Arts in Public Places Advisory Board - Regular Meeting

We will call the meeting to order. We have board members, Tim Foley, Andy Wright, and Stephanie Hauser here. So we have a quorum. We are missing Jasmine and Anna. Is there any public comment not on the agenda?

All right. Then we will move on to business approval of minutes from the 12/18/2025 APP meeting.

I move that the board approve the minutes from the 12/18/2025 APP meeting. I second that motion.

The motion was made by Tim Foley, seconded by Andy. To approve the minutes. All in favor? Yes. Approved by everyone present. Move on to the Homestead Interpretive Signage Project Update and Overview.

I think you could probably just switch your chair up if you want, or stay right there. It's fine.

Stephanie, do you

want me to preface why Leslie is here? Or is that clear enough?

So an introduction, probably just for the

word of

name and

I mean, know why she's here.

I'm Leslie Buckland. I'm the Assistant Public Information Officer for Los Alamos County. And I am the project manager for the Homestead Interpretive Signage Project, as well as kind of the project manager over signage. So, I'm here today to give you quick rundown overview update of what is going on with the homestead interpretive signage project so you know kind of where we're at in the project, what's coming, order of operations, placement, that sort of a thing. So first, I wanted to make sure you all know just a brief history.

We've had two versions of Homestead sign kind of, you know, really, really old version that was kind of rolled in with a historical walking tour that was also a very ancient version. When we updated the the historical walking tour sign, not this current time, but the previous time, we broke out Homestead, Llano, and the county worked with Homesteader families as part of a settlement that Llano had to interpret the Homestead era as part of kind of some legacy work following the Manhattan Project era. And so we had a huge event. We launched 17 signs around town. Landell had a couple signs down by the Romero Cabin.

We had a big homestead event, and that was the homestead tour. And so we had a brochure that went with that. It was a driving tour. And then over the years, the inevitable happened, which is at this altitude, the signs just don't last very long. But the other thing is that there were a lot of lessons learned that came from that project.

So lesson learned number one is that Lantel really wanted to focus more on having a digital presence and learned through their agreement that their digital presence and the history and the storytelling they're doing on their website is enough. And so they were happy to relinquish the responsibilities of the interpretive signage back to us fully as opposed to in partnership. The other thing is that we learned that people aren't really overly thrilled with taking a driving tour across Los Alamos Mesas to random places. And so we those brochures were just not being picked up. And so we we don't haven't been printing those or putting those out there.

Lindsay, can I interrupt you?

Yes, please.

Can I know there was some question when we were meeting with the working group about where those brochures were being Yes? Given out.

Sure. I will tell yeah. So the history so we have 22 kiosks across town that there's actually one in the art center, and they're all over the place. 22 of them. Several at Lionel, and they hold there's one in the lobby if you wanna see what it looks like on your way out. They hold eight brochures, and they have a map that tells, like, where you are. And so we would put the brochures that are strategic for certain things, certain locations in those. And the homestead brochures just didn't move. They just never ever moved. So we we tried putting them in different places.

We tried handing them out by hand to say, hey, try the homestead tour. And just it was not a popular People were not they were interested in the information, I think, but I don't think they like the idea of taking a driving tour. So they weren't taking the brochures even though really it's just good information. So we pulled those and stopped making those and prioritized some other things. So and just for comparison so you can understand how we were, like, pulling the information and making the decision not just based on the fact that they weren't moving quickly, but other things as well.

Last year, I think I ordered 500 homestead brochures in, like, 2021, and we never gave them all out. And last year, we gave out over 30,000 Oppenheimer film location tours. So it's not about tours. The second largest publication we hand out is the walking tour, historical walking tour. So it's not about tours.

It's about that particular topic. So we when the signs kind of died and I I want to tell you the other thing that we learned, lesson learned from the placement of the signs, is we had each family had their own, all 17 of them. And then we had them in different locations. And then one of the things they thought would be kind of fun at the time is if, you know, I I should the project managers at the time, which were it was kind of a committee outside of the county. They they really wanted the signs to be placed in a way that you were looking at where the cabin was.

So I don't know how many of you remember the four that were over by the Romero Cabin. They were about this big, they would you know, they're for the sake of the recording, they're a little bit more than eight and a half by 11 in size, and they were all facing totally different directions. And so it was very confusing for people who would come across four of them and did not understand, not to mention some of them would be turned all the way around because basic cabin would be facing this way. And then they were not ADA compliant because you couldn't see it if you were in a wheelchair because it was faced away from the sidewalk. So we kind of learned, yeah, that that didn't wasn't as cool and neat and as fun as people as as the original committee thought it might be because there just wasn't enough context for them understand the intention behind that.

And also having so many individual signs was also not necessarily cost effective and also a bit confusing for folks. So pulled most of the tour. There's a handful left that are still in pretty decent shape because of where they're located. There are a couple outside the golf course pro shop that are in the shade most of the time. They are they almost never see the sun, and they still look pretty good.

So they haven't been pulled yet. But we're gonna pull the whole tour. And we will so the new goal is, in approaching this, new the update is to take what we've learned into account. We'll probably make a better digital presence

where you

can find the information. You can get answers to your questions. You find it with a QR code, that sort of a thing. If we do any sort of a publication, it will likely be a RAC card similar to what we have for White Rock interpretive information. But the signs themselves, we're gonna narrow down to four signs.

And so these four signs are going to be it'll be one for up at Quaggae Mesa Trail, which is in Manhattan Project National Historical Park asset. It's also there at the I don't know if you all know where that is. It is North Mesa. It is on the Far East Side of Femerville, for those who know what Femerville is, just south of the stables over by the tennis courts and the play lot and the little community garden there. There's a trailhead, Kwa'i Meehaw Mesa Trailhead, and then there's a series of interpretive signs for the Lantel Manhattan Project Trail.

