Planning and Zoning Commission - Regular Meeting

Hello. I'm going to call this meeting to order. Uh, Chair Goss is not here at the moment. You guys will have to pick a temporary chair. Uh, with respect, I suggest uh M. Commissioner McCoy take over given he has the most experience on this.

And I've never done it. That's true. Thank you. Order, please. Okay, thank you. Chair Goss, Vice Chair Swap is excused. Commissioner McCoy, Commissioner Sarkeesian is excused. Commissioner Sixa, Commissioner Sprinkle here.

Commissioner Waters here. We do have a quorum. United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. And chair, could we just chair,

could we just state the what this meeting is and the date and time? Thank you. I'd like to figure out what it is. Commission work session September 24 All in favor say I.

I uh I don't want to oppose but uh sorry chair chair McCoy did we receive the minutes? Sorry I just sat down. I have to confess I haven't run through my email. I haven't run through yet.

Um abstain because I haven't read them. Ordinance update presentation of public comment comprehensive place. Good evening, commissioners. Tonight before you is actually just an overall comprehensive update to the city's uh proposed amended zoning code as well as our subdivision ordinance. I'll also be providing a couple updates on a couple policies that are being uh proposed as well uh to help with our development uh process uh along with uh spurring on economic development. This is really night two of a three series of uh workshops or special meetings. Uh we did hold a meeting yesterday uh with the development community as well as the community in general that was invited. We had quite a few stakeholders that had interest. Uh some of those are back here this evening. uh they have a glutton for punishment and they want to hear this presentation again. So we do appreciate them coming out. Uh I'm going to start off with just giving you a really brief uh overview. The purpose of the zoning ordinate really is to modernize and organize the code for improved clarity and usability. Uh what I have seen in my year uh here working with staff uh working with the development community uh the organization of the code does

make it very difficult to read. Uh makes it difficult for our staff to implement it. uh makes it difficult for homeowners uh to be able to understand it as well. In addition to that, it's to truly align some of the evolving land uses as well as the expectations and state legislation that's come forth. And ultimately, it is here to support businesses, residential, civic development uh through a clearer, more flexible standards. The code is broken up into six different uh titles uh with title one really being our general revisions. Title two goes into codifications of some of our rebranded development process uh as well as an update to our temporary use permits. And again, these are some of the high level uh the the documents that were sent out to you in your emails uh are are redline documents. It gives you much much greater detail um for for what's being proposed. Title three is our zoning district and land use. Uh this is probably where you'll see one of the larger changes uh to the code. Uh more specifically, we have a very condensed uh current land use matrix uh that uh our staff implements today. We've actually expanded that matrix and you'll get to preview that this evening. In addition to that, uh we are looking at the transct zones which uh mostly comprises of just this downtown area. Uh when you think about transect zones, you probably don't think downtown district or downtown identity. And so we're actually changing the name of that designation to downtown district. uh to actually align and provide identity for the downtown area. Uh ultimately, it's to create a more recognizable zoning identity for the downtown. It still does continue to uh implement what the transct zones were intended for, which encourages context sensitive uses that support walkability, mixed use, and local character. And again, the comprehensive land use matrix update uh goes into clear delineation of permitted, conditionally permitted uses uh by the zones. And again, it really is designed to be uh more readable uh to the developers, business owners,

economic development, and for staff. Title four gets into our supplemental standards. Uh so some of the the key things that we took uh over this last year uh direction, whether it be from uh working with the development community, working with the council. Uh some of those things we're bringing back as part of the comprehensive update. Uh metal buildings being one, accessory structures, driveway standards, and then we went into more of a a uh use specific standards and and I have micro schools called out. Uh it's it's an emerging use. Uh micro schools and daycarees, they are much needed uses in the city. However, they come with their own problems uh when you start looking at how uh how you implement those. So um to go along with the expanded land use matrix, we have the parking code update. Uh so it's an expanded uh parking uh table that uh provides for clarity there. And then there are some changes to our sign code. We are not doing a comprehensive sign ordinance update. We do plan on bringing that back sometime in 2026. However, there are a few things that we wanted to be able to address currently based on some of the feedback that we've received. That being one, the reuse of pole signs in the commercial zones uh where it's an existing pole sign and cabinet uh that's already there. Uh with the adoption of the 2019 or the 2021 code, uh pole signs became uh a non-conforming and non-permitted use uh for signage in the commercial zones. And then looking at the subdivision ordinance, we'll be looking also at commercial real estate signage uh and then signage associated with temporary uses. Uh so if you followed any of the the council meetings and some of the workshops that we had uh in the spring and into July, uh it really was looking at uh some of the direction we received was to come back and uh design a permitting process for the nonprofit or the other types of events that occur uh not on a regular basis, but that gives them the opportunity to to

advertise within the city without violating the city's current zoning ordinance when it comes to temporary signage. Um, one of the other bigger changes, uh, definitions. The current code had essentially two sets of definitions, some of them having the same term with different meanings for different purposes. Uh, so we've actually gone through and we've cleaned that up to where we have one comprehensive set of definitions. Uh, and we'll we address synonymous uh, terms in that particular format. Getting into the subdivision ordinance, uh, we'll we'll go over that uh, in in generality. uh it is a repeal and replace uh approach to that particular ordinance. Uh this is being uh mostly driven by the fact that state legislature made changes in March of this year. Uh takes away the planning zoning commission's authority as well as the city council's authority for any type of public review for subdivisions. And so with that, we do have to implement a revised subdivision ordinance that brings that to an administrative review. And so that is what uh is comprehensively outlined in that particular process along with the um financial asurances. And then uh we get into just uh some some additional items that uh for the the aspect of the subdivision ordinance. Currently our ordinance is fairly silent when it comes to lot splits, lot combines, uh parcel combinations, and lot line adjustments. So, uh, a common terminology used throughout Arizona's minor land divisions, which can encompass all of those. And so, we're actually creating a process and defining it within the subdivision ordinance. So, it gives uh developers and homeowners alike a very straightforward path in order to to accomplish these uh these changes to their lots if that's the case. And then we'll round out at the end a couple new policies. One is the expedited plan check review and then the at risk rating which again both of these are directives from state legislation.

So I want to start uh with some of you that may not uh be aware u staff had been working over this last year on rebranding its development process. Uh we rolled this out in April or in August of this year uh as a test pilot uh working with the various developers and the community in general. Uh in our previous process, you would have to go through what we would call um essentially a design review. Uh and then you'd get into a actual uh my mind is I've given this thing so many times now. Um getting into a secondary review process before you get into site plan review and then getting into your actual uh plan check. And what we found is uh the developers were submitting the same thing at every single point of the review process with very minimal changes. We were uh expending exorbitant amount of staff time uh in doing so and giving them the exact same comments throughout the entire process. So what we've done is uh we brought it back and we changed the process for due diligence. Uh it's a an application process that they can get through in two weeks. It's really designed for those that are policy driven. So, general plan amendments, changes zones, subdivisions. Uh, typically we'll go through that process. Uh, that allow the developer to sit down with staff, get some general direction, especially when it comes to policy related items, ensuring that we're consistent with general plan, uh, especially if they're proposing a change of zone or a subdivision that would would follow with that. The second step for them would be the development plan review application. Uh, and this particular process is a little bit more detailed than it was in the past. uh this does require that the applicant have a more much more robust uh submitt um from day one when they come in with their their application. So a conceptual uh site plan or conceptual subdivision, conceptual grading uh utilities uh in

