in that past position to make decisions on the floor But this should not conflict.

Okay. Director Takamori, do you have any input on action items 101A and 101B about a Kihei Transit Hub? Are you already working with the NPO on these actions or not yet?

Good morning, Committee Chair Poulton. Thanks for the question. We have not started on it. So it is a project that has been spoken about, but we have not done anything on it.

Do you have any input for us on the verbiage currently? I think this is the recommended grammar per drafting guidelines here on page 114. Do you have any issue with the verbiage?

no issues with how it's written currently.

Oh, great. Members, do you guys have any questions for Director Takamori or amendments to make? I have none. Is that the going rate for a transit hub? Was the Central Maui one 12 million?

um thank you for the question it i guess it depends um the it depends on if land is going to need to be purchased right so land could add a lot to the cost so the build i believe the construction of the college transit center um the initial contracted amount was four million but i think by the time we finished maybe it was um five it was a little bit higher than that But given the going rate too, it could be more by the time we get to it. So I think that's probably a comfortable amount listed.

Thank you. And then do you have a preference in how your department is acronymed? At some point it says TD for Transportation Department, but here it says DOT and then I said MDOT. Do you have a standard acronym that is being used for your department or a preference for TD or MDOT or Mark Takamori? I don't know.

Usually we go with MDOT, and if we're referring to state, then we usually say H-dot.

H-dot, okay. We'll go with the standard to not confuse future readers.

Yeah, thank you.

Thank you. Okay, any amendments from the floor on 101A or 101B? I have no recommendations for amendments. Being none, we can move on to 1.02, which is also on 3C, page two. This is a department proposal that, it started out as a department proposal, and then it... was changed, but this one was not split into two. I was a little bit confused about 1.02, which is priority number 10 in the CIP Appendix H. It talks about an additional transit hub near Ma'alaya to serve as a transfer station between south and west sides of Maui, reducing congestion and encouraging public transit ridership. I wasn't clear on why we need an additional transit hub when there is one currently at Ma'alaya Harbor Village. The only other place I could think of for an additional transit hub could potentially be like the Kihei Junction. But then when I kind of looked up the definition of a transit hub, it was near things that like, you know, if people wanted to go shopping or use the bathroom or like amenities. So I was... i wasn't sure why we would need an additional transit hub beyond the ma'alai harbor village are they kicking us out should we in our next changes in zoning for those folks like ask for an easement or is that a quid pro quo i'm not too sure um but do you have any guidance for us on why the department envisioned the need for an additional transit hub at Ma'alai when, to my understanding, Ma'alai Harbor Villages serves that purpose for the community.

I don't know why this policy is in there. I mean, this action item is in there. It seems like it's already being met. I would ask Mark as well if this is something that the Department of Transportation is looking into.

Okay, Director Takamori.

thank you um i don't think we really need a another transit hub we do already have a bus stop with a shelter um near malaya village harbor um what what when we first saw this listed we're thinking that maybe the idea is we can look at maybe expanding what we currently have because we just have a shelter with i believe maybe seven seats, covered seats. So maybe there needs to be an expansion considered for maybe additional seating capacity in that area. So that's how we kind of took that request. The hard part is that if we were to create a secondary location, then what would that connect to and what would that serve? So that was our internal discussions.

Thank you. Member Johnson, followed by Member Sinensi.

Thank you, Chair. It's really interesting, Director, that you mentioned that, you know, if it did, I know the bus stop, there's only one, you know, there's just a small little area, but I know folks coming off the ferry go over to that bus stop. And wouldn't that be a nice kind of, you know, flow where you, that transportation area where the folks can get off the ferry, get on the bus and vice versa is, wouldn't that kind of be a TOD in a way?

Member Johnson, if I can clarify, are you talking about adding a stop mirror to the ferry for folks to get on or?

That's what a lot of my constituents have been asking for is the bus stops kind of far from the ferry. So can the ferry dock opposite? But then it gets, you know, we're in state property there. And on that side is where the Coast Guard is. And I don't even know the depth of the harbor on that end. So there's a lot of unanswered questions. So I was curious what if there was the ferry was a consideration in that.

And are you anticipating the ferry to remain at the Ma'alai'a location in the long run?

That's another great question. I think it's a yes and where we would do, well, Director can now obviously speak to it as well, but like a West Maui run in the Lahaina when Lahaina's ready as well as Ma'alai'a because, again, we just had this discussion over the weekend. A lot of services are in Kahuluguailuku and Malaya, you're right there, right? And we used to, during when Lahaina was running, sometimes there'd be, the poly would be closed for an accident. We would all miss the ferry, you know, that kind of thing where the ferry gets you right into where most people are headed and we have Malaya.

Okay. Director Takamori, did you understand Member Johnson's question? Do you have an answer for him?

I would say that I think we would be needing to work with DLNR in terms of it is state property. I think the challenge would be we have essentially three buses that somewhat meet up at Malaya at the same time so people can transfer between West Maui and South Maui. So I don't think we would have the three buses run down to the ferry area, but we also know that the ferry area is quite congested. I'm not quite sure if DLNR has been looking to see how they can better alleviate the congestion down at the harbor. The unfortunate thing is that the harbor, the ferry terminal is at the very far end of of the harbor too right so i think even having some type of small bus to get to the end over there is very difficult in general um so i think there's a lot that has to be discussed with the state so as of right now because it's just more limited in that area. We weren't looking at having a bus come down to that lower area. But I mean, depending on if the state is looking to do improvements and we have discussions on what that could look like, I think we're open to further discussions.

Yeah, it's obviously an issue, how congested it is, and to maybe bring the ferry on the other side. But then again, like you said, we have to work with the state on all of this. So thanks for clarifying. I just wanted to see what your opinion was, as if we could get them a little closer or maybe build some infrastructure first. But we're talking about something that the state is obviously going to be at the table for. So thanks for your response. Thank you, Chair.

Sure thing. Member Sinensi, followed by Member Cook.

Hello, Chair. I too was thinking the same lines as Councilmember Johnson, just access to the water after the Lahaina wildfires and the closure of the poly during fires, then Malaya just becomes this choke point. So I think access to the water as a potential whether it be evacuation to move people in and out should some of these highways get clogged or by disaster. Maybe in the future, potential water taxis that could take leave from Malaya to Lahaino to South Maui. So again, if this is a 30-year plan, we're just kind of looking ahead at what water access could be. Thanks.

Thank you, yeah, so this goal is additional transit hub, and if anything, it sounds like maybe we would try and get an additional stop towards the ferry end, but that would have to be in coordination with DLNR and maybe have some bus turnaround space or something of that nature. Member Cook.

Thank you, Chair. It seems like for the, or lie at the bus stop to expand it, to accommodate it? Is there like a mini hub?

I mean, it has the transfer buses, if you're doing, I think, I'm not sure if it's called the West Maui Express or the West Maui Islander, and then the South Maui Islander.

I'm thinking like a pavilion with facilities, but anyway, an electric shuttle getting people from the, ferry to the bus stop might be an option to be able to address the congestion and finesse it in a low carbon way. Like a golf cart? That's it.

Multi-passenger. Got it. Okay. Mr. Kanahele, was there a discussion of why an additional transit hub near Ma'alaya would be needed? Ma'alaya Harbor Villages are like the only amenities in the area. So was the intention to build up a whole other complex?

I think we were just supporting what the Department of Planning had put there, you know. I don't think there was a lot of discussion about it.

Okay. You guys are ready to spend $12 million. All right. I think I would entertain a motion to amend 1.02 to say something along the lines with non-substantive changes allowed to expand seating and shade of the transit hub near Ma'alai'a Harbor Village's transfer station to reduce congestion and encourage public transit ridership. As Director Takemori said, there's like seven seats, and if we want to encourage more ridership, potentially we can expand the existing hub. Mr. Takamori, one further question. Do we have an existing lease with the Ma'alaya Harbour Village shops and how long does that run through to?

Thank you for the question. I believe that our current stop is located in the right of way. So we don't actually need a lease.

Oh, great, great. So they can't like kick us out like say Ka'ahumanu Shopping Center or anything? Okay.

No, we're in the county right-of-way.

And do you have an estimate on what it would be just to expand the existing hub?

I guess it would depend on if there's any issues with utilities. So if you were to consider adding further seats or adding additional shelters there, we know that there's going to be some groundwork that needs to happen. So if we have to relocate some utilities under because you're going to put a shelter over, that can add up costs. think we would also have to do engineering work so that's also going to have to be part of that cost so um i would think that you could probably maybe place a budget hold of maybe 2 million if if we don't need to do utility relocations or whatnot, then of course that's going to come down. But if we're not building a new facility, like the college transit center, then the cost can come down substantially.

Okay, thank you so much. So, um, And, and that would still be a CIP priority still medium and timing still long and that funding sources could be county state and federal. All right, okay um staff do you mind reading what my recommendation motion language was back to us.

Okay, chair. So right now I have. And I'm not sure if we're including this 1st part, undertake a study. To expand seating and shade of the transit hub near Malaya Harbor villages, transfer station to reduce congestion and encourage public transit ridership. So I'm not sure if we're including undertake a study still.

