City Council - Regular Meeting

Christina, we have an empty seat up here. Where was your seat? Wasn't that it? Same district, right? Same district. Come on up. There's a couple. Okay. So, we're gonna get going here.

Okay. Start the webinar recording in progress. Okay. We will begin now the Wednesday, January 21st regular meeting of the Maria City Council. We have a roll call, please. Anita. Council member McCarthy here. Council member McAdams. Council member Biala here. Mayor Pertim Fischer here. Mayor Delgado here. All right. Are there any changes to the close session agenda? Thank you, mayor. There are no changes.

Okay. Let's go to public comment on any closed session items starting with uh in person. This is close session only which regards anticipated litigation uh different than last night's potential litigation. Is that correct? and existing litigation with the museum of handcar technology vers city marina performance evaluation with our city manager lock patent park real property negotiation equestrian center property negotiation and conference with uh legal counsel and chief of police for a consultation threat to public services regarding cyber security some long-standing issue we've been dealing with for a few months Okay. So, those are the issues that we're seeking public comment for now. And let's start with the public here.

Hello, council members. Uh, Christina Medina Dirkson, resident of Marina. Thank you for your service. We very much appreciate you. Um, I'd like to address you about close session matter 4E and that is the Marina Equestrian Center. I'm noticing here that there is a negotiating party by the name of Douglas Hartran. Um, as a member of the public, I would like to um remind you that we do have a concession agreement that did not allow for any sub assignments as far as I remember. Um, it also had very uh very um clear obligations as far as uh the concessionire not being able to board horses. Um there has been some rumors that that has been happening, some private boarding. Um there also has was other matters in there about um holding um events out there and and what they look like. So I urge you to look at the concession agreement before you I'm not sure what you're doing. Um, and I'm sure you're going to use your best judgment, but I really would urge you to first go back, perhaps consult with our city attorney and go through it with a fine tooth comb and make sure that the negotiating party has the ability to negotiate. And secondly, that the terms of the agreement are being upheld because there were some automatic um uh cancellations of that agreement. So, I urge you to please do your due diligence. Um I also um oh just there's one more matter on that. Um I guess I forgot but uh essentially please take a look at the agreement before you make any decision. Oh what I was going to say is can you please provide the public an update of what has happened? It's happened periodically where we've had the um the mayor talk where it's been on agenda matter. I'd like to know how much money is coming

in, how much more how much money the city has been um allocating towards it, the status of the agreement, um those kind of things that were part of the agreement. I would request that you come back and perhaps just give a public uh comment about that. Um, and then if I could have your attention on uh what was the other one?

Sorry, there was another matter that I wanted to Okay, you still have time. I think that I think that's it. And I know it's been a trying week for you all and for our city. So, thank you sincerely from the public for what you're doing. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Christina. Okay, not seeing anyone else rising in person. We'll go online and again remind people that we have a very specific close send close session agenda uh that we're looking for public comment now. There'll be opportunity for public comment on the open agenda um at 6:30. But for now, let's go to Caitlyn Dempsey. And Caitlyn, we're working on un unmuting you. Hi. Can you hear me?

Yes, Caitlyn, we can hear you.

Okay, great. Um, I'm also commenting about the Marina Cresting Center. Um, I'm confused as to why the negotiations are being done in close session given that the uh former uh RFP process was done as a public um discussion. uh doesn't seem to be that this contract is available publicly and um there was a a statement by uh the National Park Service which has restrictions on the deed that um the city of Marina is not allowed. It says uh leases and granting of easements or any property rights are not allowed. And yet this is being listed under prop real property um negotiations. And I had have an email from September 8th, 2022 from David Seganthaler from the National Park Service asking him to clarify that and he said that the city is not allowed to lease this land. So, um, if we could get a statement as to why this is being done in close session instead of for the public's view. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Caitlyn. And maybe we'll get back to that as soon as public comment is over. Uh, Caroline, please proceed if you're there.

Can you hear me? Yes. Okay. Wonderful. So, I wanted to first begin. Um I believe I could speak on this matter. I'm not sure if it is um going to be discussed during close session. It does have the same panel code as yesterday's um agenda item. So, I'm unsure, but I'm talking about item uh A. So, I wanted to begin by expressing my deepest condolences to the family and loved ones of Ronald Tinsley who lost his life. Uh Caroline, let me ask the city attorney. I think this is a completely different issue, but let me refer to our city attorney and we'll give you back your time in just a moment. Yes, that is a completely different issue.

Okay, thank you. It wasn't clear on the agenda item. Um thank you. I wasn't available to speak in person. Might I ask a question though why we weren't able to view the um meeting yesterday via Zoom? Uh yeah, I think we can take that question. City manager in in discussions with our uh city attorney um and given the tight time frame and and it was just a close session. Typically on on our closed sessions, we don't do that. And so we just thought it um it would work to do it in person and um that was the decision that we made is completely legal and and we felt it was appropriate at time. We were not expecting the large crowd that came out in person. So Caroline, that's how we normally do close session only meetings. So we followed our precedents to do that. Do you have you have more time, Caroline, if you'd like to speak on any of the close session items before us?

Thank you. I do not have anything else to say. Thank you. Please consider coming back at 6:30 to talk about the issues that you would like to talk about. Okay. Thank you. We'll do. Okay. Let's go. Excuse me. Let's go to Miss Cannon. Welcome, Miss Cannon. Okay. Thank you. Can you hear me? a little low, but we can barely hear you. Okay, hold on one second. Better. Not too much. You can try to proceed and I'll tell you if it's difficult.

Okay. Um I'll just speak louder. So, I am referring to um the item on the closed session regarding the Marina Equestrian Center. I wanted to ask who is this person that you're negotiating with? It is my understanding he is a manager of Chapperel Corporation. He is not as listed per the most recent corporation filing with the state of California. He is not an owner or a partner of this corporation. And I want to confirm um is this an assignment attempt or what exactly is going on here? Because again the contract is not available in a public records request. I'm not sure why, but this would require an RFP. And where is the due diligence? Um several years ago there was zero due diligence performed on this vendor as confirmed by the city manager to me personally. This included zero audited P&Ls, bank statements, verification of tax returns or review of their many lawsuits since occupancy. their other locations in San Francisco and Euseimde were shut down in after an in-depth news multi-art news expose regarding horse neglect and abuse and other locations in Malpas Loscatos and most recently in Woodside, California were also shut down. Currently, there was a um citation for um criminal animal neglect abuse, which it resulted in the death of a horse, one of the horses that was at Marina that I asked and begged the city of Marina to help get this horse some help. Her name was Honey. She died during a heat wave, a horrible death, and the manager of Chapperel has been cited for that neglect. These are all things that we had warned were going to happen that fell upon death ears. And so really the big question is what is going on out there? Who is this person? What is going on? And there really should be more transparency with the city on what is going on with this

operator and what the plans are for the future. It would be awesome. As the other speaker just spoke, according to the parks um David, the representative for the NA National Park Service, he confirmed with me also that the intent was not to have this leased as a private company for the benefit of a private company. And according to the California Constitution, section 16, article 6, this um gift of public funds is against the law. So, I just wanted to put all of these out there and make sure that you were aware before you get in any further with with this uh negotiation. Thank you.

Thank you, Miss Cannon, very much. Very on point comments. Let's go to Jasmine. Good evening, Jasmine. I'm here. We can hear you. Okay. Loud and

clear. Uh my name's Jasmine Ruva. I'm a Marina citizen and I just would like to know how Chappelle has held up their agreement with the city um since they've uh taken over the Marina Equestrian Center. Thank you. Thank you very much, Jasmine. Thanks for joining us. Okay. Uh we'll hold public account for another moment open in case anyone who hasn't spoken wishes to do so can raise your hand and during that moment. All right, we'll close public comment and uh our process for questions is for uh city staff to get back to you. I'll turn it over to our city manager so he can explain what that next step might look like.

And the items on close session are those are close session discussions with the council. And so those things we will not be uh discussing with the council or with the public. we um may anticipate getting some direction from the council and and based on that we'll proceed. Um those things that we um can talk with the public about we certainly um will do that and make them aware of of what what um is going on in in future plans at the equestrian center.

Okay. So for those couple or two or three people asked about the status the of the equestrian center, when might we get back to them with the status? Uh, depending on on tonight, I I think very soon we can update the public on where things are at. Okay. All right. Thank you everyone, Caitlyn, Carolyn, Jasmine, Miss Cannon, and uh Christina for commenting on this close session agenda. So, we'll come back here at 6:30.

recording in progress.

Okay, thank you for being here everyone. Um, we have a a large agenda tonight. We're probably going to go very late. Uh, we just came from close session. We started at 5:00 PM. And what we do at this time is ask our city attorney Renee Ortega to my right to report what we did in close session if there's anything that's reportable. Uh, yes. Thank you, Mayor. So, council held close session uh yesterday evening and uh just moments ago as well and uh council took no reportable action. And that's my report. All right, we have uh Council Member McCarthy, Council Member McAdams is on Zoom, myself, mayor, Kathy Biala, uh city council person, Elizabeth Fischer, mayor Prom, and we just heard from Renee Otega, our city attorney, and to my left is Lane Long, our city manager. Our staff tonight, our public works director, Ishmael, our finance director, Tori, our new city engineer, Scott. He's only one week old. Randy is our police chief. Dre is kind of acting like our director of recreation and cultural services. Wasn't of her choosing, uh, but she's doing a great job with recreation in so many ways. Mark is our interim fire department chief. We're so glad to have him. Probably is going to be our future fire chief, but he's not going to let you know that yet. He's going to be so excited about his year or so as interim chief. He's not going to want to let it go. And Belinda uh is the boss as the human resources department um director. Mark can't get his job without her processing his paperwork. So he's always very nice to Belinda as everybody is.

Belinda went to Japan with us and Korea too. Just Japan and Korea. Belinda went to Korea and Japan with us to see our sister cities. Okay. So our first order of business is uh did Yeah, I mentioned Tori is our finance director. Didn't want to pass you up. Okay. And then Ron uh back there is our uh coach. Teaches all kinds of kids sports. Hockey, football, track. Track I think is his favorite. Thank you, Ron, for being here to represent our recreation department along with Drea. So, we have three uh special presentations, but first I'd like to ask you to stand and have a moment of silence. And then I'd like to ask a member of Steve Williams family if we could volunteer someone now to lead us in the pledge. Is there anyone in your family that would like to lead us in the pledge of allegiance after uh a moment of silence? Nathan. Okay. Thank you. being a good sport, Nathan. Okay. Um, our first population is to honor the Shake family. They own the old fisherman's grotto. They own the fish hopper. But more important is what they

do for community. And they're rooted in compassion and unity and service. Um, we come together each year as a city to give warmth and food nourish nourishment that the Thanksgiving holiday is supposed to be for everyone. the Shake family. Uh they have these iconic restaurants I mentioned and they demonstrate extraordinary generosity every year and civic spirit by providing support and donations to the city's annual community Thanksgiving. And I believe the the Christmas uh holiday festival is also right, Ron. They've ensured that thousands of our residents are able to enjoy Thanksgiving and Christmas season with fellowship and celebrate with the community and have a feast with music and good good friends and family. The Shake family's commitment to giving back serves as a shining example of local leadership, hospitality, heart reflecting the very best of our regional business community. And we, City of Marina, extend deep gratitude for this generosity which uplifts our families, strengthens our sense of community, and ensures that no one in Marina goes without a Thanksgiving meal or Christmas meal that's prepared with love. And therefore, the city council of the city of Marina hereby recognizes and honors the Shake family, Old Fisherman's Grotto, the Fish Hopper, for their outstanding dedication to community service, their continued generosity, and their meaningful contributions to our holiday meals. And I want to give special shout out to Council Member McAdams. Uh this was her idea and she helped put this together, pull this together. So, thank you, Jenny. She's online. Um

but yeah, come on up. Introduce ourselves. They have at least one brother that's not here, but if you could introduce yourselves, just say a couple things.

Hi everyone, my name is Chris Shake. Uh my brother Sabu here. Um, we owned the old fisherman's grotto on Fisherman's Wararf, celebrating 76 years. This when our mom and dad opened the restaurant 1950. They actually met in Sacramento and came to Monterey for their honeymoon and decided to move to Monterey and that's where the old fisherman's started. But my brother and I learned a lot about giving back to the community from our mom and dad. Um my dad was um a a very generous man giving back to churches and nonprofits and uh he really did a lot for this community and that's how we learned. Uh and after our dad passed away, my brother and I wanted to do something in his memory and that's when we started doing the fundraising for the Salvation Army. And I'll let my brother Sabu speak a little bit more about uh the fundraising that we've done over the years. Thank you. Uh my name is Sabu Shake Jr. also go by Jr. Uh my brother Chris covered a lot but you know as he mentioned my mom and dad were always giving back to the community. Salvation Army being one of our uh biggest uh nonprofit organizations that do so much for the whole peninsula. Um it's an honor for us to be involved with the marina community. Um, you know, by like my brother Chris said, we opened up the old fisherman's groter, my father and mother did in 1950. Uh, have roots in seaside and marina. So, it's always feels good to be part of the community giving back and helping those in need. And, uh, it just becomes natural and we're just honored to be here tonight and and thank you for this tonight, mayor. And thank you to the staff and and all the, you know, members from the staff that help a lot of the youth programs out here. It's a great thing that they do. Thank you, Ron.

Uh, my father's name is Sabu and my mother's name is Isabella. My father's from India, Pakistan, and my mother's from Calabria, Italy. So, got a little curry and a little bit of Italian food. So, we grew up on everything. Thank you both.

Thank you very much. Chris. So, this next one's kind of special because when you think of custodians, sometimes they don't get the attention they deserve, but uh I think it was probably Council McAdams again that was looking out for branch's janitorial services to honor them. They've demonstrated exceptional generosity and civic commitment through their continued financial support and donations to the city's annual community Thanksgiving meal. Similar to the Shake family, these contributions have played a vital role in ensuring that our residents can gather each year in an atmosphere of dignity, togetherness, and community connection. Branch's janitorial services commitment is giving back and reflects a strong sense of social responsibility. The city of Marina expresses its appreciation for this, which strengthens families, fosters unity, and helps ensure the spirit of the holidays are accessible to everybody. So therefore, the city council does hereby recognize and honor the branch's gener janitorial services for their outstanding generosity, commitment, and community service in a meaningful way to our city of Marina. So is anyone here from from branches? Come on up. So, as soon as he's done taking this

call, Emmanuel is going to say, uh, how lucky Marina is to have him. Hello. Um, surprise me. Um, my name is Emanuel. I'm a second generation of branches janitorial. Uh my dad started the company about 1994 about and we've been working for the city since for about 20 years and um like what Bruce said it's not about cleaning the um offices and everything but serving to the community. So that's all I got to say.

Samuel Branch, my dad's name is Samuel Branch and he's actually right over there cleaning the carpets for the police officers over there. So, we're still busy working and you know, anything we could do for Marina Ron, just give us a call. All right. Okay. Um, this is a celebration and it's it's a sad celebration. It's a happy celebration. Uh, Thomas Steven Williams uh passed away recently. He was uh his blood was here his whole you know adult life. He was a wonderful human being. Gave his heart to the city in many ways. Born in Tacoma, Washington 1954 to his mom Sarah who's here now and Tom who Williams his father who has passed. Growing up as a military family, the Williams eventually found their way to our peninsula where they were stationed at former Ford or Steve enjoyed growing up here and he and his brothers had many adventures. I'm sure many of them we can't talk about tonight. I can imagine I can try to imagine what they did outside together. And they graduated from Seaside High School before we had a high school here in Marina. Steve met his wife Debbie who's here tonight. They were married at Lover's Point and never fell out of love. They were married for 49 years. Whereas Steve loved his community and gave back wherever he could by volunteering with Marina Soccer Association, Marina Volunteer Fire Department, Toys for Tots, and many

mayoral campaigns for several elected Marina mayors. He also had a great relationship with his children. Always talking about his children. Loved taking his grandchildren uh and talked about them all the time to school on little adventures and giving them, I'm sure, unsolicited sage advice. He was always joking around with them and everyone and lived for the time he got to spend with his grandkids. He was a prankster. He always had people smiling and laughing. Unfortunately, he was also an avid 49ers fan. Go Steve. Go 49ers. And he loved to watch them play. Steve was always looking to help others and that's how I knew him. He had the biggest heart of anybody I know especially for children and families in need. Now for there it be proclaimed that uh I Bruce Delgado on behalf of the city council wish to adjourn our meeting later tonight in remembrance of Thomas Steve Williams and wish to acknowledge that our community is wonderful only if people like Steve care enough to show up as Steve always did and serve the rest of the community in ways that Steve did you know pretty much his entire life until his health declined and he couldn't do what he would love to do and that was to continue serving our So, if if Debbie and Sarah and Chrissy and Nathan and and uh if you can come on up and the family, Jack, come on up and uh we have something to give you. um our interim fire department chief wanted to make sure that uh he was here tonight because uh Steve service with

the volunteer fire department uh Marina Volunteer Firefighters Association uh the me the gentlemen and women that worked with Steve uh in the fire department uh wished to to make sure that we had a representative. So, Mark Sweeney uh is here to give some things out. Steve didn't want any uh services, so tonight for me is the the best way we could do this. And I appreciate the family coming and uh he did what other people wanted him to do. So, we're doing something. Jack and Nathan, when's the last time you got flowers?

There's one, two, three.

Okay, never guess. They're best friends, Cheryl. Oh, good. Okay. Uh, next, um, we go to council and staff announcements. Staff Hannib announcements. Thank you, mayor. Um, I have uh one announcement and that is to introduce our new city engineer. Uh, Scott Shepard comes to us from the private sector with 15 years of experience as a consulting engineer in a variety of roles both on the project project management design side and as a construction management uh, and resident engineer. He is the son of an engineer and former public works director. Scott brings a multiaceted experience to Marina, having worked on traffic signal design, structural engineering, roadware, roadway design, active transportation design, construction management, and inspections. His background and experience make him uniquely qualified to help move forward the large variety of projects we have planned in our CIP. So, we're very excited to have him here. Uh, when he's not working, he enjoys any activity that gets him outside and he loves spending time with his nephews and nieces. um which I've also seen because during the recruitment process I one of

the times I called him he was uh on a ski trip with his uh sister and nephews and nieces. So um he already loves Marina enough that he bought a season pass to the Monterey Bay uh football club games, the soccer games. So we have him at least until October. So come on up, Scott. Nice to meet you all. Uh, appreciate the claps. I don't think I have much to add, but I'm excited to be here. Um, I love building up my community. That's something that I've been passionate about since I was a kid. Um, honesty, transparency, and um, accountability are big for me. Pobuddies. I can't promise I won't make mistakes, but I'm always going to hold myself accountable for it. And that's a promise that I can make to you all and the community at large. Uh, yeah, I'm excited to be here. Thanks.

I'm gonna give this proclamation uh to the family before they take off. Any other staff announcements? All right, let's go to Councilwoman Council person Jenny McAdams. Jenny, let's get you going here. Thank you, mayor. Um, this morning I had the opportunity uh to attend the Selena's mayor's faith breakfast. Uh, and I left feeling encouraged and and deeply grateful for the spirit of unity, positivity, and collaboration that was in the room. was really a powerful reminder um of the strength that comes from community um even when they're faced with difficult times. Um you know, so for me, I want to take a moment to acknowledge um the very real emotions that many are experiencing in our community right now. Uh the hurt, anger, frustration um and devastation. And so I just I am doing my best to remain encouraged and I know that we are a resilient community and that our strength has always come from our ability to stand together even when it's really hard. So thank you.

Thank you Jenny. Let's go to Council Member Biala. Thank you, mayor. I hadn't even put on my light, so but thank you. Um I want to sincerely thank um all that came yesterday as well as today coming to our city council in remembrance of Ronald Tinsley and your presence here allowed us from the dis experience firsthand your collective grief and however much our council is restricted by process and legal constraints. This does not mean that we are devoid of feelings and sadness for you and for the world we live in. I can only say this with complete sincerity. So, thank you for coming.

Thank you, Kathy. Mayor Prom Fischer. Excuse me. No one can speak. Public comments coming soon. It's on the agenda and it's next. C Mayor Prom Fischer.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I also would like to thank everybody who's here and many of you were here last night as well. And um last night's meeting showed that you're you're that Charon was loved by so many people and he had lots of cousins, aunts, uncles, friends, and who are all you're all grieving together with his mom. Just like you, we want to know what happened. But just like you, we don't have more information than what is shared by uh on social media by the district attorney's office. We all need to be patient while the DA office is doing their investigation. So I I my thoughts are with you and I wish everyone my thoughts are with everybody involved by the way and I wish everybody patience and strength during your time of grief. So thank you very much. Okay, Council Member McCarthy.