So it's a good complement to that area, and that one would be likely it's gonna be like lifestyle information about what it meant to be a homesteader on the Mesa because you'll see some of those elements on that trail address just some things that are not duplicated in Mapper's science. I mean, we we want and and excuse me. Mapper is the short term for Manhattan Project National Historical Park because it's a mouthful. So Matt Berlantl did those signs together, and we will obviously take we'll we're gonna make sure we're not duplicating efforts. So it'll be a unique story there.

Then we will have one over that's kind of, you know, where the posse shack is on North Road. We're right near the entrance to the stables across from the RV Park storage. On that corner there, it's kinda 90 degree torn quarter. There is a homestead cabin there. There's also a homestead cabin in the stables. And so we're gonna have a sign up there by the more visible one that will talk about those two cabins and living on North Mesa and some of the families in that area. And then we're going to have one, we'll have two downtown by the Romero Cabin. So one will be about the Romero Cabin and the, Ashley Pond Cabin because you can't go see

it because it's behind lanel fences.

It's part of the tour that, you know, some people get to take, but most people don't. So we'll talk a little bit about those two cabins. And then the second one, we'll talk about the rest of the families, and we'll likely have a map that shows, like, where did the homesteaders live on the Mesa kind of a thing. So those are the four interpretive signs we're looking at. They will look like, match, complement the current historical walking tour signs.

The intention moving forward is that all of our signage will match. It will be branded. It it's branded not only with our branding as Los Alamos County, but also with New Mexico True branding. It complements both. And it a lot of them work for the National Park Service as far as complementing those as well.

So we won't we're just gonna use the same template we have for the historical walking tour that we installed last spring. And so the same colors, they'll just it'll say homestead to or I don't know what it's gonna say yet. I haven't decided. But but it'll indicate it's about homestead instead of historical walking tour. We have to remember just as a reminder to you all in the the new updated historical walking tour, there are 22 signs. We did include some storytelling signs. There's one about Ashley Pond. There's one about Manhattan Project. There's one about Fuller Lodge. There's one about the five eras of history.

And I feel like there's one more. Anyway, those all you know, couple of those, they they all I think all of them mention the homestead area, but but a couple of them directly address it. So we're again, we don't want all this repetitive information out there, and we also don't wanna drown ourselves in signs. So we're gonna make sure that these are very straight to the point, clean, match the other signage, complement the other signage, and and then they'll be placed over there near the Romero Cabin. The timeline for this is, right now, we are in the process.

We have, three of us working on it. Owen Felton, who works with, tourism, and I will be kind of narrowing down all the information we have. We pulled all the old signs and the old brochure information, and we're gonna narrow down these the signs are about 18 by 24. So there's and they have four photos on them, And so they're limited in language. We want that.

We want them to complement all the others that are the same. And so we will be narrowing down the information we have and trying to come to the conclusion of what's the most important information. And and then we have one I have one staff member working on pulling historical images from the archives, and I have one staff member working on creating templates. So we are hoping to aim for having these signs done and sent to the printer in April sometime so that we can get them in and get them installed. And, I mean, I I late spring or early summer, but we are a little bit at the mercy of parks availability.

So I don't wanna make any promises about when they'll be installed, but it is only four signs, thankfully, and not the 22 we had for the walking tour. So it's a little better. So the thing that I think I want to point out, so, you know, why does this matter to you as the APP board? There's going to be a lot of content that we can't include. We're going from 17 signs and two huge lanel signs to four smaller signs.

That's an opportunity for telling a story through art. There is also we're trying really hard to be era respectful when we with all of these signs, they all have historical images unless we're telling a story that leads up to today. So you'll see, like, on the Ashley Pond Park storytelling sign, it has pictures from the day, you know, when they started digging it out all the way up through today since we're telling the story of that park. But for the most part, the whole historical walking tour is historical photos. They're they're era photos.

And so we do wanna honor those eras. And so, you know, if if APPB decided to do something to tell a homestead era story, I would highly recommend being really honoring the era and and, you know, making sure that you're not telling it in a way that has so much tells a modern story of it or something. I I don't know how to explain it, but that's that's up to you all. I just want you to know that our vision for our interpretive signage is to honor the stories that we're telling and honor the histories and really have an accurate nod to those histories. And so we are making sure that if we continue to build on those stories that we're keeping that that's what I'm looking for, that intention behind it.

So I think that that is it. Do you have any questions for me?

I feel that was very comprehensive.

Oh, good.

Good. Okay. Alright. Well, I mean, that's that's the scoop. It's not it's not overly complicated. I will add just for your knowledge, just because it kind of complements this project, that we will also be doing

two to

four wildlife interpretation signs. We're waiting because we have a contract out there for bid right now for a wildlife assessment of the community, and we wanna we wanna see what that contractor has to say about wildlife education stuff before we create those. But likely, we will have a couple at the pond and maybe a couple at a couple of the locations that will, again, match the whole suite, but they will be about interpreting the wildlife of the Parrido Plateau. So I just wanted to throw that out there so you have that in the back of your mind. The other thing that I wanted to remind you about that you none of you would know about because this is years ago, is our way finding signage, has four.

They're called discovery spot signs, and they go there's, like, a couple on the Kangaroo Trail and then a couple that go I can't exactly where they're at because it's literally been, like, five years since we we have them. They're here. They're ready to install. We just facilities has to be able to have the manpower to do it. So and they're gonna be doing street signs first. These are not the priority. But they have four topics as well that are addressed, wildlife being one of them and nature. And so but they're meant to be about discovering what's happening. I'd be happy to provide information that you could pass on to the board as to what those four signs are because those are also gonna be out there

for tourists and users to discover.

