City Council - Regular Meeting

I WOULD HAVE BEEN SLEEPING BY NOW. GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO THE BUDGET AND FINANCE COMMITTEE. MAY I HAVE A MOTION TO RESUME? MOTION TO RESUME. MOTION HAS BEEN MADE BY THE VICE CHAIR ZARASAKA. that might come to the plan all those in favor say I I I last time we did not close out the meeting we what we made a motion to resume to us so I although the meeting is continuous I do want to remind everyone that Pursuant to Chapter 20 of the Acts of 2022, this meeting of the Budget and Finance Committee is being conducted both in person and via remote participation. A reminder that persons who would like to listen or view this meeting while in progress may either attend here in the City Council Chamber. They can also view it from my Facebook page, YouTube page, Comcast Channel 22, and Verizon Channel 42. All right, we are going to continue with our budget hearings. Today is day two of the budget hearings. We have in front of us today the city attorney's office, the city clerk's division that is made up of the city clerk's office, election, vital stats and annual listing, health and human services division that includes council on aging, veterans office and recreation, police department and fire department. Before we start with the city attorney's office, Madam Capo, is there anything you would like to say before we go into the... All right, city attorney. Muin, you are up. Please let us know what page to start on. 26.

Okay.

Before we start, Director Shepherd, is the police chief joining you tonight? Yes. Okay, because I am being adamable. Okay, thank you. Continue, City Attorney.

So 46 is the overview of the general fund. As you can see, more information is available on page 47, which shows you the salaries, the purchase of services, supplies, and other charges. No drastic changes. The only difference that you will see is I'm dropping a half of person, which is I had one and a half secretaries. I've been holding onto that while hoping to replenish my office at the time. It's still just me. We've just concluded a long negotiations but to see if I could add someone that has broken down So I'm starting again. So hoping to have someone very shortly have someone before you within the next 30 days but it still just me one confidential secretary and That's it Counselors do you have any questions for the city attorney?

I? COUNSEL MARMAL.

ATTORNEY HUNTON, SO I'M ASSUMING YOU'RE LOOKING TO FILL THIS POSITION EVENTUALLY?

I'VE BEEN LOOKING, YES, FOR OVER A YEAR. WE'VE HAD VARIOUS CANDIDATES AT VARIOUS TIMES. JUST RECENTLY WE'VE HAD A CANDIDATE FOR THE FIRST ASSISTANT. THAT NEGOTIATION TOOK CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF TIME AND IT'S JUST BROKEN DOWN SO I'M GOING TO BE LOOKING ELSEWHERE.

WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY BROKEN DOWN?

WE COULD NOT COME TO A MEETING OF THE MINDS.

Okay, I'm just wondering as to like why the reduction if you're looking to fill this position?

No, the reduction is in secretaries, so.

Oh, yes, that's why I wanted to ask about that.

So we originally had two secretaries. We went down. One of my confidential secretaries retired. She was good enough to come back on a part-time basis, so we have her as a part-time basis. But there's still only me right now, so to reduce that to one while I fill it, I may be back eventually, I hope, if I have a full staff to need another secretary. But right now, one is sufficient.

Okay.

Attorney Huynh, I know every year we go over monetary, I'm sorry, a question I didn't see. I can wait. That's okay, go ahead.

All right, so the biggest thing that jumps out at me is just the lack of, fully budgeted with personnel, lack of personnel. We funded this department, fully funded, with 1.4, 4 1⁄2 people in this past year, and we've actually had 2 1⁄2 people, I think, in this past year.

Correct.

So, and I think you were the one and only, I think, for the entire year of this current fiscal year?

Current fiscal year, yes.

Okay. So you can imagine, we voted on this budget last year with the hopes and expectations that you, office, would be fully staffed. Almost a full year later, there's been no movement in your staffing. And from where I sit, the responsibilities, the pressures, all the things that your office needs to do has not gone down, it's gone up. So I'm a little, I'm not sure what the right verb is. I wanna say frustrated, but I'm not sure that's accurate. Disappointed, and I'm not sure that's the right word. But it doesn't sit well, maybe that's the best way. That we voted for something and it didn't come through. I think I deserve, bit of an explanation as to why we didn't get anything done this year.

VARIOUS REASONS. AS YOU KNOW, THE POSITION IS APPOINTED BY THE CITY COUNCIL AND APPROVED BY THE MAYOR. SO EACH CANDIDATE THAT COMES IN IS VETTED BY THE MAYOR. I ORIGINALLY HAD THREE CANDIDATES FOR THE SECOND POSITION. NONE OF THEM WERE APPROVED BY THE MAYOR. I THEN HAD A THREE CANDIDATES FOR THE FIRST POSITION. THE MAYOR CHOSE ONE OF THOSE. WE'VE SPENT A LOT OF TIME CONSERVATIVE ON A TIME IN NEGOTIATION WITH THAT ONE PERSON. LIKE I SAID, IT JUST BROKE DOWN. I LITERALLY MEAN TODAY. SO, YEAH. TO BEGIN WITH, THE PROBLEM IS THAT NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE APPLY FOR THESE POSITIONS. It wasn't you and I won't give the name. Somebody once told me that lawyers were a dime a dozen, but municipal lawyers are not a dime a dozen. It's a very particular field of law. It takes someone, and to be quite honest with it, and no disparaging, but it's a political position. You have to stand up here, and unlike many lawyers who may walk around all day thinking they are the greatest gift on earth, you've got to come up here and you've got to have a thick skin because you take a lot of Questioning, and rightly so, a lot of questioning of a lot of people Commenting on your work, etc. You you make the newspapers You know the I got in trouble one set I believe at a City Council meeting because I remarked that someone had criticized me I said unlike the person that had criticized me I was an actual lawyer didn't play one on TV and I saw that made the paper and I was criticized for that remark, too so there's a lot of things everything you say ends up in the paper and a lot of people are don't like that. So that's the problem.

So my question is, if past practice or past is an indicator of our future, why should I not cut two positions out of this budget? What makes me think this year is going to be the year that we're going to get a fully staffed city attorney's office. If we're going to be sitting around not spending the money here, I know a lot of other places, good places, that we could put money, taxpayer dollars through that could do a service rather than having to lie dormant for an entire year.

uh... because what's going to happen is that uh... and i'm going to make up numbers a hundred thousand dollars spent on a city attorney is going to save you five hundred thousand dollars outside council those positions are not there the work still has to be done if somebody sues the city we have to answer we have to go to court we have to do that thing that work has to be done whether it's funded or not and if it's just me uh... i can't do all that work so outside council has to be retained and outside council is expensive So I think the prudent thing to do is keep those positions open and hope that they get filled. Two years ago, I was proud to come before this council because one of the parts of my contract was that I had to reduce the use of outside council. For a period of six months when I had a full staff, not one case was referred to outside council. So, saving the city an enormous amount of money. So, that's what I'm looking for.

I do not disagree with your assessment of the cost. If we had good council in our office, in office council, that would be a tremendous savings, and that would be fantastic. But my concern here is that we've I've sat here before, and we were supposed to have it. It doesn't have it. I'm not sure what assurances I can get, and I don't even know if it's in your hands.

So the other problem is, and everybody knows this one, is when you deal with... I'm going to use a bill. When you want to pay a bill... with the municipality. The vendor, it takes 90 to 120 days. And many vendors don't like that. So if I want to hire someone, this is the biggest problem, is if I want to hire someone, they need a job today. If I now have to go create the position again and then hire them, we're now talking three to six months, I'm going to lose all candidates. Nobody's going to wait.

I'll end with this. I just think it's really important. And I, I don't doubt that your efforts in trying to make it happen. I don't have a doubt in my mind that you're doing whatever you can. But I just need to reiterate again from where I said. Knowing the city as I do, how important it is for that for your staff to be fully staffed and not just have 1 because it does a disservice to the. to our government, when we can only have one person and we have to go outside for other stuff. We just can't get the work done. I agree with that. That's it. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to add, because I know I'm very direct, as you know, as a councillor. You mentioned that for one position you had three candidates, and ultimately the administration, the mayor, didn't agree with any of those candidates. One of the key components to why your office is understaffed is that right there, is that the administration is looking for a specific person. And I don't mean specific person. That's the wrong term. They're looking for attorneys to be on their side. We're not hiring for the overall city because as you stated before, as we talked about publicly before, there's this debate about is a city attorney with the administration, with the city council, or the city of Lawrence. There's that debate and it continues. So when we're looking for first and second assistant attorneys, what it comes down to is that the administration want who they want. They have an ideal persona, because it's not a certain person, but persona. And that's who they're looking to hire. And when we talk about these positions, we should be looking at their qualifications.

That's what I like. Believe me, I have always stated and I will continue to state I represent the entire city of Lawrence. Any person I hire, they have to understand they represent the entire city of Lawrence. If anybody wants a specific lawyer for themselves, they can hire their own specific lawyer. But the lawyer in my office represents the city.

So thank you, and I believe in my opinion, as one counselor, that's 50% of the challenge that we're having when it comes to fully staffing the city attorney's office. Council President.

Thank you. Thank you, Madam.

Thank you, Madam Chair. So just on the same issue of hiring personnel for the city attorney's office. Under the city charter, the city attorney reports to the city council and subsequently you go ahead and hire other attorneys, including attorney number one, two, three, four, and so forth. Do you think it will be appropriate to present those candidates to the city council under a specific item as your potential candidate to hire before you present it to the mayor?

No. The reason being... Say it to me why. Okay. I'm going to hire you. You might work for someone else. You might do another job. When you become a final candidate, okay, You're going to be here. Your boss is going to see you. If you don't get appointed, you might not go back to your job. So before I present someone, I want to make sure that everybody is on the same page. If I know that the mayor is not going to confirm a particular candidate, I know that you present, but it's with confirmation. So if I go to the whole trouble and the city council approves, and I go to the mayor's office, I've just embarrassed that attorney, because now they're not confirmed. I've embarrassed their family. I don't look good because they trusted me. Again, I got to work with these people. I want hand in glove. So I would never do that to someone unless I had the feeling. And I'm not guaranteed. You have the absolute right to say no to any of my candidates. I'm not suggesting that at all. But if I know right from the get-go they're not going to be approved, it would be disrespectful to the candidate to present them.

I understand. I understand those points. And I agree with you until everybody agrees. It shouldn't be public. Once everybody agrees, it should be public. I got it. But that doesn't hold you from introducing finalists to counselors if they desire or request the information. And sometimes we as a counselor, me as a council president, You have the liberty of going and doing the best for the office because I believe, as a president, that every head of department should have the autonomy to run that department accordingly for the best interest of the city. And that's what I do with you, and that's what I do with the city clerk. And delivery that is required and needed for you to do a good job, that's part of it. But that doesn't hold you from actually have a conversation about potential candidates that you have been interviewing that will be a good fit. Why? Because at the end of the day, we work together. And there is things that we can do as a council. There is things that we can do as a councilors. to make sure that the administration agree upon specific candidates to help out your department. I believe that working in conjunction will help out the overall operation of the senior Chinese department.

I could do that to a select person or persons. Again, one of the detriment to that is I could not ever do that to the council because I'm the person that's protecting you from violating the open meeting law and I just violated the open meeting law because I've given you someone and you have deliberated or talked about it outside of a posted meeting. So I could talk one-on-one with someone and just say, I have a candidate, here's the person's background, but I could not do it with the whole group. It has to be an open session.

That's not the question. That's not the question. It will be individual councillors and not necessarily with the caveat of breaking the own permit law.

I have no problem with that.

And I would like to add this whole, if the council approves a candidate and the mayor doesn't sign off on it, If the council as a whole, say in an ideal world, say the council unanimously confirms an assistant attorney, the mayor comes and vetoes it, we have the...

It's not a veto.

It's not a veto.

It's a confirmation. He would not confirm. And again, I don't want to get into the mechanics of this, but... Prior to my administration, a couple of administrations, we had the situation where there was a council candidate and there was a mayoral candidate. And what the ultimate power on this, and again, I'm not suggesting, is that all the mayor has to do is say, I'm not paying that person. I'm not going to sign their checks. I'm not going to sign their payments. And okay, I'm appointed the CITY ATTORNEY AND I'M NEVER GOING TO GET PAID. SO YOU NEED EVERYBODY ON BOARD. IT HAS TO, I CAN'T HAVE, AND PLUS I REPRESENT BOTH PARTIES. I REPRESENT THE CITY COUNCIL AND I REPRESENT THE MAYOR. I WANT EVERYBODY TO BE HAPPY BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO REPRESENT EVERYBODY.

WELL I THINK TO WRAP UP MY, THEN I'LL GO BACK TO THE COUNCIL PRESIDENT. You just made my case even stronger about the remarks I mentioned earlier, and I think it's important for counselors, when we do have these discussions with the mayor of the administration, is to look at the bigger picture. There may be a mayoral candidate, there may be a city council candidate, but if it's not the right candidate for both parties, we need to... GET IT TOGETHER AND COME TOGETHER AND DO WHAT'S RIGHT. IT'S NOT JUST WHOMEVER THE MAYOR WANTS OR WHOMEVER THE CITY COUNCIL WANTS.

I AGREE WITH YOU.

COUNCIL PRESIDENT.

THANK YOU, MAYOR CHAIR. I THINK THERE'S A POSSIBILITY. WHAT YOU JUST SAID, THE MAYOR AT SOME POINT SAYS I'M NOT FIGHTING THAT PERSON. I AGREE WITH YOU. THAT'S A POSSIBILITY THAT MIGHT HAPPEN. BUT I DON'T THINK THAT No mayor wants to go into the battle with the city council. Why? Because eventually the city council will do the same thing. And that's not productive for the city. So it is a matter of sitting down, talk about it. Everybody have different point of opinions. But at the end of the day, we all going to agree if we have one specific matter on top of everybody, which is the best benefit for the city. So I don't like the fact that we are just taking that approach without getting, or we are crossing the bridge without getting to that specific section of the bridge where we're gonna get wet. So by not trying, We're just admitting that that's what's going to happen. And I think that at some point, if the mayor at some point says, I'm not paying, then I think that at some point the mayor and the city council have to sit down and discuss those because that's something that is important. there is less important meetings per se. And perhaps that has happened at the mayor's office between the councilors. And I think that that might be something that is a lot more important than a lot of meetings that have happened between us. So let's allow us to go through that process when that happened.

and and uh and let's see what happened okay thank you any other questions pertaining to the budget for the city attorney's office c a none thank you city attorney thank you very much thank you counselors we next we have the city clerk's division and we have madam clerk eileen bruno

Thank you, Council. City Clerk Eileen Burnell, 257 Mount Vernon Street. Our budget is pretty much level funded. The increases that you see relate to salary, the majority of which are for the collective bargaining agreements through the different unions that my employees are a part of. And those increases are actually pretty minor when you divide it across nine different people. I know this is not a time to flood for my office, but I have your attention, and I get two minutes with the mic. I have the best staff in the building. I really couldn't have better staff. They work so hard. We are the absolute busiest office of all the administrators. They tabulate who goes into which offices, who gets the most mail, who gets the most online orders. Our office, every single time. They're consistently, they do an excellent job, and I just really couldn't be more proud of all of them. If they weren't in collective bargaining agreements and I had the right to negotiate raises with them, I would love to do that, because I really couldn't be happier or more proud of my staff. We do the births, the amendments of births, deaths. We host a hospital, so our birth and death rates are so much higher than the other communities around us. And the staff handles it so beautifully. And then sometimes the hospital gets it wrong. We have to amend the death records. We have to amend the birth records. We get it done. We do the marriages, we do the business certificates, everything to dog licenses. And then the zoning board and the planning board, we retain their records for them. Plus we work with you guys, plus elections, plus the census. We have a lot going on. And I think on a very tight budget, we get it done. Richard is here with me if you have some specific questions on the election stuff too. Richard and I have kind of gone through the budget and I guess we share the same concern. We get that everything is level funded and we get that that's a citywide policy right now because budgets are tight. Our biggest concern is postage, which sounds silly, but We're going to be mailing out a ballot in September and again in November. It's going to be a busy year. It's in a governor's year. It's going to be a ballot that's heavy because we send out a bilingual ballot, plus it's going to have ballot questions. We do the census cards. The amount of real mail that we send out the door is a lot, and the cost of printing's gone up and the cost of mailing's gone up. And that is our one concern, but pretty much everything else, we think we can make it work.

Thank you. Councillors, any questions or comments? I have a comment. Council President. I have two comments. So Madam Clerk,

Two days ago, we hear the same thing from Ramona, that they have the best staff. So I don't know. You guys need to talk.

