Historic Preservation Advisory Board - Regular Meeting

It's 10/27/2025, and I am calling, the Erie Historic Preservation Advisory Board meeting to order. Thank pledge of allegiance, please. I pledge your allegiance to the flag of The United States Of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Thank you.

Okay. Deandrea?

Yes, sir.

Do you wanna do roll call?

Just trying to download the

I can do it if you want.

Go ahead.

K. Mike Turner, here. Deanne Brea Arndt? Here. Melanie Fuller, not present. Rachel Folger? Cesar Jimenez?

Sir, here.

Alex Wicks? Here. Laura Thomas? Present. And we also have present councilman.

Brian O'Connor.

Miss O'Connor. And councilman O'Neil is missing. I think that's it. So we we have we have five, so we have a quorum. Has everyone had an opportunity to review the minutes? No. I I mean, the agenda? I'm sorry. Yes. May I have a motion, please?

Motion to approve the agenda as written. Second.

It has been moved by Laura and seconded by Rachel that we approve the agenda as written. All in favor?

Aye. Aye.

Aye. Gotta raise your hands for the video.

Bye.

K. Has everybody had an opportunity to read the minutes that I got out late?

Yes. Yes. Yes.

It wasn't that late.

The motion, please.

Twenty four hours ago. It was twenty four hours ago. Yeah.

I moved to approve the minutes.

Second. I'll second.

It has been moved by Rachel and seconded by Alex that we approve the minutes as written. All in favor?

Aye. Aye.

I don't see anybody here. So I don't see see three representatives, but I don't see anything anybody from the public here.

Yeah.

Any residents. So

Say, this is a spooky

Yeah. We don't just just so you know, we don't have we cannot do both here. Like they do on the council chambers, we cannot do it here. So if you're not here so

No. Come.

Okay. And what we did is for general business, what we did is we moved you guys up front so you wouldn't have to be bored tonight. So what we're gonna do is discuss the certificate of appropriateness, COA, for the shed slash old barn at Schofield, You're up. No. Hold on. And and would you introduce yourselves, please, so we can get you on?

Yes. My name is Rachel Weiseth. I'm the recreation division manager for the Parks Recreation Department.

Okay.

I'm Kathy Cron. I'm the development and neighborhood service and division manager for Parks and Recreation. And Rachel and I, Luke Folinger, meant to be here tonight. He's done other presentations for the barn to you all. We're we're all kinda pinch hitting for him. But Rachel and I are both kinda co project managing these projects with Lou, and I'll let Jessica introduce herself. The architect is here to back us up as well. I'm Jessica Reski, and I'm an architect and sort of preservation specialist with FormWorks Design Group.

From what group? FormWorks. FormWorks. Yep. Okay.

And we've been working with Kathy and Rachel and Luke on the Schofield site since twenty nineteen, twenty eighteen.

So Mhmm.

Been a while.

Yeah. It

predates me. Yeah. Okay.

You guys are up.

Thanks. So I'm gonna kinda go through the the PowerPoint presentation that we put together, and then we could see if you have questions and discussions at the end. But we did introductions, so you can go on the next slide, Harry. And so this is just a quick agenda of what we'll go through in the PowerPoint presentation. We'll go through a little background with Schofield, of which you probably have heard. I think Luke was before you back in August for a certificate of appropriateness for the barn. So a lot of this information might be repeat, but we'll go over that. We'll go over the process, which you all know well. We'll

do

a quick project overview, and we'll look at the schedule, and then we'll have questions and discussion. So a little background, and probably repeat again, but the property was purchased by the town in in 2014. We did a master plan in 02/1818, and that was really a a process that involved a lot of community engagement. So the community could kinda guide us on the vision for the property. So we've really been in everything we do, we are referring back to that document.

There's a historic structures assessment that was completed by FormWorks in 2019. And again, that document is just more a more detailed guide of the condition and what we could you know, guiding us on how to use the buildings and how to restore the buildings. We did utility work in in 2021. This was kind of extensive utility work just to get the site ready to support the the building renovations that we're doing. And then the farmhouse rehab was completed in 2024, which was super exciting.

Rachel and I actually get to, be office out of there right now, while all this is going on. It was a great project. And I Formworks again. Formworks was the architect on that project.

Were you guys in there one before the rehabilitation?

I was in it during, so right at the beginning. So, like

You didn't get to see all the nasty colored carpet.

Not some of it. Yeah. And now and then we're in site improvements phase one right now. So it is under construction. The the the we kinda phased it out to get the parking lot drainage utility work going in phase one of the site improvements.

And, you know, this is Indy.

Renovation is under construction, and the barn rehab has started with some of the exterior masonry work is underway. So we're at with it. This slide just kinda shows an overview. This is a concept plan. We're working with Wenk and Associates.

