Town Council - Regular Meeting

Motion made and seconded. Is there any discussion? If not, those in favor signify by saying I. Oppose. Nay. Adopted. Three. Agenda item three, approval of minutes regular meeting of January 13, 2026. Motion made to approve and second. Are there any comments, errors, emissions? I wasn't here.

So noted. No further discussion. Those in favor of accepting the minutes as presented signify by saying I. Oppose. Nay. So approved. Agenda item four public remarks. Is there anyone present who would wish to make general republic public remarks at this time? I just wanted to let everybody know that the community survey is ready and it'll be live. I mean, I think it's open now, but I'll be spreading the or sharing the links on Facebook. It'll be on the town website. There'll be paper copies around, although we would certainly prefer if you did it electronically. Um, I have made up little cards that have the QR code on it. So, I'm gonna give one to each of you and then there'll be some around if anybody in the audience wants one. Um, so feel free to use your ticket. Thank you for passing it last time once we get it ready and it'll be open for probably months. I think we decided what it is. there. Anyone else who would care to make public remarks at this time? Not

um hi, my name is Empress Valencia. Um I'm here on behalf of the senior center to talk about my experiences there. Um so basically I prepared a speech just to talk about that. So um the senior center in East Hampton has been in create cre collaboration with the East Hampton High School's community service club also known as interact. Since the end of my freshman year I have had the pleasure of being in charge of communicating with the senior center to organize volunteers for fun events such as game days or holiday parties. And it never fails to have students pushing to sign up. With every senior center event Interact attends, there's always a great sense of community and true connection. Whether it's dancing with the senior center members with to Elvis or having a blast playing Uno, there's never once been a negative atmosphere or comment following volunteering there. Personally, I think that the senior center has helped me find out what I want to do in the future, which is to become a geriatric nurse. Finding connection and forming bonds with the older generation has made me find passion in wanting to do it for a living. And I think the senior center has given me great experiences. The senior center is important to our generation because it gives younger generations an opportunity to interact with older people whom we may never met had it not been for the center. It lessens the bridge between generations. And it is a place with strong values and community respect and bringing joy to everyone who steps in. A community center, a place not just for elders, but a place meant to bring recreation to all would be extremely beneficial to this town. I feel like that same success and community we all feel at Interact when we go to the senior center would flourish having a community center. Overall, the senior center is such an amazing place to visit and I'm extremely grateful for all the experiences I've had there. Thank you.

You're welcome. Thank you.

Is there anyone else who would like to make public comment at this time? Um, hi, my name is Samantha Pugo and I'm also here on behalf of the senior center. Um, I just want to come up here tonight and share my personal experience with the senior center as I'm currently the president of the Spanish club and the interact club at the high school. Um, my experience with the center has ranged from planning sales with seniors to just interacting at their festive events every other month. Um, all of which I've enjoyed enjoyed thoroughly. Holly and the rest of the directors have been great to work with. Um, and I think I could speak for majority of the students when I say that their events have brought the community together in a space where collaboration is welcome and appreciated. And I just feel very feel very lucky to be able to have that center to be able to participate with. Um, and I just want to say thank you to the senior center

Holly. Hi, I'm Holly Morero, the director at the East Hampton Senior Center. I sincerely want to thank the senior center service task force for the time, thought, and dedication they've put into this project. Their work has already led to meaningful progress, and we're close to completing all five short-term projects identified for the senior center. I'd also like to highlight the growing demand for our services. From July 1st, 2024 to today, the senior center has welcomed 264 new members, which that number makes me happy. Um, a lot of younger folks are starting to come in. We have our usuals and it it's just amazing to have that many new members and it's showing the importance of continued planning for our future. While we've made important strides, we still face challenges with limited space for programming, the need for staff break areas, private space for confidential meetings, and parking concerns and staffing shortages. Given these ongoing needs, it's important that the task force's efforts continue. Their collaboration and momentum are essential as we move toward modern modernization and meeting the needs of our older adult community. Thank you. Sorry, I got emotional.

Hello, my name is Lynn Wilks. I've been a resident of East Hampton for over 50 years, and it's my turn to enjoy the senior center, which I definitely am. The senior center sometimes is someone's only chance to socially interact with people. And um one of the big things about the senior center is their wonderful director as well as their excellent staff. Um the people that are there are caring and they're dedicated, but they're overworked and they definitely need someone else to assist on a full-time basis. But my personal concern is the fact that although I'm lucky enough to still drive, there are some of my friends that cannot drive. And um that's not a problem Monday through Thursday because they have a driver who is also a wonderful person. And um Friday is is a problem because he is doesn't work. He's part-time and uh he also takes vacations like we all want to do and then people are left stranded. Um now I know we have this excellent bus service in town. I haven't used it myself. However, um my this friend of mine has tried to but she has the most incredible driveway in the whole world. I I if if I had seen that house and seen that driveway, I would have run the other way because it looks like a roller coaster. And she's got a walker. She's is supposed to get up to the top of the, you know, by the road. And she can't. So Fridays all she does is sit home and say, "Gee, wonder what my friends are doing or you know, I'd like would have liked to participate in this or that or whatever." and she's

discriminated against. So, I know that the survey came back and it was 90% of the people's needs were met, but there's 3%. And those 3%, you don't want to be in one of, you know, one of them because they have no options. Sometimes they have no family. They have nobody to um back them up and support them. So, I'm hoping that money can be found somehow as to get the um full-time person and also please try to get a driver for Friday. So, thank you very much.

Thank you. Is there anyone else who would like to make public remarks at this time? Going once. Going twice. Mary, you want us to talk now about the senior center? Okay, can you get up to the microphone? Yeah. Or can we move that? I can bring it close enough. Oh, okay. Go ahead. Yes. Go ahead and talk. Thank you. Okay. We're sorry. Yes. Pull that off.

Yeah. Allow me to assist. That's how we do it. We go through this at the senior center all the time. Okay. Okay. Don't worry about it. Just go ahead and talk. Okay. Well, I want But talk to the council [laughter] because otherwise I can't hear you. Okay. All right. And to the microphone.

Okay. Council, I wanted to tell you [clears throat] that that I am a very active member of the senior center. We're talking about senior center now, right? Okay. Good. And um I've been there many many years. I used to be a receptionist and what I one time this is when I worked with Joanne and Joanne and I were alone at the senior center and she had to rush off to a meeting here and I was the only one. Well, I was fine. I said, "I'll handle it. I've been a manager before. I'll handle it." And it was fine. But there weren't enough people. And so, thank God she had me who knew a little bit about dealing with people. And I wanted to The other thing I wanted to tell you was about our Christmas party. We had a Christmas party that was really wonderful. The whole senior center is wonderful. You should be very proud of our senior center and and the good management and the good people we've had. Uh, all the staff is real friendly. They even make jokes. They're nice. They're helpful. I mean, they can't do enough for you. And and we just love them. And uh I haven't had one tiff with anybody in 20 years. And that's pretty good, isn't it?

