Parks and Recreation Committee - Regular Meeting

I'd like to call the October 6th meeting of the parks and recreation committee tree advisory board meeting and we'll start with the pledge of allegiance. Algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Okay, first thing up is the uh roll call. Gary Johnson here. Kathy Stiss, Mary Heinman here, Jennifer Mueller here, Thomas Byron here, Mike Abbott here, Jay Arens here. We have seven for the quorum. All right, thank you. Next up, approval of the minutes. You should all have a copy of those minutes in front of you. I'll make a motion to approve. Second. Okay, thank you. All in favor of approving the minutes as written, raise your right hand, say I. I. I.

The same thing. Minutes are approved. Thank you very much. Okay. Public comments. I have no public comments. All right. Thank you very much. Park and recreation committee uh committee meeting items. Old business discussion regarding a bid to move the Oldtown Pavilion. There's a memo out from Dan Howard this time. Dan, you with us?

Sorry about that. Um, yes, I did meet with the uh company that's that is willing to be able to move it. Uh they're reviewing the plans that we had when we originally constructed it uh to give us a price on what it would take to move it. Um we would have some utility or some oldtown street lights to remove or take down if it is decided to move it depending on the cost. Um but it is still in process.

All right. Any questions for Dan? I guess I had one. We uh we waited a long time to get some action on this and I don't know for sure all the alternatives. One is obviously leaving where the farmers market is now over in Fenton Park. I guess another one's moved back to where it came from with some additional parking and I I think one of the issues was they didn't have a restroom nearby. I'm not sure what all knocked them out of the race originally in addition to move moving it over to the block diagonally across the road from where that is now. But I wondered, do we know how much it would take and what all we might do to the existing location to make it acceptable? Um, with the existing location, the statements have been with the farmers market was that there's no restrooms. Um, and that there wasn't enough parking by the time the vendors showed up and they parked. There wasn't the size of the facility was fantastic, but it wasn't had the amenities they needed.

Okay. I think it's more of a flood plane down lower close more of a flood plane closer to the the creek where it's at now. Right. Okay. The Does the city not own all that property? The grass probably behind bluffs and could be turned into parking. We do. It's but it is in the flood way. So that's not acceptable for a parking lot. We could look into it, but it would it would not be uh easy or cheap um because of what we would have to do for MSD number one. And again, you're building in the flood way. Okay.

Yes. I guess the elevation just across the street is much higher. So that that's not in the flood plane. it it's uh not it is still in the flood plane but it's not in the flood way which they're very different when you look at flood plane development. Um Dan, do you want to speak to that?

I mean yes. Currently the existing location is in a flood way. Um when new maps come out it's going to put majority of 41 gravel where where it's being proposed to be moved to. is going to put pretty much that whole property in the flood plane, which is a lot less restrictive. Um, in order to construct uh a parking lot, restroom facilities, any type of amenities like that down at the existing location, we would have to go through engineering review, flood plane studies, uh, no right certificates, uh, so much involved just to do additional development than what's already down there. 41, there are still some restrictions, but not as restrictive. Um we would not have to meet a no-rise. Uh but there is still a flood review. It would have to take place if uh it is decided upon to explore further to actually remove or even construct a new facility, farmers market, pavilion, whatever you want to call it on 41 Gravoy. So even though we're not out of the woods by by developing that that piece of property, there are still hurdles to jump through. Okay. Seem seemed like there might be more traffic issues at the proposed location. It's uh got a lot of traffic goes through that light at one uh old 141 coming from business small business area. But uh I don't know. I guess we'll learn more about it as we get into it more. And there's there's no other suitable location that is under consideration then other than moving the building. Right now, we are still, and I apologize it's taking so long. Um, I called multiple companies that move buildings, and the company I'm working with is the

only one that was willing to even touch it. You're you're looking at a 45 ft wide by 120 foot long uh structure uh that they are actually requesting that we take off the leg the support posts um in order to not have to involve utilities to have utility lines dropped to have traffic signals basically taken down. Um what he's proposing is to yes we would have three or four oldtown street lights that would have to be taken down in the process of the move but um like I said we this has taken some time don't get me wrong and I do apologize for that but only having one company that is willing to look at this um I'm kind of at their mercy so you know we're doing what we can get the numbers together but now that we I finally had a chance to meet him on site he has a very clear understanding what we're looking for as far as a proposal. He has our plans. Um, and it's it's not going to happen overnight. I mean, this is something that if this is even something that the city wants to move forward with, uh, we're still a long way away from think about picking that building up and moving it. Yeah. Um, as stated in Dan's memo is one of the items that they would want to look at is removing the roof off the structure with the posts. And this was not a kit build. This was a stick build. So reviewing that, we would have to have a structural engineer involved to get a permit to even replace it to make sure the structural integrity would still be in place after the the posts are removed and then replaced. Mhm.

