Airport Economic Development Advisory Board - Regular Meeting

Okay. Today is August 21 and calling to order the monthly meeting of the Erie Airport economic development advisory board. Roll call. You know what? I don't have it listed on here.

It was oh, it's on the minutes, not on the right. Sorry. Somebody anybody got a list

from one of the old meetings?

If you just pull up the the minutes from last Beautiful. You'll have your hold. Sir.

Michael Bowden. Here. Kevin Kane. Here. Emma Dowling. Here. Paul Hufftailing's here. Lyle. Here. Andrew McClain. Here. Jennifer Webb. Awesome. 100%.

Pledge of allegiance.

Wrong place.

I pledge allegiance to you, the flag of The United States Of America, and to you the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Everybody's got a copy of the agenda, had a chance to read it. Questions, comments? The only comment I have is down at the bottom. It says October 16. It should be September. You are having a meeting next month. Right? Yeah. I'm sorry. That's alright. Maybe we'll just make that change. Yep.

What is the third Thursday in September

eighteenth. Right? Yep. So change that to September 18.

I will.

Any other changes, comments?

Nope. Motion to approve. I'm gonna do that. Second?

Second.

Everybody in favor? Aye. Opposed? Excellent. Do we have the minutes from the last meeting? They were sent out. Okay. Everybody seen it?

Yep. Comments, questions, concerns? Motion to approve?

So moved. Second? Second. Favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? Excellent. Alright. We have another individuals here. Just double checking because you all said not here for public comment. Welcome.

Thank you. Appreciate it.

We're gonna skip through section a first, and then we're gonna run to B 1 Airport Fund Q 2 report. And our friend, Laki, from the town staff is here to give us the q two financial report on the airport.

It's all yours, buddy.

Hello. I am Locky Woods. I am the town's, URA urban renewal authority and development, accounting analyst. Was asked to help out and prepare these quarterly reports for the airport, which should have been sent out, either last week or earlier this week. So you all should have a copy.

It seems like with the video, we're not gonna be able to share and put it up on the screen, at the moment. But, the first page just shows a bar chart with revenues and expenditures categorized into different categories. And the second looks at the airport budget fund budget budgeted amounts compared to actuals in those same categories broken down. And then on the second page, you have a more line by line look at the airport fund, the amounts that were budgeted in 2025, and then the actuals through the second quarter of the year. So those are just how much, how much has been spent or how much revenue has come in, through June, of this year.

They're not kind of annualized in in any way, shape, or form. You can see that the the budget projections, for 2025 look fairly dire, in terms of, the airport fund kind of running through the, the fund balance even with a significant transfer from the general fund. The situation through q two looks better, but, the airport manager, Jason, will be able to speak more to kind of specifics on, some line items that haven't hit yet. I think what you'll you'll see is that a quarterly report isn't gonna capture expenses in the the greatest way because a lot of those expenses will come at certain times of the year. And if they're just something that's an annual expense that comes in q three or q four, it's not gonna show up yet, in this report.

So for example, like, the line item for, buildings, grounds, maintenance services has $89,000 budget in it, but nothing has been spent in there yet so far.

But,

yeah, that about kind of summarizes the report. And if you have any questions, I'm more than happy to take questions at this time.

I think maybe before we did that, you probably have something to I did not get a copy of that. Yeah. I don't think we have any copies, and we can't show it.

What is this? Show one. Yeah. No.

You might be able to add a little more clarity to what's being shown and the numbers. If not, that's okay.

Yeah. Why don't you give me a few minutes here, like Okay. Through

this in pretty well.

While he's doing that, anybody have any questions?

So these numbers are through q two? Yes. Yep. So, Jason, the the revenue that's shown there, the 66,000 online item, is that the the fence revenue?

That is the through defense revenue.

Yes. Yearly total or is that

Yep. Yeah. So that's pretty much all just gonna be paid in in January of the through defense fees. So, yeah, that's that's we're not projecting that number to get any to go up in any way in q three or q four. Which item is that? The miscellaneous income item, the last one in total operating revenue at 66,000.

The last one in green. In green. Yep. Jason, does that number comport with what your expectations are for

That is he's right. That's most of that comes at the beginning of the year because we collect the defense fees at the beginning of the year. So the other fees that we collect the monthly fees we collect are due mostly as tied down fees.

Does that number reflect those who aren't paying?

Today, wanna say that I think there's only three people that we've been trying

to collect from. I gotcha. So most of it is there. Most of it is there. If it's three, we're talking $1,800. Right? K.

It's on the operating budget. You know, have not much has been spent yet, and there's a whole lot budgeted, like, 245,000 budgeted. Right. We're halfway through the year. What's your expectation on spending on that 245,000?

Yeah. Well, I assume this budget was made. You know, I I proposed budget when we discussed our management at the airport before we came to an agreement with the contract. But I would anticipate there there's not much more in the way of significant expenses on the second half of the year.

So you don't think we'll be spending anywhere near that $2.45? No. Okay. Well, that's good news.

And additional specs is not his contract.

That's right. So you got your contract at $2.40. Right? Right. Then we got 245,000 for maintenance and operating expenses.

Correct. And I think, Laki, when you did your presentation at the study session, you had implied that the total for his contract and the additional expenses is probably all in at about 300 is what you said. Right?

That's yes. So that's the amount that the of of general fund transfer that was budgeted was 300, just over 300,000 for the idea being that that's how much, you know, the operating loss would be for the airport. And so to make it whole from the general fund, the transfer was the $240,000 of the contract and then about $6,065,000 dollars additional on top of that to cover these operating expenditures or capital expenditures. But it sounds like Jason's saying that these operating expenditures, the actuals are not gonna be anywhere near the budgeted amount, which will Reduce the amount the town has to cover. Yep.

Yeah. It'll be a it'll definitely be good for for the airports fund health and for the reducing the amount of transfer from the general fund.

But all of the airport fund has been used for the annual budget to co because you have to cover any expenses first and foremost from

that. Yes. Yeah.

Jason, that amount is roughly how much every year?

For what? You know? I'm sorry.

That's what you believe that the year will be for all revenue into the fund. And that usually run around, like, a $160.

We forecast about a $160,000 in there.

That include grant money or no?

No. That's just through the fence fees, tie downs, fuel flow. Those three big. Those are three ones. Right.

So we will spend the $2.40. That's a commitment that's fully consumed at the end of the year. The 3,000 for the contract? Yes. It's just the $2.45 on the operating maintenance that we may spend half in it.

That's what I would

On what it's looking like.

Yeah. I mean, as a kind of a comp, we brought Longmont's operating budget

Yeah.

Which is about 600 a year. And so we're we're came in at four. We're doing pretty good, but I think we're probably sub 400,000. So let's say

between the two, it's roughly 320,000, maybe. And we got a $160,000 operating income. Right. So more 160 short.

Agree. More than a 160. 160 is what we commit. The difference is you're saying roughly 300 that the town's gonna have to pony up.

That that's what was budgeted, but we're again, we're saying Jason's saying the we're if you if you look at the general fund transfer gonna come Yeah. Yeah. So if you have if you have the operating expenditure down to a $120,000, the the the town, you know, you would just take that out of the the town's transfer because the airport wouldn't need it. But, yeah, on an annual basis, if you're looking at total operating revenue of around a 160 and then the vector contract at 240 and operating expenses at a 120. That's a 160 versus 360, and so that's a a $200,000 gap in between operating revenues and operating slash management expenses.

It sounds like it might be a little less than that.

Yeah. More. It's back of the napkin math. Yeah. Yeah.

Jason, the long months, $600,000 a year operating expenses that do they pay their airport manager or does Longmont?

Well, Longmont pays their airport manager.

So it's not in that 600? It is. Oh, it is?

It's six changes. It's it's almost seven. I think it's $6.70 something. But, yeah, they have one employee. Yep. And part of that is their BISV

or his salary. Lyle, I wanna make sure you're got what you needed.

Yeah. Lokey, one other question for you. Do you know what the average full time equivalent employee for the city of Erie cost the city?