And but I want to tell you about our Christmas party. We had a Christmas party. and what what we were told come to the Christmas party at a certain time around noonish and that she said there's no lunch but there'll be snacks. So we get there and uh the middle school had a choir there and they were playing piano and they were had us come in and and all the tables were set up. lot of tables, lot of chairs, lot of work any for them. And and uh then when they were singing, they passed out um the little sheet with all the Christmas words on it, a lot of printing, a lot of organization, but it was a happy occasion. A lot of the seniors, that's all they have for Christmas. They lost their husbands maybe or wives and and this is what they get for Christmas and it was wonderful. And then our van driver who will be here in a minute is a wonderful guy named Jim. He was Santa Claus and his wife was Mrs. Santa Claus and they were there together and it was they were very charming and then they um other then they passed out cookies and uh

come on Jim I'm talking about you he would say goodbye I come in and his and he's a wonderful van driver he he helps me all the time um but anyway um Then they they passed out the even the kids from the school passed things passed out cookies and sting and then we enjoyed talking and they uh I got a ticket you get a prize and then after that they said we want you to go down to the other end will take your picture with Santa Claus and Mrs. Claus

and Mrs. Claus. That's right, Lynn. and and and then they had peasants for us like a little uh like in a shoe box, little presents, little slippers, little creams, little perfumes and things like that. I think you were there, weren't Were you there? Didn't make it this year. Oh, you didn't this year? Well, [laughter] I know him a little bit. We um what what happened is during some of the senior events I asked him to come and sit on our table and he did. And when you first came from the Midwest That's right.

I he was delightful. I liked talking with him [laughter]

and and and I have to say Dean Markham is a pretty good card player too. But wait, wait, let let me just let me finish my story. So, after we had our little after we had our little things that we ate, they were we went down to get the presents, but the senior center staff, they're so organized, they didn't send the whole mob down at once, a few uh tables at a time. But what I noticed is even though everybody was cheerful, there was a little furid brow when they turned away because it's so much work. Those big tables when we play cards, they have to roll them and they're great and they you they store nicely, but they're heavy and the chairs, they're they do that a lot. And um if I was younger and in my golden well I am in my golden years but

but if I was younger I would have them and um they need help and I don't want to lose our staff. We need a full-time person there. So I'm pleading and keep in mind nobody's getting any younger if you have a chance to make a difference. Yes you do. All of you have and you [laughter] have a chance to make a difference and maybe someday when you want to go to the senior center you can strut in because you made help make the difference. So I wanted to tell you the story. Thank you everybody.

Thank you Mary. Can we have Mary at most of our meetings? Is there anyone else who would like to make public remarks at this time? If not, we'll move on in the agenda. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. One more. I don't have a court to get all the way over. You'll have you look able-bodied enough to come to the podium.

Hello, I'm Ava. I'm the vice president president of our interact club at East Hampton High School. We have worked a lot with the senior center and it's been so impactful to be able to see people who I wouldn't see dayto-day. Um I also sophomore year was a senior center liaison and I just want to say how amazing this program is and how much of a connection we can make u make with the people that we don't get to see usually. Thank you.

Anyone else? I'll close public remarks at this time and move on to the agenda. Agenda item five, presentations, senior center and services task force presentation. Sherry. Sorry. All right. Thank you.

No, you had I had your email sitting up there. I don't think you want that. I'm fairly certain you don't want your email sitting up there. Or will it not? If I could add something about the seniors, friend of mine, Annie Costa,

was a custodian there for a library and a senior center for 24 years and he was so delightful and uh they work an odd shift 6:30 to 1 or whatever. And I visited his wife at home. She had an illness and I visit her. He said, "Don't feed her. I get home at 1 and 1:30 and I will take care of her." And she was in a convolescent home for nine years with Parkinson's and early Alzheimer's. And uh he and Michael were invited to come to our Christmas party, but no, no, they didn't want to. Danny came and so did Michael. Michael, they came for pictures and now they want to know when can I get my picture? But anyway, these are two delightful people that have worked uh for the senior center. Okay,

thank you. Thank you so much. I can't believe you made me go after Mary and the kids from the interact club, but all right. So, good evening everybody. My name is Kim Crab. I am vice chair of the senior center and services task force. And before I share with you the summary of um our work this past year and our recommendations for moving forward, I want to take a moment to thank the members of the task force along with our dedicated adviserss for their hard work, their commitment, their dedication, and their steadfast belief in the value of and need for a new modern senior center. So tonight, I plan on sharing the work that we've conducted over the past year. We're going to look at the short-term goals that we completed that was completed by the senior center. We're going to look at the thoughts and experiences raised by residents of our town, the information we gathered through meetings with key town stakeholders, and lastly, the priorities for moving forward with this important work. And just to point out, you all received the full task force final report and its appendices, which have the complete details of the work. Tonight it's just a short summary. So, um, yes indeed, the East Hampton Senior Center is is more than just the building that it's housed in. It's a place where older adults are greeted by their name, where they take classes on nutrition, learn to tap dance, stay fit and strong, meet with others who like to write, to travel, to cook, or play the drums. It's a place to stay connected and engaged, to build friendships in a warm and friendly community that welcomes you. But the East Hampton Senior Center is aging. It's 40 years old, and the building no longer serves the growing number of adults, older

adults in town. Um, the center has grown steadily since it opened in 1986. In the last 15 months alone, nearly 300 residents have signed up as new members. There are not enough rooms for the many new and diverse programs. There are not enough staff to manage the many new and active members. And there are not enough parking spaces for the 95% of of members who drive to the center. So, the resolution um that the town council put forward in January 2025 um charged this task force to explore and examine the issues. And we took that charge seriously and committed to doing the necessary research and work. From the first meeting, we created these three working groups. Immediate needs, community outreach, and shareholder interviews. Need a tissue.

Oh, thank you. So, okay. All right. So, in the short term, uh the group uh led by senior center director Holly Morero identified five issues that were of immediate concern but could be completed within a short amount of time and they succeeded in completing all five woo with almost all five close with no small thanks to the funding com provided by the Rotary and the donation of a computer by the library. So, what did they complete? Installation of water bottle filling stations, which save the town hundreds of dollars every year. Um, updates to the computer center with the addition of a new computer, installation of ADA compliant handrails on two restrooms, communication and check-in area was redesigned, and a new coffee bar and social area was completed. Um, in no time this area has become a place to sit and chat, have a coffee and a pastry and catch up with a friend. So, um, wrong direction. The next uh, subgroup was community outreach and uh, we held six focus groups with 29 residents in ages from 50 to 89. Almost all drove their own cars. Most had attended the senior center but not regularly. Um and uh this is the summary of what we heard from those focus groups. Most were unaware of all the events, activities and the recent senior center upgrades. They found the environment depressing or outdated. They found the oper hours of operation were not conducive to their schedules and um they have physical

limitations and identified parking as a problem especially during bad weather or peak hours. Um so in our survey which I'll talk about in one quick moment uh the last question was do you have any other comments? So the next few slides show some of those 83 comments that we received just a couple. And this one I thought was pretty powerful. I feel strongly that a senior center must not be isolated and must be a part of the larger community. This would encourage promote interaction and activities across generational boundaries that would be beneficial to all. So then we did our survey and the survey was directed to all community members over the age of 18. It was open for 5 weeks from August to September and 314 residents completed it. uh 18% were under the age of 60 and 82% were 60 or older. And um this graph shows some of the basic demographics of our outcomes of the survey. So 95% live less than 5 miles from the senior center. 97% are moderately or very active. 68% were retired and 32% were still working. 95% were healthy or very healthy. 95% drove and 89% own their own home. And here's another comment. I'm in my mid30s, but it is important for me to complete this survey because our seniors would benefit from more options and activities in town. Further, a community center would be beneficial for residents of all ages. Um some additional data that was reserve um that was observed from the survey. 84% of those respondents would like to see a community center. 74% of respondents

ages 60 to 69 they want expanded hours evening and weekend. 88% of those people um also want a community center. 95% of respondents again reported that they drive and 63% have a interest in expanding the parking lot. And here's a great quote. I hope to be able to stay in East Hampton for years to come. As I have now lived here 27 years and consider East Hampton home, my hope is that as I continue to age, I will have a community that is able to provide me with a safe, inclusive, and productive space to enjoy my later years of life. As a longtime town taxpayer, I hope that the town is able to look at its aging population as closely as it looks at its school age or educational population. So, of those 83 comments, to me, this comment felt like one of the most important one of all. I think this is great. The town is taking a serious interest in East Hampton's aging population and community needs. So, you, the members of the town council, should know that adults in town, feel that they are now being seen and that they are now being heard. Establishing this task force was important to our residents, was long in coming and is more important now than ever before. Um, and finally, the last subgroup was stakeholder interviews. So, this group met with these six town leaders chosen for their interest in and expertise on the needs and issues surrounding the current and future senior center community center. um all stakeholders, they welcome the opportunity to discuss the needs and wants of the senior center and a future future community center.