that in that particular process staff now has enough information to guide and give them very detailed comments in regards to their proposal. allows the developer to go back and instead of what what they used to have to do is come back through a now a site plan process which could take them anywhere from three to four months as they go through numerous review processes with that or reiterations. It now lets it push it back into the developers uh or the design professionals laps and they now get to hold that process. They get to work with their applicant. They have clear direction all of the code requirements uh an updated zoning code uh that they can refer to. they can go back and actually design their project and instead of now coming back through multiple reiterations of the same thing, they'll be able to submit for site plan and their building plan check along with street improvements, grading and so forth concurrent and we will take all those plans at one time and we will move them through the process. Uh with that being said, uh ultimately we've we've seen that it saves anywhere from two to three months. um we can probably speak to say that it's probably a little bit more than that. Um knowing how many times that they would go through the site plan process ultimately reduces the redundancy in the process, gives the applicants clear direct uh path forward. And so we implemented that again as a trial period. Uh we took comments through the process from the development community and now we're bringing it back to actually codify it in the code. And here is just a development process summary. basically kind of shows uh essentially starting with step one there would be due diligence and again this this goes back down to the general plan amendments change of zones and so forth. Once they get through that process again two weeks they can come right back they can submit for development review committee uh and that's where the applicant now comes in and sits down with staff in a roundt format. They're sitting with our fire department or engineering department planning and building and they're getting comprehensive comments that are

specific to their project. They're not just getting a list of here's our code requirements, go and design it. We're actually giving them more detailed comments because they're giving us more details up front if they don't need an entitlement. So, if they don't need to go through a change of zone or a general plan amendment, a variance or conditional use permit, they'll be able to actually move straight forward and go to straight step five uh as shown on this exhibit, which is getting them into the building plan check process. And so, it cuts out a lot of that in between process. um if they have a very clean submitt and it looks really good uh when they have to go through an entitlement process such as a conditional use permit uh then they'll start that process and again if it's a very clean submitt we would allow them to also at their own risk start the building plan check process and then of course getting to step six which is the building permit issuance. So part of the amendments tonight will actually be to incorporate and codify this into code. One of the other things, again going back to some of the the meetings that we held in the spring and then moving into July of this year, we had a special workshop with the city council regarding temporary signage. Uh temporary signage, as you may know and have seen, it gets put up on fences and so forth throughout the city. It's proliferation of signage. Um some of it gets maintained, some of it doesn't. And so as the planning department and more specifically neighborhood enforcement set out to start doing proactive enforcement in certain areas, uh it was it was realized that a lot of these that utilize this form of of signage and temporary advertising of their events. Uh ultimately they were putting their banners out illegally because we don't allow them on uh fences currently. Um and uh at the end of the day uh we were uh given direction to come back and actually look for a permitting process to allow for such. And so already in the code is temporary use permits. Uh so that was the easiest place to start looking because they are for temporary

events. And so by doing so we're able to incorporate uh temporary use permits to allow for temporary signage in conjunction with their actual event. So as part of that uh we went through and created some SA standards. So more specifically we limit to 12 events per location per year. Uh basically can be on public or private property. Um when we get down to the signage uh what we heard uh we started out at about 16 square feet. We we heard that they wanted it to have a larger signage. So we are proposing 24 square feet in area. Uh the banners can be posted uh up to eight places within the city. Um, however, no more than two per intersection. Something to be very, very clear in regards to this is I can only issue a temporary use permit for an event that's within the city. So, that's the only way that they can put up temporary advertising, is if the event is held within the city boundary. So, if it's held at a location outside of the city boundary, a church or another location, something of that nature, the city does not have the authority to issue a permit. Therefore, they would not be able to to erect any type of temporary signage. Moving forward, some of our biggest concerns is just making sure that it's a fix so it's not blowing away. As you can see, some of the signage gets torn down on the fences based on the exhibits that are there. Uh, also adhering to the triangular line of sight. There's an exhibit further in this presentation that discusses that. Uh, more importantly, when can they put them up? So, as part of the temporary use permit process, they can erect their banners 14 days prior to their event. However, they would have to remove the banners within 48 hours upon conclusion of their event. Uh, in talking with several of uh the the entities, uh some of them hold events that start in March and they go all the way through October, November, uh and some some even December. And so there's uh some additional language that was put in here that uh for for those types of events, they still cannot have

any type of advertisement uh greater than the 12 consecutive months in the calendar year. And then ultimately, we're asking that they put the temporary use permit number on the front of the banner so that from a way from an enforcement standpoint, as my neighborhood officers are out there, they'll be able to see what is actually permitted and what's not permitted. Moving forward with respect to some of the changes uh I I alluded to the transct zones. Transct zones primarily make up this downtown area. Uh we have T4 neighborhood which is shown in the top left hand side of the exhibit. Uh that particular area really is attributed to more of an R2 type designation. Uh across from that in the the light or mentor green uh T3 neighborhood which is really a single family designation allowing for minimum lot size of 6,000 square feet. And then we get to T5 general which is the areas that flank Beiel Street uh as well as some of the other uh uh roads within the the downtown area Oak and Spring. And then T5 which is really the main street corridor uh which fronts along Andy Divine. And again to really bring about identity, there's no changes in regards to the development standards in this particular section, but we really wanted to be able to give it identity uh with respect to the downtown district. So we're essentially just renaming those from the the T4s, threes, fives uh to DD1, 2, 3, and 4, which brings us to the next portion, our land use matrix. Uh currently the the city's land use matrix is uh encapsulated in about three pages. Uh and then it gets spread throughout every different section of our code uh starting with residential all the way through to uh our uh plan development zones. And when that happens uh it allows for a lot of opportunity for things to get missed. We are current we cross reference some of the same uh

footnotes or development standards time and time again. Uh and for I will tell you from a staff perspective as well as from a development stand standard u being able to provide consistent information is critical uh for for any type of developer within the city. So this helps align all of that into one usable matrix. It provides all of the uses which we've actually expanded to be more uh economic development friendly. Uh it lets brokers know that we're open for business. their uses are permitted expressly discussed within our zoning code. Uh but we also then uh in the the the column immediately to next to the use we call out use specific standards. So with those you use specific standards it gives a direct link not only for staff but as well as for anybody that's looking at it to be able to uh to take a look at uh those requirements. I'll just quickly flip through these. These were all part of your packets. Uh so if you have any questions regarding those um as part of this presentation tonight we are taking comments through October 10th which where we'll go back and and we will uh make any final last minute changes and edits based on the comments we receive. We will push out another public draft of this uh in preparation of bringing it back before the planning and zoning commission and city council. So I talked about youth specific standards. Uh some of those again deal with all types of uses whether it be a marijuana use and again we already have those in our code uh down to automobile related uses things of that nature. Um however one that's kind of emerging is the the microschools daycare centers uh preschools. The code was unclear as to how those were handled um with respect to they lumped them all into a school per se or a daycare. Um, however, they each have different types of requirements depending on the age range in which the the attendees are are going

