Council Budget and Finance Committee - Regular Meeting

Good evening, everybody. Today is Wednesday, 05/21/2025. This is the council budget finance committee. It is five, thirty two PM, and I like to, welcome everyone. First, I'd to call the meeting to order, and I'd like to have miss Hatfield to please take roll.

Present.

Present. Thank

you.

Thank you. So we do have quorum. Next, we have, public comment. This is reserved for anybody in the public that would like to make a public comment on something that is not on the agenda. I don't see anyone online. I don't have anyone in the room that would like to make a public comment. So I'll close public comment. Move on to next item, which is, approval of minutes. I'll move by council member, seconded by council member, There are no objections. There's nothing else.

Thank you. Moving on to our, item number two, which is reports and action items since the trans transient occupancy tax review. And I believe our finance director, Sherif, will kick this off. But, if I am not mistaken, I believe, this is, this is an extension of the conversation that we had as the outcome of our council meeting where, I believe the, there was a lot of discussion focused around, the appropriateness of, hiking the the TOT tax. I know there was a lot of discussion around, you know, 12%, 14%, and then there was the excise tax element to here and so forth.

So, with that said, mister Etherin?

Thank you very much, mayor.

Good evening. In can you show that conversation, mayor, as you know, going back to January, the the council budget finance committee met and we left off was is to recommend someone between the ten and twelve. Then I carried through the council meeting meeting. We have that presentation, so I don't have any present Yeah.

Good. That's what I'm with.

We did go back. We obviously heard from the hotel here at that night. Yeah. Consideration moving forward. So we do have a an adjusted recommendation for the committee and for council. And to quickly just go over some of the actions, one of the first things wanted to highlight was if you go to daily review of the report three zero five. You can see the compare comparison of current QT rate. One of the questions from Council was to see kind of where we stand across the board and to see if we were required. Don't know why based on if someone else has an excise tax on or some side some sort of other tax added on to their TOC. So you can see with the current 10 and a half percent, which we clearly do not we're nowhere near the top as far as that stands.

If you add the excise tax, it would still be in the middle of the pack, if you will. And so that's where we stand as far as the all in when a guest stays in the hotel with the tax rate. It gives us a first comparison. The second piece, I wanted to talk to your attention. Was a question of what would the increase look like for council's mindset as far as dollars.

And for every 1%, you would increase the TOT. It's about $240,000 in annual revenue. So a 3% would be $740,000 increase. And so just keep that in mind as you as we're as we're talking. As staff look at the input from the hoteliers, input from council, pieces, basically, what we wanted to do was not stand out as a as a city compared to other cities per se.

Be in line with the other cities, but also not leave revenue on the table. So the recommendation tonight for discussion is that we could go to 12%. So if you raise it from eight and a half to 12 with your excise tax, that puts us at 14%, which is basically in line with others and not as far as going up to the 16 too high now based on all those discussions. With the added piece of we don't wanna lose revenue at the same time. So the excise tax is set to sunset in fiscal year twenty seven, twenty eight.

And so the recommendation from staff is to do a 14% all in, a 12% increase in TOT this fiscal year. And in fiscal year twenty eight, have an automatic 2% increase, so you keep that revenue moving forward. So Moving 12%. This fiscal year, July 1. And then when the excise tax expires, you have an automatic 2% increase, you're not actually losing as you move forward. So that's basically the Mhmm. The report.

I a a question I was I wanted to ask is is it a normal practice in in you know, I'm and I'm I guess I'm looking at sort of the economic development side of this, sort of the business side of hotels. Is it a common practice for hotels to increase increase prices to prepare for big events? Right? I mean, do they you know, do hotel prices you know, if they know, like, a Super Bowl or a World Cup is coming

You know?

Will next year, they'll raise their rates, you know, particularly, like, if we're near an airport? You know? Do you know if if I mean, is that

sort I think you'll definitely see a a a a rate increase, and, obviously, we're in on demand Mhmm. And based on other places. And so I know literally hotels will call each other. They actually have an open network where they call each other and ask for their room rate, the rack rate. Mhmm. So as you have those events, their room rates will certainly be. And we put in a small factor in here to account for the Super Bowl for the World Cup and different pieces if it was to occur. However, at the same time, you're looking at them, right, where folks might stay. So it's not gonna be something that's at a 100% occupancy for very long. So we didn't provide a small factor in there. But we certainly don't want to lose the revenue to keep the TOT rate too low. You're not capturing the potential revenue that's coming in. So kinda find trying to find that sweet spot.