Results of the townwide survey uh was shared with everybody. Here are some of the highlights. Representatives from the senior center, the library, parks and wreck. They had common needs related to additional space and parking. And of course, the senior center expressed a critical need for an additional staff person. Uh there were concerns that were raised around expansion at the current location and reconfiguring space in the senior center and library as well as parking issues. And uh there's a typo here I noticed the other uh yesterday and I didn't finish the town manger.

That's you and planning office agree that further assessment of needs fe feasibility and cost needs to take place by an architectural firm. So, okie do priorities. When we put all that information together, all the work we did this year, um these are the shortterm priorities that we came to. Number one, addition of a full-time staff member at the senior center. How many times can I say how much we needed? We needed um number two, additional space for programs and classes. They have reached their maximum number of programs and classes. They have run out of space. Um, and you've heard it, you'll hear it again, additional parking. So, these two photos are on October 30th of this past year. This is the parking lot of the senior center and library where both centers had a event going on at the same time. There was not one parking spot available anywhere. And as you can see in the bottom photo, one of our members with a walker had to walk get her way in bad weather all the way to where the van is, which is where the front door of the senior center is. Face this every day all the time. Long term, what do you think we need long term? A new senior center and community center is a long-term goal. So, what's happening out there in the world? The data is clear. The number of adults over 65 is expanding at unprecedented numbers with some professionals calling it a gray tsunami with 11,400 adults turning 65 every single day. If you look at this chart, if you look at this

chart, you can see the growth of the uh population over the age of 65. In 1900, there were 3.1 million adults over 65. 2020, there were 56 million. 2040, there's expected to be 80 million. And it's only going up from there. What's happening here in Connecticut? [clears throat]

In Connecticut, 24.5% of the population are 60 and over. In East Hampton, 26.1% of our population is over 60. We are expecting to live much longer than our parents and grandparents. And the structures that we put in place to support healthy aging are really, really crucial. So this is what happened in the East Hampton Senior Center as of August 2024 to December 2025. There were 2,138 members. There were 18,246 total event signins. There were 35,98 total hours of programming. There were 342 trips. There were 2,914 individuals who had transportation during that time and 1752 hours of volunteers. So, and staff, we got one full-time director and four part-time assistants. So the 2025 this past year budget at the senior center is less than 1/ half of 1% of the total town budget. And we must ask ourselves, are we ready? Is the East Hampton Senior Center equipped to continue to grow its programs and services to meet the needs of a growing and diverse population? Currently, there are three generations of older adults that use the senior center. You have the silent generation, those ages 77 to 97. You have the boomer generation, ages 58 to 76. And now, generation X, those currently 45 to 60 years old. Is the senior center building equipped to

continue this level of growth, especially the needs of those 55 and 60 who were recently approved to join the center? Are we ready? Oh, wrong direction. No, we're not ready. So, in our final report, this task force completed its work as set out by the resolution, and we are now asking the town council to consider the following steps. Approval of an additional full-time staff member at the senior center. reconfigure the membership of the senior center and services task force for the next year to reflect the required competencies and specializations that will be needed. Define expectations for the next phase of discovery and action. And finally, engage a consultant that will conduct a uh needs assessment to evaluate and recommend staffing, parking, and interior space for current and future growth. hopefully to com be to be completed by September 2026. So, the East Hampton Senior Center is a place for community. It's a place for connection, a place for health and fitness, and it's a place for engagement. According to Dr. Dr. VC Murthy, the former US surgeon general, being socially disconnected increases our risk of heart disease, dementia, depression, anxiety, and premature death. For those of us that understand the hardships that older adults face when partners pass, friends move away, homes become unmanageable, and health declines, we understand just how important our senior center is. spend just one day, even one hour at the senior center to know that there is support and hope and friendship

to be found. But with everything we saw and heard and documented, we know that this level of service for the older adults in town is simply unsustainable. That's it. Do we have any questions? Anyone in council questions? Was there not I don't think so at this point but or Jack not okay. I'd like to commend the members of the senior center and services desk on the job they have done in making clear the issues of the support of seniors in the senior center. All the members have made a notable contribution. I'd like to particularly thank Krab for coordination of the test. They have recommended that we continue the effort on the senior center and services and I support that recommendation and hope that we broaden participation will others in the community handle services to people in also [clears throat] I support their recommendation that we have a second full-time person at the senior center this is not a very costly step having only one full-time person at the senior center is under staff The number of people using the senior center and seeking support there certainly justify an extra full-time person.

Thank you so much. Thank you. Joel, I just want to thank you and all of the committee for all of your hard work. As as somebody who has dealt with um aging parents and um and the passing of my dad and Parkinson's and Alzheimer's and all that, I understand how important having a place like this to go is and just having that camaraderie and that support amongst friends. So, I am looking forward I have not been to the senior center, but I am looking forward to going down and visiting with you all. And um I just want to thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you.

I would recommend to any of my colleagues here on the council, take a little time and go play some setback or do really big cards. I don't know.

I love setback. or have a cookie or a cup of coffee. But it's it's an enjoyable experience and we'll have you all back during the budget process and the hearings where you can expound upon your thoughts to a greater degree. No further comments from the council. Move on the agenda. Bids and contracts. review and possible action on police lease union contract.

Apparently, I'm not all that exciting. I think the room is going to I think the room is going to empty out. And we know why they came here tonight, apparently. Don't worry folks, just go ahead and walk. That's our I don't mind.

I tell you. Right. The next item on the council's agenda is to review uh a proposed update to the police union contract uh for the upcoming term. Uh you'll recall that the uh police bargaining unit includes uh everyone below the rank of lieutenant. Uh so that's lieutenants uh three sergeants and uh all of our police officers, all 12 of them uh who serve in uniform wear badge every day. Um their agreement uh their current agreement is set to expire on uh the end of June uh in this fiscal year. It's a three-year agreement that comes to uh comes to end uh June 30th, 2026. However, as a result of some conversations we've been having with the community over the last uh several months, uh and you've heard [laughter]

and you've heard the chief uh talk with you about the challenges and concerns we've had about recruiting uh individuals to fill positions uh in our police department. you know that we've been um short staffed for a number of months actually several a number of years uh we've been short staffed in trying to deal with that challenge. So the conversation uh around this particular contract uh dealt with that or attempted to deal with that. So, uh, while the contract you have in place today expires on June 30th, 2026, uh, the proposal in the new agreement is to start, uh, earlier than that upon some final actions by the town council. I'd like to take a couple of minutes and just review with you the the major changes that are taking place. For the most part, the contract remains the same. It's been the same contract for uh, many, many years. uh and each year we try to adjust a little bit uh to improve operations and uh we deal with economic issues. The most significant changes that we've made in this particular contract revolve around pension. Uh the police officers are the only group who continues to who who are new employees that continue to receive access to a defined benefit pension program. uh as opposed to new employees in the balance of the community, in the balance of the town, uh have access to a defined contribution plan. In order to help make East Hampton more competitive, we took a step last year to increase wages slightly uh and that helped uh and in order to become more competitive in this contract, we're making some other amendments uh to the agreement uh as well. One of the changes moves the final calculation or where the the formula around the final calculation used to determine earnings. And therefore what