Let's wrestle. Mine's great.

You guys need to kind of get on the same page.

I will say, Ramona is pretty awesome, so her staff is good. But mine is just a tiny bit better.

She's the one that's up for the money. Anyway, I want to bring up something to everybody's attention when it comes to the publication in your office. A lot of the money before used to go to publication, publishing, public hearings, and so far so one. Individually, you have combined those since. And I think that that's going to bring up a lot of saving for the last few years. and for the future. So doing that will help out tremendously. Um, obviously that is, that is all the things that need to be changed within your office that we're going to keep on working hard. But if we have the best heart and the best intentions, I think that we're going to get it done. So thank you.

Thank you. How's the marble?

Um, I do appreciate your office efforts. I know that you guys are super busy, which is why whenever I do have any questions or concerns, I try to be super understanding, not having the expectation of you guys responding to me right away, or if something hasn't been answered. I'm really good when it comes to following up with you guys and working with you guys. So it makes me wonder, a staff of five for your department, Is that sufficient?

I would love more staff. I just don't know. We are busy. There are times when there's a line two, three people deep. If I had more staff, I would use them. You know what I mean? I don't think anyone is sitting around. And right now we do have everyone's cross trained. We're pulling poor Henry up from the basement from the elections office to help out. And even with pulling him up, we're still busy. So if we had more staff, we would use them.

Well, the reason why I asked is because, you know, I've seen how we do create positions to help to help. these higher positions. I'm trying to be respectful here. So I'm trying to gain an understanding as to an office such as yours where it is a need for it, why is it that I don't see a push for having additional staff in order for your department to run adequately?

I did have a conversation with Mr. Maloney, the prior clerk, and he told me that at one point he had six clerks upstairs, and I just have four right now. So that office could definitely support.

Are you requesting this to the mayor? Like, has there ever been a request on your end?

I have not requested additional staff. No, I have not. Good on you for pointing that out. That's a good request I should be making, yeah.

Okay. The second question I have is in regards to The increase in pay, specifically, it's your position. Is this increase to align with other city clerks, with other neighboring cities and towns? Are we there, or is this just a contractual negotiation?

Yeah, mine is just what's in my contract. I don't know... I don't think I'm far below other communities, but I don't think I'm, like, at the max or on the high end of the city clerk scale. But that raise that's in there is just based on the contractual raise that you guys have given me in my regular contract with you. Okay.

And that is all.

I have one other question.

Counselor LaPilo.

I don't really have any strong questions regarding expenditures and that. Where my questions lie are on two much bigger elements that we have talked about and that I mentioned publicly. And I always get the name of it wrong, and I'm asking for your help on it. But it's in our charter, in our municipal ordinances. And I know every 10 years, not only are we supposed to review the ordinances, but every so often we're supposed to go ahead and make sure that our ordinances make sense. There's no conflicts, no contradictions. It's placed in the right place. And it's kind of like a massive audit of our ordinance book. And you always remember the clever wordage and I can't. So what's that called again?

I, you got me tonight, but I was thinking audit and I know that's the wrong word, but yeah, I know exactly what you're speaking.

So, so, so here's the thing, clerk, the we've had this charter since 1986. Okay. We are in 2026. I'm doing the math without taking off my shoes. I think we're at 40 years.

Sounds right.

We've never done this. Can you imagine going through an organization, doing rules, and never having a proper review of something over 40 years? And I just think... If the city attorney was here right now, sometimes we have court cases based on conflicting language in our ordinances. And then I'm heavily reliant on the online ordinance book. And if that thing's not current and if that thing's got conflicts, I can't be a good decision maker because I'm relying on what's in. I think our residents do to a lesser extent, but they do as well. So that's the one thing. I need to harp on this. I don't know, in our city council budget, I haven't really looked at it. I don't know if there's, maybe the council president, did you put aside any money for that purpose in our city council budget?

No.

We are going to be in discussion with that. And I actually have a discussion, me and you have a discussion about the importance of that. And I told you that I was going to prioritize that. That's by all means going to take place when it comes to the ordinance and the ordinance book reorganization perhaps. I know that the clerk have a quote from the past. It's probably stale now.

We did get a quote on that. I think when you were the president, we got a quote on that. But it was substantial, and then we didn't. Yeah. It's also, as I was saying, it's a time. Maybe that's where we can put the two new people to free up some time. It's a time thing. Even if you're working with the company, you have to put in the time to check what the company's doing for you, or it's not going to be of use. You know what I mean? But no, I think it's worth noting, and I think it's worth investing the time and the funds in to get it done.

So I'll end this portion with that. To me, I don't have a sense of any problems in your office. I think you were leading it well. If there is conflict, you seem to be able to manage it.

Thank you.

I think your staff, I think follows you and you've got a good team that seems to be working and going for the most part in the direction that you want to achieve the best course of action for the city. So I don't really have any problems with that. So my issue, and it's not really problems, but it's, So that's the first thing was that audit. The second thing is, and this is, if we don't do this now, it's like DPW and telling them to work under the ground. It's not very sexy fixing the pipes, but if a pipe breaks, my God, it's like the most important thing. But it's not like a park. You can do a park and say, look at the fantastic, beautiful park. You can see it, but you can't see the pipes. In your office, it's the archiving. It's the records. And And it's not sexy, and it's not, but when you get these public records requests that I'm sure that are coming in, and people are entitled to get information regarding our government, and we're not, and I'm not blaming you, this is institutional.

No, no, I understand what you're saying, yeah.

But we need to work on figuring out a way that if we wanted to find out a police department or a health and human services department or recreation or police, fire, et cetera, we could find out what those records are with respect to it. And it's a valuable resource to the people who are currently working, because we are a transient city not only with our residents, but with our employees. We turn over, and when we turn over, the institutional memory is lost, and sometimes if you don't have the institutional memory, if you've got something written, at least you've got a place that you can find something. Oh yeah, that's what they did back in 2012, or 16, or whatever the year is on that. speaking an awful lot, but I haven't had a chance to talk about that in some time, and I think it's important. And I just want to put that on your radar screen. I would put that number two. Equally important, but we haven't done the other thing in 40 years, and it's a mess. Anyway, if you have a reaction on that, is that something we can do? Is the CAFO still here? I can't see her, if she's still here.

She's here. She has no choice.

If you want to respond, but I do want to throw a little bit of this grenade on the Capo's desk, just to see if there is, you know, we have capital improvement stuff coming on, and I just don't know where the money is. So anyway, Clark, did you have a response? Do you think it's important? Am I overstating it? You can be honest with me.

No, I think when you say the day-to-day public records requests, that part I feel like we have actually under control in a really good way. My concern, and I thought you were going down a slightly different path, a lot of people right now want to get their dual citizenship. It is the hottest thing since sliced bread. I don't know. I'm looking at it. The French Canadian population is the one that really wants it right now because like most cultures, you have to go back, you can only go back two generations. Like for Irish or Italian, you can only go back a parent or a grandparent. With the French Canadian, to get the dual citizenship, I probably shouldn't tell you this because you'll be down there tomorrow, you can go back as far as you can go back till you find that French Canadian relative. So many people want the Canadian citizenship. It's... it's hot right now, and because they can go back more than just a parent or grandparent, they're going back two, three, four, great-grandparent, beyond the great-grandparent. And those books are a concern to me. Some of them, the pages are, Some of them, the ones we use more frequently, the pages are almost falling out a little bit. But even the ones we don't use frequently, the pages are dried out. The ink is fading. That kind of archiving is really a concern. And that's a big project. That's a huge project. That's something that we would need to earmark a bunch of money. That would be a $40,000, $50,000 project. That's...

So what I would like, if I was king and ruler and by executive fiat, I would order that we would do... He's just laughing. I would order that we would do two things. One, we would immediately get rolling on that audit. And the second thing I would... The audit with regard to the books, I'm not even sure that could fit. I doubt it. You're the expert on capital improvements. The second part would be the... the archiving, that I would say, you can't do it all at once, do it step by step, do it incremental, do it over four years, five years, to get the cost out, so it's more manageable, so we don't, and it's a lack of space. I mean, everybody's talking about, was it 255 Essex, is that the number? Everybody's using that? I thought at one point we were gonna use that to store stuff, I don't even know if that's true anymore. But, like papers and things. But those are the kinds of things, I think, as we start focusing on our government and our space that we need to take a look at. And I'm asking you, are either one of those items something that the capital budget can be spent on? Or free cash. I guess free cash could be, but...

So I will be coming for the budget and finance next week for the PAYGO capital for FY26. Those items are not included. I have asked departments to submit the request. I don't remember getting one from the city clerk, but we do have FY27 PAYGO capital that we can put some money aside to get something started at least. So I would recommend maybe getting a quote to see where we're at, where we need, and then we take it from there. We can put money aside for that.

That's my request. If we can make it happen, it would be awesome, but at least taking a few steps in that direction I think would be positive. And so when we have this conversation next year, we can say, yeah, we'll make some progress. That's right.

Thank you. Before we go to the second round of questioning, I have two questions for you. Three questions. One is for the capital. I was going to ask you, Eileen, but I guess this is more like a citywide question. Are all city employees, since we're talking about the city clerk's office, including the city clerk's office, subject to comp time?

So comp time, when it comes to union, each union has their own comp time definition. When it comes to non-union, we are currently trying to implement some guidelines. So we're working with the administration along with the personal department and the city attorney. So that's something that's in the works.

I'm going to request an itemized report for comp time per department and per employee. I want to look into that. I know there are some... I just want to look into it. I think it's important as we're reviewing this budget. So if we can get that to the Budget and Finance Committee, that would be great. Absolutely. Thank you. Also, I'm not done with my questions. This is a question. First, a comment. Thank you for the laugh. Our first night, Monday evening, we had... a few laughs with the financial department division, and it was actually a good night with them. So I appreciate that you started off with a nice little joke there. Not joke, but your kudos to your department. One thing that I asked the other offices on Monday was, IN-STATE TRAVEL. WE ARE AWARE OF IT, BUT SOMETIMES WE DO GET ASKED ABOUT IT BY CONSTITUENTS. GIVE US AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT AN IN-STATE TRAVEL LOOKS LIKE FOR YOUR DEPARTMENT. FOR THE CITY CLERKS SPECIFICALLY.

THE TWO INSTANCES WE REALLY HAVE OF IN-STATE TRAVEL IS IF ME OR ONE OF THE ASSISTANT CLERKS GOES TO THE MASSACHUSETTS CITY AND TOWN CLERK ASSOCIATION HAS MEETINGS. WE DRIVE TO THOSE MEETINGS. That's the in-state travel that we have. They do have a conference. Jen went to the one in February. Didn't go to the one in June, but I've gone to the one in September. That's really the one in-state travel that we would be driving to that. The other in-state travel that we do is on election day, which sounds crazy, we rent a U-Haul truck to get all the equipment out there, and then we put that into the in-state travel as well, because it's in-state and it's travel. But we do the mileage for that truck, and then the rental of that truck goes through in-state travel. So our in-state travel is pretty minimal, and it's

It's only 500, but they do get out sometimes.

Yeah, but if it's that, it's specifically the U-Haul and the mileage for election day and the primary, and then as well to go to municipal clerk events.

Thank you, and then my last question is, as I was listening to the conversation and the questions that Councilor LaPlante was asking, you did say at one point that there was a quote requested for the audit.

Yeah.

And what happened? Why wasn't there any movement at that time?

At that time, we just didn't have funds, so we got the quote, we didn't have the funds, life gets busy, then next time, I SHOULD HAVE DONE IS EXACTLY WHAT THE CAFO IS KIND OF INDICATING IS GET AN UPDATED QUOTE, PUT IT IN FOR PAGO CAPITAL, AND THAT, SHE'S SAYING WE'RE GOING TO HAVE FY27 PAGO CAPITAL COMING UP. I WILL GET AN UPDATED QUOTE AND GET THAT INTO THEM WITH A REQUEST FOR THAT.

THANK YOU. MAKES SENSE. THANK YOU. COUNCIL PRESIDENT.

Yes. Madam Clerk, you have under your department, you have subdivisions, departments, like perhaps your own office and the city elections office. That's correct. I'm seeing that previous years, I've seen that the principal...

We're not on elections yet. We're still in the city clerk's office. Yeah, it's the city clerk. It's under her. On Monday, we had each director.

Yeah, but I have a question that is related to salaries on each department. She oversees those.

Oh, got it, got it. Thank you.

So in your previous years, we have made the change to make, as per the union negotiation, the principal account clerks. Yep. And all of them has a similar salaries. That's correct. Similar raises. Yep. So in your department and the elections department as well, I'm seeing they have three accounts clerks, principal account clerks, and the elections divisions also have principal account clerk as well, three as well. Yep. So the salary look the same, but the raise under the union negotiation should reflect the same, but this is not the case.

I hear what you're saying. Yeah, I'm looking at that also. The assistant clerks are the same and they should be the same. The principal account clerks, In the, I don't think this would be that big of a factor, so that may be underfunded, there may be a problem there. The principal account clerks in elections are more senior, they've been there longer, whereas the principal account clerks upstairs in my office are newer.

So there's not a contract negotiation on that, on a specific range? Okay, just wanted to understand.

Yes, so within the same principal counselor grade, we have different steps. So the senior ones might be a step five, where a new person might be a step one. So there is some difference in the steps.

So potentially you're getting, like, if the union negotiation is, let's say, 3%, I don't know, 2.5. 2.5. 2.5%. In some occasion, I know that you also get steps, and then the step might vary based on the person, how long they've been. Is this the case here?

Yes, so we do have a variation based on the steps, and also if last year's budget was a little on the high side, we literally went through every single person within each department to make sure that we are reflecting accurately what the person's getting paid with the increase. So we feel comfortable with the salary that we have here, and it does reflect the difference in different steps for the different positions.

So if you look at the city clerk and the principal account clerks, that's 153,939, right? 2.5% of that, does that mean 2,091? So you're on the city clerk's office? Yes.

Yeah. Right. So we literally took every single person and... No, it's not a person, it's a percentage. No, I know, but we have to take the person and the step that they currently have and then reflect that on the budget. LAST YEAR'S BUDGET MIGHT HAVE BEEN A LITTLE BIT OFF IN TERMS OF THE STEPS AND WHERE THE PERSON FELL IN.

LAST YEAR, I HAD TURNOVER. RIGHT NOW, ALL MY CLERKS UPSTAIRS ARE BRAND NEW VERSUS DOWNSTAIRS, THEY'RE MORE SENIOR. I THINK THAT'S WHY THEY'D BE AT A HIGHER STEP VERSUS THESE LADIES ARE AT A LOWER STEP.

Right, so the city clerks are maybe step one because they're all pretty much no, whereas the clerks within the Elections Department are all seniors, so they might be on step five.

It still doesn't make sense because the 2.5% is $3,848, and the increase that those three are getting is $2,091. So there is some type of maybe a mistake there or something. Because if they're getting 2.5% all of them.

Right, but they also get a step increase.

No, but I'm talking about this one, the city collection only. Let's assume that they have no steps.

Okay.

Just the 3% out of the 153,939, that's 3,948.

Well, you can't just take that amount and multiply it by 3%. We actually take the actual person, and we see what step they're in, what their race is, and that's why we have the number based on where the person is currently on the step, and then we do the 2.5%.

So what you're saying is that it doesn't matter the person, but I have three people, the total salary is $153,939. And based on the recommended budget, it's going to be $156,030 with an increase of $2,092.

Right.

And if that increase is only the 2.5% and not the steps, the $2,000 is not going to make it. Right. So they're not getting 2.5%.

The FY26 budget might have been a little bit inflated is what I'm saying.

I'm looking at this number. I'm not looking at the previous budgets.

No, but that's the increase you're referring to. You have to look at the previous budget.

So basically, if you played it last year, you get a little more last year, and now you're not getting it.

No, I mean, you have to see what happened in the department to come up with that, because maybe...

But the base salary is also lower now, because it's a new person coming in. It's not somebody that's been there for 10 years.

Right, so it's all the steps. So if you had four people, three people on step five, and then you go back to step one...

I'll call you tomorrow to go through the numbers.

All right. Thank you. I'm surprised he didn't say the joke on Monday was, we'll see you Wednesday. Don't worry. We still got you Wednesday. We still got you Thursday.

You see, I got you.

Monday evening was a funny night. I have to say it was a good night. Any other questions pertaining specifically to the city clerk's office? Seeing none, we're now going to move to election. So on Monday, I gave the opportunity to directors or the person in charge of those of their offices to come up and say a few words. So I am looking at Assistant City Clerk Richard Reyes to do a little introduction. Tell us how your office is going and then we'll get into the FY27 question.