Um, in addition to that, we're looking into what it would have to take to remove the light standards and then have those replaced just to get it down the street. Yeah. And I think the cost of this pavilion at one time and it was done through a grant was um the overall cost was whatund I think around I want to say $110,000. That's that's correct. That's what I found. That was just for the pavilion. that was not for the concrete work, the peer work, the parking lot area, that was on top of just the structure itself. There's still a lot that would have to go into the idea, but I do believe that, you know, the commission had requested though, they just wanted some numbers on what it would take. We're doing everything we can to get some numbers put together.

Yeah.

I I have a question. Would it be more costefficient just to keep the farmers market at its current location, which has parking and a bathroom, and just build another pavilion there? Because the vendors often say that there's not enough vendor space there, but I just can't help think that that would you already have parking in place, you already have infrastructure there. Why would you could just build build a another pavilion there and you have two pavilions and you don't have to worry about putting in bathrooms and parking lots because you already have that existing. I I guess the question is if that was the main goal for 41 Gravway Road is to turn that into the farmers market. I mean, my suggestion would be and has been is that we would look at getting a applying for another planning grant like we did for Budweis and have a planner come in or we'll work with a company to do an overall site development of what we would want to do with 41 Grab Boy Road. And then if we go through that process, we can start applying for grants for the amenities that we want to do. I mean, it's my understanding talking with Emma, um, we do have some overflow of vendors at the current farmers market location, but, uh, nobody really complains. They've gotten, you know, used to set up their tents. We have some under pavilion. We have some that request to be on the parking lot just because of their setup and what they're selling. Um, I'm not sure that we have had an overrun of vendors at the current location that at this point has outgrown that location.

Um, but you know, the staff is just doing what has been requested of us to try to get some numbers and to get some, you know, stuff together for, you know, the park committee, for for the the board. And it has been tough. It has been tough to get somebody to give us numbers to move the current structure. Yeah. Well, I didn't mean to bog it down. We'll get some numbers where it's at and maybe we can think of there any other alternatives, but sounds like there's not going to be anything cheaper maybe. Well, anyhow, any other discussion on that point? All right, let's finish uh what we started here on old business and then I think we have a request for a speaker. Is that right? Yeah. Okay. So, we got one more item on old business to get through here. The park for would you rather just jump to the speaker? Guess we don't have to stick with old business

in regard to anything on the agenda.

Yeah, the farmer farmers market. So, maybe it's more appropriate to hear that now. that. All right. Okay. Got a Marlin. Is that right? Yep. If you would come on over to the microphone, state your name and address, please. Marlon Mley, 509 Main Street and Oldtown Fenton. If two points, one that just hit me when you were talking about the existing farmers market pavilion. I've gone to those just to watch and see how traffic flowed and where the vendors set up and all. And I think the fact that several vendors are outside of the pavilion under their own canopies actually adds interest from the walking up potential customer perspective. It broadens his perspective as viewed from the parking lot, especially with the with the the one guy sitting there popping popcorn the whole time. So, that's just one thing. But, um, on the subject of moving the old farmers market facility, and as much as that's a pain in the butt, I've I've been in on Oldtown Fittton for 37 years, half my life, and I've wished all along to try to figure out ways to what's right, jolly up the neighborhood, maybe do art fairs and things like that. and we think, "Okay, let's have a let's have a flea market on Main Street, close Main Street." Well, the thing that pops in up instantly is no parking, and you got no way to park when you do that. But when when when I heard the first idea of moving that farmers market pavilion to that lot across from Joe Clark's, you look at it, that Main Street dead ends to where that'll wind up approximately. and to have a big pavilion there with adequate parking and restrooms, which I gather was the big headache with where