Yeah. And and and the only way I and the only reason why the only reason why I bring the only reason why I say that is because, you know, I don't want I don't want you know, I don't wanna leave money on the table, so to speak. Right?

And I

think I mean, I don't wanna come across, like, we're we're price gouging either. And and I you know? But I also I mean, I'm looking at, you know, the I mean, mean, San Leandro is 14%. I mean, you know, why do people go to San Leandro?

I'm gonna get your tongue in on. It's a lovely city.

Yeah. It's a beautiful city. I mean,

I love you know?

You know? So I anyways, I guess, anyway, I'm just thinking out loud. The second so let me ask the second point of question. Second question I have is, you know, I know we had a lot of hoteliers, show up the other day. And did they did we notify them that we're gonna have this conversation? Can we reach out to them or anything, We

don't think we put a special notice for CBFC. We do definitely, points for a council meeting.

Yeah. True.

That's good. Okay. Okay. So just to

be clear, we're we're talking about a total all in of 14.5 with this 12% box. We're at 8 0.5 currently. Are you recommending that?

We're recommending we go to twelve. We're not 12 or five. With the 2% x. So even even 12 with the Got it. Okay. So it'll 14.

Okay. So it'll match San Leandro would match. Understood. So we'll be at 14 flat. Okay. Just one would be okay. Yeah. And

Right. Questions. Okay.

We're still exercising the the right to go up to.

Mhmm.

Fourteen and twelve wants to excise tax.

Yeah.

Sunset. Five. Okay.

So so the will be left with

So we're gonna be at twelve, and then and so wait fourteen. So if we wanna go up to fourteen, it'll be sixteen.

No. So we're gonna wait for the excise tax to sunset. Okay. So it stays at so the TOT stays at I see. I see. So as a consumer, you're a $100, you're paying your 40% tax no matter what. So that won't increase.

Okay. The other thing that I would I would suggest when this comes back to us is it doesn't have to be in here, but maybe a a slide, on, on the on the PowerPoint, you know, as accurate as possible, sort of a real time hotel price. Like, how much is, you know, the Fairmont or the Fairfield in? Let's get a let's get you know, how much are we talking about? I know last time we asked I forget who it was that asked, but, like, know, how much does it cost to stay, say,

at the

Fairfield? And, you know, and see what it costs. Is it $16?

Is isn't that what the suite is?

Yeah. It's interesting. Yeah. Well

yeah. So I so I have a question about occupancy rates. Were you able to sort of verify what your occupancy rates are throughout the course of the year? You know, is it, like, 80%, percent, 90%? I know we can

through the the receipts that we receive. I'm looking to the analysts to see, but we basically it's passive. Right? So you get your your money. You can clearly see if the if the occupancy rate increased.

So there's a way of There's

a way of checking. Yeah. Okay. And occupancy rates are public. Can call.

Oh, really? They call each other.

They call each other. Personally used to work for the Hilton, and I used I used to call Hilton. Yes. So you literally call your your competitors, and they would give you the right rate and talk to your agency. Oh,

I'm just remembering where

I got

the 12.5.

Is that

right, Mike? Yeah. When we were looking at the first pass of the budget, we had budgeted in 12.5%. So that means the deficit that we're looking at is gonna be not 12.6, but maybe 12.7 now if we're not

It'll change slightly. Okay. There's it's it's still squishy. Okay. This year's a little bit softer than the year before as

far as

it fells well. Then you have a little bit of bump for, you know, Super Bowl or

Mhmm.

Where it competes. So I I think it's it's marginal Okay. At best. Okay.

You know, I I hope, you know, you know, we'll bring this up at the next, economic development. And but, you know, you know, next year is gonna be a big year. And, you know, I wanna I wanna you know, over the weekend, I was thinking about, putting together a committee of the the hundred and fiftieth year anniversary committee for the city of Hayward. But in addition to all that, but I was also thinking about, you know, next year's a big year. I mean, there's, you know, Super Bowl, World Cup.