They're the landscape architect on the project doing the site improvement work. This plan is kind of an updated iteration from the the master plan. So this kind of brings it to today, brings it to really what can we do. So it's grounded in the master plan, but it kinda shows the loop trail system that we're trying to do, the parking lot, and then, you know, just kinda how the you know, we focus so much on the farmstead area, but this is kind of what's going on-site wide. And then the next slide zooms into the farmstead area, and then in a yellow circle in the middle is the shed and brooder house structure that we're talking about today.

And as you can see, it's really centrally located in the site and which serves it well. Our intent is to utilize it for site restrooms. We're really not we're really not moving any of the buildings on the site, which is kind of important to us to maintain what's, you know, the way things were laid out at Schofield Farm. And so having centrally located site restrooms is really beneficial to the site because we're not only trying to have visitation to the buildings and events. We're also trying to have kind of passive open space use of the trails and invite people to the site to utilize it when there's not an event or they're not, you you know, just visiting something happening in a building.

So that's why we're excited to be able to utilize this structure for that. This I won't read this slide, but Luke wanted to make oh, go. You can I'll just touch on it. You know, this is the process that we're that we're in right now. I think you all know it well. So we've submitted the application for the COA, and we're you know, it's in review. We'll discuss it today. And then the goal is to kinda get a recommendation moving forward to council. We're scheduled to go to council November 4. So if we get the recommendation on the written what are they the what are the written thing about

your Some of your findings.

Yes. The written findings. Yeah. No. Findings. Thank you.

You guys are going November 4. Right?

Fourth.

We have forty five days to know. You you know? So

If that works. We'll see how that yeah.

Okay.

That's the hope. And the reason for that is we do have the, construction contractor on-site working on the barge, so there are cost efficiencies if they're able to move forward with the deconstruction now rather than waiting. So that's why we're we're trying to do that. The project overview. So, again, we're we're asking we're moving toward deconstruction and reconstruction is what we're asking for, and that is supported by the the state historic fund.

We have a representative who's actively reviewing and helping us through each step of the project. So, again, it's it's planned for community use as a site restroom. And then the Bruder House, which is attached and behind the shed is intended to be used for storage for events. And so this current scope, they'll be salvaging of all of the usable materials and store and that that will be stored. And then anything that's unusable so that there'll be demolition of the failing structural components.

There'll be need to be a new foundation poured. And then this next bullet, we said this slide was done. We thought we were gonna need to raise the building by 18 inches, but there has been more review by the historic state historic fund representative. She would like to see us not have to raise it 18 inches, so we're looking at lowering the interior floor elevation to try to get that overall height to as close as what it is today. So that's under still under review and design.

And then, again, we'll we'll we'll replace the missing materials with the same in kind. So the form and the massing of the building will be retained, and we have approval for this approach from the State Historic Fund. This photo, I think, is the only photo that we found of the of the shed slash original barn, circa 1961. I just think I jotted down. We think that the original construction was somewhere between 1893 and 1896 for that barn.

That kinda gives you an idea of what it looks like. You can move on. So these are the elevations that we're looking at now. And, again, these are when we did think we were gonna raise it 18 inches. But the top one is the the elevation from the west, so sort of the back of the the structure. And then the bottom one is the south elevation, so that's looking at it from the Kwanzaa Hut Building.

The front?

This is from the south. So it's the side.

Okay.

The side. The south side of it.

I'm a little concerned about what it's gonna look like when it's done. Okay.

And so that shows there's windows, and there is a door that'll be restored but not used. So that kinda gives an idea of that one. You go on to the next slide. It has the that's really the front elevation or the east elevation where you've got the kind of the sliding barn doors. The two existing doors on the outside will just be restored but not used, and then those center doors will be the actual public access into the the restroom structure.

And then the bottom one is the north elevation. I'm kinda looking at it from the the big barn, And those doors would be doors to the Brewer House, so doors for storage. So those would be usable doors to the to the Brewer House storage room. And then the next slide has the kind of the floor plan. And so we kinda have this vestibule concept where there's a men's and a women's restroom, but you kinda you come into the vestibule first where there's drinking fountains and and and space like that.

I I personally, I think this will help the restrooms stay cleaner, less debris, get you out of the weather before you're coming in. And then there's a janitorial area behind it. And then you can see the back, the Bruder house is kinda open storage with shelving. There is probably gonna be some electrical panel or, you know, mechanical panels inside there too that we're gonna need to make space for. Hold on.

And then this, ignore the colors. They will not be that color. I think it's just shown so things will pop, so everything's not white. But and and, again, that line with guidance from this state historic fund, we're gonna try to bring that line demarcation, that 18 inch rise down closer to the original. But you can see how we're retaining the the massing of the buildings and the form of the buildings in the reconstruction plans.