the one is now. That would that would be a major plus plus to the possibility of doing something interesting in Oldtown. I'm not saying it's worth the money. It sounds like it's going to be a crazy expensive thing. Um there are ways to engineer it. It's just a matter of getting the right people and what fits the rules. I suppose if you ever decide to set up a a committee to discuss it, by all means ask me because I'll be glad to sit on it. That's I guess that's all I had. Thanks. That's an interesting prospect. So, appreciate the input. Thanks very much, Marlin. Uh we'll go back to our original agenda here. Discussion regarding park projects for the 2026 budget. There's a memo out from Nikki.

Um, this is the revised information as discussed at the meeting last month. Um, the items in red. I'm just asking for if there's anything additional you'd want to add or any amendments to this. Um, or else we can go ahead and because it would need to go to the committee meeting this month, the board to review. I I do have one question and this this might be a question that Dan can answer. Um when I was down looking at Heroes Memorial, I was going to wait and mention this in the parks report, but since we're talking about budget, I don't know the cost and whether it would need to be added as a line item. I did there were people on the basketball court and they were commenting about the lack of paint on the basketball court. all of the per se basketball insignia and everything, free throw lines, things like that have pretty much faded out um on them. So, I didn't know if that might be something that we needed to add. I don't know the cost of something like that.

I I think the cost on that, Dan, would be minimal painting or it would be minimal. It's just staff time to be able to get it laid out and get it painted. Yeah. So, it's not necessarily a capital item that would just be done under our general budget, operating budget. I yeah I I understand but I just wanted to make sure

and I believe we are also looking at capital next year to take care of some drainage issues uh that are currently on the basketball court. So I really want to jump ahead and start doing a lot of striping just to uh do an overlay or do whatever we decide to do with the greatest concerns on the basketball court. Well, everybody had time to look this over. You got any new items for consideration?

I guess seeing none, then we'll go ahead and have a motion to I'm sorry. Go ahead. I'm good with how it's presented. Need a motion then to go ahead and approve this. make a motion to approve the the park plan. Okay, I'll second that. All in favor of the park capital plan as written, raise the right hand say I. I. I.

Opposed? Nay. None. Pass. Thank you very much everybody. So then that goes to the board alersman's next meeting I guess. Yep. Okay. Good. Uh new business. Boy, this will be a good one here. Consideration of amendments to chapter 220 public parks, city municipal code, etc. here by Nikki. This is the electric and motorized bike, etc. We do have we have um officer Aaron Dilks here, who's our neighborhood officer, but officer Yuzi, who's our parks officer, came in on his time off so that he could discuss this with us because he's got since he's in the park.

Yeah. So, good. Just

thank you guys. Um, just to kind of kick off this information is that we've been reviewing the parks code. Um, we've had a lot of complaints, concerns about electric motorized, and I want to be very specific in this. There is a difference between electric bicycles and motorized bicycles. If you review the information that was provided, um, they they are very different even under state statute and how they're regulated. Um, we've had a lot of concerns, not just with that, but motorized skateboards, scooters, and other types of uh, vehicles on our paths. The way our current code reads is no, motorized vehicles of any form are to be on our paths. That can be just very simple to say that. But then what was brought to my attention by the parks officer is that we do have residents that use these um I guess motorized uh bic these electric bicycles that help them it helps them uh with their self-propelling um to provide for additional exercise. So really the first question is is do you even want to entertain allowing motorized or electric bicycles I think is what we're going to stay with. I don't think anybody has the desire to put motorized vehicles onto our park pads. Um but the electric bicycles if you do have a desire to do that what restrictions would be provided? Um even if if you want to dive deep into it with the electric bikes there's different levels. There's levels one, two, and three. However, you always have to think about a code. You have to think about an enforcement issue from an officer, from staff. Is that are you going to be able to look at that bike close enough to go, "Oh, that's a level one or that's a level two." We're not. So, to me, it's all or none for enforcement reasons.