Have a virtual side question. Yes. What happened to the Marjorie Belle Chambers sign?

Are you talking about the the historical marker?

Yeah. It was a historical marker of hers and Peggy Pond.

It's not still there? It should still be there. What they so one of the changes that's happening at the pond right now and will be in place by spring is that for safety reasons, we have to add bollards because of the fact that it's unfortunately a growing issue of cars driving into crowds, and we have our concerts there. And so we need to we need to increase the safety elements around those concerts. And so there will be bollards along the Trinity along Trinity Drive there.

They've cleaned up the landscaping and stuff and redone some sidewalks and really done some good work around there. And so it might actually just look different enough because we put in some plugs for vendors and we put in you know, the area looks a bit different because it's all cleaned up, but it's not quite done because they're gonna put in these bollards. And so I just the last summer, it might have been hidden because we had to have something in place for safety. So we used do you remember transportation concrete barriers? And they're hoping, I think, to get the bollards in place by summer, but it may not happen.

It's it's gonna be very dependent on the contract process and who they find and that sort of a thing. So so that's the thing else you can keep in mind. But that marker should still be there. And if you go downtown and you find that it's not calming, I wanna know.

Oh, look. I I thought it was by the pavilion.

It is. It's so it is right next to the 20th Street parking lot, and there's, like, a little triangle where the sidewalk cuts off diagonally along and then the main sidewalk goes off this way, and it's in that little triangle there. So it's kinda halfway between the ice house or the you know, and the and the parking lot.

Yeah. I just missed it.

They've done a lot of work over there. They've done a lot of work over there with covered pavilions and all kinds of things. It probably just

I just want to throw one thing out. So you're talking about wildlife and the We are putting up a mosaic over on the by the police station that's gonna have a significant amount of wildlife on there. Nice. FYI.

That's good to know. See, that's a good idea because I one of my ideas was demo garden, was to do a wildlife interpretation design in the demo garden. So orb over by the library because the deer lived there. So yeah. So anyway on

the other side of the Yeah.

It's on the other side of the street. But but yeah. I mean, I think that the downtown area that from the Rose Garden, as you know, all the way over, you know, to the the pond where the people gather. Right? So that's why we're thinking about the pond. And then over to Oppenheimer where you're going to have that. That's those are all that's kind of the area I'm looking at for these signs.

Yeah. Nicely done. It'll be

bad news if your sign is contradictory mosaic. Mosaic.

No, no, no.

So I suck. It's Yeah,

that won't go. No,

It will be interpretive. Although I really hope your head Your real life is neat. So

we worked really hard with

the community. The community gave us lots of input, so we don't show too.

Well, you can always go to my website, lacnm.com/wildlife, and look at the wildlife in the Pirated Plateau, and there's a whole huge list.

Okay. And I got

fun animals that I'm hoping to

add too.

Are roadrunners on that list?

No. Because they're not really up at our altitude.

Okay. So the

other issues? That was under Mosaic. We had the Knicks. So

No. It's true. It's not not really but Pingon Jay is gonna be added soon. We also have the oh my gosh. Mexican spotted owl is one of our endangered species. So I mean, we we have a lot of green horned owls. We have I mean, we have a lot of unique birds for our area, but that is not one of those. No

owls. No owls.

That's okay. That's alright. We just don't wanna

have something.

Okay. That's okay.

We have everything, but we just

Well, you know, the surprise of of the century for me is that ringtail is is native to the Pirated Plateau, which everybody is always like, I thought that was an African animal. I mean, that's what I get all the time. So we're gonna tell some about that. And ferrets, the white ferrets that people are starting to see more. And some of our endangered species.

So You

got around mountain, white ferrets. Yeah. Yeah.

They're kinda they're kinda I mean, they they're all this stuff is at the bias. You can go see it at the bias, and it's amazing that you can see a bunch of it in town too.

Thank you, all.

Thank you for your time. Yes. Absolutely. Have a lovely evening. Yes. You too. Let me know if you

have questions anytime. You can just shoot

me an email.

Most sure

where I live.

That's when we get deeper. Bye. Bye.

Thank you. Okay. So we will move on to working group updates. Home center art project.

How are you?

We thought we just

had an update.

So I don't think they have anything else to share.

They met last week together. And yeah, we're disappointed to know that the seven signs had been removed because that was part of the thing that they were thinking of putting art near those signs. At that time, my understanding was that they were condensing it all down to one sign at the Romero Cabin. And they were disappointed in that because they didn't want to send the message to the community or the visitors that this might be the only location. They liked the idea of having multiple sites.

They would have been they felt like people didn't know enough about that tour in existence. Whereas Leslie is saying, they just didn't pick them up and they were all over the place. These guys felt like, maybe they just didn't get advertised enough or something. And so that's and then I found out later that, right, it it wasn't that they're gonna come didn't sit down to one. That's why then I asked Leslie to come, but then, of course, right, our two.

It's recording. Yes.

Oh, yay.

Can I chime in?

Yes. We didn't know you were here. Yay.

Oh, I've I've been trying I've, like, come on and come off a lot because it won't let me talk.

You can hear me now.

So I'm glad you

can hear me. Yay. Yay.

So I'm chiming in with the idea was putting benches around town, kind of where all these homesteads are. And the joke is kind of that we were gonna put sculpture chickens everywhere. So it's like a chicken scavenger hunt for everyone to go find, and it'd be at each of the homesteads.

Just remember with benches, it has to have

It has to be ADA compliant.

Yeah. So it's a little

bit more involved than pudding.

About ADA compliant chickens?

I'm just kidding. They

would be on the benches.

