Government Relations, Ethics, and Transparency Committee - Regular Meeting

Good morning, everyone. Will the government relations ethics and transparency committee meeting of 12/03/2025 please come to order. It is 09:07AM. I am your chair, Nohelani Uhu Hajins. Members, in accordance with the sunshine law, please identify by name who, if anyone, is in the work vehicle or work space with you today. Minors do not need to be identified. Let's begin with committee vice chair member Palton. Aloha.

Aloha. Aloha.

District office, and I'm here and ready to work, ma'am.

Member Johnson, you would match on the 6th Floor. They're having spirit week, and they're having their sweaters today. So yes. Perfect.

Perfect. Well, know it's cold in the chambers and is the season, so I've got my Perfect. Year

on. You look wonderful. Council chair, Alice Lee. Aloha ka yaka.

Aloha, mai ka

ka. Council member Rollins Fernandez. Aloha ka yaka. Oh, I saw her face. Sorry. I

gonna wrap my sweater.

Oh, k. Perfect.

Aloha ka ka yaka chair. My mokai nui a hina. I'm at my private residence alone here. There are currently no testifiers at the Molokai District Office, and I wanted to quickly send a special happy one year mark. Happy birthday to our first office baby, Ava Gray. Oh, happy birthday. She's Yay. Yeah.

I'll go grab my sweater.

Yay. So cute. Oh, thanks for sharing that. Council member Shane Sanancy,

chair, and baby Evan.

Yes. Happy birthday. And members Sugimura is excused for now. I've been asked to make an announcement that there is kon and maki sushi in them back for I was gonna say the council members, but then that'd be rude. So I guess everybody on this side of the floor on the blue carpet. From corporation council, have with us Thomas Colby, deputy corporation council. I don't see Abby. Oh, hi, Abby. Are you gonna be with us for a later item? Okay. Then please come join us now. Thank you. Abby Hoke. Am I saying your name? Okay.

Deputy corporation counsel. Susan Leader, deputy corporation con counsel, and Christian Tarnstrom, deputy corporation counsel. We also have with us, Josiah Nishita, managing director, Kimo Landgraft, deputy director of water supply, Shane Agawa, deputy, director of environmental manager management, Jody Oshida, boards and commissions liaison, and assistant Greg chief Okamoto I'm sorry. Assistant chief Greg Okamoto. Messed that up.

Maui police department. Our committee staff include Maria Leon, committee secretary, senior legislative analyst, Clarissa McDonald, legislative analyst, Peter Hanano, legislative attorney, Lei Dineen, and Jean Pokipala, council assist services assistance clerk. Please see the last page of the agenda for information on meeting connectivity. Testifiers wanting to provide testimony should sign up in the lobby, join on the online meeting via the team's link, or call into the phone number noted on today's agenda. Written testimony is encouraged and can be submitted via the e comet link at mauicounty.us backslash agendas as well.

Under the sunshine law, the chair will receive oral testimony for agenda items at the beginning of the meeting and as the item is called up. For individuals wishing to testify via teams, please raise your hand by clicking on the raise your hand button. If calling in, please allow the prompts. Please follow the prompts, via phone 5 to raise and lower your hand. 6 to mute and unmute. Excuse me. Staff will add names to the testifier list in the order of the testifiers signing up or raising their hands. For those on Teams, staff will lower your hands once your name is called and added. Staff will then call the name you're logged in under or the last four digits of your phone number when it is your time to testify. At that time, staff will also enable your microphone and video.

Please ensure your name appears in Microsoft Teams as the name you refer to be referred as or anonymous if you wish to testify anonymously. If you are in person, please notify the staff that you would like to testify anonymously. Otherwise, please state your name record at the beginning of your testimony. Oral testimony is limited to three minutes per item. If you are still testifying beyond that time, I will kindly ask you to complete your testimony. Once you are done testifying or you do not wish to testify, you can also view the meeting on Akaukoo Channel fifty three Facebook Live, or mauicounty.us backslash agendas. We will do our best to take up each person in an orderly fashion, and we will now call up testifiers wishing to testify at the beginning of the meeting. Staff, do we have anybody wishing to testify? Chair, there is no

one signed up to testify, so I can do a last call. Please. If somebody would like to testify in the chamber, please let staff know. Or on Microsoft Teams, please raise your hand. This is final call for the beginning of the meeting. Three, two, one. Chair, it appears that nobody wishes to testify.

Thank you. We're gonna begin then with the first item on the agenda, which is resolution 25191, settlement authorization for Elaine and Robert Goebbard. Claim 4089446 dash one, property damage, grade eleven twenty. We have before us resolution twenty five nine dash one which should approve the settlement of the claim filed on 04/25/2024 in the amount of $57,664.74. The claim alleges damage to the claimant's property resulting from flooding from a water main break occur occurring on or about February 8, 2024.

Do we have any comments from deputy corporation counsel? Thank

you, chair, and good morning, counsel. You pretty much covered what I was going to mention. This it's a settlement of the claim of Elaine and Robert Bogard for property damage to their home as a result from flooding from a main break that occurred on 02/08/2024 in Kihei. The claim was investigated and evaluated by the county and our third party administrators, and we have been working with the claimants and have reached a tentative negotiated settlement at $57,644.74 after review and consideration of the supporting documents, appraisals, and estimates. So we are recommending settlement and requesting settlement authority at that amount.

Thank you. Deputy Director, do you have anything you'd like to add?

Okay. So it's at 276 Kaiola Place. Kaiola Place is in Kihei. It's Makai, LP Landing Highway, and you see it as you approach Oahu Kai Road just before you get that major intersection. So we have a 18 inch waterline in that road. And it just so happens that this house is at the lowest place of that street. The 18 inch waterline broke. It has a large volume of water. And basically, there are drains in the area, but there was so much water that the drain couldn't keep up. And so because the house was at the lowest portion, the water got into the house before we were able to shut off.

We did respond right away to the break, but being an 18 inches waterline, it does take us a little while to shut down because of the size. We can't just close it off and have more problems. Right? So it took us about forty five minutes to get it shut down. As soon as we were shut down, we noticed that the water did recede and the drains were able to take the water, but the house got flooded before that happened. So that's kinda what happened.

Okay. Thank you very much. Do we have, managing director? Is he with us? I don't know if we need any comments from him. Oh, okay. Okay. Thank you. Alright. Before moving on, let's open up discussion again for this item, grade eleven twenty. Do we have any testifiers?