there. Um, and then you get into micro schools which have no regulations under the state of Arizona. Um, and with that being said, you could end up in a residential zone having two or three of these types of uses immediately adjacent to one another, having anywhere from 5 to 12, you know, plus kids, uh, even those up to driving because it allows for uh, of all ages for for K through 12. So, what we did is we went back through, we truly identified and and defined what schools were for K through 12 uh, private, micro schools, college, universities, trade school standards. What's not in here is public schools. Local jurisdiction does not have authority over public schools. So, um, so that's why you'll see that it's regulated to just those particular areas. One of the other areas was metal buildings. Uh, my staff constantly was in a battle in regards to how to address metal buildings. We had some that had architectural elements that were being imposed and it's behind the building. It's behind their main house. You can't see it. Uh then you have metal buildings that are very forward of the of the front of the house that had no architectural elements. So we came through and we really cleaned that up. And basically if if you're going to be forward of your rear building line, you need to have some architectural elements that match that of of your primary dwelling unit. If you're back behind that rear building line, paint it to match your primary structure. We're not here to be overregulatory. uh the previous code uh goes into having so many percentages of glass or other architectural features. Uh then the my staff as well as the applicants and typically the homeowners uh are sitting there trying to figure out what constitutes an architectural feature at this point. Uh became very ambiguous. We ended up with structures that probably had 30% or had 10% at the end of the day. And so this this came back and it made it for a level playing field for anybody that's looking to utilize a metal building on their residential property. But also we went through and we looked at th those that would be allowed for commercial and industrial uh

industrial metal buildings. Uh the biggest changes some have some of our industrial areas have metal buildings already. Um and for us to sit there and say that you know we want your next metal building to be this architectural grand feature on your property when it doesn't match your existing we felt that that was uh overreaching. And so we did provide for standards that allows them to match their existing some of the other standards that we went through and we've kind of gone through the accessory structures on a couple iterations as we've gone through a couple code amendments uh since I've been here and really this is now just taking accessory structures and pulling it into one area. It further defines it. Uh but it also provides greater latitude for patio covers especially patio covers that are open on three sides. we're not to looking to count those towards uh lot coverage requirements and it provides a greater flexibility for the homeowner. And then I think when we get down to one of the other problems that we've run into and we we deal with this on a regular basis is getting into the driveway uh standards. Uh engineering department does have driveway standards when it goes to connect to our public roadways. However, the area for let's just say RVs or let's say the areas that they're not connecting to an improved ride ofway um it was very left unopened. It was it was left to where they could have basically a dustless surface uh and in some cases they didn't have to put any driveway requirements in at all uh if the road wasn't uh already improved. And what we saw with there was uh if we allowed it would continue to go down that road. uh at some point in time the city will and potentially come through and improve those roads and we're going to have homeowners with no driveways, no driveway approaches. The way the current code was written is that now the city would go out and force them to put that back in. So alls we're doing is pushing it down the road when we could be asking them to put it in now and then when there's a transition period that's in there, whether it be because of where

the rideway line is or the property line is, there's an alternative material that they can use. This again levels the playing field, allows everybody to treat be treated the same way. Again, I've seen uh anything from PA strips to gravel in some areas to GG to DG with uh basically a stabilizer that's on it and it's deemed dustless for the time being, but after one or two rains, it's no longer dustless. Um so then it becomes an enforcement issue for us. One of the other bigger changes is going back and looking at our parking requirements. Uh, as we expanded the land use matrix, we went back and looked at the parking requirements and we aligned the parking requirements to be consistent with that of all of the uses that we incorporated into the expanded land use matrix. So, that was uh done as well. I will flip through this. There's a lot of information. This entire table was a repeal and replace in the code. So it looks like it's all brand new. A lot of it was already existing. So coming back to uh temporary signs, uh with respect to those types of temporary uses and events, uh we did need to make some changes to our sign code. Uh so in this particular table, you'll notice a couple things. One is we allowed for uh the off- premise temporary use permit signs and the commercial zones. Uh they can have an a banner that doesn't exceed 24 square ft. they get the eight per event, no more than two per uh intersection. And that's consistent with what we've uh written into the TUP section. Uh one of the other things that we came across was the feather banners, which is located in the bottom right hand side of this exhibit. Uh what we were noticing is we were seeing feather banners, two, three, four sandwiched right adjacent to one another. Um not being maintained. it creates line of sight issues um both for pedestrian as well as for vehicular purposes. Uh so we went through and we actually added some

standards that were in there that does require that they have 25 ft spacing. Uh and then it does allow for them to not exceed 40 square feet uh in their combined area for their for the feather banners. One of the other op uh items that has come up more recently uh more recently even uh just a couple council meetings ago we did bring forward a presentation addressing some of the poll signs. We have existing poll signs in our commercial zones. They have existing cabinets associated with them. However, in 2021 when the new code went into effect, pole signs were uh prohibited in our commercial zones. So it rendered these signs non-conforming. with them being non-conforming, if they were not reused or repurposed with the new tenant within six months, they could no longer use that. So, you end up with these abandoned structures that are out there. You have new tenants that are coming in. You have economic development and growth uh coming forward. And so, you certainly have users that would like to reuse and repurpose these signs. Uh in the interim, uh staff is recommending that we go ahead and allow further reuse of the existing signs. uh as long as it's an existing sign, existing cabinet, they can put it back into play, um it's no longer blighted, if they put a new cabinet face in it. And then when we get into the 2006 uh uh 2026 comprehensive update, we will probably come back and look at pole signs in totality uh and probably actually create different design standards uh that will allow for for better design or better designed pylon or pole signs. So, I talked about the triangular line of sight. So, the exhibit down on the bottom right hand side, this is really where the area that's kind of hashed out. We don't want anything that's exceeding three feet in height. Uh once it exceeds 3 ft in height, it becomes a visibility issue for anybody that's in a car or if you have pedestrians and so forth. So, when we talk about uh banners, we talk about signage, we talk about things that are temporary in

nature. Um this is the area that it's prohibited from being in. And this is citywide. So, we have this for any type of walls, any type of landscaping, any type of signage. Um, with that being said, uh, an area that was silent in our code, uh, was real estate, uh, commercial real estate signage. Um, there was no allocations or discussion as to how do you legally advertise that you, you know, you have a suite within the Walmart center that's available for uh, for for sale or for lease. And so, most most cities have these uh, already built into their code. they're exempt from any permit. We did the exact same thing. So, we did create standards that are consistent with that, allowing up to 48 square feet, maximum width of 8 ft, maximum height of 14 feet. Um, overall, uh, we went through and continued to look at some of the the issues in it regards to the real estate residential signs and again, uh, some areas it was silent, some areas were were left untouched in previous codes. And so we came through, we actually incorporated uh signed standards that allowed and aligned with that for the re real estate uh industry that uh serves our our residential areas. Uh in this particular area, the most important thing is the open house signs. Uh basically restricting them to 7 in the morning to 7 at night. They can advertise, they can put them out there seven days a week. However, we do want them to pick them up and not leave them out there on a permanent basis. So I think that's the really the biggest takeaway. the size of the signs and so forth. It was all per industry standard. It was missing in our code. So, we've added that back in. So, we did get a request from one of the the local developers uh in regards to advertising for subdivisions uh subdivisions specifically to allow for off- premise signs. Uh this was something that came up essentially out of the valley uh a couple years ago. I actually worked closely with the