Good evening, councillors. Richard Reyes, Assistant City Clerk, Canton Street Lawrence, Mass. My office right now, we're short staff. We have an opening. It hasn't been filled yet. My concern is that the month of June, we get real busy. We deal with confirmation cards that are going to be going out to anybody who didn't answer the census. Also, we're going to be dealing with postcards that the state is going to be sending out to every voter if they want to vote by mail. That's going to be another project. So right now, with three people, it's going to be real difficult. Hopefully we get somebody in there as soon as possible. So right now we're hanging on there. We're doing pretty good for now.

All right. Thank you. Councilors, any questions pertaining to the Elections Department? Councilor Marble.

I'm going to stick to similar questions with the city clerk. Did you, being that you've mentioned that you're short staff, was there ever a request from you or your department to the mayor?

Well, the position is there. We're just waiting for it to get filled.

So you just need one position to... One person to announce, yes. Okay. All right. I must say that when I looked at the numbers, there's nothing that really jumps at me. I think that your department is actually being feasible with the numbers in terms of the increase in salary. There's nothing that really that jumps at me for me to question it. And I understand your departments, how stressful it is along with other similar departments as well. So there isn't really anything like, I don't see myself objecting to specifically to your department's budget.

Any other questions or comments?

Remind me again, this year, this election cycle coming up, early voting and the vote by mail. Remind me again of who pays for, are both options around the table again this year? Do we decide on one or both? When is the state election? And is there any budget money for either one of those options?

Right now, the city pays for it, and then after the elections, after the November election, the state sends us this thing for reimbursement.

Pays for which one? Excuse me? Pays for which one, the mail or early budget?

For both. For both. They'll look at staff, any equipment that we purchase, which we're going to be purchasing new equipment, and staff, they're usually doing reimbursements on state elections only.

All right, so the budget side of that, so the state will pick up all of that, reimburse us. Mm-hmm. Okay. Do we, in years past, we've, there was one that we had no choice, we had to do, another one we had some control over. Was it the mail-by-vote, we had no control over, we had to do it, and it was the early voting that we did have control over?

We had early voting, but we opted out of, no, we opted out of vote-by-mail, but we had early voting.

But it's only for city election. We're not going to see that in this upcoming year.

City council doesn't need to approve for the state election. It's mandatory.

We're out of this altogether. And out of curiosity because we are paying for it and then we're being reimbursed. Is early voting required for the state elections? Yes, it is. How frequent? One week in September and two weeks is going to be in November. Is that usual? Is that changed this year? No, that's usual for the state election. One week in the primary, two in the general. Yes. Okay. Okay. Do we have collection boxes as well? Remind me of that for the mail.

We don't have a drop-off box for ballots because with a lot of stuff that happened throughout the state and other states with people throw cigarette buds, damaged boxes. It's happened in other states. So what we do is my staff and I We usually like getting the ballot inside the office because in case the voter forgot to sign, because if they forget to sign, we have to do the whole process of rejecting the ballot, sending them another one, and if it's a short distance of time of the elections and they don't get it on time, the voter gets upset. So we rather have the voter drop off their ballot to us in person. So in case anything is missing, we could kind of get to them and tell them to sign it. So the drop-off box, honestly, no. I don't think it's a good idea. Is your board, are we fully staffed on the Board of Registrars? Right now we have two, but I think one of them was resigning, if I'm not mistaken.

So we only have two members right now?

Yes, we need one. So who are the two that we have right now? We have Aldonza Perea, the Democratic Democrat, and Eileen Bernal, the chairperson.

So we need a Republican.

Nick Petrakis, a Republican, is the one. Who is? Nick Petrakis.

Petrakis. He's still on, but he's leaving? Yes. He has resigned already? Yes. He wants to. Okay.

He's kind of waiting for...

Yeah, we're just waiting on a replacement. They have to be Republican.

Okay, great. Thank you. Is that an application process? It's like a board.

I guess whoever decides.

So it's the same process. Okay, thank you. Council Marmo stepped out for a second. Council President, do you have any questions for the Elections Office? No.

I've seen that in previous budget. Thank you for being here. First of all, thank you for being here. Oh, thank you. Assistant the clerk. I'm seeing that in your department, over the years, you have the longevity section on the budget, and that's no longer.

No, in our office, no, no.

So nobody have? No.

Not even you?

That's a whole long explanation, but I don't really want to get into it now.

See, that's why I'm getting my books from previous years. I look at it and look at the difference. I've seen that it is $2,000 longevity. I mean, $1,500 longevity. I understand. I mean, we can definitely have that conversation, I guess, later on. That's another one. I'm going to write down a few. Thank you. You're welcome. Hi.

All right, I'm going to wrap up the elections portion with saying, and I say this to you every chance that I get, Richard, I appreciate you. I know the work that you do is not easy. Elections, campaigning, I mean, a lot of positions within municipal government, government in general, are political, but you are literally the definite, not you, but your office is political.

I have a great staff.

And what you guys do down there with the amount of work with the little staff that you, the short staff that you, small staff that you have, I'm appreciative. I know it's hard, but your work and your efforts doesn't go unnoticed. So thank you for everything that you do.

Thank you, counselor.

Kepa.

So if I may, I'd like to go back to that point. I didn't have the exact figures, because I just want to. For which one? For the 3%, the 2.5. The longevity? No, no longevity. Longevity, we can talk about that another time. Okay. So the first on page, on FY26, for the principal accounts clerk, we had three people on step five, right? 51,313. Then for FY27, we have two people on step five and one person on step one. The difference between a step one and a step five is $5,000. Give me one minute.

So the steps are $5,000 or for two people?

No, the total between, the difference between step five and a step one comes up to $5,000. So there's your variance. That's why it looks like it's not a two and a half percent, it looks less than two and a half percent, it's because one other person is at 48,000 versus step five, they're each at 53,000.

Yeah, but we have the total amount.

Right, so we have to do it individually. Each person, depending on what step they're on, then you put in...

Send me those figures without the names. I just want to see the numbers.

Yeah, absolutely.

For the three people.

Are we good?

Are we good? Councils, thank you very much.

Thank you. Thank you. We went over vital stats and annual listings. All right, next we have the Health and Human Services Division. We have Director Velez here tonight and her staff.

Good evening. Martha Velez, Director of Health and Human Services, 155 Haverhill Street. Good evening Madam Chair and council members. Tonight I come before you to ask for your support, approval of HHS FY27 budget for $1,568,479. I am very fortunate to work alongside amazing team of administrators. Recreation Director Adely Gonzalez, Veteran Services Director Victor Ortega, Program Administrator Lisa Lovasco, and our supporting staff who love and work and do the work for the betterment of our city every day. We have accomplished many amazing things and are looking forward to continue growing, learning, and exploring new opportunities. This would not be possible without the numerous partnerships from the city, private, and nonprofit organizations, such as police, fire, DPW, Mayor's Health Task Force, community development, assessor's office, library, MassHealth, Groundwork Lawrence, AgeSpan, UMass Lowell, Essex County Foundation, United States Tennis Association, Everyone's a Player, the Red Sox Foundation, FIFA Soccer Mini Pitch, MassYouth Soccer Festival, Beyond Soccer, Counselor Mark LaPlante, the Lawrence Cultural Council with the unveiling of new veteran signs, Disabled Americans Association, and earmark funding from Representative Frank Moran. I can go on and on naming so many more. It takes a village, no one person or organization can do this work alone. Here are some of our major contributions to our city. Recreation acquired a new $100,000 mini pitch for Lawrence. Lawrence will host a FIFA viewing party June 29th at the stadium. One year anniversary of our tennis program, Howard Park renovations, Oxford Street handball court renovations, summer program with over 350 kids, Light Up Lawrence celebration, and the city's Christmas tree lighting event. We hosted the first ever Red Sox Foundation RBI coaches training. Department of Public Health Mass in Motion program highlighted our forms and procedures at their statewide meeting. VETERANS SERVICES DIRECTOR OBTAINED CERTIFICATION TO ASSIST VETERANS WITH FEDERAL VA DISABILITY CLAIMS, PROVIDED MORE THAN 675 DOCUMENTED VETERANS INTERACTIONS, LAUNCHED CHAIRPOINT INITIATIVES, DEVELOPED A COMPREHENSIVE STANDARD OPERATING PROCEDURE DEVELOPMENT PURPLE HEART CITY INITIATIVE TO IDENTIFY AND RECOGNIZE RECIPIENTS. implemented digital upgrade focused on accountability, reporting, record management, and operational progression. The center has registered over 7,000 seniors in our database and has provided 41,151 units of service, 7,912 congregate meals, supported the delivery of 79,000 200 meals on wheels in partnership with H-band. Over 25 elders became United States citizens through our citizenship class. We host Somos Fuentes Breast Cancer and Aroma de Cafe Alzheimer's support groups, monthly outreach to all elderly housing. HHS is not the police, fire, or EMTs, but what we do does save lives. We do this through social engagement, nutritional services, wellness, and exercise programs, support groups, educational opportunities, cultural and community events, outreach services, meaningful social connection that help our community remain healthy, engaged, and independent. I now ask you to turn to page 130. THE COUNCIL ON AGING'S BUDGET REALLY REFLECTS WHAT THE 2% RAISE IS FOR THE STAFF ALONG WITH WHAT WE ACTUALLY GET IN GRANTS. I WANT TO JUST MAKE IT CLEAR THAT I AM NOT GETTING A $33,000 RAISE. I MADE $156,000, BUT $125,000 LAST YEAR CAME FROM THE CITY AND $29,000 CAME FROM A GRANT, A FORMULA GRANT. My salary this year will be a 3% increase with the contract, and everybody else is 2.5%.

Martha, same for Council on Aging. Give us an example of an in-state travel.

So in-state travel is basically the person that goes and does outreach to the elderly housings, they get it. If our case manager goes out and has to do a home visit, she gets it. If I go to a conference or my staff goes to a meeting anywhere that's in Boston, in Springfield, we do travel, but not a lot. I mean, now with Zoom, before we used to travel a lot more.

I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT THERE'S AN ASSISTANT COUNCIL ON AGING DIRECTOR.

IT'S A PROGRAM ADMINISTRATOR. IT'S THROUGH THE UNION.

OKAY. COUNCIL, ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS FOR THE COUNCIL ON AGING? COUNCILOR MARMAL.

I'LL BE QUICK. DIRECTOR, I JUST WANTED TO SAY THANK YOU FOR SPECIFYING. The, that 33,000. I'm the type that I'm trying to make sense when I'm looking at, you know, other positions within other departments, like other directors within different departments with a similar salary range. And I'm trying to like do the math. I was like, well, why is this position is like a $6,000, you know, increase, which would include the 3%, but then this is so significantly different. So mentioning the grant just illuminated a lot for me. So I'm assuming that, has it always been that way, that your position, it's a portion of it is a salary proportioned by the city, and then the other remaining balance is coming from a grant?

No, that was just last year.

Okay, so for this fiscal year, would that?

That's all city money.

the 159 would be all city?

Correct.

Okay. All right. Similar questions with the other previous departments. Are you fully staffed?

I am right now, yes.

Okay. All set.

We actually added a program assistant, and that's why you see that it went up to 193. So the grant, that used to pay me now pays this person.

Okay, got it.

Almost there.

Okay, I heard Councilor LaPlante turn on his mic. Councilor LaPlante and then Council President.

Is that the key now?

Well, I heard, yeah. Like Morse code? As I looked over here. No, it's easy to be next to him and be like.

Okay. All right, so I want to.

Councilor LaPlante. Maybe you should join us.

So I wanted to thank you for your involvement in the Lawrence sign project. I'm going to be thanking the police department and the recreation department with Adelie and Lisa and veteran services officer. Your department has been extremely supportive. And I just want to thank you for being partners in this. And it's been a joy to do something like that. and having the kind of cooperation and partnership that your office and others have shown. So I just want to say thank you.

My pleasure.

I also, I've got a question on the Council on Aging. It's the, and this is the second time it's in the budget, and I think this year is the first year that we've had it. Do we currently have a Vietnamese coordinator?

We do.

And how did that go? And why is it, is it Southeast Asia or is it just Vietnamese? It's not Laos or Cambodia or any other of those Southeast Asian countries. It's just Vietnam.

She's Vietnamese, she speaks Chinese and seven dialects. So basically we have a lot more Vietnamese than any other Asian population in the city of Lawrence. When I partnered with the Asian Center way back, and this has started from way back like 30 years ago, there used to be a Cambodian population. Most of them have moved to Lowell. There is a small population, but it's a younger population. So yes, she does speak Vietnamese and Chinese. So she's able to communicate with everybody. And she's been with us for like 20 years now.

Is this just strictly with the Council on Aging, or is this like cultural, so no matter what your age is, if you are here most recently from Vietnam and you're looking for a place to get resources or assistance, like any other immigrant that we have that comes into our country, into our city, does this person do any kind of assistance, or just people who are seniors?

No, we help everybody, or we connect people to everybody. She also works at the Asian center, the immigrant Asian center, so she works there part-time and for me part-time. So when someone young comes in, she gives them the information and then she sees them in the Asian center and she actually connects them to making sure that they have the documents, taking citizenship classes, English classes, workforce development.

The other stuff that I have is on the revenue side, which we dealt with on Monday, and unfortunately I was out of the country and I wasn't able to be here for that. But I just have... We can, I think, talk offline, but I just want to tell you what the subject matter is. Sure. The subject matter deals with the working relationships between our recreation department and DPW, the workings of the fields and making sure the fields are maintained, that we're getting proper and we talked about this earlier, but funding and permits and fees of that nature to help offset any costs that are there. And I don't know if there's a working relationship with Groundwork Lawrence. They are, from where I'm seeing, heavy hitters in our city when it comes to trees and parks. They're like a de facto arm of our city at this point.

Agreed.

I don't know if that's good or bad, but that's the way we are right now. So I'm neutral on it. But I'm curious as to how all that interacts. That's a longer conversation. I don't want to, because I'm not sure how this is going to impact the budget. And so I just wanted, let's have that conversation later. But just be aware, I want the chair and our committee members to be aware that I do have, I'm not sure if it's concerns, it may be too strong a word, interest is probably a better word in how all that plays together and potential concerns if we're losing possible revenue sources to try to offset some of the costs that we are, we just voted for ANOTHER ON WEDNESDAY LAST NIGHT ON FOR THE FEAST OF THE THREE SAINTS. WE VOTED FOR MONIES FOR SAMANA HISPANA. WE'RE VOTING FOR ALL THESE OTHER KINDS OF THINGS. I'M JUST, I DON'T KNOW. WE NEVER USED TO DO THAT. WE'RE CHANGING. that is in your rubric. So those are the kinds of things I want to have a conversation on. If you want a very broad response, I'm welcome to it. I just don't want to take a lot of time on it.

As a matter of fact, as we, and I think I mentioned this to you once, we're looking at our ordinance for the recreation department and how we do permitting and I'm actually wanting to have a conversation with all of you also about how do we permit parks like when we do the common. It costs us money because I have to send a staff to turn on lights or like,

You spoke about this just two, three weeks ago.

Yeah. So I think it's really important that we look at this. We also, you know, right now we're not charging for leagues to play every week, but we do charge for tournaments. And I totally agree. I think the recreation department has to generate revenue. I mean, we all know that... In order to survive, you need money. And nobody ever has enough money, so we have to figure out how to make a dollar out of a penny.

I got two more questions and these are budget related. One's budget, one's not. Do you have any cameras through any of their, whether it's maybe recreation department, have any cameras in our city that you guys operate or have some use of?

That we operate? No, but we do work closely with the police department. They have cameras and when we see problems, we talk to them.

So who has custody of those cameras? Is that the police department or one of your agencies?

No, it's IT and the police department. Right, Chief?

Is it come before us for the for a budget for the budget yesterday? That's for revenues. That was for revenues. But also that was it. Were there any questions on cameras on it?

NOT SPECIFICALLY CAMERAS. I'LL DEAL WITH IT AT THE FULL COUNCIL. WELL, WE HAVE THEIR HEAD BOSS HERE, SO THERE IS A QUESTION. REMOTE IS HERE.

YEAH, BUT WE'LL DEAL WITH THAT TONIGHT, BECAUSE I.T. IS NOT HERE. I'LL JUST DEAL WITH IT AT THE FULL COUNCIL LEVEL FIVE.