I mean, there's, you know, you know, other you know you know, there's street parties. There you know, there's all these events that happen in Hayward or around Hayward that I hope that, you know, economic development and and perhaps the e team starts to really think about, you know, how can we capture as much of that, you know, revenue as possible. You know? I mean, you know, how should we you know you know, one missed opportunity that I see all the time,

and I'm not not being honest with you. Maybe it goes

with my very You know? Like, every restaurant in Downtown Hayward every restaurant in Hayward right now should have a sign that says, celebrate your graduation here. You know? I mean, that should be, you know, that should be a full court press in May and June, you know, in the city of Hayward. But, you know, I guess my point is I'm trying to say is that we should, you know, we should make it a discussion on what is our full court press plan to capture as much of this, you know, potential revenue that's gonna be coming through our city in the next year. This next year is gonna be pretty active.

Mhmm.

You know, just all over the Bay Area. And, things, you know, I just I just don't wanna lose that opportunity.

Yeah. Absolutely.

So, Tom, do you wanna move that? Sure. Do you wanna The recommendation or counsel to go with that recommendation?

Yeah. 12%.

12%. Okay. Sounds good. Thank you. Okay. Do have one more? And the the intent is to have this go on June 3. Mhmm. So it'll be the same same day as the budget. Just I'm sorry. June 10, which segues into overnight. So this will go on the same day as the budget discussion. And it'll be effective one, July 1. That, I think we need to talk about because it may not be enough time given the fact that you're talking a couple weeks from the telerich. Maybe it's August 1. I'm sorry about that. I can double check. And I'm in the works with meeting with Lisa Lopez. Lucy. Lucy.

Thank you. Now looking to meet with miss Lopez from the chamber to be able to discuss this as well, so can come up with that recommendation.

You know, the other thing too, you know, perhaps, you know, maybe another sort of way that we can, you know, buffer the blow, to the hoteliers is, you know, what can we do what can we do to really encourage, you know, people to stay at at at at hotels in the city of Hayward? I mean, how can we how can we support that that sort of effort? You know? I mean, I, they're gonna, you know, they're gonna they're gonna say, you know, this is gonna impact their business. Yeah.

But if we keep but if they have continued to have business, right, I no. They won't you know, the blow may not, you know, be that much. You know, maybe a conversation in the chamber within the chamber would be, you know, what's how can we sort of support their work in making sure that their hotels are consistent filled. You know? I don't know what that looks like.

Maybe that's it. I I kinda made a joke about Expedia, but, you know, I think when I travel, you know, I look at travel sites to find available

Mhmm.

Hotels. And and I guess I wondered to what extent are they competitive in making themselves sort of, like, available on on travel sites?

They're pretty available. I was looking at them. I I looked them up last Tuesday when this discussion came up. I I think the problem is people just aren't staying anywhere early ever since the occupancy is Yeah. I don't know why.

But And you mentioned it before, man. And we talked about there's other things that I'm not speaking on finance related stuff. The hotels just, you know, ensuring the hotel is safe. It's clean. So Mhmm. You know, the area is safe around them. Those things that you mentioned. There's some hotels that are dedicated to, you know, motel vouchers and things that might not attract folks from the outside. There's other total, you know, stuff where it's a lot of that's economic development and marketing. So we need even our

even our hotels are in the airport at two suites. Like, their occupancy is stated. It's good, but it's not like I mean, they always have vacancies. Right. You know? So and that's a very good place and neighborhood. Right. So I mean, but it's not really in the middle of downtown or anything. I mean, it's kind of

in the outskirts. So

who knows? I I was I was, at a local eatery, and I was, ear hustling a couple talking, and, they didn't, they didn't have a very glowing review of the new hotel that was built on on Mission Boulevard. And it wasn't because they were staying there, but it was because of the you know, they're not done with it yet. Right. So there's a fence and the, you know, the fence still has part hanging on it or you know?

And they they they they weren't sure if it was still open or if it was open or not, and and they just said it it just looked janky and, you know, it was I was I didn't say nothing, but I was I was just listening to what they were saying. And, you know, part of it is, yeah, it's economic development. They they gotta get the I don't know what it's I know there's something about the canopy that they they're they're finding a part or something that they gotta fix that canopy. That's the last remaining issue, but, it's taken time, and, you know, it is what it is.

Can we clarify the budget schedule? Because right now, it's showing as, being approved on June 3.

Yeah.

I don't think it's gonna be ready.

Yeah.

An unscheduled Tuesday, and that's why there was polling. You're traveling on June 3. Yeah. Even if it were ready. So June 10?

Yeah. June Which actually segues to the next agenda. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. I might have to be.