Any other comments about the home center working group? We'll go on to the police station.

No. That's about it. I think we were waiting next year.

Sorry. Okay. I jumped too fast. So then we'll go on to the police station working group.

Jasmine? My update on that is I need to meet with everybody, and I'm having a hard time scheduling everyone. So that's my plan for next week is getting the meetings in unless Chelsea has more on the contracts.

I have more on the contracts. The contracts are all the two contracts are signed, and I gave the third artist all the information, the deliverable part of the contract so that she knows what what is being requested in terms of what we get so that we can make it all similar to put out for the community survey once we get it. You guys had requested a sixty day deadline once the contract was signed. Luckily, both contracts were signed on the same day. So that deadline is March 9.

So after March, we should be getting all the information as of March 9, no later than that. And then we can figure out like, then we need to meet like we did the first time around. I did get an email from one of the artists, and he is wondering if he could be allowed to give a video chat presentation, which we hadn't really talked about.

We'll look at the at the call for art, make sure there isn't anything that anybody objects to. I would I would have liked to set this have the vote on this today, but

if we

don't feel comfortable voting on it, as far as, like, sending it out or agreeing to send this out, maybe we can, I don't know how we would do this? Yeah. Do we need to have a vote? Or we could just okay.

I don't I don't know. Stephanie, correct me if I'm wrong. I you guys voted on the approval of the project in general.

Okay.

And that included that you would have a call for art. Okay. I don't think that APP then needs to continue to approve all of those things once you get

I don't think so. I think we already approved it, and we're not purchasing anything. We're just taking the next step.

All right. So let me just say this. I'm perfectly fine with as this document is published, minus that we need to add the art, graphic.

The logo.

Yeah, the logo. But otherwise, I would say this is ready to go. So I'll give it to Andy. Represents, we'd be the final gate on this.

I can certainly send it out to the rest of the APP members. I can send it out tomorrow. And that way, then ask everybody just to email me, of course, not the group. But just email me if there's any edits or suggestions or feedback of any kind. And then I could share it with you two as the working group.

I know that Diane also just sent us it seems like about an hour ago, like the boilerplate form we were talking about. That's it's just like the entry form. So it just, like, asks people's information and it's how people which nothing I don't know if we need to send that out as well or not. But I think it's

What kind of information does that ask for?

I can pull it up, but it's basically, you know, name, address, contact info, as well as dimensions of the art to make sure that it's, you know, it the it's not gonna be, like, eight feet long or something or eight inches, like, as well as some I think there's an image of the art requested as well. And then

So that's duplicative as to what's in that.

Yeah. It's nothing there's no like nothing that would be considered.

Joe, let me just also say this. At this point in time, given the deadlines that we have, I would emphasize trying to get this out the door as quickly as possible so that we give the artist an opportunity to respond to the call in a timely manner. So like I said, I'm willing to just bless this as it exists and send it out the door. Yeah, you're right. We just got to

get it out.

I think at this point in time, it's just sort of around the edges and not really going to make it a better product.

It was really I was just curious. Is it like was

asking. Yeah. I have the details if you want them, but it's really nothing. Was a clarifying question.

Do you have any questions on that, Jasmine, other than you can't see this?

I can't see it. Describe it in detail.

Find one.

I'll send it to you tomorrow by email.

I'm Sounds good.

Chair of the library board. My name is Beth Stell. And so Chelsea presented the plan at the Boards and Commissions luncheon. And I thought this could be a good opportunity for some collaboration between boards. And so I wanted to come along and mention that as you're, you know, working on planning, if you think there's an opportunity for library board members to support the effort in any way, we would love to to help out. It sounds like you've already done a lot of the legwork getting things set up, but I imagine as it gets closer, there might be opportunities to have some more helping hands. So, yeah.

Yeah. We definitely really appreciate that offer. We'll keep that in mind, especially, like, if we need hands around the opening or anything like that. I know Diane and Katie kind

of run

their own show.

Yes. For sure. So yeah.

And also, would offer up that as we go to make it, like as we're looking at the art, one end of the spectrum is we get two pieces, and then it's very easy to say what goes up. The other end of the spectrum is we get a lot of very large response, and then we'll have to down select as to what makes the show. If we end up in that latter position, certainly we would look for other folks to participate in that down select process. And that might be a great opportunity to collaborate.

Absolutely. I think we would be happy to help in that or any other aspects of the event. So I have emailed Stephanie and Chelsea. So they have my email address. If it's helpful for me to sort of just pop in to the monthly meetings or wait until someone emails us to say, hey, we need some input from whether the library board members can help. Either is fine. But I think it could be a great way I

So do you guys also like collaborate do you guys also help plan the displays? I know that sometimes they have thematic displays, at the sort of the entrance of the library. Would this be something that could be considered like, you know, like art books?

Right.

Like '17 from 1976 or something along those lines that could be sort of put up for display, sort of help people understand what it is that we're doing with this art show relative to what's been done historically for, you know, other fifth year, one hundred year anniversary for the country art wise.

Sure. We don't typically have input on the displays. That's the library staff who do that. But it's certainly something that we could bring to our next board meeting as a suggestion from other boards as something to consider because the library does have sort of planned thematic displays throughout the year to align with different celebrations such as National Hispanic Heritage Month and and things like that. So this would make sense to have a display along those lines. So yeah, we can certainly put it on Gwen, the library manager's radar, as something that she can talk to staff about to support

the event.

Did the library manager attend your meeting?

Yeah. Yeah.

We can come and talk to this if you'd like. Come to your board meeting.

Right.

I'd at least describe what it is we're doing and why we're doing it and what it all entails.

Yeah. That could be great. Our board meetings are the first Monday of the month. So we could definitely talk about that.

