Plan and Design Commission - Regular Meeting

I guess I'm going to call the meeting to order. Welcome to the City of Highland Parks meeting of the zoning board of appeals for January 15th, 2026. Patrick, will you please call the role? Yes. Member Harmalch here. Member Arnoff here. Member Weissberg here. Member Tashansky here. Member Zeransky here, Vice Chair Chase and Chair Yavlon here. We have a quorum. Also to introduce our new uh student leaison, Zoe Heler. Hi, nice to meet you all. Hi Zoe. Nice to meet you.

Okay. Um call the roll or quorum is met. And next item is the approval of the minutes from the uh November 20th, 2025 meeting. Has everyone had an opportunity to review the minutes? Yes. Yes. Excellent. Are there any corrections or anything like that for anyone? Nope. Would anyone like to make a motion to approve the minutes as drafted? I move to approve the November 20th uh minutes as drafted. Excellent. Second. I'll second. Thank you. So, all those in favor of approving the minutes, please say I. I.

I. I. Anyone opposed? Excellent. And um I guess to put on the record that I'm assuming member Harmel uh is abstaining. Yes.

Okay. And do we have any business from the public? Anyone that's not on the agenda? Nope. Okay. So, that moves us to new business. And we have um starting with VR 2025 000058 for the property located at 2021 Old Brier with uh that's zoning district R4 and the aqualant and owner is Bo uh Opanuk Opana. Patrick, do you have a presentation for us?

Yes.

Thank you. So 2021 Old Brier Road applicant Bo uponuk. Uh the proposal is for a pool and accessory structure. The property is located in the R4 zoning district and the property was newly constructed. Uh they filed for permit in 2023 and uh I think they finished in 24 is when it was uh completed. Uh and the owner at the time was Eretti Holding Group Incorporated. Uh the request of relief is to encroach into the north sideyard setback of 19 ft by 6.5 ft for a pool and to encroach onto the east sideyard setback of 12 ft by 9 ft and to the north sideyard setback of 19 ft x 8.5 ft for pool equipment and a gazebo. So here is the property. You'll notice that it is a corner lot with frontage along Old Brier Road and Red Oak Lane. Uh because it is a corner lot, it looks to its neighbors for its uh sideyard requirements. Uh this property does not have a rear yard requirement per zoning. Uh so just two sideyards and two front yard requirements. And here is an aerial of the property uh plat survey. Um just showing you general makeup of where it's located on the lot. So the picture on the left here, uh this is me standing on Old Brier Road looking at the front of the property. Here is standing on Red Oak Lane looking more towards the back of the house.

This is the northeast corner of the property looking towards the patio area. And this is the north side of the house here. Uh this car here is where the U and uh the garage is located to orient yourself. And then this area here is where the improvements will be happening. Uh the deck area that I just showed previously is located here. Uh so the pool will be located along this area along with the gazebo and pool equipment. So the blue uh this is the existing house with that uh covered deck area. The yellow are the improvements on the property. The yellow this is the swimming pool and this is the gazebo with pool equipment that will be buried underground. So it won't be noticeable but it is still an encroachment. The red lines here are signifying the sideyard setbacks. Again, the north sideyard setback is 19 ft and the east sideyard setback is 12 feet. The gazebo and pool equipment encroach into the both sideyard setbacks while the pool just encroaches into this northern sideyard setback. Here are some renderings of the uh proposal. Uh these are new. I we received these yesterday or today. Um so these were not in the packet. Um, the gazebo will look like this, mirroring kind of the brick of the existing home with the pool located here. Just get some other air angles. This is that existing deck area. And this is the proposed gazebo. And then here's just kind of an overall shot. Um, you'll notice that the fence