No, Trey. There's nobody signed up to testify. Would you like me to do a last call? Yes, please. If somebody would like to testify in the chamber, please let staff know. Or on Microsoft Teams, please raise your hand. This is final call. Three, two, one. Chair, it appears that nobody wishes to testify.

Okay. Thank you. Members saying there are no individuals wishing to testify without objection. I will now close oral testimony. No objection. Thank you. Written testimony will continue to be accepted. Members, we're gonna have a three minute questioning period. If you have any questions, please raise your hand. Member Palton?

Thank you, chair. So just clarifying, this this place is, like, a short term rental?

No. It it the it will be paid to the claimants as the homeowners.

But they rent it out short term?

I'm not I don't have knowledge of that. I I don't believe so. I believe they are living there.

And then, the inventory we're we're paying out for the whole inventory, like, the surfboards were damaged by water?

They did send in photos to, our third party administrator, and those were, evaluated by them. And they did, I believe, attach depreciation for all of the personal property. Okay.

I mean, it seems like surfboards go in the water, so I'm not sure. Like, I didn't I didn't see pictures of the surfboards damaged or, like, you know, folding tables and things? Like I mean, was it

muddy water? Yes. I do believe some of the water, well, the water was, within there. Sorry. One second. We're gonna take, a five minute re recess.

The Internet is off. We're gonna return at 09:22. Oh, wait. Oh, okay. 09:22.

Sorry. Will the great committee please reconvene? It is 11:06AM. Thank you so much for that recess, members. We had some issues with spectrum and, a power outage with the Internet.

But before we begin, I wanna say good morning to member Sugimura. Good morning, chair. Good morning. So where we left off, earlier this morning, we were in discussion for resolution twenty five dash one nine one regarding a settlement for, mister and missus Bogard for $67,664.74 for flooding. Their home is in Kihei.

We left off with member Palton asking a few questions. There is some information, regarding rentals in the packet that we got. FYI, that rental is where the owners of the property, mister and mister Bogard, will need to live when the home is going to be repaired. Does anybody else have any more questions? Member Palton, did you wanna continue your line of questioning?

No. I think I got all my questions answered. This is is part of the project that we approved, and it's just sad. That was supposed or it was affordable project. So Yeah. Super unfortunate that this happened to them. All their stuff was Damaged. Damaged, evaluated by a third party. Mhmm. Sedgwick and depreciated for value too. So ready to vote.

Thank you. Thank you, member Palta. Member Senancy?

Just a clarifying question. No other neighbor was affected by the flooding.

Was there any other people that were affected, or is

it just them? No. There there were multiple, properties that were affected. We have settled, I believe, two other property cases in this development. And I assume we have not received any others to my knowledge. I assume that those were taken care of with their own insurance companies, their own property insurance.

Okay. Thank you.

Thank you, Member Senanse. Members, any other question before my recommendation? Nope. Seeing none. At this time, I would like to entertain a motion to recommend the adoption of resolution 20 five-one 191, including any non substantive revisions. I have a motion made by member Sugimura. I have a second? Second by Chair Lee. Discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

Aye. Chair, there are seven ayes, zero nos, one excused. Member Rollins Fernandez, motion carries.

Thank you very much. This item, will move on to full council for its consideration. Thank you very much. Nice to see you guys. Members, I just wanted to finish that up, so we didn't lose track of where we are.

But considering we had a very long and unplanned for recess, I would like to do this item and possibly the next, take a brief recess wherever we are from there and continue on with our agenda. We have two items that will probably need, executive session. The last item is member Palton's item, relating to the Children's and Youth. I would like to end at 04:30. If we need to, if it's okay to defer that last item, if we so happen to don't get to it, Cherley's item regarding the alternate members could be the last thing we need to discuss.

It it, that and along with everything else is time sensitive. So we will do our best to be as quick as we can, if that's okay with you folks. Perfect. Okay. Thank you. Charlie?

Did you mean we're gonna work through lunch?

Nobody wants to work through lunch to deal with me being hungry, but we're just gonna take a quick lunch if that's okay. Perhaps maybe from 12:30 to one ish or so. 12:30?

Yeah. Okay.

If that's okay with you folks.

Yeah.

But we'll we'll try our best to

be quick. Okay. I might have to leave at twelve. Mhmm. K?

That's fine. Thank you. Okay. Let's move on. We have before us resolution 25 dash one nine two, which would approve the settlement for Aisa Nishiyama v Maui County Police Department at all civil two c c v 23 Dash0000346 filed on 10/30/2023. The claim alleges unlawful employment discrimination and retaliation between 10/18/2021 and 07/15/2023. If I could at this time ask, miss Leader from deputy corp, from corporation counsel, for any opening comments.

Thank you. And good morning, counsel. Aisa Nishiyama was a juvenile counselor with the Maui Police Department, and she did file suit for the claims that, as were stated, employment discrimination, retaliation, and also whistleblowing. Trial is set for May 11. We had an initial demand letter come in, it was way back in 2023 before I was on the case.

And apparently, that was immediately rejected. So we haven't brought this before you. Now we're going into the final discovery and we'd like to get approval for settlement authority going in. While we have defenses against her claims, there is some risk and so I'd like to be able to discuss those with you in executive session unless you have some questions, preliminary.

Okay. Thank you very much. Assistant chief Okamoto, are you online? And if so, do you have any opening comments?

I'm online, but no comments at this time.

Okay. Thank you very much. Before we go into the discussion, do we have anybody wishing to testify on this item grade eleven twenty one? Yes, sir. There is, one individual who signed up online,

Jim Laneford. Alright. That's our first testifier. Mr. Langford, we have promoted you, so you are unmuted on your end. You'll just on our end, you'll have to unmute yourself on your end. In the top right hand corner, you should see a camera and mic icon with a line through it. You'll have to click on those to unmute. Chair, there's nobody else signed up to testify, there's an I individual see you. Yeah.

Approaching the podium, so we can return to Mr. Langford after. Okay.

JC Long, Waakaua, Hupuaa. Good morning, council members and council chair, Noelani. It's regretful that. Things like this happen. And. I haven't read the the packet. Find out what's going on but I just want to stick up for my, local police chief. And, I won't get too much into the, the man versus woman thing. And I save the rest of my time for the Hawaiians.