Okay.

So we'll take your recommendation, bring that back to the council, and then we'll go to the next item.

And I'll have the slide of the example of what was out. A $100 is right now, you're paying 10 you're paying $10 on 10 on $100,100 dollars. Right? This would be expire for $5. So I believe the next item on the agenda is budget.

Yeah. Budget's get the schedule. The the budget work session.

Oh, how was that? So the budget work session that we have with council, I don't recall, We have been debriefing our staff, obviously, given also the events of last night and the leadership change and different pieces. We wanted to have time to debrief ourselves and make that team and with active city manager with Lawson to be able to come up with next recommendations moving forward. And given the fact that you are out of town, we wanted to capture the mayor meetings as well. So the recommendation was to move the budget presentation from June 3 to June 10 to give us a little bit of wiggle room to come back with some more recommendations.

And it was clearly stated in the work session as you all know what is. Thank you for presenting the budget. Thank you for showing the $12,500,000 deficit. But what's next? What's the next plan? What are you gonna what's gonna happen between now and June?

It's got fall. That's what we're saying.

We're not over and over. That's obviously that's the biggest piece. So given the changes from last night, what we're also going to do is going to be very quickly in short order next week and on exactly multiple times and to be able to come up with a plan, if you will, and a recommendation to counsel to show Here's what we're working on now. Here's what we can change in the budget tomorrow. Here's what we can do in three months.

Here's what we're gonna see in September or October. Right? To be to have more concrete information for for council. So with the June 10 recommendation, obviously, still gives you room that if we do need to come back for whatever reason, come back on seventeenth or the twenty fourth, if the lift is too heavy or not too heavy. But what we're looking at when we talk about finance is the budget book is basically done, And it's it's a big book and it takes a long time together. So basically, what we would do is recommend having an addendum to the books. So and as we were talking to you through, we have our budget book budget book almost, you know, it's printed and done. We could have a new budget message that's updated. And then at the same time, we can have an addendum. And then as we're talking through, you can have a fall addendum.

You can have a March addendum. Right? You stack it on top of the the budget book, if you will. And then we can adjust the budget book, but that takes a lot of time. So theoretically speaking, if we come back and say we recommended on going to save $500,000 on it, we can implement that. And then as it goes into the detail of the book, that will take longer. So it's kind of our thought process for the next couple of weeks on the budget to be able to talk things through and the exact team identifying what are some of the savings we can have now, a month from now, and then also in the fall. And actually come up with a schedule to say in September here, things that will be looked at. Here's what's October's gonna look like. But it's it's an it's an active breathing breathing process.

There's no magical June 3, we're gonna come back with millions of dollars on June 10, nor on the fall we advise we're coming with some magic silver bullet. I think it's in in bite sized pieces. Well, but the most important thing was hearing that there's progress being made towards the $12,000,000 because having a budget deficit of $12,000,000 in the line of services. That's the thing I'm I'm sure council wants to see.

Okay. Let me share that in the executive meeting this morning where we did talk about the budget and the challenges on the meeting schedule of June 30 that just the whole atmosphere in the room felt different. There was much more engagement, much more collaboration, looking for fixes. And I I appreciated that there was I wouldn't call it genuine excitement, but, there was very definitely a very fresh and engaging. I think adjusting the schedule is gonna be good in terms of so we'll come back with for possible adoption on June 10.

But if it went over to June 17, you know, we've got that flexibility kinda built in. Thanks

for the update. I understand why I wanted to move it to June 10. Before we had talked about, changing our coverage to realize potentially a million dollars in savings, is there any way that we can approve a budget that incorporates those savings, for example, or projects to recoup those savings? I I would hate to see the next version of the budget. I just know real see if there are other things that we can factor in our budget for us that we're proving maybe is now about $11,000,000 deficits, about $12,600,000.

So that's that's our intent. We I mean, we were, you know, Yeah. Spitballing numbers.

Yeah.

But the goal would if it if it's twelve point six today, the goal would come back at eleven or ten. Okay. Something to show movement and using the analogy of the ship.

Yes. Yes.

That the ship is course correcting. Right? And so you would expect that if it goes from twelve to eleven to ten, then the fall would

be Yes.

Nine or eight or ten. So it's kind of showing that trajectory. So we're gonna be in as we even come back a I fully expect a a different number.

