Board of County Commissioners - Regular Meeting

Okay, good morning. Can everybody hear me? I'm going to call to order the regular meeting of the Haywood County Board of Commissioners for Tuesday, September 8, 2026. Our first order of business will be our Pledge of Allegiance, and after that we'll have a moment of silence. So if everyone, if you can, please stand for the pledge.

Amen.

Okay, thank you. Okay, our next order of business is a public hearing. And this morning we have a public hearing to receive public comment on Haywood County's proposed use of $2,006,840 of its North Carolina DPS Disaster Relief and Recovery Mitigation Resiliency Grant funds to assist the towns of Canton, Clyde, and Waynesville with a water system interconnect project. So who do we have presenting? Mr. Hikes is here. We presented it last week. We can just open the public hearing to comments and maybe set the stage a little bit. Okay.

The county's contribution would be $2,006,000.

$6,000 that we received from the state general assembly related to support for businesses after the tropical storm threat. So these funds would come from the use of those state grant dollars.

Okay. So we're just going to take public comment at this time?

Yes, sir.

Okay. Very good. Okay, I do have a couple of people that have signed up to speak. Chuck Dixon. Okay, go ahead. Come on up, Zeb. Okay. If you say so.

For my job, so I have to go to court and I'm paying a job. Okay. No, thank you so much for being here. I am joined here with my friends from the town of Waynesville, the town of Clyde, and the town of Canton. It would take more than three minutes to go through each and every one of you of what your friendship and leadership has meant to Haywood County and the town from really COVID to Fred to the mill closure. and then Helene. It has gone across the county, it has been bipartisan. There are people's lives that are still with us because of the leadership, the county and the towns working together. And this is just a next chapter in that. But one thing that haunts me and probably haunts each of you is when the next storm, the next emergency arrives to Haywood County, can we look the people that voted for us, voted against us, our friends and family, and knew while we were in this small spot, we did everything that we could. What this interconnect does, an unprecedented cooperation across the county between three municipalities through resiliency funds from the hurricane to put together an emergency interconnect, which will allow all of us to be able to receive water when we need it the most. Obviously we have been through flooding. We have been through economic disaster. But next time it could be a wildfire. It could be a chemical spill. And in those moments to have the ability to access that water immediately is paramount. This is one of those issues which is a legacy project because we will be able to look our citizens in the eye and say we do not know when that next emergency is coming. but we did what we could with the money we had to make sure that all of Haywood County was served in our time of need. And I think to be able to answer that question really speaks to just a continued legacy of doing this the right way and doing it for all the people of Haywood County.

Thank you, Zane. Hope you do all right in court. Come on up, Chuck.

My name is Chuck Dixon here for the town of Waynesville. I'm on the town council. One of the key selling points of any successful economic business recruitment effort is the guarantee of a safe, continuous flow of potable water. This is so important that the state of North Carolina has a written policy encouraging the interconnection of water systems. A reliable water supply is also absolutely necessary in order to fight fires. Over the past decades, Haywood County has experienced floods and droughts, which have led to serious interruptions in the water supply provided by our local governments, leading to boil water orders, voluntary and involuntary water conservation restrictions. These water systems are unable to meet modern businesses' requirement of a continuous flow of potable water. In order to reverse this history of unreliable water service, the towns of Haywood County initiated an effort in 2017 to determine if constructing an interconnect would be feasible. Their efforts have been endorsed by Governor Stein, and a significant portion of funding for the project has already been obtained. The town of Waynesville is donating $2 million to be received from a loan from the state. The towns have agreed to design and construct an emergency water line which connects Canton, Clyde, and Waynesville, their water systems. It will be capable of delivering up to 2 million gallons of water per day from Waynesville to Clyde and Canton. The line is also capable of reversing its flow so that Waynesville could also benefit from water coming from Canton. The towns have adopted a memo of understanding that establishes a framework for providing emergency water to each other. The line is designed for emergency use only. Each town will charge their most favorable bulk water rate for the water currently under $4 per 1,000 gallons. The line will be kept in service. Basically, we keep it full of water so that it can be placed in operation immediately after a town has a need for water. We believe that a finished water connect is an essential component of Haywood County's industrial recruitment effort. The interconnect will encourage existing businesses to expand and will protect businesses from losses due to failure of the water supply. Waynesville and the other towns in Haywood County encourage the county to join this effort to construct the interconnect. Thank you. If anybody has any questions, we'll certainly be glad to answer.

Okay.

Thank you, Chuck.

Okay, that's all I have signed up to speak for the public comment. Okay. So I'll close the public comment. Just wanted to make a point that we've had, you know, when Chuck was talking, I was thinking about when Asheville needed water at the hospital because their reservoir had been pretty much decimated And I don't know if y'all, y'all may not know this, but the night of the flood, there was a sail that was coming, a sail of water. We had a lot of water, but there was a particularly larger amount of water than we thought it was going to hit Haywood County. And it actually went to the east. And when it went to the east, just slightly, it hammered Chimney Rock and Black Mountain. It kind of went up that corridor, if you will. And Asheville's lake is in Black Mountain. I used to survey in Buncombe County, so I know. And I always wondered, I thought, they've only got that for the source of water, and it seems like that's not a good thing. But anyway, that source of water basically was flooded. And so they were pretty much almost, well, they were, they were out of water. The hospital was out of water. And Waynesville came to the rescue of the hospital. And I can remember Actually, I think I was talking to one of my cousins who does milk. I think they might even use some of their tankers because they were very clean to get water there. So it was definitely a community effort to help our hospital in Asheville. So this is a good way. Waynesville has a great water supply system because of, from what I understand, their aldermen back in the 20s had bought the land up in the, and I might be wrong about that, but Way back, they bought the land in the watershed, and that watershed has been a great asset for the town of Waynesville. In a day when our water lines are aging and we have water lines that break quite often and it drains tanks and things like that, I think it behooves us to, in my opinion, to be able to have a reliable water system. And we have that in Waynesville, and I think most taxpayers in Haywood County would probably wonder why we haven't already done this, if you will. Or most citizens in Waynesville would know that. But I just wanted to make those comments because I guess I have a little bit more in-depth knowledge than than the average citizen, but it's good to know that we have that kind of asset. And I will say also, along those lines, Maggie Valley also has been working on their sanitary district. They are working in the Campbell Creek watershed and the Jonathan Creek watershed. This is above a ghost town. And those watersheds are being protected by the conservation fund has been buying large tracts of land in Maggie Valley to where in the future, as these become available, they're able to, the conservation fund is able to buy the land, turn it over to the sanitary district, and they can manage it, and that'll be another really clean source of water for Haywood County. I think we already have an interconnect with Waynesville. So, Maggie Valley does. So, basically, I guess what I'm saying is, is we're making sure that the waters wanna flow. I know where I live, They've been working on the road, and one day I turned on the spigot, and it wasn't working. It was like 8 o'clock in the morning, and the water didn't come back on until 12. And you don't realize how important water is until you don't have it. You turn that spigot on, and it's amazing, when I get to thinking about it, what it takes to get water from... from these lakes and these reservoirs all the way to our taps. So it's very important that we have good water supply because it's not fun when your water's not working. You realize how much water you use when you do that. So I don't know if anybody else has any comments or anything. Okay. Okay. I didn't mean to take up all the time. Okay. Go ahead.

At the next meeting, we'll have on the agenda the agreements for you to authorize me to execute the agreements to fund this project. We'll have the budget amendment and everything in front of you at the next meeting. OK. All right. Thank you.

OK. Next order of business is our public comment session. And I would ask you to, I've got several people signed up to speak, so I would ask you to limit your comments to three minutes. Hannah will let you know when your time's up. I believe there's a clock on the screen right there. Okay. She'll remind you in case you forget. And, you know, I'm not going to, if you'll just finish your last statement, it would be good if you go over the three minutes. I don't want us to go on and on. So we've had folks do that, and it's just not fair to everybody that abides by the time. So I'm just going to take these in the order that I received them, and the first person signed up to speak is David Henderson. Oh, I'm sorry.

Welcome. Thank you for having me. I would like to address the commissioners. Thank you very much for being here. On the Saturday afternoon gatherings out here on the courthouse lawn, Hayden, thank you very much. You're very professional. You were very cordial when I visited you. But I read through the regulations, the do's and don'ts, because I had talked to several veterans about having a gathering out here. I was also present for the parade in memory of Charlie Kirk. And I was motivated by that incident to make a sign. It was very simple. Charlie Kirk welcomed open debate. He was responded to with a bullet. Now that's fact, we all know that. And I stood out here on the sidewalk for the parade with my sign in one spot. And I'm a Vietnam veteran, very patriotic. I'm unaffiliated politically, but I was motivated to show up. And I had people approach me from the gathering here, told me my sign was a lie. I'm a troublemaker. You need to leave. And I responded with, you got your opinion, I have mine. Leave me alone. Anyway, I read through the regulations, do's and don'ts for a gathering. No loud noise, no amplification, no disturbance. You're not to be a public nuisance. And being Naval Intelligence from Vietnam, I document, I photograph, I have photographs of many violations repeatedly done over the last 13 months at these gatherings. I've talked to the town. They say when they're on the sidewalk, it's the town property. The permit is to be on the courthouse lawn. Am I correct? OK. I have photographs of the political gathering. Not one person is on the courthouse lawn. Took the pictures from the front door. They're on the sidewalk. They're in the road. We need to take care of this before it escalates. Public protest, I'll defend it. Have your opinion, I'll have mine. But we need to do it orderly. Thank you very much. OK, thank you.