Thank you, Mayor. Um, just want to echo a lot of what's already been said. Um, but share with you the one thing that I have heard from you, uh, is pleased for the transparency and expediency of information. I share those values and I am committed to doing everything that is within my power to uh expedite and forward those goals. I've seen what the rest of the audience has seen and nothing more. Um and I know nothing more. Um but I share I've heard what you are saying and from where I sit I am doing everything that I can to forward those goals. So you are going to have an opportunity to address us again tonight. As Roslin said you are the narrators to some extent um at this point and uh we are listening. So thank you for being here.

Thank you Brian. And I just want to repeat what I said last night that we understand how tragic this was. None of us wanted that to happen. What happened on Sunday night when Chiron died. And I also want to say that it's it's a cliche, but it's true that we support transparency and the investigation that's going on as independent of us as it should be. Our police have nothing to do with it except that today I understand they were starting to be interviewed. Um but it's an investigation basically into our police department's handling of this tragedy. So um we hope that communications through the DA office can continue and that the body cam footage can be released as soon as possible. I understand in King City that uh it didn't take that long when they had an officer involved shooting not too many not too long ago, but that's out of our control and we we welcome you tonight as we did last night. We welcome you on February 3rd, which is our next meeting. You always have a chance to speak your mind and you always have a chance to speak on anything that's on our agenda. Uh but now we'll move to hearing from those who want to speak. And before we begin, I want to remind you that this city council meeting is regulated by law called Brown Act. And it's a limited public forum uh where the public are welcome and encouraged to participate. that I have to maintain order and follow the city's decorum, our rules that are outlined in our in our ordinance, our charter. And this is so that everyone can be heard. Uh nobody gets booed, nobody gets um disrespected. Please

direct your comments to us as a whole and avoid interruptions if you don't have the floor, the podium, or if you're online trying to speak. That's who we want to hear from when your turn comes. And we don't want anyone to prevent other people from being heard. Uh we listen to comments, but we do not respond. And that's frustrating to you last night and it might be frustrating for you tonight, but we refer questions to staff so they can get back to you with answers and follow up as appropriate. So, let's go to all of you who would like to speak. First we go to the people here in person and then we go to the people online. So um the floor is yours.

Yeah. It's also the opportunity to speak. Oh yeah. We also have something called a consent agenda. It's a bunch of stuff that we don't look at individually. So whoever wants to speak on the consent agenda items or anything that's on your mind, this is the time.

Hi, good evening council. My name is Renee Young. I'm here as a member of Seaside um and also as an organizer with Monterey County Black Caucus. I was present last night and I want to speak to um some of my observations and the distinction in which I noticed between those who on the council exhibited their humanity and those who exhibited more of like a politicians um way of sitting up here. And I'll kind of expand on that a little bit. I'm gonna put Miss Kathy Biala, if I'm saying that correctly, on the spot. And for good reason, because I had my eyes on everybody who was sitting up here last night and kind of was just a little more perceptive on what was going on in the room. And I noticed that you were locked in. And I think that that was felt I can't speak for everybody, but I want to say that you seem to be very locked in. Um, you were very obviously touched by a lot of what was being said. Um, your face said it, your body language, and that was unique from what I saw up here beside you. I saw a lot of stone cold faces. I saw knowing what you said just that you all can't comment. That's understandable. But there's a difference between not being able to comment and trying to maintain this demeanor that you are um almost unaffected and that I think speaks louder than any comment that you could have said. Um there is a humanity aspect to this

whether you can relate directly to it um or not. you you know that there's a humanity aspect to it because we all just saw some of you crying not 10 minutes ago. With respect to the um gentleman that was just recently lost in the community, I actually recognized some of his family that was here tonight and I wish they hadn't stepped out so soon cuz I grew up with a couple of them and I wanted to say hi. But um it was seen just how deeply this person affected you all and I even felt affected in some ways hearing what you had to say not ever having met that man, you know. But um and like I said, that's no disrespect to um the vulnerability that you all showed tonight because it's obvious that you all suffered a very personal loss. But that said, um it's something about this that I just wanted to come up here and set the tone moving forward that we're all kind of watching you throughout these next few minutes as people send are going to give their comments. And so, thank you, Miss Viala. And uh yeah, I yield my time. Thank you.

Thank you very much. That's good. Thank you. Uh uh Bruce Delgado. Um and to the council members, I'm Miriam Smith. And I'm surprised you didn't recognize me. Uh Mr. Mayor. However, uh I want to say that I came in here tonight and I asked was there a video of last night because I wasn't here last night. Uh I was told that um and this is a respond that I think is what we are we are talking about as far as the or what the people are talking about as far as the the uh fatal shooting of Ronald Tinsley. Um when I asked for the video tonight, I was told that uh there was no video. So maybe you all can help out with that and make sure that even what happened last night should have been video, but it was. and I was told that it was deleted off the phone. That's a response. That's a response. So, somebody in here did the video and then they turned around and deleted it. So, that's telling us and telling me and I'm willing to tell everybody that what you think about what happened to a black man in your city. And I respect you. Uh, Mayor Delgado, I've stood on the front lines with you with many of issues and um I know and I thought and I felt you were a person to be respected. But to have hidden stuff where you can be sneaky dismiss us and tell us in our face or tell people in their face that you are sorry. I happen to know that things can be released

because I'm I'm Paul's the cause, Miriam Smith. And with that, I deal with reducing harm from the police officers and I deal with with um saving lives, saving black lives. And so with that, all over the place, they are releasing information. You let the officers go. We need the names of the officers. We need information about the officers. how many of them shot and how many shots were went out. All that can be put out in the news. Should have been put out in the news. Investigation doesn't stop certain details to be released. That would be transparency, not a I'mma hide behind. We can't do anything because this and that is is going on because of the investigation. There is some things that if you care about and I know I thought the mayor of this city, Marina, was a type of person that stood up for what was right. So I know that you should be able to release the information. So dig a little deeper, try a little harder and release what you know you can release and be more transparent with the family, with the mother, and with the people that care in this community so that we'll know what's going on. We should not be completely blind. Just like the the whole incident was blindsided, we shouldn't be completely blind to what's going on. We need to know. The people have a right to know. That's what news is all about. How do you hide stuff from the news? It doesn't make any sense. But you're saying DA my foot all over the country. DAs get involved. Investigation start.

Miam, I'm sorry. I have to ask you to stop because the 3 minutes is up and I need to be fair to everybody. Hey, just release the information. You can do it. And please come back on February 1st if there's things that happened that you want to talk more about.

Thank you, Miriam.

Good evening, Mayor Delgado, council members and community and members of the community. My name is Ramisha Smith. I'm here again as a grieving cousin of Ronald of Ronald Tinsley. I'm here again because the information being presented to the public about my cousin Chiron continues to change and frankly it makes no sense. The first article stated that my cousin had a weapon on or about the vehicle. The following morning, we were told the firearm was found after he was shot and now the narrative has changed again that he had a loaded revolver in his hand when he was shot. Would that not have been one of the first things one of the officers would have told their chief? These are not these are not minor details. These are major life ordeath facts and they keep shifting. So which version are we supposed to believe? Because from the outside, what this looks like is a story being adjusted to justify the use of lethal force after a black man has already been killed. We are told the footage is under investigation. We understand investigations take time, but let me be clear. There is no justification for withholding unedited body camera footage from the family. We are demanding the immediate release of the full unedited body camera footage to Chiron Tinsley's family. Transparency delayed is not transparency. It is control. The Black Panther Party taught us that police are not our protectors. They are oppressors when there is no accountability. And right now, accountability is absent. Malcolm X said, "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who you are who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." And that is exactly why these shifting narratives are dangerous. My cousin was a father. He was an entrepreneur, a community figure. Like I said last night, our superstar, a human being. He does not get to speak for himself anymore. So we will. We are not asking for favors. We are not asking

for spin. We are demanding truth, facts, and full transparency, starting with the release of the footage to the family. Until that happens, everything presented to social media, the newspapers, news, everything to the public will remain in question. Thank you. Thank you.

I wasn't here last night, but I pretty much know what went on cuz I've seen some bad work up in here. Crooked, backstabbing, lies. They shot my baby in the head. In the head for expired tag. This evil. They were supposed to give him a ticket and send him on his way, but they killed him. I can't stand her. I feel bad up in here with y'all. I ain't lying. Bad spirit. Evil. You kill him. You kill him. You kill him. My name is Nina. Um, I'm a member of the community and a youth organizer for Monterey County Black Caucus. And I just want to say that it is very pathetic how when I walked in here, you got a chance to give flowers. No disrespect on that family, but there was no flowers yesterday that I saw to those families. But I'm going just say how unhumane and pathetic that really is. But I'm here today because a black man was shot and killed by the police. And I should this should stop us in our tracks right here. Before anything else, I want to say this plainly. He was a human being. Not just a statistic, not a headline, not a problem to be managed. She was someone's child, someone's father, someone's loved one, someone who mattered to the community. As a black person in America, especially a black man, moments like this are not shocking, but they are deeply painful. They reopen

a wound that never seems to fully heal or be closed. We are consistently reminded that our humanity is still questioned, still negotiated, and still often ignored. We're here. We are here told to be We are here told to wait for the facts to be patient and to trust the process. But patience is hard when the p the pattern is familiar when accountability feels rare. When justice feels delayed or denied. I am demanding full transparency. I am demanding accountability. And I am demanding justice not just in words but by actions. Public safety should never come at the cost of someone's life. when there were when there were way other options to be handled. Protection should not mean fear and authority should not erase humanity. This community deserves answers cuz I know if it was y'all and the foots were reversed, but they will never be reversed because you're not black. Everyone on that council was white. But I'll save that for another conversation. This community deserves answers. This family deserves the truth and we all deserve a system that values black lives because everybody want to be black and so it's time to be black. Not only as statements but in practice. Justice for this man means more than investigation. It means more than these sillies games that y'all are playing. It means real change. So this does not keep happening to another man, another black man, someone's father, someone's cousin, someone's husband. But you get my point. Thank you. Thank you, Nina.

Okay. name is uh Stefan Hill. I'm from Seaside, but I live in Brunell right now. Now, from what I see and everything, even all through the country, a police shooting this camera within hours, it's all over the TV within hours. What's happening here? Anybody else answer that? There's an investigation going all through the country after a shooting, but they released the camera from the police. So, can you all answer that what's going on? I know you all see it on TV after something happened, cameras on TV, Nashville, all over the place. This man was shot by the police. It needs to be given to the family and probably the TV station. It's not going to uh stop the uh process of the investigation. That's all I want to say. Thank you. Thank you, Stephan. Good evening. My name is River Navi. Um, I'm a community member, a teacher, an educator, and uh, I'm just here as a non-black person to say this is really messed up. um the pattern of extrajudicial execution

of black people on our streets is just un unspeakably wrong. And it's a legacy of ongoing uh racism, slavery, segregation in our systems, specifically the system of policing. And so I won't repeat what's been said that the information needs to be released, but I will encourage you as a city that claims itself a progressive city to consider alternatives to policing. Can we please uh have other systems in place? Why do they need a gun to talk about traffic stops? Let's I mean, let's just defund the police, put some resources elsewhere into our community, and uh really make steps because for as long as we try to reform, for as long as we allow the police to uh quote protect and serve unquote, um people keep dying and it needs to stop. So, Marina, that's your challenge. Thank you.

Thank you, Reverend Nebby.

My name is La Asia. Um, I came here yesterday. I'm a cousin of uh Ronald again. I'm back. And I seen some stuff on the news that this picture you guys are trying to paint or whoever is trying to paint my cousin and new evidence supposedly found. And I think it's not fair that you guys keep trying to paint a picture of somebody, but we don't get a name of a cop. We didn't get a name of a nothing. We just keep getting this black man on this TV. But where's the white cops that did all this? Or where is the Asian cop that did all this? Whereas the people that did this, you guys keep putting his name out in the least, but what about everybody else? Everybody in the press gets to keep seeing what type of person that you guys want to paint out to be after we sat here and everybody's faces yesterday and sat there and told you guys what type of person he was and how you guys understand us so much, but I don't feel like y'all understand we got going on. Thank you. So, I'll give everyone a moment. If you haven't spoken and you're inside the room, if you want to come up and speak, give you a moment. And then after that, we'll go to people that are remote. Okay. Oh,

hi. Hi.

Um, I just wanted to say, um, echoing what other people have said, I also know Toronto Tisley that was killed by the police. Um, seems like you guys are your energy feels like you're annoyed, like we've hijacked your meeting or something, but um, it was necessary for all of us to show up here today. All the people that showed up yesterday, we're just asking for transparency. In addition to that, we're asking for justice. In addition to that, uh, Marina canled the Marlo Dim activities in light of this event. So, if y'all canled activities, put the work in and show us the results. There was an incident that happened in Salad less than 72 hours. KSVW had that body cam footage on the TV. There was an incident that happened today in Hollister. A carjacking. I watched that prior to coming over here. It was shown on the TV. Where's the transparency for this event that has happened? We are asking for Chief Randy Hopkins to take accountability and officers that are involved. We want the information released now. We're asking for Janine Pacion, District Attorney's Office, to release the information now. We're tired of waiting. We've waited and we're no longer going to be patient. We're going to keep showing up to these meetings. Thank you for inviting us to the next meeting on February 3rd.

Thank you.

Good evening, city council members, members of the public. staff. I didn't come with anything prepared to say. I'm standing here as your planning commissioner, as your black American negro freeben descendant of American child slavery, human with all of these descendants of American cattle slavery, black American negro freed men in here tonight. And I hope that you heard them cuz I've been talking to you about this long time. A long time. And you've ignored me a long time. I gave you statistics and I talked to you about the Blanc and ethnosside that was happening in this county. I talked to you about all of the freed men that are no longer here after Ford closed. I talked to you about the racism that happens here in this city. And I know you remember what you said to me when I talked to you about those things. So now we're sitting here having cancelled the Martin Luther King celebration because you expected retaliation from my community. What in the world?

Yeah.

What in the world? Why? My community needs answers and they need them loudly, clearly, and now. Now, not later, not when you feel like it. Not deleted something. None of that. This is ridiculous. And as a member of your city leadership, it is unacceptable. If you're a Freman, I'm inviting you to come to black aaf.net. Trace your lineage, establish yourself as a descendant of those enslaved under the institutions of US American child slavery and join us as we pursue reparations across Monterey County for what they've done to us. Thank you. I land. Thank you, Audra. And thank you for your longtime service on the planning commission and other roles you've served in City of Marina.

Sir, we can't let you come back up. I'm sorry. It's a one one time per person. Sir, please. You have to re you're I know you you can't do that, sir. Sir, you can't do that. Sir, please. Sir, please maintain order. Please maintain order, sir. Please, sir.

So, we'll give everyone a moment if you haven't spoken in person and wish to and then we'll go online to folks. Okay, let's go to Eleni Matiakis. Sorry if I'm not saying your name properly. Elenni. Oh, yeah. Hi. Can you hear me? Yes. Loud and clear.

Hi. Um, is it possible if the city marina could you guys put a school crossing zone between Marina Vista and Lyelis on Carmel Avenue because there's a crosswalk but parents drive. One one moment, please. Lenny, please. Everyone, let's hear her speak. I'm having trouble hearing her. Probably everybody is. This is public comment for anything that's on your mind. Eli, please proceed. I didn't hear you the location that you wanted. Uh

yeah, between um Marina Vista and Los Ibelis over on Carmel Avenue, there's a crosswalk, but cars go right through it, and someone's going to get hit there one day, and it won't be me. So, I'm just really I I just I would prefer you guys put a school crossing zone like especially right in front of Marina Vista because that's a really busy school area between both schools. Is that possible?

So, Elenni, this is this is your time. We we don't have a conversation with you in this way, but you're welcome to contact our staff anytime during the day as it is when we hear you and we're going to refer this to our public works director and our traffic advisory committee. Okay. Uh and uh Elenni, I think if you contact marina at citymarina.org, or we could better understand the location. I'm having a little bit of confusion because those schools are on different streets. So, please email your concern to marina at city of marina.org. Okay.

Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Elenni. Okay. Let's go to Carla. Carla Lobo. Thank you. Can you hear me? Yes. Loud and clear, Carla.

Okay. My apologies for not being able to attend in person, but yesterday's special meeting was a missed opportunity to demonstrate true leadership, transparency, and respect for a community that's grieving. While words of sympathy and understanding were spoken, your actions told a very different story. By holding a special meeting without Zoom access, without public full public accountability or accessibility, and without a permanent recording, you silence a large portion of our community. Those who could not attend in person were excluded from witnessing, participating in, and processing a moment that deeply impacts them. Grief does not stop at a city limits, and civic participation should not either. When you remove trust, regardless of intent, the result was suppression, not inclusion. You said you respect the community, you understood our pain and sympathize with our loss. But respect must be demonstrated through action. Yesterday, your actions reflected restriction, control, and a lack of regard for the magnitude of what our community is experiencing. There were also serious failures in decorum and responsibility. And yet now you sit up here trying to tell people what decorum should look like. asking a community member a question and not allowing her space to respond to your question and then demanding later placing her in a position of reciting the pledge of allegiance was inappropriate and unacceptable. You know better than that mayor. The burden does not belong to the community. It belongs to this governing body. Grieving residents should never be placed in ceremonial or emotional labor roles to compensate for institutional shortcomings. Imposing strict time strict time limits on expression of grief rather than loss of life, especially a life with more than 30 years of history, love, future potential

is profoundly disrespectful. You cannot compress a lifetime into a few minutes without minimizing its value. This was not a routine agenda item. This was a moment of human loss and our community deserved space to honor that. A more responsible approach would have been to open the public comment for a minimal block of time, if necessary, voted to extend that time. But instead, it felt like control. Our community deserves an independent investigation, one that is truly independent. The community must use it selective in to be able to select the investigative body. I strongly recommend the formation of an ad hoc board to ensure real accountability and re real transparency. Asking institutions to investigate themselves is not accountability. It's an oxymoron. Our community has both legal and moral right to be angry. Respectfully, the time to take a reset has passed and gone. Also community I urge you to record, share and post all of this because history it is not documented accordingly and accurately. Documentation ensures a narrative is not disordered by special interests or personal agendas. Again, real action needs to take place now. So let us use the same tools often misused to mischaracterize the pen and paper and media. You have a chance to follow decorum Robert's rules. Um if you don't have enough time, somebody else can yield their time to you so that you can utilize that.

Thank you. Okay, let's go to Rob Den Turley. Maybe this is Denise Turley. Welcome.

Yep, it's me. So u so um while I'm pulling up um I am going to make a connection to what has been said uh here so far in that the events of Sunday evening need to find out how Mr. Tinsley was served and protected and the uh cancellation of the uh Martin Luther King event needs to be rescheduled and soon because it sounds deaf or it appears deaf. Okay, switching to my favorite subject, probably not yours. Landlords and tenants, please search California 2026 new rental housing laws include zip code. These have been there have been many changes opt outs unbundling utilities from rents for mobile home parks and multi multifamily housing and uh disclosures of mandatory fees and increased documentation requirements on both sides. I have reviewed the 2026 lease and found it extremely problematic. I have shared those concerns with Brian at the League of Women Voters, meeting we both attended Yummy Salmon Lunch and I'm willing to do so with any other interested party. Hopefully, Miss Viser and others

by Friday. Public comment is needed for the new oil and gas leases proposed off our coast. The Monterey Bay Aquarium and Save My Coast each have a link. So, you just click on the link, type out your little thing, hit send, and it goes directly to the appropriate authority at the White House. Finally, we need more information on the status of up changes upcoming changes to rent stabilization and other issues. Is there any proposed or date yield 20 whole seconds? Thank you.

Thank you, Denise. Let's go to Caroline. Welcome, Caroline.

Thank you, Mayor Delgato. Caroline Carol, Marina, District 1 resident and disabled mother of three. Um, I just wanted to ask our city leadership to commit to full transparency, meaning not just observing the Brown Act, but please allow accessibility to the meetings and record. We timely we need timely communication and accountability throughout the investigation process so that the public can have confidence that the truth will be fully examined. Our community deserves clarity, compassion, and a commitment to public safety that protects both residents and officers. The shooting has shaken our community. Many residents are feeling grief, fear, and uncertainty, especially when a routine traffic stop ends in death. I am asking the city and our police department to prioritize trans. Tonight, our community is mourning and we must lead with humanity. A life was lost and that deserves our full attention and care. Beyond the investigation, I hope this moment prompts us to look seriously at policies, at training, and at oversight that can prevent future tragedies. Public safety must also must always include the safety and dignity of the people we serve. I urge our leaders to listen closely to the community in the days ahead. and Valencia, my heart aches for you. I asked the remainder of my time to be observed for Ronald Tinsley. And I ask, why is it that when you have a negative interaction with the Marina Police Department, it is then further

excessive force is all I have to say. And he wasn't just the first person. Yes, this landed in this deadly shooting, but why must it always be an excessive force? Thank you, Carolyn. We're going to go to iPhone. Thank you. All right. Thank you, Caroline. The next speaker shows up as iPhone.