here uh is proposed as kind of a buffer for these improvements. Um, I receive I I found out there was a fence today. So, we're not talking about this fence as it appears to be 6 ft and this would be encroaching into a front yard setback. I have notified the homeowner. Uh, we haven't had time to discuss that aspect of it though. So, uh, the fence here, uh, with six feet or, it would only be allowed to be 4 feet within the front yard setback. Um, so that's either something we'll discuss with the applicant in the future or, um, yeah, or possibly at a future ZBA meeting. Uh, city staff, I didn't receive any comments from city staff. Um, applicant didn't provide a drainage and grading, so there wasn't really much for building to review. just as a a note. Uh and then we did receive one public comment post uh packet posting that is provided before you uh if you'd like to review. Um I also if anyone is interested in that I have copies if anyone from the public would like to view that letter. Um, so just in uh review, the requested relief is to encroach into the northern sideyard setback of 19 ft by 6.5 ft for a pool and to encroach into the east sideyard setback of 12 ft by 9 ft and the north sideyard setback of 19 ft by 8.5 ft for pool equipment and a gazebo. Uh, and that's all I have. Use a chapter 150 standards of approval. And yeah, let me know if you have any questions. Does anyone have members?

Trishansky. Trashansky. Okay. Okay. Every time. I'm so sorry. Just just for clarification, did did the current owner who's applying for the variance build this house? So, I did some uh permit research. It was listed under a Holding Group, Inc. uh as the property owner and then the current owner purchased the property in 2024. So, I believe a company constructed it. I haven't had this discussion with the owner if they were a part of this group or not. Uh but based off of the research, it was a different group who was just turning or flipping homes and then the applicant um purchased the property after.

So So the current owner purchased the house as it was. They had no correct. I I believe input in designing the house. I I believe that's how it is, but I'm not certain. uh the applicant uh this is the owner is not here so I don't I can't deal with that question does anyone else just I I just the the uh equipment vault is a little bit of an unusual element is that is it shown in that is it going to be in the footprint of the proposed gazebo I'm confused as to what

so the applicant is here maybe I'll have them answer that but it is underneath the uh gazebo so not quite sure how that works, but uh the applicant can probably speak further to how that works, but it will be as seen here in the rendering. You won't know that the equipment is there. It's underground. Okay, we can ask that I guess. Any other questions for Patrick?

Okay, thank you, Patrick. Um, guess that brings us to invite the applicants or who's here for the applicant to present the case. You could step up and I'm going to start by swearing you in. Do you affirm that the testimony that you intend to provide this evening is true and complete to the best of your knowledge? I do. Excellent. Thank you. Oh, just say your name.

Oh, so my name is Mike Salazar. I'm with Platinum Pools. I'm representing Bo Oamp for his variance request. Um just to very briefly summarize the letter that he submitted with his application. Um as Patrick laid out, he has two frontages with 40 foot setbacks. Um so that substantially reduces his buildable space on the lot. Um we're worried about digging the pool excessively close to the foundation of the home. So that's why uh regarding the pool um Bo was requesting that the northern setback be not 19 feet but 12 feet just like a normal sideyard setback in the village. Um that allows us to be outside of any easements there um away from the property line and also away from the foundation of the home. Um I know that there are other elements to this like a like a gazebo structure. Um the non-pool items are not in my scope though. So, I kind of peripherally know about what he wants to do there, but um my portion of it is the pool and the pool equipment. So, I could do my best to answer any questions about the non-pool stuff. Um and hopefully we can look at it together.

Okay. Uh does the board have questions for Mr. Salazar? I have a few questions. Member Zansky. Um thank you. I just a few questions. Um, how deep is the ball? Uh, I have it here. I believe it is 5 1/2 ft deep or 6 ft deep. Let me see here. Uh, I believe 6 ft deep. And then So, how how far is the actual pool from the current house? 17 ft. Okay. Because I'm just just curious. We've we've had other testimony from Are you an engineer by any chance? I am not.

Okay. Okay. So, we've had other engineers come here and, you know, be on the record that apparently you're it's I'm also not an engineer. I've just heard testimony from engineers that you can safely dig a pool one foot like however deep it is, you like basically if a pool is 5 1/2 ft deep, it can be 5 1/2 ft away from a foundation safely. Okay.