OK, our next person to sign up to speak is Dr. Russell Binkley. Welcome.

Welcome. Hello, I am a 25-year educator. I taught 10 years in Tuscola, Illinois in middle school and 15 years at Western Carolina in social studies education. And my presence here is just to encourage people to realize that citizenship and civics is more than voting. It means activism. It means understanding what's going on in politics. It means educating ourselves about the issues. And it is not a spectator sport. It is a sport that wants you to get out there and participate. And I admire the solo counter-protester that comes on Saturdays because she is exercising her First Amendment rights also. But I would like to encourage us to really understand what democracy is about, and it's about more than being a passive citizen. Thank you. Okay, thank you.

Okay, the next person to sign up to speak is Anne Vandenberg. Welcome, Anne.

Good morning. My name is Anne Vandenberg and I'm a proud member of Hands Off Haywood and I'm also a proud resident of Haywood County. Proud because Haywood County for the last year and a half has upheld our freedom of assembly and our freedom of speech as guaranteed by the United States Constitution. As we assume that as the governors of this county, you will continue to uphold our rights and privileges and that we can continue to be proud members, proud residents of Haywood County. Thank you so much.

Okay, thank you. Okay, the next person is Kim Genova. Welcome, Kim.

Good morning. Thank you. Y'all know who I am. I am here to address these protests on Saturday. Every Saturday on Main Street, in front of this very building, an agitated, rowdy group of protesters take over this town. They block sidewalks, stop traffic, harass passersby, and cause havoc by even lying in the street, defying drivers to run them over. The First Amendment rights proclaimed by these people include the word peaceful and exclude threats, fighting words, obscenities, and defamation. They are anything but peaceful. They antagonize, threaten, and curse everyone who indicate a lack of support for their cause, I'm a victim of this. I can no longer drive my car downtown on Saturdays because they recognize it and know who I am. Not only have I received calls from people and complaints from businesses also. They're complaining that it's hindering their customer base because people don't want to come down here on Saturdays anymore. going into our busiest tourism season. These businesses are rightfully so concerned. Waynesville will soon have its own ghost town, and it will run right down Main Street. Businesses are leaving. No one in this county or town is willing to accept responsibility for allowing this to continue week after week. Mr. Ensley, on August 24th, you informed me that the county had nothing to do with any permit issued because they are on the sidewalk, which is the town of Waynesville issue. They are on the courthouse lawn. And I have learned, in fact, that these people have been issued a permit from the county. Per the rules and regulations that the Haywood GOP received on a rally for July 3rd, sidewalks cannot be blocked, loudspeakers are prohibited, and traffic cannot be impeded. My question is, why are you allowing this to happen week after week? You have to take accountability for what's happening to our county. Are your loyalties with these people who are bused in from Asheville with a mission to clone Waynesville into a likeness of it? Or are your loyalties with the people of this county who elected you? Gateway to the Smokies will soon need to be changed to Welcome to Lunacy. I implore you to stand up for the businesses and people of this community. Restore peace to downtown on Saturdays. Thank you.

Okay, thank you. Next person assigned to speak is Steve Wall. Welcome, Steve.

Good morning and thank you very much. This is so important to have this kind of discussion. That's what our democracy is about and I appreciate the board. I've been to about 60 of these rallies in front of the courthouse. The largest we had with the permit had about 1,200 people. I stood next to Bishop Carter of the Methodist Church who came over from Junaluska. He admired how peaceful, how dedicated this was and how appropriate. This country was founded by protest. The Boston Tea Party, we all know about that. It's a heritage. It's a reason why our founding fathers put the First Amendment in there. Previous to that, you were not allowed to question the king. You're not allowed to come out and state your opinions. We have that right now, and we appreciate that so much. I have been to about 60 of these rallies in front of the courthouse. I have never seen one incident of cars being impeded down the street. I don't know where that's coming from. I think anyone who wants to have their own opinion, their own signs, is fine. I've never seen anybody complain they can't walk through the sidewalk. I would invite any of you to please come and join us on a Saturday just to observe. We make a point of keeping that sidewalk clear. When we have loudspeakers and electrical appliances, we get a permit from the county. And that's been also very peaceful, up to 1,200 people without one incident of violence, without one car being impeded. And I've been a doctor for 30 years. I've seen 60,000 people in my time in Haywood County as a physician. I know half the people who come by there. They wave. They give us thumbs up. They give us the peace sign, whatever it is. Some people are a little less polite and oppose what we're doing. That's their right. If some people get carried away, we make a point of saying, please calm down. No obscenities. Get out of the street. The Waynesville Police Department have had not one complaint that they have addressed to us, because we respect their job, we respect what they need to do, and they drive by all the time to make sure things are fine. We have not had one incident where the Waynesville PD has had to stop and address any issue at all. So this is really getting exaggerated, and I wouldn't invite any of you to come out, even for 15 minutes at 12 noon, and take a look at what happens like last Saturday. Nothing happens. People hold signs up about healthcare, about free housing, equal housing, about what we feel sometimes are overreaction of ICE, to public needs. And these things are important for the public to hear that there are people who feel certain ways. So I would just say in my 60 plus times of being in that rally, including standing next to clergy and town leadership, I've not seen one serious incident at all, except one time when someone tried to hit some of us with their car and the WPD arrested him because he was the aggressor and he now is a court case, but that's another issue. So please, Join us, observe what we're doing, and I think you'll be very pleased at the way things are carried on. Thank you.

Thank you, Dr. Wall. Our next person signed up to speak is Lynn O'Hara. Welcome, Lynn.

Hi, I'm Lynn O'Hara. I reside in Clyde. And at first, I would really like to thank all of you commissioners for your time today. I'm a local. I was raised in Bethel. I began attending protests last year around the time of the most doge cuts. And I've met the most wonderful people on the sidewalk, people from all sorts of backgrounds. And I do consider myself a better person for knowing them. I've never seen a group of people more patriotic, worried about the state of our country, and willing to donate their time and risk their own personal safety to use their constitutional right of peaceful assembly. I've seen some online chatter that we're running off tourists, I've personally had tourists walk across the street, grab a sign, thank us for being there, and protest with us. It's not only tourists, so many locals wave and honk horns in support for us. In fact, the more time that passes, the more cheers, waves, and supported horn honks we seem to get. I'm glad I can stand on the sidewalk for people who feel like they can't, people who might be afraid of being open about how they feel for fear of being fired, losing friends and family, or even being targeted by our own government. I had taken a break earlier this summer, but I returned to protesting after Pride. It came to my attention how much hatred our local LGBTQ plus community were receiving online. My daughter is part of that community. a worry for her safety in our current political climate, and I, as any mother, want to stand up for my child. My daughter protests with me, and I'm so proud of her for using her First Amendment riot. It's taught her to stand up peacefully for what she believes in, to not let ignorance and threats keep you from doing what you know is right. I'll admit it's hard to stand there for an hour once a week because of the hate we endure from MAGA. No one is doing this for fun. I have literally feared for my life. I have been called every name in the book. If middle fingers were dollar bills, I would be rich. I can't speak for the group, but for me personally, we have eight weekends left until midterms. After that, I'll probably just be attending the larger no-kings rallies. To close, as you can see from the photo on the sheet we provided, we have always policed ourselves. We have volunteer security that have gone through training, and we wear body cameras. We know the rules, and just as our Facebook page tagline says, we peacefully resist the rise of fascism and advocate for democracy. Thank you.

Okay, thank you, Lynn. Okay, the next person signed up to speak is Laura Lee, yours. And if I pronounced that wrong, please correct me. But welcome. Thank you.

Good morning, commissioners.

You can pull the mic down if you need to or raise it up if somebody's tall.

Thank you for allowing me time to speak this morning. My name is Lorelei Yersey, and I'm a resident of Fines Creek. I've been a resident of Haywood County for 24 years, and I'm a retired registered nurse. I remember learning about American government in junior high school and was so impressed, even as a young teenager, about the three branches of government and the system of checks and balances. And I have known and understood the importance of the Bill of Rights since I was 13 years old. In fact, I attended a protest against the Vietnam War when I was 14 in 1970 because I understood even then that citizens have not only a right but an obligation to speak out when they become aware of wrongdoings at the hands of our government. As citizens, we have the right to speak freely and the right to assemble. These are two of the five core freedoms guaranteed to us as citizens within the First Amendment of the Constitution. The other three are freedom of religion, freedom of the press, and the right to petition our government. We do not have to agree with one another, but we must respect each other's right to voice our opinions in a peaceful way in the public square. I am standing here today to defend our right to assemble and to voice our opinions as citizens of Haywood County. Thank you so much for the opportunity to speak to you.

Okay, thank you, Lorelei. Okay, the next person signed up to speak is Kathy Johnson. Welcome, Kathy.

Hello, and thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak to you. My husband and I have lived in Haywood County for 11 going on 12 years. We live here full time. We pay property taxes, local and state taxes here in North Carolina. I worked for six years as an RN in the CAP program for Haywood County Health and Human Services. I also volunteer for Meals on Wheels, Haywood Christian Ministries Food Pantry, Haywood Gleaners, and in the Master Gardener program. I donate to Grace Church, Pathways, Mountain Projects, and other local entities. I am registered to vote as an independent in this county. I believe in the idea of America, in the idea of liberty and justice for all, and freedom to peacefully demonstrate our convictions. I believe in freedom of speech and the idea of America being a beacon of justice, fair play, and to give a helping hand to those less fortunate. I can assure you that no one in our group is funded or paid. None of us are. We are all volunteers.