Thank you. Do we have, Mr. Langford?

We've promoted Mr. Langford, but he hasn't unmuted himself on his end.

Can you please do last call and then

we can move on? Yes. Somebody would like to testify in the chamber. Please let staff know. We're on Microsoft Teams. Please raise your hand. This is final call. Three, two, one. Chair, it appears that nobody wishes to testify.

Okay. Thank you. Members, seeing there are no more individuals wishing to testify without objection, I would now close oral testimony for this item. Thank you. As a reminder, written testimony will continue to be accepted. Members, again, we're gonna have a three minute round. So if you have any question that you would like to ask in open session, please feel the need to do so now and raise your hand. If not, I don't see anybody, I'm gonna make a motion to go into executive session. So moved. Okay.

Thank you. I will entertain a motion made by chair Lee to convene an executive meetings in accordance with section 92 dash five a four. Hawaii revised statutes to consult with legal counsel on questions and issues pertaining to the powers, duties, privileges, immunities, and liability of the county, the council, and the committee. Section 92 dash five a eight, Hawaii revised statutes to deliberate or make a decision upon a matter that requires a consideration of information that must be kept confidential pursuant to a state or federal law or court order order. I have a motion made by Chair Lee.

Do I have a second by member Sugimura to enter executive session for resolution 25 dash 92? Any further questions? Seeing none, all those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye. Aye. Chair,

I'm seeing seven ayes, zero nos, one excused. Member Rollins Fernandez.

Thank you very much. For the record, the following personnel will be in attendance in this executive meeting. All council members, including myself, committee chair Noheu Ujajans, committee vice chair Tamara Pothen, council member Tom Cook, council member Gabe Johnson, council chair Alice Lee, council member Shane Senancy, and council member Yukile Sugimura. We have with us as well, Peter Hanano, legislative attorney, and Maria Leon, committee secretary. From corporation council, are we gonna have you, deputy corporation council Susan Leader? Mister Thomas Colby, are you gonna be staying as well? Ms. Hoke. Abby? Hoke. Okay. Those three. Did I say your name correctly? Okay. At this time Can we

have Greg Okamoto also?

Can we have Mr. Greg Okamoto? Can we have mister Okamoto?

Yeah. That's be that'll be fine, sir.

Okay. And assistant chief Greg Okamoto. We are gonna take a five minute recess, as we and we will reconvene in executive meeting members. Don't touch your computer screens. Casey will move you over. And we are now in recess, it is 11:17. Welcome back, everybody, to the government relations ethics and transparency committee meeting. Will I please reconvene? It is 11:50. Members, we have just completed our executive meeting on resolution 25 dash one nine two.

And if right now, I could refer to mister Hanano to provide us a summary in accordance with Hawaii revised statute section 90 two-four.

Thank you, Chair. Your great committee met in executive session to discuss strengths and weaknesses of the case. Settlement authority amounts by corporation counsel. There was some discussion regarding policies and procedures of the Mali Police Department related to spreading of rumors or harassment, which I think should be discussed in open session. Thank you, chair.

Thank you. Assistant Chief Okamoto, is he with us? Yes. Okay. Can you please turn your camera on and then member Palton has a question for you? If you don't have the answer, we can also send you the question in writing. But it was related to oh, did you wanna did you wanna ask? I don't wanna take away your words.

I just was wondering what the process and procedures are when there's rumors going around about, employees' personal sexual life.

So, yeah, they have the right to make a complaint if there's a particular person that that they feel is started that rumor, then it'll it'll be either investigated by their supervisor or internal affairs.

Is is there any process, policy, procedure of the folks repeating an untrue rumor to get a negative evaluation on the j p r as, this individual was given a negative evaluation on her j p for gossiping?

Chair, this is Tom Colby.

Think

now that we're not in executive session, anything related to the specific details of this case should be kind of discussed in more of a general pattern. If there are general orders or other particular protocols that are in place at the police department, those would be appropriate to discuss rather than specifics related to this case.

Okay. Yep.

If anyone is found to be repeating a rumor, will they receive a negative mark on their JPR?

Well, so the categories for evaluation is based on performance. So if that rumor is part of their, you know, some sort of negative reflection on their performance category, it can be used as a justification for their rating.

I don't think you're understanding the question I'm asking. If the upper chain

You're saying

you're you're you're saying upper chain of command believes a rumor, endorses it, and further repeats it amongst the chain of command, is there negative consequences for those people that are repeating and furthering a rumor against the female employee that they are untruly having sexual relations with their supervisor? Is there any consequence within the MPD for folks that repeat

an untrue rumor? Okay. So are you asking specifically? Because because, as I stated As process No. Procedure,

I'm asking, is there negative consequences in the Maui police department for anyone to repeat an untrue rumor about having sexual relations with a supervisor. Is there any consequences for that? Negative.

Okay. So not so not again, so so like I said, you're you're talking about, a specific rumor, then, there are certain behaviors that are general behaviors that are prohibited. Like I say, if you're saying that it's, now you're talking about evaluation marks too and stuff like that too. So again, if it's part of their performance of their duties, then yeah, they can it can be used in in evaluating an But then now you're talking about also is there

you're you're if you're

sure if and I'm asking, is there?

Well, again, you're talk so you're talking about spreading rumors. Is it is it a perceived harassment? Is it a harassment complaint that that they're gonna make against against someone? You know, we're talking about conduct and how how internally how employees treat each other. We do have, rules against that, rules for that as well, two policies for that. So

All the way to the upper chain of command are to follow the same rules?

Yeah. The policies apply to everyone in the the department. Department.

You. I hope so. Thank you, member Palta, and thank you, assistant chief Okamoto. Members, are there any other questions before we move on to my recommendation? Thank you very much. At this time, I would like entertain a motion to recommend the adoption of resolution 20 five-one 192 including any non substantive revision. Thank you. I have a motion made by member Cook, second by member Sugimura. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye. Aye.

Chair, that's seven ayes. Six ayes, zero nos, two excused. Chair Lee and member Ron Fernandez, motion carries. Thank you very much.

Members, if you don't mind, we're gonna take the next item up on the agenda before we take recess. It should be relatively quick. So before us, we have resolution 25 dash one nine six, which would approve the settlement of the claim filed on 05/05/2025 in the amount of $55,668.18. The claim alleges damages to the claimant's property resulting from a sewer line collapse under the property occurring on or about 06/01/2024. At this time, I'm gonna ask for opening comments by deputy corporation counsel Susan Leider.