Without any kind of extra cost, precautions, etc. So, I'm just curious as to the hardship revolves around the the pool has to be where it's at because um you're concerned about the foundation of the house, which is, you know, presumably a in wellshaped new foundation. It's not like we're trying to protect an old historic structure, etc., etc. Sure. So, I'm just curious how that kind of layers into your hardship of the pool needing to be where it is where it looks to me like it could be moved into the buildable footprint with, you know, with without any kind of engineering issue um whatsoever. I am not an engineer either. Typically, we try to stay 15 20 ft away. I know that we do

I understand you could that's what you would want it, but I'm saying like structurally I don't believe it needs to be reset. I'm not qualified to designer. That's what the hardship letter was about. That's what I'm curious about. Yeah. Maybe he could maybe Bo could provide some more information on that. I'm not sure. Okay. Um I guess couple other quick questions. Sure. Um maybe you can explain a little bit more about the pit. Mhm. Um and in addition, um there wasn't really anything mentioned about any kind of hardship related to the gazebo.

Correct. So yeah, you mentioned that's not really in your purview, but you're asking us to approve a gazebo and a pool. So the burden's on you to prove that there's a hardship, why the gazebo needs to be where it's at and why there needs to be gazebo in the first place. Okay. As well as the pool equipment in the, you know, encroachment. So I just I guess I'm just kind of wondering what your take is on all that. Sure. So, the the pool equipment vault um is something that we've done several times. And basically, it's a a concrete structure that is completely buried. There's a hatch door on top. It is harder to service the equipment, but it's all vented properly. It has drainage and lighting. And so, the you don't really know that it's that it's there on the property. Um could be

I I could maybe suggest a bow if there's a different location for it. Um, we the the plan was to put it out of sight and out of mind and, uh, buried underneath grade. So, uh, as far as the gazebo, I didn't really have a hand in designing or placing it. Um, so I don't really have too much to offer on that. I apologize. Okay. So, is there like a sump pump in the pit or how do you Yeah, there's there's drainage. Uh, I mean, I can maybe get more details about exactly how they do it, but I know we've done it on another property for B. Um, and we we do it um not really commonly, but a lot we've done a lot. Okay. And then there's some kind of exhaust also. I would imagine that just it's just not showing the elevation or something or

Yeah. When we when we do a permit process, engineering drawings are provided for all this stuff. So, someone smarter than myself is going to put that together. No, if you're asking for a variance on, you know, a condition that, you know, it just would be nice to see the elevations of what it actually looks like instead of just a presumed pit. But it is what it is. But sure. Um uh that's all all my questions. Thank you. Okay. Member Transky look like um Yeah. I was just wondering whether you know moving the pool or making the pool smaller was even considered.

Uh the original consideration was for a 20x40 and so we went 14x40 um just to try to get as much space as we could there. So um that's kind of where we ended up. Okay. And I have a question. Can Can the pit I'm sorry. Nope. I had a question and then then I'll call you in a second. Um for the foundation

is the porch that's connected. Does that have its own foundation that's distinct from the house? Like is that just I'm just trying to figure out if the foundation really starts at the end of the porch or up against the house. I can't answer that. I apologize. Okay. Sorry. Thank you. Okay. Member, do you have a question? Could the the pit be moved to a different location outside of the variance zone? Um, I can get with my construction manager and see if he has any objection to moving the pit out around. It's going to be buried. So, this is this is the 17 ft.

But Okay. But you're asking for a variance. And if it could be elsewhere that wouldn't require a variance, that would be one less thing to ask for. Sure. Okay. Would it be possible? Are you able to go back to the page where it has like the map with like the dimensions and the p the There we go.

Yeah. Thank you. Would it be possible to move that entire gazebo structure with the pit like closer to the house so it's within the boundaries similar to what you said like but not just the pit, the gazebo entirely. So, it's just asking for about like 9 ft of the pool outside versus that gazebo seems to be entirely out of the zoning area. So, I guess my as the pool contractor, my role for the gazebo is going to be to just report to Bo what you guys will allow. So, I I'm not too sure about that portion of it. I wish he was here. He's traveling outside of the country right now. So,

is Bo the original developer? I don't I don't know. Oh, okay. You said you worked at other projects, which I was curious. Yeah, we built a pool frame uh in Wisconsin. Uh I did look at Lake County's uh ownership information and then so 2023 2024 was that area holding group and then Bo purchased the property in 2526. They filed for permit to construct a new house in 23. Yeah. I I just guess the question is does is Bo part of that because yeah uh I do not know it would seem to be relevant. Yeah, I didn't see any his name on any of the application materials but again I'm I do not know

how close is the the pool going to be to the the house of the person who uh submitted an objection. So, um, it will be 12 1/2 ft to the property line, uh, from the pool to property line. Uh, it's not a great picture. We'll do the aerial. Um, so this property, yeah, right?