Yeah, I don't think we need a study. I mean, if there's planning or engineering that needs to happen, I think that was included in the estimate. So just develop additional seating and shelter at the Ma'alai'a Harbour Village Transit Hub transfer station between south and west sides of Maui.

to reduce congestion and encourage public transit ridership.

Does that sound okay to the members? Okay, entertaining and then amending the 12 to 2 million amount. So they put 2000. So I'll entertain a motion to amend 1.02 on page 114 in that fashion with non substantive changes and reservations if they want to make it more grammatically correct and readable. So moved. Moved by Member Johnson, seconded by Member Sugimura. Any further discussion on this one? Member Johnson?

Chair, yes. My further discussion, just to add a point of information, and of course Director knows this, but as the county is considering and hopefully purchasing the ferry, that does open up more federal funding when counties own ferries to improve harbors. So this could be, and I'm glad that funding sources included federal because that would be the first apple off the tree I would try to pick, that we could use federal fundings to really help us achieve this goal. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you and I did neglect to say make the corresponding changes on. Page 179. For 1.02. And so this would still remain priority number 10. the cost was different on page 179 than it was on page 114, but we'll have a 2,000 over there to make it be 2 million estimated. Any objections to that being a friendly amendment for a corresponding change on page 179? Okay, any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, nine ayes, zero noes. Motion passes.

All right. Continuing along on to 1.03, bottom of page 114, this is listed as the highest priority in Appendix H. I did have some clarification. And it's also on Attachment 3C, page 3. At one point, it goes from al-hana slash Kanani Road to Kanani and Aohana Road. When I look this up on like some online maps, it looks like Kanani Road comes down and like turns into Aohana Road like that. So I'm not clear on if the North South Collector Road includes segments connecting Kanani Road and Ohana Road versus Kanani slash Ohana Road means the same thing or something different? Because like with Kanani Road being like this and Ohana Road being like this, is it gonna like cross here at Kanani Road and then go down to Ohana Road and cross or connect to that and then come up? or if somebody that's familiar with that Kanani Ohana is the intention for the Liloa Drive or South Maui Connector Road to intersect with both Kanani Road and Ohana Road, and was that the original intention all the way through, or when the verbiage was Kanani slash Ohana Road, was it just to connect with Ohana, which turns into Kanani, if you folks understand what I'm talking about.

Yes, that was based on drafting guidelines where you're not supposed to use the slash, so it might be better to say or. I think it's to give the general direction of where it needs to connect. It needs to connect somewhere along that road. Daniel would be a great person to ask for more information. Okay.

Mr. Kanahele.

I drive that road all the time. Which one?

Kanani or Ohana?

Kanani, Kanakanui, and Ohana.

Oh, and that was the other thing. Kanakanui looked like it was right there, but it's not included in the language of what to connect to. Is it intentional that Kanakanui was left off?

Well, Kanakanui, Aohana, and Kanani all intersect at one spot. And then Kanani goes down by the Kalama Heights retirement, down to the cove, and Aohana kind of curves out in a bow. To South Maui Gardens. South Maui Gardens. And then Kanakanui goes... south-north parallel to Pi'ilani Highway. But when they built that intersection, they all just intersect right there. It's kind of a weird intersection.

You couldn't potentially extend Kanaka Nui into becoming Liloa Drive?

You could. Kanaka Nui continues if you make that intersection where Auhana, Kanani, and Kanakanui intersect. If you make a right turn on Kanakanui, you go up to Kanani, and that leads you onto Piilani Highway, which is directly across the South Maui District Police Station. But before you get to that, if you make a right turn, there's a continuation of Kanakanui and they're private homes on the left, but it's undeveloped property on the right. There's a large parcel of undeveloped property between Kanaka Nui and where Liloa is. So,

So what if it said segments connecting Kanani, Ohana, or Kanaka Nui Road? Yeah. Yeah?

Yeah, I think that would be fine. Because maybe there's another way to get from Ohana to Liloa. There is development. So it's going to be going to have to use some creativity to figure out how to connect to the north-south collector road, which continues on. There's Liloahama, which is the newest section that was built between Kilohana and Kealanui.

It gives them a little flexibility, but it gets them to where you guys had intended wanting it to be.

I think because the land wasn't protected somehow from being developed, there wasn't a corridor that was maintained, so you have like a straight shot down there. It's... I believe that you can have a north-south collector road, but it's not gonna be exactly north-south. It's gonna go askew at some sections, unless you're gonna condemn properties to make it a true north-south collector road, but I think there is space to make it happen so that you have interior circulation and another option other than South Kihei Road and Pialani Highway to go from south from Kiloana, basically, all the way down to Uwapu, and then hopefully find a way to connect to north-south Ki'e or to Veterans Highway. And you can possibly do that. So this This action names all the areas that have to be connected in order to complete some version of the North-South Collector Road. And yes, CFAC felt that was probably the highest, at least the highest transportation priority in the plan. Okay.

Member Cook.

Thank you, Chair. In this last budget, we put in $3.4 million to purchase the 14 acres at the southern end of the Norsell Collector Road. There is, it's laid out with a, it doesn't have an easement, but it's laid out where it's gonna continue. So anyway, I'm hoping that we'll pull the trigger and do that.

Are you aware if that southern easement, is that verbiage okay connecting to Kanakanui, Kanani, or Ohana Road?

I'd have to yield on that and look at the map. I'm not as Akamai as my brother there for traveling the road all the time. But I've talked to Department of Public Works and talked to Josiah and they're aware of it and this is the planned on the map southern end of the North-South Collector Road where it tees into the Mauka Makai, because Kanani, you bear right, you go down. The police station, you go down at the east end of that.

From the conceptual plan map, we do see that it goes from Waipuilani through Kaono'ulu in phase one and phase two. This is one of your handouts early on. But I don't know that they have plans to continue all the way on to North Kihei Road from Kaonaulu or if that... right away or easement has been considered yet. So that in that case, we may want to hold off until we talk to Public Works on that portion of it. Although I would like to make a note that we seem to be okay with adding instead of Kanani and Ohana, Kanaka Nui, Kanani or Ohana Roads the part that I would like to check on with Public Works is the Kaono Ulu to North Kihei Road section if they have intention or easements on that way. I do like the part where it says where the original right-of-way has not been protected and cannot be used, consideration may be given to rerouting sections. But other than that, I think that's as far as we can go at this point with this action item. We'll mark it as a revisit to such time we get DPW on the call to assist us with the specifically Kaʻonoʻulu to North Kihei Road section of it. Other than that, I don't have any issue. I think that they were awarded $25 million raise grant for the section that will begin in 2027. And it's expected to take about like 18 to 24 months for that first phase. And then phase two will follow, but funding does need to be secured as well. So any objection to revisiting this one when we have DPW available to us?

Okay, thank you.

Moving on to 104 A and B, as you can see from page 4 on attachment 3C, this was a CPAC original. I am not sure, this is Priorities 7A and 7B in Appendix H of the Infrastructure CIP. I'm not sure what the Kealia Bypass Road, if somebody could tell us where it's intended to start and end and what it's intended to bypass, because you have that, I think it's called like North Kihei Road that connects out to Kihei Junction and then the other Mokulele or Veterans Highway, whatever you want to call it, that is the other way out. So where is the Kealia Bypass Road intended to start and end? Does anyone know?

This is a action from the 1996 community plan that CPAC recommended bringing back. It is intended to replace as a phase out of the North Kihei Road as sea level rises and it would be intended to go between Mokulele Highway and Honua Pi'ilani Highway inland of Kalia Pond.

Oh, Mr. Kalanikau, you had something to add?

Yeah, they go Mokulele Highway to Kuihilani Highway. So if you guys know where the drag strip, the National Guard unit, somewhere around there. So the only way this is gonna happen, Maipono would have to agree on easement or repurchase land going from Mokulele Highway to Kuihilani Highway. and it's all because sea level rise, as you guys know. They're still repairing that road by the Broadwalk.

Okay, I'm gonna write down Mokulele to Kuihelani. and also mark this for a revisit so that we can speak with Department of Public Works on this planning. Have you run this by Public Works at all for their input?

We did send action items to the various departments for their input. I do not remember what the comment on the specific one was. Just as far as resilience, it is an important project. Not sure DPW is the correct agency though.

And then if it's a resilience important one, would it not be better placed in ready and resilient systems or?

It's both transportation and resilience. I find the current arrangement sometimes a little bit confusing.

OK. And maybe we would need to reword it as well if the intent is to get an easement or something from Mahi Pono, the rewording the action or implementation to discuss with Mahi Pono about an easement that would allow for a road kind of thing?

That would be part of the planning phase. Oh, okay. Might include purchase.

Okay, okay. All right, so I'm gonna mark 104 A and B, which is priority seven A and B as a revisit. Member Batangan?

Thank you, Chair. Since it still needs some more discussion, can I ask that when we reach out to the department, that we also ask them to consider connecting Veterans Highway to North Kihei Road, rather than going all the way to Kuihe Lani. There's an opportunity to still go mauka of Kealia without connecting to Kuihelani. It could still be further Makai.

Yeah, staff, did you get that? I think maybe so that Public Works is ready when we get to these revisits, maybe we can indicate which items we would like input from them on, which at this point was 103, and that was specifically about Kaono'ulu to North Kihei Road. part of the implementing action. And then for 104A and 104B, their input on Mokulele or Veterans Highway to Kuihelani or Veterans Highway to South, or sorry, Kihei, what is that road called? North Kihei Road?