The next question is then, okay, if we do allow it, they have to meet all the same restrictions by state as far as safety requirements, all of those items. But then do you want to put a speed limit? Um, this is very new to communities. A lot of other communities are still diving into this. The most recent adoption that I did see is the city of Alvette. They they're allowing for all of them. I was a little surprised. Um, but and they're with a cap of I believe 20 miles per hour. Our typical cap in our park is 15. So that's what we placed in there. Again, staff is not saying that this is our full recommendation. And what we're I'm just starting the conversation to give you something to look at. But I would like the reason we asked officer Yanuzi to be here is he's in the parks day in and day out. He interacts with the people that use the parks. And again, I don't think we want to do anything that would um somebody say, "But you know, I just use this to help me self-propel." Uh we wanted to make sure I mean that could be the answer. this commi this committee could say no guys we don't want to see any of those in you know on our paths and that's the answer and we can just amend our code to be a little more um to where we do address the electric bikes and the motorized bikes by by stating that they are banned within it and we do have the right to do that we can ban those but I guess the first question starting with is do you want to look at either banning them or allowing them and if so at what level and that's why we've asked officer Yanuzi because he's the one that can say this is what I see in your parks.

Mhm. All right. That's I think that's the next part of we need to find out from officer Yunuzi exactly what he's seeing down there on the daily. Yeah. Right. And officer, are you to act in a make a recommendation capacity or are you just going to provide some facts and comments? Good evening. Uh I'm Officer Yanuzi. At this point, I'm more apt to answer any questions that you have. Um, you know, from from a strict perspective, I'm a police officer with the St. Louis County Police Department. It's not really my purview provide a direct recommendation, but I can provide insight. Mhm.

Well, I and looking quickly over the information, it seemed like they it came out 15 miles per hour seemed reasonable from the way the papers were kind of stating it in my mind. I don't know how fast they're going. We had a couple older gentlemen who you think maybe were using these cuz they couldn't get around, but that wasn't the case. But they they blew by us. We were over in Sunset Hills, the park just across the river, and I bet they're going 30 or 35, and it was like, man, I know 15's a lot less, but I I might consider Well, I guess we have to decide. I might consider something 10 or below. That's like most people riding a bike can go 10 miles an hour. If you're a teenager, you know, or you bike a lot, you might get to 15 or higher than that even, but 10 shouldn't threaten anybody. We were walking dogs, you know, and it scared the dogs so much. What What would happen if a dog jumped out front of them and they were probably 50 or over. I don't know why they were going that fast. That was just my thoughts on the surface. Consider it maybe at a lower speed with an honor system. I don't know how how you monitor it and enforce it exactly, but you can tell a lot difference between 10 and 20 miles an hour at least. Anybody else?

Have you had any negative experiences with the motorized electric bikes?

Well, in in the city of Fent, we typically we really have like three types of users of electric bicycles or electric vehicles park system. The the first group, and this is probably the majority, are older residents or older non-residents in the nearby area that are using electric assisted bicycles to help them in their getting around fitness where they typically wouldn't be able to ride a bike otherwise. Uh the second group of individuals that I'm seeing in a routine basis, this is actually starting to grow a little bit, are some folks that are actually commuting to the industrial park on both sides of the highway from typically south of Fenton and going through the parks using electric assisted bicycles. And then the third group uh is youths using electric bicycles, but more to the point other devices who the Razor scooters, the uh what's what's the word? um various devices that have no sort of propulsion other than the electric propulsion and uh those individuals tend to if you will cause the most consternation amongst the other residents or people using the paths at that time. Um we don't see a lot of the older residents or the the commuters blowing the doors off so to speak uh people on the pathways. Usually it's young kids and that's kind of what young kids do. So from my perspective, that's that's what we're seeing.

And and what's being proposed this evening would be still banning those types of within the park um with on our in our paths. Um it it's not to say that we can't stop them from being on the streets and other places. They have the right, but it it keeps them off the pads, the recreational paths. Um, the other thing to look at is that within here it states that if they are used, the electric bikes are used, and again only the electric bicycles, they must be on a paved path. They can't be on our our nature trails and other places. It has to be a paved surface within the park.