So, all the improvements will be here. This is where the objector's um property is located. They have some accessory structures back there, so I assume they enjoy their backyard as well. Um and then and then the house directly where your cursor is now. Mhm. They've had no comments. Oh, that's you. Okay. But it's going to be it's still going to be 12 1/2 ft.

Yes. Um to clarify, uh pool deck can encroach into sideyard setbacks. Um patio, anything that's pawn grade, uh isn't allowed encroachment within sideyard setbacks. So it's just the pool well and the gazebo and pool equipment

and the rest of the neighborhood sideyards are 12. uh roughly I mean it depends on so sideyard setback uh for R4 is 30% of the lot width uh and it cannot be smaller than 12 ft so it's generally greater than 12 ft on both sides but it really is just dependent on how wide the lot is. Thank you. Does anyone else have a question for this witness from No. Thank you. Okay, you could be seated. And uh seems like we have someone from the public who'd like to speak, please. Sorry, man. This

No, no, you're perfect. If you could state your name and then I'll swear you in. Sure. Uh Mark Seagull, uh 243 Red Oak, which is the property just to the north. Okay. Thank you. And do you affirm that the testimony that you intend to provide this evening is true and complete to the best of your knowledge? I do.

Okay. Thank you. Uh so good evening and thank you. My name is Mark Seagull. Uh the property at 243 Red Oak just to the north of the applicant's house. Um we've just been in there about year and a half, a little over a year and a half, although just moved down the road from Deerfield where we were for 36 years. So in the area, um we've uh been speaking on and off with Bo, our next door neighbor who did recently move in. And while I can't give you 100% assurance, the question was asked and I'm pretty sure that he was not the original um I'll call it redeveloper. They're not the original developer from the 60s of that house, but uh that house was redone uh a few years ago and I'm pretty sure by the seller to him. So the question was asked. So, just for your information, um I I know that you're charged with and I appreciate all your efforts on this with the various standards that are in the zoning ordinance to see whether or not it's a hardship, it's a convenience, it's an inconvenience, and I'll leave that to you and your expertise and experience. Uh but I would like to focus on one of those items specifically. Uh and that's number five. They're injurious to other property. um coupled with your authority to protect the adjacent property values of which we are as I mentioned to the north and uh our kitchen just to give you a sense looks out directly onto uh the pool area here correct so that is our house over correct so we're looking out from the kitchen I guess morning noon and night onto this so we're we're impacted and probably can impacted the most our common neighbor to the east of the applicant and to the south of us cuz we sure our backyard is backs up to the common neighbor on Brier. Uh she I didn't see this letter. Can I take a

copy of this with me? Okay. So I've not had time to read it and but um you know she's we all sort of share common property boundary lines together because of the corner and the sides that we have. Um but I know that uh and that's a basketball court that she has in her backyard there. Um anyway, so going back to number five there in terms of the standards and jurious to the other property along with your authority to protect you. There's two major things that we're concerned with and as I mentioned we've been speaking with Bo and I think you know I don't know your company in particular but you know I think Bo wants to do a good job here but we still do have concerns and I'm sure that you would do a great job building it but what we're concerned about is two things. One is grading and flooding and uh as was mentioned you know there were no comments yet from forestry from engineering and from building my sense is that comes maybe after the ZBA approval or non-approval but from our perspective at least it would be really helpful to have the full and complete package I know in commercial applications typically we're making full complete packages I'm not faulting anyone whatsoever I'm just telling you what would be would have been great and helpful And this has evolved uh cuz I know that you know plans renderings their preliminary plans and then as you get into the details the engineering things that's you know things are more specific but unfortunately we don't have those yet and so we don't have everything but from a flooding and a grading concern in particular uh our shared neighbor has significant flooding and I'm not speaking on her behalf but we've talked because we've share our backyards together and we've had a a little bit of flooding and then the neighbors directly to the east of us uh also have flooding. Um so there isn't any right now but when you