And no one, I can't read what I put.

And no one that I have ever seen, and I have gone to as many of these demonstrations as Steve has ever been impeded on the sidewalk, and I have not seen confrontations, although there may have been some, I have not seen it. So thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak.

Okay, thank you, Kathy. The next person signed up to speak is Kathleen Forrestal. Welcome, Kathleen.

Thank you. I'm a little shaky, so I've heard a lot of things about myself. I'm the lone counterprotester, and I'm not going to waste my time defending myself. I'm just going to say my little speech. I'd like to use my time to talk about preserving the culture of Hayward County. When I moved here in 2014, I remember what a typical Saturday in downtown Waynesville used to be like. It was a stroll through town, browsing the shops, enjoying a good meal, and if you were lucky, hearing a busker playing a ukulele or singing bluegrass. Families with children could visit without feeling uneasy. They could get an ice cream at Kilwin's or a bag of candy at Mass General Store and take silly pictures in front of the banjo men. Beginning around 2024, however, I began noticing a change in downtown. At first, the difference seemed subtle, but over the past three years, it became increasingly difficult to ignore. I hear a lot about inclusivity, but at times what I am seeing feels less like inclusion and more like special groups dominating a shared public space. This summer, families driving into town had to encounter a man yelling 86-47 through a bullhorn, while loud car horns and whistles filled the air. If the families chose to park downtown, they might find themselves walking through a sea of rainbow flags and encountering posters advertising a drag show, leaving some parents to explain subjects to their children that they may feel are way beyond their maturity level. Some people may view this as an expression of diversity and free speech. Others may see it differently. Either way, I believe we need to acknowledge that there can be real conflicts for both tourists and local residents. Imagine a tourist turning the corner from Walnut Street onto North Main for the first time, expecting a peaceful day in a small mountain town. Instead, they may encounter hundreds of signs expressing ideological viewpoints that they may or may not reflect their own values. They may reasonably wonder, does this represent the culture of Haywood County? Likewise, when a local resident feels that they have to plan their Saturday around a recurring demonstration that includes political messages such as, honk if you hate Trump, and ICE is Gestapo, it raises another important question. Is this the culture Haywood County wants to portray? Or do we want a culture where... Families can feel safe physically, psychologically, and spiritually. A culture where diversity can be expressed through different ethnicities, traditions, art, music, food, and community celebrations. I believe there is room for free speech, protests, and differing viewpoints, but I also believe that public spaces belong to the entire community. Can we establish reasonable boundaries that protect everyone's ability to enjoy and participate in our downtown? I will close with a passage from Isaiah Berlin's Two Concepts of Liberty. Men are largely interdependent.

Yeah, pretty well finish up your last comment. I'm sorry. You're three minutes is up. Pretty well just finished up your last... Can I just finish that quote?

It's just like... Yeah, yeah. Okay. Men are largely interdependent and no man's activity is so completely private as to never obstruct the lives of others in any way. Freedom for the pike is death for the minnows. The liberty of some must depend on the restraint of others. Thank you.

Okay, thank you. Okay, next person signed up to speak is Chuck Dixon. Welcome, Chuck. You got a two for today.

I actually spoke at the first Snow King's rally about social security. That was back when they were threatening, Doge was in, they were threatening to close social security offices. Fortunately, the one in Franklin did not close, and people are able to go to that office now. I was there on Saturday. Actually, I was recruiting people to do some door knocking in the campaign this fall, and I spoke to everyone there at the rally. I can assure you that the laws are being changed. The sidewalk is, there's a five foot buffer which is required so people on wheelchairs can get up and down the sidewalk. The folks that I spoke to were at the edge of the sidewalk at the street. The only harassment I saw was from people passing by. people shooting birds, people cursing them. I did not see the people yelling back or doing any kind of thing like that. As far as defying drivers to run them over, you don't. You don't stand at the edge of a highway like that and a big truck come by and defy them to run you over. As Dr. Walsh said, there is a lawsuit, there's a criminal action going on right now against someone who did try to run someone down. And to set it straight, the sidewalks do belong to the town, but they are public spaces. We, as long as they keep, as long as people keep the sidewalks open, they're perfectly free to use the sidewalks. Anybody can demonstrate. Anybody can carry a sign. Anybody can walk up and down the public sidewalks. They don't need a permit. And as long as they don't block traffic, as long as they allow the free freedom for people to go back and forth, that's what is... That's what they do. So I just wanted to give you my... Oh, and the other thing I was going to say, at the risk of offending the group here, it's a lot of old people. And most of these people have probably not demonstrated or protested before. I'm not going to go into the reasons why they are. We'll keep it simple. But anyway, it's a good group of people. And... I'm actually in that old group too, so that's how I can say this now. But anyway, thank you very much.

This is public comment. Okay, the next person to sign up to speak is John Culp. Welcome, John.

Hi, my name is John Culp. I'm a retired Lieutenant Colonel from the United States Army. Thank you very much for allowing me to speak this morning and excuse my messed up voice. I spent 30 years in the Army as an enlisted man, as a non-commissioned officer, and as an officer. An additional 19 years in the CIA as a CIA officer. So I've defended this country around the world for almost 50 years. Since I retired, I've been to Ukraine seven times as a humanitarian volunteer. So I'm not done yet. But one of the reasons I stand out there is because during my years in service, I took the oath many, many times. And so I know what it says. And that oath is to the Constitution of the United States. It's not to any individual. It's not to a chief executive. It's to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic. Now, the Constitution does not permit any kind of masked federal gunman breaking into people's houses without judicial warrants. It does not defend masked federal gunmen shooting down American citizens in cold blood and not being prosecuted for it. What it does protect, though, is the freedom of assembly. And it does protect the freedom of speech. And I wanted to add that I live in Jonathan Creek. Now, I wasn't born in Haywood County. My father was a Methodist minister, and we served the Western Carolina Conference of the United Methodist Church. So I've been coming to Haywood County since I was a little kid, and we had a house. My dad built a house up here when I was about five. So I grew up playing in the playgrounds at Lake Junaluska and going in the pool, fishing in the lake. So although I'm not fully a native, I've only lived here permanently about 10 years, I definitely feel like I'm part of this county, and I appreciate you giving me the opportunity to speak. Thank you.

Okay, thank you, John. Okay, that's all the people I have signed up to speak this morning. We'll move on to constituent concerns. Does anybody have any that they want to comment on?

I just want to bring up that I've had numerous, numerous people talk about the protest thing. And I've tried to stay neutral on both sides of it because I know once we get elected, we're here to represent everybody. And that's what I do. But sitting here listening to some of the comments, I saw many, many videos on social media that contradict a lot of what's saying on either side. And I respect everybody's right to protest and stuff, but I do know for a positive fact that I went up through there one day and Bruce McGovern screamed real loud through a bullhorn right in my car window. And I did get upset about it. That did make me mad. I didn't say nothing, but it made me mad. And I understand where these people are coming from when I've heard people sit here and say that there wasn't nothing going on. Well, these videos don't lie. But, and you know, this one lady right here in the back with the white hair, I saw a video Saturday where she was standing on the opposite side of the street and there were four other women come around across the street over there, get around her. And that, to me, that's contradicting what we're saying here. Everybody has a right for peaceful protest. But if everybody does, and this, one thing that did sort of bother me a little bit is I did see a sign that said 86-47. All right? Did we not just have somebody prosecuted in the federal level for putting 86, that same thing, in the sand somewhere on the beach here just a year or so ago? And one of the senators, the legislators, And I believe in peaceful protest, and I understand that 100%. But this courthouse right here is the people's courthouse. It's y'all's, the other side, everybody's. And I would prefer, myself personally, if it was somewhere else on the sidewalk, either side, Republican, Democrat, whoever, somewhere else. That's not my decision, but I think that would be the wise thing to do for everybody. I'd like to see everybody get together and talk. Everybody's got good points on both sides. But to me, this is not helping our businesses in town. It's not helping either side because when somebody's heard something 75 times, they're not going to listen to it the 76th time most of the time. And I understand both sides. And I think both sides are wrong when we have these confrontations. He's talking about the... Legal action going on. I heard one of the protesters standing there, that's been a friend of mine for years and years and years, step out there the other day and say something. Run over me, I'll sue you like I did the last one. Is that peaceful? All I ask is for people to be peaceful and do the right thing. And, you know, we get these calls. Y'all don't get these calls that we get from different people. So we don't know unless we're there. Exactly what's going on. But when we get complaints every day, over and over and over, there's got to be some, a little bit to it anyway. I mean, you can't, when you get 10 calls, I don't think all 10 of them is going to be lying. But that's my stand on it. I just think everybody could get along, and everybody, just like if she's on one side of the sidewalk, she should be left alone. Y'all are on one side of the sidewalk, y'all should be left alone. But I don't think it's helping our people and our economy or anybody when people can't get to businesses on Main Street because they're scared to go through there. And I think the most... Reasonable part, if it's legal for us to do it, I think we ought to just have an officer there to make sure that this is going on, and then we won't have this problem. We can't stay there every minute to see what's going on, but I know I've been up there two or three times, and I'm just like everybody else. I get out of control a little bit, too, a lot of times, and I think y'all get a little bit excited sometimes more than you realize you are. And on both sides. I'm not saying on one side. But I'm saying that there's such a thing as back 40 years ago, people would go out and talk to each other. They wouldn't scream at each other because they had, you know, several people behind them on either side. They'd talk about it and work things out. And that's just my opinion on it. But I respect peaceful protest, but I'd like to see it be peaceful. Thank you.