one makes in retirement is being reduced from a calculation that include that counts 60 consecutive months, five years to four consecutive year uh months or or rather years 48 consecutive months. There's also a provision in there that allows an officer that's been impacted by workers compensation. So an injur an officer who was injured on the job uh and his pay is impacted during uh that period of time uh can substitute another month adjacent to that 48-month period. Uh that was a concern that was brought up forward by the officers because that has occurred unfortunately for some of our officers in those last few years of their employment. Major injuries have occurred. They've been out for uh multiple months and it has an impact into their retirement. Uh, we changed the eligibility for retirement from serving with East Hampton for 25 years back to 20. And I say it that way intentionally. We made a change a number of years ago that moved it up to 25. We're going to put it back to 20 because uh in the evaluations that we did of pension plans and that sort of uh benefit in the in the state, we found that uh more of them were in uh especially those that were in our our uh comparables group were more likely to have a 20-year time frame. We've also allowed uh employees to purchase at their cost up to five years of service as a veteran uh in the US armed services or a police officer serving in another organization, another accredited organization. So, we're allowing them to purchase uh that up to 5 years. The other more significant change is one that you don't see very often, but it does still exist and has and does show itself in some pension plans in the state uh is a cost of living adjustment for retirement

benefits. So the benefits that they get paid as a pension uh recipient uh will go up after they reach the age of 62 by 1% per year. Uh in addition the uh employees so that we don't fall behind on wages uh will their wages will be adjusted uh 3% annually in exchange if you will um the officers will play will pay an additional 2% uh most of the officers will pay an additional 2% uh of their salary into the pension plan to help pay their costs. uh that has value to the community, to the organization, uh to the town. Uh additionally, in the end, in the last year of the contract, they'll pay slightly more for their slightly slightly higher percentage of their health insurance premium. They'll move to 15% uh from their current 14 a.5. So, small move, but nonetheless a move. More significantly, however, the uh the chief and the and the officers were able to work out some operational changes that I think will be very beneficial to the chief. uh some allowances for uh bringing in certified officers at a higher salary rate uh to help encourage bringing in people who are already certified as officers in East Hampton or rather in East Hampton already certified as officers in Connecticut to East Hampton um for a variety of reasons. Sometimes we've been able to attract as as you'll recall I've said from this podium uh individuals who served a full career somewhere else are young enough want to move on want to come to East Hampton and do a few more years with us uh we can pay them commensurate with that similarly we have another in you know we've had individuals who have been with an organization for a short period of time certified officer but that wasn't a fit for them East Hampton is a fit we can bring them in pay them commensurate with their service uh with their experience uh and uh not force them back to the beginning, so to speak, of our pay

scale. There was a conversation that we had earlier, and I'll share that with the community because I think it's an important one. The the cost of sending someone to the academy, right? So, we hire somebody who was a non-certified officer. They've never been to the police academy before. We hire them and we begin to pay them a salary. They spend six months in the police academy and they spend three months in field training. Before they are released, become a fully certified police officer and begin to patrol on their own. Nine months of pay, round numbers, is probably uh closing in on $60,000. If we can hire one individual who is a fully certified police officer, even if we pay them at the top of the range, we still save well over $30,000 on that one move. Um, so it's an important uh agreement that we came to there. Additionally, uh, we made some other operational changes again that I think the chief and the the department agree will make it easier for us to respond to major community events like old home days and the variety of things of that sort. uh as well as dealing with some other operational changes that uh that uh don't bear well for this conversation. Uh so nonetheless uh you have in front of you a an agreement that is uh modified uh as I described. You have two versions of it uh and it'll be added to the uh to the agenda materials for this meeting so folks in the community can see it. You have one that shows the clean version. You have one that shows uh all of the changes that have been uh incorporated. and you are asked uh on behalf of the management team and the officers to approve that contract. The officers have uh ratified the agreement uh as presented to you. So they are in agreement as well.

Any questions of the town manager? Rich?

Yeah, I think David I think this is great. You covered a lot of territory here, but a lot of good work has come out of your negotiations, but I think it would be helpful here in public forum to discuss the challenges that we've had. I know we've had an internally uh in executive session, those sorts of things. But I think it's extremely important to talk about the challenges we've had um in hiring and not just us but statewide um to put things in perspective of why we're so focused on these sorts of things if you could.

Uh I can try. I can certainly do that. Absolutely. And the chief is here uh as well. And if I if I don't say something, uh, Chief Westerner, feel free to come up and and take over the podium. Um, well, look, um, as I alluded to before, we've had, um, vacancies for a number of years. Uh initially prior to the time that we amended our salary range and you'll recall that discussion uh the town of East Hampton was uh of the 90 uh police organizations or 91 police organizations in the uh in the community, the town of East Hampton was uh in the bottom quarter in terms of of starting in top pay if I remember those figures correctly. uh the adjustment that we made at least moved us into the middle and perhaps the upper half uh of uh of pay in the state. So that particular change had pretty a nearly immediate impact on the number of candidates that we were getting um for our positions and for various advertisements. we were getting only one or two uh people applying to the organization and no certified generally. um that change I'll say doubled that number right we got four maybe five uh candidates applying when we had openings it helped and it wasn't enough though um as we started to go through through these discussions and police officers began to um see what the possibility ilities were. I think that they started to feel like uh there was a light at the end of the tunnel. Um

we made some headway and knowing that these kinds of concepts were in play uh I think made us more attractive to some some of those certified candidates that we saw. And so as we evaluated this and began to talk about this as a possibility, it started to show up where we're now getting certainly not the numbers we used to, but we're now getting seven, eight people that are are coming in for uh for um a particular opening or a particular session uh a an oral board as they call it interviews the rest of us would call it, but an oral board uh for the police organization. So, uh, it has really been a challenge for is it it's 2 and 1/2 years that we've been down four police officers.

One time down six.

It's not It doesn't help that we have an officer who's currently called up to the reserves. We have another officer that we have a an employee problem with, uh, who's not working. But, it then those things don't help. But um it's really those situations that we're trying to address. Uh you alluded to the rest of the state and frankly it's the rest of the country. It's a challenging time to um state in public so to speak that you want to be a police officer. Uh has been for a number of years. Um and the way communities unfortunately have to react to that is like any organization that needs people with a particular skill, you have to pay a little more. Um, and that's really what started us down this path of looking at what does pay look like for other organizations in the state. And as we talked about, as I alluded to earlier, what do the other benefit programs look like uh for communities that are our size? We tried to make sure that we weren't talking trying to compare to our compare ourselves to um, you know, a West Hartford necessarily or a New Haven or somebody who has a lot of resources in that regard. uh we primarily focused on municipalities of our size, population grand list. We did however look at what the pension plans were for some of the organizations to whom we lost officers. Whether they were our own officers who chose to move to another organization or they were officers who seemed interested in us but chose another organization uh or rather individuals who were not yet officers but moved to another organization. We wanted to see how we compared to those other organizations to try and get to try and understand more fully why did they make that choice. So, um, at at a high level, I guess that's kind of what we were trying to to uh address and hopefully that answered your question. Chief, is there anything you'd want to add? No, he's shaking his head. No, I

think that's important to everybody here, especially session. you know, you guys worked hard to bring this home and to make it meaningful for new recruits and think you've done a great job. Thank you. Well, I'm certainly not alone in that, but thank you. [laughter] Right. So, as I said, if you're uh if you're willing, um uh we would take we would appreciate a motion to approve uh the agreement. Joan motion check second. Is there any discussion?