So if the floor is lowered 18 inches, that is a, like, ADA and dropping down.

Yeah. So that's where our site improves. So Wake and Associates will come in. They're doing the site improvements. We do think that there's enough space that we can make that work. It's kind of raised right now. Mhmm. So there is room to bring it down. There'll probably be a happy medium that'll have to be met there and potentially some retaining walls to yeah. To the site. But

As a landmark property for Erie, I was concerned when you started showing the pictures that it was not gonna maintain its its original outline.

Okay.

Okay. But I can see that it pretty much does.

Yeah.

That was my when I said I'm really concerned, that's what I was about. It's a landmark property.

Yes. Yes.

So I don't care what you do inside, but the outside has to look the same.

Yeah. And that is fully the intent. And I

I think

there was a you can fill me in, but I think there was a lot of evaluation before we arrived to the deconstruction reconstruction approach. I think we had hoped to kinda keep the shell and just restore the shell and maybe build inside of it. But looking at at some of you are probably out there for the groundbreaking that we had and saw the condition with the buildings in.

I've been out there well before then. Beautiful. I've I've been in that building, so I know what condition it is.

Yeah. So I think and, yeah, I think right now, it's just a matter of how it's sitting with grade, and the intent is to keep its relationship to grade as close to what it is as possible. There's a head height, some clearance issues inside the building where we only have, you know, like, five feet of clearance against

I'm sorry.

Sorry. I'll speak up.

Yeah. So

we have head clearance issues inside the building itself. So we either need to ramp down to a lower floor or raise the whole building up. So the ramping down would keep great at relatively the same relationship to, like, the roof heights from the outside. The other complication is it's kind of sunk. So especially at the Bruder house end of it, if you look, the door threshold is about a foot below the adjacent grade. And part of it is just erosion and sediment buildup against the building, but the foundation is lacking, to say it kindly.

Doesn't have one. Yeah.

So the building has gradually been sort of sinking while grade has been rising. So we have kind of a splitting the difference that we need to achieve. And then just for longevity, we need to get the wood structure out of grade and keep the siding and stuff above grade too. So

Yeah. For

Well, the ultimate goal is to retain the appearance of the building.

Yeah. That has to be.

Yeah. Yeah. For sure.

Just to make sure I'm seeing this properly, is the red what is the existing roof? And and if you had to do the 18 what am I seeing? I don't know what I'm see

So the dash line is existing roofline

Yeah.

Okay. Or, like, compared to where the grade is. Okay.

What does the red strut show?

So that's existing Okay. And if we had to raise it

Yeah.

The full height

That would that's on top. Yeah.

That's how far up it would need to be raised.

Okay. Thought I would've I was seeing, but I'm in the pink shirt.

Put together the graphics. I'm hoping I'm interpreting it correctly. Go ahead. Yeah. I didn't I thought that came from you.

No.

Yeah. And I think also one point that we wanted to make is we're really excited to be able to utilize the structures, you know, for you know, because if we we if we didn't do the deconstruction, reconstruction, we we wouldn't be able to use it for a site restroom, and then it wouldn't be used. It would just sort of be a building that's restored on the site, not have a use, and then we'd have to bring in a a different structure for a restroom that wouldn't be in keeping. So I think that's why we're really trying to go this route with this structure.

What's the cost what's the cost savings by bringing it to council November 4, And is there a trade off for bringing it? I I

I mean, I think I don't have the exact number, and I'll be honest. I don't think it would be horrible to the project if if it didn't make it to November 4. There is some cost savings. If it doesn't make it November 4, it's not gonna make or break the project. It's my understand. That is my understanding too. It was the contractor who's doing the deconstruction work at the loafing shed that's attached to the north side of the barn could also take this apart, sort of go through the whole salvage and Sure. Back up the process.

I just wasn't sure if there was a a trade by moving it up.

There there is a cost savings, but I don't know the exact number right there.

But there should be no downfall.

You brought goodies.

If anything, the upside is that the salvageable materials are stacked safely out of the way of the site work. So Well yeah. And they're out of the weather, so we try to protect what's remaining.

Break your manuals. I saw the note

and and the advanced agenda, so I don't know. I was gonna ask the question, so I figured I would just be in chat's question. We'll work together. Yeah.

We're kinda heading into discussion. We just have one more slide on project schedule. If you want me to just look through this and then we

can Sure. Think

we are. But so back in July, we would have the 50% construction documents. And then in in August, that's based on that. That's what the contractor recommended the the this approach, the deconstruction reconstruction approach. We discussed it with the state historic fund in October.