I AM GOING TO SAY THAT WE ARE GOING TO HAVE SERIOUS CONVERSATION. ACTUALLY, THE CHIEF AND I HAVE HAD THIS CONVERSATION, AND WE ACTUALLY SPOKE TO THE MAYOR ABOUT IT. WE DO NEED MORE CAMERAS IN SOME OF THE PARKS. ESPECIALLY AT THE O'CONNELL, WHICH WE HAVE REQUESTED TO ADD CAMERAS TO THE BASKETBALL COURT. AND TODAY I WAS MEETING WITH CAPTAIN CIRILLO, AND THERE IS A CONCERN ABOUT THE SULLIVAN PARK. SO THERE ARE SOME ISSUES THAT WE HAVE TO ADDRESS, AND, YOU KNOW, THESE ISSUES CAME UP NOW. BUT RAMON IS VERY OPEN FOR ME TO COME IN AND SAY, OKAY, HOW CAN WE FIGURE THIS OUT? CAN WE GET SOME MONEY TO DO THIS?

JUST REMEMBER THAT IF THERE ARE GOING TO BE THOSE CONVERSATIONS AND THOSE BEAR FRUIT AND YOU WANT TO ACT ON IT, IT HAS TO COME HERE TO THIS COUNCIL, JUST AS A REMINDER. AND THE LAST THING, I JUST WANT TO, CAN YOUR DIRECTOR OF VETERANS SERVICES COME UP?

HE'S COMING UP NEXT. HE'S NOT PART OF YOUR GROUP? I'M ONLY REPRESENTING THE COUNCIL ON AGING.

WHAT WE DID WAS ON MONDAY WE HAD EVERY DIRECTOR OF EVERY OFFICE COME UP TO THE PODIUM TO ANSWER THEIR OFFICE QUESTIONS. YOU'RE WELCOME. Speaking of cameras, I'm going to add a little plug. I'm not sure if it's the city's responsibility or the state, because it is a state park, but Riverfront Park, we've had incidents there. The park itself and also the boat ramp. I would appreciate if that could be part of the discussion when it comes to adding more cameras to the parks.

I will definitely reach out to DCR.

I see Adderley may have an answer. Yeah. He's coming up. Yeah.

So we did have a conversation with DCR not too long ago, about two weeks ago, so it was Captain Cerullo, Lieutenant Oliveri, and we did talk about putting maybe one or two cameras, and they'll take care of it because they have their own vendor, but it's something that they're going to collaborate with the police department so they can have access and they... The police department has access and then the state as well has access to take care of the boat ramp.

All right.

Thank you.

Thank you. And the other thing that I wanted to say is that today I also had a conversation and I'll be reaching out to DPW to somehow put a fence over at the end of the parking lot in the boat ramp so people don't think that they can have picnics in the parking lot.

Thank you. I appreciate that. Council President.

Thank you. Through you, Madam Chair. So just going back to your salary, you clarified that you're getting 3% based on your contract. And then down the discussion, you also mentioned that you were getting $29,000 for A GRANT OR SOMETHING AROUND THAT. CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN A LITTLE MORE AS TO WHAT WAS THE GRANT, WHAT TYPE OF SERVICE YOU GUYS PROVIDE, SO FAR SO WELL, BECAUSE I HAVE THAT QUESTION. PEOPLE LOOK AT NUMBERS. YEAH. So basically everyone takes over the number. Sure.

Everybody that you see here is the formula grant, which I come before you when we get it. It's $16 a senior per year. And we have 14,000 seniors, 14,500. So we get roughly about $206,000, $210,000. And basically all of that goes into salaries and it also goes into MCOE fees because they're the ones that fight in the state asking for more money. And then any kind of subscriptions that we have. So we have a subscription for being able to show movies. If we go to a conference and we have to pay for that conference, it comes out of that. And my senior center gets paid from there also.

And out of that grant, that's when you receive the amount?

For last year, yes.

For last year. So we do receive these grants every year, and we actually approve it at the full council. Absolutely, absolutely.

I come to you every time it comes, yes.

So now you're not receiving that amount?

No, I did.

I received it, but again, I... For this next year, you're not receiving that amount anymore?

We are, but we're getting a program assistant. So I took that money. The city is picking up my salary. And I took that money and paid a program assistant.

So essentially, you're getting the $29,000.

Oh, yeah, yeah. It stays the same for 10 years. It's based on the census.

No, no, no. I'm saying essentially you are getting the salary increase of $33,000 because the city is picking up on it. It's costing the city.

Is that what you mean to say? Yes.

No, no, no. I just want to make sure. It's coming out of the city's pocket now. At the beginning when you started, you say no and then eventually it is. I just want to make sure. Because, I mean, the city will pick up to this year, and then next year will be on the budget from every year and so forth and so on. Correct. It will be an increase, yes. All right. You also mentioned that... You also mentioned that it's going to be a new position that's going to be paid under that and I see that you removed one position out of your budget and increased one position, one new position to your budget. So that's the position that was created and then it's going to be funded now?

Right.

Okay. So in that position is program assistance, right?

Yes.

Okay. What is the base salary for that position?

It's $25 an hour, so about $47,000 right now.

And that's a union position?

That's the new position. No, no union. With the 2%, 2.5%, it would come out to about $48,000. $48,483, I think it is.

So is that person going to be hired, or it's already been hired?

They're already hired.

Okay. And that position will be assistant with the senior specifically?

No, basically I cross train all my staff to, yeah.

At the senior center?

Yeah, or sometimes like if the veteran services director has to go to a conference and the confidential secretary is out, I send one of my staff to cover. HHS is one department, I believe, or team.

No, because the reason that I'm asking is because the fact that we're paying part of the salary with the specific amount of money that we receive per senior, which is $16 per senior, and that's a federal money, IT'S STATE MONEY. THEY HAVE DIFFERENT RULES.

I WANT TO SAY THAT Senior services have come a long way. They think more of a whole service now, not just based on a senior, but how do we help a whole family or a whole unit? There are seniors that are by themselves, and we help those seniors, absolutely. But when we have a family unit, we help the unit of the family and the senior, not just say, okay, what does a senior need, but what can we help the whole family with?

Yeah, the whole 10 of the health and human services is a combination of everything. How many years of service? 37. 37.

10 mayors.

Don't put it in perspective with the mayor. God bless you.

It's 10 mayors.

It excites me more when you say 37. Yeah. Because that's a long time.

I think 10 mayors is a better... I survived.

Getting along with them. Getting along with them. That's the point. Well, eventually I'm going to ask more questions about the recreation and stuff like that. But, I mean, you'll be involved as well.

Yeah, yeah. I'll be here. But they're capable.

I know.

They're amazing. So, Victor, your turn.

If you or Adelie can send me an email pertaining to Riverfront Park. I do have the neighborhood meeting coming up next Monday. I can give that quick update. Thank you. Director, how are you?

Good. Good evening, Chancellor, Madam Chair. For Victor Ortega, Veteran Services Department for Union Street, this year is going to be a level, same as last year. We just for FY27 major recommendation, 135 for salary and wages, 900 longevity, 615 stipend, 23,000 for other purchasing services, six hundred for office supplies, two thousand for operating supplies and seven hundred for dues and membership. When it comes to salaries, last year was seventy nine thousand but that was not my pay so trust me if it was a reduction in pay I would be here fighting for it but The correct pay for this year for FY27 is going to be $75,000. That's an increase, the 2.5 increase from last year. Confidential secretary, $59,950. And the 900 longevity, that's for her. I don't rate any longevity as of this year. On page 134, that is our chapter 115 fund. And if you can see the big increase there is because last year we didn't have exact data to see how much we'll be spending when I did the budget last year the first time. So we went with the same as the year prior to it, but now that we have the numbers for FY25, 26. So now we come out with that number this year, $427,000 to cover all the expenses for Chapter 115 to include ordinary benefits and barrier costs for veterans, widows, and dependents.

Before we get into the question and comments, I want to say, I mean, all city employees, for the most part, work really hard. Director Ortega You, I came across this Facebook post that you were delivering or picking up, I forget what it was, some, I think it was hygiene supplies, I forget what it was, I shared it to my story, and I would have never known about it if I didn't somehow come across that post. And what I'm trying to say by using this as an example is that as the Veterans Services Director, you do a lot, well, many do a lot, that we don't see. And a lot of our city employees are unsung heroes. And again, I want to thank the Health and Human Services Department. I want to thank you, Director, for your work, especially with our veterans, as you are yourself as well. That has given so much to our country. And thank you for doing your best every day for this city and for them.

Yeah, absolutely. I don't like to like take too much credit for it. That's why I don't like to post it on social media a lot.

I know, I know. I saw it. But I saw that I'm like, oh. Go do it for you.

Council of Marvel. Director, I really want you to go back and give me clarity with what you meant by the actual salary should have been 75, like, because I'm here. looking at this budget for your department and it actually makes me furious when I'm looking at other departments to which there is no problem when we're seeing an increase even though it's contractual obligations if that's how we want to word things. This isn't making sense to me and I am willing to vote no on this budget just simply because of your department. I don't agree with it. I don't like it. It doesn't even make sense to me. So give me clarity just so I could understand. Because to me it looks like a decrease in salary.

So that 79, that was the budget for my predecessor. So when I started it was 69, 703 I believe.

Still disgusting. I find it so disgusting. And it's a slap in the face to this department. It's a slap in the face to you as a director. It's a slap in the face to continuously for, I don't know if to place blame at the administration. I don't know who to blame when it comes to looking how this department is continuously being disrespected. is disrespected by not being fully staffed. Am I correct by that? Yes. By saying that? So honestly, I'm furious. And I am willing to vote no on this whole budget just because of this one department. Because I don't see how it's an issue for other departments Clearly I'm seeing $6,000 plus on pay increases. And despite that we want to defend the fact that there's contracts in place, you know, let's put it pretty, there's contracts in place. You know, we have a contractual obligation of 3%. And so we can negotiate for certain positions, but then somehow we drop the ball in this department all the time. But I don't know what I'm talking about sometimes. I don't know. I don't know if I'm furious for no reason.

I believe that that's the step for the unions, correct? Yeah. This was...

I understand your frustration. I'm sorry that you feel that way, but it is a union position. It's supervisors union. This is the steps that they put them in. So this has to be negotiated. They went through negotiations. I can say that just like the recreation department, I actually told them to ask to be brought up to another step or another grade. But it's part of the negotiation of the union. And this is what his salary is. He has one more step to go. Two more steps. Because he's only been here for a year and a half. A year and six months.

So when he came in, did you come in at the 79? No. No.

No.

That was just the person previous to you.

Yes.

You came in at what?

69.

So you came in at 69, and it's...

He had never been a VSO before. I actually interviewed him and loved his... He did a great job interviewing. He really had a passion about wanting to help veterans, and that's really what I was looking for, is someone that really cared about doing the outreach, how to connect to veterans, and that's why we hired him. Because he had never been a director or had that kind of experience, he had to start in step one, which was $69,000. And then every six months... Every year, no, six months. It used to be six months, right? First it was six months. Now it's every year, I think. I have to check.

So he started at 69 and it's being brought up to 75.

Right. And he's been here a year and a half.

Okay. I know. Like for a director.

I hear you.

I just, it pains me. I'm sorry. Totally agree. It pains me to see these numbers and to see how we're just like so easy to give.

Someone that also hasn't been in a position before and may have less than a year and a half.

We're giving money away with salaries that don't make sense yet. You know, somehow they get appointed. And I just feel like I'm looking at this and even though we're following, we're going off of the steps, but I don't know.

You know, I'm going to fight for my directors, especially, you know, and I mean this. There's two directors here, which is Veterans Services and the Recreation Department. Recreation Department director does not sleep probably from April all the way until like November. We're on call all the time. He's on call with veterans. I mean, so they're not an 8 to 4, shut your door, go home kind of position. It is not. So... I hear you, I feel you, because I also feel like, you know, my staff, the directors really deserve to make more money. But there's no control in that unless we really negotiate next year and really bring it up to.

And how many open positions are currently in place for this department?

There is none open positions. There are positions in the ordinance. We did agree that while he got himself, and if you notice when I spoke, you know, about how he's really putting systems in place, there was no way to really keep data on how many veterans we were serving what we were doing, what the outcomes were. So now we're doing that. So next year, we're definitely gonna come before the city council and say, okay, he needs either a part-time or another full-time person to help him with the outreach. And I will definitely fight for that.

But we've been knowing that, and I feel like this budget would have been the opportunity to advocate for this.

We did speak to the mayor about it, but I have to be truthful, right? I mean, anytime I get money, I have to have data. I have to have numbers. And the only numbers that we had before this was the 33, right, or 44 people that were on Chapter 115. But now he's keeping track, like you saw, 675 units of services. You know, he's keeping track of the burials that he helps. And he's having his confidential secretary do the same. So she's being trained also to be able to follow the process of shared point and do everything that needs to be done to be able to really show our need. Our need is, do we have something else? We give the veteran services director, senior tax work off people, my staff always helps him out. Lisa, our program administrator, she's always, always willing to help Victor. We create flyers together. We help him in whichever way that we need to help him. We put up flags together. We do everything together so that we know. I will definitely next year. I know that he's doing what needs to be done. So there's not going to be a no because there's going to be numbers showing.

Yeah. Well, my apologies for, uh, I actually like your passion, but yeah, my, my frustration, I'm going to put you on my side. It's just seeing like kind of gross negligence from other departments where I'm just, the numbers aren't making sense. And then I come across his department and I'm like, I, and it's just, it's time and time again, not, it's not a one-time thing where it's like, you know, we're having a rough time this year fiscally. Let's be a little bit responsible. It just seems like it's every fiscal year. Your department seems to be like, you know, like you're a mat and people walking all over you.

I WANT TO HEAR FROM DIRECTOR OTAY BECAUSE I'M LOOKING AT YOUR FACE AND VERY BLANK AND I'M TRYING TO READ YOU AND MONDAY I THERE WAS MINIMAL LIKE THE DIRECTORS OF THE OFFICE REALLY REALLY HELD THE CONVERSATIONS FOR THEIR OFFICES AND I WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU WHAT IS REALLY THE ASIDE I UNDERSTAND BEING SHORT STAFF BUT WHERE DO YOU REALLY NEED THE SUPPORT THAT Director Velez can say, all right, next year, this is for sure. Where is that hole?

So I'll be completely honest, yes, it would be amazing to have more staff to it, but we have to look at the bigger picture that we are in. We don't have a place to put the mat. If you look into my office, there is no way we can put one, two more staff there. It would be ideal to have more personnel, because outreach is something that Director Velez will work on this past year. It was not done before. We implemented some way to do outreach in the community, And we were able to reach out more veterans that way. That is our biggest goal, our biggest focus in the office. That is where we need help at doing the outreach because per the report from OVA, we have about 3,100 veterans living in the city. We are serving only probably 0.2%. out of that. So that's a big problem for us. So we need to find ways to reach out to them, do more outreach, and that is our main area where we need to help at.

Would these outreach positions, would this be more like remote positions where they're visiting veterans going to their home? Visiting, yes. So why would they need space? You know, if anything, they could... Mary Mack Street, there's... I don't know if there's office space, but if this is more of a remote...

I was going to say that the center upstairs, your conference room, is a hybrid schedule.

And this is more remote, so I don't see... You know, it's not a desk job. They're more of an outreach, so... Yeah, they don't necessarily need to be in the office. You don't need space for them like that. Yeah, I agree.

Right?

I want to also say that he has been certified to do VA claims. VA claims are very difficult to do time consuming. we just started doing it right uh... finally you know we followed through with what we wanted uh... there is a strategic plan for us like how to get to that point right and uh... When he does get to that point and we put all those words out, we will need somebody to work with the VA claims because it takes a lot of time. But again, like you say, it could be someone going to somebody's house with a laptop and then he'll need a laptop and he'll need Wi-Fi and he needs all that other stuff that we will put in place. I promise you I will put it in place.

I'm assuming, do we have data as to how many veterans are wheelchair bound? So they're struggling to... kind of, you know, transportation issues. So you have to, we would have to physically go to them.

Yes, absolutely. We have, with the outreach initiative we did this past year, FY26, we have about 47 that are wheelchair bound. And out of those 47, I'm highly pushing to be placed into a rehab center or a nursing home because the conditions that they're living in are not safe. So that is something also when I do the outreach and when I go visit veterans, that is something that I take note if it's safe for the veteran, if it's not. Then I have to take time to coordinate with other services that are in the area like H-PAN, clear path volunteers of America so we can enroll these veterans to get them the services that they need. So I'm able to delegate some of that weight when it comes to helping veterans with these groups, but I'm the type of person that when they're not moving fast enough, they're not moving at all. That's the military.