Okay. Anybody else want to say anything? I just wanted to make a comment. Oh, I'll make a comment about this in just a second, but the library is seeking, on a kind of calm note here, the library is seeking your input for their next strategic plan by conducting a community survey. Your participation will help identify areas of potential and future growth. Paper copies of the survey are available at all branches or online at the library's website, haywoodlibrary.org. I'm going to have, at our next meeting, I'm going to ask if we could just have Chris or Frank comment on the ordinance, on the ground use ordinance. I know a lady had asked me, a lady said something that I had told her. As far as I know, you folks are on the sidewalk, not on the courthouse lawn. So to be on the courthouse lawn, you have to have a separate permit, right? Okay. So, and then as far as on the sidewalk, I don't know what the policy is for the town of Waynesville, how they do that. Other than, I guess there's a federal law that basically, Chuck, you might know, but there's probably a federal law that says you can be on the sidewalk and protest as long as you don't impede traffic. I've read your, I guess y'all passed this out. So, yeah, if y'all would abide by this, this would be, you know, and I'm sure, I mean, I've got folks on my side, and I don't want to say my side and your side, but I know that people do get emotional at times about this issue. I've been a commissioner for a long time, since 2002, and I've never seen the public discourse like it is today, and there's a lot of reasons for that, unfortunately. I hope that we can maybe start, that can be calmed down in the future But, uh, for now, I think people are just very, um, aware of what's going on and they're out protesting for whatever reason. And, uh, but we do want y'all to be peaceful. And I do think for the most part, you guys try to do that, but you do have some that I know, I know Bruce that when I've had complaints about him, I'll just tell y'all I've had complaints from, uh, from people I work with in the real estate market that are concerned about this for businesses downtown and for their business here in the county. And I know we have people coming here from all walks of life, but we do want to be respectful of everybody. And if you could get some of the ones that are maybe a little more brash and loud, if they could tone it down a little bit, I think it would make your group be a lot... People would not be as... If you get somebody worked up, we've kind of gone past the point we need to be at. So if y'all could just calmly get your message across. And calm protest is what our country was based on. You know, our patriots in the early days, they didn't like what the King of England was doing. And when y'all were talking, I was just thinking about some of the comments that people make about me, you know, and about us. which are usually not true, and if they are true, they're cast in such a light that they're almost not true. But we can make fun of the president or whoever, you know, and that's our right. And, you know, if we were in the Soviet Union and we did that, we would probably be in Siberia for a while, or maybe forever. So I appreciate that our country and the veterans that on both sides, I know my dad, he fought for our country, and he was always one that wanted to make sure that everybody could exercise their constitutional rights. And I think most veterans, probably almost all veterans will tell you that our constitutional rights are what is guaranteed. And and that's why they're defending those. So they might not like what they say, what one side says, but they'll defend your right to their death to do that, and that's what they do, and I appreciate that. And I know my father-in-law was in World War II and had some really bad experiences there. He was on the Yorktown in the Enterprise, and we're very proud of his service also. But anyway, if... If y'all could just tone it down a little bit, I think everybody would be a lot better off. Anybody?

Go ahead. I guess I am the only one of us that has a business in downtown. My office is located on Wall Street. We are not open on the weekends. But occasionally I will come to Waynesville to retrieve keys or a file or just do some work with the door locked. And so I have been privy to these protests, if you will. And a couple of things that I think these are just suggestions that I would like to mention. I have been approached driving through driving up Main Street. Someone stepped out from the crosswalk. with a sign, shaking the sign at my vehicle, and I guess that's their right to do that. I believe very much in the right to stand at this podium. And we've, all of us have taken it pretty hard sometimes from people from that podium. And as citizens of the United States, we have the opportunity, and I've said it every time, someone's come to that podium or on that street with opinion different than mine is that that's one of the beautiful things about living in the United States is we have the right to voice our opinion, whether it's my opinion or not. But I will tell you as a business owner, and I have really good friends that own a business on up the street, several actually on up the street, and I hate this. I hate to say this, but the word on the street in Waynesville is business stops at the red light because tourists are not wanting to come past that red light. Part of what I do in my business is I manage short-term rentals, and that's where people would come here and rent a home and enjoy everything we have to offer in Haywood County. And I have had guests in their review say to us, We really enjoyed the mountains, we enjoyed Cataloochee Valley, we enjoyed Mackey Valley, all the things that they enjoyed, but we did not feel comfortable on Main Street. And so all I want to say to you guys about this is that you are definitely entitled to your opinion as I am entitled to mine. But I think what you'd want to do with these protests is that you would somehow want those words and actions to equate to something that makes real change. And I don't know if we are off-putting or making people uncomfortable that either side would accomplish real change if we were not very careful in our demeanor. You know, if I come to your house for dinner and I am rude and rude. hard to get along with, and I don't clean my plate up after we have dinner, you might not invite me back. But if I came to your house and I could do it in a way that we could meet in the middle, we might make change together. And so my point is, as a business owner in Waynesville, that I don't know that you're really accomplishing what you're setting out to do. And that is you would want it to equate into a vote, I think, that made real change. And so I believe in the right to have a difference of opinion. I think that is protected by our Constitution. It's very, very important to me. If you'll go back and watch all the meetings, any time we've had people come to that podium, I have said you have the right to come to that podium and speak what's on your mind. Just do it in a peaceful manner. on the street or in the grocery store, and that's really what we want to maintain. And so maybe we just all can look at the way we're going about it, not trying to sugarcoat anything, but we certainly don't want small businesses to struggle. We don't want people to not want to come past the red light. We don't want people to feel like they're not comfortable here. So I would just ask that we all try to work together to follow the rules that you've set out. This is definitely a public space, as the sidewalks are. And I would just encourage you to maybe, you know who the folks are in your group, as any group would know, the outliers, that you just work and coach them a little bit on how to how to manage what they've got to say. So I appreciate you coming today, and I appreciate we hopefully can work together as a community to everybody get their point across.

Anybody else coming? Well, I wasn't going to say anything, but I guess some of these speakers inspired me. You know... You know, I believe in the rights of free speech. I know several of you said thank you for allowing us three minutes. Well, we allow people three minutes every meeting. We believe in free speech here. Your first amendment rights of free speech. Every meeting we have a public comment session. So I thank you for saying thank you, but there's no thanks needed because that's just the way we operate. We believe in free speech. And our county attorney, he's famous for me. He's famous for saying, hey, we videotape our meetings. You're on videotape. And our county attorney's famous for saying, you know, free speech is a two-edged sword. You know, you can get up and say your bit, and then you can be very professional, or you can really show out. Nobody showed out here today. You all were professional in what you had to say. But, you know, free speech is wonderful. The videotape is wonderful. People can see where you come from, where you stand, whether they agree with you or not. Everybody has their opinion, as the gentleman said. I do have one thing about free speech. There was a Russian and an American met at an airport. And the American said, hey, you know, we got free speech in America. You know, we can go to Washington, D.C. in the halls of Congress and say, at that time, Ronald Reagan was president. Ronald Reagan stinks. Ronald Reagan's terrible. And the Russians said, well, gee, we've got free speech in Russia, too. We can go to the Kremlin and say Ronald Reagan stinks and Ronald Reagan is sorry. Think about that for a minute. You'll get it. But we do have free speech here in America. And Hey, that's why we're here. And so, you know, people can make their own mind up as to their opinion on your protest or whatever you have to say. They do us every day. And that's what makes America great. But we need to agree to disagree sometimes and move on. So thanks, folks. We have free speech here.

I guess everybody else talked, so I might as well, too. But I guess I can't say it no better than my other colleagues here that have said what they've said. I've heard both sides as well. I've heard negative comments from a lot of the protests that's going on. As Jennifer stated, I've got comments that people don't want to come. by the courthouse. I have not personally had any conflicts with anybody, I guess because I ain't been around when you guys are protesting. Other than on a Sunday afternoon when I get out of church, I do drive up the sidewalk and see you folks standing there. But personally, I haven't had any conflicts with anybody, but I have had a lot of comments of a lot of my constituents that have called saying, is there something you can do to keep the confrontational stuff down? And that does bother me. I don't know what is going on. I know that there's a lot of videos and pictures that people says they have. I haven't seen any of those. But I will be looking at those going forward to see what's actually going on because I'm hearing both sides. But one thing I do believe in is everybody has a freedom of speech. You ought to have that right to protest and I ought to go both ways. As this gentleman said, if he's standing over there by himself, nobody should be in his face trying to intimidate him. or as the lady back here in the back said, or any of you folks. So I believe in freedom of speech and believe we need to do, as Kevin said, if we abide by the sheet that I think you guys may have handed out. I think if everybody does that, it'll go a long ways. Nobody gets anywhere by fighting. I know I have been to... Washington a couple of times actually with Mayor Smathers and our message a lot of times in Washington is hey even though I'm a Republican and he's a Democrat we still work together for the right of Haywood County and we get things done when we fight all the time and want to be confrontational and you don't get nothing done nothing accomplished so I encourage everybody to try to get along and try to do the right thing and Each one of us has got our own thing to say. Me and my wife even have disagreements at times. I love her more than anybody in the world, but we still don't get along all the time, but we've got to work through those. I encourage everybody to work, to be positive in the best way that you can. If you want to get your message out, that's fine, but don't be intimidating. and surrounding folks and, as Jennifer said, that's not helping anything. All that does is make people want to fight. And I can promise you one thing. I may have been a little bit of a scrapper back in my day, and some of that still comes up at times. So if somebody gets in my face, I'm going to fight my way out. So I take that for what it's worth. But anyway, I think if we do it in a positive way, it goes a whole lot further.