Yeah. And and really what you the timelines around the world is. Is is that possible? I mean Yes. And then for the addendum, just wanted to clarify that part of it. So you're saying rather than producing an entirely new budget book, which I I understand the print version, it can be difficult to wrestle with. Why not just update the the digital version? Are you are or you wanna do a track change and get and then that's why you want

No. Keep in mind, like, the budget book is is a digital

Yeah.

Copy of three systems I see. Altogether.

I see. And so let's say we say we're

gonna save I'll make it up. We're gonna save a $100,000 and over. Yeah. But it's 10 in each department.

I see. There's 10 different lines and 10 in three different programs Mhmm.

That come back together, then you regroup everything together. Right? So becomes much more complicated for the actual book to be done. Yeah. As opposed to cancel each we walk away saying we saved, you know, a $100,000 Yeah. Or $10,000. But the book itself becomes more fun. I see. Doesn't mean that in July or August, almost like, maybe in August, you come up with a different book. That's totally fine. Yeah. But as we were talking about, like, the budget for June 3 is due

today. Understood.

Right? And so the the idea is here's an addendum to the foot. Right? So that's resident Yeah. Council or residents. Oh, these are the changes they've made Yeah. Since the budget book. Yeah. Then update the book.

Yeah. Through the full.

So by the time we get to the full revise, we'll be not Okay.

That's that's that's a thought

process. I understand it. The most user friendly. Yeah. And it gives us more time to focus on the budget rather than the the book itself.

Yeah. Okay.

Okay. That's it. Thanks. Thank you. Thank

you. So a couple of questions. First is, can we revise the the memo before it comes back to council? Absolutely. The message message will be updated. Okay.

And then Yeah.

Can you figure out that whole homelessness?

Yeah.

That that's already that's being so two things that council member that are gonna be adjusted as of today is that 1% homeless number piece, the TOT. Because a little blurb on the TOT will now say staff recommends 12%. Right? And we'll update that. So we can certainly make any other adjustments.

Just real quick. And who's gonna be who who will author that message? Would it be? Michael? Acting

I think that's up to counsel. I think it make it would make sense to have you know, we're sitting right here. Okay. On that that piece, we cut also with the June 3, June 10, the budget message is due today. Mhmm. Right? So we wouldn't be able to make any changes that we would have to post it for the public. So giving us the June 10 is small. We'll over

to the seventh. Just to follow on your question, what is the number from the county? What is the right number from the county?

I don't know. Okay. Do you know

I think that's something that you might be able

to buy.

Okay. So we'll see when it comes.

Well, and I think that number is still being don't think that

makes sense.

The issue is that the

issue is we don't know not clean on either side. So I have looked at the numbers from the county because, I mean, it's public information from the CFC. Right? And it's it is what it is. But, anyways, I don't wanna get into all of that. So next thing is I'm actually fine with this tenth thing, but I'm actually even more okay with the seventeenth if we can find a way to come back with budget reductions. Right? So, I mean, if if we were to come back on the tenth and say, hey. We're on the cusp of, like, you know, identifying $2,000,000 more to come back on this. Like, I really want us to spend these next few weeks, like, addressing the budget with the urgency that it needs to be addressed with to find more than $2,000,000.

I mean, when I was thinking about the size of this budget for us to not be able to find 3 or $4,000,000 would probably you know, we I think there's opportunity there on top of that 12,000,000. So I I I mean, I'm even uncomfortable. You know, I'll just be clear. Like, even $8,000,000 approving that much in the reserve makes me feel uncomfortable. So whatever we can do to really drive down any reserve ask, I think, is gonna make the whole council feel better, and it will make me feel better.

And then whatever that reserve ask is, seeing that burn down on how we're gonna go from 8,000,000 to 7,000,000 to whatever. Because if we don't my concern is if if we don't keep our eye on the ball with that and if we don't really realize these savings, like, can pin to paper. But if we don't realize that we're just gonna burn through that 12,000,000, and then we're gonna be in the starting position of our next budget of an 8% reserve, no one wants to be at. Right? So I just I appreciate, you know, what what you were saying about the staff coming together with sort of a renewed sense of urgency and purpose around the budget. K. And I'm just very hopeful that that momentum will continue over the next few weeks as we tackle. That's not really an issue.

But we might love having the flexibility of doing it on the seventeenth. Okay. If you if the mayor's absent on the third and you're remote on the tenth, I think we're having everybody in the same role at the same time, and even having a little bit more flexibility still gives us twenty fourth if necessary. I think so I think we can work with that if if if that's the direction.