North Kihei Road, yeah. So North Kihei Road is the one that goes along the shore that they were talking about replacing, but the area north of the... the generating station that needs to be decommissioned could still work, right? So you don't have to completely bypass North Kihei. You could just salvage the existing northern part of the road and then branch off to, what do we say, Veterans Highway.

So branching off from...

So basically abandon the portion that goes Makai of Kealia Pond and divert it, Mauka of Kealia Pond.

Got that style. Okay, so we'll be sending those ahead to Public Works so they know that when we revisit, they know and we know what specifically we're wanting input on. Okay, so revisiting that 105A and B. As we can see on page five of attachment 3C was a CPAC generated implementing action. And part A talks about developing a program to monitor multimodal level of service with a goal of incremental improvement of level of service for all modes of transportation during the life of the plan. And part B talks about implementing that implementing a program to monitor the multimodal level of service with a goal of incremental improvement of level of service for all modes of transportation during the life of the plan. And by life of the plan, I'm assuming we mean this South Maui community plan. And then I guess I was wondering what the geographic scope is was like all existing roads, all existing county roads, all existing state roads, both, um, and our concrete.

The scope of the road is probably major county and state roads. I do also believe that MPO is already working in this direction. Oh, there.

Planner Julia. Are you on today? She is DOT. Oh, okay. Director Takamori. Are you working with MPO at all on a multimodal level of service?

We are not that I am aware of.

MPO doing that?

Not sure. I would have to check with MPO.

You're not aware? No. Was Ms. Apotakayama available? She's still at the conference. Something like that. Okay. Let's see. Okay. this would be a federal and state, but it says DOT. So is this a high dot or H dot that we mean in the county lead agency or M dot?

It should probably be MPO actually at this point since they're the one doing it. Okay.

MPO and state. So can you mark that revision?

Implementation should probably be mdot and hdot.

Implementation mdot slash hdot. Would hdot then replace state? Yes. Okay, so on 105A, it should say mpo and state, and then on 105B, it should say mdot hdot.

Chair?

Yes, Mr. Takamori.

Hi. Just I guess a clarification then on the implementation part. I guess if we're looking at implementing a tracking for that, that may be able to be tracked from the MPO standpoint. It's the only reason why I'm throwing this out there, is that I guess if you're tracking any improvements that are being done by Public Works or State when it comes to pedestrian, biking, or roadways, that would fall under HDOT and DPW. Transit would fall under MDOT. So from an implementation of that tracking, it may be where we provide that data to the MPO.

So for implementation, we should put MPO, HDOT, and DPW.

From what Mark just said, it might just make the most sense to put MPO for both of those, and then the other ones would be coordinating with them anyway.

Mm-hmm.

M-P-O and H-dot for both.

Just M-P-O for both. Sorry, what?

Just M-P-O for both. Okay, just M-P-O for both. All right. Instead of D-P-W on the bottom one.

Okay.

I don't have any issue with this. It is 12 o'clock. If members, yes, Mr. Kanaheli.

Just speaking to this from our CPAC discussion, we tried to set a standard to measure improvement and then we use the level of service, you know, A to F. So now with the multimodal service, is there also a level of standard that is gonna be used? So how would you measure incremental improvement and what is the definition of incremental improvement?

That's a question. It would be that it moves from up, I guess, from F to E, like that. It would be moving better.

So you're still using the A to F?

I believe it is, but it's measuring the various modalities, right? You'd still have traffic level of service that you're measuring, pedestrian level of service that you're measuring, biking... level of service that you're measuring and then I don't know if you average it or how you do a multimodal level of service but in my googling that's what it said is that you would take the various modes of transportation and rate them and so it incremental means that it would be getting better right

Is there a baseline? Are we using a baseline for those multilevels?

We would still need to develop and implement the program. So we don't have a baseline currently until I guess it gets developed and then implemented. So as I said, I don't have any recommendations for change on 105A and 105B. We can stew on it over lunch and I can check back with you when we come back at 1.30 from our lunch break.

No?

Okay. All right, so as it is 12.03, I'll recess for lunch and then we can come back at 1.30. Okay. Meeting is in recess. The time is now 1.34. Will the drip committee return to order from our lunch recess? I hope everybody had a good... lunch break and came back ready to work and not ready to fall asleep. We left off on 105A. and 105B on page 115 of the draft plan, and they are on page five and six of attachment 3C. Mr. Ramirez, can you flash for us page five of attachment 3C on the screen?

Can you repeat that?

I was asking Mr Ramirez if he could flash the attachment 3C on the screen, which he has done. And I guess the main question that I had was while there were no changes made per drafting guidelines or recommended changes, the acronym MMLOS in the MPC draft was removed. Was that intentional or unintentional?

It was probably intentional because I don't think it's anywhere else in the plan. You can leave it in if you want.

Okay. Do members think that we need the MMLOS acronym? I don't see it in the acronym chart. So I guess it's a policy decision. I don't know that anyone outside of the planning will... Metropolitan Planning Organization will understand MMLOS. So I think it's okay. And the only changes I had recommended were for the county lead agencies to be MPO. Was there anyone from the members that had a change to recommend for 105A or 105B separate from the lead agency being the MPO? No, okay. Is that a substantive change, having the lead agency be the MPO? It is? Okay. So I will entertain a motion to amend county lead agency for 105 and striking what is written to say MPO on both, right? Yeah, on both. Motion made by Member Johnson. Is there a second? Second by Member Cook. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, you have seven ayes, zero noes to excuse members Betongan and Uuhajans. Motion passes.

Thank you. Okay, let's see. Mr. Ramirez, can you flash up for us page six of attachment 3C? This was a department proposal. It was slightly changed at the CPAC level, and then slightly changed at the drafting guidelines level, and then there's a recommendation to take out the example. it would say, apply for federal grants to help fund the completion of transportation projects, including the North-South Collector Road. And I'm amenable to taking that out as the recommended changes. It had said, apply for federal grants such as U.S. Department of Transportation Raise, Rebuild American Infrastructure and Sustainability Equity Grant. Because, you know, they always... new administrations tend to rename programs like the Raise Grant or the Build Grant or the Save Act. So if we don't call out the type of grant that we're intending them to apply for, it's broader rather than something else. just to note that the application, the Department of Public Works did submit an application in February of 2023 and they were awarded 25 million June of 2023 specifically for the North South Collector Road. So yay them. They're already doing this and this is why I guess it would say ongoing and the cost is not applicable and the funding is not applicable because they're doing it as part of their regular everyday work going out and searching for grants to apply for. So yay them. And I guess... My recommendation would be to entertain a motion to amend what is written on page 115 for the recommended changes on page six of attachment 3C in the bottom right hand corner. And it's just tightening up the language without really changing the meaning of the implementing action.

So moved.

Moved by Member Johnson, second by Member Sinensi. Any discussion?

Member Sugimura has a question. So based upon what you said about not listing specific grants, on page 115, it does list the RAISE grant.

Oh, yes, it does. So my recommendation was to strike that whole thing and replace it with the language in page 6 on attachment 3C that Mr. Ramirez had previously flashed up. Maybe he can flash it up again for you. It was the wording, the verbiage that I had read. So you see that verbiage on your screen in the bottom right hand corner, that's what we're replacing it with. And it does say raise grant, but that is bracketed out. And we all know that bracketed out means like, you know, deleted and underline is added in the Ramseer format. Got it. Any further discussion or questions from the members? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, seven ayes, zero noes to excuse members Uhu Hodgins and Betonga on motion passes.

Thank you. Mr. Ramirez, would you please flash up for us page seven of attachment 3C? Okay, we can see from this attachment that the planning department came up with a proposal and then it was amended by the CPAC and then further amended for drafting guidelines. I did look up... as was the recommendation from CPAC, the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan, which was drafted in October of 2003 by Chris Hart and partners. There isn't necessarily a Greenway section listed in the table of contents. It looked like page 32 to 36 of the plan had comments about Greenways, but the entirety of the plan is roughly 23 years old, so it seems like a lot of it is needing to be updated. I wanted to check in with Mr. Frampton, if he is on the line, how relevant this South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan is, like if you use it a lot or refer to it a lot. Mr. Frampton, are you on the call? And you guys enabled his microphone.

Good afternoon, Chair. Yes, I am here.

Oh, awesome. Mr. Frampton, being with Parks and CIP, I was wondering how often do you refer to the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan?

That's a great question. That's a plan that I've been looking up. I've been aware of it for the last several months, just as I've only been here for about a year. I'm not aware how often the rest of the department has used it, and that'd be something I'd follow up with. But I do remember it being formed. I actually helped a little bit with that because I did work with Chris Hart and Partners years ago and worked with guys like Joe Bertram on that. And it was a pretty good plan, but it is, like you said, dated at this time.

Yeah, so I mean, I don't know about updating one section of a 23-year-old plan and expecting it. I think, I mean, I don't know how it matters, but I would take out, it seemed to me only page 32 through 36 talked about greenways at all. So maybe pulling out that section and updating it into a South Maui Greenway multi-use path plan or something because if I was looking for relevant updated information on South Maui Greenways, I don't know if I would go to a 23-year-old plan called South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan. You know what I mean?