I do not know that off the top of my head. No. Sorry. But that would vary very significantly by department.

I'm just saying. Yeah. Is it 150?

No. I don't think it'd be a 150. I think it'd probably be sub a 100,000, but I wouldn't you know, that's just a guess. Don't hold me to that.

Yeah. I don't wanna get off of it. They got a lot of employees.

Yeah. I'm just curious. And if you're talking about a airport manager salary, Walmart with benefits is somewhere around 160, $170, about a $130,000 salary company car. So about what would come gonna come offshore? Probably yeah. But

they have more than one person.

We yeah. We have much. Yeah.

No. They Longmont. But you couldn't support an airport with just one employee. They do. Yeah. Wow.

Does Boulder build it up too? That's Boulder has too. They

may and he in Longmont, they may have a part time person, but that's the difference. That's how we can manage the airport for you. You know? Understood. You know, they're they're paying a lot more for professional services, like mowing and plowing and stuff, or we're doing it in house.

We get economies of scale because you are

and your team Yes. So we come

as a full blown You know, a plowing event at an airport that's using a subcontractor might cost 3 or $4,000 every time it sells where, you know, we've got, a $20 per hour employee and equipment that we've got through the state. Let's do it again. The cost of fixed. Yeah. Yeah. So but it might cost us $200 to do, you know, to plow the airport. You know? And even with maintenance on the equipment over the year, it it might bump that number up to a thousand dollars or so storm or something like that. But that's where, yeah, put up. 650,000 worth of it.

There's a lot more, and all those services are being farmed out. That one guy is not doing it. The airport manager is not out. Well, they have to. Yeah. Because it otherwise, you'd have to have staff people, and that's where we've got a staff people, but they're FBO, and we're utilizing them to Right. To do services at the airport.

This may be redundant, but I wanna make sure everybody here fully understands what's going on here and kinda why it has to go on. Before you all were here, we did a legal analysis with his leadership and the town's staff help. The way it's set up is dictated by the ordinance that created the fund. All the money that goes into the airport fund is just an accounting fund. It's a bucket.

Now it runs through vector management, and they collect the money for the for the fund. But the money goes to the town, ultimately. The town is required by ordinance to pay all the bills associated with the airport first out of the fund.

And then whatever shortfall there is, the general fund fills in the gap. Yeah. I mean, the the ordinance is it's written and kind of it's old. It's from 1991. It's kind of pre TABOR taxpayer bill of rights.

And so whereas, like, you know, the the town has storm water and wastewater that are true enterprise funds where the money coming in has to equal the the money going out. The revenues and the expenses have to offset directly. The language kind of precedes that setup. It's not an enterprise fund, the airport fund, but there is language that basically says the airport fund should operate independently and should be should not be a drain on the town's assets. And so that's kind of the the logic of the airport fund should be as self sustaining as as possible.

And kind of theoretically, it's unclear whether we can, you know, get to the point where it is actually self sustaining, can build up revenue, and repay the the general fund for the contributions that the general fund made to the airport fund. That's kind of the the ethos of the of the ordinance as it exists right now.

But it would hold true theoretically that if we had plans to make some improvements to a runway or lighting or whatever on the airport, and we applied for grants, and we got 90% of it from the FAA, 5% of it from the state of Colorado, and we had to come up with 5% of it. In theory, there could be a situation where if the town decided given their budget constraints, since we had to chew up the $160,000 for this year's annual budget first, we may not have enough money to match the grand money.

If if the town decided not to backfill that portion of the

Grant money. Grant match. Yes. Right. Everybody understands that? Mhmm. Right. That concerns me. Mhmm. And is my driving force behind wanting the ordinance changed? Now we submitted it to you all last month. I say you all, meaning our liaisons. Where are we at with that? So

one of the things and I I thought at the airport study session, I thought that we would be discussing that as part of that meeting.

Because you asked me to send it to

you. Yeah. That meeting, unbeknownst to me, took on a entirely different character. So there has not been much discussion around that. I've spoken to mayor that that we we do need to have a discussion around that.

I think there's are having a September 6, we are having a board retreat. And I think that is probably a good place anywhere we would have sufficient time to discuss that before it was brought back for council. So that's going to be my request that we dedicate some time to that. If it can't go there, we would probably have to find another study session, which are getting kind of few and far between. But the objective, I know we talked about this, that this would be brought up for the end of the calendar year, that going into next fiscal year that we would operate under this new ordinance that

Right. And we've been and he's been great about it. Julian's been Mhmm. Good about educating us as the protocol and the procedures that as this board needs to follow with respect to how we need to do it. And I think we're on we're doing what we need to do. We we formulated the draft. We sent it to

you

all, and now it's really in your hands. There's nothing for us as a board Correct. To do until you come back with whatever it is you all

Correct. Yeah. We back to us. Is that right? Yeah.

And then we would either sign off on it or say, oh, no. This sucks.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I just wanna make sure that it that it doesn't run off the rails or get stuck.

Agree. Yeah. That's because it's kind of That's my primary concern too, it's just getting it a place in the discussion table and understanding, you know, and the big thing. Yeah, I think, between Julian, Lockheed and our other finance staff, I think we've got the people to speak to it, to us as counsel, I think it's educating counsel. I think the letter that you wrote, I think is very well summarizes what

Did you

write it or drew wrote? Drew wrote.

Oh, yes, sir, thank you. The little letter you wrote, they're very well presented, and I think it speaks to how we need to look at this and yeah, that is a concern because we're I know we live and die off those FAA grants, that is potential missed opportunities if Right. Yeah. And I know there's potential budget constraints that the town is facing from other issues, and I don't want this Potentially. We're not Denver. We're like, yeah.

Don't want the I think everybody I think I can speak from everybody. For everybody, I don't want the airport to become the stepchild of the budget. I agree.

I agree. So

that We also I think you said we probably or Julian said probably need legal counsel to opine as to what we can do. We may wanna do one thing, but that doesn't mean legally we'll be able

to Yeah.

Draft. That's what we're gonna draft, but that's out of our hands.

Yeah. That that I think with, yeah. Kendra's input and and yeah. We'll have to we'll have to go through that. That that may actually I I know we've already got some stuff already deferred to we have an airport attorney that we're working with. I'm guessing Kenner's probably gonna defer that to them. Yeah. So that the good part, we've already got somebody we're working with, so it's not like we gotta go dig up the yellow pages if anybody uses that anymore, but

Right.

Yeah.

All this moving forward, we're all aware of it. You know, I think there's a lot of things that we have on our minds that really to some degree are predicated on getting a resolution of this, whatever that is. Yeah. So we're kinda treading water on some of these things. Right? Okay.

Curious. I mean, I feel like a study session would be appropriate because I I think one of the things that needs to be put into context is, you know, the 1991 was when that ordinance was adopted. Yeah. We have managed up until 2022 to keep to to keep that fund balance self sufficient, and that's something that 90 something percent of the airports or or municipalities are have been unable to do. So I feel like there's kind of maybe a little bit of a negative tone as to, oh, well, airports all of sudden cut or not all of sudden that it it's costing much of money, but, historically, we did really well.

That ONS, which was risky at a time when the town was in completely different financial situation than it is now. You know, thirty years of managing, you know, the airport at a net zero, and now it's time that it now it's no longer possible. It's not feasible. Mostly most municipalities can do it. Haven't done it. Most airports are subsidized, and now we're just trying to rework that so that we can protect the FAA you're in and just establish a budget for the airport like the other division, the other departments within the town. So Yeah. Yeah. That I don't wanna lose the history there that we we've been we've been doing. Yeah.

And and that's something I I and, yeah, my apologize to everyone here because I I I was kind of felt like I I'd been left out of the loop or something. As I said, the the intention was that airport study session was was that was the place to talk about this, and I don't know all of a sudden, you know, we're talking about traffic patterns and things like that, and

I I just like don't think I don't think it was effectively published as to what the meeting was for. Yeah. Understandably, a lot of the public thought it was something that it was not intended to be.

Yes. Yeah. There was some, yeah, misconceptions for whatever reason. And I I I know there were a lot of folks in the airport that thought that we were we were approving development out on the The Cross which one and that was It wasn't. It was Yeah.