Library?

It's actually in this

room.

When we have our meetings in White Rock, we do have it at the branch library in White Rock. But this one will be here.

So that would be February 2 then, the Monday.

That's right. Yeah. Okay.

Okay.

That's great. Excellent. Okay. Thanks so much. I think this could be really fun to help out with.

Great. Thank you.

Sorry if you emailed me. I'm It in a flood of

was a couple of weeks ago. Yeah. It wasn't. Thanks. Thank you

so much.

Thank you. Thank you for coming in.

Okay. Then going on to the strategic plan working group. It's a working group.

Strategically planned.

We're strategically planning.

We had a good meeting last

We did have a good meeting last week talking about moving towards creating a plan for reassessment. Tim had a really good idea about making of a flowchart to kind of step us through the process on when to deaccessions and asking certain questions about the status of the piece. Is it costing a lot? Is it beloved? Is the community willing to to spend a lot to maintain this piece? Or is it something the community could let go? And getting to a point where we maybe ask for community. Do you have anything else?

I think this is going to be the focus, at least for the next several weeks and months. You know, and and I think one other element to this is that, you know, Stephanie is is going to be sort of departing from the board, you know, her terms her, you know, terms coming to an end. But, I think we've discussed continuing on on the working group, not as a Board member, but as a member of the community, which I think is a great idea, and I look forward to that. So we'll have to get another Board member to participate. But yes, I think we're going to try I mean, in the host of things that we could focus on, I think the deaccession plan is the next big thing counter to the procurement.

So that's where we are in Okay. So next is the Clowns Working Group.

Hey, Jasmine. I'll I'll take point on this. So so, yeah, I I am still in the process of filling out the form. Probably I probably should take more care in getting that accomplished. But

The project plan?

The project plan. Yeah. I need to work on that.

You got make the project. I got to make do the project. Got to

make the plan before we can do the project. So we've not really made too much you know, before I I've not made too much forward progress on that. I need to sit down and finish that. But, yeah, I mean, it's like I said, the as far as I can tell, we have a I have an email address for the artist, and so we can contact her. Looks like she lives in Colorado, so not a huge commute.

And I have basically this document that I put together that sort of describes the history of clowns and why it looks the way it looks and how it came to be there. So just that whole description. And so yeah, I think that's probably it. I think we need I mean, I guess the question before we go too far on this would be, do we want to pursue this as it stands? Guess the first question would be, we do I'll put this together, but I think the first question I'm going to be asking is, can we even move this thing?

Considering that it's actually I did find out that it is made out of cinder blocks. It's not a solid Yeah. The wall that the mosaic is on is made out of cinder blocks. And so and also that the mosaic elements are unique. So it's not it's not like we're talking with, like, music where it's just tiles and if we pop one out, we're get a replacement. This is tiles the tiles that composed the mosaic clowns are unique. And so if we break them, there is enough way to replace them. So that's just something to consider as we think about it. I'll write that up in the project plan so that we have that documented for historical reasons.

Are there any other comments or questions on this working group? Then we'll go on to the fire station working group.

So I'm having a hard time with this one. Anna and I were gonna go meet with the fire station and talk to them because I had ran into a couple of firefighters at Smith. And I asked them, hey. What do you think of this project? They had no clue that that was gonna be the project, like the art project, and they weren't happy about it. And then Anna had asked some people she knew about it, and they were offended by the concept. So we're both kinda like, maybe we need to investigate this a little bit more.

So who did Anna talk to that was offended by it?

I think she talked to a coworker, and they were here when all the fires happened. So they were kind of like, this is just rehashing trauma

Mhmm.

From those fires.

Right.

Okay. So I had met with Sylvia, the project manager who was here last month, and David, who is the architect, who was online last month, and then his partner. Asked more questions about how they envision this project because I was feeling uneasy about the it felt like we were kind of jumping into the middle of of the project as opposed to the beginning where we create the project plan and get the input and stuff. And so they helped work out kind of a a that I thought was a little bit better. And so I gave and Jasmine, I think I did email this to you, and I put it I printed it out for you guys, just a rough draft of a project plan where and and it seems like what the what the architects and Sobia would like is sort of an agreement from you guys that of two things.

And it seems like, right, we might not get that at this point. We have to keep working at it. But the first one is the location. Can you guys agree that even if this is not the particular artwork

that that

happens there, that it's this sort of screen right here. Can that be is that an okay location for this art since it's been kind of designed into the architecture already? I asked if that is not okay, what ends up happening. And and the there's the vertical posts and there's a metal bar up at the top that that would sort of be there. And that's all that would be there then if you guys didn't like that location.

Regardless of what we decide, that that that element, that structure, that's gonna be there.

Yeah. But not the not the wires Yeah. Not the wires. Thing. But yeah. That structure, that's how that's going to be designed. So regardless of the art, that's it. And so do you guys can you guys agree that no matter what the art is, it'll be located this is the location. That's one of the things that they'd like to know from you guys. The second piece is the idea of the theme, which sounds like from what Jasmine is gathering might be problematic right now.

So but it's it's it needs to be hashed out more. But then the idea is once we get once you guys get the theme of what you want, right now, it's commemorating these three fires. If and maybe more detail about that. Then the idea is take that piece, not the art yet, but take that piece out to the community and say, here is what this is here's the placement Or maybe not even that yet. Just here's the story we'd like to tell with this piece of art.

Can you and ask the community what is missing from this story? How best can we tell this story? And then we gather that inform I mean, we can do it very specifically, so it's not all over the place. But it gives the community a chance to say, I don't wanna commemorate these fires. That would be offensive, like like Anna said found out. Or yes, this would really mean a lot, but we wanna do it this way. However that works. We gather that information. Then you guys refine the story. Then with that story and the location, that's when we can then do a call for art for the artist to say, okay.