You were mentioning going to D.C. I forgot about that. I think Anthony Sutton was there for the town. You were telling me that, I'll let you say it, but it seems like you guys were up there for a common reason and a common cause. Sometimes we agree on a lot more things than we disagree on, you know.

Yeah, I mean, that's a good point. You know, we've even said that many times. You know, we're not going to agree on everything, just as I said, me and my wife don't. But we agree on a whole lot more than what we disagree on, and we all knew that. You know, going there, but we still were fighting for what was best for Haywood County.

That's right. That's right, yeah. We appreciate you going up there, too. You and Anthony. And who else went with you? Zeb? Zeb went. Who else from Haywood? That's probably it from Haywood. Okay. Very good. Okay. All right. I'll move on. If you all have a need to go, you can go. I mean, and stuff, unless you want to stay. I'll give you all a minute while we move on to our next. The next will be agency reports and presentations. and we have our 2027 reappraisal update. Tax assessor Judy Hickman, if you guys will come up here in just a minute. Go ahead, Judy. Thank you. Appreciate y'all coming this morning.

I'm not usually used to saying good morning. It's usually good evening whenever I'm up here. So I kept telling myself all the way down, this is morning. Just want to give you a little bit of a brief update on our 2027 reappraisal and include some sales just so you can see kind of where we are in the reappraisal process. I know that a lot of this information is going to be repetitive. but I think it's important because someone may be seeing it for the first time and it's important information that I feel like that our property owners need. Okay. What is reappraisal? It's the process of valuing all real estate at full market value. It's important to know that real estate in Haywood County is only reappraised every four years. Of course, right now we're in our sixth year. We were scheduled to have a 2025 reevaluation, and we had to push that back a couple of years due to Helene. So what we're looking at, the values now that we're seeing are the values that were set in 2021, not today's current values. Whereas your registered motor vehicles, personal properties such as campers, unregistered vehicles, boats, all of that stuff is reassessed each year. Okay, our goal is to ensure that all properties are treated equitably. And, of course, we have to follow the North Carolina general statutes. So what tax value really means? North Carolina, as I said, is a market value state. So basically what we have to do is we have to look at sales that occur within Haywood County. We have to be at 100% market value as of the reappraisal date, which will be January 1, 2027. A lot of people ask what they can expect from a reappraisal. If you were to sell your property on an open market, you would probably expect a little bit higher than what you see on the tax records currently, so you have to look at what you would sell for. Property values may increase or decrease after a repraisal. This change alone does not determine what your tax bill will be. Okay, market value is set by the buyers and the sellers for residential and commercial properties. So basically anyone that sells their property or anyone that comes in and purchases property is who sets our market. Reappraisal only interprets market data of sold properties. Then we develop models which will imitate or reproduce tree value of unsold properties. So now we've got some cells listed in each area of the county, and I'm going to let Levi go over some of those. I will say that we have been having some, what do you want to call them? We've been going to different places to try to get people to come out. We've had some one-on-one time with taxpayers. We print their property record cards and we go over their property record card with them. That's important to us because we want to make sure that the information we have is correct. We don't see the inside of the home, so a lot of that stuff may be incorrect on your property record card, and that can make a difference in value. So we encourage people to contact our office so that we can sit down and go over that property record card with you. We do have one other date. I believe it's September the 26th on a Saturday at the Waynesville Library. We'll be there all day, so we encourage people to come and And sit down and talk with us, and this is your opportunity to ask a lot of questions regarding reval.

Good morning. I just wanted to go over just a handful of sales here that have all taken place in the last couple months, just to give an idea of where we're sitting at with our values compared to the market. I tried to pull one sort of in each area of the county. So here's one from July of this year, sold for $280,000. Our tax value is $156,200. It's in the Jonathan Creek area. We've got one here, another one from July, sold for $351,000. The tax value is $266,600. It's in the Maggie area. Got one here from Clyde. This is from August. Pretty recent sale. Sold for $303,000. We're at $154,400. Here's one in the Canton area. Looks like sold in August. Sold for $450,000. We're at $276,100. And finally one from Waynesville here from July. Sold for $364,000 and we're at $198,000. So that's just an idea of about how far off we are on most of our values. Our most recent sales ratio is 56%. So that's the comparison of what a property sells for versus what we have it valued at. And this is a direct result of the extended period since the last reval. I mean, our 21 reval would have been mostly sales that took place in 2020. So that's how far out we are. And that's why there's such a change. But we do want to encourage folks still to verify. Like Judy was saying, we've had these events, but folks can always go online, haywoodcountync.gov, go to the GIS website. They can search for property. There's a little button up at the top that says view tax card. Check your tax card. If you have any questions, call our office, email us, whatever you want to do. Let us know. If there's something wrong, we want to get that data correct before we issue our values next year. And here's some contact info if anyone needs to call us or email us directly. Do any of y'all have any questions of us?

I've got a question, Levi. On that, you said they were selling, that's what they sold for, and that's what the previous tax assessment was?

Yes, sir.

What does that do now to... like the neighbor that hadn't sold or bought in the last 10, 15 years or 20 years maybe?

Well, comparable sales are extremely important. That's how we establish values through the county. So we would take into account any differences in the homes, but a home that is similar to another home that sold for a certain amount should be close to the value of the other home. So, you know, it's not necessarily just that a neighbor sold. If the neighbor's home was similar to the other home, then that would be a pretty good comparable sale. But we'd have to be talking about apples to apples. You know, it would have to be a 1,200-square-foot brick home compared to a 1,200-square-foot brick home, not a 5,000-square-foot home compared to a single-wide mobile home or something like that.

I just wanted to get that clarified so that people would know that it wasn't going to kill people that didn't have that. Yes, sir.

Yes, sir. And the market as a whole has increased. But we look at specific sales. So we check for certain things. Some neighborhoods may be more hot than others. Some may sell higher than others. Some may sell lower. Some areas might have lower land values than other neighborhoods. It just depends. And also, every home matters. One home may be renovated and one may not. We'll take that into account. Also, the age of the home, square footage, all sorts of things like that.

I've had a lot of questions from a lot of elderly people and stuff, and I just want them to understand exactly how it works.

Yes, sir.

Just quickly on the vehicles, when you say 100%, that is the wholesale value of the vehicle. Is that correct? Yeah, it is market. Go ahead. It's a what, market?

It is market.

So it's not wholesale?

No.

Oh, okay.

No, it's market value. Basically what we do is we use tech data, which is essentially what all the other counties use, and what they do is they look at all of the vehicle sales within the state of North Carolina.

Okay, okay. And then on the, I guess I want to try to keep this simple. So when you say 56%, does that mean if your property is worthless, Let's say the tax value is $56,000. In the new reval, if this holds, it'll be $100,000. Would that be fair to say?

I mean, it's not across the board, of course, but yes, yes. I mean, that would be, take the percentage that is low on the sale. So, so theoretically what those properties were valued at or what they're, so what they sold for this year should be close to the market value.

And that's like the broad average. So, and just to step that up, if it's $560,000, if It'll sell for a million if it's the total average house in Haywood County. Yes, that'd be possible. And these are mass appraisals. They're not going to be perfect, exact. They're going to be approximate, very approximate. I had an appraiser tell me one time that, He said that, you know, really your tax values are always just a little bit lower than what you can actually sell it for. But probably starting out they won't be, but they will be as time goes on. But we've gone six years and, you know, it seems like during COVID people found this place and were buying and just driving up the cost. And that seems to have leveled off a little bit, I guess.

Are you all seeing that? Yeah, we've seen some change probably in the last six months now compared to, I won't say that the values, the sales, the values have all been down that much, but we have noticed things have taken a little longer to sell than they were a couple years ago. Things were selling the same day they listed. It's calmed down a bit, but we're still six years out from our last values. So probably those sales have leveled off maybe a little bit.

Yes, I think so. Instead of increasing like they were. It seems like there was just this huge jump between 2019 and 2021 or two. Yes. Okay. Go ahead. Is there anybody else?

You know, we did this, like you said, six years ago, and I had just come on the board, and I will say that I thought it was, I thought you did a painstakingly good job managing sales. that rebale. And it was driven, like you said, by COVID. There were so many people, you know, you could work anywhere. People were coming, they were flocking here because of all the things that we have to offer. And so we did see a big increase there. And so I appreciate your willingness to come and help educate people about how this works, because I think that it's sometimes a little confusing about how those tax values are created and people You know, they say, well, it's going to go up 56% or something. They get the numbers. Maybe they're not clear on how that works. So I really appreciate you coming, and we'll just continue to get the message out as we move toward this. And I think that really helps. It even helped me as a new commissioner at the time to really educate people on how it works.