I don't know if we're looking for consistency um because we're part of the Green Wig Trail, but I think their current policy is class one ebikes only. and I can contact them for clarification. I think the I think the issue with that is and again we can put that in here. Um it's that when you're looking at and those are you know those are limited to a speed of 20 m hour. Um, but again, we can look at a we can look at a speed and understand he's not going to be out there with his radar gun saying it it's going to be based on common sense, but it does remind the users that you need to keep it at a slower pace when you're in our park. Um, but I mean we can look at the greenway. Um, actually I did mean to contact them about this because we are part of the greenway. However, um also we do have the, you know, general regulations over the city. But I will tell you, I see I see those razors on their greenways. You see, especially in the Crestwood area, crossing over. Okay. Other thoughts? Anyone?

Yeah, I had some thoughts on some of these markups. Um, section 22 under 150. Um, I like that it it talks about removing that, but I like that it has no bicycling after dark. There's even a pedal bicycle, you know, some of the corners or walkers and dark clothing. It could be a problem or low hanging branches that they don't see. So, if you remove that, if that could be fit in somewhere else. Okay.

And um discussion about removing the uh 20220.090 090 camping prohibited um because of park hours. Yes. So, you know, if if you remove that section, if the police come across somebody in a tent at 9:00 a.m. surrounded by 24 empty beer cans, you know, there's they're there during the time. They can't don't have a would they have any reason to address that? Yep. This was actually something in discussion um between myself and the city attorney regarding that with with current regulations and others is that

until you define what camping is and we don't define what camping is, the the easiest thing to say is the park is closed. You can't be here overnight. You can't be in our park overnight. You can't be here your past your past hours. I don't know that we can stop somebody from putting a tent up except for where we do have other regulations that say you can't use ropes. You can't put ropes into the ground. We have other regulations that fall on that. So, it was not only just redundant, it's the fact that we're not defining what camping is. And when you try to define what camping is, you'd be very surprised that that's a very slippery slope. Okay. So,

and even there in 220.2 O2 it section or number three says construct or erect any building or structure of whatever kind whether perman or temporary. Yes. It's still in there. Yep. It would fall under others. It's just that Yeah, we looked at that and we wanted to define camping and when we started going down kind of a slippery slope, it's it's easier just to say that I mean camping can be permitted. If you somebody wants to have an event, an overnight event, they can always come to the board, ask for permission for a special event and hold it that. But otherwise, you shouldn't be in our park after the the hours of operation. Okay.

Do we have many problems with people overnighting in the park? Not recently. Just out of curiosity, have you had a chance to review this the amendments being proposed? Not all the amendments. I have spoken with Nikki on several occasions on some of the the issues that they she is bringing up now on some of the inconsistencies such as camping.

Camping and then also with drones. With drones that is being newer. Again, this code is a little older. A lot of these are and as time changes we we amend and and go with with drones. We can't stop them from being in an airspace above a city park. what we can stop is the the launching and landing within the park and that's what this is addressing. All right. So my question to you would be these amendments as written would they help you or hamper you in doing your job? Do you think

without seeing them in their newest form? I can't give you a concrete answer there. Okay. But like I like I have said u

some of the items being brought up to you tonight have been things that I have brought up with Nikki over the last six months in seeing how the ordinances relate to today's concerns. And so Nikki's been working with the city attorney in that regard to try to modernize these ordinances so that they are either in compliance with what is going on today or make things overall easier for both the city and myself to conduct Any other thoughts? My only complaint would be 15 miles an hour sounds pretty fast. Think of a teenager riding a bike as fast as they can.

You would like to reduce that. You would like to reduce that? Yeah. Well, I would I don't know how everybody else feels. I mean, if it's a nice you and police officers could tell if you're riding a nice casual rate. I don't know if they're going to be able to try to guess is that 15 or is that 20 miles an hour? 20 is way out of bounds in my mind. You're supposed to be on a path like that to enjoy a walk and we're trying to accommodate, you know, something that's not enough of a disturbance that you'd outlaw it. But you'd want to reduce that to 10, you said. Well, my preference, I don't know how the rest of the board feels. 15's just getting a little out of line when you're especially it's not even your own power doing it.

You're sharing it with the walkers. Share the trail. Walkers can't get to 50.

I think if we go to 10, it's going to put something in their mind just to slow themselves down. They probably are going to exceed 10 miles an hour. I think at 15 they can try to exceed to 20. Sort of like your typical driving on the highway. If the speed limit says 55, you're probably going to go 60. Um, I like the idea of making that suggestion with signage saying, "Please go 10 miles an hour." I think the challenge for your position, policing it, you got other things to be challenged with. And trying to monitor someone or kids or whomever it might be, could be a senior, whatever. Going over 10, 15 miles an hour is going to be very challenging for you.