All right, well. NO QUESTIONS AS OF NOW.

COUNSELOR, I'M GOING TO DO THE OPPOSITE THIS TIME. COUNSELOR. JUST BE CONSISTENT. GO AHEAD. I'LL TRY TO SWITCH IT UP. COUNSELOR PLATT.

I MEAN, IT'S THE SAME THING.

COUNSELOR PRESIDENT. ALL RIGHT.

No, I actually don't have, like, that deep of a question. I just want to say thank you for everything you do for the veterans. And I believe that, you know, the fact that you came in, you've been getting yourself involved into the benefit for the veterans and see the needs of the veterans from Lawrence, it is something that it takes a lot for any director to be successful. IN YOUR DEPARTMENT AND ALSO MANY OTHER DEPARTMENTS THAT DEAL WITH PEOPLE. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES IS FOR THAT. SO THANK YOU FOR JOINING THEM. THANK YOU FOR WHAT YOU'RE DOING. ABSOLUTELY. THANK YOU FOR HELPING US WITH THE FLAGS. OH, YES, SIR.

COUNCILOR PLATT.

THANK YOU. IN ALL SERIOUSNESS, I DO APPRECIATE ALL THAT YOU'RE DOING. I want to throw some vocation and direction. I'll save that to the end. I want to ask first regarding your numbers that you gave regarding the number of veterans in the city.

What was the number you gave? So the total number per the federal census that the federal government sends to the state office, veteran advocacy, right now in Lawrence, per those numbers, 3,104.

3,104. And then you gave another stat. The number of individuals who, through your office, you're providing any kind of assistance was what point something?

675. 675. Those are the times a veteran came into the office for services, veterans, widows, dependents. Sure. either by walk-in appointments, phones, or we do an outreach or a home visit.

I think that your job is critical. I think it's important. I think that having someone in your position providing services to the men and women who served our country and have returned back or came to Lawrence, however they ended up in Lawrence, is important. What's fascinating to me is in a federal government that revolves around numbers, everything's numeric, right? Count everything. I think that's a guesstimate. I think that's a number that can go up or down. It fluctuates. And from people that I've talked in the kind of position that you're in, no one really knows for sure how accurate that number is. It could be up a little more. It could be down a little more. No one really knows what that number is. And not every veteran is going to be needing of services. I know plenty of veterans who make six figures who live in the city of Lawrence. They own their homes. They're not going to be knocking on your door looking for benefits. But I do know veterans as well who are not doing well, who are struggling to make ends meet, who are in need of health care, most specifically, because they don't have the kind of assistance and those kind of medical needs are more prevalent than mostly anything else. So I do know that we really, when we talk about our veteran community, it is very, I mean, it's high and it's low, it's a lot in between. And so I just, I don't know if that 675, that's a real number, I'm not doubting that. I don't know if we can set a target number because we just don't know what the needs are. And so to chase a number, I just think being available and present and not saying no to someone who is in need is what we need to be and making sure people are aware that if they do have a need, there is a resource here. And I know we have other organizations. I'm thinking DAB right off the top of my head, who's very involved in partnering and you've got those resources. So anyway, I thank you. Someone in your position, And I've known you before you took over this position, and I'll never forget the kindness that you offered. But I just know how much you care for our veterans, and you are one. And you've led men before, men and women. And so you are a leader. You know how to lead, and you've got that kind of training. So I've got a lot of confidence in you. which goes to my bouquet. So I want to thank you for the LSP project. I also want to thank and I want to remind my colleagues, your agency was the one who gave me the flags that I was able to plant at those 19 grave sites in those three cemeteries. So in addition to the LSP project where you've been there every week, because most of the folks, not all, most of the folks that we have corners and things named after them are most are veterans, not all. but you've also stepped up with those flags. I usually picked it up myself every time I went down there, and it was nice to have a partner who picked that up a little bit, and it was great. So I just want to say publicly thank you. That was meaningful. The people who have contacted me, and it's not just me, it's people like both of you and others who have done something amazing to help me do what I've was able or have been able to do over the past nine years. So thank you. Thank you for that. And I do appreciate you big time.

I appreciate, appreciate that. And, uh, you brought up a point about, uh, you know, veterans that make six figures a year, they might not need benefits. Uh, but as a veteran myself, there is some, uh, needs that are not seen like mental health, uh, or things of that nature. Uh, we are, uh, uh, I CANNOT SAY WE ARE A RESOURCE CENTER WHEN IT COMES TO, LIKE, WE HAVE THIS, WE HAVE THAT, BUT WE ARE THAT BRIDGE, THAT GAPS, THAT NEED FROM THE VETERANS TO THE SERVICES THAT THEY NEED. SO REGARDLESS IF THEY ARE WEALTH FINANCIALLY AND THEY DON'T NEED CHAPTER 115, THERE'S ALWAYS SOMETHING THAT THEY WILL NEED TO US. SO I DO APPRECIATE YOU BRINGING THAT POINT. willing to work with you, continue to work with you in the future when it comes to veterans and a veterans project in the city as well.

Any other questions or comments? Seeing none, thank you, Director Ortega. Next we have Director Gonzalez. I think this is your last one, Martha, right? Director Velazquez.

good evening good evening good evening madam chair good evening council president and counselors my name is adele gonzalez director of recreation for the city of lawrence and i know i'm going to butcher this because mark is here 481 south broadway how do you say counselor

Is that how I say it? Let him say it. Go ahead.

Is that the correct way to say it? Broadway.

I was waiting for him to be like, it's Counselor LaPlante.

So before I get started, I just want to mention to everybody that's watching, the summer program applications are up and running. So if you have any kids 6 to 12 years of age, you're welcome to pass by our office at 155 Haverhill Street, the second floor of the Recreation Office, and pick up your applications. They'll be open until the last week of June. So I hope I see all of you to come and sign up your kids for the program. And the program is six weeks, July 6 to August 14, 8.30 a.m. to 2.30 p.m. All right. All right. First of all, I just want to talk a little bit about my department. I know Martha covered Director Velazquez. I know it's like, covered a lot about my department and everything we're doing. One of our biggest things and accomplishments is working with Mass In Motion. We have created a lot of things, a lot of programs, a lot of structures with that in my department. When it comes to tennis in the parks, all the relationships like, director burlesque mentioned with the rest of foundations with fifa we're having the bruins celtics patriots new england revolutions all these organizations come to our city and take care of our students and our kids has been a great success we have a young lady that works at the council on aging but Martha lets me borrow her once in a while. It's a great help for my department. She is mass in motion, you can say. She does everything in every program with my department in mass in motion.

Is she the one who, when the first session of the tennis program that she was sitting in? She's amazing. Yes, she's amazing.

So she's a huge help for my department. When I'm focused with Director Velez on other things, she's always on top of things and getting things done for my department is a huge help. And it's worked out a lot. A lot of things have been happening because of her, so kudos to her. When it comes to structure in my department, we have been tirelessly years after years working on how to structure our department better. This year, for the first time, when we get churches that want to get permits for the corners to preach, we're charging them $25. Because like we said, we have to make income somehow and revenue for the department. So having... something so small to come in, it helps a lot with some of the bills that we have to pay. So that's one of the new things we added this year. Another thing is we work tirelessly with the city clerk's office on permits that come before you guys to approve. So any common, south or north common, They come in, they fill up a citizen service application to our department, they pick a date, we put that in our calendar, the city clerk's office confirms with us, once it's approved and okay by us, it comes before you and you guys approve, that's another structure that we put in our department. We're still working tirelessly with the softball organizations and our sports, but that's something that we're still gonna keep working hard and keep developing in the next couple of months or maybe the year. And we'll keep working on that. Our collaboration with DPW is getting better. We have started a new Excel sheet and Google sheet where we're communicating more on what is it that we have to do on parks. Staffing at the stadium or any maintenance or anything that the park needs. Every day communication has been key. So every morning we meet with the park supervisor of DPW. We go over things to have to get on throughout the day as well as maintenance or any of our concession stands or anything else So it's a work in progress bus We continue we're still gonna keep getting better and better and if you have any questions before I go to the budget I'll be sure to take some Two comments actually What you Have done this department with recreational services this year is amazing

And with the limited budget that you have this current fiscal year where you have introduced tennis, flag football, soccer, cheerleading.

Basketball. Basketball.

Like I mentioned, I went to the first tennis program last summer. And then a few months ago, you guys had the girls, girls and sports event that that the name was packed, packed with young girls from our school system. And it was beautiful to see. And I'm rooting for you guys. I want to see more of that. And I know funding is an issue. But the fact that this has been successful from the start, that I know Director Velez is a data person. That data right there speaks for itself. So I'm hoping that helps you. it makes your case stronger when it comes to advocating for funds for programming in our community. Secondly, as you are continuing to prepare for the summer, I'm gonna mention this again, the boat ramp is one of my biggest headaches. I have top three, and that's one of my top three. I get calls consistently from constituents that live in that area about the boat ramp, and I know there is still a meeting coming up for it, please keep me in the loop um I I want to make sure that we have someone there the hours that there's supposed to be that is blocked off when it's not in use or locked up or whatever the term may be and just ensuring that yes and I understand that's that's a a great recreational um area to have not many communities have it and i understand that but we need to find a balance as well because i i do get numerous of calls from residents that live in that area pertaining to to the activity there so that's my last little plug for that well regarding the bull ram bomb

Since it's not open yet, that's why you're getting a lot of calls and a lot of neighbors giving you complaints. But as soon as we open the bull ramp, it's fully staffed. We have two individuals per day. One goes to lunch, one stays, then they come back there together. But once it's there, we pretty much keep... Everybody out of the boat ramp and we keep order and when there's always a problem Or we have anything that's happening the police department in the fire department always there to help us out And it keeps order on the boat Rambo I mean we'll work on that and like you said there's is some meeting coming up for the hours of this year And we'll keep you in the loop for that.

Thank you. I appreciate that

Yes, and we also changed the lock.

Thank you. Councilors, I see Council President's ready. Council President.

Yes. So, Director, thank you for everything you do. Thank you. You're one of the directors that I get. you know, that I call a lot for a specific reason. I like to, I'm involved with sports, so the recreation department is definitely a special department for everything we do when it comes to sports in the city of Lawrence. And the way that I defined the recreation department, the way that I see it, the way that I have a vision for it, is that we fund or communities fund recreation department with the purpose of getting kids out of the street on an affordable way. If we change from there, then that might become an issue because that's the main purpose of having a locally funded department that help out that you know that work together with different groups organizations and and help out manage the local fields and the local sport activities throughout any city, at least in Massachusetts. There is other ways of doing that that many organizations or many cities and towns use, and that's using nonprofit organizations, that they manage the park, that they maintain it, and the recreation department goes away. We don't want that in Lawrence. But we don't want the recreation department to work similar to a nonprofit organization either because that's not the purpose. It's two different systems. Both of them work. Cities have different needs. In Lawrence, we have a recreation department run by you, an athlete, that not many people knows your background as an athlete. If you share with them, I don't wanna share it, so they know, and people up there knows what you have done when it come to sport, this is the time.

Okay, so I guess you put me out there in the spot. So what a lot of people don't know is I was a Lawrence High track athlete. I was the Division I state champion in the 800-meter runners. I was one of the top 2,800-meter runners in the country at the time when I was a senior. My talents took me to a small college in Kansas my first year. Went to a Division I school after the Kansas State University. After I got back, I joined the Dominican Olympic team where I ran for six, eight years. Got to travel the world a lot. Got to go to different places. I ended up going to Ghana and Kenya for a month. And I was able to train and see different cultures and expand my horizons as an athlete. And now I've been at Lawrence High School for four years now, and I'm the distance coach for the school. So it's great to be back and give to the community that build me. I was an Oliver graduate, so I did fourth to eighth grade Lawrence High School kids. So it's good to be back and give back to the community. you know that gave so much to me and gave me the opportunity to go so far so like you said not a lot of people know that i don't share that a lot with anybody but i mean now it's out there and everybody knows the kind of person i am and the kind of athlete i was so

No, and the reason why, I know that, sorry for a long period of time, but since I've been here in the council, you come every year to talk about the recreation department, and you don't share that. This is the first time, and that's why I was like, I need to put him on the spot. And I'm sorry about that, because I mean... And why I did that is because people need to know that our recreation department is not run by somebody that haven't played before. Right. That haven't been on those fields before. That have gone to the struggles of having a field that is not quite fixed, but you have the heart of the person, of the athlete on it. It's special for Lawrence Kidd. My son, he's 12, he's an athlete. And when we go and play to those beautiful fields up there in other cities and towns, Guess what happened? He come from the fields that have hold on it, and that's making a better athlete. And because of the heart is there, because he knows where he come from, and also because he represent. And that's a key issue that recreation departments in general throughout Massachusetts have the kids represent. And they don't have a lot of money potentially They don't have a lot of research potentially, but they have that heart that makes them special. We want to keep that, Lawrence. And through the recreation department, I believe that we are doing that. Do we need to fund the department a little more? By all means. I'm seeing that you have new items on the departments. We definitely, if you guys put it on there, that's because we need it. I understand that. You also mentioned that you, or I think that maybe Martha mentioned it, that the fields and the leagues for different sport, they potentially, the tournaments are gonna be, they're free. during the weekday, but you're going to charge for the tournament. Did I get that correct?

Yeah, so the leagues are free, but when it comes to tournaments, they're charged by hour. We have a system that we implemented of how we price the tournaments.

Yeah. So when it comes to that, that's why I wanted to make sure that we mention the importance of the recreation department because we understand when you said the mentality is we need to make some money to keep on doing what we're doing. I got it. But I think there is ways of getting those funds. And there is ways to identify... uh also uh those those tournaments that are making more than a regular tournament that uh are not i just i just i just they just did it because they want to happen so in espanol that not everybody should be judged by the same way. The same sense. Exactly. I know a better answer.

By the same sense.

But that's the idea. So those that are creating the problem, let's identify those. But those that are just having a tournament to have fun, I don't think that we should use the same formula. And there is ways of identifying that and putting the result. Perhaps I give you a good idea. There is tournaments that don't bring more than 100 people to the site. There is other tournaments that do bring more than 100 people, 200 people, 300 people, 1,000 people, probably 2,000 people, maybe 3,000 people. down on Lawrence Street. I'm part of it. I go there. I love them. But we cannot judge those tournaments. They send us, oh, a team from Pennsylvania come up to Lawrence, and we're not going to be able to host that team because they don't have the money to pay for the fields. So that's what I'm getting at, and that's an important conversation to have. I don't think it should be the same way, but I believe that if this is not fully implemented, that we should have more discussion before it's fully implemented. Because trust me, there is going to be people that only have one opportunity to play. And that's on that specific tournament. And if we don't have that specific tournament done, then potentially we might have more people in the street. And that's one of the main purpose of the recreation department. So Adelie, I know that you're well prepared. You have Marta behind you as your boss, that is, she's also an athlete. And you guys understand the need up there and it is important that we kind of like, you know, continue the conversation.

I want you to know that Adelie and I meet with everybody. And even with tournaments, we ask the questions. We ask the questions. We ask if they're going to charge. We ask how many people are coming. We ask how many parks they're going to be using. Unfortunately, in the past, everybody was used to just taking five parks. And if they didn't use it, they didn't use it. And if they did, they did. And now there's a structure. And to be honest with you, you know, the charge for a tournament that normally there is a prize at the end of whoever wins or money is being collected to fundraise for an organization or for something. We only charge $25 an hour to use our parks. So, I mean, if someone that doesn't have a lot of, like, money, then use one park and then maybe grow into the next one. But, you know, it's been a wild ride. It really has for Adelie and I. I think that we both have always agreed that it's probably been the hardest thing that we've had to do is to structure how it's being run and to learn from our mistakes and to learn... And we've made mistakes. And I'm the first one to admit it. I'm sorry we made a mistake. And I'll be the first one to call somebody and say, all right, how do we fix this? But then we have people that, you know, no matter what you say to them, they don't want to fix it or they don't want to play nice in the sandbox and your hands are cuffed and you have to say, okay, because... You know, there's people that will negotiate with you and people that will talk to you. And then there's people that will talk to you and tell you something that's not really happening. And then you find out that something else is happening. And then there's a lot that goes on. But I think we'll get to a good space. I really do. I think that we're, like, 90% there. Where, trust me, when I tell you two years ago, we were probably only 5% there. And it was tough. It's been tough. I say to Ramona, it's probably been one of the hardest jobs I've done is trying to like create a system and create equality and try to understand where everybody's coming from to try to be fair. But I hear you. I understand what you're saying. And I think that we are very open to listening.