It was that was not I mean, I think it was I think Julian has an overall presentation that that had that that was mentioned in there, but we were not making decisions on that at all. So I don't know how that got miscommunicated. I've spoken with staff about that it was so as liaison, I'll take ownership of that because I probably didn't do as good a job communicating what what what I wanted to see or what what this this body wanted to wanted to see out of that because I don't I don't think we ever really got to the we we did touch on it, but and and one thing I'll say, staff, Julian's presentation in there was phenomenal. Yeah. Phenomenal.

So so we had Very good. You were there. Yeah. It was very good.

So Very Between the two of them, they're a tag team. I feel

like once the slides became public, know, and then everybody found their one thing that kind of triggered them, whether it was Yeah. Noise or lead or, you know, development of Crosswind and turned it turned it kept for them, it turned that the meeting into that. Right. Yeah.

I was

getting blasted with, oh, there's a, you know, noise there's there's a meeting about noise at the airport. There's a meeting about fuels. There's a meeting about expansion of the airport. There's I mean, people just picked a bullet point, and if it was something, you know, they're they're passionate about,

they Yeah. Show up. It's I think people I I think the general public doesn't really understand how the the I mean, I think they think like the the town has a lot more control over the airport than we do. It's like, I I always compare we have we have a a privately run golf course, but but municipalities that have like a municipal golf course, it's like, you know, the city owns the golf course, but they hire just like we hire a Jason to manage that, we've got there. Yeah, so there, yes, there's a connection, but at the same time, it's a private enterprise and it's a town on our asset that's privately managed and there's a relationship there.

And so I think that, yeah, they think, and you know, that one of the things that, in the meeting that we had, following that during my board commentary, made some comments because we had, we had somebody coming public comment at that meeting that came again to talk, they were concerned about expansion of the airport and I don't think they really understood the focus of this. So I took that time to explain and one I told everybody and for anybody listening now, it's like, you can go on the erieco.gov website, go under transparency, you can see every meeting we've had from the beginning, it's all public. And you know, I think this board typically doesn't get a lot of visibility as compared to say like maybe opens, you know, open space board and so, or planning commission or something. So, know, I'm trying to be more vocal about like getting people to, you know, to listen to this, to understand the things that we aren't talking about. And and, we were very intentional when when this board was reformed.

The the prior airport board, I think was just called Air Airport Advisory Board and yeah, and and we were intentionally renaming it when we brought it back up because it's dealing with the economic development around the airport. So That study session, correct me if I'm wrong, the true purpose of that study session was to discuss potential ways to increase revenue to the airport. Yes. Yeah. That was it. That was it. Yeah.

Was the true purpose. Yes. Didn't quite know land that way.

Yeah. Yeah. So those lines at the state session, it was brought up that the three defense agreements, the land lease, increasing those roughly 65%. And I don't know what the timeline is for making that happen. But, Jason, have you done any projections on what that 65 percent would do to our revenue picture?

I have it, but, I mean, it's it's not a very difficult calculation when you look at through the fence fees here at $66,000. But we

got all the other lease stuff that's gonna go the same amount. Right? Right. Because through the fence is one

piece of it. That's the biggest piece for sure. But, yeah, you could you could easily I have not done that, but you could easily put that number together.

Although so I think I heard you

say the total revenue is anticipated to be about a 160,000.

I think that's about right. Yeah.

So if we took that and took 60% of it?

I mean, you have you know, it could be adjusted, but that's not a 66% number.

So, anyway

I think I think probably a 100 of that is probably in land lease through the fence and tie down. So you could probably

you could probably I'm

just trying

to get a feeling from where we may be able to get to by the end of the year, to be wise. Right.

That's the

number I can And what our short our shortfall is not gonna be as dire No. As what it you it appears to look like right now.

We won't have the actuals until they actually Yeah. That's one

of the frustrating things. We don't have great forecasts. We don't quite know where we're at on things.

Well, I mean, if I'd known that we needed that number tonight, I I could easily I mean, those fees haven't changed. The last update to the through the fence fees the last update to the orders for through the fence fees was It's been over over fifteen years ago.

Yeah. I think we all agree they need to change, that I out by the year. I'm just trying to get a feel The point

is, though. We're gonna be. The the the quantity of fees, at least right now, the number of people that are assessed the fees, the number of commercial, through defense fees that are administered. That number has not changed significantly for, you know, fifteen years. The only major increase in the through the fence fees was when the flight park was built, mixed use.

You know, that added $15,000 to to through defense income. There's another phase that's that's gonna be built, and there will be fees associated with that. But I could easily go back seven, eight, ten years, and the number of the so through the fence fees that have been collected have been the same.

So It's relatively fixed on an annual basis.

It is it is fixed. I mean, short of the the way the residential side is calculated or the people that the fees that are calculated on the residential side, it's a used fee. So the only thing that really changes year to year is if someone buys a house, they don't have an airplane. Now they don't own the fee anymore And vice versa, if there was a house that wasn't paying you through the fence fee, they would've been they've got an airplane nowadays. So there's 35, 40 homes that have direct access to the airport. Two or three of those come to you every year. You know, somebody moves out. They don't have an airplane. Somebody moves in, they do. But point is that revenue stream is very consistent.

And, if we talked about a 60% increase in that, you know, I could nail that number pretty easily. Could for the

next meeting, could you Yes. Bring in the vector of 240,000, the operating expenses, budget at two forty five, but we know it's gonna be somewhat less. And maybe by the next meeting, you'll be three quarters of way through the year. You have a pretty good feel for what that's gonna be. Or we know what our income

is. Yeah. That's the easy one.

And there's gonna be a delta there. You can what I'm getting at is is 60% the right number for changing? And if it is, what do we need to do to make that happen by the end of the year?

I don't think we're gonna make it happen by the end of the year, and that's the part of the kind of the problem that we face is and it it's helpful to kind of look back to your comment. We were balancing. And then as part of what we we kinda created our own monster, if you will Sure. In our success to do what we all wanted to do that the town agreed to is to create a separate contract for you as an airport manager and then a separate agreement for you because you happen to be the FBO tenant as well. You know, our our desire to get more clarity as to what's going on here.

And because of the changes, which I think in the long run are great for the airport and the town as a whole, it has created this situation, if you will. It's not negative or positive. It just is what it is in terms of what we now see is is really I mean, you wanna call it a shortfall. It's just the way the thing is set up. We now have a better sense as to how it all works because quite frankly, when we first came into this, we didn't really know.

I mean, for those of us who have been here since the beginning, which is you, and it drew to some extent. You've been here probably the next longest. It has taken us a while to kind of figure out where we are today. But I think we also agree that certain things need to happen, which is include including restructuring and changing the fees. They're too low. They haven't changed for how long did you say? Yeah.

I mean, they were 200 when we started out the airport in the nineties. They went to 400. And for at least fifteen years, they've been at 600 on the residential side and whatever the price per square foot on the

Yeah. One begets the next in terms of what the charge is. Right. But to your point, and I it's a very valid point. The other thing we face is the through the fence fees, that too is determined by ordinance. And that ordinance would have to be revised with a new fee amount and structure, and I think that's another part of what lies ahead for us. So those changes, I don't think that's gonna happen before the end of the year.

Just to to kinda speak on on everything that you just discussed there for a little bit. Firstly and and I'll work with Jason for the next meeting to make sure we can present this kind of information in the nicer format so y'all can have it in front of you and look at it. Before the airport study session, I did do some, like, kinda back of the napkin calculations. So if you increase the through the fence fees from 31 houses currently paying in at 600 to all 55 houses potentially is the number Julian gave me at a thousand, that's an additional, $36,000. And then if you do the same 66% increase to the commercial rate, that generates an additional $31,000.

I will say, as Paul mentioned, there was you know, this is gonna be subject to the council's decision and the town council's direction. And I think there was, and, mayor pro tem Bell can confirm, there's some discussion about equity issues and concerns about applying that fee to everyone regardless of whether they have an airplane or not. So whenever it comes to fruition, it may or may not get applied to to houses without an airplane. So that would change, kind of that number. As far as timeline goes, Julian and I have met with some firms that do kind of economic, impacts studies for airports, to get a, get them under contract to do a fee study updated for 2025.