Enforcement will be very difficult. It will be.

I mean, there's other parks that I've ridden in um self-propelled where they have speed bumps and they also had grates which slowed people down. It cost a little bit more but it was very effective and extra signage. Um so it cost more money to do this. But if we're going to allow ebikes in the park, there might be ways to try to slow them down. Officer Yunuzzi, um I know you you flex your schedule and you're in the park at different times. Do you see a lot of bicyclists after dark?

No, I don't see many bicyclists. So, look at adding in number four back into under the exceptions. Thank you. Um, the other question I had on the exceptions, it says that bicycles may be wheeled or pushed by hand. And and I don't know what wheeled is that

and we need they're rolling them. They're rolling them. Yeah. So maybe just sitting on it, pushing it by their feet or something. But uh would would we it would just be maybe pushed by hand would be the easiest way to put that in there. And would we want to consider uh prohibiting them from playgrounds and ball fields? Well, they're already those wouldn't be okay. Paved surfaces. I mean because it already says it but that it has to be except for pave park roads, parking areas and other such designated areas for vehicles.

Okay. Officer Yuni, would you have an issue with limiting them to just what is known as the level one or do you think that that's going to be an enforcement issue?

That's going to be an enforcement issue. In a little bit of research that I've done regarding electric bicycles, uh you can buy the exact same bicycle with different capabilities. So it's not that you see model A, it would be model A with certain capabilities versus model A versus a different capability. I would not be able to discern that without stopping the individual and looking at like some sort of serial number or model number and then having to reference that probably on the internet. So you know as far as classes one, two, and three, that would be very hard for me to enforce on a just superficial basis. I I would recommend going with the the all versus one, two, three. Just it become it becomes it would tie up too much of their time trying to determine if if there was the opportunity to do that. Just trying to determine what it is.

Hopefully the point is also that if they're screaming past them and they know they're definitely doing more than 10, 15, 20 miles an hour, it's not going to matter whether it's one, two, or three. They're they're probably going to get asked to slow down, I would imagine.

And Nikki, did you say and you're checking with other municipalities, there's more people that have allowed these devices and vehicles? I think everybody's in the same boat as us as they're trying to regulate. Yeah. Okay. Um because again, it's become such a a hot trend. Yeah. Um Oh, yeah.

for all generations. So, um it's that but many municipalities, some are even looking at and we're we're look at the board level, they're looking at looking at what we're going to do about them on our streets, um you know, requiring regulations that they have to follow, same as a bicycle um with the helmets and other safety regulations. So, um it's not just this, it's just separating the the fact that we have received a lot of complaints within our park system. Um, we receive myself, um, Dan receive emails from from constituents saying, you know, I was in the park today and I people are just blowing past me. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, I don't know. Threatening signs like

don't do it or officer, you need Yeah. You'll lose you'll lose your privilege to ride a bike on a trail. We just had 10. Well, they were just riding regular bikes though. But I don't know if it was Sunset Hills or your police, our police department had some group come riding through with green shirts and one of them has a police bag, you know, on they didn't have a badge, but they had a police bag on one of the adults that was riding with them. They had one in the front and the back and we thought that's pretty nice. Those aren't motorized. They're not going 10 miles an hour, but you know, they were associated with some camp, I assume. which is pretty nice.

Well, so uh any other comments? And I guess we have a couple. Can you summarize the

Yeah. Do you want me to walk through the changes that were proposed? Okay. As written, if you were to to uh forward to the board, it would be as provided by staff with the following changes under section 2200040. Um reducing it to 10 miles hour from 15 miles hour. We will be deleting bicycles may be wheeled. It just might may be pushed by hand over any grassy areas. We will be adding in the exception regarding uh uh the the times of operation where bas it can't be after dark and before 6:00 a.m. in the morning. What about

Well, I guess that would be city park time anyways is when the park opens. So that just answered that question. Sorry. Um and I think those were the only differences. What was and then yes, we'll leave it as it's stated to where the electric bicycle is defined as all three classes as defined in state statute, which was how it was provided within. I think I caught everything.