Who's, environmental superintendent. Clifton Clifton Song. Okay. Thank you.

Thanks, counsel. So, yeah, as mentioned, it was a sewer line collapse. This was a fairly old sewer line. And the owners of the commercial property. They rent space to a gym amongst some other tenants.

And during the time that the sewer line was getting repaired, they actually did not have bathrooms and it's a gym. It's the Omana barbell gym. It didn't have any restrooms. They were using restrooms next door and neighbors and that sort of thing. So the claim is actually for their lost rent during that time and also for some additional water bills during the time of the repair and some a few cleanup items.

So Okay. And I did reach out. Mister Song is here, but he he went and did the initial inspection, but then requested help, and it went to a civil engineer at Capital Improvements. And I initially hoped he could be here, but unfortunately, he had a site inspection out in Lahaina with people from the Mainland. So he's not able to be here, but he did provide me a statement that I could could read that I would probably answer some of the questions.

And he states and he says he would swear to this as truthful. And we had to replace the old sewer line, sewer line c, or SLC because it had collapsed. SLC had been problematic for some time and in fact we had to install new sewer line on Pequi Alley Place a few years ago to reconnect homes which were previously serviced by another portion that had previously collapsed. Unfortunately, we could not connect the Hau'omana Barbell Island Island Appraisals and Spaulding Realty to the new line because it would be impossible to run a lateral from those properties to the new Piankali Place line, meaning those properties had to remain with the old sewer lines, which eventually failed completely. And he goes on to describe more details.

If you have questions, I can go into those more. Essentially, it's lost rent, cleanup, and water we're asking. And they have settled this if you approve it.

Thank you. Does environmental management have any comments? Is director Agawa online or mister Song, do you wanna provide any comments? Okay. Mister, director Agawa, do you have any comments?

Hi, chair. Comments in addition to, miss Vera's statement that was just read. I was gonna say the exact same thing to give a little bit of background. Okay. But we do that the pipe collapsed and that we had to make repairs in that area. Thank you, chair.

Thank you. Members, I should have mentioned earlier, but this is, again, settlement authorization for kanani kaoloha fale fale fiene. Claim 4A25055GZPO0001 property damage. This is grade item eleven twenty two. Do we have any testifiers? Chair,

there's currently no one who has signed up to testify. Could I do a last call? Please. If somebody would like to testify in the chamber, please let staff know or on Microsoft Teams, please raise your hand. This is final call. Three, two, one. Chair, it appears that nobody wishes to testify.

Thank you. Members, without objection, I will now close oral testimony. Thank you. Written testimony is still and will happily be, accepted. We're gonna have a three minute questioning period. Members, if you have any questions, please raise your hand. Member Sanancy followed by member Johnson.

Thank you, Chair. Just checking if, there were receipts, received for the damages.

Yes. So they provided us and it's in the claim. They provided us, the rent, what they had received on rent. Although it has explanation that apparently the tenants at the gym were behind on their rent. So they itemized it out by month and then provided us the bank record of what they actually received with an explanation that a lot of that was paying back rent.

For the time period that they're requesting, they didn't receive any actual rent from that. So I did review those bank records. We also were provided with the water bill, which does show the amounts that they were requesting. One that's due, they had stated more due to the contractor of 162 and then the time when they had extra water between I'm sorry, they had water bills between the time of the repair that they weren't able to use the facilities.

Thank you, Chair.

Of course. Thank you, Member San Antonio. Member Johnson, questions?

Thank you, Chair. This question might be for Mr. Song, but if Corporation Counsel has the answer. The water bill jumped by a lot, and I'm curious of what was going on. In May 2024, it was $48, and then in August, it was $405. Was that due to the damage or the cons was it just water? What what happened? Why is it

then

of with

work to government. And the the

Okay. And they're doing asking for us to pay do that whole list of water bills from May 2024 to 09/2024. That's Correct. Okay. I'm not sure if that's contractor use. I cannot confirm. That would be a Juan Rivera question. Okay. What is the total? I'm I'm looking for the total ask or the for settlement. Do we it

$5,668.18.

Thank you. Okay. Alright. No further questions. Thank you, chairman.

Thank you, member Johnson. Members, any other questions? Okay. Then, at this time, I would like to entertain a motion to recommend the adoption of resolution 25 dash one nine six, including any non substantive revisions. Thank you. I have a motion made by member Cook and a second by member Sugimura. Any further discussion? Seeing none. All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

Aye. Chair, that's six ayes, zero nos to excused. Chair Lee and member Rounds Fernandez. Motion carries.

Thank you very much. Okay. Members, we do have three more things on the agenda. The next is Kumar, and we will go into executive session for that. The next is Chair Lee's one regarding alternates on boards and commissions. And the last is member Palton's one relating to the Commission of Children's and Youth. What would you folks like to do? Because it's only twelve now. How long of a lunch do you folks wanna take? You wanna take a one hour lunch? Well, we were we were in a recess from, like, 09:30 to eleven.

Yeah, Cherry. I don't mind a shorter recess. The half hour, forty five minutes.

Do you guys wanna come back at 12:45? Sure. Is 12:45 okay with you folks? What about you guys, corp counsel? Are you guys okay? Is Casey okay? Peter, are you okay? Maria, you guys okay? 12:45? Okay. Well, it is 12:05 now, and we will be in lunch recess until 12:45. See you folks in forty minutes. Good afternoon, members. Will the great committee please reconvene? It is 12:59PM.

We're gonna go straight into the next item on our agenda, which is resolution 25 dash two zero one, settlement authorization, county Department of Environmental Management v Komar Maui Properties one LLC case one two four c v zero zero two zero, zero three, grade eleven twenty three. So, again, members, we have before us resolution 25 dash two zero one, which should approve the settlement of county of Maui department environmental management v Comar's properties. They are Comar properties is seeking abandonment damages under section one zero one dash 27. Hawaii revised statutes under the after the county withdrew claims for eminent domain of the subject property identified as tax map key two three eight zero zero three zero two zero on or about 11/18/2004. And at this time, I'm gonna ask corporation counsel for opening comments.

Thank you.