My only comment on that information you said will be added to the packet. Yep. for this. Um, personally I feel out of trans I'm I support it, but personally I feel out of transparency that it might be a good idea to let the res have the opportunity to do it. All right. Is there a second? Any further discussion? We'll table this until our next meeting, which is

February 10th. February. February 10th. No. Um, no, it it doesn't. I mean, you certainly can vote on that. Um, we'll continue to move forward based on your comments. Um uh we'll continue to move forward preparing sort of the second step which is as I mentioned to you bringing forward uh the pension the actual pension documents that change the plan. Uh we need to prepare those yet and bring those forward. So we'll begin to work on that assuming that nothing m dramatic changes. Can I ask a question?

You may. If we push this out, correct me if I'm wrong, I may be. I thought that with our approval this evening, there were certain aspects of it that would go into effect. They would go into effect when the council approved the amendments to the pension plan in detail. So, so it's not if we table, it's not delaying any implementation of those. Correct. Okay.

The effective date in the in the agreement is the later the latter of or rather it's the earlier of either your approval of the changes to the pension plan or July 1. So as soon as you get those done which would have been in a couple of week in a couple of meetings anyway. So this particular delay won't have an impact. Ju just for the record I am in a support of this uh contract and although I'd like to pass it tonight for the reasons so stated transparency we'll uh defer this till our next meeting.

Okay. Can I make a comment? Sure. I'd like to state that I'm in support of the contract, too. And um I just want to make a comment to the chief that um just based on what I've seen, I um your officers are very lucky to have you to see the advocacy that he has um provided for his officers has been wonderful. That's very true. Very true. We're lucky to have him. Yeah. We're all lucky. people. Okay. Uh I will put that on the agenda next time. Your bylaw is allowed that just two of you can push it. So

we'll do that. Moving on the agenda seven, resolutions, ordinances, policies, and proclamations. You have none of those this evening. Agenda item eight, continued business. A subcommittee reports and update updates. Is there anyone

ste committee? We had our discussion last week with the EDC's um that I thought that went very well. We've had some great participating in that discussion and our next very important discussion is housing which we will share a little bit about tonight but that uh focused discussion this Thursday at 5:30 in this item. So I certainly urge residents to attend and let us know your thoughts on housing. Thank you. Anyone else subcommittee reports? Well, it's not really my subcommittee, but I'm going to report anyway. Why not?

Um, so, uh, just let you all know, uh, if you don't already, uh, the ambulance received a, uh, very large donation, um, from a resident of $30,000 to, uh, purchase a, uh, a mannequin, uh, to assist them with the trade. uh that has uh commence. Uh the first training is on the third 31st and uh the it was uh purchased uh to try to uh uh assist the ambulance but not only assist the ambulance but hopefully uh start working with the um high school or other organizations to uh better community for emergency services.

Very good. Anyone else? Move on. Agenda item 8B, review and possible action on town council bylaws. Do you want to You're up.

Uh so, um we had a subcommittee for our town council bylaws that we uh we tried to do as comprehensive a review of them um as possible. They were originally adopted in 2016 and then readdopted in 2020. So um um information was taken amongst all of the council members and then um along with our town manager and based on those conversations and suggestions, we made some um updates uh to the bylaws. A lot of it was just language and numbering and basic stuff that hadn't been looked at in quite a long time. So we did that. Um but we also wanted to um ensure that um there was a clear authority process in our town council meetings. Um and um how our meetings are conducted and uh you know just clarifying rules around public participation because I know there's been some you know concerns around that. Um and just a quorum and the conduct of town council members um the rules of debate just doing a lot of clarification of the current um bylaws to just kind of update and modernize them. So with that um you all have a copy of the of the changes and um Tim do you want to add anything? No, besides you've done you did a very well. This was not an easy task. It really wasn't. And uh you was sat on this thing. We did sit with Mr. Cox for a while and discuss some things back and forth. Uh some of the stuff was dated. Some of it we just needed to sharpen up a pencil a little bit and things a little bit. I don't think there's anything major in here besides more better explanation of things.

Yeah. Just my Yep. Sing 22 second paragraph. It should has a message with the non special doesn't clarify that

then should be there. Yeah, it just talks about the council chairperson um appointing members of the council to subcommittees, but there's no talk of um appointment of other members to those sub subcommitteees. So, we wanted to maybe add a line in there that said the um shall appoint members of the council and the public, I guess, and other I don't know how you want to word that. The public maybe. Yeah. other or members of the public to other to such subcommittees. No, it but it's not mandatory to appointatory to others others

depending on what the committee depends on the topic and this subject. I would urge you to think about what you're really talking about. If you're talking about a a body that you intend to be a subcommittee of the council, truly a subcommittee of the council should be just then I think it's just council members. If you're talking about a body that is something else, then I don't think it's really described here. It's really a task force, a new subcommittee or a new committee, a new something else that might have council members on it. Just food for thought. Otherwise, I'm standing here ready to take down your notes.

Right. of the council, right? Does that make sense to you, Jack? Are you looking by the bylaws need a method for appointing other committes or other things? Council has the authority to uh

on the charter to either uh approve resolutions or ordinances. I don't think anybody would argue that the council has the ability to do as the chairman just mentioned. I I I'd have to I don't have the the full set of policies in front of me, but I think there might be uh policies that relate to that, but I think this is intended to be committees of your body, in which case Yeah. Is that okay, Jack? Yeah.

Right. Any Ted?

I have a couple uh concerns. Um one is um regarding emails and video um the videos that are seen. um if someone sent us an email and asked us to be read into the thing which has been happening numerous times and uh the chair's response was well it's added to our packet and it's not it's being uh it's not being lit yet someone that posts a video instead of adding it to our packet or our online packet it is shown on the screen which means you're discriminating against one member of the public

in favor of another. So, if they both took the time to address the council, why is one of them allowed to be seen at a public meeting and one is excluded from being heard in a public meeting, especially when they're not able to attend? They send an email and they are asked specifically to be read into the meeting minutes and they have been told continuously, "No, we're just going to staple into our council packet, put it on file." So, if we're going to not allow for um emails to be read into the meeting minutes, then we should not be allowing video to be shown at the council meetings. They should be attached to emails or something to the otherwise you you're taking one person and putting them uh in a different place than another and that that's not appropriate. Um that that's one of my comments. This other one under communication with the town attorney. Now we do have a pol and um this this is the town's council chair person in consultation with the town manager. They'll determine whether they're request for engagement by our charter. The town council chair is for ceremonial purposes. He does the chair does not hold any more power than any one of the other seven members. So you are then going against the charter by giving one person more power than one of the other seven. And I do not agree that especially when we already have a policy where it is notified or if one or more council members do ask that it is to become

correct me if I'm wrong you might remember or or Mr. Town Manager. Um, I believe both of the um sections of the bylaws that you're referring to were already part of they were already in the bylaws of the we have a separate policy for the communication with the town. I took that is it was I don't have a copy of the old notify the town uh the the town council chair and the town manager.