building industry association uh as well as every agency within the valley and we took the the best of the best from all of their ordinances uh when it came to off-site signage and presented a comprehensive sign ordinance to the building industry association. Uh they were h very happy with that. Um it served their needs especially when you end up having subdivisions that are further off the freeway, harder to get to, doesn't have direct visibility. It allows for those uh developers to actually put their signs up on properties uh in a manner that they can help direct uh potential buyers to their properties. So, what is currently proposed in this particular site is uh they would be allowed to have uh three, I believe it is three on-site signs, uh and then they could have one off-site sign. The off-site sign had to be on a 1acre parcel uh or greater. um comments and feedback that we've already heard. Uh we're already making changes to incorporate some of those uh those changes. Uh specifically in this particular case, uh we're going to allow it to go on halfacre lots. However, we're looking for 2500 foot separation from signs. Uh and they can have two. And again, that just goes back to to helping our our local developers uh get get their product out there and get it known. One of the other things uh it was uh originally proposed to have is to be within a landscape area uh around the base of the sign. Uh we're going to remove that just as long as it's got no trash, weeds, and debris. One of the bigger things is is it limits it to it has to be a subdivision that's 50 lots or greater. So that way we don't have so many of these coming up in in the city and it becomes a different proliferation of of signage. So that's going to wrap it up for the zoning ordinance high level. What you have before you and in your documents uh again is a lot of redline text. A lot of

that text is existing throughout the code. It was brought over. It was reformatted and put into the areas. So my staff, developers, homeowners, community members alike can go directly into the code, go to one area of the code and see all of the development standards that would be associated with that type of development. Um, currently I could tell you the current code if you wanted something to deal with parking, you looked in three different sections because you would have landscaping parking, you'd have lighting for parking, and you'd have parking. Well, now we put it all in in one area. So, moving forward, the subdivision ordinance is probably the next biggest change. Again, a lot of this is driven solely off the fact that state statute is going to require that these be administratively approved uh within the local jurisdictions. uh that has to be in place by January 1st of this year. Uh ultimately when it's all said and done, uh it allows for uh eliminates the the council review of the standard subdivisions. Um but we will be establishing processes for the lot spits, lot combinations, and lot line adjustments utilizing the parcel plat process which is identified and recognized under state statute uh for subdivisions. Couple other things that'll be incorporated into it. Uh as part of that uh under the state legislation changes, we do have to uh implement an at risk grading process. Uh currently we do do it. It's just not a defined process. So that will be included in this particular ordinance. Uh in addition to that, there's some changes that we saw on a consistent basis. We were seeing waiverss coming forward uh based on whether it be block lengths or culde-sacs, things of that nature, or single tiered lots where they back up to a street. Um those waiverss have been taken out in their entirety. Uh standards still exist, but the applicant has to basically demonstrate that they meet those standards. Since it's going to be administratively approved, staff does not want to be put

in the position where we're having to administratively also approve waiverss. So, that's going to be one of the bigger changes uh within that subdivision ordinance. Uh easements. Uh couple of things that keeps coming up in regards to easements. Uh a couple things that come up in regards to easements is uh any type of permanent construction, specifically walls over easements. Uh ultimately is what we're we're saying is we're not going to tell you to change your practice that you've been doing. and we know it's going to have a significant effect uh on the developers if that's the case. However, we do want to make sure that they're holding the city uh as well as any of the utility purveyors uh and they're indemnifying us. Uh ultimately, what happens is if you have a wall constructed over an easement, Unisur has to come through or the city has to come through for some reason or another, they have to take out that wall to access the easement or access something in that nature. Uh it's not always going to be the city or potentially that private utility putting that wall back up. it actually falls back onto the owner's responsibility. So, we want to make sure that the owner is fully notified. We've been doing this as a practice from a policy standpoint for for several months. Uh making sure that they do have a a disclosure notice uh either at the time that they enter into their purchase agreement or through escrow. And so that'll codify it into this code as well. And then one of the other things and and this is still something that is ongoing. It is it is here currently which is the traffic impact analysis. uh as it stands today uh really it's about 200 lots or 200 trips that triggers it today. That can vary depending on the type of density and the type of project that you have. Uh we are proposing currently that uh if you have a subdivision that's going to exceed 100 lots. uh you would have to come back and actually prepare a traffic impact analysis which analyzes all of the intersections, all the trip generations uh and so forth based on a scoping session uh that is established by the city engineer. Uh again, this is

still subject to change. City engineer and I've been going back and forth. We may tie it back to trips as opposed to number of lots again because uh density itself may may trigger uh that change. And then uh kind of starting to round this out, uh a couple things again that w was asked in that legislation is that cities had to come up with an expedited plan review. And when the legislation was adopted, it said cities can adopt their own subjective standards as to who or what type of project could go through that expedited review. Uh I can tell you my staff nor engineering wanted to be in that position where we're saying you good developer meet the requirements. You developer don't meet the requirements. Uh so we came back uh working with uh uh my counterpart Shawn uh looking at the type of permits that we felt comfortable with that could qualify for an expedited review. Single family and duplex lots uh duplex type residential uh uses uh providing no variances, no zoning entitlements or discretionary approvals would have been required and the project has been designed to demonstrate compliance with all applicable zoning subdivision development standards. Those would be projects that could go through an expedited review. Uh 10day uh plan review for a single family lot. Uh that would be cut in half to five days if that's the case. So uh that just gives you an idea as to how that would that would work. We will continuously monitor and see what types of uses we feel can further go into that category. Uh but this is what we wanted to start with. This is where we felt comfortable with. two other elements to that. Again, going back to the new development process, we looked at what projects could be exempt from that process altogether. And then what could actually get a waiver and I'll explain the waiver process as well. So those that could be exempt, new single family residents or duplex, they don't have to go through development plan review process. Again, as long as they meet all the zoning requirements, they have it designed to meet all this the standards, they get all their

structural requirements, they can go straight into building permit. And again, in theory, if they meet all those requirements, they should be able to have a permit within 5 days. Uh assuming assuming there's no second round of review uh parcel plats. So again, going back to looking at those minor land divisions, so lot combinations, lot splits. Uh again, this will get goes back to the subdivision ordinance. It's already uh in in effect with Arizona State statue. So as long as they are four lots or less, they would be able to fall under that category. And then there may be other lots or or other types of projects. So or there's exemptions as determined by the director. So as we see different one-off type projects, they may be applicable. We certainly want to give them that opportunity. Uh we really are here to usher the developers through the process. We want to get them through it. We want to get them in building uh on their property. We don't want to be a roadblock at the end of the day. Kind of rounding out the projects that we looked at for waivers. So the development process as it is, it is a mandatory meeting. So the applicant does have to come in and meet with us. It can be via Zoom. Um we do prefer that it be in person because we feel that we get uh uh better round of comments uh better engagement and understanding as to their project, what they need out of it and and what the city is is looking for as well. But that being said, we've identified certain types of projects that would be allowed to go through a waiver process. And again, this helps for a lot of our tenant improvements where we're really trying to get, you know, reuse into some of our existing tenant spaces. So, as long as it's 2500 square f feet or under, uh there's no uh structural uh interior walls or petitions, interior mechanical, electrical, plumbing or alterations and the exterior mechanical is any type of like forlike replacement, they would qualify for a waiver. They would still submit their application for development plan review. However, in lie of coming in, staff will review it. Staff will give them a comprehensive list of requirements as well as their applications that move them into the next process in the next part of the process. Um some of the other things