Here's the story we want to tell. Tell us, you know, give us and then kind of do what we did with the lion sculpture and say, give us your qualifications for why you think you'd be a good artist for this project and give us an idea of your vision for the kind the the art that goes here in order to tell that story. And then we move the process forward like the lion sculpture.

So the one thing I would say about the public input portion is if we just say this concept, like it or not, I feel like we'll only get the I don't like it feedback. And so if we're going to put something towards for public consideration, it should be choose one of these concepts. In other words, it's very easy to get the feedback of I don't like this from some number of people. If it's that or nothing, then we've got nothing. So it'd be much I think it'd be better if it's like this choice, this choice, or a third choice, which one you like. And then we sort of use that as feedback versus And

I agree with you. But I think for me personally, just and again, right, it's not really up to me. I understand that. But, like, thinking through the process of this. Yeah. I think that right there is the second part of getting community. You get community feedback twice. You get it on the front end with help us tell a good story. Has nothing to do with the art. So it's not like, what do you like? This piece or not this piece? It's tell us more about the story.

Yeah. I'm sorry. What I'm saying

get to the

is the theme. Right. So other words, like, people are really having a hard time with the idea of a piece of art that commemorates the fires that happened. What I don't want it to be is, do you like this theme or not? Because if it's this theme or not, I feel like we'll just get a bunch of the not feedback versus here are two themes. Which ones would you have two choices. Is this or this, not nothing? Right? So I I would like to have at least two options feedback on the two options versus just yes or no on this one theme. I mean

I hear you.

Yeah, because we can have something. And if people are very upset about the idea of commemorating it, Okay, that leaves us with no other options. And we're back to where we are even before we had this meeting. So I'd rather just have two themes and let people pick which theme are we going to go with. Then we can use that to inform the call for art. Then the community can actually fed the feedback on this one or this one or this one, these pieces of art. But really, what we're talking about is like, based on what Jasmine and Anna have seen or heard, the theme even is problematic, potentially. So you can't even jump into what the call looks like until we resolve this issue with the theme, I would think.

But before they do that, we have to decide whether we want structure for the art to be

Oh, yeah. Well, no, the superstructure is going to be there regardless.

But they want to know if we're going to put art in this location. And I think before we do that, because of the feedback they've gotten, I think it might be beneficial to get a firefighter or even on our working group so that we get direct input from them and so that we know we have people there who are involved.

A representative that can speak for the firefighting community versus any one firefighter may object to a piece of art, but somebody that is sort of designated to speak for folks.

Or even I mean, when you were doing PE, you had two people there. And it was really an engagement of three people. And so it might be beneficial to get more input. And I know you had mentioned that we were going to get some firefighters at our next meeting.

Sylvia had said that she was planning on reaching out to the new fire chief. We just got

a new

one. And was hopeful that he could come to the next APP meeting. So I can follow-up with that. February. And I could also reach out. I hadn't thought about asking them to be part of the working group too. I could reach out.

I think they might have better input because I had questions. And so I shared it with the people I know. And the most common comment is, do firefighters actually want that? And so I'm really curious. I don't want to hear from somebody else who claims they talked to a firefighter and said, that's Okay. I I don't want the project manager to tell us they said it was Okay. I want them to come tell us.

Okay, involved in the decision making process from the start, yeah.

Because they're going to have to look at that every single day. And I had concerns originally about the context. I have concerns about the design. The community is not necessarily an abstract community. We're very literal, and I personally am very literal.

So if you tell me to go over there, I'm gonna go over there. I mean, that's just my personality, and I think that's common in town. But I'm I'm really if we're gonna stick something on a fire station, I really wanna make sure the firefighters are okay with it. And that two of these fires were escape control burns. It makes me very uneasy. I mean, that seems to be highlighting the wrong I mean, what the firefighters mean to me is something very different than these fires. And so I that's personally not that I would want to do it.

Rajai, I think your point about making sure that we have involvement from the fire department, I mean, think that's only fair because, I mean, with the police department lying, we have a member from the police, a duly designated representative from the police department participating

in

the board. That would be fair. Somebody from the fire

department

seems to make logical sense.

Did you have thoughts, Jasmine?

I think it's a good idea to maybe have, like, a firefighter or someone who works really close with them on the working group just so that we get that opinion and it's legit and honest instead of, like, oh, I talked to this person and they said this. We'll have an actual voice for

them. That

wasn't to discount your comments in reference to them.

It was

really that I was hoping that they would have an act.

Okay. The Justice Center wall mosaic. The contract has been signed. We're waiting on getting him paid his first chunk. And then once he receives that payment, which we're hoping in the next

week or

so, once he gets that payment, then he can set a date for when their team is going to come out. Once we have that, I met with a recreation superintendent, and I met with the head librarian, two the librarians. And they are all super excited about this project. And they showed me around. And the the Mesa Public Library on the Bottom Floor, they call it the zone.

We looked at that. But based off of what the artist is thinking about, like needing to keep things set up for the duration of the time and that they need to secure it when nobody's around. It looks like we could use the conference rooms. There's one that has a partition that opens up to a big room upstairs on the 3rd Floor of the library. And then there's that rotunda right in front of the step up gallery.

And so we could spill out there and maybe have signage about APP, about this process, all of that kind of stuff could be up there and then, have all the community, engagement pieces in, you know, three days. Maybe it's Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, something like that, set up in in this. Then they'd be right across from, you know, down the street from where they're going to actually install the pieces. The library is more than happy to help us, with the media of it and get it out on all the social media. We were thinking of even like banners, maybe a banner over the past and maybe even banners.