have significantly more impervious area obviously there's a concern of flooding and ultimately I have no doubt that the city engineering the city building departments will take a good look at that but we just have a real you know that helps with the full picture and having all the plans in order to make an informed decision. So that's that's concern number one in terms of the you know potential injury to our property and I know you're aware of that. The other major one is the visual concerns of which and I appreciate you you know you that wasn't not what you're addressing today but Bo and I have been in conversation as recently this afternoon. Um we've got a few concerns. You know we've got the gazebo we have what he's proposing as a solid fence and he and I have talked about the pros and cons of that. Uh, and then lastly, as was pointed out, uh, this vault for the equipment. And on the one hand, I think there's some good to it. Um, but there's an exhaust that's basically going to be going out to our where we're grilling and where we're, you know, our kitchen is. So, I'd be interested in that exhaust detail as well, cuz it's going to be going right I'm not saying it's be directed at our kitchen, but it's right there. So in summary, it's that visual and I guess a little bit of engineering concern. We had uh as you probably saw, I don't know if you can show the photographs. It looks pretty barren right now. And the reason is there used to be, you know, I see used to be and you know just very recently there was between our properties a significant amount of buckthornne which I know you you know understand is invasive. We've been working with forestry at the city uh and getting rid of it and putting in the herbicides to make sure it doesn't come back. Uh but the bottom line is there was a lot of buckthornne or otherwise it was still landscaping. So, um, you know, we were hopeful of that and that's what we started talking today to Bo about is

we need to figure something out at least from our perspective on landscaping because we would much rather see that visually uh as I think the neighbors would than a wall and I by wall I realize it's a brick and I know a brick wall is whether it's pre-cast or you know whatnot um you know some thought was put into it but it's still a wall so our concern is that it would be landscaping of some sort whether it's with a row iron fence, whether it's landscaping on either side. Again, these are details that haven't been figured out and worked out. And that's our real big concern. In addition with the gazebo being right there um sort of perpendicular to an existing uh covered patio as well. We would be really concerned about looking at that as opposed to covered with landscaping. There's there are a fair amount of pools. hopefully you build them all in in the area. Um, and yes, you know how close they are. Some of them are fairly close, but the key thing is they seem to have landscaping all around. And you know, a rendering is a rendering, but it's not the final plan. That's what's agreed upon and what's going to be built. So, uh, you know, we would ask that hopefully that we could continue to have that finalized for us to have a better picture, for you to have a better picture, and so everyone can make a more informed uh, and intelligent decision on this uh, relocation of the gazebo, you know, and or the pump would be great cuz I've got a concern with the noise, but and I presume there's sound attenuation in there of some sort.

Yeah. When it's Oh, sorry. I talk.

I don't know if that's appropriate or not. We can have we can have you come back up for a second. Sorry. Never. I'm sorry. We could talk off. Anyways, so I think there's the bottom line is I think there's a lot of detail that would be important for us all for us as the property owners. Uh again, I can't speak for my backyard property owner. um as well as for the ZBA to have in order for there to be a final decision and maybe to look at some creative options here for it to be attractive overall while providing the functionality that I know that they're looking for. So, thank you for your time and your consideration. I don't am I supposed to make a formal request on my part or you just sort of heard my comments?

We we heard your comments. Um, I know I have a question for you and others might as well. Um, are you concerned at all about uh your supply of light in terms of where the gazebo is to your house?

No, I'm really I don't think so. I mean, I didn't do a light analysis. Um, I'll just think quickly off the top. No, because Oh, this was the other thing. So, sorry, I'm going to blank. Um, there was originally in the application there was a different design. Had a pitched roof. This is a flat roof. So, to answer your question, I think that that would minimize that concern. Um, you know, that's part of it is if we've got I'm just thinking out here quickly. If we've got the sun coming from the south there, yeah, it will affect it. The gazebo will affect that. And then if we're going to request some sort of landscaping to block it, it's going to block it even more.

Okay. Yeah. And we're just so and we could probably work with the aquin in terms of you know where that impact would be most directly because it's a relatively small area on that side of the house that we're concerned about but it's an important one. You know the kitchen's the heart of the house. Does anyone else on the board have questions for the witness? Okay. Thank you. And thank you very much. Um Mr. Salar, do you mind swapping places and answering questions or is there a question that was asked of you if you be so kind?