Correct. I understand. Okay. But I do think it would be good to comb through that. There are some potentially good pieces of information there. We'd be happy to do that.

and anything that's relevant and applicable because there were some great guiding values and visions that were used back then i still i believe it's still applicable today okay okay so um i guess for planning is any of the action items in this south wine community plan update to update the entirety of the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan, like in Goal 2.2 or anything? Or was it just to pull out the Greenways part and only update that part?

We would have to check and also check the Maui Island Plan. But I don't recall that being an action.

Okay. As this was amended at the CPAC level, do our CPAC resources recall whose amendment it was and why they wanted to update only the Greenway section of the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan?

So I believe the impetus for this was written testimony that was submitted to the CPAC and one of the members of the CPAC proposed that we include it in the planning department's proposed proposal. action and so it got put in that way okay okay um

I think my recommendation for amendment would be along the lines of incorporating non-substantive changes and revisions to pull out the Greenway section contained within the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan and create an updated Greenway plan updated or pull out the Greenway section of the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan and create an updated plan for South Maui Greenway multi-use path system linking all of South Maui, period, include numerous east-west segments connecting P'ilani Highway to South Kihei Road. For example, P'ikea Avenue, East Lipua Street, and Ohu Kai Road, period. Does that sound okay, Mr. Frampton?

Sure, would that be something the planning department undertakes or we jointly undertake together?

That would be something that Parks and Recreation would work on with Public Works.

Okay, I see DPW, sorry. You got it.

And then later when we get to Goal 2.2 for parks, we can have a different implementing action to update the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan if you're amenable to it. Since you worked on the first draft, you can work on the update 23 years later, or 24, 25, 26.

Right. There's been quite a few new facilities built out, and it'd be good to update. And pickleball wasn't even mentioned in that plan in 2003.

Pre-pickleball times.

Yeah.

Okay. Member Johnson?

Thank you, Chair. I understand that the plan is old, and it sounds like that's why you want to amend it. But is it that you're taking out the implementation timeline? And that's kind of my concern.

Yeah, I didn't mean to take out the implementation timeline. Good point. The point was that I'm not sure that someone... Oh, I'm hearing an echo. Are you hearing an echo? Oh. Maybe, Member Johnson, if you could mute yourself and then unmute when I'm done talking. But I definitely wanted to include the implementation timeline. So thank you for pointing that out. I was thinking of creating a separate plan building off of the Greenway section in the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan because it's not super intuitive that if I'm looking for a Greenway's plan that I'm gonna, a South Maui Greenway multi-use path system plan, that I'm gonna look inside of the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan, you know what I mean? So I was thinking of pulling that section out to update it and plan and complete a South Maui Greenway multi-use path system linking all of South Maui and including numerous east-west segments. including an implementation timeline and basing it off the original draft being like the parts of the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan that relates to greenways. Is that a little bit clearer? Sorry.

I mean, okay. And there's a lot of planning in this one. So I just wanna make sure that we're not requiring two plans. That's where I was getting a little confused because I want the implementation timeline to be in there that they actually try to do something. So I'm glad that you clarified that you had the implementation timeline in there. So, okay, I just wanted to clarify that. Thank you, Chair.

Yeah, dude, I gotta finesse the words a little bit better. Something like pull out the Greenway section contained within the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan and plan and create a South Maui Greenway multi-use path system an implementation timeline for a South Maui Greenway multi-use path system linking all of South Maui, period, and then include everything from include on down to the underlined area. in the changes per drafting guideline, which is include numerous east-west segments connecting P'ilani Highway to South Kihei Road, for example, P'ikea Avenue, East Lipoa Street, and Ohukai Road.

I'll make that motion if Mr. Frampton is in support, but I see Charlie's hand up. But Mr. Frampton, does that sound like the language you...

Yeah, yeah. Did you get that? Can you read it back to us? Or do you need me to try and repeat it?

Chair, what we have right now is use the Greenway section contained within the South Maui Region Parks and Open Space Master Plan and create a South Maui Greenway multi-use path system, which includes an implementation timeline. Include numerous and then the remaining in the drafting timelines. Okay, so moved.

Moved by Member Johnson. Seconded by Member Sinensi. Any discussion? Charlie, did you have any discussion?

All I was going to say is that the changes per drafting section included like 95% of what you're saying. The only difference was pull out as opposed to update. So the staff can easily polish up that language.

Okay, staff, Charlie has great confidence in your ability to easily polish up that language. So that's good news. Any further discussion? Oh, Ms. Komkowicz, is that a recent hand up?

That is a recent hand up. Could you put based on instead of pull out so that you are using it to develop the new plan and not just pulling it out of the existing plan?

Oh, yes, that's much better verbiage. Nobody wants to pull out. All right. We didn't vote yet, did we? All those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Aye.

Chair, seven ayes, zero noes. Two excused. Members Patonkan and Uhu Hodgins, motion passes.

Okay, thank you. I'm on page 8 of Attachment 3C. I didn't look through too much ahead because I was focusing here, but was the original action number 106 moved to Ready and Resilient Systems or some other place? It just says delete, but previous times I questioned about delete and then you guys said it was moved somewhere. So I just wasn't sure if that's one of the, this is one of the circumstances where it was moved. Let me double check. I don't recall. Okay. Or to the CPAC resources, do you recall if this was moved or just deleted by you folks?

I recall it being deleted. I don't recall the reason for it, but it would seem like it would be a good thing to move someplace else in the plan.

So that could be what happened.

Or it's found somewhere else.

fit in ready and resilient systems that the verbiage read previously. Plan and implement adaptation measures to address the impacts of sea level rise and increased flooding on South Kihei Road. I can try mark that as a revisit for when we get to goal 2.3. Staff, can you mark that down? Because I may otherwise forget it. Page 8, attachment 3C. Initial action 1.06 for revisit during goal... 2.3 implementing action. Did somebody say pardon? I did.

Okay, you go. I do think I remember why this was removed. I think the basis was that it is continuing to put money into a road that should probably be a part of sea level rise retreat rather than to continue to fund adaptation along that road.

Okay, so we don't want to adapt, we just want to retreat kind of thing?

That's what I remember from the discussion, yeah.

Chair, sorry to interrupt, but I think this came out of our maybe meeting from Director Jordan about whether we wanted to maintain infrastructure, that we were high possibility that we would lose it by keep investing money into repair or replacement when it's a big sinkhole. It's literally a sinkhole.

Yeah. I mean, we saw what happened just a few months ago, and it seems that we are continuing to do it, but okay. I guess we can have that bigger discussion under ready and resilient systems to if that's the goal is to just retreat rather than continue to sink money into adaptation of a road. We know could not hold up. All right, so then moving down to action. 107 that ended up becoming action number 1.08. This is number 9 priority in our Appendix H CIP plan. It looks like the verbiage stayed the same throughout all iterations. My only question, I guess, is if we named the community plan designation transit-oriented corridor, why does it say transit-oriented development corridor here and can development be stricken?

Transit-oriented development is usually the names of the plans that are funded at the state level. So don't remove development then? Just, yep, that's how it should be phrased.

Okay. I don't have any recommendation for amendment on this one. Any recommendation from the floor? I mean, other than the one I tried and was denied. Okay. Moving on, Mr. Ramirez, can you flash page nine of attachment 3C? So this one started out with a proposal from the department. that said create transportation demand management strategies for South Maui that shift commuter priorities away from driving alone to reduce congestion. And it became instead implement the transportation demand management strategies of the MPO. For example, providing incentives to partner with South Maui employers to sponsor flexible work schedules, bus passes, shuttles, rideshare, bike facilities, or other multimodal programs to connect employees to jobs. I think, can we make an overall amendment or is it non-substantive to replace all the DOT with MDOT? Non-substantive? Okay, cool. So all the DOTs will be replaced with MDOTs. I don't have any issue with this action. It is one of the to-be-determined cost amounts, I think, because it's a lot in just talking to employers about shifting the schedules. I remember Big Island used to have the van shuttle where... if people were living in Hilo and working in Kona, they could sign up to be the driver of this van that would drive everyone from Hilo to Kona. And then on the days off, you could use the van for like your own personal usage, like as kind of an incentive. So those kinds of things, I don't know that depending on how implementing the transportation demand management strategy depends on the cost. So I understand why it says to be determined. Does anyone have a problem with it to be determined here? Would you like to put an estimate on the cost? I mean, I guess it would depend on the strategy that is employed. Some of them could cost nothing, whereas offering of incentives or bike facilities. Member Sinensi followed by Member Batangan.

Mahalocha, just curious if the CPAC had any recommendations?

They didn't put any. Did the CPAC resources we have had any discussion on a dollar figure?

I don't recall us putting a dollar figure. We combined two actions into one, that's what happened. But I guess they thought it was a good idea to get people, cars off the road by combining ridership. But no, to answer your question, that I recall. Okay.

And then... Thank you. I'll follow up with Member Batongan and then Member Johnson.

Thank you, Chair. I guess I was just going to say that I can't remember if the transportation demand management strategies were specific to community plan areas. I think they were countywide, which is why it would make sense for it to be TBD because then you would have to pick and choose which ones you want to implement and when.