Hello. Yes. Hello.

Hi. Yes. Um, this is Natasha Schultz. I'm calling from Nevada. I'm calling because this is some bull crap. What happened to my nephew Chiron? This should never had happened. My thing and my question is where's the training? A traffic stop turn into a homicide is unacceptable. So what we need transparency most definitely, but we also need to hear that audio footage in that patrol car at the time of when they pulled him over. I want to hear the narrative of what they had to say. Why did they pull him over? They need to go ahead and release that footage camera and release the names of the officers because if it was somebody else and it was a homicide that somebody else on the streets did, y'all would have put the name, the family members, EVERYBODY'S NAME. SO WHY WON'T Y'ALL release the police officers names? How come we can't know WHAT OFFICERS WAS INVOLVED in it? Because we may have some BACKGROUND THAT MAY THAT may be accessible and may be helpful towards your so-called investigation as well as an independent investigation. What's going to happen? So, I just advise that. I just think it's wise and respectful and giving the mom some type of closure, some type of some type of notice of what happened to her son and who did it to her son. Y'all need to go ahead and release that information. What are you guys holding it for? What are you guys hiding? You know what I'm saying? Like, this is unacceptable. Valencia, I love you with all my heart, all my soul. Arman, Keon, I love y'all with every bit in me. Best believe the whole world is gonna be woken up behind this. This will not go unswept. Justin for Chiron Tinsley. I wave the rest of my time for whoever wants to speak on behalf of my nephew. I love you guys all. May the uh blessings and peace be within y'all.

So go ahead and let somebody else use my time, please. Thank you. Thank you, Natasha. Oh, the keys locked in the bathroom. My name is Nathan Grahava and I represent Seaside. Nathan. Nathan, we're going through the remote people. We'll call you up when we're done. We're just trying to follow our rules fairly. The next person is Mala Velasquez. Malikica, thank you. Yes, this is

this is Malikica Velasquez. I serve on the MPSD school board and on the Seaside Community Safety Advisory Commission. I am speaking tonight as a community member. First, I want to say to Valencia, I am so sorry this has happened to you. Our children, our our hearts manifested outside of our body and flesh, and no mother should have to go through this. So, I send my condolences to you and your family. Now, I would like to address my community. as a member of the African-American Freedman community and say that it is 2025 and this is still happening and it is now time for legislation because apologies, family settlements, etc. are not changing what is happening um in regards to training depending upon the motives behind this or what happened. um this may not even be a training issue because there are certain things that cannot be trained out of people. And so we've had the COVID AAPI anti-hate crime bill. We've had the anti-semitism bill. And it is time for the black American community to have its own hate crime bill. And so I implore my community that we need to get at our elected officials and push for legislation because the the only thing I see changing this is a consequence to actions like this. And so I implore my community to reach out to your congress people, reach out

to your senators, even reach out to the presidential administration, whoever. And we need to start pushing for that. We need to start pushing for legislation because this should not be happening in 25. There should not be mothers in 2025 dealing with the same thing that mothers dealt with in the '9s, that mothers dealt with in the '60s, that mothers dealt with in the 1940s. This is long overdue. Something needs to be done and we need legislation. Not only that, as Sister Audrey said, we also need reparations for incidents and things such as this. And I yield the rest of my time.

Thank you, Malikica. Let's go to Angie. Trying to unmute you, Angie. There might be trouble on your end. Can you hear me? Yes. Okay. So, you can hear me still loud and clear. Welcome.

Okay. Welcome. Thank you. Good evening and thank you to everyone who was here whether in person or joining us virtually. My name is Angie Fonda and I'm here today not just as a family member but as someone who is standing up for the truth for justice for my nephew Ronald Shiron Tinsley II. I want to start by reminding everyone who Shiron truly was. He wasn't just a name and a report. He wasn't just a statistic or a news story. Chiron was a son, a father, a nephew, and a friend. He was a man who gave light to everyone around him. He made us laugh. He made us feel loved and made us proud. He had a future. He had a family that relied on him. A community that adored him. And that future was ripped away violently and unfairly. What happened to Chiron was wrong. We know it. The people who took him from us know it, too. We want answers. We want transparency. And we demand the release of the body cam footage as well as the audio. What are they hiding? Why is they being kept from us? We are his family and we deserve to see the truth. We have the right to understand how this tragedy happened and why Chiron, a man with so much life ahead of him, had his life taken away so callously. We are demanding the names of the officers involved. We want to know who they are and what to know. And we want to know why their actions led to the death of an innocent man. Their actions have shattered our family and will not rest until they are held accountable. This is not just a family issue. This is a community issue. Chiron was loved by so many. He was a brother to son, a son to others. He was a friend to many who could rely on him for support, kindness, and understanding. His death has left a hole that no one can feel. It's not just us, his family who mourns. The entire community feels this loss. We have lost someone who mattered. Someone who had a positive impact on every life he touched. We need to stand together in demanding justice because what happens to one of us affects us all. This tragedy is a strain on our community and we cannot let it go without action. No one should have to

suffer like we have. So today I'm I'm here not just for myself but for my nephew Shiron for his memory, for his spirit, for his family, and for our community. We demand justice. We we demand the truth and we demand accountability. This is not just about what happened to Shon. This is about ensuring that no other family has to go through the pain and loss we are experiencing. We will not rest until justice is served. Until this death, until his death is not forgotten, until the truth comes out and until those responsible are held accountable. V, I love you. That goes without being said. Arman, Keon, the whole family, I love you guys and I'll see you guys soon. Thank you for hearing me.

Thank you, Angie. Let's go to Jackie O. Welcome Jackie.

Hello. Can you hear me now? Hello. Yes, we can hear you. Okay, one second. Um, I think after watching and hearing from everyone, uh, there's so much more that I could say, but let me go to one second. Um, let's see. Can I pause my time? Um, we can come back to you if you'd like, Jackie.

Okay. Actually, can I now I I have something up. Thank you. Um, good evening, mayor and members of the city council. My name is Jackie Owens. I'm a member of the Marina community. I'm here tonight to address the city's decision to cancel the Martin Luther King Jr. Day celebration this last Monday. I submitted an email earlier today, but I wanted to speak directly to the record because I believe this decision warrants public discussion. While I um Dr. King's legacy is not just for fair weather or times of peace. His message of non-violence, justice, and community healing is most revalent and most necessary when a community is in pain or facing trauma. By cancelling the event, the city missed a vital opportunity for us to come together, process what happened, and reaffirm our commitment to the values of Dr. King that Dr. King stood for. The city press release mentioned pausing festivities out of respect. However, honoring Dr. King is not a festivity. It is a com a commitment to civic duty and social progress at a time when there may be tension or confusion regarding law enforcement and community safety. We needed a space for dialogue and unity. When we cancel these events, we lose the beloved community Dr. King spoke of. We essentially allowed a um we needed time to he we need time to heal from this very tragedy. In the future, I urge the council the council to view our community celebrations, especially those rooted in civil rights and social justice, not as an option, not as option events that can be set aside when things get difficult, but as essential tools for community resilience. I hope that moving forward,

the city will prioritize finding ways to keep us together during crisises rather than sending us home in silence. And the rest of my time um is to mourn Ronald Tinsley. Thank you for all of the and sending love to all of the family. Thank you, Jackie. Okay, let's go to Francine Rod. Welcome, Francine.

Good evening, city council members. Um, this is one you guys know me and you know that I'm not without words. Um, this is definitely a time where I am having trouble for multiple reasons. one, as a longtime Marina resident, having grown up here, um, starting in 1968, as a member of the Monterey County Black Caucus, as someone who had sent in a letter asking the city to not hold conflicting MLK events at the same time um, as the city of Seaside, who over 40 years had been holding an event at the same time on Monday, but asking for the in the future to really collaborate and coordinate so that people in our community could really more experience his reality and his humanity and his vision um for a beloved community. And then all of this happened on Sunday night. And um so it has been a uh you know a very difficult time for our community. My heart goes out to Miss Richardson as a mother of a black man. I um know how much our heart hurts every time they go out. um every day they go out. I am very confused. We're feeling assaulted by the federal constraints that are happening in our our our country and now very confused by this local situation. I heard you all talk about the desire for transparency. I heard you all talk about legal constraints and right now that feels a little bit like code to me and I know each and every one of you. So I am also asking like all of the other folks in the room for some transparency in the sense of if other places can share the information why can't we share it in Marina what are the constraints what are the legal constraints so that at least we can understand the difference or the

duplicity or what the heck is happening it feels very confusing to us and yes we need time for healing and yes we need time for respect and yes we need time for love. Um, and so I'm calling on all of you to help us with that. Um, to be transparent, to be sharing the information, to recognize the hurt, the healing that needs to happen in our community. And now, as the executive director for First Five Monterey County, I can also say that we are available to help with um, funding activities and events that might help with healing in terms of what our community needs right now. child care or uh helping to support food at circles that might be needed. So, um, we are available to help to support with that. And I would like to seed the rest of my time for silence as well. Thank you, Francine. Is there anyone else online that hasn't raised their hand that wants to so they can speak? We'll give you a moment. Okay, Rosalyn, welcome back. trying to unmute you.

Welcome. Thank you.

Good evening, Mayor and City Council. Um, I am back again tonight just to really uplift uh Ronald Chiron Tinsley II, the person that he was, a son, a father, an uncle, a nephew, a cousin, a friend, a seaside raised black man that profoundly found an opportunity. Found an opportunity to change the trajectory of the life that he was born into as a black man being disenfranchised. He found a way to begin his own business so that he could leave a legacy for his children who are now left fatherless. So again, I will continue to reiterate and say his name until justice is served for Chiron. In addition to that, I had originally planned to be here tonight to speak to the Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. celebration that was scheduled um on the

same day and same time as the 40-year event in Seaside. We are very um minority community in Monterey County and I want to assure that this year we will be considerate of the time and date that each of our neighboring cities are planning to celebrate and uplift Dr. King so that we can all be in attendance. Also, I want to acknowledge that Evangelist Leavon Stone has been hosting a MLK event in the city of Marina. And unfortunately, I did not see, hear, or know of any collaboration with the Vangelous Stone when the event was planned um last year and this year. So, please Marina, let's do better. Let's take time and negotiate and work together.

Thank you.

Thank you, Rosalyn. Let's go to Da Robinson. I'm sorry if I'm saying your name wrong. Deja Robinson. Yes. Thank you. Can you guys hear me? Yes. Thank you.

All right. Um, sorry I couldn't be there in person. I was there yesterday and my heart and prayers are definitely still with everyone who is mourning this tragic loss. Um, but I do want to just say that the district attorney's office has allowed public statements about Ronald Tinsley to circulate while providing no evidence and releasing nobody worn camera footage. The statements are now being used to justify his killing in real time while his family and our community are left with nothing. If that information were verified, it would have been released immediately. Instead, what we are seeing are selective leaks, speculation, and public character attacks without transparency or accountability. So, we have to ask, why is Ronald Tinsley being publicly scrutinized and doxed while the officers involved remain unnamed and the evidence remains hidden? We understand that you do not control the investigation, but you do oversee the institution. You have the authority to formally request a clear timeline for the release of the bodywn camera footage and for regular public updates. You can publicly caution against speculation and misinformation while evidence has not been released. You can support independent review and meaningful community oversight. And you can commit to policy changes that ensure this does not keep happening. We're asking you to use the authority you do have to demand transparency, to correct misinformation, and to put community trust above institutional comfort. I want to yield the rest of my time for a moment of silence as well. Thank you.

Thank you, Deja. Okay. Does anyone We don't normally do this, but does anyone in person want to speak that hasn't spoken? There was a gentleman earlier wanted to speak. I know, but it's not not our practice. Okay, city manager, did any questions come up that you want to ask folks to email you about? Council, did you note any questions? All right, Council Member McCarthy. Yes, Mayor. I mean, at risk of sounding repetitive, I mean, there was obviously the clear plea to for the city to take a stance on the expediency of of the release of information. I think it's fair to say to the community that that has been relayed um or discussed and is um those are our values.

Yeah. And without getting into detail that we're not allowed to get into, last night we had a close session meeting after hearing the public. And it's a very human nature sort of thing by those of us up here and those of you in the audience to want what Council Member McCarthy just said. Uh, I wonder if our city attorney can speak to what you see as our power over the investigation, our power to uh release information or force or expedite the release of information.

Thank you, mayor. I don't have any answers at the moment, so but I will get back to you. But I mean when I I took the questions down um and I will follow up. So what I mean is uh being that this is the first time in a long time that we've had an officer involved shooting. So we haven't worked with the DA investigation process. I know that the DA office kind of specified the order they're going to conduct the investigation, which I guess is a boilerplate. Uh so that's what they've said they do. Um, do you or the city manager or the police chief understand whatever power we have as a city to um request demand they do something we want done such as release of the body cams tomorrow or certain time frame we want something done in. Do we have any power to affect the DA investigation? So, we can certainly make that request. Um, but I'm sure they will follow their protocol and timeline that they have, but we can make that known.

He said we can make that request, but likely they will follow their timeline that they've announced. Brian, do you have anything in in particular? No, mayor. Thank you. Okay.

Okay. Like last night, uh, thank you for being here tonight. Those of you that are still here, those of you who aren't still here, thank you for coming. February 3rd is our next meeting. We usually meet every first Tuesday of the month. We usually meet every third Tuesday of the month, unless there's a holiday that bumps that. So that's why February 3rd is our next public meeting and we always encourage and welcome public comment that's not on the agenda and public comment for every item that's on the agenda. So thank you everyone for being here tonight. Okay, Council Member McAdams, you have the floor.

Oh, I don't have my hand raised, do I? Okay, just checking in. I know that you're remote, so thank you.

Okay, we're going to go to our consent agenda. Do any members of the council and everyone's welcome to stay. Of course, you you go at your pleasure. Thank you again for being here. Does any council member have any quick questions or want to take a deep dive and pull something off the consent agenda? I had a question on 10F2, the um limited term community service officer, new position. Um I sent an email but late to our police administration. Um because if you go to 10F2, it has a list of duties of that community service officer that does not include any homeless uh outreach, etc. But we also have a a homeless procedure policy that says we're going to hire a cso specifically for homeless outreach. um and homeless services. So, um Randy, is anyone here can you speak to that? If you look at the staff report, it does talk about in a paragraph homeless outreach needs, but it's not in the list of uh the position support duties.

Good evening, everyone. Uh I did get your email and I replied, but you were probably going into close session. So what um what my response was basically the position uh will be for a limited time. We're down one cso. Uh that person's been gone for about a year and we're not sure when that person will return. And my hope is to in this limited capacity put someone in place and that will be able to shore up the position that we're short because the positions that are currently fulfilling those duties are being pulled in multiple areas and we're shortening staff. And so this would allow us to work with our home housing or homeless liaison officer and to then begin to shore up some of those collaborations with the mental health agencies and kind of get some of that done. So it may not may have missed the line or something in there, but this position will help. It will not be full-time because some of the uh homeless camps are uh they need to be with an officer. some of them are could be somewhat dangerous. We've had some experiences lately. So, this position will be able to help with some of the administrative do some of the resource allocation collaboration with those other uh agencies that we are partnering with but at a limited capacity. This will allow us to maximize that and then uh I think we should be in a much better place.

Okay. If you add chief homeless services to that paragraph, there's such a long list of of of duties. Is this kind of a band-aid? Like we've got it's just a job description for for that position in general. But uh to answer your question, the short answer is yes. They by a band-aid I mean

we have a title wave of need and we have this limited cso with a list of a long a long list. Is it that we need a lot more csos but this is the best we can do with the budget we got? I think more the latter, but I also think with with adding this third U cso will allow us to maximize and and shore up the aspects that we're seeking to to coordinate more often with our HLLO officer. Okay. Thank you, Chief. Sure.

Council member Va Randy, this question is for you. So, on the same topic, just a real quick question. So, is this is just for a short a limited term position of one year? One year. Why do we do that? Why are we just not hiring or We're hoping um right now it's cost is salary savings and we're hoping that the other employee maybe will come back and if not then we could re-evaluate at the end of that period. Okay. Got it. Okay. Thank you. And then I have one other question. Okay. We have let's get on this issue. Oh, let's go to Jenny, Council Member McAdams. if it's on this issue. And if not, then we'll go to council McCarthy on this issue and then we'll move through the other comments people have.

Thank you, mayor. It's not on this issue. It's on another consent agenda item. All right, let's let's keep your your hand up. Um Brian, did you have something on this issue? All right. Uh Kathy, you had the floor. Do you have another on 10 G3? This is on the the um light in motion. Just wanted to ask so basically um the council just okays a sub lease but we can't dictate the type of business nor deny a valid subleaser because the leaser still assumes all the legal responsibilities of that initial agreement. Is that correct? Just want to make sure I understand that. That is that is correct. Okay. Thank you so much.

Okay. Let's go to Council McAdams. Thank you, Mayor. I um I just had a quick comment on 10 M1. Uh just a a thank you to the residents who um stepped up to serve as our um building division board of appeals. And then also, you know, as we're um starting off 2026, a a big thank you to all the commissioners um who have volunteered for this year and who have recently been appointed. All right. Thank you, Jenny. Let's go to Council McCarthy.

Thank you, Mayor. Uh 10 G4, which is the landscape professional contract. I I think I probably ought to just pull it. I guess I'd ask the city manager. There's is there anything extremely urgent here or timely? Um uh you know we can schedule it for February 3rd. Then I thought that there was some kind of deadline looming. Ishmael has been the lead on this. Funding needs to be spent. Uh there there's no funding deadline, but we do want to do an Earth Day um tree planting and we we So yeah, the sooner the better.

There's a lot of things that have to go into the planting and the prep u by Earth Day. So I don't know if you want me to make a couple brief comments, but Yeah, why don't we pull it? Okay. Okay. So maybe we'll get to it tonight, maybe we won't. Sounds good. All right. Any other consent agenda input before we entertain the motion? Does anyone want to make a motion? I'm happy to move for approval. Minus 10 G4 if that's okay. Minus 10 G4. Is that okay, Jenny? Absolutely. Okay. Second. All right. Do we have to roll call someone else? Council

member McAdams. Hi, Council Member McCarthy. Council member Biala. Yes. Mayor Tim Fisher. Yes. Mayor Dado. Yes.

All right. Thank you everyone. That passes unanimously with the five of us voting. And I lost my agenda. So there now we move on to uh Marina Station issue of the community facilities district the CFD and our city manager Lane Long will introduce our first the right word what's an adjective the Lusters are old are amazing

with a fresh new haircut and we have matching jackets. I know.