that we looked at uh basically uh no change to the building footprint, building heights, uh or any type of utility service, no change in occupancy classification. This is one of the big ones. And this goes back to again some of those daycarees, the micro schools, things of that nature where we just end up having children in buildings that aren't meeting the the basic safety requirements in regards to exiting or any type of fire suppression or alarms. Uh moving forward from there, no modifications to the site. So from a traffic circulation standpoint, access or drive or parking requirements and no increase in impervious surface which would trigger additional engineering review any landscaping that was being removed as long as it's like for like uh we've done several projects as pilot projects. Um I will speak specifically to two that I know are publicly out there. Uh one is the In-N-Out. So you'll notice all of their landscaping has been completely revamped. It's all drought tolerant. It is all low water use. Um that was a pilot program for us. Uh the other one being and we are still working through that process and that is BOSA donuts. They are still coming. Yes, their sign came down. They had to make some changes to that but I I saw some some comments out there. Um but they also they qualified for that that exemption under the 2500 square foot. And so uh they they did elect to come in for that process. Um however that particular applicant and I we have a long-standing working relationship with he wanted to come through the process and we explained to him you know we want to utilize you as as a pilot program and he was excited to go through it. So uh now coming back to uh a change from last night's uh presentation to tonight's is our at risk grading process. So some of the comments that were received last night were able to go back. This is one that we were able to to quickly go back in and and take a look at as well as provide some additional clarification in regards to what is needed uh as part of it. So at risk rating we currently do allow uh again it's by policy only. We have no

written uh aspect to it. However, as part of what's required under the the legislative changes is that we do memorialize something. And so being included into our subversion ordinance would be an atrisisk process. It would allow them as soon as they are done with their preliminary plat. And while they are preparing their final plat, they could actually come in and ask for an atrisisk rating permit. Uh in addition to that, and what we've heard from the development community is they also want to be able to perhaps build their perimeter walls and some of their retaining walls. uh as they're doing some of that grading all at risk. And so this actually outlines the process for that and more specifically it actually talks about the fact that they still have to give us financial asurances which is normally what we would get at the final plat stage uh as we're moving through the process to make sure that the city has some assurance in the event that the developer walks away something catastrophic happens like it did in 2005 to 2008 where developers walked away and left stick frame buildings standing there or partially graded lots. It gives the sil city a financial assurance and ability to go in and and either mitigate it, correct it, finish out some of that work to make sure that we don't end up with drainage or other issues that would impact residents nearby. So, I'm going to quickly kind of just talk about what we've heard. We've heard a lot. So, um you've got about three pages of comments before you. Um the red line version is our response to the comments. Uh I can tell you of the comments that we've heard, some have already been incorporated. temporary use permits allowing for eight events as opposed to six. 24 square feet in area as opposed to 16. The atrisisk grading um that you see tonight here. Uh other of those we are going through the process. We are evaluating and we do anticipate that there will be some additional changes. Uh those that uh from a staff perspective maybe we're just not comfortable with uh or if it's policy related uh those will be placed before the planning and zoning

commission city council ultimately. So, um, those will be items that we ask for direction back on. So, um, being that said, again, you have it before you. I won't go through every single one of them, but it'll give you an idea of again what some of the comments are that we're hearing. Um, goes down to again, can I have my event that in the county we're clarifying that if you're in the county, you're not eligible for a city permit, so you wouldn't be able to advertise. Um some of the the major comments that came about was shifting the burden of cost of development earlier on in the process and certainly that is the case in in in the manner of the fact that we're asking for conceptual plans through the development plan review process. Um typical industry standard these would be being prepared anyways. You would have a conceptual site plan. You'd have a conceptual grading plan. You would have conceptual utilities and streets. all of that would be already on a plan uh when they're coming in and sitting down to really start getting uh getting comments and feedback from staff. Uh so although it seems like we're shifting it, we are just actually shifting the burden back to the the developers to provide us a better quality plan up front as opposed to waiting into that site plan review process that was taking four months or then kicking it further down the road and getting into the plan review plan check process and then that being four or five reviews. Um so by asking for that information up front, we're getting greater detail. We're being able from a staff perspective to give uh more detailed sightspecific site development comments back to the applicants uh which in turn allows them to uh to bring back a project. I I will tell you from the design professional standpoint uh I did hear a comment that well we only designed to about 6 to8% and we let staff actually design the rest of it for us based on comments. uh staff is here to review the project against the standards. And so by cleaning up our

code, allowing it to be uh easily readable and so forth, we're providing those tools to the development community uh to help them get through that process a little bit easier. Again, I'm not going to go through every single one of these. Most of these have been addressed in some manner or another. So again, as you uh you know, take take your time to review through that. Um staff is going to take comments on all of this through October 10th. We will again go back. We'll make some final revisions. We'll push out uh final draft copies uh to the stakeholders, to the commissions, to the council. Uh it'll be posted back on the city's website, which is where it is currently posted as well. Uh that way again we can solicit those comments. Uh just a little bit about the timeline. We kind of started this essentially back in January. We started doing a series of workshops well actually in October of of 2024 but throughout the year we were were continuously taking comments from the development community stakeholders and so forth and that's how we got to where we were with this comprehensive update. Um the development process uh rebranding uh launched August 1st uh and again we we've had uh good feedback on that particular process and what we're targeting is to be able to bring this back to the planning and zoning commission in November. It will follow essentially one week later to the city council uh in November. So that way it's ready for implementation as of January 1st, which is a requirement for state statue. With that 49 minutes and

yeah, I will turn it back over to the commission if you have any questions. Um it is a workshop in a sense type setting. So I know the public will have comments that they will probably like to make uh in regards to this. my staff and myself will readily take uh notes of those and then we'll come back answer any questions you have. Great. Thank you so much, Jason. Thank you. All right, we're going to save our questions for staff until we move into our next phase. Um but right now, I'm just going to open the floor for public comment. So, if anybody has anything that they wish to address us with, they can approach the podium and state your name.

I do have one. Um Okay, we have a a Robin Robin Gordon. Thank you.

Good evening. My name is Robin Gordon. I'm here this evening um representing a group I'm involved with called Sounds of Kingman. Sounds of Kingman has been um putting on concerts in Metcafe Park for now 15 years in the during the summer months. And then several years ago, we added to our schedule for the winter months some speakers that would speak primarily in an indoor location like the library and speak on historic subjects and offer those um to the public. All of our concerts and also the speakers are free to the public. We're very fortunate that the business community has been very supportive of us and sponsoring these events so that we can pay the performers and also pay the people who do the presentation yet offer the events free to the public. We are a nonprofit. Um I'm here tonight to talk a little bit about the temporary use permit, the special events application. Um, this application does not work for us. The reason it doesn't work for us is because we have events scheduled throughout the entire year, the summer months and the winter months, and at the beginning of the year don't often know or don't know what the dates are going to be for the events later in the year. So, we would end up having to file several of these applications and pay each time for that application. And I think that that's not really fair. Um I think that either we should be able to be charged once a year for the application and then any subsequent applications that we would make during the next of the year would be at no charge or something like that I think would be more fair. Um, part of the reason why we can't predict when

these events are going to be is we use the county libraries facilities and they only allow us to schedule events 3 months in advance. So there's there's absolutely it's impossible to schedule for a whole year, especially with the library. Now the city parks, which is Metaf Park, which is where we hold our concerts, that's not a problem. But right now, the problem would be would be with the library. It's just impossible for us to do that. Um, I'm also confused by some of these things that are exempt from having to file for this um, special event application, like seasonal sales. Why are seasonal sales exempt from having to um, file an application and they're allowed to put up signs. Basically, it would be at no charge. And then last night, I talked a little bit about the yard sale issue. Um, I understand that that's a staffing issue that you don't that the developmental services doesn't have the staff to be able to monitor that, but I think that yard sale signs is probably one of the big problems we have in this community as far as clutter and making the uh community look trashy. And I think that's kind of what started this whole thing. So, I think it needs to be addressed as well. Thank you for allowing me to talk to you. And if you have any questions, I'd be happy to answer them.