We're here tonight for HFAB. Looking again, looking to move forward with council approval. And then we've like like we said, we would move right away to giving that notice to proceed to the contractor if it were approved. And then it'll and then it'll wait because we are focused on the the barn the big barn right now, and so it'd probably be 2026 for a 100% construction documents and then quarter four where we start the reconstruction. So that'd be fourth quarter of next year. So really okay. So thank you. Let me Yeah. End of the presentation, and then great discussion. But, again, we're looking for a recommendation on it.

What

what did you say when you first came into the vestibule area? Is that what you called it? Yeah. What what was exactly in that area?

It was fountain. Yeah. Drinking fountain primarily.

Water bottle filling station. Yeah. That

would be like a a mudroom.

Yeah. And one fun idea, I think, that you for that FormWorks brought forward is it could also like, the wall space in there could have interpretive photos and and be an area where you could come into the space and have some historic photos or interpretation and things like that. So we're kind of excited about that. Part of that was also I know it doesn't matter as much to you what goes on inside the building, but this is currently how the building is divided. So there's a main entrance that goes into it's unfinished right now, dirt floor, but kind of a larger open area in the middle, and then there's two side wings.

So that kinda gives a nod to the original layout of the building as well and keeps the structural walls in the same spots that they were originally. And then in that vestibule, we're also planning to follow the roof shape so that when you go in there, you get the sense of space that you currently do. It's not a huge building, but, again, just kinda give people an idea of what it look like.

As a former teacher, I'm imagining a horde of children in their Mhmm. Just like the bathroom. So I I figured it out.

Yeah. But it's even it's important. Yeah. Like, too many times. Yeah. Yeah. For those

of you who have never been on the inside, if you walk in it, it's basically you got a big side, this side, and a small side, and there's where the equipment was on the right, and there's basically a tool shed on the left. His work area, workbench, and everything was there. Yeah. Oh, okay.

Is that a current photo?

Yeah. That's current. But I if you go in it, that's what you see.

And the Bruder house at the to the left in

the

drawing is not currently connected inside either. It's it's the old building that was sort of smooshed into the original. So I don't I don't exactly know how that worked out, but there is no current interaction in the inside at that point either.

So do you envision the ramping down needing to have it inside?

I think we would ramp down to the entrance. So it's got the double doors. So it's gonna be kind of a new set of doors inside the sliding doors. Excuse my arm wagging. But you would ramp down to the new doors.

Okay.

So I think that's where Kathy was mentioning. You might have some retaining walls along that ramp to kind of Okay. Hold the barn. That makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. There's gonna be a main promenade through the site from the south parking lot kinda heading north that we'll have to come off of. But there does seem to be plenty of space to make that grade, I I think. Yeah. And that's that's one of the reasons for the schedule that Kathy was showing is we need to coordinate with the overall landscape site plan to make sure that their grades are landing where we want them to.

Makes sense. Yeah.

So we got to about 50%. We've gone a little further with our engineers as well, but now we're kind of waiting for them to catch up with us. We can all finish together and

And now mushrooms, are they?

All corny. Are they mushroom? No. It's like

It's materials that are gonna

be salvaged. They're not gonna be used to use it. Right? They're just, like, stored? Or

They will be used. They will too. Oh, that's cool.

I mean, it'll be limited. So some of the original are already gone. So some of the original siding was replaced with modern materials at an unknown date. The roofing's gone. There aren't any windows in the original barn. There was, like, a shed. Sorry. The opening on the south is just an opening, so the plan would be to infill it with wood panels. No barn. Like, no window in the bathroom.

And on the south side of the Bruder house where Kathy was showing the door with the windows, that's the existing configuration. But we've talked about putting painted plywood or something in the windows instead of glass since it's just storage. So original materials would be kind of limited to siding and trim and then the doors that are on the main facade of the building. So what you're seeing in the picture down there.

There's no plan to use any aluminum or vinyl on there, so is there

That would not be in kind material.

No.

No. So the new siding that's needed will replicate the original siding and trim.

Yeah. Composite is allowed. So

We're planning to use real wood.

Pumpkins. Yeah.

And then the roofing would be the cedar shingles to match what's on the house. So Yeah. Trying to make it look more historic than it does right now even.

And you keep it white?

I think so. I mean, we had a paint analysis of the building completed, and that was that was the color.

Mhmm.

So unless there's a case to be made to change it.

What barn do you read?

The barn is concrete block.

Oh, okay. Yeah.

So we weren't planning to paint that. Gotcha.

Yes. Please don't.

That building, fortunately, is in decent shape.

By comparison Sure.

The cracks

are getting filled. They are these. Outside

of the environmental hair, the blends, the all the feces in it.

Yeah. The masonry's coming together. Almost in. Yeah. There's a fair amount of structuralism.

The the certificate of appropriateness.

Is that what yeah.

Yeah.

So this is thank you for your presentation.

Welcome.

Okay. Is there any discussion?