Um, uh, Karen Tedman has been our, uh, city's special attorney on on many of our redevelopment projects and our development projects going back 20 plus years. Um she was involved in the original formation of the development agreement with Creekide. Um and uh has more knowledge about this project than any any person. And uh this is the first step and she goes to the presentation of a community facilities district that is required by the development agreement and is u extremely beneficial to the city. We also have James Fabian here who has been our financial advisor and we've been working on this for uh probably a year now and we're um ready to make a proposal, start the process. So Karen,

yes, good evening. Um so I'm going to start this and then Jim Fabian is going to talk to you a little bit more. So, as your city manager indicated, we're here tonight to take the first step for the formation of a community facilities district for the Marina Station project. Um, do I have control of the slides with this? Oh, excellent. Well, that didn't do it. Oh, wrong way. There we go. Okay. So, by way of background, um, it Oh, I think I went one too many. Yes. Okay. So, the Marina Station project was originally approved by the city council in 2008. Um, at that time, you took a bunch of actions to approve the project, including certifying an environmental impact report. You adopted a specific plan. And there was a general plan amendment, um zoning ordinance amendment, tenative map design review and a development agreement. Um and the development agreement is important to this topic because it does contain some of the requirements with regard to the formation of the community facilities district. So the development agreement originally had a 18-year term to 2026. It was amended in 2022 to extend that term and we'll talk about that a little bit. Um so when the project was approved it was um endorsed by Landwatch. It was touted as um responsible city- centered growth and the traditional neighborhood development concept was um given great accolades. It was environmentally sustainable and it was considered a model of the future. Hopefully, we are

now at that future and we're gonna actually see some development. So, as I mentioned in 2022, um the city council approved an amendment to the development agreement. The amendment was um motivated by the fact that because of economic conditions um with the great recession and um some litigation around the project, the project had been unable to move forward initially. So um the developers requested an extension of the term and you agreed to an extension to March 2036. There was also a change in the developer. So, the original developer was CreekBridge. Um, CreekBridge pulled out of the project. The owner of the property brought in Third Millennium Partners and they are now the developer of the project. Um, you also approved some other changes that were beneficial to the city. um including that rather than the impact fees that the developer had to pay under the original development agreement, those were frozen at the 2008 level. Um the 2022 amendment increase those impact fees so the developer will pay impact fees that are in effect when they get their building permits. Um you also required an update to the fiscal neutrality study. Um the fiscal neutrality study was required originally for the project. It's part of your general plan that the project um be fiscally neutral to the city so that it pays for itself. Um and so as part of the 2022 amendment, you required an update to that fiscal neutrality study as a condition of approval of the final map. Um you did receive an updated fiscal neutrality study and we'll talk a

little bit more about that. Um and that was um received before the final map. Uh also the developer as part of the amendments is required to comply with your green building code. Now um and then there were some revisions made to parks but one of the revisions was that in addition to providing some parks, the developer is also paying some of the park impact fees. So this is just a graphic of the project showing you it's quite a significant project. Um uh you know the gray is more of the commercial and the rest of it is residential and you can see the parks and open space. So the project consists of 320 acres. Um the proposal the proposed project is 1360 residential units. Um 887 of those are planned to be single family and 473 are multifamily. 20% of the residential units are required to be affordable and we'll talk about that a little bit more. The project um did meet your general plan jobs housing balance requirements including 60,000 square ft of retail, 144,000 ft of office and 652,000 ft of industrial resulting in over a thousand jobs. There's also 19 acres of improved parks and additional open space as part of the project. So in the development agreement, the city has certain requirements. The developer is required to build the infrastructure necessary for the project. Um and some of the infrastructure like the roads will be

private roads um maintained by the homeowners association. But there are certain roadways that once they are built, the city will accept them and the city is responsible for maintaining those. And that's the list um there. The city is also responsible for maintaining um some of the parks once they are built. So those will be dedicated to the city as well and then it will be the city's responsibility to maintain. Um there's also a plan for a fire station and the city is responsible for operating that fire station and then the city's responsibilities include providing your basic municipal services. So as I mentioned the project is required to be fiscally neutral to the city and as part of the development agreement there was requirement for fiscal neutrality study. The development agreement is explicit that fiscal neutrality is dependent on the formation of the community facilities district to finance the maintenance costs of the publicly owned infrastructure. So that is a presumption behind the fiscal neutrality study is that this community facilities district would be formed. So the comm community facilities district um has two purposes. One is to provide funding for the construction of the infrastructure and then there's a service component that will provide funding to the city to maintain that infrastructure. And then as I mentioned the um homeowners association will also be maintaining some of the privately owned streets and some of the smaller park areas. And just finally on the project description. So, as I mentioned, the 20% of the residential units are required to be affordable. That's 272 units. The

development agreement requires that the affordable units um be dispersed amongst the income levels of very low, low, and moderate income. The council approved a below market rate housing agreement with the developer. Um as part of that agreement, 95 moderate income units will be for sale. And then the 95 low-income units and the 82 very low-income units will be rental units. Um, and the developer is working with affordable housing developers on moving forward with those units. And now I'm going to turn it over to Jim to talk about the CFD.

Thank you, Karen. Okay, so we're going to go quickly through the CFD formation process. Karen provided a great background on the uh development history of the Marina Station project and now we're focused on the actions required of the council to for consideration to form the CFD. As Lane mentioned, we have been working with the developer for about a year now. We actually approved the reimbursement agreement uh to cover all the costs of the CFD formation back on December 3rd of 2024. Uh it took a a a lot of effort uh by staff to work through all the costs associated with the development to make sure that we adequately had the funding required to maintain the infrastructure after it was built. And so that took a lot of uh uh effort to get to the point where we have uh really good numbers and we have built that into the uh rate of method of aortionment for the services side of things. Additionally, the city has received a petition from the property owner uh to form the CFD. Uh this petition includes uh consent and waiver forms for the the election process. So when we have our public hearing that is scheduled for March 3rd, we'll actually have the vote of the landowner at that point in time because of the waiver of the election requirements. Uh this CFD also will levy the special tax for not only the the services to maintain the infrastructure, but it also has a facility component that will be used to bond to pay for the reimbursement of infrastructure that the developer will build. Uh the uh unique thing about this CFD, a little bit different than your other CFD, the dunes, is that we are forming a improvement area number one right now.

Uh that has specific boundaries. It it contains about 352 residential units for phase 1 and two of the project. And then we're also designating future annexation areas uh that will as the project builds out and they get a more definite plan of development, they will actually uh come to you with a unanimous consent form and come in front of you to annex that property into the C CFD at a later point in time. Let me just go to the map here real quick. So this is the CFD boundary map. It it's mimics the map that Karen showed of the development. The the dark area is that uh future annexation area that will come back uh to the council at some point in time in the future. The lighter gray area is what what is called improvement area number one, the 352 homes for for phase one and two of the project. Okay. So, as I mentioned uh in in terms of the uh the rate and method of aortionment, we have uh identified the cost per residential unit. It ranges from $2,700 to $44.58 per unit for single family home. uh if we had uh to levy on developed property per acre uh it would be 44,000 or 70,841 per acre. Uh the property the in the CFD is broken into five different tax zones uh to provide more efficiency in the levy of the special tax in order to produce the revenue generated for the the services and the future uh facilities. uh the services special tax

will be uh increased every year based upon the construction cost index so that we can keep uh pace with inflation for maintenance and services costs. The facility special tax will be increased at 2% per year. Again, uh the uh fi the the infrastructure that will be financed is what we call the backbone infrastructure. It's the roads, it's the sidewalks, it's the parkways, it's the sewer, water, uh curb and gutter, uh traffic, uh landscaping medians, uh street street lights, uh entry signs, uh the typical type of infrastructure that you see for a project of this nature. Uh and then on the services side of things, uh we'll be able to use the services special tax to fund the parks, the parkway, the park lighting, sidewalks shown here, the the streets, and then the cost associated with the fire protection and fire suppression, the cost associated with the new fire station. Uh so tonight in your packet uh I should mention uh Vanessa Legbant of Straddling the city's bond council is with us tonight. She has prepared uh the petition that has been submitted to the city clerk uh signed by the property owner uh that uh starts the process of the CFD formation. She has approved the resolution of intention which really describes the steps involved with the CFD formation process showing the boundaries of improvement area one the future annexation area uh describing the rate and method of aortionment which is used to levy the special taxes each year and then that resolution also sets a public hearing for March 3rd.

Uh then we have the resolution declaring the intention to incur bond indebtedness. As I mentioned, this is different than the DUNE CFD where you have the DUNE CFD is just all services. This one has a facility component to it. So t sometime in the future, say uh two years from now when the project is starting to be built out, it's about 50% developed, the the developer will request CFD bond financing. And at that point in time, you would consider issuing CFD bonds and using the facility special tax to fund the cost of the debt service for those bonds to reimburse them for the infrastructure they built. Uh we have a not to exceed 7.6 million uh in the resolution. Uh this is determined factoring in the money we need for the services and then looking at what's left over uh for facilities. And that's a a pretty padded number. We we think it'll probably a bond issue for the 352 homes will probably be more in the $5 million range or at at the time in the future. Uh we don't know when that will be. And then as I mentioned uh in the future, uh the council will the developer will sign a unanimous consent form to annex property into the CFD. uh that approval will come back to the council for uh discussion and ratification. Karen had mentioned about the fisc neutrality aspect of this project that the CFD is a key component of that and each phase of the project uh the CFD needs to be in place to make make sure that that fiscal neutrality is achieved. Uh so tonight in front of you as I mentioned you have the resolution of intention. Uh that sets the March 3rd

date uh as our public hearing date. At that point in time uh anybody can discuss any issues they have associated with the formation of the CFD. Uh that public hearing if it if it goes well after that we would adopt the resolution establishing the CFD. We'd have the the call for the special election where the landowner would vote to approve the CFD. The city clerk would open the ballot at that point in time. We would have a resolution uh showing the results of the election. We'd have the first reading of the special tax ordinance and then we would approve the acquisition funding agreement which is used to acquire the infrastructure as it's built by the developer and becomes part of the city infrastructure. And then we'd also have a services funding agreement that would lay out how the services special tax would be used in the future. Uh to tonight is really the first step. The the CFD is not formed until that public hearing happens and there's the vote of the the property owner. We need a twothird uh election approval at that point in time. uh assuming the public hearing goes well, we'd we'd come back with the second reading of the special tax ordinance at the next meeting on March 17th and then the 30 days later the special tax ordinance would become effective. Uh again, Vanessa is here from Straddling. Uh Karen, myself, Jim Fabian, Susan Goodwin is our our special tax consultant. her firm has put together the rate and method of aortionment which really is the the the key document that talks about how the special tax works, how we determine what's needed for the services component and the facilities component. And with that, we'll open it up for any

questions that you might have. Thank you. Thank you, Jim and Karen and Vanessa. Thank you for being here. So let's now thank you for reminding me. Let's now go to public comment starting with folks in the room. If you wish to speak, please come up to the podium. Not seeing anyone rise. We'll go to remote. Jeffrey Markham, welcome.

Thank you, mayor. Thank you, staff, council members. I had a question regarding uh the fire station and and pardon me I'm I'm this is from memory but my recollection of the development agreement was that after phase 2 and before phase 3 began that there would be a determination of whether or not a fire station was needed and that would be something that the city and the developer would uh would do and it was not clear to me what the financing mechanism of that would be. So if we could get some clarification on that I would appreciate it. Thank you.

Great question, Jeff. Thank you. Anyone else online wishing to speak? Please raise your hand. We'll give you a moment.

All right, let's close public comment and uh get to Jeff's question. before phase three fire station determination. Can someone clarify that process?

Um the development agreement doesn't require um them building the fire station. Um that will be the city's responsibility. Um initially it talked about potential fire station on the site but as we've have done our long-term fire station study um identifying the locations a location in Marina Station would not be the right location longterm and we've talked about Vince Deaggio Park really is the is the long-term location and um that fire station um is built into our our um public safety impact fees But uh that will be funded by the general fund and public impact fees over time. And what is really happening is we aren't creating any new fire stations. The plan is um we have two fire stations right now. Longterm we only need two fire stations. We just need them in different locations. And so the long-term plan is um we have an existing station at Palm which is our headquarter station. We have another station out at the airport and when we build our new fire station uh which we'll be talking a little bit later in the in the committee vis uh in our next presentation um that will be somewhere in the California Avenue location next to um and so that will be the new headquarter station. The station of Palm will serve as our second station. The station at the at the airport will go away. Um and then at some point in the future, probably in the next five, six years, um we'll build the second fire station out at Vinc Majio Park and the Palm Station will close at that point and those station locations will serve long-term all the response times that we need in the city.

What the development uh agreement and this uh community facilities district does uh provide for is the operations of the fire station. The agreement requires up to $2.4 million will be funded and uh and the CFD will fund 50% of that cost. And so as the development is built out, when it's built out, it will be contributing $1.2 $2 million to the city's general fund for staffing either that Palm station if it's still there or the new fire station at Vince Deaggio Park.

Is that 2.4 million? Is that uh does that go up every year?

Uh uh double check that, Jim. Well, and I'm not quite sure about that particular amount, but the the services component that is in includes that fire contribution goes up by the construction cost index. So, it will escalate over time. whatever that amount of the construction cost index increase is each year, the special services special tax, which includes that 50% that the city manager just mentioned would go up. So post construction during operation, every year money comes in from this development to operate the fire station.

So when you say construction, I get confused. So will the will the contribution go up every year into the future? Yes, by the construction cost index which is is different than CPI because it's more uh attuned to the cost of materials, labor for maintenance. And so that's why we use it in the rate and method of aortionment versus just CPI. Is it normally in the ballpark of CPI or it can vary widely? I I don't really have an answer for you on that. All right. Um, so the fiscal neutrality study, first of all, have I seen it? Has it been sent to council?

Uh, yes. Uh, it was provided to council way back in, uh, June 2022 that could that be resent? Is it electronically? Yeah, we can we can resend it to council. My question on the fiscal neutrality is um that plus property taxes that generated from the people that will live there and the property owners, the multifamily, will those combined funds be enough to equal the costs of city services going to that neighborhood? Yes. what the um and Karen can come in and go more detail but uh like car

and I'm mostly concerned with uh recreation that we that we pay that we support residents with and uh police and fire.

Right. So the fiscal neutrality study what it does is it looks at all of your costs of serving this new neighborhood and then it looks at all of the revenues that would come in from the neighborhood. So that includes your property taxes. Um it includes potential sales tax revenue from the retail, all of that and compares those two and then determines whether the project is fiscally neutral. In this instance, you need the CFD to make it fiscally neutral because the property taxes are not sufficient to pay all of your service costs. So that includes recreation, everything.

That includes everything. So, it's a very detailed analysis of what it costs the si city to provide your full bundle of services to the new community that's being built. Is that any different than the CFD at the dunes or the CFD at Sea Haven? Um, it's not different. We didn't have the fiscal neutrality in their agreements the way that it is in this agreement. So, um, this was a particular provision of the Marina Station development agreement that is not in Sea Haven or the Dunes.

The So, the intent of the the older units, the older developments was to be fiscally neutral, but we didn't take that step. So, we kind of

we we did and we didn't. We did do fiscal a fiscal neutrality study for the dunes. Um, and we do have some provisions as you'll recall that it it the way the fiscal neutrality was handled was a little differently and that there's certain things that they're required to maintain and there are certain things you're required to maintain. Um, and then there was um a more general provision about the ability to use things like a CFD to manage the costs. Okay. So it wasn't quite as specific as it was. Um Marina Station followed the dunes. So we learned in the experience.

Okay. I can add one of what the fiscal neutrality study um the summary of it was. When the project is built out, taking in all the cost, taking in all the revenue, the city's going to be 1.7 million a year in the positive. And so it's more than going to be fiscally neutral. It's going to be 1.7 million positive additional revenue be coming into the city above the estimated cost. Okay. And my last question on this round, uh I was a little confused about the fire operations contribution. It was like 2.4 million, but only half of that came from one side of the fence.

Yeah. The what the what the agreement requires is they pay 50% of of the cost of $2.4 million. The CFD funds that and the other 50% is out of your general fund by the the general fund. Okay. So 1.2 million a year from the development CFD to operate the fire station a fire to through the fire program.

Correct. And essentially it it gets divided by the number of building units. And so um you take the 1.2 2 million divided by the total number of building units and and every year as they build say 100 units that proportion of the 1.2 million they start contributing to the general fund. So by the time that last building unit is built they are now contributing 1.2 million at that point. Okay. Thank you. Let's go to council member.

Thank you Mr. Mayor. So, um maybe well I'll see if it's Karen or Lane to answer this, but on uh page one in the report, it says um the the reservation of a parcel if needed for the development of a fire station. I know that we've just talked about um have the location would not be a feasible one by our estimation, but given this if it had been appropriate there, they they don't have to give us the land. We'd have to buy have bought the land at market price, I guess. I mean, it's not that they by this it sounds almost like we we were going to be provided that parcel, which would be a great deal for the city. So this was uh part of the original development agreement and um it was not that specific. Basically, it said the parties after the first phase was built, the parties, the city and the developer would meet and discuss the fire needs

and um and it this had to do with also development outside the urban growth boundary and that if that the developer could reserve a site within the prop project for a fire station. So it was not a definitive requirement in the development agreement. It was more of a negotiation as we see how the development proceeds. But they were not necessarily giving it to us by res parcel. Well, that it wasn't clear.

Okay. Well, now it's clear that we're now looking at a parcel that's owned by the city and so we might have missed a great opportunity, but I know it's it's it's too far north to service, which is really uh unfortunate if we could have had a exact that that parcel. Okay. Um

I I have a question. when we talked about um the um the fiscal neutrality the to the city assuming the community facility districts are formed to fund the costs and we talked about a public hearing on March 3rd and then there's a landowner vote the only CFD one that I recall was the dunes and there were basically only like four voters because the parcels were very large and I'm assuming this one and you're I Jim, you said assuming things go well and I'm going whoa, you know, the whole ne neutrality agreement depends on the formation of the CFD. So my thought is what happens if things don't go well? What what happens? And I kind of have to understand with that many how many voters would be participating in this?

We have one property owner. Okay. So So okay, well then right

pretty much things will go right. And really when you think about like the the history of this project, fiscal neutrality being really important for both parties, the development agreement being the the legacy document, and then now the CFD to implement the terms of the development agreement to maintain that fiscal neutrality, the property owner needs it, the city needs it, and that's why we're we're here tonight to start the process to to really institute the the CFD to allow the development to go forward. They're, you know, I drove by the project today. I mean, the the ver the ver vertical construction is going to start soon. Uh they anticipate that they're going to have models up in 2026. And so, we need to have the CFD in place before there are homeowners out there that have the ability to vote. And so this at this point in time, we have a land owner that owns all the property that has a vested interest in saying yes, let's do this CFD.

Okay. So there's really zero risk that things won't go well. Correct. But you as the city council ultimately have to approve approve the CFD too. Okay, great. Thank you so so much for that. All right, let's go to Mayor Pam Viser.

Thank you, Sam, and thank you both. Um, yes, I know there's no risk because there's only it's not really an election. I mean, let's be fair, but um, a few questions. Um, you you said, uh, Karen, you said you learned or we all learned from the process. So the dunes the the most recent phase that is the correct number I assume and the original phase is much lower but people the CFD annual fee annual tax is that still sufficient for the maintenance or maybe probably the city manager for the dunes. Yes, the phase one of the dunes.

Yeah, I I think both all the dunes different phases um there's sufficient revenue to cover because the newer phases it's quite a lot higher, right? It's higher because there's a lot more a lot more to maintain. Yes. Okay. Does Se Haven have a CFD? No, Caven does not. Yes. Okay. Just wanted to confirm that. How is the So those homeowners do not pay towards maintenance of the infrastructure. Correct. Once that project is built and once the city accepts that infrastructure at that point it becomes the city's responsibility.

Okay. It's just different for each development just to explain. Yes. Yes. um for the I probably need to ask Jim I think uh the range from 2761 to 4,458 per year for single family residents is that based on the lot size or the size of the home is square footage of the home the home. Okay.

Correct. And and the the way that that is determined is that they have estimated home prices. they want to maintain a certain uh effective tax rate for each one of those homes. And so that's how that uh amount was determined and I think we're looking at I think approximately 1.6% effective tax rate for each of the single family homes in the development. Okay. Because at the dunes it's just one fee per home. It's not No, no. I think it uh it remember here we not only have services but we have facilities. So it might slight it it does the bigger the home the more special taxes they pay

which brings me to my next question. Um will it be the same for the affordable homes? Is that also the same square footage calculation or do they get a break?

The affordable homes are exempted from completely exempt. Okay. That that makes me happy. Yeah. Thank you very much. Okay. because it's a couple hundred per month. So, thank you. Um, oh yeah, and then the net surplus. So, the homeowners are uh contributing to the general fund through their tax. Correct. Okay. Thank you. Just to make be open about it. Yes. Yes. And we'll definitely uh make that fiscal neutrality study available at the council. That will be very interesting. Thank you all. No, that was it. Thank you, Mr. And it functions like a tax, but it's a fee. Correct.

Correctly. And as as Jim talked about, it varies based on size of the home. The affordable units are exempt. And and actually it makes sense for the affordable units to be exempt because what you charge them is based on those those fees that CFD and HOA costs get built into it. And so, um, the more those costs are, the lower that they can sell the home for, and so it works for everyone. All right, let's go to Council Member McCarthy.

Thank you, Mayor. Um, thank you, Karen, for trying to distill something that's very complex into something that we can understand. Um, not sure you were totally successful, but I'm I'm trying over here. So, um, couple questions. one. Um, and this is a little bit of a weighted question, but is it fair to say that we're going to be talking about the CFD agreement for basically every year into perpetuity just like we do with our other CFDs? I mean, this is something where we're going to look back and say, why did we make these decisions and probably have a little bit of an argument every year? Um, yes, conceivably you're also, as Jim said, this as we annex territorian, this is going to be coming back to you each time.

So, you're going to see this regularly. Thank you. With regards to the roads, is this the first CFDM marina that kind of has that exact paradigm where it's like what I thought I heard was the CFD kind of owns the road, but kind of like how in East I believe it is in East Garrison where the CFD or the HOA kind of owns the road, but the city has some influence over the rules and the parking regulations. But

so the city's going to own the major roads, okay? and those are the ones that you're going to maintain and the CFD services portion is going to pay for that. Um, it's funny you should mention East Garrison because I think a lot of this was modeled after East Garrison. Um, there are some roads more internal within little subpocket neighborhoods that will be owned by the HOAs and the HOA will be responsible for maintaining those, but the city will own the major roads and those are were those like four or five roads that were listed in the beginning. Y. So everything outside of that though will be HOA owned or

um not everything but those are the roads in the development agreement that you were required to maintain. So I actually have to go back and look about whether there are some other roads that are going to be dedicated to you. Okay. Um I in the agreement I and I honestly didn't read the whole thing but is there some understanding of what influence the CD sorry the city has over those HOA roads? Um or can the HOA say we're we're doing whatever we want. We're painting it purple and if you don't you know live here you can't whatever right like

um so it's similar to our agreements in Sea Haven and the Dunes in that we have the city has the right and the requirement that we approve the um CCNRs that govern that HOA so that we can ensure that the maintenance is included in there. Um, I can't remember if we have a provision in this agreement that says that they can't amend those sections of the CCNRs without the city's consent. I would have to get back to you on that. Okay. But we definitely have to approve the CCNRs to make sure that it's covered.

