Finance & Personnel Committee - Regular Meeting

We're gonna call this special FNP meeting to order. It is 05:55PM. All members of FNP are here. And the first order of business is 20Five-eleven57, Resolution Authorizing Capital Equipment Purchases for the Street Department as part of the approved 2026 capital improvement plan. This has been short circuited by mayor Washington Spivey on ninethirtytwenty five. Councilmember Kahlo.

Thank you, madam chair. Can we have an explanation? Because this was short circuited, and so I don't I did read the staff report. But for everyone who didn't, why we're taking twenty twenty six and spending it now? Thank you, Director.

Sure. Thanks for the question. Actually, can speak to a couple issues if you want. The reason it was short circuited was because we're it's essentially the old case of dealing with quotes that we have right now, prices that we can lock in for future pieces of equipment. So if we deliver our yay by the end of this month, we can lock in the price before it goes up to actually get these in the next year or two. The reason it was short circuited, we didn't make the first short circuit date. We submitted this to the mayor's office. I believe it went to the clerk's office, and staff was out or unavailable. Otherwise, this would have been at last week's f and p, so our apologies, but we missed it. So it's here tonight for that reason. But it's essentially using the same amount of funds this resolution, the same amount of funds for 2026, just allowing us to spend them differently.

It's still 2026. Okay. Thank you for that explanation.

Yeah. It's really just to amend the descriptions to buy different pieces of equipment. Yes.

Council Member Newberry.

I motion to approve.

Motion to approve by Councilmember Newberry, seconded by Councilmember Northwood. Is there any discussion? Councilmember Newberry? Okay. We'll go ahead with that vote.

And this motion passes four to two. Next agenda item is 20 five-eleven 58, resolution authorizing use of street department operating budget funds for the purchase of a large capital equipment in 2025 for multi department use. Again, circuited by mayor Washington Spivey on ninethirtytwenty five. Can I ask what happens if there's no motion to approve? Councilmember Jansen.

Sorry.

I'd like to hear a report from the department head first.

Sure. Thanks, Councilmember Janssen. So this is actually really germane to a lot of the operating budget discussions that we just had. One of the cuts that refuse and recycling will be recommending going forward is to essentially have less of this contingency in its budget. This happens to be an amount for 2025.

If we don't spend it this year, it's gone. But next year, this money will not be there because we're proposing a $100,000 cut to the revenues in recycling budget, hoping that the amount that comes in per the contract will be within what we can afford and not the maximum worst case scenario. So the reason we're asking for this piece of equipment, it stemmed from staff requests regarding the Christmas tree pickup. Essentially, we're dealing with multiple claims every year for back injuries because our maintenance workers are having to take the trees and throw them up into the dump truck. So they said, could we get a brush chipper, do this more efficiently rather than loading them once, unloading them back at the shop, then loading them into a wood chipper to do it.

We wanted to do it more safely and more efficiently. Also, we could use it between the two utilities to maintain their well and lift station sites because they don't have a brush chipper right now. So again, this would be use of funds this year to avoid a capital equipment purchase in the future.

Councilmember Johnson? So you're saying

you don't have a brush chipper now?

No. Public Works does not have one.

And is there one that could be borrowed?

No. Every time we ask parks, it's unavailable. We never get to use it.

Council member Newberry.

Thank you. Council member Goggins, I have a question for director Hawkins just in general about what happens to departments that come in under their operating budget if we weren't to allocate this. Director Gallagher just said it would be gone. Where does it go typically?

At the end of the year, it either goes to help offset or balance other departments that may have exceeded their levy. But ultimately, in the end, that goes back into fund balance.

What would it take to make that go into next year's operating budget? If there are any budget that comes in under their operating budget this year.

There has been a mechanism in place that allows for carryover funds from a department. The past couple of years, our recommendation and the mayor have opted to forego that ability to use carryover for the sheer fact that we were trying to help build fund balance as well.

Got it.

Thank you. Council Member Newberry, that's what we used to do in the past. It was very common to carry over by the last month or within the first month of the New Year. Departments would say, we request carryover. And that hasn't been done now for several years.

Okay. So but if if that were the case, then you may be asking to do that instead? Yes. Okay. Thanks.