I do also wanna caveat, because, Maribina, because I hear you, and I I certainly agree with that we do more. The the issue is the timing because keep in mind, 80% of what we do are salary benefits. So everything we do, if we're gonna do anything with salary benefits required especially for our union groups or labor groups, all the different pieces. And so it's not as fast as we might like. So for us to commit to over an overtime reduction or to a part time positions that we have or looking at all the things that we do or moving folks around from spot to spot, then that's something that can't be done in a week's time because it doesn't require those discussions with the other groups.

Right? And this is new for the the staff. It's also new for myself. It's new for actually, I give it the time because we already know what the other way around was. Go for $2,000,000 today. Let's do $3,000,000, and that doesn't

go. So there's that.

Yeah. I mean And I don't

have a solution either way, but I just want to kinda put that out there that, you even dealing with weeks' time, because it's such a large budget, there is room, but we kind of took that already. Everyone line by line by line. That was when I was presenting, talking about all those different levers that we can use. And so we've kind of run out of those. And so I certainly think we can we can make some significant progress. I still wanna get hung hung up on our number. And it might be I mean, it's

hard not to get up on I know.

Know. Talking about

So, like, I mean, I would love to not get hung up

on a number

either. But, I mean, that's my issue is I am hung up on the $12,000,000 in the survey. I appreciate what you're saying about this takes time, and that's why I think it would be helpful to understand what can be done in the next thirty days, what can be done in the next ninety days, and what be done in the next six months. Because if if if we're hopeful that some of these reduction strategies are gonna be reducing over time, quote, whatever whatever those are. Right? And they're gonna take six months to negotiate. That would be good to know so we know we're gonna burn through six months of that 12,000,000. Right? And we're not gonna be hopeless. And I think that that's what I'm really looking for is just that that pragmatic, you know, reset and ground data on.

We are gonna be looking at burning through four or five of this at least, and that's even with the best budget reduction strategies. You know? So it's like and then maybe worst case is we, you know, we we end up taking it, you know, 10 or 11. But I just think that that sort of but whatever you can do to help us see that a little bit more clearly over the

next few weeks, I think, would be helpful. Yeah. Definitely hear that.

Okay.

So

we're looking at the seventeenth? That's the recommendation from So if we if we if we do it on the seventeenth, so we won't meet, then there's no council meeting then on the tenth.

So think you're getting a poll from the city clerk. Okay. But that's not absolutely necessary. If we have the flexibility of doing the seventeenth when everybody's in the room, and that helps us do a little bit more work. Right. Right. Seventeenth is probably gonna be better Yeah. Than the third or the tenth.

That's so hard as you all know, because members, when you're doing the question, because you back up and you back up and you back up. I said, oh, it's due tomorrow or it's due next week. So or anything where I think about that to come up. Okay.

Got it. Yeah. Okay. Moving on to, a future agenda items, review and approve 2025, agenda.

We did make some shifts, mayor and council members, to the future planning agenda to the different pieces. Knowing that today, we were gonna talk about TOT, we did move some other items that were time sensitive to today to September and October to give us time, September and November. So for instance, the annual city benefit liability and funding plan that was on today's agenda for a while, we we moved that to September. Then also the investment portfolio review, because it does take time if we were to suggest a new provider with our fee process that we need time. So that will come back to this one within November.

Those are the two adjustments that we make moving forward, and then given obviously the the task of the budget. Is our contract expiring with our current provider?

Yes. Is that PM three?

Yeah. The PM. PMF? Yeah. It was going to council to extend the PFM contract Yeah. To one year, so time to do our RFP review.

Got it. Is is the Hayward Economic Development Corporation coming before the whole council, or should that happen here first?

That I don't know what the if it was either going straight to council or, here first.

Yeah. For the economic development.

Yeah. He would need to the executive manager, Youngblood, you know where that kinda left off.

I hear an economic development corporation. I just think it'd be good for us to have some discussion about what we're trying to do with it. So

there was a plan to meet ended up getting rescheduled, and now we have to. I haven't been involved in any of those conversations. So it it I think beneficial if we internally and still bring that.