So, I guess just a note to staff when those CCNRs come to us, I think it's worthy having that discussion. I'll try to remember as well, right? Because I think those things are important. It's created East Garrison some problems. Um, so if we can learn from those experiences, I think it would be um, valuable for us. Um, I'm going to go to the fire station for a little bit. Um, you mentioned that the original language of the agreement says that after phase two, we're going to have this discussion. Um, and it sounds like we're not doing that anymore, that we've kind of already made this decision. Um, does that require a change to the development agreement or um, we didn't?

Yeah, I think those were discussions back when we were uh, talking about that amendment to the to the development agreement a couple years ago. So, I think the question is in the future, do we have this discussion or is it moot? I I I think it it's moot at this point

and it's moot because we've decided or because the development agreement is different. So let's just hypothetically right in five years we decide nope actually fire station is absolutely appropriate for uh Marino station and and a and a partial that is provided whatever that means um are we we no longer have that ability to enforce that provision in the development agreement? Is that what we're saying? and and if so, what mechanism has created that lack of enforcement? Um, those are all really good questions and I don't have the answer. Okay.

I need to look at the first amendment a little more carefully and at the existing development agreement.

So, is one reality, Brian, you think that all the land is already spoken for, so there's no place any longer to put a fire station? No, I think my concern is is that as we know, there's a future agenda item tonight where we're going to talk about these facilities and the community has told us time and time again that to the extent that we can rely on the developer to help us through this process that the community wants us to do that. And it sounds like we're somehow not making the decision not to do that tonight. And I that's problematic for me. Um, and so I'd like to make sure for the record that we're not um tonight making some decision to prevent us from having that the right to have that discussion in the future. And I think we might be because there'll be no land available for a fire station if we approve everything tonight and it may be too late to change the land use plan. That's why I think important to have this discussion tonight.

Well, we are not changing the land use plan tonight at all. So if if we need to address an issue of you know a lack of clarity in the development agreement that would have to be a subsequent action because the CFD doesn't change the land use plan. So so Brian you have the floor but do you mind if I ask a question on this point? So Karen, I I think the council wants to know theoretically, could we require a piece of land in Marina Station to be a fire station or is that horse gone?

Um, well, the way the development agreement reads, theoretically you might be able to do that, but I don't want to give a definitive answer because I want to go back and look. If theoretically it's possible, but the land use plan already allocates a different use for all of the land, then we would have to amend the land use plan to squeeze in a fire station parcel. Um, I don't know that you would have to amend the land use plan. You might have to amend the map. Okay. All right. So,

and I think if I can have a fourback, I think there's um a site identified right in the in the I don't know if it's a specific plan or a land use map on along Delmani already, right? And that's identified site is still in whatever agreement I would assume. And land use map. I I'm not sure exactly what it's called, but I remember seeing that at one point. Yeah, I would have to pull up the the plan. The land use map. um the final map and um see if there's a site still identified. Still identified. Yeah. Because it might have been changed due to

Yes. I I don't know if there was a change made. I don't know what was originally identified. I'm trying to remember back. Um but I can't remember where it was specifically identified because there's no site specifically identified in the development agreement itself. It just says a site may be reserved if there's a need and the development agreement includes it may not be within the project site. So

okay so I'll wrap up my comments for now uh anyway to say two things. one um you know this issue of you know and I don't know the right words to say but ensuring that the developer contributes right to the development of our facilities is something we hear all the time and we get a lot of push back on um and even for developments that happened 20 years ago 30 years ago right so I don't want to make that same mistake tonight um and then the second piece is just regarding kind of HOAs and you know I think um this is maybe a broader statement, but I think the city might benefit from reaching out to all the HOAs that we have in the community or something and and kind of understanding how they're operated because based on what I know is that they're all very um disjointed and um they all have kind of their own understanding of what the city's interests are. Ask me how I know. I happen to live in one um who has the same provisions that say can't be done without the city but then they ask the city and then that they tell me that the city says no do whatever you want we don't care and then you know but here I am on the das as an elected official and I'm feeling something different and um so I think there's a huge opportunity there to kind of start to really add some clarity to that as we move forward and we have more and more HOAs in our city. Um, I'm a big fan, by the way. I think that they serve a great purpose and when managed well, um, they they do a lot of good for the community. So, yeah, those two points, I'd love to hear what the my colleagues think on the private.

Thank you, Mayor. Okay, before we move on, let's give the floor to our city attorney and then Sure. And um Karen can connect correct me if I'm wrong, but I think uh the action tonight doesn't affect one way or another the fire the fire station issue that was raised by council member McCarthy. Thank you, city manager Lane Long. I'm sorry.

Oh, maybe you didn't. Okay. The only thing I would add with that back in 2022 when we looked at this um the fire chief and as we complete our fire studies, they said that there's no way that we'd ever build a fire station there. If we build a fire station there, it would have to be a third fire station built in the city. And so we would incur an additional multi-million dollars a year and and we didn't need it. And that that was the problem. So I think in the original agreement they're saying, "Okay, we're building all this all this land out here that would need a fire station." So they kind of wanted to reserve it. But as they looked at it, fire chief said that there's no way that we' build it. And if we did build it there, it would service those communities, but we'd have to build another station in the core part of Marina to uh adequately meet the the response times in the core part of Marina.

All right. Thank you both. Let's go to Go ahead, R. Can I just respond to that just because it was kind of my comment. Um I I think where I'm challenged with that and I understand we've had studies and we've talked about this a lot. Um and we're talking about Vince Deagio that's on Delmani a fairly vast thoroughare of our our city and the border of Marina Station is just barely over half a mile away. Um, it's hard for me to imagine that that kind of distance on a major road makes that big big of a difference in response times, especially if you know it's going to save the city a tremendous amount of money. And so I guess that's not really a question, just a little bit of feedback. And I would love if it does come back to us to kind of understand that piece a little better.

And I think to understand that piece better, a review of the fire study would be the first place for us to go, right? and it might be 15 or 30 seconds more. And what does that mean to who would be part of the discussion?

Okay, let's go to council member or mayor Fisher who's been very patient. Yeah. Um, thank you and thank you for your questions, uh, Council Member McCarti, because I also think if we can still have the option of, uh, if we can have a site, if it's still in the plan, why not keep it in the plan for maybe future uh, building construction long after we're gone? But anyway, the city might expand even more in the far future. So, um, my question is also in general for all CFDs. Um, I've asked this before and I'll ask again again. How can the homeowners who pay into CFDs get a financial overview, a statement of the income and expenses? What is the procedure for that? Or can we set up a procedure for that by contacting the HOAs? you know, just provide it to the HOA management companies or the boards or to each homeowner, which would would not be very handy, but um yeah, every year sits down, he works through the budget. I think that will shift over to our new uh city engineer and and so I think we have some resources that can uh work and and provide that documentation. So, welcome to our the new project. Yeah, because I think it will be easiest to contact the Hway management companies and they can send it to the board and then everybody is out of you know this will be really transparent. So thank you. Yeah,

thank you Elizabeth. Council member Viala.

Thank you Mr. Mayor. So, initially when I brought up this issue of the the reservation of a parcel if needed language in the original agreement and I think we I think Karen said she was going to research that and I thank you for bringing in the idea that people are always questioning how much we have um uh we have sort of uh um made developers pay their fair share. or whatever. Now, it's very complicated because it seems like we have sort of committed to a fire station at the Vins Deamagio, but that's owned by us. And so, I I kind of feel conflicted about bringing this up. I can just feel the the um devout 3 3M just cringing at this conversation we're having now. Um, so but but I I do think that if if it's not and and the our fire study did say and you know that it's it's a little too far out there for the us to service all of the other uh areas. So I think that was probably the major motivation for having it not be at at uh the Marina station. But having said that, if in fact we find that there is language that they were willing to reserve a parcel and if that's legally uh something we were entitled to, maybe at this point we can ask to have a little bit more development money put into the CFD um or somehow arrangement u for us to get a a larger portion of the development of um our and the operation of our fire station. So maybe it's that kind of thing because I don't want us to be uh now challenging the feasibility

study for the new fire the fire station. So and and there's going to be a lot of um belly aching about us now adding something into the marina station development because of this thing. But if it if it were sort of in lie of uh actually having a parcel reserved on that property, maybe we can expect a little bit more of participation in the funding of the fire station operations or maintenance. Just an idea. But I'm a little bit anxious about opening up something that, you know, um uh may create a lot of ripple effects. uh because we've come quite uh you know a long way with the Marina station. They're already breaking ground and building. Um but it might be worth just a query and I think Karen is going to do that.

Okay. Since tonight the city attorney said that what we do has no impact on that, it sounds like we want staff to bring back to us an ability to discuss this. I also think that 1.2 2 million a year for the CFD forever. Um, it's going to work. It's going to outstrip whatever the cost of the fire station was. And I'm guessing when we talk about this, we might find out that that was the swap. You're not going to build a station. You are going to help 50% operate in perpetuity probably. But we'll find that out when we have a deeper discussion. Great. Okay. Thank you.

All right. Anything more, Kathy? All right. Thank you, Kathy. I wanted to get to the open space. Is Scott Waltz still here? Yeah. Uh Scott Waltz was involved with the Sierra Club that was involved with the open space planning. I see there's 83 acres and I think by reading and seeing the presentation tonight that it's true that the CFD will pay for costs associated with the habitat restoration area maintenance, etc. as part of the infrastructure. Is that true? I say that because the res the presentation said that it's going to pay for parkways and open space. And so I assume the 83 acres of habitat restoration open space and is going to be paid for. It's on page 13. Maintenance of easements or right ofway and open space.

Right. Let let us can we bring that back and discuss it on March 3rd to give you a definitive answer? We can have the special tax consultant address that issue. I I don't remember, Lane. I'm not sure if you remember from the the services budget whether there was anything specifically for open space maintenance. Um I I think the open space is more internally, but we'd have to we'll just have to double check. It says listed in exhibition B is maintenance of open space,

right? So, if that's what's listed in exhibit B and and then we can look back at the services budget to see if there was a a line item for that cost and get back get back to you on March 3rd. And the reason I bring it up, and I won't belabor it more than appropriate tonight, is because I've I've talked to the developer, and it's going to cost millions of dollars to do what the first version of the habitat restoration plan said would do. And I think that if we don't get uh experts to tell us it's doable, that it's not a waste of money, then I think that needs to be addressed sometime, not tonight, because we don't want to throw millions of dollars into something that experts would say that is not going to work. And basically I'm talking about using goats and lawnmowers and stuff like that to convert a weedy grassland into a native grassland and spend millions of dollars doing it when nobody in the world has been able to do that and many have tried. So I don't want to waste millions of dollars and find out it's a failure when we could say in advance that's not the best place to spend several millions of dollars. So, if we're going to spend the money, let's spend the money on something that we think will work well for open space. But anyway, I've already said too much. Okay. Uh, Michael, Katie, I understand that you're on the line. Uh, let's find you. You're not in the panelists. No, maybe you are in the panelist. I'll look at the attendees. So, let's get Michael to have the floor. Maybe he's attendee. Yeah, I just Oh, here we go. Welcome,

Michael. If you could let us know what you think on that. Hello. Can you hear me? Yes. Hello, Michael. We can hear you.

Hi, this is Michael Katy from Third Millennium Partners. Just want to clarify actually kind of a lot of things. Um, one in regards to the uh, Mayor Delgado, you're talking about the mitigation space. Uh, that is different than, uh, specific plan open space within the development and parks within the development. The CFT maintenance cost will cover all of the parks. The the mitigation property you're talking about with Mr. vaults in the Sierra Club. Uh all of those improvements in reveation are going to be paid by Third Millennium Partners and Third Millennium Partners will probably enter some sort of agreement with a third party land manager to hold it and then we will pay them an endowment to manage that property separately. Completely separate funding, completely separate entities. CFD is not involved. HOA is not involved. It's all funded through the developer actually doing the reveation and the developer then giving a third party who's going to hold the easement uh an endowment. So not associated with CFD.

Thank you for that clarification, Michael. So, I'll end that point saying that uh can I please can we please receive an electronic version of the most up-to-date habitat restoration plan because it was going to go through revisions the last time we heard last time we reviewed it and I just want to see if I believe you guys have it. It was approved by the Sierra Club and it was taken care of. So, I'm more than happy to provide it. Okay. Yeah. Last time we heard it, I we were told we'd get it back before final to check it for doability. So, if it's been approved without us having the chance to check it for dability, that's not what I remember the last time we had it in front of us. Okay. Um, last question. I'd like to go back to the fire station issue also.

Sure. Go ahead, Michael. I don't believe there's a designated fire station on the site and I think Mayor Doug Delgado, you're exactly right. Um, I think at one point in time, I don't even think it's in the DA to be perfectly honest with you. I think the obligation was when the city decided that they did not want one in that portion of the city that the condition was changed to us pay 50% of operational cost of the the serving um fire station. So that Okay, Michael, while we have you um are there four tag trails in your development?

There are. Are those considered parkways to be infrastructure to be maintained by the CFD? They are not. So, they're kind of like that mitigation land. They're separate from tonight. That's correct. It's not part of the CFD maintenance. Okay. Uh, this is a little bit off to the side, but I've heard a lot of folks, Michael, who live nearby Cells Court and Kaskky Drive, they want to know when they'll be able to access the little trail that's going to be right next to their development on the east side of the existing homes. I I Mayor Delgado, I don't know the answer to that.

Okay, we'll get back. when this feature made public right now everything is still owned by the developer in private so but it was certainly something we can talk about offline but I don't know if it's pertinent to the discussion tonight it is not thank you I'll follow up really appreciate you Michael

yeah but I I it is key that this gets approved tonight and I think it's also important to understand that this CFD maintenance budget has been negotiated for over a year to make sure that the city has the more than sufficient funds in their annual cost of uh inflation factors in there to make sure that it stays properly funded. And the CFD maintenance annual budget is that is not included in the 1 $1.7 million surplus. So it's a full maintenance budget plus uh surplus above beyond that. So I think it's important to understand that it is all very very adequately funded on the on the city's behalf. So,

we appreciate your your input, Michael. Thank you very much. Okay, let's go to Council. Actually, let me let me correct Sure. Go ahead, Michael. Let me correct that wrong. Uh my LD manager is telling me that we did include the the four tag uh trail within the rightway maintenance, which is included in the CFD maintenance number. So, it will be taken care of. Okay. Can can we get a map of where the trails are? I've seen tonight's and recent maps and I don't see the trails on it, so I don't know where the trails are. Yeah, the Can you follow up with that?

Yeah, I can follow up. I can get you a map. The map was approved by Scott and the Sierra Club about two years ago. Thanks again, Michael. Now, let's go to Council Member Riala.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh, so, Michael, thank you very much for the whole thing about the fire station. I I really appreciate now understanding how that all came about. Um I and Scott Waltz um were representing the Sierra Club when we worked on the mitigation plan and I just wanted to give a shout out because um we met uh at least two times if not more and we actually consulted you um Bruce on that as well um at one point. Um but I want to say that there were a lot of people in the room. Um, Michael, I I don't know if Dustin was there and and you, but uh, 3M was extraordinarily accommodating and um, so I just wanted to say that you devoted a lot of time and resources to that and I think we came up with a very good plan and um, I think I saw the final version but maybe I'm I'm incorrect but certainly it was done and it was done I think very well. So, thank you very much for your participation as 3M representatives,

council member Vial, I appreciate that Dustin and I were both in that room with Scott and yourself and I know uh we incorporated every comment that was provided to us. Yes, you did. Thank you very much. I think Mr. Waltz would confirm that. Thank you very much.

All right. Um I think we're we're done with our discussion. It looks to me. Does someone like to make a motion? a motion that we adopt the resolution before us of intention to establish the CFD at Marina Station and that we adopt the resolution before us declaring the intention to incur bonded indebtedness within the proposed improvement area number one of the proposed community facilities district at Marie Station. I'll second.

Okay. Any final comment before we vote? Yes. Uh, so let's do a roll call. Council member McCarthy, yes. Council member McAdams, about five minutes ago. Okay. Uh, Council Member Biala, yes. Mayor Patton Fischer, yes. Mayor Delvado,

yes. Thank you. That motion passes four to zero with those of us voting. And we move to the advisory committee uh regarding our facilities. Thank you, Vanessa. Jim, thank you. Thank you, Karen, as always. So, we'll we'll have to take a vote. Uh, unless you guys want to do it now. We're going to run up against 10 o'clock before we're done with this issue. You might as well handle it in advance. Uh we have this and the information that for uh city park and the pulled item uh for Earth Day. So does someone want to make a motion about how far to go tonight? I motion that we um finish item 13B and when it's finished, we decide whether we'll handle the last item, yes or no, tonight.

Okay. So, after 13B, we'll bring our heads back together, but we're we're okay to go past 10:00. Um that's the motion. I'll second it. All in uh let's get a roll. Let's see. Well, we don't need it now because we'll just sit here. All in favor? I I. All opposed. That motion passes 4 to zero with those of us present.

Thank you for being here. Do you want to explain? So, this is really a followup from the October or September meeting we have with the city council. He talked about um facilities and options moving forward and and one of the directions that the council gave and they approved subsequently was um we had previously had an agreement with the trip Smith but was to expand that agreement for them to provide um public educational and outreach services, a lot of community meetings on our potentially new city facilities and part of that was establishing the citizens advisory committee and uh trap Smith writer uh and his group would be responsible for facilitating um that um that whole group and so that is one part of the report but um and writer will go over that but the big picture is is we want to talk about the whole facilities plan and get some feedback from the council and writer will cover that in his presentation and and the end result is we're trying to get some direction from the council on how to move forward on some key issues on on ballot measure on funding on sites on on other things that that the council may have. Thank you, writer. Just some small stuff team. Uh honorable mayor, members of the council, always a pleasure to be back in the great city of Marina. Lovely to see you this evening. I have a PowerPoint deck with several slides to guide us through a conversation. I of course will welcome your questions throughout as I go through the process. Uh there's also a huge uh staff packet of available information. Uh all of which is summarized in a um a report. Uh I went back to my college days and tried to make the report as long as possible so I get an A+ on it, but effectively it uh

is very transparent everything that we covered in the course of our work with the citizen advisory committee. Uh let me also just pause and say thank you for having the courage to uh form a citizen advisory committee and ask them to go through a lot of this hard work. Uh and I also just want to thank those citizens that took the time to make that happen. Right? They gave uh three nights, two hours each night roughly a little bit more plus an extra bonus night on Zoom. So, it was a lot of uh conversations and discussion and for me personally like that's one of the things I love about the work I get to do is really helping residents engage in deep dive conversations and it just proves to you that even in the most difficult issues if you can just have conversations for a while you can make a lot of territory and close a lot of gaps that exist in our society. All right, enough of my diet tribe. So, these are the uh various items I would like to cover this evening uh as we walk through our agenda. Uh I will not read each one of those. Um essentially we formed the citizen facility advisory committee um at your direction uh to gain uh insights and analysis from their perspective on why measure you failed uh what their perceptions are of a city facility issues and needs. So I in some ways I would describe the group uh from one perspective as being a very long uh term uh focused group in some ways right so you can experiment with ideas and hear their take on it but on the other hand it was also an interesting discussion about um uh truly hearing their grassroots perspective on the challenges and issues we faced. We itemized the participants in the committee here. I will just note we ended up with 13 participants in the committee. uh we had 13 applicants and uh when we looked at it on the margin it made more sense to include more voices in the conversation than it did to exclude certain number of voices and get to a specific number and since our end goal is to try to achieve consensus uh although we ended up with a odd number of participants uh we were not particularly concerned with that as much as we took advantage of having the perspectives of the folks in the room