Thank you, chair. And this is in regards to the eminent domain action the county brought to obtain property owned by Komar Maui Properties one LLC. That's the property they own that's close to the Central Maui landfill. As council is aware, after multiple attempts to buy the property, we initiated an eminent domain for the purposes of using it for the permanent disposal site for the Lahaina debris Mhmm. For various reasons.

Chiefly, that the county was not able to maintain or obtain immediate possession of the property, and at the same time non ink land became available for purchase, we abandoned the eminent domain action. Under Hawaii revised statutes 01/2007, when a government entity abandons eminent domain actions, that allows the landowner to seek, what's called abandonment damages. And that can include, attorney's fees, costs, other reasonable expenses, and damages that they occurred because of the eminent domain. Kumar has exercised that right to seek those damages, and, the federal courts have set a jury trial for determination of those damages next year in, I think it's August right now. So, the parties had a settlement conference on October 24, and, we are here to discuss settlement, liabilities of the county and would request to move into executive session to discuss the details of all that.

Thank you.

Thank you, miss Tarnstrom. Before, moving on to discussion members, do we have any testifiers wishing to testify on this item? Chair, there is

no one signed up to testify, but I see someone approaching the podium. Alright.

Aloha. Ka'a. Okay. Kalana. Oh, Luna.

Law from Kula'uka, Waiako, Ahupo'a. Thank you, corp counsel, for working on this one. I think if we would've had a court in Hawaii, then we probably would've got it because California's a lot bigger, and they don't have the same problems we do with waste disposal. It was 11/05/2019, that I learned about a process called, and you're the perfect one for this one, Noilani, because, I learned about a process of gasification, which is high temperatures under pressure. Here's the trick.

With no fire. If we would have just spent a lot of our time and money on getting one of these gasification machines for the waste process, process, then, we would have been a lot further along. And so, yeah, that's it. Gasification. Look it up, you guys. Thank you for your time, and I would save the rest of my time for the Hawaiians. Hawaiians.

Thank you. Anybody else wishing to testify? No. Chair, would

you like me to do a last call, please? If somebody would like to testify in the chamber, please let staff know. Or Microsoft Teams, please raise your hand. This is final call. Three, two, one. Chair, it appears that nobody wishes to testify.

Members, without objection, I will now close oral testimony. Written testimony will continue to be accepted. Again, we're gonna have a three minute, discussion period, per member. If you have any questions, please raise your hand. Please note we plan to go into executive session, so ask any questions you feel is comfortable in open session. Quebrada Hera echo. We got it? Okay. Thank you. Member

Palton. I just was wondering if, the abandonment of eminent domain, triggers these, things to be paid for by the county. Would it is it very better to not abandon it? I mean, I know it's not an imminent need for the debris removal, but We aren't really cutting down on the amount of waste we we produce. Would it make sense not to abandon the eminent domain?

I can't I can't speak to the policy decision of choosing to abandon the eminent domain. I can say that I believe the purpose of the statute is distinguishing abandonment between actually taking the property. If we actually took the property, we would owe just compensation, and that would cover the landowners somewhat of their damages, but really mainly just they would get some compensation for their land. In this instance, I believe the statute kind of contemplates us taking possession and maybe damages and then letting go of the action because we got what we needed or something like that. The idea is to compensate the landowner for those abandoned actions.

Again, it's a policy decision as to whether or not to maintain the eminent domain and move forward with it. I believe greater concerns were related to the identification of a permanent disposal site and I think that was the focus, but I can't really speak to that.

And then we passed a resolution to go forward with the eminent domain. Do we need to pass a resolution to abandon it?

That's a good question. I don't believe that there's no requirement in the state statute that requires withdrawal of eminent domain be approved by a council. There is a requirement that the county council approve the action of eminent domain. It doesn't require the dismissal of an

action of eminent domain. So at any time the administration could pick it up and run with it? Because we already passed the resolution to eminent domain.

I think I think that the the I'd have to look at the state statute, but I think there's specific requirements as to the initiation of the eminent domain as permitted by the county council. I don't think we could just pick it up and run with it.

Because we already secured the site for the purpose of that it was being eminent domain.

It involves the appraisals within a certain amount of time and and an amount certain put aside for the eminent domain. So yeah. Okay.

Thank you. I think that's all my open testing questions. I'll yield to anyone else.

Okay. Thank you, member Palatin. Members, any other member sanity, please feel free.

Yeah. Just a clarification. The county is the plaintiff.

Yeah. Thank you. We are the plaintiff. There's a bit a bit of confusion in this kind of case because it was consolidated with another matter, but which in which we were the defendant. But the remaining case, we are the plaintiff and Comar Properties is the defendant.

Thanks. Alright.

Thank you.

Thank you, members and Nancy. Members, any other open session questions? If not, I would like to entertain a motion to convene an executive meeting in accordance with section 92 dash five a four Hawaii revised statutes to consult with legal counsel on questions and issues pertaining to the powers, duties, privileges, immunities, and liability of the county the county, the council, and committee. And section 92 dash five a eight, Hawaii revised statutes to deliberate or make a decision upon a matter that requires consideration on information that must be kept confidential pursuant to a state or federal law or court order. I have a motion made by member Sugimura and a second made by chair Lee to enter into executive session for resolution 25 dash two zero one.

Any further questions or discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye. Aye.

Chair, that's eight ayes, zero nos. Motion carries.

Okay. For the record, the following persons, will be in attendance in this executive meeting. All council members here right now and online, which include myself, committee chair Nohei Uujajans, committee vice chair Tamara Palatin, council member Tom Cook, council member Gabe Johnson, council chair Alice Lee, council member Keani Rollins Fernandez, council member Shane Senancy, and council member Yukile Sugimura. Office of council services staff include mister Peter Hanano, legislative attorney, and Maria Leon, committee secretary. From corporation council, we have deputy corporation council Christian Tarnstrom and deputy corporation council Thomas Colby.

And deputy corporation counsel, Susan Leader, and Abby Cohn. And, again, we are gonna take a five minute recess. It is 01:09 to set up an executive meeting. Chair. Members I apologize.

I believe director Agawa is also online.

Oh, and director Agawa. If you Yep. That sounds great. And director Agawa of environmental management. We're gonna, again, take a five minute recess. It is 01:10. See you folks in a few. Don't touch your computer. Casey will move you over. Thank you. K. Oh, yes. Member Ros Fernandez? The great committee, please reconvene. It is 03:12PM.