That makes sense because the for South Maui part was taken out to or stricken from there. It's just says implement transportation demand management strategies of the MPO and it cuts out for South Maui, blah, blah, blah. So that makes sense. And then I guess they would pick and choose which ones would work for South Maui.

Yeah. And I think that would make sense for all of the community plan areas just to have the more tailored approach per community plan area or is per community. And then some of them you could even do in coordination with with our private partner. So we wouldn't all have to be on on the county or the state to fund either.

okay um so i'm hearing of a recommendation to amend the funding sources to include private maybe yeah potentially um yeah because i guess it would depend on which ones you pick yeah okay uh remember johnson

Thank you, Chair. I'd like to maybe make a suggested amendment, but I'd like to hear maybe a discussion on it. But I'd like to include ferry tickets on this in the four example sections, because hotels will offer a ferry ticket if you're traveling during high season and they want to There's a Four Seasons in South Maui, there's a Four Seasons on Lanai, right? And just including the ferry tickets would be a good place to put it in there, for example. So I wonder what the body and our resources would think on that.

Any feedback on including ferry tickets before or after bus passes? Member Batongan.

I guess my only thought is that they're not one of the transportation demand management strategies identified in the actual MPO plan. Is that required?

Well, that's what the description of the- The wording says, implement the transportation demand management strategies of the MPO, we could say, and Member Johnson.

Who is on the board.

Who is on the board but didn't make it one of the demand strategies. Um, okay. Well, we need to change the verbiage of the sentence. No. Okay. All right. So then I guess the only recommended amendment I have is a motion to amend the final column of action 1.09 to include private. Moved by member Sugimura, second by member Sinensi. This is based on input from member Batonga and any discussion? Oh, member Sinensi.

Hello, Chair. Yeah, I was thinking on the same lines. I mean, every time there's a first Friday down in South Maui, it's always nice when there are some community groups that have some of these things. So I was just thinking maybe that would be a good opportunity to get community input during those times. Thank you, Chair.

Good idea. Okay. All those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Thank you. Okay. Mr. Ramirez, can you flash for us page 10 of attachment 3C?

Okay, there was a county planning department proposal that was identify opportunities to partner with South Maui employers. Oh, this is the one that was combined, so that's why it was deleted. Understood. Then the next one below that looks like it was a planning commission original. and it says to improve Makena Alanui and Makena Road to include a continuous bike lane, providing cyclists safe access to Makena State Park. So this wouldn't have been seen by the South Maui Community Plan Advisory Committee, Would we like to get input from them on their thoughts as to this implementing action proposal? Are you supportive? Do you see the need for that?

I guess it sounds like they want to go all the way to McKenna State Park.

Looks like that way to me as well.

So the roads are pretty wide until you get to Malawaka. That's when it narrows and it's a little rough and hilly. And I'm assuming that's a county road, right? Do we give tickets on that road and people park over there?

I think we give tickets regardless if it's our road or not, but we don't collect the money. I mean, I think we hand it over to the state.

So it's probably a half mile from where the, you know, wide road ends to McKenna State Park. You got three entrances, one, two, three. So, I mean, if you took it up to the first entrance, you know, that might... I don't know how far they went. If they went to the whole park or just part of the... Do you think your CPAC would be supportive of bike, continuous bike? There's a lot of guys that bike down there. And, you know, once they get on that section, it's not very safe because the road does narrow down. You kind of take... It's a risky... You kind of take your life in your hands when you go down there, especially the way some people drive. So I have to consider the safety element in a minute if... I suppose it might be a good idea for safety reasons to do that, protect life and limb.

I won't mention any names on drivers or anything. Ms. Komkovic?

This was originally a policy in the department draft and the CPAC draft, and then it was decided at Maui Planning Commission to put it in the actions instead.

Oh, okay, okay, that makes sense. And the $10,000 to $50,000 estimate, that was made by DPW?

That estimate was based on other C. I. P. Projects that included bike lanes. Okay.

Um He was Mr. Connor. He was seeing that the section from Maluaka Road is a little bit narrow and, um, if memory serves me, is not that well-paved, so maybe resurfacing, a little bit widening, and either a shared bike lane or a separate bike lane kind of thing is what you're imagining?

That is what was envisioned, yeah.

Okay, I don't have any recommendation for amendment. Member Sinensi?

Just a question for Deputy or Ms. Tomkovic. And I would think that Jordan would be asking about, do we, is it state property alongside the road or does it require acquisitions of property alongside the road to input? By Pats?

I don't know. We would have to research that more. And I think that was part of the reason it was originally a policy is so that it would be for developers in McKenna to consider as part of their proposals.

Yeah. And how many of it is on state property too? Thank you, Chairman.

We don't know how much of it is on state property. Okay. Chair Lee?

I was just thinking rather than state a destination, just put providing cyclists safe access to the extent possible.

So you want it to say improve McKenna-Alanui and McKenna Road to include a continuous bike lane, providing cyclists safe access to McKenna Park to the extent practicable?

No, no, I didn't say to McKenna Park. Just for that stretch, that stretch to the extent possible, because then they can decide where they want to stop.

Okay, providing cyclists safe access to the extent possible.

On McKenna Road, because that's how you started off.

Yeah, improve McKenna-Alanui and McKenna Road to include a continuous bike lane to provide cyclists safe access to the extent possible. Is that what you're saying you'd like it to be?

That's just a suggestion, yeah.

Okay.

Mainly because Mr. Kanaheli said Maybe the first part of the park, not the second. Rather than get into that kind of detail.

Oh, first entrance, you mean?

Yeah, yeah.

There's like three entrances, I guess.

Right, so he's saying that the beginning might be okay, but as you go further, it's narrower, right?

Yeah, when you get to Maluaka Road, he said it gets narrower.

I don't know if you want to get into that kind of detail.

Okay.

Member Sugimura. So do you want to ask DPW to comment on this?

We can if you'd like. You want to revisit this when we have DPW? Can you add this to our list to transmit to DPW that we're going to revisit it with input from them?

Thank you.

Okay, moving on to page 117 of our draft plan, action number 1.11 had very minimal changes from the department's draft all the way through. The only thing that CPAC changed was making this a high priority from a medium priority, and it's actually priority number three, in the Appendix H, capital improvements. So it's to retrofit existing streets with pedestrian and bike facilities using complete streets and Vision Zero Maui principles where appropriate. to improve connections through South Maui neighborhoods and around recreation and commercial areas. Priority areas include sidewalk and intersection improvements discussed in the Helemai Maui Long Range Transportation Plan. So it got an upgrade from a medium priority to a high priority and is actually priority number three. of the CIP. I have no recommendation for amendment. I think it's good the way it is, but I will hear from the body if you folks have any that you'd like to recommend or propose. Seeing none, we can move on to page 12. Mr. Ramirez, will you put this up on the screen? So this one had revisions from the original department draft to the CPAC draft to the MPC draft. And it looks like the MPC draft is what made it onto the booklet. And It looks like it's just kind of broader. Not so specific. I did have a question about unpaved green strip. Like are we talking about like spray painting gravel green or is it grass or... Was it supposed to be stripe? I'm not sure. Or is it like an island, like a traffic island?

Like an island, but just a separate strip of unpaved landscaping area, but not necessarily landscaped. Just like dirt between them, kind of like by Mokulele Highway. Or it's just separated from traffic?

I guess I recall when that traffic island was made, I think, by the Maui Lu area. And I... I remember hearing some concern about when emergency response vehicles are going through, if it allows for cars to pull over. I think that, you know, the Green Strip or a traffic island or buffer is good for biker safety, especially if you have an emergency response vehicle coming and a driver is anxious to pull over. But we don't want them running into the biker, but we do want them obeying the law and pulling over for the emergency response vehicle. And so What would take priority, I guess? Or is it not the kind of island with curbs and so you could drive over onto the unlandscaped green strip of unpaved weeds, I guess?

The way I read this is it does not have a curb. It would be very similar to what is on Mokulele Highway where there's no curb. It just like is dirt between the two. So you're not going into the biker when you pull over for an emergency vehicle.

Okay.

And it also allows drainage.

Allows for drainage. So it would kind of slant into the green strip. No curb.

Yeah. Okay. Ask Daniel for more information since he was the one who proposed these changes, I'm pretty sure.

Well, the CPAC changes aren't the ones that made it into the book. It was changes to the CPAC to the MPC that made it in. I think they took out reference to 30 inch wide and including lighted or rectangular rapid flashing beacons at crosswalks where feasible, prioritize locations as identified by safety and need. So it took out a lot of the things that the CPAC added in terms of specifics, like a four foot wide sidewalk and concurrently create six foot wide. So the specifics look as though they're taken out as well as paths adjacent to sidewalks. So the CPAC version read on South Kihei Road Install continuous unobstructed four foot wide sidewalks and concurrently create six foot wide bike paths adjacent to the sidewalks separated by a 30 inch wide unpaved green strip where feasible. include lighted or rectangular rapid flashing beacons at crosswalks where feasible, prioritize locations as identified by safety and need, and it became on South Kihei Road, install continuous unobstructed sidewalks and protected bike lanes. separated from traffic by a unpaved green strip where feasible. So a lot of the specifics were taken out, I guess, because Public Works probably has their own standards that they follow. I don't have any issue with, The changes, this would be a number four priority on the CIP appendix. Does anyone from the body have any recommended changes? I do not. Nope, okay. This looks like a CPAC original, and it's a number two priority of Appendix H. Action number 1.13 reads, begin installation of sidewalks, bike paths, and crosswalks as prioritized in the Kihei sub-area transportation plan. And this was estimated at costing $137 million. But I think that's for the entirety, not just the beginning. Okay. All right. So and then we did get that HRS 205AQ or something. So this could happen pretty quicker than without that exemption. So yay on that slight move forward. I have no recommendation. I think it's a great implementing action, especially now that they can be exempted from the SMA. And The Kihei sub-area transportation plan, that's fairly, it's updated. It's not like out of date or anything.