I I would be fine with not bringing it all the way down to eight. I don't know if that's our say or not, but, like, bring it whether it'd be safe than short of a building. I don't know.

Yeah.

I I think No.

I don't think six to 12 inches is gonna make a big difference.

No. I think I mean, the bottom line is we need to gain 18 inches of height. Right. And But if you split the difference. So the floor either needs to be lower or the building needs to be raised. So I think it's gonna be a little bit of both, but we'll try to absorb most of it by going down.

Having to do a foundation floor. So

the Yeah.

Building's gonna have to be then brought back. So I feel like if if you're able to do it to where you don't have to mess with the structure of the building as much, that would be

Yeah. The deal.

Because I'm concerned that whatever happens, the the form and the way it is now is is maintained. Mhmm. It's I would have to stick my spear in the sand about that one.

So this, are you are you meaning, like, the square footage and No.

Table? It's the see the frame? See how it looks?

Yeah.

Like, the barn? And that needs to stay.

The roofline? Yeah.

It is a landmark property that has to stay.

Yeah. And there's been no proposal to change that.

Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. All of the massing and forms stays the same. Yep.

Yeah.

It's just how high above grade is the roof. Yeah. And we just got word on that last week where we got that guidance from the state historic fund to to to evaluate that. Mhmm. That's why we're not quite Yeah. Haven't quite figured out yet.

Yeah. They asked me about the chicken coop as well. I was asked this a few years ago. And I said, again, they wanted to turn it into a classroom. And I said, that's fine, but it has to look like a chicken coop.

Yeah. And that's really our intent out

there. Yeah.

Not to change things. And we really are hoping to not have to bring in other buildings, you know,

that aren't into being Right. That's our hope and intent.

Rachel?

But this will look a whole

lot better than porta potty.

Yeah. A good perspective. Yeah. And it it would

be cheaper than portable, right, the portable bathrooms coming in and out all the time. Yeah. Those tray ones on trailers.

I think it's a great use of space, like I said, for

Yeah.

For families and residents coming to visit. Especially

if there's especially if down down the road, it's anticipating that this could be used as a wedding venue. And you would definitely need something like that.

Well, these would be additional restrooms. Right? Because aren't there some restrooms in the the barns? This would be overflow

Right. Exactly.

Yeah. There's some restrooms.

No pun intended. Yeah.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. But this building is helping us to not need to put a whole bunch of bathrooms in all the buildings.

Oh, sure. Sure.

And this would be open more to the public all the time.

Yeah. Similar to how we utilize how we kinda have our park restrooms set up.

Is will this be unlocked for the maker space as well?

During yeah. During park hours.

Yeah. Okay.

They have an agreement to have them open. You know, the well, we have to work out those details.

Because I'm thinking about makerspace as well, that it would have the restroom there, but I didn't know if it would be locked when like, on the weekends when nobody was there.

The downward decision? I think only after hours. Right.

Like, if our hard restrooms lock at eleventh, this one will lock at eleven. It must be according to the security company for the access requirements. So yeah. So if if there's some special use that has an arrangement

Yeah. Because we can't control Makerspace hours. That's not part of it is on Schofield, but it's not part of Schofield.

But long was

the line of Makerspace. There was no path going from Makerspace to the restroom and the site plan.

It's in front, really. Yeah. So when I say front, I mean east.

So you keep the walk. I

think you'll come out of the east side of the Makerspace. You'll be able to go north and head into the into the main part of the site.

There's no footpath per per se. It's just natural ground path that's been walked on, but there is no footpath. No.

We'll definitely look at that. We're in the early stages of what we're calling. We're calling this package b of the site improvements, and we're kind of in the concept plan stages. So I'll look at that and make you know, we'll need to make sure there's an accessible route that you don't have to go south to the parking lot. So if it was a miss, I'll look at them.

Today, you can go between the two of them, your honor, rather easily. So some kind of footprint just so they stay on a path.

Could be just green right now. Everybody's circulating.

Up the site. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. It on what I'm seeing, it looks like it there's no connective tissue there.

We'll look at that.

Yeah. You're right. That's easy to Yeah.

It's just It's a good that keeps in mind. Yeah. In the council packet, can you include, like, pros and cons of moving it up just so that

Yes.

We don't

have to

Okay.

Ask for it. Yeah.

Because if you look at that picture in front of the makerspace, you see there's nothing blocking Yeah. Exactly. The way to the restroom. So there a path could be made there.

Mhmm. Sure.

But, again, we'll have to look at grades and stuff, especially if we need to change the finished floor elevation. But

I'm just thinking pee glitter.

Than what's shown there.

I moved to approve the certificate of appropriateness for this project.

Is there a second?

Second.

And Deandrea has moved that the COA for the Schofield Shed slash Brooder be approved. It has been seconded by Rachel. All in favor?