Thank you members and public and everybody else in this room for your patience. Today has been trying us all. We have just completed our meeting on Resolution 20 five-two zero one and at this time I would like to refer to Mr. Hanano to provide us a summary in accordance with Hawaii revised statute section 90 two-four.

Thank you, Chair. Your committee, met in the executive session to discuss, with corporation counsel settlement efforts, case strategy, settlement authority, county's defenses and county's exposure as well as any settlement authority. Thank you.

Thank you, members. Any questions before we move on to my recommendation? Seeing none, I would like to entertain a motion to recommend the adoption of resolution 20 five-two zero one including any non substantive revisions. Thank you very much. I have a motion made by member Cook, second by member Sugimura. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye. Aye.

Aye. Chair, that's eight ayes, zero nos. Motion carries.

Thank you very much. Members, if you don't mind, let's finish out the next two items because I think we have enough Internet service to go, but we will make it quick, if that's okay with you folks. Just in case, we do need to adjourn this meeting so that the morning's, time sensitive issues are not lost. So we're gonna continue on, and we have before us bill one zero five twenty twenty four. Thank you. Entitled a bill for an ordinance amending title to Maui County code on alternate members of boards and commissions. Bill one zero five's purpose is to allow alternate members to fill midterm vacancies on boards and commissions on an interim basis. Right now, we don't have that option. Chair Lee, did you want to add anything else before we take testimony?

Well, the purpose is to allow alternate members to fill midterm vacancies on boards and commissions on an interim basis. Thank you. Okay. Thanks.

Do we have Jody Yoshida? Does she want to provide us any remarks before we take testimony? Okay. We don't see her online. Let's go into testimony for this bill one zero five. Do we have any testifiers? Chair, there's currently no one

who has signed up to testify. Would you like me to do a last call? Please. If somebody would like to testify in the chamber, please let staff know or on Microsoft Teams, please raise your hand. This is final call. Three, two, one. Chair, it appears that nobody wishes to testify.

Thank you. Members, without objection, I will now close oral testimony. Thank you. As a new reminder, written testimony will continue to be accepted. We're gonna have a three minute, questioning period with any follow-up you folks need. But, again, we're trying to make this quick. So it's pretty straightforward right now. It's just to allow alternate members, which are how many, boards and commissions have alternate members? Just a handful. There's only two.

And, you know, if somebody if a regular member does, for whatever reason, need to leave, it will provide them a way to fill the vacancy with the alternate member as it's as as it should be. Anybody have any questions? Member Senensi.

Thank you, chair. The, bill one zero five states the HANA advisory committee. That would be one of the the boards that have alternate alternates.

Uh-huh.

What would be the does it state the other one?

I think it's like UDRB or something. And So public three.

And oh, okay. And so we would just be following those examples?

Yep. All three of them will have the same, process to fill a vacancy with their alternates.

Thank you.

Thank you. Member Palton?

Oh, my Internet on my Surface Pro isn't working. I was trying to pull up the bill, but, just wondering if it was signed by court counsel. Let me check. If my Internet was working, I would check.

I don't see that I only see that it's signed by Cherry Lee. Do we have any issue with the corp council? Do you want a copy? I have it here. Do you want this one? It's a hard copy.

It is just signed by Chair Lee. What's the question? Would would you Are you okay with it? Yeah. Oh, yes. I understand now. It hasn't been approved or or recommended. Okay. Yes?

Can we get the signed copy by first reading?

Yes. Thank you. Yeah. What appointment is that?

No, That's probably

Friday, nineteenth. The nineteenth or after.

Yeah. Yes.

We can work with

you. That concludes my questions.

Perfect. Does anybody else have any other questions? Seeing none, I would like to entertain a motion to recommend passage on first reading of Bill 100 five-twenty 25 including any non substantive revisions. Thank

you. Second.

Thank you. I have a motion made by council member Cook. Second by chair Lee. Any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor Member Rollins Oh, member Rollins Fernandez, you have discussion. Please go ahead.

Real quick. I fully support this, and,

maybe we can have alternates for, like, all the boards and commissions to help with this. Great idea, Charity. Mahalo.

Mhmm. Thank you, member Rollins Fernandez. All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

Aye. Chair, that's eight aye, zero nos. Motion carries.

Thank you. This item will move on to full council for its consideration with a signed bill at that time. Thank you. Okay. Last item. We have before us bill one eighteen twenty twenty five, a bill for an ordinance repealing chapter 2.39 Maui County Code on the Commission of Children and Youth. It is again to disband this commission of children and youth. Member Palton, did you wanna have any opening comments?

Sure. You know, the mass nominations is a unwieldy beast, and there are boards and commissions that have a specific outcome to it that helps the county function, like, you know, planning commission, cultural resources commission. It needs to give these approvals before other things can happen. And, Charlie had said that in her creation of the commission on children and youth, they were to weigh in on the distribution of early childhood education grants. And in asking Department of Human Concerns if they do, they do not.

And just seeing that, our boards and commissions as well as ourselves are kind of held up from doing important work by the sunshine law. You can't meet together without agendizing it. So, you know, it's all that work. You can't, have conversations outside of the meeting that is unagendized and things like that. And so I think having this border commission not up not doing the original intention of the function that it was created for and not stopping them from meeting but from being a board and commission that is part of the unwieldy beast just makes sense to me.

Not seeing that these individuals couldn't continue to meet on their own and do the great things on their own, but it just doesn't make sense to me, to continue on this process in this way, especially that it's not fulfilling the original intent that it was created for.

Okay. Thank you very much. Oh, hold on. We're not in discussion. That was just opening comments. Oh. But I will, call on you first after we take testimony. Do we Jody Yoshida, is she still with us? If not, I'll move on. Yeah. She oh, she's staffing IMB. Okay. Got it. Okay. Then let's go into the, testimony for bill 18 one eighteen. Yes, chair.

There is no one signed up to testify. Would you like me to do a last call, please? If there's anybody in the chamber who'd like to testify, please let staff know or Microsoft Teams, please raise your hand. This is final call. Three, two, one. Chair, it appears that nobody wishes to testify. Thank you. Members, if there

are no objections, I'm gonna close oral testimony. No objections. Thank you. Written testimony will continue to be accepted. We're going to do again a three minute discussion period and I'll begin with Shirley. Yeah. I'm not opposed to disbanding this commission.