You know, just to comment, 56%, that's astronomical, really. That's huge because we haven't had a reval in so long. I tell you what I'm seeing and some of the people that are vocal about this reval are people who are taking advantage of elderly people and the heirs of elderly people who died. They'll swoop in on some poor family member that doesn't live in this county, maybe in a poor region of South Carolina or North Carolina. And they'll call them up and say, hey, I'll buy you your loved one's place. Oh, yeah? What do you give me? Well, it's on the tax card for $200,000. And some of the examples you just gave, they full well know that that piece of property is worth $350,000. And this person that's grieving over a loved one in a state somewhere where property is not worth what it is here says, sure, mail me a check. And they're shysters. They're ambulance chasers. There are opportunities to take advantage of these folks. And as far as the reval goes, this protects some of those people because they're not going to bother going and getting a paid appraisal. They're not going to go check your real estate. They're in a state of bereavement or a state of need. And they just sell it for what Haywood County has it evaluated for on the tax card. And I'm telling you, you would not believe how many stories that I've heard of people getting took advantage like that. And it's wrong. These folks are, you know, they're doing that because we've been negligent of getting a reval. And so we bear some of that responsibility. And I know they should probably get a paid appraisal. You could look at it both ways. But I tell you what, I don't have a lot of respect for people that go take advantage of loved ones who are in a state of bereavement, and they throw a little $100 bill out in front of them, and they sell it to them for what we had evaluated for six years ago. And so for the revalves concerned, it protects people like that. It protects some of our lower end of our society. And I was in a meeting in Durham two, three weeks ago. David Baker was explaining some of the properties across North Carolina. And I'm telling you, properties have exploded all across the state. We're not really unique in that. We are a little higher on the scale. But, you know, a reval protects some of your lower segment of society. You know, he used an example. Somebody bought a mobile home. And you know the depreciation schedule on a mobile home. The longer you go without a reval, those folks are paying more. They're paying more. As long as we delay the reval, some of our poor people in our society actually suffer the most from not having a reval. It's like the chairman said, there's going to be some instances where there's 200%, 56%, 100% gain, but there are cases to where reval is going to lower people's tax, their tax bill. There are cases where that's going to happen. And so it's interesting how things are relative. You know, the folks that spoke here before and the big... These protests, you know, people, the big catchphrase is peaceful protest. You know, well, some people's opinion of what peaceful is are different than what other people's opinion of peaceful is. I know a guy, kind of bring this full circle, who moved here from a northern state. And I worked with him. I was telling him we're fixing to have a rebound. He said, oh, man, this is great. I'd never heard that reaction from somebody, really. He said, my home is currently evaluated, I think he said 225,000. He said, on this next reval, he said, my house is probably going to go to $350,000. He said, just imagine, you know, getting $125,000 gained in my personal wealth in one year. Yeah, he's optimistic. He said, well, my house is at $225,000. It's going to go to $350,000. He said, basically on paper, I'm gaining $125,000 in one year. I had never heard anybody say that. But it's true. If you go by that tax card, you know your personal wealth. People can work 30 years and never save $125,000. But they've gained in that respect. And he did go on to say that where he came from, his taxes were nearly $12,000 a year. He lived in New Jersey, and his property taxes was $12,000 a year. And they're just a fraction of that here. And so that guy was just jumping up and down over this reval and our tax rate. So, you know, it's a relative term. You know, it's like... Your opinion of the reval may be completely different from the next guy's, but some of these terms are very relative. I got a question. The 56%, that across the board. I lost my train of thought there for just a second. It'll come back to me in just a minute. I did have a question about that 56% number. That is across the board. That's the average across the county. I think you answered that just a second ago. All right.

Okay. Anybody else? Yeah, just quick. I appreciate you guys trying to communicate to not only us but the public on how this is handled. You know, you hear a lot of comments that we just sit around and make up numbers and want them to be higher than what they actually are. And a lot of this is on social media, and it's untrue and false. But I appreciate the professional way we go about checking on these revals. You know, and it's very similar, correct me if I'm wrong, to if you get an appraisal on your house or if you're wanting to get a loan or if you're selling your house or whatever, we look at the sales comps in the area, and that's how this is figured up. So, again, it goes back to what Commissioner Long was saying. If you want to get a loan, you want that appraisal to be high. You know, a lot of people want that equity in their home so that their self-value is higher or lower. Then there's a lot of people on the other side that says, hey, I paid $50,000 for my home, and that's what I want to pay taxes on. So you get both sides. But I appreciate the way that we go about coming up with these values. I think it's the fairest way. And one thing I want to encourage folks, and I know that you mentioned it when you were speaking, that if there is a discrepancy or you think your home is not worth that or if the inside of the home is trash you're looking at stud walls or insulation whatever people can bring pictures in to prove you know the that their home may not be worth what we're saying it's worth. And I want folks to know it's okay. Same with a vehicle. Is that true? If you've got a vehicle that you guys are saying that it's worth X amount and they can prove through other sales or other similar vehicles. Is that right, Judy?

That is true. That's why we have an appeal process. And that's something that we'll be talking about when we come back is how that appeal process works and how we can help you

um follow your appeal yeah i've had maybe three three or four this past week that's asked about vehicles and i've just encouraged them to come in and talk to you folks and that that brings me to the question i had if somebody wants to come in with pictures or uh proof that their vehicles or homes may not be what they're worth do they need to set up a meeting or can they just come in

Our doors are always open. So we've always got someone in the office that can talk with someone. You know, the more information that you bring to us, the better. But, yeah, they don't have to set up an appointment.

Okay.

The only time that we have to make appointments is like during a reevaluation when we have, you know, we're sending out 50-some thousand records. And then during the Board of Equalization Review. Okay.

Thank you. I encourage all of our constituents to do that. If you feel that it's unfair, come and see you guys. If you have proof that it's inaccurate, we'll fix it. Absolutely. A friend of mine last week posted something on social media about his tax bill. The home had been flooded and it wasn't livable and we had sent a tax bill. Well, we do make mistakes. All you got to do is call us and we'll fix it.

Absolutely.

No sense in making a, I don't know if they're starving for attention or what, but it seems like they're wanting to get people stirred up. And it goes back to what we were saying earlier about the protest, you know. You don't fix nothing by doing that. All you do is make everybody mad. They made me mad, and I'm going to let him know that when I see him. But outside of that, you don't fix it. If you'll bring it to me, then I can fix it and say, hey, this is wrong. Let's fix it, and we'll correct it. So anyway, I just encourage everybody to come and talk to us, talk to you guys, and we'll fix something if it's wrong. So thank you again for coming.

You know, just to add on to what Commissioner Rogers said, if you don't agree with your tax bill, you come... protest it here. That seems like a catch word today. But you can protest your tax bill here in front of you guys and if it's wrong, fix it. And then if they still don't agree, they could take it to Raleigh. Could you describe that mechanism for us?

That is correct. There's different levels to the appeal process. The first one is called an informal appeal where you can come in and bring in some information and talk with your appraiser, which is the person who actually looked at the property. And then your second round of appeals can be to the Board of Equalization and Review, which is a board panel of five members, which is appointed by the Board of Commissioners. And they hear both sides. They hear the county side and they hear the taxpayer side. And they make their decision. And if you're not happy with that, you have 30 days to appeal on to the Property Tax Commission, which is held in Raleigh. That's also another panel of members. And it's a more formal setting, but then it can go all the way to the Court of Appeals.

So, you know, I always tell folks, you know, a lot of people say they don't care, the commissioners, they don't care. Well, we follow the law. We don't make it. And all those things that trickle down to us, they come from Raleigh. The Tax Code, the Machinery Act, all those things are set in motion out of the state legislature. So... And I tell folks all the time, well, you know, I don't like paying taxes. I think it's terrible. I really do. I mean, when it comes time to pay my taxes, you know, I just put it off the last minute. I don't care to tell you. I just kind of put it off the last minute. I don't like paying taxes any more than anybody else does. But, you know, if you really want to make a change... You need to talk to the folks like Jimmy Rogers or Danny Davis or Kevin Corbin or those folks who are our state representatives in Raleigh. Again, we follow the law. We don't make it. And I know you guys take it on the chin, and we do too, but sometimes you do feel helpless. You know, it's like the hammer's coming down on us from above, but... I know you guys got a tough job. You take a lot of probably unnecessary tongue lashings, but appreciate the work you do. So thank you.

Could I make one clarification, just importantly? If you disagree with your tax value, you can come talk to us in an appeal. Not your tax bill. We can't change your bill, but we will look at your value. Just wanted to clarify that. Right.

Yeah, okay. Good point there, Levi. And I did want to make a comment, too. A lot of people say the county, the county did this, the county. And usually I'm like, no, it's the state. We're an extension of the state, and tax laws are all handed down by the state. And they tell us how to collect them, when to collect them, how to do the value, how not to do the value. So this is done through the state, and we're just a conduit is all we are. So people need to realize that, too, that. When they say the county's doing this or that, they need to figure out what the issue is because it could be a state or federal regulation that we're having to follow. And there's a lot of those that you guys have to do. Our staff does a great job because they're just trying to keep us, you know, in our lane, if you will, and make sure that we're, you know, doing what we're supposed to. So I appreciate y'all doing that. Anybody else on this? Okay, well, thank y'all. Appreciate y'all educating everybody. I know it's a long process. Okay, the next order of business will be a consent agenda. Does anybody have any questions on the seven items on the consent agenda? And if not, I'll entertain a motion. We approve the consent agenda. Okay, go ahead.

I'd like to ask a question about that number two.

Terry, can you turn your microphone on for a minute?