Aye.

Any opposed? That is unanimous.

Thank you, Grace. Thank you. You. Was. Yeah.

Yeah. It's just.

Yeah. Mix

and the orchard. Tell me more about this orchard. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm pretty

food for us in our new.

Well, you know, the the Yeah. I'm gonna liaise up

for the trade board, they

might be interested in here.

That would be a great

thing to come up with us. Yeah.

And this is gonna be you. Right? Yeah.

I really saw that stuff.

I hear tonight. Yeah. Because Because we already approved

this thing. This this

this is Oh, it is? Some new New Denmark.

I'll try.

This is sweetener. Oh,

I didn't talk for y'all. Done. Tonight,

you have to be here.

Been a It was been they're gonna be a behind a little

Joyce, I've got the allergies.

I don't remember what we

My daughter has not allergies. By proxy, I'm not No.

They were gonna take it down.

It looks amazing.

They're not taking it. They don't they're not gonna take it down.

Amazing. They decided not to Got some Yeah.

Sweet. Oh my gosh.

It's because sweet. It's garlic garlic. Yeah. Shakespeare.

I love these so much.

I am that's sweet and this is all. Thank you. I'll take one. This is spinach, so

I do not eat any vegetables. That

sounds like a personal frog pattern.

Yeah. That's why I asked if those were mushrooms. Mushrooms.

I don't eat red like a black ground batter. A what? Fried in oil. Like, gram batter.

Like, mustard. I

Oh, yeah. Fried in oil.

There you go.

You, everybody. Nice to

meet you.

Great to meet you.

Is this hummus?

No. It's No. It's sweet.

It's a sweet. It's like pistachios. Oh, ghee. Pistachios and almonds like a

Oh, it's pastry.

Yeah. It's like the flaky kind of sweets. Yeah. Probably, it's there in other this imagine something wasn't being picked as well. Yes. They're here. Oh, yeah. They just there. Okay. Go ahead, miss Corina.

I I I'm sorry, Anil. I'm one of the world's worst picky eaters.

Yeah.

So the the next one is the COA for town Hall bell tower improvements. And so this is a new certificate of appropriateness that Chad Alexander, who was for the project manager for the this building actually that we're sitting in right now, the addition to town hall. He wasn't able to be here tonight, so I've said I would do my best to present a form. But so currently, there are no changes proposed to the bell tower, so it would stay as

of this. We voted to

Yep. And because the last COA was to remove it.

Isn't this is a different

yeah. No. No. Sorry. Sorry. We're you're thinking of the

The siren.

Tower. Yeah. Yeah. Hang on.

So I'm talking about this bell tower on

Oh, Liberty. Yeah. Oh, this bell. On on the school.

Yeah. That's, like, up on the corner.

Yeah. That can't change.

Well so It's clear. Let me let me walk through this. What they're proposing to do is

Let's listen to the presentation now.

Yeah. So here's here's a photo nineteen twenty. So you can see the bell tower on the front, the Lincoln Building Lincoln School building here. And, originally, we think it was open air, and you can see the bell Mhmm. Bell structure through the openings here. And so at some point in the past, we don't actually have the exact date, it was covered up with these louvers.

Mhmm.

And that's how it looks today. This is, more or less, modern photo. The bell is still in there, though. And so what Chad Alexander's team is proposing to do is to actually reopen it up with glass windows. So it wouldn't be open air. You know, there are concerns about, like

Birds. Birds. And

as of whatnot and weather. Yeah.

Mean The hawks that or the owls that live in the tree across the tree. Yes. Yeah. We saw They wouldn't like that at all. Saw one across Yeah.

It's like one who's up on the cross.

Yeah. They hang out up there. Yeah. Yeah.

That was really cool. Hold on. So one one thing I probably would if Chad was here, I would've wanted to clarify this. So there are two actual, like, construction details that they've included here. So one, you can tell is a taller opening.

Yeah.

And that, I think, corresponds to the Ridge. South side. Or no. I'm sorry. That's the taller. So you can see one of these is a little

Yeah. Wider. The front is wider.

Is a little wider. So I think that's the purpose of why they're showing both of

the Yeah.

So I I don't think there's any plan to actually change the opening, and that's I'm sure what would we we would want is not to change the Yeah. Yeah. At

all. My heart skipped a beat when you said Bell Bell Tower in the Lincoln School, and I went, uh-uh.

Yeah. So Chad Chad thinks this would be a good way to actually bring it back a little bit more close to a historic appearance.

Yeah. I I think really well

it. If no one can see it.

And and in theory, another thing I wish I could ask them is whether the bell would actually

I know it's an operation.

Yeah. I'm sorry about

that too. So this one.

Why they closed it with Luvus? Because of the birds

I think it

was a few birds. Yeah. Yeah. What what

oh, sorry. I'm not sure.