You know, we have reports from previous years, but to update, that for 2025 and make a recommendation to to the town council and to the economic development advisory board on what they think reasonable amounts for those fees would be. I don't know exactly when that would be, but I think we're hoping that it can be a a fairly quick turnaround. And maybe maybe end up in town council late this year or early next year. I don't wanna, you know, kinda overpromise and and under deliver on that on that timeline, but that train is is moving, so to speak.

Do we know how much that will cost?

Not not sure. So that was another thing. I was gonna work with Jason to to figure out the the budget for that, but I I don't think it will we're not looking at, like, one of the giant reports. We're probably looking in the 10 to $15,000 range for the consulting on that.

So the previous report that we got Yeah. Was was only the group up at at Loveland.

ASC or was it? BAG, business aviation group. That's it.

BAG. Yeah. That's right.

I mean, you know, that report's only two or three years old with with some numbers in it. Yeah. The the Is there is there a benefit to spending, you know, more money to to study this? Yeah.

And to to be clear, that's where I got the thousand dollar number for the through the fence fees for residential was from the airport business solutions report from 2023. I think the I mean, to to be you know, when you do fee updates normally for, like, other kind of municipal enterprise funds or or looking at impact fees or things like that, you do those things can change pretty significantly on a kind of biannual basis. So I don't think it's entirely unreasonable to to look at fee updates every two years. The other thing I would just say is that given what Jason has stated and kind of the the scrutiny that the airport's under and the amount of the amount of time it's been since we've updated these fees, and how much kind of political weight there is on on the airport issue and a lot of different butting heads and opinions, it's kind of a matter of really wanting to to dot your i's, cross your t's, and be as buttoned up as you can when you come to to town council and to the the town of these are the the fee updates, recommendations that we're making.

And we do also plan on asking the consultant kind of it's not just a a fee update of what do you think we should charge for through the fence fees for rental rates for the hangers. It's also gonna be kind of a give us a more holistic plan for what does it look like for the airport to get back to being revenue neutral, if that's, you know, feasible. One

of

the other things I wanted to mention kinda in conjunction with this, and this was another thing that kinda threw me for a loop in this is that just like we have with so, like, UDC items and how they come to the council, know, they flow through the Planning Commission first and then come up here. So one of the things I know that got thrown in to that presentation was they talked about the touch and go fees. And then the discussion kind of evolved into touch and go fees is kind of almost fees to kind of preventative fees, I know whenever we get into that, like you you, because we are getting grant money from the FAA, like I'm always wary of things before preventing stuff, you know, that that, you know, part the the training is part of, you know, what you need to to, you know, get your, pilot's license. So, but these that that discussion came up and I don't, I mean, I don't remember ever discussing that here first. Mean, did staff bring

Which part?

To this part, the the touch and go fees, did that ever get No. Okay. Yeah. So that's one thing that I talked to Malcolm after that happened is that typically if there's a change to those types of things like, I wanna get this, I mean, that's the whole purpose of having a airport economic advisory board thing. Yeah. Say something. Really wanna hear

Yeah.

What you all think. Okay? How much did we spend for Business Aviation Group? Do you remember? Was like Like a $100.

$50? I thought it was, like, a $100.

Mean Business Aviation Group was, like, $50. Okay. And then there's the one with the 217 page.

Oh, that's what I'm thinking of. Okay. That's

I heard a $100. Do we know how much we paid them? I do not know.

Okay. Jason might know.

And then we had another one. I forget which one it was. It totals up to a fair amount of money. Yeah. K? We got all kinds of people doing this to the airport and the airport board making comments that I take exception to, which is the airport is a drain on the budget of the town. I'm sorry. It's not. We're talking $300,000 here. Yeah. We also in the survey, we're talking about $1,200,000 for green energy projects.

K?

It's not a drain on the airport. I would recommend that we not do this because quite frankly, we got a lot of very smart people here that sit on this board. And what I'd like to see happen is before the town sends spends yet more money on the airport so people can say, see, we just keep spending more money. We're a smart brunch bunch group of people here. And I think we know enough about the issue relating to impact through defense fees.

I would recommend that we, first and foremost, along what you're saying, sit down and come to together and figure out what we believe based on our knowledge, which is a lot, what a fee structure change should be in our minds for this airport. Then if the town feels that we don't know what we're talking about, go spend the money. But it's not I would not support spending that money right now.

Yeah. I I agree with that. Yeah.

And I would like to know from all you whether you agree with me or whether you don't agree with me.

I agree with you, Paul. You know, I know this town has protocols, and let us get through the process. And if we're we come up short, then follow follow the next steps.

So I'm hearing you say you kinda agree with what I'm saying. I

agree with what you're saying.

Okay. Great. Perfect.

One of the things we've we've I think specifically this more ran into into the problem is the, you know, the sort of kicking the can down the road type of thing. And and I I think to your point that the whatever the one that we spent the $100,000 on in 2023 that that was Yes. ABS. Yeah. It's the specialist.

Sounds right. So that that particular one, again, it's like we kind of, we pay for these reports, we get them, and then we don't act on them. Now, yeah, lucky to your point that, yeah, I think going forward, I think once you've established, you know, what the new baseline is for what the fee structure is, yeah, as a best practice protocol that, we should be going back to those every couple of years. So we don't have a, you know, twenty year period where we don't look at them. And that's what we've kind of done with everything.

We then, you know, to be fair, this is what happened to our water fund, we had the exact same thing that we didn't look at it for like a five or six year, we changed the rates like in the 2020. And then we did look at again till this last year. And we're like, and everybody's sensitive about like water prices in this town. And we're like, and what we never want to have is we never want to have existing residents pay for water access for new residents. And so when we do those TAFI studies for the developers, it's so you know growth pays for growth type of thing.

So that's something with this and I guess with respect to what you're talking about with some of the equity issues that came out is one of the things that I'd like for this group to bring up in that is because I think in the study that we had have, I remember having discussion and it was we had that thing where it's like, you know, if you own a house in the air park, it's like you're the value of your house is benefiting from the fact that it's at the airport. And that was the thought process in that. I know that one of the interesting things we have here because both Councilmember Preseromelli and myself, we are not now that we're districting, we're not in District 3 where the airport is, Councilmember O'Connor is, Councilmember Baer are, I think Councilmember Baer was the one that was most sensitive in this. She is not in the airport, technically she's in Ridge Subdivision, but obviously right across the street. Her I think it's a says no as the street name says no, but it's actually on the Vista Ridge side, but, she's obviously neighbors with a lot of air park residents and maybe has heard some concerns from there.

So just throwing this out as a question for this group to spitball is like, would there be ways maybe to for folks that haven't had to pay this fee before? Is there a way to ease them into this, like you maybe have, you know, for this is similar to what we did with the tap fee things is we, because we when we increase those, we did get a lot of, concerns from the home builders that that this was gonna be a huge impact on them immediately. And so I think we, you know, allowed some time to to for them to get into this. So what whatever whatever that is, and I'll just leave it up to this group to, you know, discuss in the future. And it may I mean, it may be that your recommendation is that that, no, what this is we want these this is and that's what that's what that study recommended was to to do it for the the the entire air park because even though there may be somebody that's got a hangar that they don't have an airplane in, know, there may be if they sell their house or whatever, then then that new residents may may want to use that.

And so yeah.

I hear what you're saying, and I think we're in agreement. But

I think the challenge we have is one of the enforcement. I don't even enforce the $600 or the thousand dollars where it may be? Right now, it's voluntary, is

it not? Oh, no. It's it's ordinance. So the the the problem you have so the problem that historically that the town has had is enforcement's very difficult. If like, it's not been very difficult for us because I noticed about everybody on the airport.

I know who's got planes. I know who doesn't have planes. But, at a time where at one point, public works was trying to manage the airport without a day to day airport manager. Well, that person's not gonna know who has airplanes, who does have airplanes, who, so when we took over the airport manager in 02/2011, there were seven through the fence fees being collected residentially. We collect 35.