However, the mission still exists. Early childhood education, preschool education, all of that needs continued attention. And I would suggest that the Department of Human Concerns create an advisory committee to help them come up with proposed legislation or programs to fund to advance this very important issue. And so, far as having an actual board that is subject to so many rules and regulations and it's so difficult even finding people to fill it, something more informal might be more helpful. Thanks.

Thank you. Member Sugimura, and did everybody get the testimony submitted by the chair of the

okay. Member Sugimura. So what's going to happen, we just I think approved someone to be on the commission. So what are we going to do with the members?

Good question. Member Palten?

Yes. If they want to be part of the advisory committee or if they would love to serve on other boards and commissions. We sure do have a lot of vacancies. I mean, either option would be great, I think. I mean or they could do both. Fill on another board or commission and be an advisory member or, either one.

Is it impossible to take this commission? I'm sure they already have parameters. But to make them advisory instead of disbanding them and then changing the scope of their work, does that require a bunch of stuff on our end? Maybe mister Colby can answer that question. I can't I was trying to look up their minutes as suggested by, the chair, but, of course, our Internet is really junky right now.

Chair, I don't have the minutes in front of me. I mean, the objectives, duties, functions, are all, laid out in chapter 2.39 of the Maui County code. And this was created by an ordinance, and there's an ordinance here to undo the commission. So I guess if you want to have something informal or remove certain of the objectives to these functions, I guess you could do that. But I'm not certain whether you would need to make changes to your ordinance in order to do that.

Okay. It shall also make recommendations to the county council on all matters related to children and youth and children and youth programs proposed for adoption by the county council. If that is the primary objective, duty, and function of the commission, it's essentially advisory in some context. It is advisory.

And initially, they were remember, Paul, then initially, they were organized to help determine what? Permanent.

How the early childhood education monies, are distributed.

But they no longer do that?

I don't think they've ever done that.

Answer that. Yeah, please. Okay. When I was the housing director and human concerns director, we had what was called a grants review committee Okay. Which decided where all the monies would go with regard to social grants.

So that would include children, teenagers, and kupuna. And I had asked each each group, like, for the kupuna group, the early childhood group, the animal group, the all the all these different groups to advise the council on their recommendations on who should get the funding rather than only one committee, the grants review committee deciding where all the money goes no matter what purpose. That was a setup before.

Okay.

And so this early childhood and youth commission was supposed to help us because one of the issues that I used to face was the grants review committee would give it to the same people every year. No changes. When new groups came up, they didn't have a chance.

That's why. Okay. Member Johnson.

Thank you, Chair. I appreciate the times have changed and I appreciate the efforts to kind of get with the times. But I have here the meeting minutes of the past meeting. And I'd say, I'd argue that these guys are doing great work. Just a few things we're talking about is a vocational newsletter by teens on call, artificial intelligence and the roles in family and educational institutions, Maui Nui and Kaapeva Youth Summit.

This is really fascinating to me. They did a temporary investigating group, TIG, on investigating, mandating, reporting in the Maui Police Department, Department of Aid, and Department of Human Services in NADs and childcare. They're doing the work out there, information on homelessness. These are all very important topics that this committee is working on. So I kinda like keeping it there.

Now the issues about quorum and those types of things, really understand. And I we we sent Axel Beers from my team to go and speak on this. And one of the things they were talking about is adding youth age into the membership between ages 14 and 24, like the way the Honolulu Youth Commission does. And if they're talking with the corporation council to see how that would work. I would I'd like to initiate something like that where you expand it so you can bring younger people on the board about young people.

You know? It kinda makes sense to me. I think that this this after looking at some of the things that they're trying to tackle, I think it's worthy endeavor to keep them doing it. And if we need to maybe widen the scope and add some younger folks on there so that you can get more of a pool of people who are interested in this you know, if you recall members, we had all the kids come down and sit in our seats and debate debate policies, and I thought that was fascinating. So to have, you know, kids more involved, especially on issues that concern them, like some of the topics that I just mentioned, I think that's, really important that, that we do more more of this kind of work.

So I think that, I I don't think I could support something like that, you know, right now.

Thank you, member Johnson. Member Bolton.

To be clear that I'm supportive of that kind of stuff, I don't think that being a formal board or commission furthers that endeavor. You know, if they wanna call each other up and work on things, sunshine law prevents it. You know? If anybody from anywhere wants to come and be a part of it, the process of the boards and commissions and the selection prevents it. I think that, you know, before taking on this job or becoming a part of anything that involves sunshine law, there's not an awareness of how limiting it is.

And, I'd love to see them continue the work they're doing and expand it beyond the bounds of the sunshine law. Because even for this council, for almost all the boards and commissions, I understand the purpose of the Sunshine Law so that decisions don't get made behind in behind closed doors

Mhmm.

Or, you know, things that affect other people don't happen in a vacuum or or like that. People are allowed to testify. But in in helping our children and youth, I think that, being this type of board or commission is a limiting factor. And I think that there are other ways to accomplish things that may be better and that by relying on a set of individuals that have to go through this process, that have to get sunshine law training, that have to be gathered in a certain way, it feels as though we're, pushing it off to a select group of people and and being done with it. You know?

And so I I don't disagree with member Johnson that they are doing important work. I just think that there are better or more efficient or other ways to do it. I can be amenable to the fact that we don't have those set up yet. Mhmm. And we could work on some other ways for folks to do it before disbanding it or whatever, but I don't feel that we should, continue on this process that doesn't necessarily have, it's it's kinda just dependent on who is on the board at the time if they are, putting things out, Like, the iteration of these people before, there was all sorts of problems, and there were hardly quorum and things like that, and then people stepping down and other things like that.

So I just I don't disagree that right at this moment, they're tackling important things. Do I think it could be done in a more effective and better manner and that we're not doing them because this thing exists? Yes. And so that's why. And also the unwieldy beast part as well.

But I think, you know, if if we wanna concentrate on children and youth, creating a board or commission that's called children and youth and just letting them go based on an ordinance isn't our best way to do it. You know, there are existing PTSAs around the, county or, like, you know, getting together groups of educators or people specialized in sports or whatever and giving them some sort of support that isn't in the form of a Sunshine Law board to me is more effective. And and just having the Sunshine Law board there is like, oh, we've we've done something for children and youth. So that's where I'm coming from. I I understand the limitations it has on us.