36

time. Yeah. So, yeah, no. I I was working with just non transitional. I don't know how I have we have information, but I think that that's a question that I wasn't sure with what where we landed with on it. It was attended to as a full council or CVSC, but I think we should set that now because I do Yeah. My understanding wasn't just a priority. So Yeah. My understanding that it was coming to this

Okay. Sure. Okay. It's up to your discretion.

It sounds like a complex meeting. We got budget right now. So I'm I'm okay with it being after the recess. Is there a specific month you think would make sense? Or I guess

Well, I mean, why not in June if they already have the memo meetings?

Yeah. I think June the the only one thing that might come up is might be in a situation what is just some financial reporting Mhmm. But that would follow our fiscal year as well. So Yeah. But I I guess I'll we can I think we can bring my homework?

Given the lift that we have now, it's okay. This group of people could go come at September September with a full analysis. Okay. That makes sense as opposed to June, which is basically in a week or two.

Yeah. Okay. And then I would ask,

you know, the the this is not because it get too crowded. The measures to annual report, don't imagine that taking too long. I mean, do do you feel like it would be good to just do that in June, or do you do it at that time of

the year for a specific reason? I think it's time sensitive.

Oh, okay. I think it's it's done up.

So we're so good. We It's some I see. Okay. Yeah. No. I mean, sorry. The the measure c n.

I just

Well, we just see. If we're gonna do it

in September, I just wanna go and

get bump up to June. Okay.

That is, like, bite sized or

I can certainly take a look at it. I don't remember how many meetings get to go, I don't think it'll take much time. Alright. So k. So we'll add h HEVC to September.

Your insight on this, you know, to go back to the measure w issue, from the county, a lot of the a lot of the dust that is being kicked around that is, there's two issues, I think, around that. One issue is the allocation issue. But the other issue is before that, which is, how the county is collecting and where it's parking measure w dollars. And so, Mike, I guess the question I have is, do you do you have any insight as to because I know with us, measure c and k one, those dollars are parked in sort of general fund. Now measure w, will that be parked when it's parked in their general fund?

Supervisors wanna park it in general fund. I guess advocates want it separated, and and and they're making that they're making dust about account that supervisors parking it in the general fund, and they they feel that once it goes to the general fund, it's lost on the bigger list. So I guess the question I have is that, is it a general accounting practice to park measure dollars in general fund and or do counties, is it a practice where they can, in fact, park it in a defined spot where we can look at it and point to it? I guess that's I guess that's the question.

Well, I I guess I can say, you know, a measure fund is basically a general fund sales tax. So it could go into the general fund. What we've chosen to do with our measure c dollars here and k one probably going forward in the future is we have them in a different fund. Right? So we didn't put them directly in fund 100.

We have them in fund what is it, Nick? Four zero four. So one one hundred versus one zero one so that we can see it. While you could, know, forego what it said to the voters and use that money any way you wanted to because it is a general sales tax, we've chosen here in the city to keep The voting public said they wanted us to use the funds in the way that they wanted us to use it. So I think you can do it either way, but best practice would be to separate it out to keep your ability to

So so so the I guess the I guess we'll clarify. So I so, I see your point. And, you know, the county doing it, I mean, if you know you know, is that a is that an accepted practice? Should we be advocating for them not to do that, or or should we or would it be who was to advocate for them to do it?

I mean,

that's up to you. I mean, I think you all are in a position right now to advocate that they use the measured W. Dollars in the way that the voters did in one way to kind of be accountable for new people.

Right. What's the political way to say just because we can?

Yeah. No.

I don't know how to say that. Yeah. We certainly wanna keep the grant I mean, the major model.

And I'm not talking about us. For us, I wanna make it I I my concern is is, you know because I've been getting I've been getting calls around, in my ear bent on, on that issue. Their mayors up and down the county are are kicking dust about it. But, you know, as they're telling me, you you know, to take a position on it, I'm thinking, well, I'm thinking about our own the way we do it. And and I'm, you know, and I'm thinking, okay. You know, is it is the county doing it this way? Or you know? But, anyways, I guess that's something that

I can continue to research look into.

I think my question, I don't know if it's better for a June topic or an August topic, but our funding that's at threat because our sanctuary is. Right?

We have an EPA loan that's dealing with. Uh-huh.

We have some funds. I I I think we did receive a a visual a few weeks back on some of our exposure. I think it'd be good to have a more focused conversation about the financial liability of us, maintaining our sanctuary city status so we know what to prepare for because that's something that we're gonna potentially be faced with down the line.