It does not say communicate with the uh consultation or uh consultation with the town manager or the town council chair. It says you notify the chair. That's a respect thing as the chair of the thing. It does not say he has any more authority than you do on making that determination. Nor should it because he has no more say than any other council member by Charlie. And then the other section that you referenced in terms of the email and the video that was already part of the bylaws. That doesn't make it right. Right. It was just I'm just telling you where you put public participation. I'm just stating that it was not changed.

That was in there already. Just so you know. I don't care if we're in there or not. I was here the first time. I'm just telling you it's it was in there since 2016. That's what I'm going to say. We didn't have video since 2016. We No. No, it was already in the bylaw. We've had video since 2016. No. What I'm saying is maybe it was that was an update in 2020, but what we went off of was the up was the current bylaw. I'm not saying you I'm just letting I'm saying that this in itself is wrong. I don't care who did

so say this I hear what you're saying to make any changes. I told you that at the last meeting I had concerns about it. It prior to us meeting as a committee. I reached out to every board member and asked them or council member as we didn't um Can you let me finish please? Ted, prior to our last council meeting and prior to our committee meeting, I reached out to every council member and asked for any suggestions for updates or changes to the current bylaws. You never responded. And when you responded at the meeting last week, you only responded about that last section about um

No, I said I had a Well, you didn't call me after that either, did you? So, you were given plenty of opportunity. So, you're going to leave it wrong just because I'm not saying that. I'm just making a point here that you have to communicate in order to make the proper changes. If you want changes made, communication is important amongst council members to get the product right. Are you kidding me? You're going to lecture me on communication when you guys have your meetings on Sunday night and come with pre-written drafts of everything. We have a meeting on a Sunday, Mr. One at a time.

What meeting was on a Sunday night? You're telling me that you don't need to caucus and and that Jack doesn't have a written thing for every one of our meetings so far that he reads his thing. He has a right to have him comment further to what we're doing. Nobody helps me write them. I write. Is there something wrong with that for him caring about what's on the agenda and making comments?

I'm confused, Ted. Very confused. Are there any further comments or questions regarding the proposed bylaws? Mr. Chairman, I do have in front of me the the policies that are along with the bylaws. uh as as council member hints did indicate the policy of the town I don't know necessarily the language in the bylaws where that came from necessarily but the policy document does talk about uh it does describe as Mr. Hence noticed or made the comment on legal information to obtain legal information from the town attorneys. A council member must contact the town chair or the town manager explaining the request. All of the council members will be notified. The response from the attorney will be emailed to all. Uh it also made a comment that said um they were hoping to uh acknowledge the legal fees are increasing and that the council should be aware of uh how we handle that to keep those costs down. is essentially what it said. But the piece about uh a determination regarding the the matter between the town manager and the and the council chair is not described in the policy that was adopted more recently.

I think the concern on that is should I I understand Mr. point and it shouldn't necessarily be the the chairperson's decision, but should the council as a whole be making that decision if we will counsel engage so that it's not one person saying hey I think we need legal help when the rest of the council is like no we understand it's good so I think I don't think it is just the chairperson though isn't it chairperson and the town manager

but again that's giving him more control than anyone else so should it be a vote of the council or should some vote of the council be taken before legal services are engaged since it does cost taxpayer money. Obviously, the council may do what it wishes. I think that particular decision creates lag and creates issues. You could certainly handle that at a meeting if you were if somebody brought up an issue and it says I think we should get legal counsel, you can agree by acquiescence. But if someone were to come to me in between with a matter that probably bears legal review, I would hate to have us sit here and wait two weeks or whatever it is to the next council meeting for you all to decide whether we want to get an opinion on it. I mean, the reality is managers, myself and my predecessors have been making that decision when approached by council members all along. whether it is a matter that needs to be addressed or maybe there is already information known oftenimes we can answer that question. So and I'll I'll just make it clear there has been no instance that I have been presented to me as chairman where I would be was asked for find legal services. Those situations that have come up have been questions raised in general by the council and we've moved that to the town manager to engage

attorney and in some instances individuals council members or more than one have gone to the town manager to seek uh legal counsel. And I think that came I think the one issue I do remember is something that you had brought up Ted regard to uh the budget and that was that the only time that the council members asked for a legal reason otherwise you wouldn't have a policy.

No. So I can assure you it wasn't just me requesting information as No, I just pointed that out as one example that I remember. I don't recall any others and

I think that should be changed to address the policy that is you know communication with the attorney should be referenc You know, I think what we were, or at least I uh was concerned about from the existing policy was it sounded like anyone anyone councelor could ask the town manager to go get a legal opinion. Um, and personally, uh, I don't think that's correct. one one council member uh who hopefully had the best interest of the town on their mind hopefully but also have nefarious reasons for that for whatever reason. And what I think we should be driving for here is a a way to uh a methodology to engage legal opinion which uh takes it out of the hands of of only one counselor. That's that's my theme. So whatever we have to do and write relative to that, that's what we should do. But I shouldn't have that power. Nobody on this bench should have the power to just call the interview and say, "Hey, uh, let's go and talk to Rich Carella about this issue and have them have them issue an opinion." That should not happen.

Actually, it's been used for uh getting opinions regarding the town manager when the town manager had done some things where they sit the town manager went directly to the town attorney and that has been done in the past too. what's been done in the past. We act as a council you point out and nobody has any other power than anybody else and nor and therefore one council member certainly should not have the right to dictate to the town manager to go to uh the attorney any attorney attorney or any special special attorney specialist attorney to get a legal reason. So that's what I think we should be driving. I'm not with the language.

I'm fine with that. You know, even if it's a couple council members have the same, you know, thought u but it should not be again if you want to change it to something. If we want to amend the policy, we'll amend the policy, but the bylaw should reference the policy should not be putting a new policy by the bylaws when there's a policy that fix conflicting policy. Mr. Policy If the policy and the bylaws disagree, I would argue the bylaws would prevail. But

why can't the town manager unilaterally make a decision that a legal opinion is necessary unless uh a subsequent uh council meeting uh we decide that it makes sense to me. We run some town. I mean certainly the dayto day you get. So I mean if we had a strike out the town council chairperson maybe that's what we do. It's fine to just submit a request to the town manager.

Yeah. Town manager. It's up to him. he doesn't have to honor the request, but the chair should be notified, I would think, and that's where the policy says that I think and and it wasn't an immediate reaction when David, it wasn't the last one. It wasn't just because I put a request in because you had already worked at it and you had we discussed it a couple times before you decided whether you were going to get the legal opinion. So it wasn't even something that was just hey we're we're doing it because that was what over a course of what two weeks maybe four beds. So it's not like it was something that was hey we're doing this today and it was done today. It was many discussions about that.

Um I mean I will tell you in my tenure it's not often that council members specifically come and say we should get an opinion on that. I I think it's it's often a matter that comes forward in the town and certainly in my tenure I have if I didn't feel we knew the answer already then I would go seek that advice get the opinion you know whatever it was if it was just a simple answer such or if it was more involved uh get the get the council involved I suspect my predecessors did the Council member Hints raised an issue of of how how would the council go to the town to the proper town man town council town attorney if they wanted to inquire about the town manager's conduct. I think in that instance certainly the council could make that decision and whether it's the chair that reached out or a particular council member I think the council could certainly make that choice or however it needed to to circumvent the town manager if I violated something or what have you.

I mean and that last time I did go through the chair but the council was aware and there was two council members I think that initiated where all communication did get to council as a I think that's probably one of the more important pieces.