There's two people that have a fundamental 2,000. There's an easement that was part of the airport back in the eighties. But so as far as for us anyway, identifying the people that have airplanes that are using the access, that's not been a challenge. Challenge is the one or two people that aren't paying it, there's no penalty. And we looked into it because, ultimately, there's a if if an ordinance does not have this is my understanding.

I'm not, you know, obviously, I'm not the town attorney. So if there's no penalty written within the ordinance Right. There's a generic ordinance that says, hey. If there's an ordinance that doesn't have a penalty, you could potentially find someone up to them. So any ordinance within town as we understand it that doesn't have anything specific a specific penalty structure, you could potentially revert back to this kind of generic penalty, trucker.

But that takes the town of agreeing to I know if prosecute's the right word, but go after somebody for these fees. Problem we had when we were managing the airport in the previous contract was that was left up to me. And so it would be hiring an attorney to try to capture 600 a year from one person, you know, in terms of business decision at that point. You know? So I think I think orders would need to really there was two problems that we ran into managing the airport for eleven years was, one, the order should have an escalator in it so that we're not having this conversation.

You know, no board no council was gonna want to even revisit every two years and raise the fees because that's gonna upset. So building an ordinance that has a natural escalator in there, one of the problems that we had in the eleven years that we were nobody wanted to raise the fees because it wasn't hurting the the airport fund because we were submitting the a fixed amount of money to the airport fund. So we were just absorbing. You know, that's why at some at the point where, our contract ended, I just said, look. I can't do it anymore. The delta the amount that I'm subsidizing the airport is not worth you know? You were balancing it. Yes. Yeah. We we were in the hole.

You know I mean? You go over the years, you know, in 2011, you know, we made it worth $4,000 a hole.

You say we, you're referring to vector air mass. Yeah.

Yes. We we operated the airport. We we and, you know, I'm not complaining because I I'm the one who backed myself into it. I said and the concern was the matching funds. The and I think that's one of the reasons we're kinda circling back around is, you know, there wasn't money for almost eight years in the airport fund to match our grant money.

And so we just didn't get grants for a while, and we that's just money that was just at that time, the state was giving only $250,000 a year on top of the AIP money, which is a 150. So we were basically, you know, leaving $3,400,000 on the table every year. So we proposed to the town in our RFP that we would just pay $50,000 a year, collect all the revenue, pay all the bills, and send 50,000 to town. I was able to make that formula work. But then as the airport became more expensive to operate because everything costs more every year, that was costing our company more and more money every year.

And it's got to the point 2022 where I'm like, alright. You know? Yeah. I'm not gonna lose $20,000 every year. Right. You know? Yeah. Yeah. That that makes sense. Yeah.

And so I think having an and I went to you know, I tried to make a push to visit the ordinance, but the council, you know, trustees at the time, they didn't wanna visit it because they knew that if they went and said, hey. We're gonna raise the fees to a thousand bucks a year. That was gonna be, you know, probably that's gonna upset some people. And so at the end of the day, it was only punishing me by not raising the fees. It wasn't really hurting the airport fund because the airport fund was still giving me $50.

So that's a long winded way of saying a new a newly structured ordinance should just have a natural escalator in it. Yeah. So that we're not revisiting it all the time. And it's gonna cost more going to the airport, you know, in two years, in three years, in five years. The ordinance should just be built to do that. The other thing is, I think, you know, in my mind, this is my opinion, everybody that's got a airpark address should pay a fee. I can see someone who has direct access paying more than someone who has maybe no access. But, if you're in the area park, you know, I can see I can I can in my mind, I see a case where if you have an area park?

There's other non Can I draft the benefits? Hold on

a second. We I wanna make sure we don't step into a world here where we shouldn't be because discussions of fees is not on the agenda. I his report is on the agenda, but we're kinda getting into a discussion of what the fee should be, what we think we should do. Yeah. That okay.

Back here and get to process and what I think we should discuss to your point is how do we engage the board and in what manner in a full blown public meeting or a public study session. And I'm interested in what you all think, to sit down and put our heads together to determine with the input of you and everybody else, what do we think should be the way to correct the issue with the fees, and there's many aspects to the issues. So what I'd like to do is bring this back and kinda have a discussion is how do you all feel is the best way to do exactly what you and I are saying, which is figure out what the fees should be based on our knowledge and then come back, present it to the town. And then if they feel that they need to go still to a consultant, Well, then that's that's on them. But I think we can get with the intelligence that's already at this table, with the experience that we have and the historical knowledge, I think we can do 90%, if not more, of this work ourselves.

So my question is, do you think we do that? Do you agree with that first and foremost? But then do you think we do that? My gut feeling tells me maybe we do a study session for the airport board to discuss fees and only fees and kinda put our heads together.

Yeah. I agree. Something similar to what we did with the line for for the Yeah. Yes.

Or hangs a little bit.

Do you think this is too soon with that getting that fund changed first before we think about really how to increase fees so that we can ensure all fees go towards the airport?

That's a very good point, but I think that I think they can be I think they can be done simultaneous. I would be hesitant to wait to have a discussion about the fees because let's face it. All we can do is recommend to the council what we believe in our professional opinion, the structure and the fee should be. It ain't gonna happen overnight because then they'll have to chew on it, discuss it, And, ultimately, as we know, we don't have the power to decide. We only have the power to advise. I think it's in the best interests of all involved to kinda do it simultaneously.

It's just difficult to champion fees when I can't guarantee it's going towards the airport.

I hear that. And that was one of my biggest concerns. And in my mind, getting that ordinance changed predicates everything that we talk about, plan about. We've had some discussions about with folks about potentially wanting to do hangers. No. I agree.

I would I would say that the numbers we're talking about and the resulting, like, 65 k in fees, like, doesn't come up against the 160 k deficit we're talking about. So while I do think it's important we adjust the ordinance, like, adjusting fees in the meantime isn't necessarily going beyond the deficit. Therefore, we're not dealing with the same issue as though, like, we had done development at the airport, but then that is the revenues from that aren't being realized at the airport. So I do think we could do them both at once. Where I would typically go with here is, like, lean on Julian to advise where in the process makes the most sense for us to make a recommendation as to what a fee schedule update should consist of and how we do that, like format and and timing.

I I had jot down notes that matched a lot of what others were saying on, like, a natural escalator, or I was I was looking at, like, an index. Mhmm. I'd be really interested in having a flat fee for access with an additional fee for use for people that have an airplane to address the equity concern, but then have access itself be recognized as a value. I would like the opportunity to engage with, like, the individuals on the town formulating this to, like, have that discussion, make recommendations like that, or understand contradictory perspectives and and be convinced, whatever it may be. So I'm just looking for when that opportunity would exist. I think that's what moves this forward.

I think we can create that as a board.

Yeah.

Agreed. Yeah. And that's kinda what I'm talking about is I think we can do a lot of that ourselves Yeah. Through a study session and through whatever engagement. I mean, you all are critical because you live in the airpark, and you have a lot of communication with those folks that live in this airpark with you. And I think we've even kind of relied on you as community engagement for the airpark. Both. Both. Yeah. No.

Absolutely. Yeah. But, again, I think I think as a board, we can do 95 90% of this through our means to then go to the town and say, this is what we think is a a good way to do this structure. And, this guy here is critical, Jason. But I think we could do it, and I think we should take it upon ourselves to make the first step in this project. I think we're all everybody's shaking their head. If anybody's doing this, do it now. So do we need

to make a motion for a study session in the next thirty days? We can. We can. I make a motion that we have a study session within the next thirty days to look at the airport budget and what the fee structure needs to be going forward. Second. All in favor?

Aye. Aye. Opposed?

Okay. Or you look I can't vote. So I

don't know why you're looking at me.

I can't look out the window. I'm looking at shit. Alright.

So we'll figure it out, and

we'll get with everybody in terms of their schedule, and we'll we'll do it. I think it's I think it's the right way to go.