Yeah, I just wanted to maybe mention that it's part of our normal process to have civil engineering done and uh landscape plans done by whomever he decides to hire to do the landscaping around there. Um I we kind of talked about it briefly, Patrick and I, and it wasn't required for this meeting, so we didn't have it done. I'm sure he would do it if that's um something that you guys would like to see just have have both in it. Thank you very much. Anyone else? How like how bad is the exhaust and how loud?

I can get details for you. So I'm not the guy out there with the shovel. I'm just the designer. So I can get details. Um I'm sure when we do one in the field, they submit to the village all the the schematics of what it's going to look like and everything. So that's just on me. I'm sorry. Worries. Anyone else from the board have further questions? Okay. Thank you very much. Thank you. Okay. Um, so with that in mind, I think it's time to have a little bit of a discussion. Member Transky, can I get where your head is?

Uh, yeah. Um, you know, at at at this juncture, I would vote no on it. I think just right at the outset, this is kind of a big ask. Um, you know, you're looking to encroach on the setback like 8 1/2 ft in two areas and 6 and 1/2 ft in another area. Um, usually when we have these types of cases, we're presented with projects that, you know, encroach a foot, maybe two feet. Um, so this seems like a really big ask right out of the gate. Um, I think I would have liked to at least seen some effort of moving the pool closer to the house. That would certainly either eliminate the ask or significantly lessen it, which would be more palatable. Um, and then, uh, I kind of share the neighbors concerns as well. Um, I think any type of plan that's presented would need to address the concerns of the neighbor. So, um, at this point, I'd be a no.

Okay. Members Rinsky.

Um, yeah, I agree too. I, you know, I apologize. they kind of just threw you in here, you know, not you know, fully prepared for the whole scope here. But, um, you know, to me, there's a clear way to put decoupling the pool in the gazebo. There's a clear way to move the pool into the footprint and build it by right without any kind of variation at all. Um, I think the hardship letter didn't really address the standards at all. Basically, it kind of just said that the reason is because of the foundation, which I don't really think is a valid argument. Um, so that's the pool. Um, the gazebo wasn't even really contemplated in the hardship letter at all, unless I glanced over it. But I don't see any hardship for uh a variation to allow the gazebo. I think there's plenty of outdoor space there. It looks like there's lots of covered outdoor living and I I don't see the gazebo being um a hardship or necessary at all. Um and then I guess the third ask was the uh equipment pit which I also frankly think is inappropriate. I mean if if you're willing to spend the money and time and and effort and and and in and putting it in the ground, you know, find somewhere else to put it where you're can do it by right. There's no it doesn't need to go on the neighbor's property or blowing exhaust and and possibly um you know pumping excess water into an area where there's trouble with water already. So um I'd be a no.

Okay. Member Wisberg.

Yay. I agree as well with uh with the previous two people mentioned. Um I mean I think there's a hardship because you don't want to build a pool too close to the house, right? that kind of the with the plans detail um probably makes the most sense, but I don't think it's an unusual or unique situation that um this property doesn't have the perfect place for, you know, a large pool. So, you know, I think there's other problems as well, but yeah, for me it just there's nothing unique really about this. You know, there's if you look at Highland Park, there's going to be many houses in this situation where, you know, the perfect location for a pool just doesn't exist. and kind of the property owner going into this knew that situation. So, um yeah, I would I would kind of recommend to figure out either a smaller thing or maybe come back with, you know, full agreement with neighbors and something that's kind of more uh easy to pass on our end. So, yeah, I'd also be a no.

Thank you. Member Arno, I would agree with everything that's said. I would be a no. I think, you know, there wasn't enough thought put into this and then that information about the the um engineering that it could be closer that contradict sort of the the hardship ladder. I thought that was interesting. Um so I don't think there was enough deep thought put into where to put these things and didn't seem to be a hardship. Okay. Thank you. And member Hermela.

Yeah. aligned with what everyone else has been saying. You know, it' be interesting to have the owner talk to the two neighbors that have concerns, see if they can, you know, get behind a new idea. That would be helpful. You know, can can the gazebo and the pool pit equipment go on the what is what would that be? The west side of the pool where it seems like there's a ton of room and they're going to put a fence anyways blocking it. So, I don't know if that's possible and that would be inside. Uh if they were to locate it on that side, it would be encroaching into the front yard setback. Uh so it would still be in a non-conforming area.