Make sure Jane caught everything. So revisit one one point real quick to just thought of this under the 220.440 about bicycles may be wheeled. Is that for that's not for like ADA or something where there's mobility concerns to where they could sit and scoot with their feet type of is that potentially why that terminology is in there? somebody with mobility that can't necessarily walk very well and we're saying you have to walk it's semantics I I I I know but if

it would be I mean through a grassy area wouldn't be an ADA okay I just trying to think of everything I think it's I think it's just a a term that was probably used wheeled and when I thought of it I didn't think anything of it I feel like pushing it, you know, wield or I mean, we could put wield slash or push. I I think the intent is known. I would make a motion that this committee recommends

be before we before I second that do you have any suggestions that would regarding this that would make your job easier per se anything we're over that you've seen that we're overlooking if you will

really the only way to simplify this from an enforcement perspective would be to outright ban them because then it's a simple honor or off. Yes or no? If you're going to allow electrified vehicles, bicycles, whatever you want to call them within the park system, uh you start varying into different areas in without draconian methods. Enforcement is more on the honor of the people using the devices rather than me chasing them down in a golf cart or bicycle or or what have you. And we need some don't abuse it or you use it kind of signs up there. Did you make Did you make the motion?

Yeah. Then I'll I'll second. I'm just making sure that you All right. Well, all in favor of uh approving and afforded the modified modifications that we suggested. Raise the right hand say I. I. I. Okay. uh pass them. Thanks for thanks for your help. Thank you for coming in.

Uh well, I guess that the only item on new business. So, three advisory board items. No old business. New business this Saturday. I guess it is 9:00 a.m. Nikki.

Uh breakfast has been ordered. It will be delivered. Um, we do will be picking up the 20 trees that we've uh received from Forest Relief. Um, we've identified the locations for them to be planted. I hope to get out on Friday, put stakes in the ground. Dan has ordered the mulch um for the area that um I think Mary suggested that we do another weeding through and and place additional mulch um and the rest of it is just going to be a simple cleanup throughout the parks. So, is that strictly trees? This time sometimes we had some shrubs and flowers and other things. This is trees only then. It'll it'll be trees only this time because sound really nice.

Yeah. The this with it being the fall, we prefer to only do the woody materials. Yeah. And you expect to have enough people without I don't know if we're supposed to bring friends if we had that would be Yep. That's great. There's always enough to go around. Okay. Yeah. Somebody wants to bring a chainsaw and show you a couple of trees. Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, I expect to be there. I don't know how many others are, but it's always a good time. Uh, anything else for tree advisory board?

Well, park park reports then. Park reports. Budweis. Well, the park is always in good shape. Uh, I did notice a couple branches that have fallen off of a dead tree, which is kind of by the path. I marked it on the paperwork, but otherwise everything looks good and uh I didn't see any issues. Okay. Uh well, I got Marramac Greenway. I didn't see any motorized bikes on there, electric bikes there. There are a few things left over from the previous week that I I had my paper on the copier and didn't remember to take my paper with me. So, I'll get that to you. But there are a couple new items, too. Uh, one, there's a nasty bird. I think it's a bird nest inside the roof of one of those picnic tables up by the board boardwalk. It's on the south side of that. And I first it was too dark up there. I thought it was bees. There were some bees around it, too. But I think pretty sure it's a bird nest. Uh, and the other thing, there's a little bit of graffiti's found its way. Same idea on those peaked roofs over the picnic tables. And this one was down uh I think south of Highway 30 at that where the overpass is. I believe there's a table on the south side of that. It's not bad. Well, I can't read it or understand what it is. But it didn't appear to be offensive, but for some reason, somebody had to stand on the table and put some stuff inside there. Other than that, Dan, your crews or your contractors were out there and doing a good job getting the edges cleaned up and everything else. Let's see. Uh, Riverside Valiant,

it looks good. Can you hear me? Yeah. Okay. So, the construction looks good. I saw that it was all um the old pavilion's taken down and it's wrapped up so nobody gets in there and gets hurt. Um and it looks like they're just going to be working on the bathroom soon hopefully and finishing that up. And I saw the signs are already poured. All the park signs are sitting in up at Valiant waiting to get taken to all the different signs or parks. Okay, thank you very much. Let's see west side.