And we work with people. I mean, there's been plenty of organizations even to use the stadium that, like Marta said, we sit down with them, we talk to them, we talk about their financial, you know, challenges, and we work with them. There's times that we charge, I'll use an example, a stadium fee, and we also, by union contract, have to pay a DPW worker. Sometimes we understand the need of this organization to use our facility that sometimes we just charge the... custodian fee so they come to our city use our facility or if they're city entities it's kids things we let them use and they just have to pay the small amount for the dpw worker so like i hear you and we can definitely sit down and have more conversation and work and set up a structure because that's what we're doing we're structuring everything we can to make sure that everything runs smoothly all right let's continue the conversation thank you yeah well

councilman thanks so real quick uh yes the uh your work when i was chair of the ordinance committee i used to call the golden ticket the yellow piece of paper the most important thing in our packet on any issue that looked for a permit that i thought was the most important was making sure that there was no conflicts on that day and i knew if they had the golden ticket there i was feeling pretty good about voting yes for that uh organization for that for that place so I think that was a really small but important change because we do go, we rely on you heavily. I know I rely on you heavily when I take my votes. If it's cleared with you, it's probably going to be cleared with me. I have the same kind of approach with the police department. If I get a clean bill of health from the police department on handicapped parking or something like that, I'm probably going to be voting in favor of it. So there are certain groups and individuals and positions that I need to rely on so I can be effective in my job. And I just want you to know that's part of what you bring to the table, and that was helpful. The place where I think we could probably use some improvements on, I still think the MUNIS, Is it called Munis? Oh, Citizen Serve. Citizen Serve, sorry. Citizen Serve, where we tell our folks that they have to do that. I'm not getting as many, maybe because I'm not in a position of leadership anymore that I'm getting that kind of complaints about it, but I was getting a lot of it at one time, and I don't know if that's still happening at all.

No, so actually, we're a little bit better. As soon as they come in and ask us if they want to use the park, we actually sit with them right on the spot if the data's available, and we help them fill out the application. So instead of telling them, oh, just come back or go on the website, we focus right there and there to just fill up everything that needs to be done so we wouldn't have that problem. Because like you said, we had a lot of problems. We took in the feedback and we restructure and now it's much easier.

Okay. The other thing, too, what I find really good, just to throw it out there, and I think Director Velez mentioned all the organizations, and I think that, and I think the Council President touched on it as well, which was we need the partnerships with these other groups to keep the cost down. I'm a firm believer that nothing should be free. I'm a firm believer that everything's got value. We may reduce the cost of it, but as long as you keep doing that, which goes back to the fields and everything, what you're trying to accomplish, I support. We shouldn't be giving these fields out for free. We should be charging something. It costs money, taxpayers, to get these things going. So while we may feel good about giving things for free, the taxpayers are actually picking that thing up, the cost for those things. And I don't, there needs to be a reasonable cost. I'm not looking to break anybody's back for money on this, but there needs to be a reasonable cost. And so I know that you're heading in that direction and getting partnership money, RBI, the private funds, all those things, your standalone, Revolving funds that you have, that you brought money in. You were successful in CDBG this year? Yes, sir, we were. So that's helpful. I'm not sure if you're going to do that in the future. Anyway, so we can talk about that later. So those are some of the things that just came to mind. And the last thing, again, I just don't want to... Since you're up at the mic, I just want to thank you for being present for the LSP projects throughout them, making sure that the... The sign is there, it's facing the right direction, you've got the covering on top of it, and just being present. And what makes me feel good about it, and to the fire chief as well, is when I see people who are interested, when I see people who look at it and then feel appreciative about it, it makes me feel like I'm accomplishing something. It makes me feel good, like information is going out there, and it's not about... It's rewarding is my point. And so thank you for that feeling. And because I think it's authentic and I think you really do care. And quite frankly, I didn't know all that stuff that you forced out of him. I mean, I knew a little bit of that stuff. I didn't know about the Olympic stuff. I mean, Greg Kent was the guy from the Marine Corps. We named, as you know, you ran on his track.

So I actually took some of Greg Kent's records at Lawrence High School.

And I knew that. That I knew. But I didn't know that you went down to the DR and you were part of that team and training as Kent was back in the late 60s for the U.S. So I think that's amazing that two guys from our city were at that level and had that kind of speed nationally, internationally is amazing. Kudos to you, but I will say this, that's not, I'm glad you brought that up, but he's more than just, he's more than just like an athlete, and he's someone, and I think you touched on it as well, but that's important, and that distinguishes you from many. Not many people can say what you said, that's amazing, but what's also really critical is your ability to, your work ethic, you're constantly working, I know that you care about our city. I see that. You know the folks who are doing this for money, and you know the folks who are doing it because they care. I know when I see you, you're not doing this for the cash. You want to make an honest living. I know you want to be paid reasonably, fairly, all that. I know all that. But you're doing it because you care for our city, and that means a lot. So thank you for that service.

Thank you.

Council Marvel. Well, I'm not going to add another 30 minutes of giving you your praises because you already know you're great. So I want to get back to the budget. And on top of the two questions that I have for budget, I did hear you talk about the activities, and I know during the summertime there's a multitude of activities happening. I'm wondering, what do we have to offer during the wintertime? And I know that considering the big snowstorm that we had, I don't know, I remember like back in my younger years here, We used to be able to, what's it called, at the reservoir. I don't know if that was legal or not, but I'm wondering what are legal ways of enjoying the winter season and how could we use the weather that we can't control to our advantage when it comes to coming up with these type of activities and kind of bringing out the youth and even adults during this time that normally people are usually like stuck at home, it's too cold or there's nothing to do. So I know there's a lot going on in the summertime. What is there that your department focuses on in creating, what initiatives, what programs for the winter season?

So actually, it's funny that you mentioned that. We have been talking about that and structuring some of that stuff. So we were thinking, I won't give too much detail, but hot chocolate, sleds, something smart the rest of the world where families can come, you know, use the hills. Yeah. Ice skating rinks at the Common. There's a lot of things that are in play, and funding is a big part of it. So it's something that we still have to structure and bring you guys the right numbers so we can have an idea of things that we want to do. We did reach out to a company that does come in and does portable ice rinks. that can be put in a flat surface and all that. So we did get quotes for that. So we are thinking about that. We've also talked about something that the city did back a couple of years ago before me of taking kids to Disney on ice. You know, getting tickets for low-income families. So there's a lot of things that we've been talking about. And a big part of it is having a bridge in communication with the school department to open gyms. Because like you said, there's many of our kids, some families have the ability to leave the city. and go on vacation when they have winter break and there's some that don't so we want to give them that opportunity to do something and not just be at home not doing anything so it's something that we're still talking about and hopefully we can make that connection with the school department to be able to use the gym okay or our biggest goal to be honest like since we're up the years maybe every school in our districts to be open and us for have a staff or two staff members and run sports inside the schools during those winter breaks. Like girls in sports, but for that whole week where they can come in one day and do basketball, the next day hockey, dodgeball. I would love that. All that kind of things.

Please bring back field hockey. Field hockey. You like it? I'm a volleyball girl. At the pro school, they used to have it.

I want us to get to a place where it's... It's the next step beyond talking. It's like, allow me or any one of us counselors to help propel this initiative because honestly, I feel like if this is in the talking stage, I'm hoping to see something a little bit more established this year so we can have it already up and running for this upcoming winter season. So it's like, I want us to use this last winter season that was pretty... It was horrendous. But like, how could we turn something bad to something good? It was like all that snow, we could have like used it to, to our benefit and, and create something special for our community. So the whole ice skating rink, like, um, that's some, you know, it sounds dope and I'm hoping that we are just doing a little bit more than talking. I, cause talking, I'm sorry. Like I, I hear that so often and it's like, you have a really good idea and you're talking about it for five, That's definitely not true. I know, so I'm hoping to see this year that we're actually solidifying what those talking points are, and hopefully, I don't know if you guys need to come before us for the budget committee to kind of get certain things approved, but by all means, you know, use us if that's what's required in order to get this ball rolling, so to speak. The second question that I have, and it's not yet on the budget, but I do have questions on the budget. Today I had a conversation with Billy from Optimum. He mentioned to me the skate park behind Rise Academy.

Miserville by the Leonard School.

Say that again?

Miserville Park.

How do you pronounce it? Miserville?

No, Miserville.

Miserville? Miserville. Miserville. Okay, I need to do better. Miserville. I saw pictures of this park. It's pretty bad. It's like...

It's 25 years old.

Yeah, okay. So my thing is, he told me how he's willing to up front the money from his own pockets. And I think it's amazing when we have people from our community that are willing to... He did, and he mentioned, you know, having a GoFundMe, which, again, it's like I'm for, you know, if anyone from, like, the community wants to donate and fix a park. But I also feel like, okay, this is a city park. What has the city been doing? Is it a priority or on the list of priorities? of like the next upcoming projects.

It is.

It is. It is. Okay, please fill me in.

It is. So we have, we've been.

Can we take that offline specifically for the park? Are you talking for the park specifically?

For like, but, well, Are you asking like a, well, I don't know how deep we're going to get into it.

So let's take that offline and let's continue with the book.

Well, if you like, we're meeting Billy at 1 at the center tomorrow. If you want to be part of that conversation.

Let me see. We do work full time. But is that part of the budget? Is that coming out? Is any of the funds to rebuild and fix this project coming out of this? No? No. Okay. Okay.

through community development and we go through parks and then we talk to the mayor and the mayor approves it. And then there's also, we go to, if we find that a park is in real need, then we go through Ramona and find out how the money is. But I can tell you that as far as park, for the first time ever this past year, Adelie and I called everybody to the table, every single league, every single sports to come tell us what the needs are so that when we build the 10 year plan, it's everybody's voice.

I'll touch base with you offline. Sounds good. So then my third question, and I'll put it together. Page 135, under other purchases and services, if you could touch on that $15,000 change increase and then operating supplies, I know you guys tend to buy a lot of like missing items. So I'm just, if you could just justify the change of the 10 K on the operating supplies as well.

Oh yeah, definitely. So when it comes to other purchases, other purchases and services, so you guys been to many of our events, you've been to four for July. We're actually hosting summer bash June 16. A lot of the things that we bring to our residents in our community, we need money to do that. So the bouncy house, face painting, anything that we do in our events that require equipment will come from that again we've been lucky the past uh four years that we had arpa money and arpa money has come to an end so having this will help us out to keep you know the same style that we have with our events to bring in more opportunities for the kids to go down a water slide, a bouncy house, to have a bouncy house, to have a DJ play music while they dance in the common. All these different things come from that. When it comes to operating supplies, summer program, 350 kids, toys don't last sometimes, you know, those six weeks. So we have to continuously buy supplies for the kids. And it doesn't stop In the summer either, when I have, you know, Easter, when we have all these kids' activities, Christmas inside, we have our cornhole, our Connect Four, all that comes into play.

Random question. Is there a specific supply that there's a pattern to go missing, or is it just very sporadic, like you just... A whole bunch of different types of supplies goes missing. Like basketballs. Like you'll buy 10 basketballs and you see yourself having to constantly buy basketballs because they, you know, maybe the...

It's actually...

So I'm wondering what... Is there a specific supply that you see yourself constantly having to replace?

So we don't lose supplies. We have them break apart.

Okay. That makes sense.

Connect four. Okay.

Okay.

Uh, corn hole is a big one that gets destroyed. It probably lasts us a couple of weeks.

You don't lose supplies.

We don't, we actually do inventory before and after we're done with our summer program. Yeah.

You know, sometimes these activities could be huge. So, you know, maybe a kid, not that I blame them, you know, they may like the toy and they want to take it home. So.

No, yeah, definitely. Like I said, we do keep a list of the supplies that we have, and I'm very thorough with my summer staff, and I let them know, like, we're limited in money. We have to take care of what we have. It's not, you know, it's something that we have to cherish that may not last, and we might not receive money, Or we might have to spend another year without something. So we're very thorough with that, like I said. And before we start the program, we do a list. And after, we check and balance everything that we need and we have to replace.

Okay. All right, almost there.

All right, well, that wraps up the Urban Services Division. I do have to say, Martha, I was expecting, well, Director Velez, I was expecting you to try it on the, my department is the best little competition here that we have. I was like waiting, I was waiting for you to say it.

Here we go, ready? We don't have to say it, we know it.

We know it, ah! thank you thank you everyone I'm trying to keep this as light-hearted as I can because public public safety you know what I should have requested was Can I get a motion for a five-minute recess? So moved. Second. There's a motion. Is there a second? Second. Oh, sorry. Seconded by Councilor LaPlante. All those in favor say aye. Aye. The ayes have it. Can I get a minute? A minute. Can I get a motion to come back from recess? So moved. Motion has been made, property seconded. All those, property seconded. All those in favor say aye. Aye. All right, the ayes have it. Next we have The hardest departments, there's always something about this department. We have, no, the police, well, that's between the two, I don't know which one. Next, we have the police department. Tonight, we have our chief, Maurice Aguilar, and our director, Rosa Shepard, to speak on behalf of the FY27 budget for the police department. You guys have the floor.

Good evening. Please bear with me a little tonight. I'm at the constant war with pollen, and today it seems to be getting the upper hand. So I've got a massive headache, but we are here. Hello, everyone. Maurice Aguilar, 90 Lowell Street, Lawrence, Massachusetts. And I'm just going to touch base on the FY27. I think overall, in the grand scheme of things, I think that we have prepared what's as close to, you know, level-funded budget as we can. Overall, from last year, there is an increase and a change of $296,787. To put things in perspective, that constitutes a 1.6% increase. When you're looking at it from the consumer price index, which deals with goods and services, the CPI has gone up 2.7%. Inflation has gone up 2.4%. The cost of living overall has gone up 2.8%. On a global perspective, everything has gone up. And so I think that when we maintain a 1.6% increase in and of itself, I think that is huge, particularly when you consider that we've hired 11 new police officers since July of 2025. And we've seen a reduction in personal services of 132,000, which is the result of redistribution of certain line items and moving around for more efficient uses. Again, I just want to put things in perspective as to how we compare as a community vis-a-vis other similarly situated communities. Since the 2010 to the 2020 consensus, overall and throughout these 26 years, the city of Lawrence has seen approximately a 47.1% increase in its budget for the police department. That constitutes 2.4% compound annual growth rate. You compare that to Lowell, Lowell has risen 91.9%. Brockton, 93.4%. Newton itself, 113.4%. Fall River, 76.4%. All of them a lot higher. And these are communities consequently which as far as population is concerned, they're not quite similar. In fact, they are, I think, less than what we have. There's a big difference between the census numbers and what real life indicates to us. So that's the overall grand scheme of things as far as the general fund and the money and the rationale. Before we get into the weeds, you know, I know we're perhaps getting at a page by page, and any questions, if you have any questions on that in and of itself, or we will proceed as you deem appropriate.

Let's get into police administration.

What page is that, Councillor?

Page 66 and 67. 66 and 67. Very well.

Okay, again, we see here salary and wages across the very top. There's a change of minus $134,575. Again, there was a redistribution of that, and that came primarily, you know, from the... I would say the displacement of the $175,000 that was allotted for the deputy chief's position to be reallocated to other line items within the budget to make it more impactful for us and more efficient as far as the overall operations of the department. So that's a plus that we've seen such a deduction overall in that. As far as, you know, vacation, a $2,000 increase in vacation and a de minimis $300 longevity, again, you know, These are issues that in and of itself are very small and minute, and these two numbers will come back up, at the very least the vacation will, as far as what constitutes the $2,000 increase in that.

Okay, we'll stop there for a second. Councilor, comments pertaining to the police administration section of the overall department budget.

Okay, quick question.

Councilor Marmo. Chief, under police administration, the confidential secretary noticing a decrease of one, just trying to get clarity if this is a position that is no longer needed for the department, or is it that eventually you are looking to have this position filled?

Let's see here. What page are you on?

This is 67. 67?

Oh, okay, very well. Oh, yeah. Say that again? Yes, so...

They changed it to another, which is the executive assistant. Mm-hmm.