We had multiple conversations today about teeing up policy discussions around federal executive orders. Mhmm. I believe that the Trump administration is gonna be publishing a list of sanctuary cities sometime this month, likely to be on I've been tracking executive order dollars, which are tied to DEI in compliance with immigration enforcement. There is multiple litigation, around the country that is sort of protecting us in the short term, but I don't think that we can trust the US Supreme Court to sort of uphold those lower decisions. And correct me if I'm wrong, the conversations I've had with Regina and Shree today, there isn't a backup plan in the budget if those funds were sort of intercepted, whether it's the 22,000,000 that's in play around federal funding for the 248,000,000 that's in the US EPA.

But I think the council so we've only got four meetings before. So there's not a lot of time to tee it up because of the budget and and other end of the year issues. But the council is deserving the opportunity to have policy level discussions about what's going on and how to respond around Sanctuary City and immigration Yeah. And budget theft. Yeah.

So that's that's really my point here is if there's not a backup plan yet, we need to have a discussion about Alright. I understand, unfortunately, that doesn't make any sense, but, maybe the the August date then,

I mean,

I just feel like we need to generate those numbers to have them all laid out before us so that we can either do it here or bring it before the full council without having the steps. Because if the floor falls out from beneath us and our deficit goes from, you know, 11 to 12,000,000 all of a sudden to, let's say, 30,000,000 because we don't have these funds, we should have a plan for that. We should I don't wanna be caught up against that. Does that sound reasonable? I just

I mean, it sounds reasonable, but, I mean I mean, you know, what if you know, we're gonna get caught with our hands down, our hands up.

Our hands wide don't we? We have to, like, go and sell city hall or something. Like, how you're prepared to do it

every day. The other mostly it's under

for one time project. Okay.

Well, we don't have, like, back full money. Yeah. The only fund that's for our operating budget was CGGB, which didn't work through. Yeah. So everything else would be that we would be, you know, not doing the bike, which at least horrible for you, but not doing the bike program.

Yeah.

And not doing some of our airport upgrade.

Yeah. And so it's not as though I don't it doesn't increase the operating

budget Okay. Gap. It just means less service.

Okay. Okay.

These will be

What's the number? Not a long you know, if they can find, you know, some that's What they want would want. Yeah. So we have some numbers that we know. It's just like yeah. But teaming up for policy discussions, I think, is what Okay. You really deserve it.

And and, not not next week, but the neck the June, I'll be in Washington, with the ACTC.

Mhmm.

And that's that is tomorrow, we're gonna be briefed on sort of our what our what our focus is, but, that is certainly gonna be that would certainly be on the agenda. Okay.

Okay. And then, you know, with the loan that's being withheld at

the moment, I mean, is

there any recourse at the state level to say, look. Can you tell the the the water board or whatever they have to re forcing us to begin this decision? Like, if we're not gonna get this money, I don't wanna, you know, triple the sewer rates of our our residents. Right? Because we need to get more bonds back, build the money that we were expecting from the. Somebody gets a a $150 water bill, right, or a sewer bill, like, we're out of here. All of us are out of here. So, I mean, what are your thoughts around, like, relief from that?

Those are some really good questions. Okay. I think that's my response. Okay. Because I don't think we know at the moment Yeah. What the tinnitus look like. Yeah. The walk. Okay.

Okay. Yeah. I would just like to begin the process

of those plans or figuring out what

that looks like, and what our plan beats are because

everybody needs to boil their water.

You joke, but I'm

is that is that a finance term?

Yeah. We're probably done a boil.

What do mean?

Just being that we would go out to the capital market for the money versus, you know, going to the EPA for it? We've actually had discussions with our because the rates are the same.

The only flexibility is you're Our asset managers. I know Alex has had that conversation with our asset fund managers. I've been in at least one of those conversations about looking at those alternatives and what that cost might look like long term long term borrowing interest cost if you were Yeah.

And then and then the other question I would ask is who who are we paying, and and what is their connection to the administration? Are we making the bridge? Is that what they want us to

do? Mhmm. So something to think about. That's to think about.

That's what I know. I mean, that's what's do force us to do

business with all these friends.

Okay. Is that it? Yep. Okay. Thank you. Mister Mullins, thank you. Miss Hatfield, thank you. Director Edmund, thank you. Thank you. And mister Lawson, thank you.

Okay.

Me and Jerry. Alright.

Thank you. Bye.