and finally I want to make sure I thank R&T architects uh and all the city staff the finance director Lane the city manager fire chief police chief who are all active the participants in this process because we want to give the residents direct access to experts from city hall and architectural firms to be able to answer um questions and kind of be in the moment. The um citizen facility advisory committee, pardon my notes here, uh we had four meetings between the 17th through the 22nd. That last meeting was on the 22nd where I presented all the draft content of the final report and sought their consent to the content. uh we did receive unanimous uh consent from committee members. Now what that means is in the room we had uh people express no objection to the conclusions that we were generally coming to and then when we did our zoom call we had no objections and I sent the final report out and said here's the totality of all the words. Um actually I sent a Google doc out and encouraged them all to participate and edit the Google doc if they had feedback or comments and they gave me those feedback that feedback. I integrated all and then gave the final report out and had essentially no comments other than saying endorsed or uh silence was also consent in this case because it was unanimous consent. Uh so I feel like we ended up with a work product here that nobody in the room objected to and and we came to agreement among 13 people rare in our society these days. We did actually begin the whole process in this very room uh on the very first night where we toured all the major city facilities. We s uh toured in here city hall the public safety buildings uh as part of the process to really gain a p make sure that our committee members had a full understanding of the impact of and the challenge that we were facing. I would probably say that was one of the most impactful hour uh that I think residents can have to understand the nature of the challenges we're facing with our city facilities. And I was very appreciative of the tour that uh Lane and the chief and the the two chiefs led us on through

that process. We also um reviewed uh revenue sources, general fund allocations. We had a nice presentation uh with uh financial information about the city from Tori as finance director. Uh and then ultimately we also evaluated five potential locations that have already been considered and presented previously to this city council. Uh this as I mentioned manifested in a report uh that's contained in your packet and which you've all been uh given access to. It's also been sent to all the committee members themselves. Um they uh had these various conclusions. There was many conclusions in the report that go into detail. I could speak to any one of them if you'd like. Uh but fundamentally these are the five uh biggies which were number one that the city facilities are long past their intended lifespan with a particular focus on this building we're in in the city hall building. public safety building was recognized as um having some seismic issues specific to public safety buildings but uh and probably in need of retrofit in the scheme of things. So could be repurposed but itself uh was not ideal for public safety services. There was a recommendation to build a joint police and fire facility at what was called California Avenue or Cypress Nolles location. a recommendation that city hall and council chambers be built at the reservation road site that is a property currently owned by the Monterey Selenus transit agency I believe uh and uh Vince Deaggio is a secondary backup option to that should that uh reservation road option not be available. Third, the committee had a pretty extensive discussion, benefited from legal uh uh council, city attorney uh firms, had a ballot measure expert who came and joined us and we discussed uh general taxes, special taxes, tax revenue options, and uh ultimately concluded on a conversation around a user utility tax, excuse me, the utility users tax. And after looking at some of

the numbers that were presented based upon analysis that uh Lane had previously uh had developed identified that a 7% utility users tax would generate about $3 million a year which would theoretically give us the capacity to bond about $49 million in revenue uh or in capacity which was roughly the estimate of the um previously provided cost estimates from R&T on the cost to build out the various facilities that were identified specific to a council chamber, city hall and a fire station and a police station. Uh and then the last point was um because it uh theoretically if there were a tax measure advanced uh that was a UT that measure um would be a general tax 50% plus one threshold as opposed to a special tax. It would be generally directed. It wouldn't it wouldn't be directed at specific project. Uh there'd be a secondary advisory vote available for residents to express their direction that this these funds should be used for these particular facilities. Um and actually that idea also came up and was surfaced by um special legal counsel uh in the course of the conversation that we had um as a community group. I will just note um in subsequent two in the committee was not the beneficiary of these particular renderings but because there was a particular interest in understanding options around Ben Deaggio versus reservation road architects who had previously put together some possible overlays of how buildings might situate on reservation road was also asked to put together some overlays of where we could potentially position an appropriately sized city council chamber and city hall facility at the Vince Deaggio location. uh I will very much want to defer to them and their expertise on on this particular subject, but this is one option that was considered. There's a second option to locate uh the city hall more towards the north side of the parking lot that is on uh at that location. And then a third option was to build a facility that's further up the hill uh a little more

detached from the um existing community building there and sits up on the hill a bit more. So that was the rough sizing of space for where you might otherwise see uh a facility uh located on Vince Deaggio for those three options. And then as I mentioned, reservation road was the uh primary suggested location for locating a new city hall facility. Uh this option presents, pardon me one second. So uh this option actually presents one concept which is locating city hall on the property which is really on the north third of the property and then the southern part actually does create an opportunity to do some sort of residential development there which might have some cost uh recruitment or a lowincome uh housing uh uh option development that could be located down on the reservation road property. And then another rendering option uh is this particular one which really gives you a sense of the amount of space that's available on that particular property and what might be located there in terms of a park facility or some other um uh some other option for that that pink area that's also identified as well. So it really gives you a sense of some of the spacing. I believe I'm sorry my vision is horrible but I think I might actually say police station on that particular one. Since since you bring up police station, I don't understand why there's a police station there at reservation road if it's going to go on California.

Yeah. So these were actually done these were renderings that were done even before the conversation with this committee. This was R&T work product that they had done previously when they were asked to look at all the options. So that was back in 2022 or 2024 I believe. So I'll defer to Lane on the exact timeline on that 22 or 2024

2024. Okay. And I I don't mean to introduce confusion on that much point as much as I believe there's desire to have some additional context for some of these sites and I just want to make sure we have these available to us in PowerPoint decks this evening as we present them. The committee itself didn't necessarily get access to these files were available because this work was done before the committee and we gave them all prior materials that were produced. The ones for Vince Deaggio were not available to them at the time because uh Vince Deagio was also not a primary site and they there were some questions that come up with it but it hadn't been pursued extensively. May I ask one question about the map? Okay. On the Vinstagio ones, is this um showing the fire station that we've been talking about?

Um is that what these two buildings on this? Yeah. Let me uh there's a magical go back button here. Okay. In my recollection,

that's correct. Okay. and and with the with roads for the fire station going out someplace on this Deli Boulevard. Yeah, but I mean on this thing it doesn't really show where the fire stations will be exiting. Right.

So, but it is the Yeah, I know. But on the site I see parking spaces. I just don't see the the road where the fire trucks will use to get to Delmonte. But anyway, I know that that's the fire station. Okay. Thank you. Yes, thank you for the question. Uh, and here was one additional rendering uh at Reservation Road for another possible layout. Again, this is all material that had been previously assembled and presented to council, but is included in this PowerPoint deck just for transparency and recollection purposes. Um, I'll just speak briefly to the tax uh that was identified or considered. Again, we talked about a number of options, but um it was noted that Marina is the only city that does not have a UUT currently. So, it was viewed as a viable pathway forward for a tax. Us are also not special taxes, which means they do not require a 66% threshold for adoption, but um rather are 50% plus one if they are not a special tax, meaning they're not directed. I could of course defer to your city attorney to clarify that further because I am not an attorney, but that's my general understanding. Can we just correct a little bit? There's there's I think three cities that don't have them like Delray Oaks and Carmel.

Oh, very well. Thank you. Yes. Uh that that I'll I'll correct my apologies on that. Yes. So, there are very few cities that have none at all. Uh we happen to be one of those cities. So, in terms of uh uh opportunity for a revenue stream that other cities currently take advantage of, which the city does not, this was one of the um better opportunities that existed compared to other cities. So um the this table of information was provided through uh I believe Kaiser Marston had done a prior study and given some numbers and data to Lane and this information was then presented to the committee as part of an analysis for where to source the associated uh revenue streams and what they could theoretically yield in bonding capacity. I will just note uh we've lost our bond experts here for the evening but fundamentally uh when interest rates go down your bonding capacity goes up with a given revenue stream given interest rates. So if interest rates dropped a couple percentage points you would even increase more bonding capacity with these existing revenue streams. That makes sense. All right. So uh and because of the nature of the projects that need to be built and the prior estimates that were provided by R&T on the estimate of cost for construction again only for a council chamber a city hall and a police and fire station um the total dollar amount of that range was estimated about 50 million allin uh the details are in the report and so uh we had to jump to a 7% UT to achieve the appropriate amount of financing to actually build the commitment. Fundamentally, this brings us to critical questions that uh are we're here to kind of discuss. Um having had the feedback from uh citizen committee on these particular issues and they explored it. These are the questions that we would like to um explore this evening with you as a city council to get your feedback on on how we um proceed on these particular um policy objectives. So um do we want to proceed with addressing facility needs? Can we identify the site where we'd like to

place these various facilities? Um can we identify a financing mechanism? And uh if we if there is direction on all these things, shall we proceed without reaching all of this to the community so we can continue to advance on a potential uh ballot measure question that they would face uh this November? Uh, speaking of which, just as a reminder, we also um are looking at an overall timeline for public outreach and engagement to achieve a ballot measure if this is ultimately where we go. This was part of a plan that was outlined by the city council. Um, the same night that we moved or that you moved to create the citizen advisory committee. So, we are now in the month of January receiving this report. We theoretically will start launching public information and outreach if if you so desire and direct this evening. Uh this will involve a series of postcard mailers, social media, press releases and information, dedicated web pages and websites explaining kind of all similar information that we've been conveying through the citizen advisory committee. Um this public information and education phase would continue on through February, March, April, May, which also includes a series of community meetings where we will get face to face with folks uh and talk with them about these very issues. And I would say lots of the conversation we've already worked through uh with our citizen advisory committee was immensely helpful I think in preparing for some of those potential future community meetings. Again we'll go to the next slide where um somewhere in the June July period we will wrap up that phase of education. you will adopt a budget. Uh and then in July there will be a a need to go through a whole series of efforts around um making that go no-go decision on a I should pause one second just note you have authorized the pursuit of a um survey tool to be done in the next few weeks if we so desire um to better inform this whole process as well. So, we will have a public sentiment polling on a ballot question as well as related issues for city

facilities. And then jumping back forward into July, you would face an opportunity to adopt a ballot resolution uh to move forward to then go to the November ballot. And at that point, we will be not in uh we will not meet advocacy mode. Just to be very clear, we will be in public information mode to explain what the measure would achieve uh how what how it will pay for the facilities and u being very transparent with the public about um the endgame of what the UT or other directed tax measure would achieve for addressing the community facility needs u in Marina. So want to make sure we include that timeline in there for your consideration this evening. I'll bring us back to this slide with these magical difficult meaty questions and of course be ready to answer any questions you have about the citizen advisory committee or anything else about the outreach process. Anything more you want to say before we go to public comment? I don't think so. Okay. Uh Lane, are you okay to go public?

Okay, let's go to public comment. When we come back, we'll start with uh Council Member McCarthy. So, anyone in the room who's been man of the year or woman of the year, please come forward. I'm stuck with this, aren't I? Uh, good evening, Mayor, council members, and staff. My name is Steve Lee, and I'm a resident of Marina. I was also honored to be a member of the citizens advisory committee. Uh I spoke briefly at the special meeting last September and encouraged the council to be bold in choosing a new site for the new city hall. I recall using the term civic pride in my comments. Marina has a chance to build something substantial that will impress residents and visitors alike. Uh as part of the advisory committee, I along with some others suggested that the Vincio site should be considered for the city hall and council chamber. This location is prominent on a slight rise. It is surrounded by landmark cypress trees that would be would be preserved and protected. The very topology of the site could be used for advantage by creating an inspiring campus with trees and open space overlooking Lock Pattern Park and the dunes beyond. There's plenty of room at Vincio to both construct the required buildings and leave open space. The existing community center could be retained, removed, or repurposed. The county courthouse is to the south with a library to the west making for an integrated civic center. Although not part of this study, it is expected that a new fire station will be built to serve the north of Marina somewhere on this property. This will involve grading and the development of vehicle access onto Delmmony Boulevard. Conversely, the reservation road location, which would need to be purchased from MST, is further from the center of Marina and hidden away, facing the blank wall of a strip mall. This may

be an easier site to develop, but it would seem to reinforce the impression of Marina as a town of strip malls. With great respect for the hardworking city staff, this would provide little in the way of downtown vitalization. Most likely, this will be empty and deserted after 5:00 p.m. on most days. If possible, this site should be de developed for mixed use, conforming to the downtown revitalization plan. Choosing the Vince Deaggio site would signal that Marina is a confident, forward-looking city, one committed to building a civic center that reflects our pride and our aspirations. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Steve. Anyone else in the room with comment at this time? We give you just a minute. just a moment and switch over to our remote audience. Okay, those of you on Zoom, if you'd like to raise your hand because you would like to speak, please do so. Let's go to Denise Turley. Welcome back, Denise.

Thank you. Um, I'm just glad that this is uh moving forward and um I'm still really confused as to what's repo proposed where and hopefully somewhere that there is an actual map of the city of Marina that shows are uh the choices being made and um that would be available hopefully on the city website. Um it's really difficult to find things on there by the way. Um so those are my comments for this for this evening. Thank you.

Thank you Denise. Let's go to Grace Silva Santella. And thank you, Grace, for your service on the citizens committee. Hi, mayor and council. You can hear me? Okay. Yes.

First, I want to thank my council representative, Jenny McAdams, for having reached out to me and suggested that I submit my name. I had not planned on it. Uh but I want to say that I found the time I spent on this committee. I really appreciated the time. I really appreciated that we were all given an opportunity to speak and to uh speak honestly. I was probably one of the most honest in the committee in sharing my views for why I had not supported measure U. And I was happy in the end of these committee meetings to support the unanimous um committee decision to recommend the reservation road site for the a future city hall and city council chambers. I want to share with you all, especially those who don't know my history with this city, that back in the late 90s when I served as the chair of the Marina Planning Commission, I worked with then uh economic development commissioner, chair Candy Meyers Owens, create a downtown uh revitalization committee. And we have been working since the '9s to create a downtown which is no longer called revitalization but revitalization which I think is a much more important change in that word. We have been working since the late '9s for a

downtown vitalization plan for Marina for central Marina. And I believe strongly that the 13 member committee that you uh appointed and allowed to speak with each other freely believed that a city hall and a council chambers at the reservation road site would be a critical important impetus to start moving forward with Central Marina's downtown revitalization and I truly hope that you will support that site as this the future city hall council chambers. Thank you very much for hearing my words.

Thank you very much, Grace. Let's go to Mike Mohler. Uh good evening, mayor and and council. Um I was also on the committee a as you know and um I I I do want to say that yeah even though the um Delmani Vince Deasio uh park location was a secondary. It was a lukewarm secondary. Um it was Mr. Lee's um suggestion and I think you know everybody just kind of said, "Yeah, sure. we need a second location, but it was pretty strong that reservation road and a downtown location uh was to should be a priority. So, I I hope you don't really take too much consideration as the Vince Deaggio Park as being um something that we seriously considered or put even close to reservation road because it it wasn't really close. Um I think we do need a downtown um city hall and uh I think it does need to go at that reservation roads site. Uh we spent a lot of time discussing it not only at the meeting but at home you know done a lot of research myself um in this matter and of course other things and uh Reservation Road is um is the spot. So um good luck in your decision. Thank you. Thank you very much, Mike, and thank you for serving on that committee. Anyone else like to speak, please raise your hand. We'll give you a moment to do that. Okay, we'll close public comment. Denise asked, um, it's kind of confusing what's proposed where, and so Denise, we do need to get you a map that's simple. I mean, that's clear. And uh basically

California Avenue is proposed for the police fire station number one. And then Deaggio Park and um reservation road are proposed potentially for the city hall including the council chambers and where the city hall staff work with a potential fire station number two there in the future which we talked about earlier. But if you don't have a clear map, definitely we need a clear map. Uh Lane, what is what steps are needed to get a a map with some stars on it for these? Yeah, we can do that very easily. We have our team in place to do that. Okay. All right. Any other questions, folks, that you noted that I didn't write down? Okay. Let's go to Council Member McCarthy.

Thank you, Mayor. Um, so I think where I start is first by thanking Treepy for working on this, for facilitating, for um, bringing together a diverse group of people that may not always agree and have different opinions and and and working through that process. So, thank you. Um, a couple questions. Um, I guess I'll start with the site selection because I know that's a hot button topic, but the it's interesting to me that the MST site, as I I will call it, is is favored and that's the only site that we don't own. Um, and you know, until the other day when I reached out to MST, it wasn't clear to me whether the property owners MST was even willing to um sell it to the city. So, I guess I'm curious, was cost um heavily discussed within the group? because again we don't own it. We would have to acquire it and and also just kind of the the mechanics of having to acquire that land.

Yeah. Um so R&T did a really good job of outlining four major criteria for each location and their pros and cons. And one of them you uh the lead architect there kept referring to as the meatball diagram of the various colors dots that indicate red, yellow, green on viability. uh and the reservation road site was green for uh ease of development and location and a couple other factors and the giant red dot had to do with the ownership issue. That was the real big question and that was discussed. They presented those trade-off issues. We did we identified a specific need as part of that financing package of having to spend upwards of $5 million in land acquisition acquisition costs. That was a rough back of the napkin guess uh from my recollection of the conversation. So, it was part of the conversation. Uh, and I, you know, the consensus in the room was we know there's additional costs there associated with acquiring that land, but if we can acquire it, um, that's the place we would like to see the investment go into the downtown. And I I think some of that may have to do with also that that that now doesn't mean we're disrupting the open space of Vaggio, right? So, it's not like we're trading off that. We're maintaining some open space there and getting this additional parcel. um that economic revitalization was a common thread of conversation among several committee members. Uh there was absolutely differing viewpoints about the merits of both. Um but if and we kind of did a rough uh hand count of the room so to speak on the final night of our in-person meeting and it was certainly a majority in favor of reservation road versus the other but at that point we're in consensus building. though we were also clear to acknowledge that Vince demagia was a backup particularly if MST couldn't come through because of property sale or some such thing like that.

Okay, thank you for that. So I think what I heard was on the back end there was a lot of discussion on land acquisition cost and stuff but in terms of the actual um body there wasn't a lot of discussion in terms of price or what was there the discussion uh the there was discussion that we will have additional land acquisition costs and so when we looked at the total financing package we knew it was going to increase the overall cost to build all the facilities including the additional land acquisition cost is my recollection of the conversation. Okay, similar question with this site uh Hillrest. Um the commercial building is included. Was there discussion or some mention similarly that there was an acquisition cost there?

Uh so there there was um there was a recognition that there's uh acquisition cost there and there was also concern about uh if we were doing anything that would require acquiring that and then booting vendors out. Frankly, there was a lot of concern that I heard from some people expressed about those are all very valuable businesses. cuz we don't want to be in the business of taking away tax basis local businesses and doing that. Um I think the thing that maybe shocked me the most in the course of the conversation when we cuz we spent a lot of time going through the conversation before we got to the brass tax of pick sites and for me the most surprising thing in that conversation was they the consensus wide consensus in the room was immediately ruling out any development on this site we're on right now or any of these facilities. um they they were ready to decamp to Cypress Nolles and Vince Deaggio Reservation Road and leave uh this area behind primarily because of logistics, commercial impacts, access road uh and a number of other factors that were raised that were interesting. That doesn't mean abandon, right? There was lots of desire to see repurpose of the public safety building, fixups on on the um the uh the community ser community facility across the parking lot here. Um, but there was also a consensus focus within the group of saying there are four core facilities that are critical to us and we don't want to see they didn't want to see mission creep and I think it was some of the feedback they had from the prior measure U was a lack of clarity on what was actually going to come out of the process.

Thank you. Um, and I'll just kind of trail onto that. So, it's interesting to me um Mr. uh Steve talked about um the Vince Damagio site and you know all of the things that were so beneficial about it and that you know the topology of the site could be used with great advantage and stunning views of the city. Hillrest. Um, plenty of room that, you know, you could have room for kind of some green space and, uh, different topology views um, on a single parcel blend. Hillrest to me, right? Bold views and vantage points of the dunes. Hillrest. Um, I mention that because I think that we often make decisions based off of the information that we're provided, right? Or that we can immediately see we look here and it's a dump, right? It's hard, so hard to imagine redevelopment on this site. Um, you look at Vince Tamagio and its green space, it's beautiful. It's beautiful as it is. So, it's super easy to imagine it continuing to be beautiful. Um, I, you know, and I've said this before, but I I continue to have concerns about the redevelopment of this area if we do, I'll use the word abandoned if we leave here. um as a city hall site. I mean, it's an area that desperately needs um some attention and um is not, you know, anybody that drives up Hillrest to attend our city hall starts to kind of look around and say, "Not sure where I'm at." kind of thing. Um so, those are kind of just my my personal views. Um I'm extremely open-minded. I'm glad to see the comments through the the committee. Um and I think that all of the sites are viable, quite frankly, and I think that we're lucky that we have some options here. Um, but I did want to make that comment about this site. I I I I continue to think it's has fantastic potential. Um, I think that the concerns about, you know, that if we were to acquire the commercial space, we would not necessarily have to kick out vendors. One, two, we're in a economic um

paradigm where we're told that commercial is a dime a dozen and they you can't possibly fill enough commercial, right? So the idea in theory, and I'm not an expert, but in theory, there's plenty of spaces to to operate businesses like this. It's not as if it's not like housing, right, where you you leave and there's there's nowhere to go because there's just not enough housing. At least that's what we're being told by developers. There's too much commercial. There's too much supply and commercial and not enough demand. Um I think I'll leave my comments there for now. One other comment just in terms of the committee itself. Do we envision a scenario where we can ask the committee questions later down the road about what they were thinking or is this kind of the report and we're we're done. Um I don't know if that's a question for council or for staff or chepy Smith if you have a

I have perspective if you would like my perspective. Uh in my prior experience with these these committee members have been deeply involved in lots of conversations. Should we have future community meetings? I'm confident they will have opinions they want to share at those meetings and they've are pretty passionate about this issue and I think they would be happy to answer additional questions. Um so like sometimes these community groups spark the ongoing community engagement from a grassroots perspective that really helps advance the conversation in a thoughtful and effective way based on facts and information and they've now been empowered with six hours of conversation that puts them in a good position to answer perspectives. That's why I kind of describe it as also a very big format focus group for us to contemplate.