I'll get ask to inform that study session if we could get notes from the town on, like, what discussions have taken place that is precipitating, like, the 65% or whatever that was, like, a in a conversation part of a benchmark. We're just, like, to catch up on conversations that have already been had as well.

Yeah. We have the tools to be productive when we do it.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'll work

with Julian and Jason to kind of summarize these so you don't have to reread 200 page reports, summarize the and the fee benchmarking information we have from those existing reports, and reach out to our other airports in the region to try and get some kind of comparable information from them to give you guys the give you all the the facts that you need for for that conversation. Perfect.

Alright. Being respectful of your time unless anybody else has any questions or comments for this gentleman. Thank you.

Thank you all.

Appreciate it. It. Thanks, Laki.

Alright. I'm gonna go back up to a. I don't feel I need to opine as chair report. I don't really have much to add specific to me other than thank you all for that. I think it'll be beneficial.

Mister Dowling, you wanna do yours in combination with the airfare? No. I'll I'll I'll just say a few things. You know, the I watched from a hotel room the sound meeting with people in the background, and and I'll just say, they're you know, the airport is under scrutiny right now, and anything we can do to try and increase the revenue to increase the relevancy of the airport is important. You know, the to me, the airport is a job center.

And the recent CDOT study said it's a $23,000,000 economic impact. So there's probably 20 businesses that have direct access to the airport. Just my estimate. And, you know, their payroll is probably on the order of 5 to 10,000,000 a year, I guess. There's more in the CDOT study, and I'm gonna do the presentation to the town council in a few weeks right after the airfare.

I think that's one of the things I'm gonna bring up is to say, okay. Yes. You know, your deaf the operating deficit's 200 you know, 300,000 a year. But in a town that's full of homes and a lot of not a lot of businesses, this is an area where there's a lot of businesses, and it's providing an impact on the town. So I can say as a business owner,

it's

You're one of ways of space at the airport. It's not airconf related, but I generate a half $1,000,000 in payroll every year.

Yeah. And and it's only increasing as the next phase of the business park gets built Right. And as future development happens around the airport. Not all of that's gonna be directly tied, but it you know, I'd look at I'll go back to my hometown of Scottsdale, Arizona. And in 1980, there was all this vacant land. And within fifteen years, it was all filled in. And, you know, the largest tire chain in the country had their headquarters there with a fleet of airplanes. So it's just something to think about.

I think it's a it's a point that is often overlooked. And I'm speaking for myself. I take exception to people beating up the airport when they don't understand

and really know what they're talking about.

Yeah. I think the the challenge we have, so I'll let you start to address it, is educating people on what kind of economic engine this airport looks. We may come up a little short on the yearly budget. Not sure what they think we're gonna be, but but we'll be short. And we're not gonna change that anytime soon. We're gonna be short for years and years. Exactly. But It's a long range. Engine will continue to get bigger every year. Mhmm. And if we can stress that, if we can promote that, that's part of what we as a board need to do. Probably a better job of because I don't think there's people, even some on this board, that understand.

I always I've always I mean, I've always pushed. Like, not the reason the state does the economic impact studies is just for this reason is to have that conversation. Because when you look at a $300,000 investment and a 20 something million dollar economic impact, it's a pretty good investment that not a lot of things, the other things that within the town that are subsidized produce. And so, you know, for what is probably half the cost I don't know what a cop car costs anymore, but, you know, one police car is $300,000. So $300,000 to subsidize the airport with a $21,000,000.

And and I've even had people bark back at me where it's like, well, 21,000,000 million dollars in economic impact is for the surrounding area. So some of that's going to Brookfield, some of that's going to Lafayette. I don't care if only 5,000,000 of it's going. You know? I'd like to see as much of that 20,000,000 go to the town as I can, and I would make an argument that the town should try to, you know, maybe through new entrance, maybe through building a hotel in town, maybe you know, I'd like to be able to point people who come to the airport from other states to the town of Erie to go, sure.

Go to this restaurant. Go to this hotel. If you stay at this hotel, there's five restaurants right around you to be perfect. We do send some people to Broomfield because it's where the hotels are at. But at the end of the day, if you take that 20 something million dollar economic impact, if five of it's going to the into the town and we're only spending $300,000, I would challenge you to find me something else in the town that we subsidize for 300,000 that has an economic impact.

Yeah. That's kinda the point I was trying to make with Lokey at the beginning is what what is one full time equivalent? Right. For for less than one full time equivalent, we're we're driving this $21,000,000 economic engine. Exactly. Right. We we have to find a way to communicate that better.

That's a good point. I always go back to the town center. How long ago did that guy do those charrettes?

It was 2018. Yeah. Is that right?

So seven years ago, I went through a bunch of those. And one

thing that guy said that stuck in my mind,

you look at this town center project as a twenty year plan. You determine what that plan is, and you focus and believe that it's going to take twenty years. You will get to the end and it will be successful, and it will turn out to be exactly what you planned, and it will be a positive thing way beyond your dreams. But if you get five years from now and you don't stick to it and you change it, it's not gonna happen. And that, to your point, is how I look at what we're doing for the airport.

It's not gonna happen in the next five years. But if we stick to it and, like you say, promote it and and talk about it in a positive way and educate people twenty years from now, we will have a successful airport that survives on its own in terms of its annual budget. We will have a town center that has a hotel or motel. We will have people flying in here that we can say, no. Stay right there. The town center will create more restaurants for people to go to. It has already you can see it. I mean, how long did that land sit vacant?

Decades. Decades. Yeah. My brother's been here since '97, so at least since then, probably before.

I like what I'm seeing there, and that's going to be huge for the town of Erie. But you guys have already also heard me say, I see those two projects, what we have and can have going on at the airport. It goes hand in hand with what's going on at the town center because there's some compatibility between the two with respect to what you're saying. So, yes, I agree with you. We can do a better job. This thing coming up in two weeks is part of that. Your projects with community engagement, we're trying, but I agree while we can always do a better job.

And then can you speak to, like, the industry too and how it it is just really growing and we have a lot of need and the airport is like the hub?

Well, I mean, the as far as flight training goes.

Flight training. Everything. Like, all industries, like, air traffic control, flight training.

Well, there's used

to drone

application just like the boom that's happening right now? Yeah.

There's I mean, there's been a huge boom post COVID for sure in all aspects of aviation. But you

have to have an airport?

And, yeah, you gotta have an airport. And, you know, the CDOT study had an estimate on the operations for our airport, which was significantly greater than it was five years ago. So, I mean, there's a lot more going on. There's a lot of need. There's, you know, a huge need for maintenance, you know, all kinds of different aspects of that. Instead of

shutting down airports, there's a need probably to build another airport to spread out all the extra use because all the airports have had increase in flights significant increase in flights over the last ten years. Well, I mean,

you know, I'm in the industry thirty I mean, how many airports have been built in thirty years? I mean, not getting the Colorado region. Zero.

Yeah. Zero. And yet

the use of them is going up and up and up and up.

What what do you

do when you have too many homes being built for the schools that are there? You eventually, you know, realize you have to have bigger classes or build another school.

It it's gonna

We're not advocating building another airport, but we are advocating.

It is the one industry or one segment of the industry where you don't respond to the demand. Right? Like, when the when there's more high schoolers, you build you build a bigger high school. When there's more airplanes, they'll you know? You just let away. Don't get built. You know what

But you don't cut back on

it. Yeah.

Don't start putting constraints and start trying to shut it down either.

Yeah. You just gotta work with what you have. Mhmm. You know? So I agree.

But the public probably doesn't know what has caused that increase in demand. They probably don't understand that at all. They just see, oh, there's more flight operations going on.

Right.

I think one of the things as a as a council, I think we can do a better job at, and I I I know we have a number of staff members. Todd Fessingdon's probably number one on that list as far as like, you know, advocates for the airport. And after that study session, was speaking with town manager Fleming, and I wanna be clear to the public, there are zero plans on shutting down the airport. And so I know we're we've had a number of people that and and when I gave my the meeting that we had following that study session, and there was a member of the public that came to ask for exactly that. And I think that, you know, we need to be clear in our intentions that, and if there's, again, you know, complaints about the airport and things like that, that one thing I want to do is, and I tried to do in my comments that night was, again, in the aspect of education, talk about what we do here.