I was thinking a banner on the wall itself like future home of, you know, whatever. But Catherine, the recreation superintendent, thought that might not be allowed. So we but they got excited enough that we can we can really advertise it. Once we get the date, we can start advertising it now, even though it might be it's not gonna be until the June. Well, the artist the what the timing on it for him, he's pretty open in May and June right now, but he's worried the temperature has to be right for the grout.

And so the June is is warm enough and not too hot yet. Even though with the southern exposure, he said he put up tents and that kind of stuff. So we're making great progress on that. I'm super excited about it. So it's going be fun.

It's coming to fruition.

The senior center security gate, the contract has been signed. They have a March 1 deadline on that one. And the we're it needs to have a permit because it's an egress situation. Don't talking beyond what I really know. But and so that and so the county can't permit the because the gate peep the gate artist isn't installing it, we have to get an installer.

The the installer that we had, it it was not willing to do the permitting process, so we have to find somebody else. We found somebody else. We're waiting on a quote for that. It's probably gonna be more than we had already, you know, had it well, I'm hoping it's not that we have a $5,000 contingency. I'm hoping it's not gonna be more than that. We'll see what happens. If not, we'll have to I'll bring it back to you guys. We'll have to talk about that. But but they need in order to get a better quote, they need a good sketch, a better one than they than we were given just as the art piece. It needs to be sketched out better, And the artist is working on that this week.

He's hoping to have it early next week so that I can get the permit so that we can get this all done. So we're hoping for a March deadline. We'll see where we are on that. But everything's in the works. It's good.

So hypothetically, right, so the artist delivers a piece on March 1 regardless of what's going on with the installation permit. Where do we put the gate?

In meantime, Parks has graciously allowed us to keep it with in their storage. And then Parks will will haul it over to the parking lot of the senior center, and then the contractor who will install it will get it and roll it down the path to the location. Details, details. Hi.

Yeah. That's right.

I'm hoping that

was hoping it's all smooth. And I sent him also the artist pictures of our crash bar because the crash bar has to fit perfectly. And so we've art we worked out that that kind of detail. And then the artist required very specific measurements. And so we went out and measured, and I took pictures of the actual measurements and he said that was really good. So we're getting there.

Yeah. That's right.

It's gonna come in. Or whatever. No. It'll be fine. It's gonna be beautiful. And I'm super excited about that one too.

I was wondering if it was going to end up in

your office for a while. This

looks nice. Never mind. You don't have to have it.

You can have my door

and I'll keep it. This is beautiful. No. It'll be a really nice addition to that area, I think. The Nature Center sculpture is supposed to be delivered tomorrow from eleven to one.

Hopefully, the snow will be later in the afternoon if it's gonna come at all. But I talked to the Natalie, is the gallery owner, and, she sent pictures, a picture today. So they so the stone company got the sculpture into the stone. It's not the stone that we had originally talked about because the process took so long that they don't have that stone anymore, and so they had to pick a different stone. The gallery owner says, oh, she thinks this stone is even better than the one that they had originally done. And so they got him nestled in. I mean, he really looks he looks he looks good.

He's gonna like, kids are gonna

get up on that and just snuggle with him, I think. Like, you're gonna see a lot of and he's gonna get worn down because he's gonna be loved,

I think.

I met with Parks to find out and and Beth who's at Peak to see where the where the location should be, and we mapped it out. They're gonna the installers are gonna dig down just a little bit to seat it, but it should be fine. And there's no apparently, irrigation problem under there, so that should work out nicely. And, yeah, he's already secured to the rock, so the rock just needs to get placed in. And we can plan a a ribbon cutting. But and it and the Peak board would like to be part of that plan, and they're thinking they would really like it to be on Earth Day. So a year later.

And I

think that was really nice. So I'll take lots of pictures and let you guys know

that you're obviously welcome

to come.

Yeah. Send me a text because I have tomorrow is off, right?

So eleven to one is the plan.

Hang on a beat.

Come at eleven and see what happens. I'll bring

some tacos. Yeah.

Are they installing it tomorrow? Yeah. It's supposed to be delivered and installed tomorrow. So I hope it's all I mean,

it didn't need a

permit because it's outside. There's no egress. It's just and we have the place, and and Pete said they could be there, and it's a good time. So, I mean, I think it's all coming together. We'll see if I've forgotten anything tomorrow, and it'll be obvious. It'll

be fine. I'm sure

that'll be

great. Yeah.

But that one's gonna be fun. Oh, and then oh, I do need to tell you this. So I'm ordering the plaque. You know, we have to have the bronze plaques for the outside ones. And we have what is it?

Raven dialogue, comma, friendly advice. That's what we've been talking about the whole time. That was in the contract like it's everywhere. That's how it was given to us at the when you And so I got it up onto the draft of the plaque. And the plaque makers actually Googled the artist and found that it's advertised on her website as Raven Dialogues, spelled differently with the o u g e instead of the o g, how it was, comma, friendly advice.

So they were like, well, which one is it? It was like three different options now. And so I had to reach back out to the artist and the gallery owner. And so it's not Raven Dialogue, v I a l o g. It's Raven Dialogues, L O U G E S. So friendly advice. So anyway, phew. Not that it's a huge deal, but it's nice that we actually got the title right to be able to put it on the plaque. The plaque will be arriving probably in, I don't know, ten weeks or something. And then we'll deal with that when that comes. I

talked to

you about the lion sculpture artists already. The deadline is March 9. And you guys said it would be okay to have an optional video presentation, so I'll let all three of them know. And then the last two on the list, Opie and Groves installation, I don't have a date on yet. And White Rock Pottery, I don't have an update on.