Sure. Great. So, I'll just end by thanking those in the room and those on the online that were members of the committee for putting in the time and the work. Um, it's really valuable and means a lot. So, thank you. Thank you, Mayor. All right. Thank you, Brian. Let's go to Council Member Vialer. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And I'm gonna likely need more time, so the round robin. Um, first I want to ask um on so the the options that you had you showed for reservation road the council had seen those before. So they were done in maybe last year some I don't remember but the ones that you showed about Vince Deaggio those were not shown to the the citizens advisory committee.

Yeah they weren't available to us. That is correct. So, so here is what uh Council Member Mc McCarthy just said is that your decisions are dependent on the information you receive. And so if the committee is making a a a an opinion about sites for which one site they had no information, I think that that we have to restore that balance. So I was really appreciative that you had that piece in this in this one for the council. Um so I you know I think that you know it's really important and also the site here um we just assume that it presents a uh a a bigger challenge to move people out from a working space and and then build. But we I've never seen anything in writing about what that would look like. What is the plan? How would we move people to in what building and how long would that take, you know, in terms of building another facility for them? So, I think that that uh that we need more information, the council needs more information and I will would like to talk a little bit more filling in some information about the Vince Deaggio Park and I do have a map and and could you put those up for me? and I started thinking about um you know all the positives or the things that would would be relevant for the Vince dejo park. So if you could show the first slide please. Unfortunately the pointers don't work on the TV so I'm going to have to kind of wing it a little bit. Okay. Is there any way you can blow this up? I know that for Denise Turley, this

is at least two of the sites that were mentioned in the CAC report. So, the one in the red is Vince Deaggio. The one in the kind of yellow is the reservation road. And I want to just first say that this piece uh is the the is the correct um uh lot size because apparently in the packet um the consultants included the MST site. So that it looked like a triangle but that's that is not part of the site that we we could build on even though that is part of the MST um part. So the actual um square footage for the lock patent uh the um Vince deagio park is 200,000 square ft approximately and the Vince Deaggio is not 150,000 square ft as was represented in uh one of these reports it's it's closer to 95 and I think that that's you know that that is an important factor when you're looking at this lot the size lots I think that Um I think uh council member McCarthy already said one of the major issues is that we don't own the land and I don't know what time frame that is. I don't know whether we even have um any kind of guarantee whether that land can be owned by us. So I think that that even though it's one dot in a in a a string of five criteria, it's a major one. Um so I I I would like to put that piece in perspective. Um in terms of um the prominence of the sites um there's a distinct visible location close to Marina. If you look at the Vince Deaggio Park the um the uh um what

I consider the edge of our downtown is the reservation site. And when you think about um the way in which to access this site from let's say freeway one most people um there are local people who you know will uh find the ways to our civic centers etc. But for the most part people coming from the peninsula coming from the dunes or wherever they're going to access um highway 1. So, if you think of yourself as um coming from Highway One going to the Vince Damagio Park, you're going to end up uh going around the Lock Padden Park. You're going to make a left and you're going to see the back the other side of of Lock Padden Park. You're going to see our our courthouse. You're going to see the Loch Paden Park with the library, the beautiful library, the MLK statue, uh the oak woodland, and then you arrive at Vince Deagio. Okay. Now, if you see yourself coming to the reservation road, um you can see the huge patches of our strip malls. That's what people are going to be seeing. They come from Highway 1. They go past, you know, Lock Pad and Park. Then there's a long way. You can see all the gray spots there. We have a downtown that is literally filled with parking lots in the front of the buildings. The very thing that the downtown vitalization specific plan says once these properties are sold, you cannot have the parking lot in front of the buildings. That doesn't make a walkable downtown. And that will only change if if the owner wants to spend millions of dollars putting a building in the front of their parking lots or they sell it. And this kind of transition is going to be a very long time, especially if these businesses are

doing well and they have no incentive to comply with our downtown vitalization specific plan. So we will have a reservation site that backs up to a goodwill. In fact, can we go to the next slide, please? This is the um the approach to uh Vince Deaggio if if our city hall and our city offices were there. We've got uh this is the streetscape. There's no wires um overhead passing the park. Please go to the next slide. This is the approach to the reservation road. Next one, please. Here we have Goodwill and of course then we're on the back side of their pickup and then there right you can see the where would that the reservation site would be. Okay, next slide, next picture. This is the across the street from Vince Dejo as a civic center. We see Lock Padden Park. Again, there's no wires across the the um the the um road. Next slide, please. Here is across the street from reservation site. Uh you can see towards the right you see the McDonald's there. I I mean this is and and then of course the strip malls right there. So and and and this is what we welcome people to our civic center is this kind of of location. Can we go back to the first slide please? So, we know the growth in Marina is going to go to the north. We have 1360 more units coming in Marina Station. That's to the north. If you look where where where the um the reservation site is, you see the

beginning of the the green there, that is a huge section that is owned by by uh um Santa Cruz, right? UC Santa Cruz, they are not going to develop that. That means that the downtown essentially will stop there. We've got a lot of commercial going further down reservation towards Selenus. So what we have is now the center. I think that the Vinc Majio shows itself to be more central to Marina after all the development north of it. And we have a natural stop to the development in um on reservation road. And really only the people coming from Selenus would have to would would avoid all the strip mall parking lots that people coming from highway one would have to see if we put it on reservation road. Am I okay to keep going? I think that you know one sort of thinks about the contours of the land. The reservation land piece um is flat. It's absolutely flat. I mean so it's it's it's a simple way of building something else there because it's flat. There's no trees except sort of landscape ones that we could easily pull out. And you look at Vince Deaggio and we have shown now from the options that Ryder presented that those buildings can be situated on that piece with still a lot of open space to be had. And you I think this came after the um the citizens advisory committee, but there was assessment of the cost of of putting buildings on on the contours of uh Vince Deaggio Park versus the flat one in on Reservation Road. And

apparently, and it it's intuitively counter counterintuitive, but apparently the costs are going to be the same. So we cannot even say that the that the this the slope on on on Vince Deaggio is going to be cost prohibitive. In addition, we have to buy the land that is on reservation road. Okay. Yeah. This might be a good Okay, good. All right, let's go to Thank you very much. Well prepared information. Let's go to Mayor Prov. Thank you, Sar. She's going to talk about the reservation road site.

Yes, I'm so happy. Thank you, Ryder. And thank you to the advisory citizens advisory committee and um I you'll be no maybe not surprised I agree with everything in the report. I'm just so happy. I always thought that sorry Mr. Year of the Man of the Year. Um I've always thought that this location is wonderful. It it's right. It will do what we are trying to do. it will vitalize downtown and I know we cannot do it all at once and I know it's next to the Goodwill and I already thought oh maybe some of those businesses can make a back entrance and make that a second front and I mean there are options there are architects there are designers we need to look at it it's um you can design something with a square with uh something go higher up to give it the importance that we want we want to have make a beautiful building and um so yeah, I'm I'm very happy. I I agree with everything in the reports except for that second location. Sorry, I don't think Vince de Majio is a good location. It will be behind the uh courthouse. I don't think you want to have a fire station right next to your uh your uh what do we call it? civic uh civ I'm losing my words civic center your uh I don't think you want that with the fire trucks going in and out um so just oh um and as an MST board member I should have done my work better I guess I did I might have mentioned it but maybe not um it was discussed so this site is one of the surplus land sites for uh MSD and it they are they know that our city is interested in this site. I the staff city manager has is in

contact with them and your guess was pretty good. It's public information. Four to$5 million was kind of the um what they think it will be have they have to sell it of course for the appraised value. So um and that of course is a disadvantage for this site, but it also means that if we leave this current site, which I think is totally not good for our new city hall, um of course we can sell this over time. The problem is that the money will not come in until after you've constructed the new um city hall. That's the word I was looking for. So um um and also the uh MST site next to the transit exchange remember two years from now line 20 the bus between Selenas and Monteray will go every 15 minutes during the day. So every 50 minutes people can hop on the bus also in Marina from South Marina to here back and forth will be so much better connected and that was the interesting thing about you um council member Viala you went from the view from a car you know look if you go on Delmonte I'm thinking about walking if we walk downtown we walk from the city hall to any of the restaurants left and right of that new site if if we choose this site So I cannot express enough I guess how good I think this site will be and I'm so happy that the uh committee came to the same conclusion. I think this is Oh, just for the Cypress Null site for the uh fire station um and police station probably uh we need to look at probably moving that uh third avenue to align with Marina

Heights Drive to make one intersection. So just keep that in mind that uh that it might be moved. Okay. Oh, and the committee I thought they of course it will be so nice to to um discuss things with them and we can do that informally but also when we have community meetings which we will have they can be involved with explaining uh options to the public. I think that's it for now. Thank you.

All right. Thank you. Um, if I think of my neighbors or people living in Preston Park or apartment complexes or culde-sacs around town, I don't think they're very connected to the pros and cons of whether a civic comm city hall and um, council chambers goes here or there. And so I want to ask you if we didn't pick here or there, but put this on the ballot saying we're considering here or there, we'd like to let the people decide in the future here or there.

How much would that detract from people wanting to support a user utility tax? Yeah.

Or they gonna have a lot of other things on their mind like how much it's going to cost them. Uh well uh some of the survey research may help us actually deduce a better answer than my conjecture. I see uh a trade-off right on the one hand you'll have people who are um very excited about one spot or another and therefore they may vote yes or no based upon picking on spot. On the other hand, one of the things I heard very consistently from the committee members, I can't say it was all of them, but it was certainly a significant portion of them, and it's in the report, was a perception that the prior measure lacked so much detail that it felt like, and I'm going to use their word, so please don't, this is not me, I'm just reflecting a word. We were giving the council a blank check with no accountability for how it was going to be spent. And so their attit the perspective from a significant perspective that I heard in that group was we would like enough specificity to feel good about where this is what this is actually going to get us at the end of the day. Um and my understanding is measure you lacked some of those specifics and it caused a lot of people to have doubts about uh whether or not it was a good a good measure to to vote on. Um my general attitude on any ballot measure question is uh it wins because of two things. Do I perceive you have a need and do I trust you with more money? And um those two basics when I look at that are do like two of the city facilities. I think you'll quickly answer the first question of is there a need? The second one of do I trust you with the money is built up through a lot of things that we all do like transparency efforts and public education and community workshops and discussions. And um some of that might or be ailarated if there are very tangible specifics in in this. it may be enough that it's tangible to just say we will build a facility at one of these two sites to be determined. Um the framework for that determination might be helpful to identify. Uh on the other hand, it may not be enough or we risk galvanizing a particular cohort against a particular site for whatever reason they may motiv, you know, may be motivated by. For example, I'm just going to make this is just a

possibility. It could be that the houses that are on the back side of um Vince Deaggio, and this is not me advocating against Vince Deaggio because my only job is to convey what the committee has, but they there's some portion of the neighborhood may object to it because they'll have to go put up with construction noise for two years. And so suddenly they rally against that particular site, whereas reservation may or may not have opposition because it's in a commercial zone. That's not me advocating for Vince Stag. I'm just pointing out the nuances of the politics of how these things play out in a ballot question. Do you think we have enough time for the public at large to weigh in on the two sites?

I think we would going through a series of public conversations and some of these meetings. We anticipate we'll probably hear more definition about that, but by the time June rolls around, if we're going to commit to a particular site, um we're going to have to have that figured out by then by the time we put a ballot measure together. you know, that's a nuance that frankly we need to discuss with the city attorney as well because we also need to make sure that our UT remains a general tax and not a specific tax. So there's some nuances to that that we have to consider here in our approach and strategy. Uh theoretically the tax could be very general but the advisory vote would be very specific. It is only advisory and I don't I don't know if city attorney if you'd like to comment on that the nature of that nuance of an advisory vote versus tax vote. So that that information would that we're talking about in terms of sites would go into the advisory measure. Uh it wouldn't be part of the UT itself because that is a general tax to be spent on you know it would go into the general fund. Okay, that question took a bit of time so I'll save my other two financial questions for my next attempt here. Uh let's go to council member Biala. Thank you. So, I just wanted to go uh and talk a little bit more. Could I I'm sorry. Could I have that map again? Sorry. Okay. So, I want to emphasize one thing with the um uh you know, with the sites again. Uh the the the the street frontage of the res of the um Vincio is very large. Look at it. If you come down Delonte, it is about 500 ft. If you look at the site uh of Reservation Road, it it is about 270 ft. So that's all you have. You have a long uh you know long uh piece of land behind the frontage, but you could miss your your civic

center because you're driving along and you only have 270 ft from the street side to see what is in the front. And of course then you're facing a lot of strip malls. So I see that as a really big issue and accessibility by public transportation. Yes, there you definitely have a big thing. But we have the MST site on DelMonte the the site for transit. Yes, there's more bus lines coming into one spot, but my goodness, we're going to have a beautiful um Delmoni station surf um bus stop and we can always have another bus stop in front of the the uh civic center in Vince Deaggio because somewhere along Delmonti Road, it goes it funnels anyway into two lanes. that funneling lane can be a place that's not disturbing, you know, the flow of traffic and it could be another bus stop. And I'm sure the MST if we put a a uh a uh CI civic center there, you know, there they will gladly put another bus stop there, especially if the road can accommodate it, which it can. So there are I I'm very I'm very um in favor of the Vince Damage, but I would also consider any other site. I really think that it's a mistake on reservation road. If we wanted to hide our civic center, we hide it by strip malls at the edge of our downtown and it's not going to vitalize our main part of downtown, our central part of Delmonte and reservation. It's actually closer Vince Deaggio and on top of that with all the new development going north of it. So I I just have some real concerns about that. U and I want to ask you uh writer if how many people

supported the um the Vince deio dur during the CAC? How many people supported that? Like I said we took maybe an informal hand raise. I would say three or four were in favor of that as a location versus the reservation road for the rest of the room.

And this is coming at the third session and coming after no information is provided about Vince Deanio. So I want you to be kind of uh tempering um what you you are saying about the actual committee um and and I would love to be able to talk to those folks, you know. I mean, um, basically the council didn't have a chance to talk to anybody because you were engaged with them, and that's great, but but I would love to have that opportunity. When you say that people would like to know about the site before they went to a bond measure in that committee, that's what they said they would have said, but 60% of Marina were okay in in a measure U bond measure. So that it tells me that the committee was not so representative of what the general community in Marina thought without knowing the site. They in fact did pretty miraculous vote. The consultants were surprised that we got so high a majority for a a property tax at this time and age. So I think you know we have to really kind of modulate um what we say now that we are considering now that this council has the ability to consider much more than even what was presented at the CAC at the um uh citizen advisory committee. Um let me see that's pretty much it for me. Um, I don't know how we're going to go about doing this. Um, I think that I'm not I'm not satisfied to say that the majority of people on CAC uh didn't support the Vince Deaggio Park because there was no information when it was brought up by

Mr. Lee there. So, I I just feel that uh we have to be careful in in making those conclusions um without adequate information for the different sites. And I think that we've already sort of at least it seems like we've sort of settled on Vince Deaggio um for the new fire fire station and that means that we're already developing that site and I think that uh you know the land obviously can support it. The land also isn't going to cost us an arm and a leg uh compared to the reservation site. So, I think it deserves a lot more attention. It deserves a lot more conversation and the public should be availing themselves as well as the council on that information. So, thank you.

All right. Thank you very much, Kathy. Let's go to Council Member McCarthy.

Thank you, Mayor. Um, I could talk about this all night, but I won't. I I just want to recommend that maybe we wrap this up. Uh, I clearly we're not going to choose a site tonight. Um, I think there's some great discussion. I think this should come back to us. I but I'm hearing two two kind of general direction questions. One is are we still moving forward with the UUT? I'm not going to answer that for everybody, but I think I'm kind of hearing some consensus there. Um and then two, I mean just kind of receiving some of the information from the committee and and the opportunity to answer some brief questions of of Treepy Smith. Um and I think we've done that. So, um, that would be my recommendation if we and then, yeah, if we do that, I have some suggestions on the agenda order going forward, too.

All right. Thank you, Brian. Let me ask a couple quick questions and we can get to wrap this item up. Uh, the UUT is a really important piece of this whole committee effort. Um, and I want to confirm that $21 is accurate to be the amount people will pay per month if the UUT passed at 7%. Um, and I think you probably heard from the committee some uh cons some some question that they want that confirmed. Has there been effort to confirm that or modify it?

Uh, yes, I did reach uh out to Kaiser Marston and and they updated these numbers as of late um like July August 2025. U they won't have any more utility numbers until 2026. So the latest data they have is correct. Um, what this data is based on is they take actual revenue collected from all of our neighboring cities in the P peninsula that they collect from UUT tax and they and then they compare it to what the rates are and and um and they they factor in jobs and some other things, but it it's a very accurate number and they compare our demographics and based on those average numbers at 7% that's what the average household would pay. Now, somebody in a larger house has larger us. It it's very easy. They take their electric bill and water bill and and some people could definitely high have higher than than the average here. But this number here represents what it would be for the average user marina. That includes people in in rental units and things like that. So, homeowners would definitely be more.

Okay. Um, is every utility tax in different cities of Monterey County the same in the utilities that are included or does each city get to choose which utilities are within the UUT? Yes, you have the ability to decide which utilities are included. Um, what they looked at was everyone had electric power and I believe almost everyone had uh telecommunications and um I'm not positive about garbage,

right? Yeah, garbage is the one that I want to know about, but also I want to know if we know which ones are going to be included to be able to say it's 21 average. Are we assuming that's going to be, you know, A through D and therefore U Debbie Kern said is $21 based on A through D and not E garbage for instance. Yeah, we can get that detail back to you.

Okay. Um, and then the total needed is 43 million. We're we're we need to raise 43 million plus some contingency up to 50 million to make sure because of rising prices and that kind of thing. And my question is very simple. Does that 43 million include the 6.5? Is it after the 6.5 Preston Park contribution or is it 43 million minus the 6.5 Preston Park contribution? You'll have to remind me what the president remind total that we need right in this report and is that because we're already considering 6.5 million coming from Preston Park

or is it that it's a a 36.5 million need when you think about the 6.5 coming from Preston Park? Uh yeah, that's a great question. So you can answer that. Yeah, thank you. Oh, granted, thank God. When when those numbers were initially drafted, um we did not have the council um approval on the we were still working through the 13 million versus the 6.5. So, as of this point, the 6.5 was not included, okay, in those numbers.

So, theoretically, we could reduce 43 million needed to 36.5 needed because we've already agreed to send 6.5 from Preston Park. If we did that, theoretically, we could go from 7% UUT to 6% UUT. If we did that, would it make a difference in the success of a UUT? Generally, on the margin, it can make a difference. It could be the difference that puts us over the edge from 49 to 51% on a particular tax. Polling data could suggest this with the FM3 authorized survey research. So, that could absolutely help. And I think even more so is the threshold of staying below being the most expensive UUT or the highest UT rate in the Mterrey Bay area. And some of that also is a question of which of those particular utilities are being taxed, which has a obviously has an impact on how much revenue is going to be raised. So there's a lot of factors in there. Kaiser Mars has to be very specific on which utilities. I tried to assume we were going to be taxing all of it, right? Just to be assume the worst case scenario of having to track tax everything. But I didn't run the models. That's a Kaiser bursted number, but it can I mean tax number go down, vote number go up. That's a kind of a fundamental principle. Uh as long as um as long as you know you have confidence, you can achieve the objective because there has to be high confidence that the numbers actually work out and people feel like yeah, this will get the job done. We're not going to, you know, fall short by 5 million and suddenly we don't get the thing we thought we were going to get.

Okay. Lastly, senior discount. Did the committee consider senior discount? There was a conversation about trying to find ways to ameliate impact on certain communities and whether or not those will be some options we could present. It was a discussion point that was a consideration and it is a common element I see uh in some of these measures where you can legally do it. Okay. So, was there any analysis? Hey, we've got 10,000 seniors that's going to bring our Okay. Uh to be clear, all the UT analysis came from Kaiser Marston. I I did not have that on my plate, so I'll have to defer to land on that. Yeah. and they did not do that breakdown.