And, you know, we are not the FAA. We're we're not gonna, you know, tell people where they can fly and and whatnot. And and I I, you know, I get these comments all the time and and again, I just I direct people back to, as I've said it earlier, you can watch every single meeting that this this body has has had from the beginning. I encourage everybody in the public to go out and watch those and to talk about what we are discussing because I and I think one of the things that probably in the in the under the old way we did things, one of the sacrifices that came in that, it was way too easy for the town just to to let that FBO just become dilapidated. There was no incentive to improve it.

And one of the things in changing this around to where we have it now, and you can talk about the balance sheet and things like that, but the thing is that there is an onus, think on the town to understand that is a town owned asset and we need to take care of it. And I've said this to staff before, because we have a lot of capital needs just overall as a town, our police departments, we've outgrown the building that we built ten years ago. You know, there's we need a new water treatment facility, there's a lot of needs that we have, but we also need to be good stewards of what we already have. There are some buildings in Old Town that are one of them that is being leased out by the chamber and I wondered the heating system there so bad that in the winter they have to they have to keep these back doors open so the boiler can the water pipes don't freeze so the, you know, and it's like, we need to take care of that stuff. And and those are all budgetary items.

So when we talk about, you know, how much it costs town for the airport, look at how much it costs all of us, all of the facilities that we manage to look at how much it costs us to operate the rec center. Don't make money off the rec center. We sink a lot of money into that, we don't get if you were a for profit business, you would never run the rec center the way that we're doing it because it's a loss, but we do it because that's what residents want, they want places to gather. Know, say the same thing about, you know, a number of facilities that we run. The parks and things like that, there's tremendous maintenance costs that we have for that, all the open space that we have, we have to pay to maintain that.

We do not make money back on it and what we charge in like TNAG funds and other fees and things like that, that does not cover, you know, what we get on there, those all those things are subsidized. So yeah, to your point, 300,000 is it's not a big percentage of budget. And that's why I know you said we maybe disagree on this point, I don't think we necessarily disagree. I just try to say like, if we keep having to pay subsidize the airport at $300,000 a year, I don't have a problem with that. And I don't think anybody else in council should should have a problem with that because it's it's an amenity that that the town acquired, the town really didn't pay anything to, if you look the way the numbers were, we got a grant from the FAA to buy the facility.

So, yeah, I think we need to prioritize that. And we're just trying to figure out how to make the balance sheet work. And I think that's a, you know, it's a math problem. And I I think it's I think it's more easily solved than than think a lot of people, you know, think it is. And and so It's not a big It's it's it's it's it's not a big problem.

And we're trying to get a heck of a lot bigger than that problem.

Yeah. And if we get the ordinance changed, we will be able to move towards balancing that and being self sufficient and being able to fund the improvements that make it something that the town Even better.

Yeah.

Thank you for that. You're you're welcome. And and just for clarity, it's not really a disagreement. Our discussion and and when he talked to the town manager, I was right there when and and Malcolm said, I heard it. You heard it. I love the airport. Okay? So if there's any thought that the town manager is not an airport or is an airport detractor, that is not the case. That is not the case. But our it's not even a disagreement.

You had made a comment that it's never gonna be self sufficient, and I sort of jumped on you. And I was like, I don't agree with that. Yeah. Yeah. Because like you, I think you can get to over time a point where the airport is on paper self sufficient, self funding, but it's not gonna happen overnight. Yeah. I think we've all been talking about it. Thank you for that. That's really helpful. We good? You're up.

Secretary. I don't have anything here, secretary.

Alright. Going down to hanger committee.

We have nothing to report.

We have nothing to report. Yeah. No. Okay. Anybody wanna add any comments, questions? I know we have some people that are I'm not gonna talk about it, but we have some people that are interested in some projects for any of these.

The one email that we got about kinda study session objectives, was that sent to everybody? I can't remember.

The email from Julian. No. Because on fourth there would be more stuff on the agenda. Julie had suggested things to put on the agenda.

We can we can discuss that in a larger

We weren't able to get it on the current agenda, but it's coming. Okay. So we're we're restricted on what we can talk about if it's not on the agenda. And so that's kinda we've got sideways. Alright.

I feel like you and I had something regarding hangar committee or no? No. No. Okay. Angel is not coming, obviously, so we'll I don't know if this is your

last How how that got on there exactly.

But this is your last one, buddy. Alright. I'll talk about airfare.

Little over two weeks to the airfare. Been working through a few logistical challenges that got situated, thankfully, recently. Everything's in place. Money's in place. Agreements are in place. Contracts are in place. It's gonna be largely the same. Parking will be at County Line in Arapahoe. We're gonna have to bring vendors in Airport Drive, unfortunately, which is kind of a mess as most people know around here. They're pouring

they're pouring concrete today, though.

Oh, nice.

Yeah. On that, I think, the viaduct or whatever on the

Oh, okay.

Side. So I I put in a call to see that, like, the phone number you see on the sign and, you know, the completion date's been pushed back and pushed back. Anyway, it kinda looked like they were getting ready to pave Yeah. On the north side of the road, but I didn't really get an answer on that. So, anyway, Sunday, September 7, we're expecting probably three to 5,000 people depending on it.

Biggest challenges right now are just getting some more volunteers. My wife said, count on her. Great. And vendors were a little bit shy on that right now. But other than that, we've got a pretty good setup. To have a little more interactive this time. We've got so is the airplane JW? Is that from you? Okay. There's gonna be a plane named after Jennifer at the airport.

Awesome. Creepy. And then we're gonna have some interactive stuff for people to participate in. Live music, eight food trucks right now, inflatables for the kids, some aerial displays, parachute flag drop. The drones a little bit smaller scale potentially. Yeah. Well no. We're trying

to move it to the other side of the the runway when have you staging them on either Lyell's property or Braun or combination too. The question is the main space for staging the drones is perpendicular to the the runways, and yet you want the show to be parallel. The question is, can the program shift everything 90 degrees? Oh, it does. Or do we need to set them up on the grassy areas instead of the paved areas? But I went over by your house yesterday, you may use. You said you want Yeah. That was me. Yeah.

It's a I'm getting my back here.

I I was Good thing you didn't load that, Shaka. I

was scouting out the feasibility of the different pieces of land for for the drones, and I'll have a call with the drone captain at 09:00 tomorrow morning to find out what the dimensions of that setup array needs to be.

And then the other thing is the board will have a tent there, several of the boards. So if you're available that day, great. Is there anybody that's not? And what is the messaging that we want to be? Oh, how many how many

you need us to man the board's tent.

Yeah. It's from ten to two hour increment or whatever works.

You just tell me when and, you know Okay. I'll commit. Like I said,

six years. Tell me when. Cool.

Won't be there for the entire three hours, but, you know, I think the last time I did an hour. Perfect. Yeah.

Okay. I'd be there for the whole three hours.

So There's locked in and our consultant's on from not called Lochter. Oh, they're called Lochter now? Yeah. They got bought bought by company. Okay. I have not spoke with that. Armstrong? Yeah. Were they in the booth with us last time? Yes. Who was with Paul was with us. Yep.

Okay. Paul. I was interesting being there again this year. So

Yeah. He's welcome to come. Do you want to contact him?

You want me to contact him?

Or Can you contact him? No. Awesome.

The Boy Scouts historically ever been enlisted to help as volunteers for operations of the air show?

So the Boy Scouts had a tent. I think it was bronze troop.

He's in cubs. He's he's gonna be selling popcorn. I'm I'm talking about your volunteer problem.

Oh, no. I I mean, just because they are high school. Yeah. A lot

of them, they are good at

I mean, being with out to the civil air patrol. They were busy that day. There's a few other groups that we're reaching out to. We don't want them too young. Right? Because then you kinda have to manage that. And That's a big thing about Boy Scouts is their leadership. Yeah. I I would say, you know, probably, like, 16. Just it's not you helping, but it doesn't come as a site. I'm gonna reach out to them and find out.