It's also the broad term for it. So when that is updated, it would be updated. It's not like identifying 2026 Kihei sub-area transportation plan. Oh, okay.

Okay. All right. Action number 1.14 was slightly amended to identify, develop and implement safe routes to schools, safe routes for seniors, safe routes to transit and safe routes to parks projects throughout South Maui. It's not part of Appendix H. but it is high priority and the cost is to be determined. Is that because we can get monies from the federal government or is the state for safe routes to school and things like that or?

We can get money from the federal government, but there's also a safe route could be creating a new path or it could be just identifying where there's existing paths that might need small changes to make them safe?

So there's such a wide range that we left it as to be determined. Do members want to put a dollar amount in there, like say over 20 years? No, we don't want to just leave it as to be determined part of the annual budgeting process. Member Batongan?

I would leave it at TBD because Safe Routes to Schools, Safe Routes for Seniors, and Safe Routes, well, I don't know what to translate, but the parks. If you create plans, you can then use it to apply for funding for those specific projects or programs. And so I would just leave it at TBD and then let the department come up with individual proposals that they can then tie to funding.

And would you say it would fall all in DPW or should we put MPO as another lead agency?

Okay, this is one where I might have to defer to my colleagues who are still on the board or who are still involved with MPO. When I was there, we proposed taking the funding that was allocated for a safe versus school coordinator from the Department of Public Works and then bringing it into MPO where we would hire and manage students that coordinator for the Seafrost School Program. I don't know what happened after I left.

So is that Member Cook, Member Sugimura, and Member Johnson were asking you, do you know what happened? Member Johnson?

Sorry, my dog. So to get the access to the federal funds, you need this safe action plan. So, should that be in here? Just say, identify, develop, and implement the safe action plan is the key to access those funds. Having the action plan is what allows us to reach those funds. So, should that be in there? Because otherwise, it's kind of vague. It's like identify, develop, and implement. the Safe Routes Discourse, and those are the programs that are under SF for All, Safe Routes for All is the overall encompassing federal PAH.

So we want to, that makes sense to me, identify, develop and implement safe action plans for safe routes to schools, safe routes for seniors, safe routes to transit, and safe routes to parks projects throughout South Maui, period. And then it makes sense that we leave it as TBD because then they can apply for grant money. Member Sugimura, did you say that MPO did hire a safe routes coordinator?

Not specifically only, but we did hire a planner, besides having an awesome executive director.

You hired a planner for MPO, but the MPO former executive director said that you took the Safe Routes Planner from Public Works?

Chair, so no, that's slightly different. We hired an additional planner, but the state... The state DOT gave money to each county to do Safe Routes to School planning. It was $100,000 a year for, I forget how many years. But yeah, they weren't, they didn't have capacity in Public Works, so we proposed NMOU to allow for the MPO to receive that funding from the state instead, and then we would then hire a Safe Routes to School coordinator at the MPO so that we could do this type of work. I don't know what the status of that is, because I honestly haven't been as involved since, but... So that's one thing. I would add MPOs and implementing agency. Then back to what I was saying earlier, I would still leave it at TBD because you can tailor projects and programs to available funding sources. So remember Cook Johnson was saying there's safe routes to the safe SS4A. I don't remember what it stands for. But SS4A, safe routes, something for all. But that's the funding source that we're using for the Hana Greenway, for example. Or you could pull in monies... So implementing these programs I think is a good goal for us to have on the books. How much specificity do we need? I mean, personally, I'm comfortable with what's labeled here and then we just give the departments the latitude to do their thing afterwards.

So you don't think between implement and safe, implement a safe action plan for,

No, I mean that's more detailed than I think we need to at the community plan level. Because that gets into the logistics of the implementation. I would rather just say implement the program.

Okay, all right, so then the only recommended motion to amend, oh, go ahead, Member Johnson.

Okay, Chair, I appreciate this discussion. I brought up the federal US Department of Transportation website, the overview of SS4A, which is, you know, safe streets for all is the acronym now. the implementation grants. So second paragraph says implementation grants provide federal funds to implement projects and strategies identified in a comprehensive safety action plan referred to as an action plan. So they really emphasize the fact that we have to have the action plan in order to get the grants. So that's why I was bringing that up. Just to point out information. Thank you, Chair.

Okay, so if we want to go for federal funds, there will need to be a safety action plan.

The action plan for Maui Colony is the Vision Zero action plan. Yes.

Yes, the Vision Zero Council is that, right?

So we wouldn't need to implement a new Safe Action Plan. So identify, develop and implement the Vision Zero Action Plan to apply for safe routes to schools, safe routes for seniors, safe routes to transit and safe routes to parks projects funding throughout South Maui. No. We already have the plan, so we're good to move forward. Okay. I will entertain a motion to amend the County Lead Agency category by including MPO. Moved by Member Sugimura, seconded by Member Uuhajins. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, nine ayes, zero noes. Motion passes.

Thank you. Mr. Ramirez, if you can flash page 13 of Attachment 3C, this looks like an MPC-initiated proposal, but it could be a transfer of a previous policy or something, and that was changed to an implementing action, which makes sense because it looks like an action. And this has... In Appendix H, it's priority number five. And so it just says, acquire parcels that provide opportunities to improve the connectivity of the transportation network, including roadways, greenways, and multi-use paths. And it's to be determined because I guess, you know, we don't know what will become available or how much it costs. I mean, it will cost money. Member Sinensi.

Hello, Chair, our earlier discussions with CPAC Chair wanted to include especially cul-de-sacs.

Oh, yes. I did see that somewhere.

This was policy 2.2.16 originally. It was part of that policy. Um, and it said as opportunities arise, acquire parcels within cul-de-sacs for incremental expansion of connectivity, um, which could still be a policy, but this part is, um, director of public works wanted it to be a little bit more broad so that whatever parcel will, help expand the road transportation network. The action applies.

Okay, so and we don't need to put including but not limited to just say acquire partials because that includes but is not limited to call the SACs and we don't say including but not limited if we can help it. So, um, and we're okay with to be determined price tag because we will never know.

It's an ongoing purchase thing, so it's going to be evolving.

Yes. Okay. I have no recommendation for change on this one. Moving right along. Mr. Ramirez, can you put page 14 of attachment 3C on the screen? So the planning department had a proposal. It was amended by the CPAC, and then that was rewritten based on drafting guidelines. So the final... comes out to prioritize the identification, design, and implementation of a new multimodal transportation corridor through South Maui to Central Maui, mauka of or above Pi'ilani Highway, connecting to Maui Veterans Highway in a manner that minimizes harm to ʻāina. And this is in Appendix H, it's priority number 13, long-range timing, high priority. So this sounds like... If it's above P'ilani Highway, it kind of sounds like that Mauka Bypass that they were talking about. So I was thinking that another important step is to acquire the easement. Like as we're seeing with the South Maui Collector Road right now, because we didn't acquire easement all the way through, now we're either having to not go north-south all the way or eminent domain, some property boundaries to create it. So I think long before any kind of development or entitlement happens, we should secure the easement for our multimodal transportation corridor. So I guess my recommendation would be prioritize the identification acquire the easement design and implementation of a new multimodal transportation corridor through South Maui to Central Maui, Mauka of or above Peelani Highway, connecting to Maui Veterans Highway in a manner that minimizes harm to the aina, including any non-substantive revisions or changes, because I know those aren't super pretty. And then if this is an implementing action with planning department as the lead agency, if we're, can planning department acquire an easement or would you need to work with department of management or something like that? So then we would also in that motion add DOM, I think is the acronym in here, which is also weird because usually we do MD, but then that might get mixed up with doctor or something. So, member Batangan.

Thank you, Chair. Is it management? I thought land acquisition was in finance.

We could put finance and management because I think finance just cuts the check and

No, the leases, the negotiations and the leases are... For easement, finance? Okay, easements might be different. Yeah, but I'm pretty sure most of that is done through Guy and his team.

Okay, we can put DPW and finance if we're doing easement acquisition, maybe. So it would be planning department, finance, and DPW because we're adding in easement acquisition so that whatever happens, at least nobody's going to build in that right away. So do you guys need me to repeat the draft motion? Okay. It's just adding in acquisition easement and the other lead policies. So moved. Moved by Member Johnson, seconded by Member Sinensi. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, nine ayes, zero noes, motion passes.