Okay. So it would be helpful just to get more information and see the neighbors support for it as well.

Okay. Thank you. Um I too agree with my colleagues that the standards have not yet been met. Um, I also though would point out and say thank you to uh Bo who's not here at the time for talking to his neighbors and having open communication because that's a very important part of our decision-m process and I appreciate that he's taking those steps and potentially we'll do that a little bit more. Um before I speak more, uh Zoe, do you have any comments or any thoughts that you'd like to share?

Yeah, I mean I kind of agree with everything that's been said. Just another thing that I think would be detrimental is it could definitely have a decrease on the neighboring property's valuation. What like as um Mr. Seagull said if he his kitchen would be looking at a fence or possibly really close to a pool and if in the future he ever decides to sell or if the other neighbor who had an problem whose backyard is next to also decides to sell and there is a pool in a large gazebo encroach on their backyard. It could definitely be an issue for possible buyers.

Thank you. Thank you for your insight. Um so um Mr. Salazar, you kind of see where the board is leaning at this time. We could either take a vote um or we could um have this continued to a later date to maybe to get some more information. Bo would want to be here. So would be appropriate to continue and maybe talk with him about some of your comments that I wrote down.

We'll jump in here. Yeah. Um so we want to manage Mr. Seagull's expectation too about like the city doesn't do like a civil review prior to this board approving a uh well so if they submit it that the building and engineering division can review that and provide comment. Um, that's not to say that they won't do another review when they do permit. Um, but no, that is something that the city would take in and review and provide comments for. Um, okay. So, I'm hearing a few comments for the applicant to work on drainage and grading, possible landscaping. Uh, we'll discuss the fence height possibility. Um,

as well as general hardships discussed. General hardships discussed. Uh, is there I'm just going to pose a question. If the gazebo were to go away, is the board more in line with just seeing a pool? Is there like I just want to separate the two items to give him some comments on options, I guess. Um, cuz not really a lot of space back here to really move anything. So, it's kind of a I mean, maybe you can move it a foot possibly, but that's not like a a large change. Sorry. There. Um, so I just didn't know if the board had any strong feelings on the gazebo in general or the pool in general if it's just like separating the two items a little bit. Well, my first question in terms of the gazebo is if they have the equipment buried,

you're saying that needs a variance anyway. Even though if it was just patio, that would count. Yeah, they could just put patio in that space. Um, if there was no like gazebo structure on top, they could just put patio and they wouldn't need a variance. Correct. But they need a variance for the pool equipment. They still would need it for the pool equipment because it's encroaching in that area. Um even though it's buried. Yeah, it's still in the area. Uh it I mean it is buried so it would be less of a nuisance to neighbors theoretically. Um but I don't know details on pipes, exhaust and

yeah. Um, anyone have thoughts to share with Patrick then of if it was versus

theoretical thoughts on the situation just for the applicant that I can get back to them. Um, if they if we do want to look at engineering, I'm going to assume that will take a little bit of time to produce. Um, the next available meeting would be February 5th, which I think would be too soon to get those materials and for staff to review them. Um, would February 19th be a more feasible? I don't know. Do you work with um obtaining uh engineering?

They're typically about four weeks if they can jump on it right away. Civil engineers are reversely slow thorough. Thorough. I mean, one thing we've seen in the past, Patrick, is um I guess I was just Mr. Seagull mentioned he'd want to see like full engineering plans before this was kind of discussed in a public forum. I was saying typically that doesn't really not the order that we typically go in, but at times we have had people do and we don't expect you to come up with this unnecessary expense too of getting detailed engineering plans also because that's a burden to you

but what we have seen people do is come back with like um like a conceptual landscape plan which is a lot easier to do than yes engineering set I'm just going to pose to bo just like these are your options you can supply this information to be a little bit more uh just to provide a little bit more information and to provide that to the neighbor if you if you wish uh that's information that if you would like to see Um, I'm just going to express that to Bo that the board is interested in seeing that information. But you're correct, they do not have to supply that. They could supply a landscape plan that shows possible Burmings or other um situations that help with water flow on the property. Uh, it is up to the applicant how much they supply. I just want to provide them the comments and the possibilities of what their options are.