Yeah. Yep. Did did you put a I

thought I saw somewhere on the Eerie Facebook page that there was a sign up list or something.

There was a yeah. There's a link to a sign up genius, like, for different tasks within the day. That's general volunteers. I mean, like, we have a thing there for driving the golf cart, you know, for two hours or whatever it is. Right. So we'll have the the VMS sign the visual electronic signs. Tom said they had a couple available, but to add on to that.

Oh, is there

Didn't they say they might be using them for the county line project? It's it's always you don't know until right up until Yeah. Whether they're gonna be available. But we're paying for three of them. One will be on Bonanza. One will be County Line. One will be Coal Creek. I that's where we placed the three last time. What's the one on Bonanza saying? No airfare access. Can't that be done with a fixed some other type of sign if you It could, but it's it's just a it's a good It's it's a goodwill gesture to the the people that live in there.

Of course. That we're trying to

We need a sign. I'm just wondering if one of those signs needs to be So it's what

it did last time. So but we're gonna try and move it. So it's as you're driving up the hill, you see it. I think last time it was over the hill. Yeah. So they

this is the last time we're gonna have a conversation before the event. Mhmm. Do you have everyone here's contact information outside of the Erie email? I know you have mine. Can we I have emails. I don't know about telephone numbers. Can everybody make sure that Emmett has your cell phone so that he can communicate Yeah. To each one of us? Because I know I don't always check my town email on a regular basis. So I just wanna make sure that you have what you need Yeah. From us. So just if everybody can give that to him before you leave, I know you got mine. Mhmm. That will be huge.

So, yeah, that's about it.

Like I said, 09:00 tomorrow, I'm talking to the drone captain. Okay. Thank you.

I'm working on the

Nothing else in terms of community engagement

that's not recovered. No. I've been focusing

on their show. And, sir, thank you for your patience. Airport manager for and we've actually hit almost this office. You you wanted to announce that there's an airfare of two weeks. Yeah. Airfares. Good job, buddy. Fee structures, ordinances, all that stuff.

They're they are starting the sewer project.

That's actually I was just

gonna say, do you do you think it would be a good idea to invite Zach at our next meeting to kinda give us an ongoing update as to what to expect and whatnot?

We can. I think as far as the impact on the airport, the the only real information we need from him is when they're gonna cut the taxiway right by the gate because that's gonna cut off access. So I don't know. Outside of that, I I imagine Airport Drive is gonna be a mess for the next

The the only reason I really ask is not necessarily more for us kinda to your point, I get asked all the time because people know that I serve on this board. They expect me to have all the answers regarding anything and everything that relates to the airport. It would just be helpful if if I could answer them and say, they're laying the pipe in two weeks or this is gonna be done here.

I'm sure Zach could either provide us I mean, they I was at the preconstruction meeting. They have a very detailed schedule that they can provide us that you know? And if there's anything outside of that, I'm sure we could invite talk to a meeting. But

Or do it as part of your report. Sure. Yeah. Okay.

How long are they projected to have parts of Airport Drive? I think it's it's I think the total timeline, don't hold me

to this. I was only con I'm only concerned about tax. I think it's gonna be about three, you know, four months. Four months.

What's actually is gonna hit? Is it bad?

Well so the right now, the existing sewer runs down the West side of the airport and terminates and heads over to Parkdale just on the other side of the gate. So at some point, they're gonna have to cut across, the West side of the airport, and they're gonna cut off the taxiway to the Schofield Hangars Oh, no kidding. Park. They're anticipating for two days. Okay. We're we're telling people five. Okay. You know, just to kinda give a little buffer, but that little segment there will be open.

And you have, like, approximate time frame,

like, when? We don't have that date yet. Okay. But as soon as I have it, everybody will have it. Everybody that's back in.

Jason, as they're do they're doing it in sections so that that access to the gate, let's say, is That one is open? That that one is gonna be open. There'll be some access to get in there.

Yeah. Okay. For you to get to work. Yes. Yeah. So what they've done is there's gonna be you know, for a period of time, you'll access the airport down Airport Drive while they're doing the suction up to the gate, and the parking lot will be opened up. Once they cut that segment, then there's gonna be access. They've already built a temporary road as of today. Yeah. You come down there, and you come in through the airport. On the West Side as well. Through the flight mark. And so, yeah, they they may there there will be from beginning to end some path to

the airport. But Okay. This We're gonna have probably thirty, forty vehicles come in to go to the gate, to go behind the terminal. Right. And I

would inform them the date of the airfare. And so Okay. That there there should be as we get a little bit closer, two weeks out now. So I guess we're we're there. But I'll talk to Zach. I don't think right now, they're just mobilizing and doing some kind of, you know, dirt prep stuff and breaking into equipment. So I don't think that that segment will be cut by then. Oh, okay. You know, Airport Road might be down to in parts, a single lane by by the airfare, but a lot would have to happen in the next

two weeks for that to be the case. Okay.

But there has been a significant increase in activity Oh, yeah. No. It was the last week. There's all kinds of stuff going on Yeah. On top of the road. But, yeah, there's all kinds of green pipe being moved around.

And Yeah. They're replacing the water pipe, you know, which, by the way, has a lot of lead in it. So Oh. Unleaded pipes. Yeah. Mhmm.

I don't really see that. Exactly.

Is the airport being shut down during the airfare?

We are going to know of the period if we can narrow it down to an hour, but we're going to the whole airport will only be shut down for the drones.

Okay.

Okay. So we can do an hour? Yeah. Okay. So we'll do an hour. K.

Yep. And that hour will be primarily for the show itself and positioning, not the setup or cleanup. That's what I'm trying to get off of the

In the middle. It'll be, like, twelve to one.

Right.

Okay.

And once it starts, if it, you know, if it fail, ends up being a half hour show, we can we can open the airport back up.

Absolutely. Sure. Yep. As soon as they're on the ground again. Yeah. Cool.

I'll say, no. Do you put do you have access to put it in one way or like that or just put on the

No. We've got the Unicom. Unicom.

Yeah.

We'll we'll put on the. We'll be on the. We have have new closures randomly. Mean, don't know if anybody's gonna ask about it. We have aircraft incident the other day. No injuries, but we have to close the airport. From my house. See. Yeah.

I come home, I go, okay.

Yeah. Yeah. So We have to close the with your vodka. We

have to we have to go and close it for We actually have to close the airport for two hours.

The light lights work when he tore the gear off of that. Yeah.

But nobody was hurt. Nobody was hurt.

Jason Alderman.

Right. Anybody else got anything for the

good of the order? We had a couple unanswered questions about the motivation or objectives of that potential road along the solar panels from last meeting? Did we find out anything more you were going to talk to somebody?

So that yeah. That, unfortunately, I can't speak to right now. That they're hopefully, they will yeah. The the I think there'll be some further clarity with that. It it's

I'm

trying to think there is I'll I'll email everyone. There's a there's an upcoming study session that I think we have to to talk about that. Okay. You're restricted as to what you can talk. I'm restricted as yeah. Yeah.

I do have one thing just especially since we're gonna have a tent and or the board's gonna have a tent talking about topics discussion. I think the economic impact study, you know, people come in and talk to members of this board to bring that up, how significant that is. Since it since the study session, airport fees got brought up. There's a really good it's the last tab on the Colorado Pounds Association that talks about the negative impacts of user fees and planning fees. I would invite everybody to go read that. It's really good. There's a lot of actually safety implications that a lot of people don't bring up.

Can you do you have a link to that?

It's I mean, just call it on past association. I can I can send that link? But Can

you just send the link to

the thing on the page?

AirPort e at work. Yeah. The mail email address. That would be great.

Yeah. No. It's it's great talking points because I think the after the discussion of the study session, I don't think I think it's gonna be an ongoing discussion. It's also a discussion as long as well. So

I think we can probably expect some of the people who showed up at the town meeting, what have you to show up at the air show and continue their dialogue. We need to be prepared to talk to them.

Alright. With no other comments, concerns, questions, this meeting stands adjourned.