Nice, thank you, members. Oh, page 15, Mr. Ramirez, we can see this proposal. Had a lot of amending through the lane. Um... The final verbiage, which I am okay with, reads, identify through consultation the appropriate locations and install pedestrian and bicycle wayfinding signage along greenway paths and sidewalk improvement areas that reflect the host culture incorporating . I think that's period. Signage may include maps, directional signs, moku signage, smartphone applications, and public art throughout South Maui. And this is a low priority, mid-range timing Department of Management would be the lead agency for a $300,000 cost. I have no recommendation for amendment. Member Johnson.

I just have a question on who the first part identify through consultation. Who are we consulting?

CPAC resources, who did you mean when you said consultation? Who are we consulting with?

I don't believe we identified the who.

Can they consult with themselves? Maybe Department of OEB Resources? Yeah. So we'd add in through consultation with Department of OEB Resources. Okay. Member Rollins-Fernandez?

Mahalo Chair. Is Department of OEB Resources online with us?

Deputy Director Robinson, are you online?

My proposal would be to replace the host with OEV and then we can change that if we get feedback from OEV department. I don't ever want to be called the host unless everyone else is like parasite.

Are they not? No, just joking.

Is Terri Robinson on? No, she's not on.

Okay. She's not on this time, but I have no objection to recommending a motion to amend action number 1.17. to read, identify through consultation with Department of OEB resources, the appropriate locations and install pedestrian and bicycle wayfinding signage along greenway paths and sidewalk improvement areas that reflect the OEB culture, incorporating Olelo Hawai'i, period. Signage may include maps, directional signs, moku signage, smartphone applications, and public art throughout South Maui. And the county lead agencies would be Department of Management and Department of OEV Resources. And maybe also Department of also be consulted not for the content of the sign, but maybe the placement of the signs. We don't want to interfere with any underground infrastructure, as they had said previously. So also add DPW about, I don't know if we have to call out that we're consulting with them on the installation locations, but hopefully they understand that. Do you think it needs to be put in the the goal or the action that we're consulting with DPW for the specific installation locations, they'd understand that.

You were just gonna put it as one of the county lead agencies, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, that makes sense.

Okay. All right. So is there someone willing to make that motion as read? Member Lee? Made the motion second by Member Johnson. Any further discussion? Seeing none, everybody in support, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, nine ayes, zero noes. Motion passes.

Mr. Ramirez, can you put up page 16 of attachment 3C? So there was an amendment from the department's proposal to the CPAC draft, and it also was changed from medium to high priority. And kind of, I'd say not super substantive change. made per drafting guidelines so the final word being would say implement additional bus route stops and more frequent transit services to increase public transit use identified in the Maui Short-Range Transit Plan. This project improves access to employment centers and community services like shopping, education, healthcare, and recreation, particularly for vulnerable communities and low to moderate income neighborhoods. So this was changed to a high priority by the CPAC. It's an ongoing action. M dot, non-substantive change, because we already said all the dots are gonna be M dots. And to be determined cost. Does anyone have a problem with this action item? I have no proposed change. Okay, seeing none. We can move on to page 17 of attachment 3C. So this action 1.19 is a part of appendix H. It is priority number 11. And there was no change made throughout the CPAC and MPC Review. and just may from a should in changes per drafting guidelines. So provide a frequent direct route public transportation from Kahului Airport to South Maui and hotels. The buses may have increased baggage allowances and storage to ensure rider safety. I have no recommendation for amendment other than the non-substantive M dot, and this would be county, federal, and private, 250,000. Okay, next, 1.2, one, no, 1.2, sorry, O. is similar where it was proposed by the department and just a minor change per drafting guidelines to separate into two sentences medium priority mdot 250 talks about identifying locations for bus shelters and park and rides, providing covered shelters, lighting, benches, trash receptacles, bike racks, and ADA-compliant areas. So I have no recommended amendment. Anybody on the committee? Everyone okay with this as is? All right. Okay, moving on to page 18 of attachment 3C. The next three look like CPAC originals with the first two having some amendment from CPAC version to the Maui Planning Commission version. Mr. Ramirez, would you flash for us page 18, attachment 3C? Okay, so transition to buses that run on renewable energy such as electric hybrid and biodiesel to transition to public transportation that runs on renewable energy such as electric hybrid and biodiesel. I think we do have some electric buses. I'm not sure if they're specific only to South Maui, but this is number eight in priority on Appendix H. It's a high priority. MDOT, $40 million allocated. Other than the non-substantive MDOT, I have no recommendation for change. It is ongoing as we know that we already do have some electric vehicle buses. So I don't have any recommendation for change. The next one also looks like a CPAC original. And instead of... Taxing as a sort of stick, the MPC took it to taxing incentives as a carrot. So study tax incentives to encourage hotels to provide environmentally friendly transportation options for visitors to reduce reliance on individual rental cars is what it turned out to be. It originally was tax hotels that do not provide airport shuttles use the revenue to provide an airport service. So went from the stick model to the carrot model, it seems. I don't have any issue with this, but I'm open to hearing from the members or our CPAC resources. Oh, I'm sorry, Mr. Ramirez, could you show people's faces again? Thank you. Okay. Looks like no hands, no cares. We can move on. Mr. Conahealy, did you have something you wanted to add?

We're on 1.20, sorry, 1.22? 1.22, yes. Tax Hotels, yeah, one of our members thought that was a great idea to use the stick to get them to provide the service shuttles to and from the airport. Folks want the stick or the carrot?

I think, I don't know, we can consult with Corp Council, but some South Maui hotels may complain if they're the only ones, if it's a regional tax put on them and not other region hotels for not providing. I don't know. Deputy Corp Council Hopper or Nunakawa, Any comment? And I guess, would it only be triggered in those same four circumstances, like subdivisions, special use plans, change in zoning, or how would it be triggered?

Oh, sorry, go ahead. It sounds like someone had already begun to answer or had a comment.

Yeah, this is Jackie from Planning Department. I remember that Department of Finance did not support the proposal to create a tax on hotels because it's kind of beyond what they do and it would be very difficult to implement. Even with studying tax incentives, I think that would be put on them and they would have to figure that out and how to do that.

On the Department of Finance, but the county lead agency is listed as Department of Management. Is that wrong?

Yeah, I think it's kind of awkward to assign a land use policy or action to Department of Finance. I have not seen that before, so maybe that's why I went to Department of Management.

Oh, okay, okay. So Member Lee, go ahead.

It's nice to have comments from CPAC, but in this case, he said one member had his idea. So there's nine of us or eight of us here that don't agree. So let's move on.

Okay, so is your recommendation to delete 1.22 action item?

Yeah. Yeah.

Okay.

Go with the carrot.

The carrot is what was written in there. It started out as a stick. MPC changed it as a carrot. So if you want the carrot, then there's no need to change anything.

Yeah, the carrot.

Okay. So we're good with the carrot and we're going to leave it as is. I'm gonna call you guys my little bunnies instead of my chickadees. Okay, so moving on. It looks like 1.23 was a CPAC original as well that had no change. It's about ensuring sufficient public EV charging infrastructure. And I'm still working on that EV bill that is modeled after the County of Hawaii. I think it showed up and it got referred to member Cook's committee. So how appropriate, because that will help us on our South Maui community plan implementation. So yay. I don't have any recommendation for change here. Does anyone from the floor? Nope. Okay. The next one. Action 1.24 was also looks like a CPAC original with no changes made through. It's about complete mapping of old plantation kingdom government roads and military era roads for possible use for emergency evacuation routes. Oh, I like that actually. I think it's great. Does anyone know the name of the road that was referenced by the testifier like going up from like the McKenna area up? And is it like the Oprah Winfrey Road now or it wasn't way back in the day because she wasn't around? But any of our CPAC resources?

It sounds like the old McKenna Road.

Oh. Okay, and so would that be one of the old plantation kingdom government roads or military era roads? Old McKenna Road?

There's several, but that road runs through what is now McKenna Resort. And I don't know if they... At one point, I think it was discussion of preserving part of that, it's not in use now, but preserving the road because of its historic use. I mean, there's many residents living today that used it to get mauka come down to the ocean. So yeah, it was a paved road. It was a pretty good road. I never used it to my knowledge. Others that I know personally have used it.

Okay.

Charlie. Okay. I just want to ask Member Cook a question because I've traveled that road and it's like where the wine place is, Tedeschi Winery or something. Okay. It starts from there and comes all the way down. And I thought it came down to Wailea, not McKenna. Does it come down to McKenna? Anyway, I traveled that road with another council member and Guy Hironaka's either father or uncle, and he brought us down that road. But I could have sworn we ended up in Wailea, but I'm not sure, it was like years ago.

Sounds like a good time. Go ahead, Member Cook.

When I used to go down, it was from Willapalooza Road and it came down to Chinks. And it wasn't, if it was paved, it was robust. I don't remember, it was like, but yeah, that was, I guess that was like in 72, 73.

That was before our time, or before some of our times.

Yeah. Mine was 89.

Okay, Richard Johnson, followed by Mr. Frampton, followed by Mr. Kalanickal.

Thank you, Chair. Okay, so some resources want to speak, but my question was, you know, listening to our community, the public hearing, they really wanted emergency evacuation routes to be a priority. Could we raise the priority from medium to high?

I'm sure we could. And I was also thinking that we should add NEMA as a county lead agency to the planning department as well. Let's see, Mr. Frampton?