I think that's probably one of the more two of the more important parts is we're going to reach assuming that the rest of the council doesn't already know just from discussion. We're going to reach out to the count to the town's attorney for this matter and when that opinion comes in, everybody gets to see it, which I think we've done in general. How you want to address that is up to you. Your policy gives um uh option uh for a town council member to either contact the chair or the town manager and then as I mentioned it all council members get notified and the responses shared with all of them.

We don't have a bush for this. So I mean I would just say reference to the the uh somehow in this or communication with the attorney refer to policy whatever

or you could strike it and just leave the policy in place. Great.

Remind me, I'm sorry, what the policy says.

The uh policy um uh reads as follows. Uh the the policy says to obtain legal information from the town attorneys, a council member must contact the town council chair or the town manager explaining their request. All of the members of the council will be notified. The response from the attorney will be emailed to all council members. Well, well, that again that suggests that one council member has the right to dictate that the attorney. That's what that said. By all means, it implies it. It implies it. I think that one council member can notify the attorney and or town manager that a legal opinion is is is wanted and then that'll that'll happen and then be distributed. doesn't say that.

No, all counselor. No, all not right. But he can still do it. Okay. From a practical meth, do you think the town attorney is going to engage any town council member individually without the town manager? Think about it. No, that's not the issue.

I I understand. But so when I brought up that I was told that uh Dave had the ultimate say whether he was going to you because we went back and forth on this for weeks uh on the matter and it was and they said it's going to be his decision in the end. That's not what that policy said. I thank you. That's what I said and that's but that's not what happens.

That policy and you put it in the uh in our bylaws which you just decided we don't rule the policy. Let's do this the right way and quite frankly can that policy that's what I would do. I mean I think that's the well how would you write it so that would be sue council members. So I would say that the town manager has the discretion to engage the council if they feel it's necessary and if the town manager says no then perhaps two council members can force or a majority of council members can force the issue to be brought to

it should be at least a two member. So I mean or or change the policy to you know require two members to have the same concern. No, I I think that's nuts.

Well, communication with the attorney as it's written here, the middle paragraph, which I would change, current middle paragraph says, council chairperson in [clears throat] consultation with town manager shall determine whether the request warrants. you should probably say scratch the council chairperson and basically say the town manager shall determine whether the request warrants engagement council that's what I that's what I would say and obviously if in fact a majority of this board this council in meeting feels that his decision was wrong in fact he decided not to get the legal opinion, then we could override it and go get one. But again, we should we should not allow any person individually to dictate to the town manager that that a legal opinion is necessary in my view because again outside of this formal board meeting, we have no no responsibility, no authority to do anything. only in meeting do we have that authority. So that would be my recommendation. If you've got an issue with this head, I would just say take that middle paragraph just what I said. You had a you had a gripe about the council chairperson.

I would say two council members if you insert two. No, I think I think I think if the town manager says no, we're not going to get it. Then at the next meeting it can be discussed by the entire council and the council can decide if it's warranted or not. That's right. Not two council memb. So you're saying then that only the majority of the council is ever going to be able to. So therefore

you're saying it has to be majority. Then you're saying that wherever the party in control is the only one that is going to have access to the talent attorney or you make it two then you have minority that has the same ability. So you're you're doing the same thing because if it was uh five Republican and two Democrat and they said, "You know what? You you really want the thing." Um you're not getting it because we're going to sit there on our heels because we're going to make it a a party line. That is not what is intended by anything that is for minority. It should be two pe two members of the council. Any two members of the council.

Where you go wrong on this is the oldfashioned approach to politics where it's always Democrats against Republicans. That's where you're going wrong here. We as a council together, seven are are elected to work together for the betterment of this town. So I I absolutely You don't think working together is a better for the betterment of the town? That's not what I and I would suggest that those discussions should not in public in front of the residents.

That you know um so Rich, we want to keep the first sentence there. Yes. Just remove the council chair first. Just remove that in consultation with just fine. I think that makes sense. It's the right way to go. each. I agree.

Is that an amendment? a motion to amend the

had a motion to move the I would move the uh second paragraph about the five communication with attorney who say that the start with town manager shall determine whether the request and uh can the council chairperson in consultation That's what I would say. I think that does the thing that I would do that was

wait a minute head that that's the question I'm asking Kathy. Was a motion made? No. Okay. Terrell, would you like to make a motion on the bylaws? Motion on the amendment, right? I'll make a motion to accept the bylaws as as presented as presented with the strikeout of the with the strikeout of uh under section five, communication with attorney. We move um the second paragraph the council chairperson in consultation with second.

Are there any other comments? What about the communication? What about the video and the email? Oh, if you're going to allow one, then you have to allow both. They are stating that if the email is sent to the council or requesting that it be readest meeting so that all the audience can hear it, it should be done or we should not allow the videos to be shown to the public because you're discriminating against one side or the other. But you're not because the emails are available in the town council packet and the public has the ability to look at the packet and read all of them

and the video is not the video's not online. It's not well then it needs to be added to it because if you are allowing that person who does the video the ability to talk to everyone directly. If there's someone that takes the time to write the email and they request that it be read into public comment, then it should be read in two to three minutes wherever it lies and it if they it doesn't if it extends past the three minutes, it gets shut off. But they should have the same right as anyone else. Sorry. They do

only if they're requested to be read in. It doesn't, you know, if if they request it, it should be done. And those individuals, if they send an email, could also call in on Zoom. There's a little reasons why they they they sent the email. If they could be here, they probably would, but they sent emails and they made public comment and then they're doubling up to their if they request it read into public comment. It should be read into public com. I'm okay with that.

Where are the words in this that you It's under communications section section 1.4.1

underneath the bullets. The council recognizes that some members of the public may be unable to address the council in person during a regular meeting. Public remarks may therefore be also be submitted in writing or through other town approved electronic means including recorded video messages. And then in the following paragraph, written communications from residents or local taxpayers shall be included as part of the correspondence listed on the agenda and incorporated into the official record as attachments to the meeting minutes. Recorded or other electronic messages submitted through a town approved method shall be presented during the public remarks portion of the next regular meeting. So we could add something in there. It says electronic messages. We could say recorded or other electronic messages submitted through it or if requested.

Yeah. So when it goes to uh it's listed on the agenda incorporated in the official record of the attachments of the meeting minutes um uh will be readed to the meeting minutes if requested or read it into public comment if requested or read into public comment. Well, they're still going to be attached to the electronic messages submitted through a town approved method that'll be presented during the public portion of the next regular meeting. That'll be presented. I'm presenting yet because I believe those will say

I would suggest we attach videos to the correspondence to the council because if we start reading every single email we get, we are going to be here for dates. Well, the reality is is how many times have we actually got that many emails that were requested to be read into public public.

Typically, it only happens at B uh uh budget time or if there's something big going on. I mean, it's not like it's something that's going to happen. And quite frankly, it doesn't matter if if if it prolongs because it is the public's right to address and address the council and the people that are sitting. So to say I don't want it because it's going to take too long and everybody can read it if you want. What about the people sitting in the audience? They have the opportunity to look at the packet also. Then we should not be showing the videos.

Okay. Then attach it. Then we can attach the videos to the is it possible to attach the video where we attach the packet. I don't know. In short, I don't know. We could certainly figure out whether we can that was the way that we allowed those persons public remarks. How many videos have we had that we've had read in

10? That was how that was, you know, it came out of COVID, of course, and that was how the council at that time um wanted to allow another opportunity for people to make public remarks, verbal public remarks that they couldn't do during a meeting. They're limited to three minutes. They're shown here as a way of getting them into the recording and into the record. uh they are summarized in the record. They are not put in verbatim as opposed to emails which are put in of course verbatim because they are the email. They're attached to the packet.