Great. Thank you so much. We're actually not allowed to respond in this setting, but thank you. You're welcome. Thank you. All right. Does anybody else have a comment?

No. Okay. I see none. Um Jason, are you going to address that one? So, uh, just real quick in regards to temporary signs, uh, let me just address the fact that sounds of Kingman, yes, they do have multiple events. Uh, they would be, if they don't know when each of those events would be, uh, they don't know the banners and things of that nature, where they're going to be, they would be subject to having to pull a separate permit for each event. If they come in at January 1st, they they know all of their events. They have them all lined up. They know where their banners are going to be. They have all that authorization from those property owners. They are able to pull one permit and it's good for the entire year for all of their events. With respect to seasonal sales, seasonal sales has been exempt in the code uh under the TUP section because it's identified specifically for 45 days. That's all they get. The seasonal sales typically don't have offsite signs or temporary banners that they use. It's typically in front of either a Christmas tree lot or a pumpkin farm, something of that nature. And again, the TUP section is only being modified in this particular instance is to allow for these types of events to actually have offsite banners. Uh otherwise, essentially, uh they wouldn't be going through this because most of these events are being held either at the county on car county fairground property or on city property, which would exempt them from going through the TU process. But again, the only reason why they would have to go through it is because they're doing off-site banners. Um, same thing with respect to yard sales. Yard sales, uh, if I were to have, uh, somebody coming in, I I would have to have a full-time person just issuing yard sale permits, uh, at our public counter. Um, to have somebody doing that seven days a week when uh, I will just tell you, we go out there, we do pull down the yard sale signs. We we go out there, we try to

monitor it from that perspective, but to to issue a permit and take away from getting development review applications out the door, working with our development community, uh my staff, my my resources are better spent in that location. Thank you, Jason. All right. Does anybody have You know what? Let me let me just open us up for commission discussion and then you can stay there and we can talk to Jason. Go ahead. Have much to say besides uh Madam Chair, uh Mr. McKin. Moin.

Moin. Okay. Um I'd just like to say you did a really good job with the uh with the land use matrix and also with the parking, you and your staff. Thank you. Um I do have one question. Um you were talking about at the end about how um it frontloads the development a little bit on what their responsibility is when coming to you. Um how much time savings though are they probably going to get on all of the review process being cut down? I will tell you it'd be significant.

Okay. From what I've seen, what I've engaged in in this last year, uh, if you were to come into our office with a 68% drawing, uh, in most cases, that design professional is now having go to go back to his client multiple times over, multiple iterations of their contract or change orders associated with it, additional services, and uh, I will tell you, every time that that happens, uh, the city is to blame. It's just how it is in the development community. We are always to blame. We're to blame for holding up the process. We're we're the ones that are blamed for uh you know giving them requirements that they didn't get the first time. And a lot of that comes down to the fact that we don't get enough information through that first level of review. So we've gone through and we've created a a standard in which they should be adhering to. They are very much industry standard. It is nothing out of the norm. If you look at what's required on a development plan review application, uh it's going to be 59 items. Uh of those 59 items, we're talking simple things. A north arrow, vicinity map, application information or applicant information, property owner zoning, uh show us existing proposed utilities, show us uh what your what your plan is for your drainage on site. Uh when we say conceptual grading, we're looking at for some topo lines. We're looking at for some some flows. Where is the drainage going? So, it is very conceptual at that stage, but it's enough to now give staff, both planning, zoning, building, engineering, and the fire department enough information to give very clear, decisive comments for them to go back, make revisions to their plans. And now they can spend that time instead of coming back and forth through our process, they can be working with their applicant fully designing their site, moving it forward into their elevations, architectural uh design and details and so forth. And is what it does for us is it allows my staff, the engineering staff, the fire department staff, building staff to be available to take

those phone calls and be able to respond to them, whether it be phone call, whether it be email. Uh I will tell you my staff uh I I I require that they respond to calls within 24 hours. uh if not same day if possible. Um but typically if we get something at four o'clock in the afternoon, we may not be able to get to it to the next day. Um but from my perspective, that's providing the service that they need, that guidance, th those types of things. So, as long as that two-way street communication is there, and I can tell you that's what I've committed to since I've came here, um that's that's the direction we'll continue to go. Thank you. Well, and it sounds like that time saving should offset any kind of extra cost. Anyway, but um thank you. I have a question. I have a question.

Um going back to Sounds of Kingman. Sounds of Yeah. Sounds of King. So, are we talking about the signs that they put at Metcav Park? Doesn't the city own Metcav Park? So, typically any type of sign or banner that they put that is offsite. So, when we say off-site signs,

currently in the city ordinance, the only person that can advertise and put a banner up is going to be the business that's located, the brickandmortar business that's located on that particular property. So, these types of temporary events, they don't have a legal mechanism of actually advertising today. They've been doing it all along. Um, we recognize it. Uh, we've been out there, we've done some enforcement on it. Um, and now what started this was back in uh March we recognized that uh there was quite the proliferation of illegal banners uh throughout the city. And it wasn't just on fences. It was the the McDonald's that has theirs up, you know, 365 days a year. Danbar has theirs up for different events on a regular basis and so forth. And so we wanted to be able to get an educational campaign out there. We got that information out there. And what ensued after that was we'd be taking away their ability to advertise their events. Um what the city was left with is uh narrowly trying to thread a process that would not put us on the map. And I say that in the respect to when you look at Reed versus Gilbert. Reed versus Gilbert was uh a case that came out uh where the city of Gilbert essentially denied prospective individuals from advertising uh within the city. And uh essentially the courts came back down and said you can't look at content, you can't look at who it is or any of that nature. You have to look at where it is. You can look at when it's placed and so forth. That's what cities can regulate. Um, so we had to go back and look at one, do we want to allow everybody in the city or did we want to allow for providing a process for events that were already identified in the code? And that's where we came up with the temporary use permit. I will say it is narrowly skirting Reed versus Gilbert probably at the end

of the day. Um, does that mean we won't get challenged? Probably not. We probably will at some point in time. Um, but we will certainly cross that bridge when we get there because we're talking about a nonprofit. We're talking about free to the community. We're talking about a community service essentially. So, could there or would there be the opportunity for an exception if it was a plus to the community instead of something where somebody was selling something for profit per se? So, I think that's that's where it is and what it is. Huh. Yeah. Commissioner six to commissioners. I think that's where you get back to and and Carl can probably chime in here. That would get us in trouble very quickly because now we are picking one versus another.

Got to pick sides. Jason's correct. We have that's why we have to be very careful about he says we're kind of threading the needle on our sign regulation to to be as accepting and allowing some of these certain type of things. Uh so we don't cross that threshold of Reed versus Gilbert. Uh I think we're we're pushing it. Uh but we're trying to make some of these allowances for those groups now. That's what this is.

Okay. So is it a state mandated that political signs have to be allowed in a city? There's a state statute that requires political signage and city right of way during this captured time period.

Okay. I just have uh one more question. Um so I've noticed that there are a lot of the digital signs that are now around Kan and uh frequently it says if you're a nonprofit you should contact to advertise. Um, does that program is that does that work for free? Is that part of a how does that program chair go? Commissioners, that program is actually managed by our city clerk's office. There is a cost to advertise. I don't want to misspeak, but I know that there's a a daily and a weekly rate um for that type of advertisement. It is limited to nonprofits only. Okay.