Yeah, thank you, Chair. I was just going to confirm for you that those are two separate distinct Mauka Makai roadways or access ways. One is the old McKenna Road that I used to bicycle down from Kula with my friends to Big Beach. And that did come exit near the, it starts near the Namauka terminus near the winery and does end near McKenna Landing, above McKenna Landing. That's where it used to run. The other one is a similar alignment, but does come into Wailea, but ends at Sun Yat Sen Park, and that's what they refer to as Oprah's Road.

Sun Yat Sen to Wailea?

Yes. Sun Yat Sen. Are they private roads? Yes, Sun Yat Sen, that Oprah one is private, and I believe the old Ulupalakua McKenna Road was private as well with Ulupalakua Ranch, I believe.

Does it fall under those once a road, always a road, even if it's on private lands, or is that even a thing? Once a lifeguard, always a lifeguard, we mean. No, once a Boy Scout, always a Boy Scout. Eagle Scout or something.

Is that Oprah Winfrey's road?

Yeah, the one from Sun Yat-Sen Park to Wailea is on Oprah's land.

Okay, thank you.

Oh, yeah, sorry, Mr. Kalanikau?

Yeah, thank you, Chair. So the intent of this is to exactly find options, other ways to emergency exit in South Maui because we only get one exit on the north side. So recently the community came to have a meeting with Mayor I was in that meeting, some of the community is asking for us, the county, to go find out more about those roads in McKenna and Wailea. You know, see if they're still government road or public roads. Meaning, were those roads given up by state or county? a long time ago, so the challenge will be finding that information, but I'm working with MEMA, Chris, on this, because they should be involved in this, and they're interested in helping with exit points and areas where we can stage people or the community for different types of disasters like tsunami, fire, or hurricane. So we have not meet with the land owners on this. We are planning to meet with the land owners and find out what options we do have. I think we're gonna find out that we don't have to completely go up, completely. I think there's some errors on the ranch lands or high tech park or different locations in South Maui that we can stage, cut the districts in smaller districts to, have areas for evacuation, but it's definitely on our menu to figure out how we're going to use the Hialeah McKenna side as a possible exit point. Mahalo chair.

Thank you. So maybe, um, Maybe the action could be a little bit simpler, like identify emergency, identify roads for possible use for emergency evacuation routes. It doesn't necessarily need to be an old plantation, a kingdom, or a government road, or a military road. I'm not sure if Old McKenna Road or Oprah's Road are any of that, but I think the gist of it is to identify roads that aren't currently in use for possible use for emergency evacuation routes. Because we don't know if Old McKenna Road or Oprah's Road were an old plantation, kingdom, government or military era road and I don't know that it matters because many people recall having used those roads and it could be good for evacuation even if we don't need to go all the way up to Tedeschi Winery or Sun Yat-Sen Park. So are the members amenable to, oh, Member Cook, go ahead.

Thank you, Chair. As far as like Oprah's road, that's the Haleakalā Ranch road, and they used it for cattle up, moving cattle up and down. Oprah bought an easement from Haleakalā Ranch. It's not her road. She has an easement, and she paid for the design and infrastructure to make it passable and paved in some areas. But it's a Haleakalā Ranch road, and she only has the easement to it for clarity. So that issue during the storm when they were like, they said people could use it to get out. Oprah basically had to sign an indemnification to the ranch that she was take responsibility for the public that used it. So anyway, that's just, since my best friend was the general manager for OW Ranch, I knew that.

Thank you. Very nice of her. Please continue to allow it. I guess the point is we don't really care who owns the road, just that it could be identified and used in emergency evacuation planning, I think is the key part of this action item. So I guess I'll entertain a motion to amend 1.24 to say identify roads, whether public or private, for possible use for emergency evacuation routes, including any non-substantive changes or revisions to pretty it up and change the priority from medium to high. and change the lead agency to include MIMA and potentially Department of Management, maybe, if we need to. sign something or coordinate other agencies, Department of Management would know who. So that's the motion I'm entertaining. And it looks like it's moved by Member Johnson, seconded by Member Sinensi. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, I see nine ayes, zero noes. Motion passes.

Nine ayes. Wow, that's a first. And I'm just joking. And that brings us to the end of action items for goal 2.1 minus the few revisits that we needed to do. Everybody pat yourself on the back and round of applause. You guys did so good. I'll be giving you guys a 10 minute reset. And then we'll come back ready to go on action items for goal 2.2. I subscribe to the carrot method for all my little bunnies. Go ahead, Member Batonga.

Thank you. Can I add one more to potential revisit? 1.23 regarding the EV charging. I actually don't know which department's responsible for installing EV chargers throughout the county.

1.23. Yeah.

I have no idea. It's listed as DOT, but I don't know if that's them. I just wanna flag it for potential revision. Once we're able to get clarification.

Chair Paulton?

Yes. Yeah, on that comment, we were kind of discussing that too, Maui County Code 1936B has some language about EV charging, but not necessarily public. That's regarding parking lots, which are likely to be private. This being public, EV charging might be something different. But yeah, we had that question too.

Yeah, I think it is in DPW because when we tried to change it in Title 19, what came back from the Planning Commission was to put it in like Title 16, which I think is DPW. So... Rather than revisit, I'll entertain a motion to amend page 119, action item 1.23 to strike DOT and put DPW. Member Cook, did you have a discussion or were you making the motion?

No, I had a comment. Okay, go ahead. Maui Electric does their own engineering, so when you go to them with a proposal for virtually anything, because they have to engineer whether they have the capacity to serve that particular area with that extent of electrical service, and then they design pretty much everything. they approve the drawings. So I just, even though they're not a government agency, if any time you're talking about a charging facility of any substance, they would be included in the lineup of people that would have to be addressed and worked with.

Okay. Yeah. I just think because, um, DPW administers title 16, they would be the appropriate county lead agency. So, um, Anybody willing to make that motion to change the MDOT to DPW? So moved. Moved by Member Cook, seconded by Member Lee. All those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, nine ayes, zero noes. Motion passes.

Okay, good catch. So we don't need to revisit 1.23 anymore. I think that's correct. And so now at this time we'll go on recess, come back at 3.25. Any objections? Okay, we'll be in recess till 3.25. Will the DRIP Committee return to order? The time is 3.32. Thank you, members, for that afternoon recess. We're moving on to goal 2.2 on page 120 of your draft community plan for South Maui. And... Our first action item, 2.01, was proposed by the planning department and it does not change throughout. Was this one of the items in the Kihei-McKenna plan? Of, what is it, 1998 or something? 96?

Yes, this is a carryover.

And that was the 1996 Kihei McKenna plan?

Yeah, from the 1996 Kihei. It changed a little bit, but it's essentially the same.

So we couldn't get it together to make the entryway sign in the last 20 years. So we're gonna give ourselves another 20 years to try and do that. Okay. I don't have an objection. I mean, Lahaina has that once the former capital of the Hawaiian Kingdom signs at the two entrances off of Highway 30, but now with the bypass, it's a little different. Was there any specific location or just the north end of South Maui?

coming in off Veterans Highway. Maybe I think it was envisioned for that little area where the roads kind of meet.

That makes sense. I guess I'm not opposed to giving the Department of Management another 20 years on this action item. It is a low priority with mid-timing and costs to be determined it's a county and private funding sources any objection to giving them another 20 years on this action no objection all right let's do it moving on this one um was also a department proposal with no big changes except for like a comma per drafting guidelines. It looks as though the priority may have been changed or added to make it be a medium priority. It's implementing streetscape beautification through an adoption program for trees, sidewalks, street frontages, and intersections. So like some entity would adopt a tree, adopt a sidewalk, adopt a street frontage, or adopt an intersection and keep it clean is what we're seeing. And this is just to create that type of program. Was this an action item from 1996 as well?

I believe this was something we heard in community engagement.

Okay, and I don't know if DPW, should handle this alone with the plethora of things that they have going on. I can see them being one agency, but if we're having somebody create a program and we want it to happen, I don't think that leaving DPW as the lead agency would set them up for success if they're the only agency. maybe adding on Department of Management or Office of the Mayor, potentially. Because I can see DPW needing to give input, but I don't see them, having the capacity to create adoption program. So I don't have a problem with the action item. I think we should, I don't know, do you think management or Office of the Mayor would be better? Probably management for consistency, okay. I'll entertain a motion to amend 2.02 to add Department of Management as another county lead agency on implementing street scrape beautification through an adoption program. Moved by Member Batangan, seconded by Member Cook. Just to let you know, Member Cook, Photo is not on, but it's not a problem. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, eight ayes, zero noes, one excused. Member Sugimura, motion passes.

Okay, moving on to 2.03. It looks like this may be a CPAC. original it's along the same lines to create a program to keep roads safe beautiful and litter free through adoption programs litter campaigns and increased enforcement um i think we do have adoption programs on the highway for south or for west maui do you guys have it on the highway for South Maui, and you guys are talking about beyond just the highway, like other roads?

Yes.

Okay, so expanding the state program to also include county roads. I have no problem with this, although if we're talking about creation of a program, we need to give DPW some help, I think, again. And so I would include, I would entertain a motion to include Department of Management as another lead agency to get the program created. Oh, moved by Member Cook, seconded by Member Patangan. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

Chair, eight ayes, zero nos, one excuse. Member Sugimura, motion passes.