I think it would help me if the gazebo was gone. Yeah. like, you know, the fact they could still have the pool equipment over there, but I mean, how high was the gazebo supposed to be? Uh, I never actually received a height. I just received the elevations and the location. Um, I mean, yeah, I mean, I I think with that it makes it the max it can be is 18 ft, but um I would agree with what you said that if the gazebo was removed, it would make the decision a little cleaner, I think, on my end. I agree. I think it's a little more palatable. It's a less of an ask.

And again, that's just information I can provide Bo. Um, if he would like to continue with doing something different, shrinking it down, that's his choice. I just wanted to try and get as many comments to him as possible if we're going to continue to a future meeting. And if we're continuing to a future meeting, do we also want to add the fence to the discussion? I will yes I will be adding that to the discussion. And in terms of the fencing, what are the pool fencing requirements for Highland Park?

Um so if there is a fence entirely around the property, that's um okay. There's also these pool like covers that can withstand a certain amount of weight that are acceptable as well. And if you only have a 4ft fence, is that still legit? I think so. I would need to Okay. look at the building. Auto cover. You do not need any fencing at all. Okay. Yeah. It's unusual, but it's I guess it's it's easier to jump a fence and get in the pool than is to bust open their auto.

Oh, okay. Uh, okay. So, um, well, since the homeowner isn't here, our options are to continue this to the February 19th to give 5 weeks for the applicant to possibly get together landscaping plans or engineering plans to review. Uh, or we continue to a date uncertain and the applicant will just have to renotice uh, for the next available ZBA case. Um, would you like to do February number two? Would you want to renotice that he'll re he's ready? He's out of the country. I mean, I'm not too sure how he's

how long he's going to be gone, what he's going to pay for some plans to get done or who he's going to hire to do landscape plants. I'm sure he'll do it. I just don't want to put a unrealistic time frame on it. Yeah, sounds good. Um, so I guess we will, um, just continue to a date uncertain and then the applicant will have to renotice the adjacent neighbors. So, uh, I guess can we get a be clear, no one on this board I that I've heard is expecting them to spend the money to

Yeah. No, I will make that explicitly clear. These are just comments that um are um being presented. You said that Bo was already working on a landscape plan. So he might have something in the works. So that I don't think he started civil engineering. Okay. Thank you. Um so I'm assum I feel very rusty. Should we Oh, good. Do we need a motion to continue this to a later date and new noticing? What? Yes.

Okay. Would someone be willing to make that motion, please? Anyone? Motion to continue to a date. Certain. Perfect. Okay. And do I have a second? Second. Thank you. All right. So, um, thank you both for your time and for your caring about Highland Park. It makes a difference. Um, Patrick, do we have a staff report? You can vote. Oh my gosh. Do we need to vote? Yeah.

Oh. Ask for roll call vote in bold. Patrick, could we have a roll call vote, please? Uh, yes. Let me pull this together. Okay. Uh, member Harmalik. Yep. Uh, member Arnoff, yes. Member Weissberg, I. Member Tensky, I. Member Zeransky, yes. And Chair Yablon, I.

Perfect. So, this will be continued to a date uncertain and the applicant will renotice uh for the next available ZBA meeting. Uh, and to answer your question, now there's no staff, but I have no additional items. Okay. Um, and for miscellaneous, I'm just going to throw in that, um, I was reminded earlier in the week that we need to just stay formal in terms of following Robert's rules and that I should be or who's ever chairing the meeting needs to be calling on people versus people just talking. I'm out of turn. And then it makes it easier as well for the court reporter to take accurate minutes. Um, so that's that's my little miscellaneous.

Perfect. And I guess that brings us to adjournment. Question. I just council center still our uh yes to my knowledge. Yes. Just curious. Um, yeah. I haven't heard I don't I think they like reshuffle more in the middle of the year if I remember correctly. Um I just think he just couldn't attend tonight. Thank you. Anyone else? Okay. Um then it brings us to adjournment. Do we have a motion to adjurnn? I'll make a motion to adjurnn. Do we have a second? Second. Excellent. All those in favor say I. I. I. Meeting adjourned.