That that's mostly it. So you so you can see I I think this rendering is not showing it accurately because it is west side is the or no. Yeah. Sorry. The west side is the taller one taller opening. The south side is the squat Yeah. Or squat one. So Mhmm. Wider. I think that that could be a con if if you so choose to recommend approval, I think that could be a condition that the size of the openings don't change Yeah. Which which I

think is the plan. If that's all is all is to to take out the lures and put in a window

Yep.

I don't have any issue with that.

Okay. That's that's all this

would be.

Is the belt what what kind of Like

Yeah. The glazing.

So let's see. Let me go back to to this one. So yeah. And I'm sure I'm sure Chad would be open to any different proposals if you all had something different in mind, but this would be

Would the bell view be visible? Like, what what kind of

The bell would be visible.

Now? Is the bell there?

I the bell is actually there still.

Yeah. Yep. It's there. I'm just

It's probably okay if it's been

Closed off. Yeah. Yeah.

What is it made of? Brass?

I believe it's bronze. Bronze. Yeah.

Oops.

Very cool. Yeah. Because I was put in there when that building was built.

Into the ball drop.

What? The eerie ball drop. That's not So

ring it on midnight. Have to draw. It's pretty cool. Like drop.

Would it be lit like this?

Not the actual bell.

Is it

would it they install lighting for it to be lit?

Yeah. That's yeah. That's the plan was to put it and make it clear too. Yep. See?

Yeah. It's gotta be functional. Yeah. Well, I just wonder

what it is.

So I took a tour of the, I guess, renovated building, and I I think the plan is to hook up some kind of electric.

Oh, no ropes? Ringing. Yeah. I I I actually have, like, a

We do ropes at the church. Kids do the polling.

Oh, that's cool. Just do it at Brockville. Yeah.

And, frankly, to have glass in there, depending on what it is, if it's normal glass, it would shatter the glass to ring the bell in there.

Yeah. Yeah.

So I'm curious, you know, if they do want it to be functional, that can't be I'm sure it's a whole glass.

It's probably it would be when they're say glazing, I'm thinking plexiglass.

Just putting it out there. It's thought that went through.

Mike, the glazing's the frame. What? The framework.

So so you can they

didn't really put that on the on the Different

colors of

Oh, yeah.

Well, it's kinda weird on the elevations. They didn't really put the lines that will actually

Right. Those so that might be a clarifying question of whether it's gonna be a single pane like that or whether

It has the difference.

Little you know, roughly needs to have

Well, they're they're again. Yeah. They're looking at what do they call them? Spandrels. Spandrels. Spandrels. There's a word for them. I can't remember. Soft no. Starts with an s, so I don't remember. But Soft. But as long as it's a frame, that mean it's not a solid piece of glass because a solid piece of glass will not survive the bill. And I

do see that it says aluminum here, but we could it you you could propose wood, or I think that would be fine.

Can't have aluminum. That is a national registered property. So Absolutely cannot be aluminum. Condition of approval.

And it must wood.

What's the what is the existing building wood?

No. The existing building is brick.

No. Well, the Those slats.

The slats.

Those look like wood. Yeah.

No. I I think the existing slots are probably wood.

Okay. They look like.

Because but there cannot be any aluminum in that building.

I'm sure there's a

Or vinyl. This building. I have to.

That building. The exterior. Yeah.

Not this building. I'm talking about this building.

Yeah. I think I would just be curious to know a little bit more about what the materials are. Mhmm. It's gotta be wood in there.

The existing or or

The proposed. Or both?

Yeah. Proposed. Okay.

Yeah. You have to go back to JAD and say, this is a national registered property, but cannot have aluminum Okay. Showing.

And I guess then, yeah, what the if if it would be operational or not, what that means.

The the community had a major uproar when the new building was gonna be added, and there were gonna be three cutouts in the side of the existing building. There was a major uproar. And so we had to get a professional company to come in and evaluate it if it would cost us our national registry, and they said no. So but

yeah.

I think that also, like, where those the word we don't know.

Right.

What that where those actually

calling it jams. Okay.

I would say I mean Jams. If it was completely open historically, the most accurate would be to have no Mhmm. Frames. But if that's re I mean, if it's required to

Rectually.

Not chatter.

Yeah. But

it's a it's a the only thing about a renovation, anytime you do a renovation, you have to make it coat. You have to bring it to coat. Right. So but I can tell you that I will not approve aluminum Okay. Frames.

I would be I if they do have to have them, I think we would all want it to be as similar to the window, the other window panes, whatever that

I think that's why

they design.

Yeah.

It just looks a little I don't know.