Like, a lot of times, I'd wanna just take the nine of us someplace, look at something on on a spur when it's happening, talk it out with the people in the community right there, but prevent it. And and then they're like, why is government so slow? Why does it bureaucracy? No. No. No. And it's like, yeah. Because the law.

Member Palton, can I ask you, after, maybe you know or member, Charity knows, but after, this commission discusses whatever item is on the agenda, where do where does their opinions go? Do we see it come to fruition in the county in any place? Do you know?

To my knowledge, I haven't seen it. But, like, you know, the the projects that they're doing, they said something about the bus talking points and like that. Yep.

Talking is teaching campaign, and they're putting buses on posters.

But, I mean, if they if they don't do anything, like, say, previous iterations of the board or whatever, nobody knows. Nobody whatever. But I did see member Rollins Fernandez had her handled.

Okay. Thank you. Member Rollins Fernandez, questions? Mahalo, chair. Mahalo, member Bolton.

I think this is a great discussion, and mahalo for the proposal in addressing an issue that we've faced for a couple years now. The challenge of filling vacancies and keeping folks on boards and commissions and being able to achieve quorum for, you know, the various boards and commissions. I agree with Member Johnson's points, excellent points, and, you know, perhaps we as council members can, know, go to organizations or try to connect with organizations that are doing this work and other youth groups that are being the voice of youth. I know that I think the state has a youth commission. Have one of my former interns serves on that.

I think I can support this. And I understand the origins of it that it was formed to serve one purpose and then that purpose went away, and then it kind of fell on the board itself or the commission itself, the members, to, you know, make it continue to be meaningful. The purpose of choosing grants was no longer something that was under their authority. My suggestion before, you know, taking action in disbanding the commission is perhaps asking them when they would like to be disband. Initially, I was thinking, oh, about how we just give them another year to complete whatever it is that they're doing?

And then I was thinking Uh-oh. You know, maybe, you know, we we can set it for up to a year, and then they can disband in a if they wanted to because the, legislation takes effect upon passage. Yeah. And so once it passes, the the section is repealed and it takes effect immediately. And I I hate to just, you know, cut them off mid conversation, especially since Member Johnson pulled up their meeting minutes and so.

So three of the commissioners term out in 2027, two of them 2028, and then one next year in March, and then one in 2030. So, you know, three of them, almost half of who's left, there's two vacancies, term out in two years. So I was thinking of maybe asking their opinion on like how many, you know, if they want a few more months to complete whatever it is that they're doing and then we, you know, repeal that section the time that they recommend.

If I can respond

Yeah. Go ahead.

Oh, did you ask?

No. I, I wanted to, a little bit dialogue on that. Like, I think it is a good idea, but, unless they're watching this right now, they don't know what is going on in our mind or what. And maybe we should send them correspondence about, like, you know, the reason that we're doing this is not because we don't think that you're doing great work. It's that we know how the sunshine law can hamstring people from doing more things and having a broader reach and the selection process and like that.

Like, you have to meet at a certain time. You have to pre agendize it. You can't, like, just have sit around a circle and brainstorm and then act on it. So, I'm okay with deferring it. And maybe under this committee, like, send them some correspondence and asking the questions and, like, explaining that we're not trying to not give you support, but Okay.

About the the limitations of the sunshine law and the extent of other things that you could do and even ask their input on, like, you know, if they feel ham hamstrung by the Sunshine Law and if they weren't a Sunshine Law board, like, what other types of support that they they might have. Like, just allow them to dream. You know? Because right now, it's like, should we have a border commission or shouldn't we? And, like, there's they are working on good things Yep. With this particular group even though there's two vacancies. But if you could not be bound by the sunshine law, is there more things you would wanna do, and how would you like the county to support you on that? You know?

Okay. Okay. So you wanna defer this item, commission, and they can figure

out corresponding

to Yep. How they would like to proceed moving forward and entertain the idea of some sort of disbandment and figure out how they could meet otherwise similar to the ag working group as you use in reference?

I love the ag working group as my example that you don't need to be a board or commission to do a lot of stuff.

Okay. Thank you. We I'm okay to do that as well. Member Johnson, thoughts?

Okay. Thank you, member Paulson.

Thank you, member Rollins Fernandez.

I'll just say that the youth council that was, here before was a great success. I I I think, Cherry Lee could push that forward if she wanted to. I think, you know, my office right here has been working to bring, the youth into this commission again, you know, to make that point. I just wanna double down on that. It's important to them to be at see the table.

And I I'd like to try some of the suggestions that we just were talking about before we disband it. The the the important point that we're discussing on the Sunshine Law, you know okay. When we saw the youth, council here actually following Robert, actually following these kind of I thought it was a real life experience for them, and I I'll argue that they're not gonna forget something like that. So, yeah, it's a burden. It's a different way to talk, you know, and it's different rules, but it's real life.

And that's what we, as council members, have to have to deal with. It's janky at certain times, you know, the like with the example, council member said, we should all just go out and look at the place and say yes or no, you know, but that's not how we operate. And I think it's real life experience for the kids. So I I appreciate the diff the deferring it, and maybe we can come up with some solutions. Yep. Thank you, chair.

Sounds good. Oh, Member Sugimura.

I support deferring it because cost of government is looking at all the boards and commissions. Do we remember that? And one of them that they are looking at is this exact commission because when it came up I remember Kama was saying, of course because she worked with Evan who's the chair. So if we can defer it and then find out what and I just texted Evan and he said next week, they are presenting their recommendations to the INB Okay. Board. And then maybe we'll hear more that, you know, have kind of the same situation or circumstances. You know? Yep. And I'm not into the meeting. I'm not allowed to get into the meeting.

Oh, you're I see you.

Oh, I I can't. Yep.

You're on

the big screen too.

Oh, that's really weird. It's not on my com never mind. Okay. I'm running out of time.

Yep. Okay. So members, then I would like to entertain do I have to I have to make a motion to defer. No? Oh, Which staff recommendation to defer?

You got it. Okay.

Yeah. She's got it. I think only of us No objections. Okay. Thank you. No objections to deferring this item bill one eighteen? No objections. Perfect. I appreciate that compromise, everyone. Today's been a long day. So for right now, this government relations ethics and transparency committee meeting is, adjourned. It is 03:42, and I appreciate everyone's time and patience.