On that number two, do we not, has the state bidding thing, have they got higher than regular rates now, or are they not keeping up with it, or what is the situation on that?

Chris, know about that?

Request approval resolution authorizing the upfit for lots and radios for 640 Explorer.

Does that keep from bidding? I mean, as the bids got so high, we can't, I mean, what's the reasoning for that?

Oh, per exception to the competitive bidding requirements?

Yeah, didn't we used to do all that through the state bid?

So the vehicles are sort of separated into two things. The vehicle purchased themselves, and I think we used the sheriff's office group purchasing to buy those vehicles. This is... That's right. We use the state price through the Sheriff's Association. This item is the upfit. This is the light bars, the radios, those kinds of things that are the vehicle to upfit it. Because, and I'm sorry, I believe it's Western Carolina Communications or something. I'm looking at Matt back there. He's the guy with more details. But they're the sole rep in this area for some of the equipment. So before I step on his toes, I'll let Matt give you a more thorough explanation. Thanks for being here, Matt.

I appreciate that. Yeah, you can tell us how you all have to go about that.

just because they're the western side of the state vendor for federal signal, which is the light bar we use, plus Kenwood radios. There is somebody on the eastern side, but we would have to send our cars there, and then if we have a problem, we have to drive. It's in, I think, Greensboro, North Carolina. So that's why we use Western Carolina communication.

I just wondered, the only reason I was wondering about that, because I knew they used to get through the state bids, you know, and stuff, and I didn't know if the state had got it right.

We've never used state bid on our equipment. We've always done a request for a bid, and Western Carolina has always been the only one over the last three years, I believe.

Yeah, they're a good outfit to do business with. I used to do business with them in record business, but that's just my concern was that it was cheaper, you know, like that. Thank you. Yes, sir.

Okay. Any other questions? Hearing none, I'll entertain a motion to approve the consent agenda. So moved. Is there a second? Second. Okay. All in favor say aye. Aye. Okay. That's unanimous. Okay, our regular agenda is next. The first is to request approval of a resolution declaring Thursday, September 10, 2026, as United Way Day in Haywood County, North Carolina. Is Salisa Willard here? Oh, there you are. You're hidden behind the podium, and I was like, is Salisa... Thanks for coming today and waiting all this time. Okay. So did you want to... Do you want to read the resolution?

Oh, shall I? Okay.

Or do you have it?

I do. Resolution declaring Thursday, September 10th, 2026 as United Way Day in Haywood County, North Carolina. Whereas United Way is a nonprofit organization dedicated to improving the quality of life in our community by advancing the common good in the areas of education, income, and health, and whereas United Way mobilizes volunteers, donors, and partners to support programs that strengthen families, schools, and local institutions, and whereas recognizing United Way's work encouraging greater community participation in its mission and inspires residents to give, volunteer, and advocate for the common good. And whereas September 10th, 2026 is a significant day for United Way as it celebrates the 30th annual Day of Caring, and whereas it is the will of the County Commission to honor United Way's contributions to our community, now therefore it is the purpose of this resolution to recognize the tireless efforts of the United Way and its volunteers, donors, and partners and Advancing Education, Income and Health in Haywood County. Declare September 10th, 2026 as United Way Day in Haywood County. Encourage all residents, schools, businesses and organizations to participate in United Way activities, including fundraising, volunteer projects and awareness campaigns. Support United Way's mission by promoting its programs and encouraging community engagement. Adopted this eighth September 2026 by the County Commission of Haywood County, North Carolina.

Thank you. So you had asked that we do this and we're glad we're glad to do it and so what all of y'all usually do on that day?

This year on the day of caring we are building three ramps and we have lots of painting projects, yard cleanups. Mostly it's for elderly and disabled citizens, but it is for some of our nonprofit agencies. We have 30 projects, and we have 365 volunteers close to that. It's one of my favorite days of the year. It's a time when people put aside their differences of all types and just go out and serve our community and help those that need help. Christmas is my favorite day of the year, and United Way Day of Caring is my second favorite. It's a lot of work, but it's worth the effort.

Yeah, that's great. I do want to compliment you for doing this and then also for your work in the flood, you know, getting the donations and out to the folks that were maybe missed by the governments and stuff like that. Can you give just a short report on that?

Yes. We have helped over 300 families. We have brought in $3.6 million. We have about 200,000 left. And of that 200,000, it's all promised to families and individuals that are not quite complete yet with their homes. but we are holding that money for them for such time as they need it. So we're almost, we have almost expended all that. And we are very proud of what our United Way, our small organization has been able to do and appreciate the confidence that you as county commissioners gave to our organizations to expend that money.

So your total was $3.6 million. So you've helped families with $3.4 million to help take care of a need and stuff. I know I had a neighbor that you were going to help with a heating system because she had no other way. And then you told her about it. You were educating yourself on what other programs were available and helped her get go through the state to use that program. We've done that a lot. And so that money was there, and you were aware of it and helped folks that way. And I know I always told when somebody wanted to donate, I said donate to United Way Haywood County if you want to do something for the floods. Don't donate to YouTubers. Don't donate to, you know, whoever. Go to United Way because that money will go to the flood victims. And I don't think you guys did not even take an administrative fee. No, sir. And so probably that $200,000 could have been your administrative fee, but you're going to put that back into it. to what y'all are doing. So we're so appreciative of that. And I think there was another, seemed like there was another one that you did. Was it Fred that you did? Or Tropical Storm Fred? Yes.

And the meal when we helped with insurance premiums.

That's right, for the meal. So I just wanted to tell everybody what y'all are doing because everybody needs to know what our United Way has done for our community, and we really appreciate you.

Thank you.

You know, Solis, I appreciate all you do for the United Way. I know United Way kind of got a, several years ago, kind of got a bad rap, but under your leadership, I think you've regained the trust of Haywood County, and you've, you know, put it back where it needs to be. And I know you had an entourage with you earlier, and I know the meetings went long. Would you like to recognize those folks that came with you? I know they must have had to leave early.

Well, some of those, I think, were with the Another entity, but one of them was on my board. Chad McMahon was here earlier that was on the board. And Catherine is here. She is our marketing and fundraising consultant. So we appreciate her being here with us. So look for T-shirts out in the community. On Thursday, when you see teams out working, we will have signs, and they'll be wearing green T-shirts with lots of our vendors and lots of sponsors on the back of those T-shirts.

Well, I know you've helped a lot of people, and I know after Tropical Storm Fred, I was on the Fairgrounds Board at the time, and our board was so moved by the devastation in Crusoe that we voted to give every penny of our profit from the state. It was kind of an abbreviated county fair. that year because of the flood we decided to go forward with the fair even though it wasn't kind of the county wasn't in a fair mood especially the southern end of the county but I know we presented a big check to the United Way and we gave till it hurt I can tell you on the board you know you want to stay have a pretty healthy fund but we kind of used that fair money to kind of float us through the year and We had some board members, like I say, who were very strongly motivated by the destruction in Crusoe. And we gave that money to the United Way to be distributed through the Baptist on Missions, which has been very, very good at helping people in our county. And I know they were recognized at the state level from the state auditors being most efficient in doing what they do to help people. And they came out clean as a houndstooth, so to speak, on an audit. And they were used kind of as a model. And we funneled that money through the United Way at the fairgrounds. And I have to tell you, I was kind of concerned about our liquidity after that at the fairgrounds. But, you know, we gave until it hurt, and the Lord blessed us for that. And when I left down there, I think we had the largest balance ever. When I left the Fire Grounds Board in our bank as a rainy day fund, operating fund, and I never would have dreamed that. And I look back at that and I think that, I think God blessed us down there with giving us ten times more than, forgiving, forgiving all the proceeds of that county fair to the people and crew. So when we used United Way, so I appreciate what United Way does. And I think you tapped me to sit on a board for the United Way this spring with Chad McMahon, and that was an honor to be trusted with some of those grant funds and sitting and listening to the grant application. So United Way is doing a great work in Haywood County, and it's in no small part due to your efforts. And I want to just thank you for all you do. Thank you.

All right. All right, so can I have a motion that we approve item one of the regular agenda?

I'll make it.

Second. Okay. I'll make a favor. I'll make a favor and say aye. Aye. That's you now. Thank you, Salisa. Thank you so much. Really appreciate all you do.

Salisa, thank you.

Thank you. Okay, so item number two is to request approval of a resolution authorizing the transfer of multiple flood-affected properties to the town of Clyde. Frank? Frank? Are you sure you guys want those? Town of Clyde's out there, so I see your maintenance man there. Joy Garvin's here.

Joy's hanging in there with us. She stayed for the whole meeting. Go ahead, Frank.

Commissioners, this is a resolution to carry out a plan kind of – Been ongoing for a little while here between the, let me get you some background. Haywood County acquired several lots in the town of Clyde as a result of a federal program that funded the buyout of damaged homes. This is actually before...

It's probably Ivan and Francis.