Uh there really no changes uh from last time other than the trees are now marked for removal. Um everything the park looks fine. Other than that lakes in the same condition. All right, good. uh Fabic

uh at Fabic Park. The American lotus plants up in Presser Lake, they're they've spread out. They've multiplied since last month. They need to be treated. Um the benches there at Pressler have erosion causing a tripping hazard. They did take care of the pile of old Christmas trees there at the lake. That's been removed and cleaned up. Uh the parks well mowed. It's clean. the bare dirt around the lake lake does need re reeding and that's it. Okay. Fountain City Park Mary.

Um no new noted um things that need to be addressed. They've been doing some tree work down there and on the burm that they're going to mulch on Saturday. I went down there and blew out some blew out leaves and did some weeding in anticipation of the mulching. Okay, Mary, my house next. Uh, that takes us to Heroes Memorial in Oldtown, Thomas.

Uh, old old town was still Oldtown. There's not a whole lot to it to, you know, really. I didn't notice anything from the last time around that that needed to be taken care of. Hero's Memorial looks really good. Um the only thing is on the south side of it on the ground um there is an electrical box and there's a couple pieces of conduit sticking up next to it. Like they weren't they're just they're just empty but they stick up above the box and out of the gravel, you know, an inch or so. and they're metal. So, it's like if somebody were to trip there, it could potentially be a hazard. I never noticed them before. I just happened to look at them this time. So, I don't know if it's the gravel has been scraped away to where they're now exposed type of scenario or or what, but it was just like, yeah, that's that's not right. So,

all right. Any other comments about the parks and their condition? Nope. Okay. Well, we got updates from the city staff and our liaison.

Um, yeah, I'll start with just a couple of updates since the capital project list came out is that the park signs will be installed starting tomorrow. Um, they'll all be done over the next few days. Um, I don't know if he plans to get them all done in one day or um over a couple of days, but it usually doesn't take long. Again, the hardest part is getting the permits and waiting for them to cure. So, um, also, um, today the, um, the forestry cutter was back up in Fabic. If you haven't had a chance to see it, it's it's pretty impressive just what one days of one day of work will do. Um, and then, um, as noted in Benton City Park, we have two contractors working in that area right now. um Gateway with Tree Removal and then Missouri Native Stewardship Services working on cleaning out um in the you call it kind of the ravine areas the the the wetland areas the lower areas through there um cleaning that out. They're still doing some work in there. We'll be going in and doing some mowing. Gateway will be coming in behind them to remove some additional trees and then this fall there'll be some plantings put into that area um by one of our contractors coming in behind that. As noted, we met with a contractor last week. The city has hired a second tree contractor. There's just there's enough love to go around as far as the work that needs to be completed. And we did start in the west side and with right-of-way um trees within the right of way. Um we started we're we're working through Courtney um Westside or I'm sorry, Woodidge and then down into Westside Park. So, those will he's going to start moving his um his um I apologize for this. They're they're going to start in the city in about two weeks is when they're going to start with that work um because it's slower time of year for them to come in. So, you should ste you'll start seeing more action happening with the tree removals. Um, just today with the forestry cutter, I'm going to be going up to Fabic tomorrow to GPS in additional trees that'll need to be removed that we

weren't aware that were dead because they were so inundated through honeysuckle. All right. um items from last month, the everything was passed, the $20,000 to roll over in the budget for the um nature Fabic nature preserve, the rebounder in Fenton City Park, the fence repair at Fabic, the fence was chosen. Um and that will be coming up. Um and then chemically treating Westside. There was a big discussion about they were going to go in and use a mechanical removal because of the spoon tail tail

and then they determined that because of the clay liner in that pond that that machine would probably rip that up. So they've gone back to a chemical spray and I know Dan had treated it once but it's weather permitted. It's been hot again. It's but they are aware of it. They are working with it. And then I was going to also mention the forestry machine. That's all.

Okay. All right. Well, I guess that's all the business before us. So, need next meeting is going to be uh as scheduled November 3rd. So, that'll be on our regular Monday. Uh we need a motion to adjurnn. Anyone? I'll make a motion to adjurnn. All right. Thank you. I'll second. All in favor raise your right hand say I. I. All oppose. Nays. Thank you very much.