Um so keeping in mind maybe that would be Sounds of Kingman. They could advertise through that that means. Um however what we have also come across is we have the craft fairs, we have the farmers markets, things of that nature, things that are on the county fairgrounds. Those are not nonprofit. Um so they would not be able to advertise on uh on those types of devices. Yeah. Because I haven't really seen anybody using it. So maybe Well, I don't uh I don't monitor that program. It is done through our city clerk's office. Okay. Thank you.

I have one question if I might. But back to the sounds of Kingman because they don't know when or where their event will be located. Is there a way that we could make a blanket license, one fee only that would cover the entire year and then on a monthly basis or quarterly basis, they could come in and say here's where our events are going to be instead of having to pay each time that they have that event. So, Commissioner Chair Goss, Commissioner McCoy, I think again we go back to are we treating one entity equal to that of another. So, the temporary use permit process is a process that's utilized for other types of events as well. So, we would it's going to come down to a policy decision. Does do do we want to go down that road to allow for an open-ended permit to where they're having to come in on a regular basis? And what I fear is they forget to come in, we go out there, they don't have a current permit on tag on their on their banner, we take their banner down, and then you then it's my staff that's that's the ones that are having to answer to it. And and I tell you, it happens. Um it happens when there's rain events because all of a sudden they cancel the event, but then they want to utilize that same period for another time. Um so then it becomes a tracking issue for our staff uh in doing so. Again, not something that's probably impossible. Uh but again, it's going to come down to is there desire to go uh to go with that type of a process. So,

okay. Thank you,

Madam Chair, if if might address Mr. Mwin. Um I just I do have a concern um like you're just talking about the subjectivity about um assigning, you know, certain people as being a true nonprofit versus a not. I mean, how does that really different differ from the design professionals that are listed in some of these documents, too? It's kind of subjective. Um, I know I know that we're mandated by the state to administratively approve these these plats. You know, we've had a lot of comment and question about them in the past. Um, I mean, isn't right now it's all transparent. The public can see what we're doing. Like, it's been three months since we've met. It makes me as a commissioner wonder what the heck's happened at the city with all these things we used to get before us. You know, I saw in the notes there was a you know there was like a provision that you have to you have to log these like these sort of decisions that were made the administer administrator or director

like maybe that could be channeled through us so we get an update on what's happening at the city without any sort of purview on our part just so that we know that there's still something happening and that we're still involved in the process. Um but again I don't understand like completely how it's you're going to avoid that subjectivity especially when you're you're taking something which conservatives should be kind of a wary of you know you have something that's open right now and you're converting it into a little dungeon in the government somewhere that's approving these things that could have a pretty huge community impact. You know, I mean, we had conversations if Chair Schwab was here about, you know, the proximity of parks, whether there's sidewalks leading to them, you know, the the depth of the um of the the drainage, you know, the the retention basins in these places. These were important conversations that now are just they're they're wiped off the face of the earth because these plats are basically the starting point for these projects and they're being taken out of our hands completely. So again, I I know you guys have heard me complain about this for the last, you know, teen different meetings pretty, you know, viciferously, but if you could provide some sort of a channel to where we understand what we're losing based on these these recent decisions which are completely out of our hands, that would appreciate, you know, that would help us appreciate what you guys are doing on your end.

That's my feedback. Sure. Go, Commissioner Waters. I can tell you coming from this side of the industry, having a very public forward process uh and doing it for 27 plus years, uh I I echo some of the concerns in regards to the transparency. Uh the state legislature uh certainly rules and governs over the local municipalities. Uh so as as the bills get passed and you know, we we've had those conversations in the past. Uh there are bills that from a legislative standpoint that we do stand up against. We write letters and things of that nature. Uh we have a legislative consultant that is currently and is always acting on the city's best interest uh at the direction of uh our policy makers, our council that's elected and so forth. So that is an ongoing thing and that happens throughout the year during every legislative session. Uh when it comes back to things of this nature, uh again it goes back to the state legislature. Uh again comes back to it was a compromise. So state legislature wanted to force by zoning onto jurisdictions. Uh basically essentially giving developers cart blanch for anything that's already zoned for residential based on density. They wouldn't have to go through any type of uh public hearing process. Uh and we would have zero control over our local zoning if that's the case. uh with what they ultimately ended up with was again the platting process which was for the most part as long as you met the standards anyways. Uh from a from a zoning or planning and zoning commission standpoint from a city council standpoint uh it it essentially allowed them to as long as they met those standards, we didn't really have a leg to stand on to deny it. That said, going back to what does come before you, which would be general plan amendments and change of zones, um those particular projects, um as we're seeing it from a staff perspective, and again,

we're asking for more things up front and and this was brought up yesterday. Um yes, we are asking for some conceptual designs that go with your with your proposed change of zone. We're not holding you to that design, but if you're going to come forward and ask for a change of zone or a general plan amendment, you're going before the public. Uh they should have an idea of what type of product, what type of loting and things of that nature may come with that. Uh and of course under the general plan, we would talk about what the maximum density are, what the maximum density would be allowed. And so those are the things that we can disclose through the public hearing process. Uh I can tell you with some of our staffing changes uh we ended up taking uh one of our positions and creating a planning or a permit project coordinator position. Uh one of the roles of that that particular position is to actually push out on a regular basis a a log of projects that are coming in. So not just subdivisions but it could be change zones, it could be general plan amendments, it could be variances, cups. uh and that is actually being sent out uh to allow for let city management council know as to where those particular projects are falling. It allows us to keep uh tabs on projects that are forthcoming. Some of those that may even have uh of a more of a interest or stake uh in this in the city in general. But yes, that is all part of the process as we are coming through. We're also implementing smart gov uh you know in this fall period that's forthcoming. It comes with additional reporting uh opportunities as well. Uh we've been talking with our GIS department about building kind of a a site where the commission council will be able to hover over an icon and they'll be able to see exactly what's being proposed, what action has been taken on that particular action application and so forth. So those are some of the things that are again in the works. It's going to take some time to get there, but for for the most part, you will be seeing some reporting features coming out so that way you do

do see what's coming forward. I appreciate it. Um I do have a couple other questions, but I don't want to hog all the time, you guys. No, go ahead.

Um the other one was uh this flyer here. Um I think I have the right one. Just give me one moment. Oh, yeah. There's there's a mention of standardized building plans and I think you mentioned that you and and some other staff got together and tried to approve some. My my big concern is is cookie cutter subdivisions like you see when you go into Henderson. You've heard me say it to you directly and other people have heard that like how would that not produce that if if you're greasing the wheels for the developers to to pick a a handy set of plans unless I'm misunderstanding what this thing is. I mean, the danger I see is is potentially not just acres, like square miles of identical houses that were easy to get pushed through. You know, I just see that potentially being a problem. And I'm not sure if there's contingencies or you have a huge number of these houses or even what this whole process.