Yes, so my apologies on that. No, there is still a need. So essentially what's going on, with regards to the executive assistant, what we've seen in that particular role is that there's been a major expansion as to her role and scope and responsibilities. Additionally, the incumbent has received absolutely no salary adjustments in over four years, and that's been because of the cap based on the Collins studies. But again, I'm requesting this based solely on documented increase in duties. Some of the changes, for example, you look at the 2022 version, which outlines her responsibilities. Her responsibilities in that are mostly internal and clerical insofar as operational support is concerned. That has evolved for a multitude of reasons, but that's evolved. Now, the executive assistant plays a more strategic administrative partnership role. It's more of a higher level of responsibilities. And in that, she's more working on responsibilities that directly support the chief's function and roles. For example, I've got, she's now communicating and coordinating with community stakeholders on other law enforcement officers on behalf of our office. She's had an added financial oversight insofar as screening. I want as many eyes as possible with every cent as possible and she helps me out with that. She's even helped a little bit with procurement and mostly final review of invoices and billing prior to my signature. There's also an extended coordination of community meetings and events and logistics for public forums, special events. and she's tracking action items as well. That was never part of the 2022 job description, certainly wasn't in there, but it's certainly expected of her now. I've also had her monitor citizen complaints and complaints that are coming in through the Internet as far as what needs priority. That includes disorder and other things. Obviously, she prepares detailed travel itineraries and major presentations, reports, memoranda for when we need to travel, whether it's myself or other members of the department for training and the like. and now compliance. There's stronger requirements for handling legal personnel and internal affairs matters with discretion and legal compliance and even competency. So again, there's a big expansion as to what her role used to be before to what it is right now. With that said, we've taken that that executive position and we've removed it in support of, you know, relabeling it as the executive assistant, which is more akin to what she's actually doing on a day-to-day basis when you look at job descriptions across the board. That constitutes approximately 14,560 overall raise, you know, to bring her up to par with other executive assistants

Councilman, any other questions or comments? Just a piggyback.

Council President. Just a piggyback question on what Councilman was discussing. Yes. Is the executive assistant position already being created?

The executive assistant position, I know, was posted. It was brought before the council, and I believe that it was tabled pending further. It was tabled on February 17th pending further documentation. I am unaware of what exactly that means, but it's tabled. But it was posted and brought before the council accordingly. So do we approve it or not?

So, hold on. So if you're saying that it's posted, but you're saying that it was tabled at the ordinance level, I'm assuming, because I have, it shouldn't have been posted if the ordinance wasn't approved.

I mean, probably there is some misinformation in between.

Yeah, so again, I don't know what the logistics behind that was.

Let's find out about that to see if the position has been already created.

Mm-hmm.

And if it is an ordinance already been created for the position, and if it is, if it was approved, and then the follow-up question will be all there, like whether or not we post it and stuff like that, but we need to know whether or not the position was first created.

Director Shepard, you might have additional information?

I believe she is.

Good evening, City Council. Rosa Sheppard, Director of Support Services of the Lawrence Police Department. The position was in the ordinance, but it was stable pending documentation. It's been tabled for quite some time. It hasn't been posted, but it was brought in the ordinance. It was stable pending documentation.

so it has not been posted no no no it hasn't been approved by the city council can we have a motion for this body is can i have a motion for this body to send correspondence to the ordinance committee to get an update you know maybe to the police department because they probably need information from them oh that's yeah yeah if they are they're pending information of who I'm sorry.

I think it's the waiting information from the personnel department.

We don't have it at the personnel committee. No, but like more information. Oh, personnel department. Personnel department. We don't have it on the.

Yes, and that's consistent with my understanding that it was up for review and that as far as it came here, it was table pending documentation. but I also know there was a review somewhere along the line up here.

Maybe it will be through you, Madam Chair. Maybe it will be helpful to work together with the personnel department to see what the ordinance committee is looking for and see what is the need, potentially also talk to the city attorney to see what is the need in the meantime to advance the issue in the meantime.

That's a great suggestion. Thank you.

I was going to say at the very least, this position has been, I believe there was an ordinance. It has been unfilled for more than six months. It's been unfilled for some time, right? This executive says this position has been unfilled. It's been dormant for a while. Have you had it when you've been chief? You've been a chief now for about a year, correct?

Yes. And so I suppose that the question is more of a technical question because I don't know exactly what dormant actually means if there was an application, a petition, a process. I don't know when that started. So if in February it was done, you know what I mean, I took over in June, that would be, you know, I don't know, July.

So the ordinance is fairly clear. It has nothing to do with whatever work. Was the position filled? Has it been unfilled for more than I think the length of time is six months? Can you be wrong on that? It could be a year, but I think it's six months. And it's been empty, unfilled for more than six months. It needs to be reauthorized. I'm guessing that's what's before the ordinance committee. We don't need to create a new one unless you're changing the language of this. And that's what I don't know. And it had to have come down from the administration. We had started ourselves, so it had to come from... I would think you would have a part to play in this and what you're looking for in an executive assistant, but I don't know. So I just want to shed that light, but apparently that wasn't helpful, so thank you.

Okay, any other? I have a question for you, Chief, pertaining to administration. We recently received, I think actually it was today, this morning, news that your current Director of Police and Community Relations has been, is transitioning to an acting role as community developer, I mean development, as Director of Community Development. What's going to happen with this position after the transition? Are you looking to refill it, or is it going to be vacant? How is that environment currently? How would that look after that transition is complete?

So the abrupt... The abrupt change related to that position has brought me to really reconsider what exactly can be satisfied by some of my officials with regards to reporting requirements and the like. and whether or not I can add that to their plate and that they can successfully carry it out. If it's not something that can happen, that they can't do it for any reason, any number of reasons whether, you know, then it's something that we're going to have to review whether we can, you know, whether we petition to fill it or what the deal is. But for right now, we're trying to reconfigure how the reporting requirements and the job description can be, that void can be filled by some of our officials.

Okay, so hold on just one second. So I asked, so we have a similar, not really that similar, but kind of sort of a similar situation with the IT department and the cyber security position. Some difficulties there fulfilling it. So I naturally asked, well, do you see this being filled within the next year? Because if not, as a counselor, I'm seeing it as perhaps an area where we can save some funds, some public funds.

There's a reason why I'm asking you, how is, how...

how will the environment look like after this transition? Will we still need this? Is this an area where we could possibly decrease funds or not? So I'm gonna, as we continue with this process, I'm gonna keep an eye out for that. I'm gonna see how that goes. Council President.

Yes, thank you so much for the opportunity. I'm gonna encourage both of you to look at the meeting when we create the position Because when we created that position back then, probably 2017, 18, we brought up a specific point as to why that position was needed. And I think that going back to the roots of things is going to give us more perspective as to why we need that. I remember that part of the discussion around that position was because we want a non-police officer dealing with the women's, specifically women's victims of domestic violence, not on the scenario of having a conversation between the police officer or another environment, more like, We were looking for more humanized conversations around that. I'm not saying that you're not. The intent was that. So I'm probably not using the proper words. encourage all of you to look into that discussion because it was very interesting at that point as to why we need at that moment the position and the need is still there of having having that that person on that position so if we just don't have it at the moment That doesn't mean that we don't need it. That means that you potentially need to look for a person that can do that work. And it is easy to find. We only have one of those positions. And reviewing the questioning... around that will give you a better perspective as to why we need that.

Can you, what year?

On top of my head, 17, 18, around there. But we can ask for the city clerk to give us the item number. Okay, yep. And then when it was discussed, when we approved the position, and then... Take a look at the video.

That's helpful for me, so thank you. I think that your recollection is correct. I do recall when that came up, I submit to you that the dynamics were quite different back then as well. Remember, that was during Floyd... George Floyd era, and there were a lot of things going on in that regard. But even with the needs of domestic violence, that was part and parcel of one of the things that I was very instrumental in bringing up, which was the domestic violence high-risk team, the domestic violence within the unit, within the Law Enforcement Police Department. And those departments have grown and evolved substantially with regards to services. I certainly am not gonna let this go on for two, three, four months without knowing what we're gonna do. I have a meeting with my command staff this week relative to what the reporting requirements are. I want to make sure that we're in compliance with what's expected of us and what those requirements are. Now, if for any reason I foresee that we cannot fulfill those, and I'm very sensitive to the needs of the civilians and battered women and the like, you know, to be represented by a non-authoritative figure, for that reason, I've changed...

He uses the purple word.

For that reason, I have a female officer who's very experienced, very compassionate, and understands the mission in the DVU now, but... If I see, Council President, that this is going to be elongated in any way, or if in any way it deviates or separates from the intent of what the position was supposed to do, or if we don't need it anymore, I will come forth and I will be completely honest with that.

Yeah, no, no problem. I mean, through your manager, I think it will be, I mean, if you believe that, you know, the needs have changed and so far so on and things like that. But I think like looking at that, looking at the roots, looking at the questioning as to why we at that moment that we kind of like didn't have much money to fund the position, decide to go ahead and do it. I think that, you know, it may be important to analyze whether or not we still need it and if it's not and then We can discuss it, but I mean, with the mentality of this was the need at the beginning, this is how you move on, and this is what we have today. Since then, and then we have changed, and this aspect, other aspect, and then we don't need it anymore, if that's the case. But I still doubted that we don't need it, I mean, because I know kind of like, you know, how sensitive that could be, and having a conversation of somebody that represent you, and help you walking through the process, it will be essential. Thank you.

All right, lastly, before we move on, I do want to say, and I know we've been keeping it as generic as possible and talking about positions and all of that, but I do want to say that DV is a very sensitive topic, and I do appreciate the work that Ms. Perez has done throughout her time as a director, and I just hope that the transition is smooth. We've had incidents recently So I just hope that whatever the police department needs to do to continue those services and not lose momentum, that that should be top of mind as well.

I understand.

Thank you. All right. So, Chief, next we have police operations.

What page, Councilor? I apologize for that. The next one. 68 and 69. 68. Okay. Okay, overall, once again, it's for our salaries and wages of concern. we're seeing here, let's see here. Again, we've hired 11 officers since July, and we also consider the officer step increases as that, as adding to the 176,669 change from the FY26 to FY27. So it's, I mean, it's in keeping with those, with the new hires and the changes and step increases for the officers that have been there for some time. If there's anything in particular that you want to talk about with regards to personal services, I think that overall, the difference from FY26 at 16 and change, Mayor's recommendation in that regard to 16, 555, constitutes $82,968 difference. There has been reductions as well in the clothing and uniform allowance by 39,650. As you can see, also holiday pay has been reduced to 83,755 in order to mitigate any spikes and also in order to reflect the actual usage of both. Staffing, as a general matter, just so you know that the Lawrence Police Department is currently authorized for 200 total positions. And that's comprised of 177 sworn officers and 23 civilians. But at the present, our sworn workforce, and that's the police officers, faces an overall...

Wait, can you repeat those stats again, but slower?

Sure. So we're authorized for 200 total positions. And that's comprised of 177 sworn officers and 23 civilian support personnel. Presently, sworn workforce faces, well, we face an overall 20.3 vacancy rate. and that number is driven by a 23% shortage in frontline patrol officers. Of the 31 vacant positions that we have, we're trying to stay on top and ahead of that with six people that we have in the academy, but there's still 25 vacancies there. I've taken into consideration the vacancies and what hasn't been actually used insofar as even though we've been budgeted for that, and though I intend to make every effort to fill it to capacity so that we're fully staffed. But if that is not being used at this time, I have no choice but to reduce it.

Just to confirm, 25 vacancies and patrol officers.

Patrol officers, that is correct. And that's because I am counting the six recruits that I have slated to graduate in June 2026. By this stage, we can kind of count them more in than not. That is not the same as in the four recruits that we're currently working on. The dropout rate and loss rate and attrition rate in those academies is something that's just like anybody's guess at how that's gonna go. So I'm not even factoring them in. Purchase and services has increased by 91,550, even though there have been cuts there with regards to office equipment repair and maintenance. But, you know, again, overall, some of the costs are anticipated cleaning company service costs for the new building. As it stands today, we're standing at approximately 10,000 square foot building. We're gonna be moving into a 50,000 plus square foot building. So you take the regular number that we've consistently counted on, and we have to make adjustments in the upward level to be realistic about what that's gonna cost. I don't have a specific number as to what the estimate will be on that because that's still out on procurement stage, and we don't know where that's going to go. But realistically, we do need to anticipate that square footage-wise, that's going to increase drastically. You will see, my apologies, no, no, okay. If we move now to the supply section, all the way at the bottom, you're gonna see a reduction of 105,000 And that's largely in part due to the reduction in fuel and lubrication for $111,000. My understanding is that that was a DPW audit revealed that the police department had been overcharged for quite some time as far as that money is concerned. Now that money that we have now with the reduction of the 111,000 more closely resembles the actual usage of what we actually use in that. And so that money again has been also reconfigured into another line item in order to keep us balanced and still maintain efficiency and operational needs so. Any questions on that?

So we have other charges and expenses and capital outlay to go over. And then we'll open it up for questions.

Okay. So, yes. So with regards to the capital outlay, as you can see, that's just a zeroed out. And my understanding is that the what we would typically use from capital outlay to buy motor vehicles or what have you, has been zero funded since 2023, and that we have successfully petitioned and received money from the PAYGO account in order to address any needs as far as the motor vehicles are concerned. The computer and software, you are going to see a substantial jump on that to $356,000. And that money there, like I said, we've moved around a couple of the line items, specifically the $175,000 from the deputy chief's position. We have completely eliminated a crime analysis position for $60,230. And the fuel and lubrication, $111 that I just mentioned, for a total of $346,230 to contribute to the computer software. And it's computer software and hardware. That is what the cost for a lot of the subscriptions and hardware of a smart building and basically what the future of law enforcement looks like. That's computers, software, video retrieval, communications. You name it, we can outline, we can talk more about that on what it is the programs that we're using and the subscriptions which have risen dramatically. But that basically is the cost of doing business in the modern police world. And that's why that has come up. And this is why we've made the drastic changes that we have in order to try to at least keep a lot of the stuff that we need in order to operate.

Can you just send us a report spreadsheet with that data?

Actually.

Thank you. All right, perfect. All right, councilors. I have a question. Council President.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes, quick question. I don't see. So you went from 2024 20 sergeant to 2027 26 sergeant. Tell me about how you changed your operation to justify more sergeant instead of removing one lieutenant and now having the operation with nine lieutenant and 26 sergeant.

Yes, so when we're looking at this, first of all, I think that we've got to, we need to look at the sergeant line item with the patrol officer line item right before it. I think that at some point, there was conflation with regards to the line items. Basically, they were either blended or misunderstood, miscalculated, something to that. I can't speak to the past budgets, but what I can tell you is if you look at the sergeant's pay, going up 584,604, but there is also below it a base salary adjustment or pay adjustment for the patrol officers of 369,004. When you look right above that, so it's really a difference of 215,000 when you deduce the 584 to the patrol officer 369 adjustment. When you look right above it to lieutenants, There has been a displacement of one lieutenant position, and all the way across it says that the change is 24,088. But in fact, what that difference is, is that's the rank differential between a sergeant and a lieutenant, is 24,088. And so what has happened is, in order to bring in more sergeants, is we've taken that $24,000 and split it at least into two, which would constitute the difference into the sergeant position.

No, what I'm saying is, Madam Chair, what would be the how your operation change to justify more sergeants and less lieutenants? Mm-hmm.

So, well, as far as operation in and of itself, I think that what I'm looking to do is sort of flatten the organization a little bit. I'm seeking to offset a little bit of the Superior Officer's overtime, but more importantly, I'm also looking to increase the supervision for a lot of the officers that are coming in, a lot of young officers. I need more boots on the ground, if you will, with regards to supervision. And additionally, not only the sergeant's position, but I do anticipate retirements coming up within the next year or so that are gonna offset some of that. But again, I wouldn't call it an experiment, but I call it a theory that I'd like to see if this is actually gonna produce the cost savings that I think and the expanded supervision that I think for what amounts to be a very young department.

So I've seen, Chairman, I've seen that on different fiscal years, the patrol officers haven't changed, but all the positions in rank have changed. Over the years, I see that you have only 135 patrol officers, and that number stayed all the way through while you have changed other positions. And I believe that we have hired throughout that time more officers, but it's not been reflected on the budget. So how does that reflect on how that transpired out here?

Well, again, the position of captain being five captains, 10 lieutenants, 22 sergeants, I think has been consistent for quite some time. As far as the officers, we are hiring more officers. Unfortunately, we're also losing officers through attrition, whether it's retirement, you know what I mean, or some of them will have left or whatever the case may be or moved on. We lose them. For example, we've hired 11 officers since July, but we've also had a certain number of retirements that have come through of what would constitute officers. Whether they're detectives or not, they're in the same officer's position. They would take that number for officers up. So it's that constant recycling of personnel, if you will, that kind of keeps that number where it is. Certainly we'd like to see a reconfiguration of that. But I think that with all of the requirements under post and liability that's at stake here, I think that our officials and the numbers of officials are where they kind of should be in order to prevent a huge liability issue for the police department.