Okay. Does the city manager have any indication if if that's a big hit or a minor hit, if we have a senior discount or not? Uh, I'd have to ask Kaiser Mar.

Okay. So, in the motion that we give tonight, I think it might be worthwhile to ask for some more information about senior discount, some more information about Preston Park, some more information about 6% 7%, what difference would it make? And some pros and cons analysis of Vince Deaggio Park Reservation Road ADA. um the fact that the committee didn't have any materials on Vince Deaggio Park. So why would more than four people select Vistagio Park if it wasn't even considered? There were no maps, no no real information about Vince Deaggio Park before they said let's do reservation. And then after they saw a lot of reservation stuff and voted for reservation, it was thrown in, hey, how about Vince Deaggio? And three or four people said, yeah, Vince Deaggio with no information. So after information, we don't know what public or that committee or this council would think, but so far we don't have we have a dirt, we have a lack of information on Vincio Park, but I do think getting fire engines in and out of the park. I don't know, you know, with the sirens running if that's good for the city hall here. It's like you don't hear it because we're it's going the other way. You don't hear it much here for some reason. Uh Mark, why don't we hear more fire sirens here since we're so close to fire?

Well, the siren is very directional, right? So, you're right. A lot of times this station is kind of heading that direction or that direction. There's not a lot of residential or call volume on this side of city hall. So, you're not going to hear that a lot. You may hear them going down Delani to get on the highway. Okay. All right. What do you think, Mark? Just kidding. But I hope you do weigh in in the future. You know, we we got to hear from fire how Yeah. how appropriate those two sites compare. Okay. Um let's go to Mayor Pet Fisher.

Thank you. I also had the question about exemptions for seniors or low income, which makes more sense. Yes. to me now then because there are a lot of elderly people who who can afford to pay. Yes. And um one more practical question. How does it work to um charge people for uh their like their if they have Netflix? Does Netflix report this or how does it work? I I you wouldn't know if they had Netflix. No, I hope not. I hope that people don't have to disclose. I mean PTD and and and water I can understand. You mean streaming services? Yes. So how do streaming services get

uh streaming actually in the last 10 years more and more EUS have been updated to include streaming services and partly what's been happening is you typically were taxing cable services as people are cutting the cord on cable public agencies are making up for it by including streaming services as part of the EU. So how do they know to be made? If she has Netflix, how do we know? I don't know the magic. It's Netflix. They know everything about us, right? That's true. This is a scary part. Okay. Silly question. Okay. Thank you. Yeah.

Council member uh let's go to Council Member McCarthy. I'll try to be super brief. So, I I was under the impression I thought there were some court cases where internet can't be taxed with UT and Netflix. I thought was not able. Am I are you familiar with any of that or I'm familiar with federal tax I'm familiar with federal tax policy that doesn't tax internet services but I am also previously did some consulting work with a firm that specialized in helping update UTS to be inclusive of cable casting services. So my last example of this unless it was overturned in the last couple years was the city of Pasadena adopted a modified UT that was taxing cablecast services as part of their tax basis.

Okay. So, good. Another thing probably to have staff check up on, um, and staff's going to hate me for saying this, but one thing maybe council hasn't thought of is I think technically we can choose different tax rates for different utilities, right? We could say that the more discretionary, the cable, right, is charged at 8 or 9%, but the electric and the gas is 5%. Right? Like, so lot of different options there. I think there's some complexity in asking the city to do that. Um, but certainly something that could could be discussed. Brian, do you think that other cities have done that? If I could type in AI quick enough, I'd probably have an answer. I don't know. Um, I believe Monterey actually has variability and they're different. We want staff to

And actually, so while I'm asking, what are the optics of that, right? if if if we told on on the ballot like hey we're we're taxing the discretionary stuff higher but your basic needs are lower like is that something that sways voters or polling data would better indicate that assuming we can get to that nuance of question you I think to me the risk risk return there is confusion over complexity of the ballot question versus simplicity of just knowing what the number is so I think that's perhaps more of a trade-off question that I would be more concerned with is introduc introducing confusion Having said that, if we view streaming services more optional in life and therefore assuming they're even taxable, we tax those at a slightly higher rate, maybe that's just more politically palable there, but I could get why that that would potentially sell.

Okay. And then lastly, um I'll bounce back to the facilities discussion. I think it's interesting. Just something I was thinking about as we were sitting here uh with regard to the the commercial building. You know, I've heard this big concern that there's the potential dis to displace businesses. that building was for sale five or 10 years ago. I guarantee you that's going to likely displace those businesses. Once it's for sale, having the city own it is a great opportunity to ensure that those businesses aren't displaced. You know, the future will tell the story of what happens there. But I just kind of wanted to throw that out on the table. Thank you, mayor. I'm sorry, which building are we talking about? The Asia Market building which believes in Yeah.

If Okay, thank you. Let's go to Coun Vala and maybe have the last word and you can get a motion going. Yeah. Uh just this is very minor but you mentioned that that on the Vince Deaggio it would be behind the courthouse. I see it if I look at the map it's side by it's right next to the courthouse. So I I'm not sure how you're interpreting that the civic center there would be behind the the I I don't recall saying I don't recall saying it was me saying that. So, and I I always look from downtown. Oh, so and it's the same remember when we had the discussion about maybe uh lock pattern. I said it will be behind the library. We had that discussion about that. Okay.

I always looked from downtown and I looked walking or biking not from the car coming from highway one. Yeah. It's for marina for us.

And and I do want to say on the transport though, how many people are going to really bike to a civic center? Like if if you think about all of our visitors, how many would actually be coming to to our civic centers um from other places, you know, all the developers, all the people that visit our centers and stuff. I just I just want to keep it like just because we we you know, we we we foresee it. And it's not that this site would not have transportation. We have the m the the surf line right there. We can build it. So anyway, I'm just you and I are gonna watch both of us and what we say. Anyway, um and we're friends, so that's even better. Yes. So, um

I love to see friends fight.

Yes. Yes. It's healthy. So I also want to say that above, you know, with the UUT tax that we we focus not so much on, you know, because I I I thought that was a great idea, you know, about charging different, but it but again, we if we wanted to have it simple and standardized, we take the the average of all of them and that's what it is. To me, the thing that I want to be fairest about is people who can't afford it this that so it it doesn't mean seniors. there there are many wealthy seniors in town. So I wouldn't want to just do those kinds of but I'm most concerned with the people who can't afford it. So it it's income based. If we can just have one ex exemption I think that we would hit the heart of what we're struggling with as a council and it would be simple. So that's all I want to say. Thank you.

Okay. Would someone like to build that motion? Council member McCarthy, I'll start by building a motion that we receive a report about the city facility citizen advisory committee and we're providing direction to staff to bring back some information on the UUT. Um I guess this is the hard part where we start building some some specific questions, but um I think one we heard well let me start with facilities. We asked staff to bring back information on facilities that includes and I'm sorry I'm guess I need help here. What are some of the questions?

Um pros and cons of instagio versus reservation. Yes. Um and clarification on uh confirming 7% equals $21. Yes. and give us some information about why that is some evidence. Both of those should be writing us down. Yeah. 7%. Where's Guido? And about Yeah. About potential discounts. Exemptions. Yeah. Sorry. Exemptions.

And Brian, if you agree with Kathy, I think you can put in this motion that we we look for an income based discount. But if you disagree and think a senior or something else should know, and I think that's the best practice. I think that's what other cities do is if you qualify for care you get keeping it simple in that way. So bring back information that you're saying regards income based discount uh confirming 6% versus 7% $41.

Yeah. If we got six and a half million coming from Preston Park, maybe we don't need 7% because we don't need 43 million. You might you So, so I guess it's What do you want to say about 6% or 7%? If you want to say anything in this motion, do you want them to give us feedback on if it makes a difference? You want to or just go with 7%. If I could just say I think the thing we were trying to get clarity on is just um is that money like clarifying Tori's comments on that to make sure that's right and how that models into the actual UT and if it can get to 6%. The secondary question is to know the difference probably requires FM3 to do ask a survey question and try to segregate that and see how much momentum there is shifting the vote where which is a common thing to say well if you won't give the X would you at least do Y and see if you can pick up 3 to 5% on or not on that. on the polling question.

So, so the thought is we'll have Tori come back uh and it's it's not just the 6.5 but um as we've now finished the audit, we can come back with um where we are on available fund balance and an allocated fund balance and give you an idea of better idea of what funds are available. So right now I have the seven the ensuring that the percentage that we're asking for equates to the end dollar amount that we are saying that it's going to be

um do we want to have any discussion on utilities included? I mean is that too early for that or are we just assuming we're going to do everything that's potentially taxable? Are we going to exclude anything? Why don't you uh say what you think should be in the motion? I think that we should probably include everything that is is taxable. I think it makes it easy and clean. Um so whatever it is 76 it goes to everything, right? So then we just leave it out. Okay. And so you want to include the uh the um scenario of this um affordability. Yes. income income based.

If you qualify for an income based program for that utility, then you are exempted. Yes. Well, well, we'll look at Yeah. No, we'll look at different things. Reduce cost all the way down to exemption. So, at least we get a idea of the impact. Okay. Because it might be if you qualify for care with that utility, you get a you get an exemption on all utilities because you're in that group. Maybe. Right. Keeping it simple. Doesn't uh Green Waste offer like a senior rate or something, but not necessarily an income rate, right? Oh, they do have an income rate. Okay. I

I think we grandfathered in senior rates for for green green waste. Wasn't new people, but existing people. So, yeah, I'm not going to go I'm not going to go there. I mean, unless anybody wants to. I'd like to second it, but did you include the site thing? Yes. The pros and cons of both the reservation and then the machio. Great.

Okay. So, we have a second and then new Brian wants to be clear. So, we're going to ask you to duel this again in just a minute. Um, the the utilities included, whether they include garbage or not, and exactly which ones are included. What does staff recommend? What does staff want to do to answer that question in case we want to put that in the motion?

Uh I don't think there's there's a lot we need to do on our end. I mean the motion is cover all utilities. We'll just verify with Kaiser Marston that the numbers they put here included all those utilities. Um so we'll come back at least with a breakdown of all the utilities that they included in their numbers specific. don't include garbage. Then we have another discussion where they're to add them in. Correct. Okay. So, Brian, could you now that you've kind of built it, can you read through it again? I

I'll read through it, but first I just want to make a comment about the garbage. Um, my opinion is is that, you know, we offer three tiers of garbage, right? That garbage is something unlike electricity and and gas that you can kind of control if you really work hard at it, right? You can get the smaller one that is almost half the price of the larger one if if you want to conserve, right, your garbage, if you will. and and therefore you pay a much lower tax inherently because it's based off of the price of the commodity or the service. So but the motion was um to receive the report um ask staff to ensure that the 7% or the percentage mentioned in the report equals kind of the end dollar amount out of uh the consumer's pocket. Um so basically check that math. Um look into potential discounts with incomebased program discounts. Um, so you or UUT exemptions based on income based program discounts. Um, and then come back with some of the pros and cons of both the Vince Deaggio and reservation site based off the conversation you heard tonight regarding those two sites. Okay. So on that for now, does the second hold?

Yes. Uh, Ryan is okay we go to Prom? Yes. Okay. Uh, Prom Fischer, thank you. Just an extra question that I came up with now. How does it work for tenants or when tenants have streaming services? How do they get mean multif family or they're renting a house or renting a house and they they have streaming services because this will come on the property tax? No.

Bills. Oh, this is separate. This was added to each bill. Okay. Thank you. Yes. On that thought, the multif family apartments, some utilities are covered by the owner and some utilities and it varies are covered by the individual tenants. So, it's kind of a saving mechanism if I live in an a multif family housing where the owner pays for water. So, I'm not going to pay uut on my water bill because I don't have a water bill. So there's a little bit of equity built in for lower income folks who tend to be lower income in apartments. Not across the board, but on average multif family have less income than single family homeowners. So I is it true that there's a little bit of equity there because the average apartment o uh uh tenant has less utilities than the average homeowner. Yeah, I think that's a fair statement that typically your partner owner's utilities are lower.

Yeah. Okay. I just want to just a thought. Thank you, Brian. Um, any further discussion before we come to a vote? I think before I vote yes on this, I just want to say that I've always been the one that has been against the UUT because I do believe it is a regressive tax. I still have those a lot of those feelings, but I think we're in a position where we have to make some tough decisions. And because of that, I'm, you know, ready to move forward and support it. So, okay. Thank you, Brian. We don't need a roll call for this. So, all in favor, please say I. I.

All oppose, please say no. All right. Thanks again to the citizens committee. You really helped to drive this. And so we're at that point to decide whether uh to do 13C, which is the Dunes City Park, and to do the pulled consent agenda item. We could schedule a special meeting. We could wait till February 1st. I'd like to make a motion to table those. Okay. Because we they're not timesensitive or anything if we put put it to February 3rd. So, I've been involved with 10 G4 uh with Ishmael, and it's super timesensitive because there's so much that has to happen.

Which one is that now? It's the uh Earth Day tree. Oh, yeah. And I don't know if Ishmael just wants to have an amount not to see exceed 25,000 from the inloo slush fund and to turn it over to the tree committee. Is that the plan? That is correct. Then maybe we just come to a quick Let's do that. Yeah, let's do that. And then then I

have to journ. My brain is fried. So basically, Ishmael, we want to take money that we already have in hand that's for this purpose, give it to a consultant to work with the tree committee to plant some trees and other things on Earth Day somewhere in town, and the tree committee and that consultant will help us decide where and how.

That that is correct. We would have one Earth Day project uh large Earth Day project uh and by by large I mean um visible uh not not might only be four or six trees but uh one project that's going to really enhance a a site and then there'll be ongoing projects throughout the year. Um uh and and some of the things we're looking at are shoulders, uh walkways, trees and medians. Um the reason a landscape architect is need is because we need the irrigation designed. Um so yeah, so optional locations and stuff will go through the tree committee and we'll hear about it. This just lets Ismael go with the consultant who he's already met with twice

and the tree committee. Okay. So, I'll motion that uh we So, may maybe since I pulled it, could I have a Yes. crack at the um so a couple concerns of mine. I had reached out to a tree committer committee member that said they weren't aware of this at all, like that this hadn't gone through them and that they were confused. So, I'm a little confused. I'm hearing on one hand that it has been through tree committee and on another that it hasn't. Um it hasn't gone to the tree committee. Okay. has gone to Ishmael the consultant and I just to see that it's a sounds like a good idea and he's saying let's take it through the street committee. They haven't heard about it because he's they're gonna hear about it.

Right. No decisions been made just Yeah. Are we thinking about any particular sites in terms of

So So because we're pressed for time the site that we are looking at right now is Vince Deagio right in front of the building in between the building and the parking lot. Okay. There's a there's a huge area there that's just been overgrown with weeds. Uh I sent staff in there to clear out the weeds. So, it's looking a little more bare. We're assessing the irrigation to see how much of it needs to be rehabbed. And the landscape architect will help us plant uh good trees, carbon sequestering trees, um things that work well here and the irrigation. And that'll be the that would be the Earth Day project. everything. Assuming the tree committee agrees with this location, they may have another location. Other other areas we're looking at is right across the the drive here. Right outside these windows is a beautiful natural uh habitat area. Want to do the same thing on the other side of uh the street here next to the playground in in front of the um cell tower there.

So, copy paste what's outside this window on the other side of the street. So, so, so there would there would be a lot of um possibilities um because of the four tag trail and the amount of trees they're removing and what they paid into this fund. We're we're we're looking at a very significant amount. Before Allison retired, she said that amount would be 100 about $115,000 once um uh once all monies are received. So this is something that could fund tree planting and medians uh which helps us get median beautifification starter especially on Im in between uh like California and the highway. Um we we could fix the irrigation, plant some trees and then use local monies for shrubs and we have a ton of mulch already. So um we would really be able to stretch these dollars far.

Okay. So, here's where I'm at. Um, first I can just looking at the mayor, I can see his passion and so I'm ready to support this to get it moving and um I think that um if anybody is good at these kind of things, it's it's our mayor and has a vision. Um but I have a lot of concerns. I think that our tree committee is long um been due for some code review, for some real workshop, some real questions about what our goals are, what our morals are, what we seek to achieve in the city of Marina with our tree ordinance. Um I'm very concerned that what it sounds like is that there's a number of trees that were removed from commercial properties and that we are kind of taking this cash in loo and putting those trees somewhere else other than the property in which that they were removed from. And I don't think that that was the intent of those that created the original tree ordinance back in whenever it was um 80s, 90s. I think um you know, I've I've seen over the last 10 years some trees removed not only from big projects, but little projects that never went back into those parcels. And um I think that's more than we can bite off tonight. Um but I want to share that with the council that I just don't think we're moving in the right direction with our tree ordinance. And you know, in talking to some of the tree committee members, I feel like they feel like they're a little bit powerless that even they don't see things maybe moving in the direction that they want. And so I think as a council and a tree committee, we really need to decide is it worth kind of opening that book of the the tree committee code and really deciding what we want to achieve or not. Um, and I would say yes. And I see the mayor shaking his head yes. So I'm going to leave it at that. I'm ready to support it after further comments. Yeah, it's just uh we have some degraded existing properties that should look nice and they look awful and Ishmael just came out of the blue and said, "What can we do to put more trees on Earth Day somewhere?" If you think of the the access to the high school, we

just let it go to not good. It's, you know, so there's a lot of places that need to be revitalized and there's some places that may be new and a lot of this tree money is coming from Tory Pines and Eucalyptus where they were thick off Parkway. It's like that's a that's a double bon. We get our cake to eat it too. Take out trees we don't want. Get money in this program to put trees where we want them and and upgrade, you know, sorry places like the high school and Vince Deaggio Park. It's it's a travesty that they look as bad as they do. So, he's taken the initiative to upgrade some of these sites and pass this one Earth Day project. It's going to be the tree committee to say, "Hey, we got all these sites. Let's prioritize where we're going to fix up first, whether it's there or high school." Gives them something to do that is really inspiring, but they should be going after the bigger picture of ordinance and vision, too, especially if they want to. I think there are two different tracks that we're talking about that are both needed. All right. Did Did you make the motion?

Uh yeah. I am um I will move to approve um the resolution authorizing the professional services agreement with amount not to exceed $25,000 and authorize the city manager to execute the agreement and authorize the finance director to make the necessary accounting entries. Okay. And I'll second and we're going to go to council Riala. Oh no. I I wait for Tam Fisher.

Um just as an addition to the if it's your concern that trees have been removed and they are not being replaced where they were. It's it's often the project there's no space like the MST the fifth street station lots of trees had to be removed but they cannot be replanted there or part and you know some will be replanted there but there's no space for all. So I'm totally in favor of looking at other locations for those. And um also one of my pet peeves um maybe somebody one day can take the time to go through the tree removal permits and check whether they have been replaced because I can tell you there's a few that I am aware of that never were replaced by a developer. But anyway, so um but that's a side note. Trees are so important. So, and the integrity of that money is to put trees where they're supposed to go. So, if we know of locations that it didn't happen the way it was supposed to, we have money to address those situations like you're talking about and like Brian is talking about. That's what the money is for.

Yes. So, that's where the tree committee can come in and say, let's put it where Brian and Elizabeth and staff have found it never happened. Yes. So, and I wouldn't spend too much money on planting trees on this site because hopefully in 10 15 years the community center will be rife. So, I wouldn't invest in too too many big large trees here. But, but definitely something for the shorter term and who knows it might be 50 years from now they might still be here. We don't know. So, thank you for this initiative. Thank you. Okay. Anything more Brian?

Yeah, if I could just make a suggestion or clarification. This was consent, so we don't need to go to public, right? But I think on the last item, we failed. Even though it wasn't a we didn't make a decision, can we just re if we did fail, can we reopen and just get any last minute feedback? The last one was a UT public first. Okay, Steve. Okay, it's late. Thank you. Yeah, it's late. Okay, all in favor of the motion, please say I. I. Oppose, please say no. Okay. And I think the thing was that we were gonna pass on the park and Lisa was here. But so everyone okay passing on the Dune City Park? Yes.

Yes. And I would like to apologize to people who stayed on thinking that we might get to it because my motion earlier. Okay. Thank you. And we don't want a special meeting for that. We want to wait till February 1st third. Yeah. It's going to take some time to get get that information.

Okay. I want to say a special thank you to staff. you were here during the earlier initial public comment and um you didn't have to be. I think it was okay if you weren't. You decided that to be here and I appreciate that you made that decision because it wasn't wasn't you know it wasn't necessarily easy and you you knew that and you came anyway. So thank you. All right, we are adjourned in honor of Steve Williams who was an incredible man of Marina