Chair Goss, Commissioner Waters. So, when we talk about standardized plans, these are plans that have already been reviewed through our architectural process. So they're so such as again angle homes, things of that nature where they are utilizing a product uh on a regular basis throughout their subdivision. This allows them to come in and get that permit in a very quick manner. Um ultimately as we continue through this process, what I see foresee is that being an overthe-c counter permit um so they can get their site plans approved for those single family homes on a daily basis as opposed to a 10-day review period. That said, we talked about some legislative changes. There was additional legislative changes that went into effect this year that the city will have to address in 2026. And that does include the fact exactly what you're talking about. The city is going to be required to have a standard plan architectural site plan for single family, for duplex, and for ADUs. uh it is implemented over a period of time over this next year. Uh we have been in discussions with the League of Cities uh as to how that looks because it's either the city is going out, we're going to have to hire a design consultant to actually create these plans, get structural drawings, and now put it on the shelf for any homeowner that wants to come in and use it. Um and again, that is another legislative requirement that was imposed. And and this is one that that we did push back on. League of Cities pushed back on, American Planning Association pooked it back on. Um, again, at the end of the day, legislation moved forward and they did adopt it and it was a bill that was signed by Governor Hobbes. That again, going back when I talk about the League of Cities, they had offered to actually go out, get the registered architect, do the design plans. We could all pay into that particular uh fee on a on a per usage basis. However, I could tell you the product that they're

building in Mesa, Tempe, Surprise, is not going to be a product that you would likely see in Kingman. So, going in and, you know, piggybacking on that type of a of a use or on that type of a design doesn't work for us. So, so we are going to probably be working locally between ourselves, the county, likely Bullhead as well as Lake Havsu and try to combine resources because again this is something that's being po imposed upon local jurisdictions that we have to come up with these plans.

Thank you. Sorry, Madam Chair. Uh so just it it's coming top down, but is it is it being driven by uh affordable housing? Is that the Yes, that's the catch catch all buzz, but it's being used. Chair Goss, Commissioner Waters. Yes, 100%. It's based on affordable housing. They want to be able to allow for a homeowner that doesn't have the ability to go out and hire a registered architect or a designer to be able to come in, pick a design off the shelf, and go out and build their own home.

Okay. And we're the population the replacement rate of of our native population this in this country is you know at replacement level basically you know for the people that die that's so what's driving it I don't know you know anyway uh I do have another question um on the title one um title one changes I noticed that um the code intends to it's under 1-20.020 it says you know you retain the first three but then the fourth one is conserve and stabilize the total value of property within the community and you know my background is an appraisal and it's you know I've always kind of used this sort of guidance as to you know why I make certain decisions up here. I'm not sure why that was struck out. Sorry I'll let you get to it. It's title one uh title purpose and it's on page three. It's kind of right in the beginning. Keep going. Yeah, you'll see four strucken out there. I mean, why wouldn't a city want to preserve property values?

So, Chair Goss, Commissioner Waters, it's a subjective standard that was placed in this code when it was adopted. Uh, I I can tell you as much as that may be a goal, it's not a measurable goal for a planning and zoning document to incorporate. We don't ask for the value of the property when they go through the planning and zoning process. We don't look at what the value of that home may be when they go to build it and so forth. Value gets looked at when they go to pull permits because the building code requires that be based on the valuation tables. Um however to have it in as a zoning or a a caveat within the zoning code it just doesn't provide value and actually gives a false sense that we are out there trying to do something of which we have no control over.

Well yeah just from this side of the the dasis I mean when I was in the the county we we ran the sales app dates and we ran statistics on them and we found that sure enough where you have density you have lower property values you know and where you have incorporation of mobile homes in certain neighborhoods, you can see a fall off in property values. It's fascinating to see it, but it is a it's a functionary thing to where you have certain inputs, you have almost a guaranteed output. It I mean, it seems like we're taking away one of the criteria we could use to prevent something like endless rows of houses that are completely identical like we were just talking about. I don't see why we'd want to get rid of that language when it is not entirely subjective. is you can go to the county website and see property values and make the case that you know based on my knowledge of how you know neighborhood life cycles or markets work that property values can go down if we make bad decisions as a city chair commission waters certainly understand where you're coming from from that perspective and I guess if I were to put a different hat on and I come up here as the general public before the planning and zoning commission city council and say I don't like a project because it's going to devalue my property There's nothing that one uh as a as a property owner do I know that for a fact there there's no data to support that one way or the other. There's there's theories there there's ideas but it doesn't give the planning and zoning commission nor the council the ability to simply deny a permit or an action based on that same basis. And I will defer to my city attorney.

You are correct. Thank you. So again, it it it it may serve a functional theory pro process. However, it gives a almost a false sense that this is solely what we're making decisions on and that's not the case.

We have a property, maybe an acre, and you run power towers over it, you know, running clear to the dam, you know, God only knows we're Phoenix or something. Intuitively, you know that that's going to have some sort of problem with the, you know, the value of the property. You have a tire shop right next door to residential. It's gonna It seems like a willful disregard for something that we know is true. It's frustrating. You know, we're losing we're losing some ability to protect our community by striking out this thing. I think particular

I think do we have um I think we basically are at a place where staff is saying that they are their hands are tied legally and we would like to be able to do it but they legally can't. So because they can't do anything about it, they can't put it in the code.

Madam chair, I I agree. This is kind of both a conversation like we've kind of merged the discussion with with Mr. Moquin with our, you know, discussion amongst ourselves here. Um I did have one more um and that was you just briefly mentioned the metal standards, right? Uh on buildings. Um just want to revisit it. it like you you it seems like you're taking a step back from enforcing some of the the standards on how much metal can be on a property. Does this allow sheet tannainers to be used as as like residences in the city or are you taking a a lighter hand on that or

so chair go commissioner waters with respect to let's start with just metal buildings in general it's not that we're taking a step back is again we get back into this subjective are we meeting this 25% threshold and again asking the applicant or staff to continuously make these calculations shipping containers in themselves metal buildings are already permitted uh within our code. If they're going to be utilized for residential purposes, uh they do require a conditional use permit. So, that would come before the planning and zoning commission and the city council. It does require that they do architectural treatments to help blend that with the community. So, those those standards are already existing.

Got it. So, at a minimum, they need to paint it, right? Chair Goss, Commissioner Waters, I think when we're we're talking what we see a lot of and again it's not the ConX containers. Those aren't that's not what we're seeing uh in in people's backyards. So I've not since my year of being here, I've not had an application come before me where they want to put a metal cargo container in their backyard and utilize it for residential purposes. What we're seeing is the the sheds or the RV type buildings that are all metal. uh they typically come pre-designed, manufactured, engineered, they're stainless or some sort of galvanized metal at the end of the day. And we're saying if it's on the back of the property, just paint it to match because you again, we don't want to be overregulatory. If it's going to be forward of the rear building line, then yes, we're looking at some of those architectural treatments.

Well, thank you.

I'd like to expand on that a moment if I could, please. At one time we had an exterior appearance criteria for houses built after a certain year. Any accessory structure had to be basically the same type of construction and appearance of the main dwelling. Does this metal building proposal override that or does that appearance criteria even still exist? Chair Chair Goss Commissioner McCoy with respect to the metal buildings again it goes back to if it is forward facing of the rear building line it is design it is required under the code as it is being proposed that they have architectural treatments that match that particular structure. So if you have a stucco structure they could come in and do a text coat type finish on it which gives it almost that stucco like exterior finish. Uh when we start looking at garage doors, we want them to be garage doors that are typically found in a residential community if they're forward facing. So those standards are in this particular design.

Okay. Thank you. Do we have any more questions? I believe so. No. All right. Thank you so much, Jason. Thank you. All right. Do we have any more uh discussion amongst ourselves?

Um Madam Chair, I would just I would like to see some of that some of the reporting that Jason mentioned, you know, stream to us or at least just give us an idea of what's been happening, especially um like a year-over-year comparison before we started implementing this um this change to put more in the hands of the director. I'd like to see what we're losing basically that used to come up here in terms of numbers the statistics. Thank you. All right. Well, if we are finished then I will adjourn this meeting. Thank you.