They could be they can even be steel, but it cannot be vinyl or aluminum. Yeah. Yeah. You have to look at time period correct. Okay. So you're looking at just after the turn of the century. So looking at nineteen o five, kind of provide if I remember correctly. So right after the turn of the century, they did have steel. Right? Gotcha. But that would not detract from the earth the building. So

It's pretty exciting, though. I think

Any windows that were made in that day would have been wood. But today, since it's so hard to get original materials, composites are allowed.

Grills as well.

Yeah. Grills.

Grills. Okay. I

do. Mhmm. Okay.

Very exciting. I hope that it came to fruition.

Yeah.

Any any older building in in in Erie that's its siding is aluminum or vinyl, they're automatically disqualified. Buttons.

Buttons. Buttons. Throws are buttons. Yeah.

Yeah. This one's, like, 1953, this photo. Maybe it's open.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. You can see right there. Cool.

Yeah. I have more of

it in the background, but not with the bell tower part. It's more of that

this Mhmm. Alright. Perfect. So I think we can do couple of things. You could we could continue it until the next meeting to get more information, or if you alternatively, if you feel comfortable, you could make a recommendation with or yeah. A recommendation with conditions attached.

No. We're I would not being I would ask to, you know, to to a continuance until the next meeting

Okay.

Is we need to know what materials and what kind of glass. Okay. And is the bell gonna be operational? Okay. Yeah. Is this this

is the, like, most important landmark property in Erie, so we kinda have to get it right.

Well, this is the only property in in Erie that is Nestle. That's Nestle.

So, like, I think it's a little nerve wracking to give a conditional.

Yeah. So So Yeah. It's it's you gotta and I know Chad probably doesn't know know this, but because you're dealing with a national registered property, then you fall under different and because in our national registered property, not only are we concerned with the outside, but we're all concerned with the inside. And the inside of this building is still all brick. Right? Although it's been covered with drywall Yeah. But it's still all brick, so that's what qualifies. But if a section of this were to be torn down, then it would not be qualified anymore. So

Any time issues or any issues with delaying in a month?

I don't think so. I think

ready for New Year's.

And and I think this was sort of tacked on it. I mean, they're they're pretty much done with their renovations over here, and this was sort of an idea that came up late in the late in the phase. So I don't think it's package of work, so

it would be okay to wait a month. Is it going to come for counsel for additional funds?

He hasn't said anything about that. I'll ask that.

K.

Yeah. That's a good important question. It's important.

We're paying for this. Yeah. So Do

we need a motion to continue?

Or I I think that'd be best. Yeah. I think Yeah. Motion. Are you

are you making a motion, Mike?

I cannot. You cannot?

In the next meeting, just so I look, the date is

November 24. November 24. Twenty fourth. A week

of It's a great Deandre and I were talking about this previously, but, actually, because the renovation just finished and we're gonna be moving staff back into the old wing during that week, The building is actually gonna be closed, so I need to check with the clerk's office to see Yeah. But it's gonna be Either we would have to cancel the meeting or we might do a virtual

It would be it would be virtual. Yeah.

Location? No. Just move

to, like, the seventeenth day.

Yeah. Which is a different date too, which looks

like different date than if you want.

Can agree.

Oh, well, that's Yeah.

Each pack and rates.

Yeah. So why not well, let's deal with the first item first.

Yeah. So k. You could just say continue to the next item.

Can I get a motion on continuance, please?

Motion for continuance. I motion

for continuance.

Is there a second?

I'll second.

The motion has been made by Laura that we as far as the COA for the Town Hall bell Tower that yeah. We if there's too many questions to be asked that it'd be continued until the next meeting in no in November where we can get our answers, and it has been seconded by Rachel. So all in favor of the continuance?

Aye. Aye.

And that's unanimous. Okay?

Well, Devin, we think it's a great idea.

Yes. I'm excited. Yeah.

I mean, it's a good idea. The problem is when it comes to we don't know what the materials are gonna be. Right.

You just wanna

get out there.

My my New Year's Eve ideas.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Something else. Off by New Year. Yeah.

Just ring the bell. I'm gonna ping the bell.

Okay. Let budget report.

Budget report while I've while I'm still oh, I guess you're not seeing this window. You're seeing my other window still. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. But the purchases we made for the booth upgrades have still actually not been reflected. So we have $66 against our account. So we have $33,994. 3,000.

So Yeah.

A normal day. Okay. $6. I don't

know where the $6 went.

Yeah. Need the cheapest steps. 3,000 what?

994. Miss Thomas, you are up.

Close to there's an upgrade on booth upgrades.

Do you guys I'm gonna try one.

You got this. I blame you.

Mike, I'm blank.

Do you guys need any gear for for the board before the end of the year since you have budget money left?

Do you want me to

send mhmm.

Do you want me to send the Sure.

I'm just saying. Thank advance.

Right. How many of those do you think we want?

Spend. What?