So for the pottery in White Rock, that is in the contractor's court right now.

Would like to I need Pacific Coast reached out to me to set the date for this year's maintenance and to ask if we had any specific ones that we wanted to highlight or have them pay special attention to. So I'll get with you guys when I have that. I haven't had a chance to think that through yet. But based off of survey results and the conversations you guys have had, I'll put something together. And then I'll run it by you all.

But I want to talk to

them also about the clowns. They had said they would get back to me, but I think they've forgotten. And I do want to let them know about the movement of that pot because maybe they have some advice that could get written into the contract for

So for them, we have a multiyear contract with them, right? Would you know what year we are? We're looking

at for a review? Didn't know. I haven't looked at that for a while. I think we're on year four or five of a seven year contract. Any

other comments, questions? We'll go on to board staff communications. Staff liaison report.

I gave you everything I had already. Sorry.

And chairman's report, I do not have anything. I do I am curious. Who is our new counselor?

DVD. You should get to pick our own if they haven't told us, right? Wild.

Can't pick our own? It won't be Counselor Herman, if the same rules apply as last year. Because Haberman was ours first, so Susie. But then when she got to be vice chair of the council, she had to be on the utilities board, which met twice a month meets twice a month. And so she could not then be on another board. And so Ren Herman is was voted vice chair this time. And so I would imagine the same rules apply. I

have a question. Does that mean Bev is coming back?

I don't know. I don't know what the rule is. I'm not sure if you're allowed to if you have to rotate or if you could stay.

We do know Bev's not here tonight.

Right.

So we don't have a counselor, so we'll move on to preview of the next meeting, February 2626. I like that. 2626.

Oh, yeah. And it will be your last meeting.

2626.

Speaking of that, have you gotten anyone applying for the board?

Have to should

we get my paper? Tim better apply, right? Okay.

I've got to reply. I've to sit down and do that. I've got every intent to do that.

The deadline I put in the paper was the thirtieth. I've been told that they're gonna push it again and see what we get. Other than that, there hasn't been any any other applications.

How do we check a status of our application? Because I clicked the link that came in my email, but I didn't get anything saying that it went through.

It did go through. We see it. We have it. You're good. And so the next Okay. Good. Thank you. Yeah. The next step is that we'll set up interviews. But I was going to wait till after the thirtieth to then reach out to everybody to set up an interview. So stay tuned.

So if next month is my last meeting officially, maybe we could do the we should know who's going to go forward.

Correct me if I'm wrong. I think you're allowed to stay on the board until we have a replacement.

So

maybe it's not your last meeting if we if we haven't found a replacement. Unless we wanted to. I don't want you to want it to be.

You're chained to this board, dear friend, everybody.

I miss you guys. What would I do once a month on a Thursday?

The call for art. So that you can still have an update. Do we need do we need an action item on the fire station by February?

It was an action item to decide whether we wanted to select that location and to approve that as the location.

I I'm not yeah. Like, our our process is that the working group works up the project plan. And then and then once you guys get it good enough, you then give it to the board and the board votes on it. But I know that Sobia, the project manager, was wanting strong like vote for the to to be able to know, yes, even though this might not be the art, this is the location so that they can move their project on in terms of that. So but I don't like know I how you feel about that.

A decision that the working group makes, whether they're far enough along. Because they need to get at least one representative from the fire station and make sure they're up to speed and get their input. And if they feel like they're at a place where they can bring it to us, then they'll tell you right before the meeting. Yeah, I think we can discuss this and make that determination.

Just to be clear

I

agree with what you think. Just to be clear, the implications of, let's say hypothetically we say no, that's not where we want to put the art, that has no implications for the progress on this project as they designed it. In other words, the superstructure, posts and the roof, they're going to be there regardless. So if we say no, it doesn't stop anything that they're doing. Is that correct? Is that

That is my understanding.

Okay.

Right. I guess I need more clarification from Sobia as to why it's so important that you say yes, this is the location, I guess.

Yeah. That's because I mean, if there is something where it's like, well, no. If we say no, that changes something about the progress of this. I don't want to hold up the progress on this project.

It supposed to be a private hallway?

I think

so. I thought that's what she said. Like, it wasn't for the public, but

not on the inside.

She said the inside was minor station. So maybe if that's not there, maybe

I just want to understand the implications of whatever it is that we're voting. If we do vote it down, does that do anything to the project's progress? Because if we sort of meander about for a month or two like we like to do sometimes, making a decision, that won't slow them down.

Absolutely. I'll get that clarification for sure. That is a good clarification. Yeah, that I'm saying it out loud. Right. I got that clarification that the structure is going to be there. So I understand why it's so important that you make that. I will get the clarification.

And then maybe task the the fire station working group to get You were going to contact the fire chief. And they make that determination whether they think we're ready enough to answer that question.

Jasmine, did you hear that?

I barely heard all of that.

So you did. So that's a yes, you heard

it. Barely.

So instead of just saying automatically that we're going to vote on whether this will be the location, that once you meet with a representative from the fire station who will be on the working group. The working group will decide if we can answer that question at the next meeting.

Okay.

Why they had those.

Is it coming from, like, above or something? Yeah.

Good point. Okay.

Don't know if you heard that Chelsea or Jasmine. Sorry. I'm looking at Chelsea. Chelsea is going to ask, what are the stipulations if we say no? And to get clarification on would that slow down the process, do we need to move faster than our typical pace? Because the design is hinging on what we say. And she'll communicate that to the working group.

Got it.

Okay. Okay. So anything else for our next meeting? We'll have our working group updates.

I'll have my class ready. I will have it ready.

Maybe we'll have the meeting. That would be nice. Is there anything else? Okay. Then we will adjourn the meeting at 06:55.