3 million share back then and 2020 2025 2025 we adopt the quote bill for the career incentive and I'm seeing that the line item have increased from 1.1 million dollars to 1.9 million dollars So I see that the mayor recommend only 1.5 million instead of the 1.9 million that was actual for 2026. So you told me how that decrease went down. Did we pay police officers more than what we were supposed to or the current incentive? was not there, there was people left. I mean, explain it to me. Walk me through so I can understand.

So what's happened with that is basically, again, we've had a couple of retirements, but more importantly, I've taken a very hard look, and I've cut it right to the edge, but not to the point where it's risky. I'm looking at actual use. What are we actually using as far as the career incentive? And I want to ask for what we're actually using. Now, with that said, there has been, at the very least, a consideration, and we put out, I had emails put out, anybody who anticipated that they were gonna receive a bump up as far as an educational incentive. An example would be, I've got my associates, but now in, I don't know, in June, I mean, or July 5th, I'm gonna graduate and I'm gonna have my bachelor's. That would constitute a 5% increase on that. So we put out the feelers to say, okay, of everybody who's on the Quinn bill now, who anticipates receiving any degree or something that would impact that? And I think that we've got little to no responses on that. Well, that gives me the green light to say, okay, well, based on that, I want to draft the budget that is more consistent with what we're actually using It's a little risky, but I want to keep the numbers down, and I want to make it so that the budget reflects what is actually being used every single time. I will make a little bit of allowance for projection, but I'm not going to get into the world of speculation.

Okay. So now the Quill Bill will be used, or perhaps the career incentive, the proper word, will be used for careers that are technically, you're taking more advantage of the knowledge and so forth and so on. Somebody have a bachelor's on something that is not related to policing, so did they get any incentive in the past?

So the language now under the current collective bargaining agreement is such that we still recognize the very core intent of the criminal justice degrees, which is what it was intended for the Quinn bill, and those that are associated that way. Because of the recruitment shortage nationwide, it wasn't just us. Across the nation, people had, well, administrators and everybody else started to expand what that is so that it's something that is reasonably associated with police officers' duties. So I would have to approve or decline or reject any application for Quinn that I don't think is reasonably situated to the duties of a police officer. If somebody comes to me with a, let's say, I don't know, culinary degree, I will have to decline the raise. I mean, I still want to barbecue with them, but I'd want to decline the raise.

Have you had a situation where you had to decline and share what that area of study was?

Okay, yeah, I'm currently in talks, and I don't want to, you know, tip my hand and say which way, but, you know, there is currently a police officer who's got a degree in... I forget the name of it, but it's like recovery services, you know, drug addiction, and the name escapes me right now of what that degree is. But it's services, you know what I mean? But it's for recovery addiction and counseling and what have you. I don't know. I don't know how I'm going to go with that, because the primary duty of a police officer is to enforce the law, not necessarily to provide services in that regard, in that aspect. We have resources that we can refer them to. I don't know necessarily that I want to burden my budget with that. I'm not saying it's a stretch. I do see the nexus. I don't know what my numbers tell me. I don't know. That's going to weigh heavily on which way that goes.

But, I mean, the police department is taking training on de-escalation. Correct. So that's what it is. Correct. You probably have training in-house that you can do now with that degree.

Yes. Yeah, and I have a behavioral health unit out there. You know what I mean? So that...

Again, I- Flurry noise, got it.

I understand. All right, essentially, I mean, I'm looking at the three different years for the police department. The increase between those three years of budget has been close to about $2.5 million. between those two three years so I just want to put that up there because sometimes we lose perspective when it comes to the budget and one of the most important departments to keep us safe but we also need to be need to be a safeguard of the of the taxpayers funds and not you know The reality is that at some point we need to face the situation. And one other department that nobody wants to say no, and nobody is in the business of saying no, is the police department. So I just want to be blunt and up there with the public that, you know, even though our police department is not fully funded, but the effort that has been made throughout the years has been significant to a point that We, as the City of Lawrence, are working on getting a department that is well diverse and very well professional. And as a result of that, we have invested a good amount of money.

That's understandable, and I certainly take your point, and I'm in total agreement with you. This is why I look at every single way that we can possibly save money going forward. That's why, you know, we scrounge through every penny, and if I see something that's not really being utilized correctly or is misplaced, if I will, I'll move it to something that makes it more impactful. You know, I'll give you just a, and had it somewhere just in case that came up. But one of the things, for example, that I've done as far as looked at for ways to save money is everything that we do, all of the projects that we have. One of the things that we were working on is, I'll give you an example of firearms, firearms qualifications. Under my leadership, the cost of firearms qualifications alone has gone down 40%. So the costs associated with instructors, the payout that we pay them, has gone down 71%. In 2024, we paid approximately $21,315.84 to instructors. In 2025, we paid out $6,123. We still get certified, we're still safe, we're still in compliance, but there was a way to do that. And there are many, many other ways that we can do that. And we're constantly looking for that. Additionally, I know that Director Shepherd has worked tirelessly to at the very least maintain, keep, seek, you know, over $4.3 million worth of grants for that. And our department as well is, you know, and it's an ancillary benefit to the city, but also, you know, our revenues are averaging $330,000, $340,000 every single year also. So we're very cognizant of the city's economic condition. We're very cognizant of our responsibilities there and we're doing all that we can in order to make that happen while still providing quality service and the public safety that this community so richly deserves.

Councilor Platt.

Yeah, I want to be asking for some brief responses. I think the first one was, Chief, I think the Council President was looting toward it. I want to dig just a little bit deeper, and that's the superior officer versus patrolman ratio. As was previously mentioned, the numbers have shifted. So we're having more superior officers, and the patrolman number stayed the same. I think it went from, the number's already been mentioned. I think it was three more sergeants, I think, that were added to it. From your perspective, you inherited this. More of your fingerprints were on this budget than the last budget. What's the right ratio? I don't need the theory behind it. What, in your opinion, is the right ratio? Are we heading in that direction? More superiors, which is what this budget's doing, or less superiors?

So my intent here and my strategy on this is more of a longer strategy, which would benefit either my successor or, in other case, maybe down the road. It is not entirely, I see the difference between the three sergeants. The other numbers have remained the same. The five captains, the 10 lieutenants, 22. There has been an increase in three sergeants. But that has been offset by the displacement of one lieutenant position. And the reason for that is to offset a little bit of the cost.

That's not where I'm going. That's not where I'm going. I'm going to ask one more time and I'll move off if I can't get down there. So what I'm looking at is I'm looking at captains, lieutenants, sergeants, superior officers, officers, patrolmen. I look at basically how the unions are operated, right? That's how the unions are constructed. I am seeing larger, small, but a trend, larger number of superior officers, whether they're, in this case, happens to be sergeants, so lieutenants, captains, or sergeants, and the patrolmen staying the same. Am I to read, am I to infer from that that you believe that we need to have more superior officers and keeping the patrolmen at that level?

No, that would be the wrong inference. And in fact, I would disagree with the premise that there is a trend. A trend would indicate more than one instance of a rise. This is a one-time deal for three sergeants. This is an attempt to reduce, as they would say, flatten the organization or the hierarchy of the organization. so that I have more supervisors without the added expense, and even on, you know, when it comes to, you know, compensation, payout packages for higher supervisors, when I could get more lower-paid supervisors to do more of the work and take on the same responsibility.

I get it now. All right, thank you. Moving over now to cameras. I'm interested in body cams, body cameras, flock cameras. specifically, so, and any new cameras. So where are your cameras in this budget? Either purchase or maintenance of cameras?

So I brought Sergeant Dar with me, and I will say that insofar as the cameras and the expenditures of the cameras, I think that that is going to be in the hardware software line item on that altogether, and that would include, you know, all of our subscriptions and what have you.

are we so i mean you're you're on the front lines of this discussion regarding cameras so i know you know what we're dealing with here so i don't need to outlay the whole thing except to say if there are new cameras being out there we need to know about new cameras new camera purchases And if you're shifting cameras around, unless they're for emergency purposes only, of which there's a certain amount of time that the ordinance says you can move things around without having to come to the council because you need to do it for operational purposes, short amount of time, it goes into some detail. Other than that, though, if you've got certain spots and you're adding them, we need to know about them. Are there new cameras, anything new on this? Thank you.

Good evening. Good evening. Sergeant Dar, Lawrence Police Department, 91st Street. As far as the sequence of your questioning, body cams goes back to bargaining. So obviously, if that's not been addressed, we've obviously said this many times, we are interested. We're also looking at avenues as far as how we're going to Procure those versus either it's grants Right now as far as the budget lays out software software only it's operational solely operational what we have right now, so anything that we've Relied heavily on grants have exhausted. That's why the cost had to be offset from other line items to software line items So I mean more sense We do want those cams as soon as we have, actually, the chief was part of that project as well to get the policy in place at the time. We've also had negotiated while I was on the union regarding that item as well.

Which item is this, Sergeant? I'm sorry? Which item, just cameras in general? This is body cameras. Oh, body cameras, okay.

Yeah, so I'm going in your line of questions. So first is body cams as far as that goes. Next would be city cams. City cams, we work in conjunction with city IT. Our manipulation of those as far as the quick deploy cameras, we are not, to make it clear, we haven't purchased any cameras just yet. And I do understand that when we do, obviously the council's gonna be the first one to know because we are coming to you for those fundings. So that's to come. It's not part of what's projected right now. We're talking about sustainability. We had servers that were failing. They had to be replaced immediately, which means when you go back to review anything, you have a buffer. That buffer is continuous, and we can't have that. There's a lag in time, lag in processing. And obviously, it's a machine. It's going to fail ultimately. There's an end of life on every item when it comes to tech. more others than some, but when it comes to that storage, its operation, it's very particular. We're reactive when it's to the cameras, especially on the PD's end of things. So there is a crime that occurs, we review it. That's what the cameras are there for. We don't have the luxury of sitting around and watching these cameras. There's 414 of them that the PD has access to. at any given time, we have a set amount of LPRs that are, sorry.

License plate readers?

Yes, those are independent, so those are flocks. Those we move around as needed as well. Again, it's operational. If we think there's a need at a particular area of the city, we'll deploy it there. And I know it's not a new implementation, it's the current implementation of those flocks since its inception. So nothing has changed there either. As far as, I know we previously discussed this when it comes to the regards of access and timelines, it's only 30 days. To answer that question, this is from our last meeting. It is only there for 30 days.

All right, so on the body cameras, I'm just going to issue my opinions on that. I think it's in the city's best interest. I think it's the patrolman's officers, their union's best interest, as well as taxpayers, because I think our officers are probably in the right, and to have that kind of evidence is probably going to be helpful, and if we're in the wrong, we're in the wrong, and we need to own up to that, and the cameras show that, but I think what we find from the stuff that I've been reading is that We, the municipalities and governments have found that the body cameras have been an asset with respect to counter argue any false narratives. I'm hopeful that the unions, and we can get to a point with the unions where they can support that, because I just think it's going to help them. When I say them, I mean the actual police officers themselves, and through extension, the city and our government. I don't want to harp too much. Do you have something quick you want to add to that?

Point of clarification on that. This body, last term, approved a grant for body cams. And we actually had the superior officer's union president at the time was the one who presented in his capacity as a sergeant to the budget and finance committee and to the full council. Unfortunately, we lost that grant. So now we have to restart that process. From my understanding, from questioning it before, it has to be renegotiated with the... Good stuff. So it was presented by the police department. It was approved. And then unfortunately we lost it. Gotcha.

Just, just to show our interest. Obviously we did go through a walkthrough in the new building, right? The it's prepared. for whenever that happens. There were several pieces to this. Storage is huge when it comes to body cams. It's actually what breaks most municipalities of sustaining them. You're talking million dollars plus just on sustainability. We have a five year contract currently with Axon using evidence.com. We are gonna use that in conjunction if we need to, but again, that's gonna have to be, it's gonna have to go higher in cost too. Not as much, but just a little more just to sustain those camps. It's nice to have that. It's also, the cost is, it gets really expensive.

I just want to move on. I want to go into a lot of depth because we could spend days on all these topics. The flock cameras are something else which I know how useful and effective that they are, both the license plate readers and other approaches on that. But with the advent of AI and the stuff that I've been reading about it, it really causes me, I can see it being a tool, a fantastic tool, but I can also see it being used in a very bad way by government. And I think our job here is to find that balance. How do we protect citizens' rights, but also making sure that their privacy, also making sure that public safety is regarded? And there is a balancing act there. And so this AI information that's coming so rapidly right now is making our heads spin as far as what Flock is going to be able to do to see things, to actually paint pictures, to really showcase real-time stuff that could be really invasive. It's an amazing tool and potential abuse. So we really need to get on our horse when it comes to that ordinance. I think that's our job, that we know exactly what we're saying yes to the police department to, yes, and that the police department is being honest with us about what those tools are, and that we have built in safeguards that we don't of the people's privacy rights. So anyway, that's a real concern and we really, I am going to the Ordinance Committee next Thursday to get that thing out of the committee and onto this floor of this council so we can take some sort of votes and some sort of decisions on it because it can't just keep sitting there. We've got to move on it. So I'm hopeful that we can make that happen. So just, I'm not sure I need a reaction unless you have a quick reaction on the flock stuff.

No, just to say, look, my intent, and you can count on the fact that I am going to be in complete compliance with whatever ordinance you have and whatever requirements you have relative to our use of such technology.

Do we still have a gang unit? Is that still operational? Do we still have it? Gang, gang unit.

Yes, yes, we have a gang unit. Due to staffing issues, we've had to merge the gang unit into what's essentially a firearms investigative unit into the detective's division. But we still have a very functional and effective gang unit, yes.

The same numbers as we have in the past? Numbers of the up or down? Am I sure what that means? The number of personnel? Personnel numbers, yeah.

The personnel numbers are the same.

Same numbers? Within the gang unit, yes. Okay. I am excited about this new police station, but every time I listen to you, I get less excited about it because you keep telling me how expensive it's going to be. So I'm like, oh, you know, and I'm looking at the budget. I'm thinking, you're in a ridiculously outdated, uninsulated... heating, HVAC things, the disaster area. And I'm thinking, you move over to the new police department, the HVAC, heating, all those other things are going to, those monies that we're flushing down the toilet is going to be going away. So I'm actually looking for improvements in our budget on these kinds of things. But I'm not seeing that. I'm seeing costs going up as opposed to going down. So to me, it's counterintuitive. I'm not sure of a reaction as to why. It appears as though some of the... Purchase of, I'm not sure where it's under. Purchase of services maybe, electricity, water and sewer repairs and maintenance. It's gone up.

So, yeah, so, I mean, there have been increases. We also have had, if you look at the repair and maintenance on the office equipment, we've seen a reduction of 31,000. Now, additionally, some of the prices, and again, I think that I may be infecting you, I think I'm projecting some of my own concerns, about moving into this new building, because it is nerve-wracking, because I can't foresee how effective, in fact, these energy-saving panels and what have you will actually be. I don't want to make a misrepresentation here to say, hey, listen, this is what they told me over there, because none of them are going to be here next year when you guys are asking me about these expenses. But I think that we're going to do everything to mitigate and to reduce it. There are going to be increases, and I think that we've moved around a lot of things to account for that. One of them is the other purchase services. At the very bottom line of purchase services, it's an increase of $71,000. That came out of another line item, but... It's in anticipation of an increase in cleaning, you know what I mean? With regards to water and sewage and the like, there's going to be an increase in water and sewage because now we have bathrooms, now we have lockers, now we have showers, you know what I mean? So I anticipate that that's going to increase. By how much? We're going to find out soon. I'll do a projection after the first quarter that we're actually in there, and we'll take a look at what that's going to happen, and I'll be the first one to raise the alarms here so that we know what we're bracing for.

I'm going to thank you on a positive note. I want to thank you on the police department side on my Lawrence Square projects and having police officials there at every time to make sure the place is safe and their presence. That means a lot, so I just want to thank you for allowing them to be there under your under your leadership, so thank you. My pleasure, thank you. I'm done, Madam Chair. Thank you.

Thank you. I do have questions for, I don't think I've ever asked this before, and if I have, I apologize. How much does it cost to fully, to buy a full uniform for an officer, with the weapon included, everything?