Council Member Michalow. So I don't know if this is for Director Gallagher or Director Hawkins. And I haven't been on finance personnel until this year. So is this tip cold that we take operating money and spend it on capital equipment?

Actually, this not F and P and Council over the last few years have done that several times. The biggest example I can tell you about is purchasing out the lease agreement vehicles from the enterprise lease program to have them as city assets instead. So it's done frequently when we identify funds that are available. And because it's triggered above the amount that requires capital equipment, that's why it has to come to you. If it were a small purchase of 5,000 or $10,000 this would be something we could do administratively. But we have to get approval from the council again.

And my question is, why is there 90,000 extra dollars already that we know of in that fund?

Sure. Again, that's because when we negotiated the refuse and recycling contract with Harders, it includes an increase every year that is not determined until late in the year. So they don't lock that in until November, December. We typically have budgeted every year to be able to cover if that goes up for the worst case scenario. This is because for 2025, the amount we actually needed to pay was less than what we budgeted. So we're trying to use this surplus now that still exists because that is there. And that, again, next year won't be in place because we're trimming $100,000 off. So we'll actually have less than next year's budget.

So didn't we then budget $90,000 that couldn't go to a different department or use something else, and now you're getting a second bite of the apple?

No. Because this was for our department. We're not taking from anyone else. This is just using it in a different way. This is not $90,000 of somebody else's money. This is $90,000 of refuse and recycling money that we want to use for a piece of equipment for the street department's operations.

And I didn't mean it like I don't I think it sound quite with the way that you took it. I what I meant was that the $90,000 that you budgeted, we had to put into a budget, and then it was not avail that was in that limit that we couldn't use somewhere else. So I'm not, like, trying to pick at you. No. Right. We don't As money works.

Because this wasn't needed, we're pivoting to use it a different way. Yes. But this was part of the street department reviews recycling budget, yes.

Councilmember Newberry?

I motion to approve.

Council member Michaela.

Thank you. I have a question yet. So this is being used for storm. I mean, there were three different uses. So my question is, why can't that money come from those utilities or cost share that?

So the problem comes with the utilities paying to own an asset that then they have to declare, and it has to be a part of their budget, and they have to own it. This is one where instead the street department can own it, and we can generate revenue by using it and lending it to the water and sewer departments and charging them an equipment and usage fee to help the levy.

And then I have one follow-up. So this will just be used one time a year during Christmas tree pickup? Or when else

will this No. Be was the impetus for it, was during Christmas tree pickup, we could use that. But this would be used any time that on a street project, we might have to trim the trees because they're in the way of something. Maybe when we get letters from the OCR, that's the Office of Commissioner of Railroads, telling us that we have to trim trees near railroad crossings. And then again, for the site maintenance, we have 27 lift stations in

the city and 12 wells

And that are owned by the utilities, and those sites have to be maintained as well. So this could handle tree and brush clippings on behalf of them.

And we cannot be sharing equipment between departments, as we're we've heard that the state is trying to get municipalities and counties to be working together and not duplicate services. But we're not able to do it within our own city? It's just not working. Is there a way to make it work? Or I don't know if someone from Parks is here that says we need that all the time and we just can't ever give it up.

Yeah. Can't speak for them, but every time we've asked, they've been using it themselves. I don't know if their use is that tight and they don't have the surplus. I don't know.

Sure. Or we have a big storm at the same time that we're picking up Christmas trees.

CHRISTINE Councilmember Janssen.

So I've seen the trucks that they're throwing the Christmas trees in, and they are very tall, so I can see why people are getting injured. Do we not have other equipment that is lower to the ground that Christmas trees could be thrown into to prevent that?

No, we really don't, not with the capacity to haul them back to the street department. I guess, Ryan, if you wanted to speak to that, you're welcome. But the trucks that we have outfitted for seasonal use are the large dump trucks, and those are what would be used. I imagine with something smaller like a flatbed, what you'd end up doing is taking a lot more trips back and forth. And again, you're still loading and unloading it multiple times versus just chipping at once.

Is there any other discussion? Seeing none, we'll move forward with the vote. And this motion fails with a vote of three to three. Seeing nothing else on our agenda, I'll call this meeting adjourned.