Yes, this is almost... 10 years ago, or eight years ago, flood damaged properties down there. When the government saw that either there was no insurance or the FEMA had paid their insurance, whatever, the government acquired the lots by voluntary purchase from these folks, okay, using federal funds. And the requirement for that system was that the federal government funded the county purchasing These flood lots that had, they're basically flat sites now because the house that was on it flooded away. The county has been maintaining those lots ever since. We're required to do so under restrictive covenants that came with the federal money. The federal money comes to the county. The county used it to buy the flood-damaged lot. The federal regulations and rules require that you not do anything on them except very limited time. maintenance and preservation of the property as basically vacant space. The shorthand way of thinking of it is you can't put up vertical enclosed structures. You might be able to put up a pavilion that had four posts and a little roof or something for a picnic area or something, but you couldn't put an enclosed structure on any of these. In general, the county has just simply mowed them. And the map you see up there is 36 of these lots that are on Broad Street, Mountain View, Spruce, and a couple over on the left-hand side there for Morgan Street. It makes no sense for the county to continue to own these. We have to mow them. It's an expense to us. We don't have a plan or a program to convert them into some use that would be appropriate for the restrictions. They can't just be put on the market to be sold for a house or something like that. They make great garden lots. The ones that are right next to the river make great garden lots. But then you've got to manage the gardeners, as weird as that sounds. In general, the county obligation has just been to mow the things. Clyde has approached us, said, If you're gonna mow them, we'll mow them, or whatever. We can also, Clyde is right there, they can develop a management program for these lots that would be more consistent with what their community needs. Puts the local government right there, go see Joy. Joy will be glad to have you a garden space, okay? Go see Joy. Joy will lend you a rotary tiller. She's standing by, waiting to get you in the gardening program here. But in any case, from our point of view, we transfer it to Clyde. Clyde still has to maintain those same restrictions, okay? Those same federal government restrictions that came with the money continue in their hands, too. But they also could—you could have some low-impact recreational uses— You've got some of these. The map you've got here doesn't show the river. The river is just on the north. It goes east and west through the town here. And you can kind of visualize where the river is by that road that's on the north side. It goes east and west. The river's coming from your right and going to your left across that diagram. So anyway, that's where we're at. The county gets... shed of a mowing job and Clyde gets the resources that they can more appropriately manage and use. Questions about that?

Okay. Thank you, Frank. I will say in the town of Clyde, and I've said this a lot, but The base flood elevation, the flood was four feet above the base flood elevation. And the base flood elevation is the 100-year flood mark. So if you built your house, according to the code, one foot above the base flood elevation, which is what FEMA said to do, you still got three feet of water. That's how bad the flood was in Clyde. So hopefully you guys can use this to... Hopefully it won't be a burden. It'll be an asset to where you can... not only maintain it, but use it to help the community there.

I think it's important to reiterate that these properties, the landowners voluntarily entered this program. They voluntarily wanted to get out of that flood. I know some of those folks down there that got flooded with Ivan and Francis and Tropical Storm Fred and Helene. When Helene hit, it's like, we're done. We've been flooded four times. We want to sell our property to this FEMA buyout program. And so this was not the heavy hand of the government coming down and saying, we're taking your land. They wanted to enter into this mitigation program, and they wanted to be compensated for their property and not have to go through that again. So I just wanted to reiterate that point. Okay, yeah.

I know one of these parcels, I had a... I had somebody staying with us. I don't know if it's one of these or not. But anyway, she came and stayed with us during the flood. And when we went back, the house had survived the other three hurricanes. And when we went back, her house was destroyed. It was actually, I think there was a tree inside the house. And the walls were blowed out. So Hurricane Helene really made people's mind up to vacate that. So it's unfortunate. Okay, so I'll entertain a motion we approve item two of the regular agenda. Make a motion we approve item two. Second. Okay, any other discussion? All those indicate by saying aye. Aye. Anyone opposed? Okay, that's unanimous.

Looking at these mitigations, people who don't live there anymore were out of harm's way when the most recent storm came through and that in itself is progress. So I wanted to bring this proclamation to remind all of our residents and our folks across the state even that this month is set aside nationally for Preparedness Month so that we can all focus just a little bit on being better prepared for whatever may come. So I'll read the proclamation. Haywood County Preparedness Month 2026. Should be prepared for natural and manmade disasters as well as disease outbreaks. And whereas North Carolina is traditionally an active state for tornadoes and severe thunderstorms with tornado touchdowns and straight line winds causing severe damage in parts of the state this year. And whereas in 2025, the state experienced 16 tornadoes, 226 flood incidents, and 823 severe thunderstorms, some with damaging wind and hail. And whereas last year, the National Weather Service in North Carolina issued 37 tornado warnings, 682 severe thunderstorms warnings, and with an average warning time of 20 minutes. 143 flush flood warnings with an average warning time of 66 minutes. And whereas communities across the state have borne the impacts from wildfires, severe weather, damaging hail, high winds, and flooding, and whereas Haywood County continues to recover from tropical storms Fred and Helene, And whereas every community, business, family, and individual in Haywood County must be ready for natural and man-made disasters, including tornadoes, flooding, hurricanes, and public disturbances that might disrupt normal daily activities. And whereas all Haywood County residents can take a few simple steps, making a family disaster plan, creating an emergency supply kit, and staying informed to help make preparedness and personal responsibility a priority. And whereas Haywood County residents should know the risks for their area and plan accordingly. Whereas Haywood County residents should help the elderly and those who cannot help themselves. Whereas Haywood County residents should include the safety of their pets and or livestock in their emergency plans. And whereas Haywood County... North Carolina Emergency Management and the State of North Carolina have collaborated to recognize September as North Carolina Preparedness Month to encourage Haywood County residents to be disaster ready. Therefore, we proclaim that the month of September 2026 is Preparedness Month in Haywood County and encourage all county residents to plan and prepare weather-related and man-made disasters by assembling their emergency supply kits and updating their emergency plans. So to that effect, we've created a website called readyhaywood.com that we encourage everyone to visit. If you need tips on how to make those emergency supply kits or to make your family plans, there's lots of good information and free resources there.

Okay, thank you. I will say that when it comes to preparedness, our emergency management was definitely prepared and basically did everything I think probably the most prepared in Western North Carolina, I would say, because we saw the results of other counties, and it wasn't pretty. And although we had a lot of devastation, the loss of life was very minimal, I think, because of your preparedness and getting the word out. And the citizens, too. I think Fred helped us to heed those warnings because it was fresh in our mind. But still, when I was at the EMS, I guess you could call it, during Helene, it continued because they were ready to do it. They were prepared, if you will. Does anybody else have anything?

Somebody said after the hurricane that that would be something that, you know, it's like when you get married and it was before you were married and after you were married, or when you have a child, it was before you had children or after you had children, that all of us would say, would use that as a bookmark or a benchmark for our lives locally. And I think that's true. And it is nice for you to be here, again, bringing awareness on a beautiful day with lots of blue sky and just a few clouds in the sky. It is good to feel like we are better prepared. We're never in control of things like this for sure. So I appreciate the work you do and that our folks in the county do.

I think that preparedness helps us feel less afraid of what might come because we're ready.

That's right. It's a shame we have that experience, but I guess we're thankful that we do.

That's true.

Okay.

Thank you, Allison, for coming. I mean, as we're talking about preparedness, that's something I'd like to reiterate and encourage all of our constituents to do. You know, just as we were prepared, as Chairman pointed out, as a county, Everyone needs to be prepared, as mentioned in this resolution, you know, be prepared for, you know, food, water, days without power, you know, have the supplies on hand to be able to survive and have enough to where you can even help your elderly grandparents, neighbors, whoever they are. So I think it's important coming up on hurricane season again that this resolution is fitting and just as a reminder to be prepared. So thank you for this.

Anybody else? Okay. I'll entertain a motion. We approve item three of the regular agenda. So moved. Is there a second? Any other discussion? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any one opposed? Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. Appreciate all you're doing. Okay. We've got under appointments is the next order of business. We have a request of approval of a reappointment of Richard Gold to a second three-year term on the Library Board of Trustees.

I say this every time. He runs an amazing meeting. He's efficient. He hears us all out. He's very kind, great leadership. And the Library Board of Trustees, they are very grateful for the service that you do there and the good job that you do. We appreciate you. So I'll make that motion that we reappoint him for another three years.

Second. Okay. All in favor say aye. Aye. That's unanimous.

And I also want to say the first time I met Richard, you know, I didn't run for re-election, so now I can say these things. But the first time I met him, he scared me. He was mad at me over pickleball. But we resolved those issues, and we're friends now.

And he was right, too, wasn't he? Yeah, he was. Okay. Okay. Okay, we'll move on to item two, which is to request approval of an appointment of Jeremy Inman and Preston Gregg to a four-year term on the Haywood County Sediment Control Board. Do you need to say anything? Okay. We just had a couple openings, and these fellows have been asked to fill those. So can we have a motion to approve those two?

I'll make that motion. Okay.

Is there a second? Second. Second. Okay. All in favor say aye. Aye. Okay. That's unanimous. Next order of business is a closed session per North Carolina General Statute 143-381.11a5, acquisition of real property. So can I have a motion to go into closed session? Okay. Is there a second? Second. Okay, all in favor say aye. Aye. Okay, we'll be in closed session when we enter the chambers in the back.

Mr. Chairman, before we go to closed session, I'd like to make one comment before everybody leaves. There's a gentleman sitting in the far left corner back there that showed an act of kindness during our meeting. He helped some gentleman out the door. And, young man, I appreciate your act of kindness. In a meeting like today, I really like to see people working together and helping each other in Haywood County. And that didn't go unnoticed.

All right. We'll be in closed session when we get back there. Okay, we've returned from closed session. Anything else before the board today? Okay, hearing none, I'll entertain a motion. We adjourn.

I'd like a motion to adjourn.

Okay, all in favor say aye. Aye. Okay.