I still believe some kind of words in the bylaws that's already come public remarks there also be submitted in writing or through other town electronic including recorded video. But what I'm saying, Jack, is the videos are played at the town meeting so that anyone in the audience can see it where the where the emails are not read in and if someone asks for it to be read in I believe it should be read. Have we ever had this already? You don't have to jump. I'm just asking a question. I'm answering your question.

Back up. It's cool it please.

Mr. Chair call the question vote on the question. Motion is the to accept with the change under section five communication with attorney currently right there because no decision. Yes. Thank you. Take a vote.

Vote. Those in favor? Nay. Nay. Eyes have it. Six to one. Agenda 8 A uh C discussion of housing law and housing task force matters.

Okay. Um the the uh council has been uh and the community has been talking about the new housing law for uh quite some time and uh since it was adopted and trying to figure out how we want to move ahead. Uh the council commented that it wanted was wanted to consider uh a housing committee or some group that would focus on the law, focus on the uh impacts of the law and the changes that we need to make. We asked uh you asked Juliet Hajj, our planner, to give her comments. Uh I sent to you uh only just yesterday, but I sent to you the material that Juliet uh gave to me to to share with you with some of her thoughts. Juliet of course is here and and can answer questions or or participate in any discussion you want to have, but I think fundamentally there's a few things going on right now. Um Juliet, myself and pretty much everybody else in the state is trying to understand all the rules, all the ups and downs, the ins and outs of the legislation. Um I'll probably be attending something on Friday that talks about it. Juliet has been to a few uh already. uh and trying to make sure that we understand what needs to get done. Um there's a lot of work that needs to get done at the state level uh to understand how it wants to give guidance to the communities on how to move forward on this. There's a fair amount of work that needs to get done at the COG level around the comm community around the state uh to move those things forward. Uh so uh at a very high level I think we're not ready to say necessarily um how we would want to proceed. That having been said, Juliet and I do agree that there is some

sense to uh creating a small subset of the planning and zoning commission uh and maybe perhaps some other individuals that would make sense uh joining them from the public or uh and certainly Juliet would staff that uh to talk about the changes that are upcoming that we do need to make uh the few changes that we do need to make between now and July uh that are really uh updates to the zoning code as she described in her memo to deal with this uh matter of um um residential middle housing residential housing in uh commercial areas. Uh and so there is maybe perhaps a very focused piece that they could work on uh if you thought that was appropriate. I think either way uh it might make sense for the uh planning and zoning commission to task a couple of its members. Uh we like the idea of putting three members of the planning and zoning commission on there because it sort of uh ensures that you have three people that are sitting there that really know the issue and have dived into it and can participate and help the others along in that discussion rather than just focus on on Juliet there. So um I don't know if there's other comments you want to make about where we are or where we think we're going. You don't have to. I just if there were things that you were dying to say. Uh but I think uh [laughter] uh it's sort of like I gave the chief permission. If I'm saying something wrong, come and let me know. Um but uh you know, kind of that's where we are. I think you've got some time yet before we dive into some of these other uh into the bigger broader issues of of of the housing growth plan. I think it might make sense at some point in the future to have some residents uh whether they're members of the P the planning and zoning commission or others or both that can work with Juliet. Frankly, you can see in there that right now we think the best move for the town uh financially and for its own resources is to work with the the regional council of governments uh to move forward with a

regional growth plan and an annex that would deal with the town of East Hampton specifically. Um, it makes sense to maybe have a few people working with her. I think right now we can all agree that we will designate Juliet to be our representative to that body when the COG puts it together to represent our interest. So, um, that's kind of where we're at right now. A little bit of a wait and see, but not intending for you to make any choices tonight. Really wanted to put this in front of you and if you had questions, uh, make Juliet available to answer them and to the extent I need to, I can answer as well. Jack, thank you Julia for your input.

We need to figure out how to work with the current housing law and get the outcome for East Hampton that we all want. Recently, an company employed by our plan of conservation development effort reported on the characteristics of our town members and pointed out the problems with an aging population. Our aging population is made worse by the absence of housing. Also, many in our aging population have trouble affording current housing costs and young people also have a problem affording uh housing. I support that we create a committee to figure out what ant eastampton should do within the current law to make eastampton better. As the town planner has suggested, we should be proactive not just on meeting the law but also on helping our residents. The committee [clears throat] should include the people the town planning has suggested plus an expert on housing innovation. The goal should be to make specific recommendations on what the town can and should do to make housing more affordable for all.

I do want to add something. I think it's important that we wait for the um the issue is that we have to wait for the state to give us guidance. So there's they're trying to develop a methodology on how they come up with the number that they're going to give us, which is just deed restricted units. So there's a lot of focus on in the when we get to the housing growth plan, that's what we have to focus on. The POCD, however, is where we would focus on some of the things you just said, you know, and and I'm happy to meet with a group sooner than later to to work on that section in the PCD and working forward in, you know, on implementation because there's housing needs and then there's affordable housing needs, capital A, capital H, deed restricted that the state wants us to put in. but we also have other needs. So, it's it's two different things. I just think whatever is related to the housing growth plan and whatnot, we're too we're premature in coming up with a committee to address that because we don't even know what we have to do yet or, you know, we are lucky that we do have a um to do a buildout analysis. So, we are sort of ahead of the game on that developable land portion of it. But, there's some things to be done. But as far as the housing plan and the capital A, capital H affordable units that we have to plan for, that's too premature. We should just focus on the PCD part of it.

But it seems to me they're related, right? I mean, they can't. The state will require something, but East Hampton may or may not do that. there may be something else we should do for our residents, you know, for our people who right are having trouble affording housing. Yeah. And that is a big topic in the PCD. So we have I mean we are addressing that right this second Thursday.

Yeah. Well, that too and the and the survey has got a lot of questions there. So I think we can get a head start as as far as identifying on our future land use plan where spots for housing are appropriate. keeping in mind that some of those are going to have to be deed restricted somewhere along the way. But, you know, essentially you're just trying to find spots that have dense that dense housing would be appropriate. And there's and you know, we also have to think about the opportunities that brings with, you know, if we focus on the village center, what resources we can get from the state to develop out the water system or something or brownfield remediation needed to support that. So, we want to have a good plan in place, you know, and not just rush into something to react to the plan. So, or to react to the wall.

Um, so we are in this process with POCD. We are talking about housing right now. That's our discussion this week. We're going to be working on what the town needs for housing, where we can put it. And I do like the suggestion of some planning and zoning members working with Julia on figuring out what is happening, what the state and about this to bring that back to the rest of the planning zone members if you're willing to do that. Yeah. And it's evolving. They're still cleaning up some issues with the bill. So, right. And then those people hopefully will be involved in the committee that we form to address. Right.

Mr. two page to be honest with you and you guys summed it up you know gave us version I thought it was very good very very insightful again I'm not like you but it makes a lot of sense what to me makes a ton of sense is that this housing committee that you're recommending be in harm really and not of this council I think that's a smart might be New York certainly better than I whatever's coming along asking that it's regulated through BC. So it would seem to me that um let this be uh let this committee be a function of and appointed by the the TNC and work there. I think I think that makes a lot of sense. Let have authority for it because it's going to be their ball game and then

they have to approve it. They got to look for it. So I think sanation.

Anything else on that particular matter? Julia, in your meetings with the I I I I wrote it last night, but with the state, right? You've had some meetings with the state level. Has there um have people come from across the state to these meetings? P, you know, town city planners in those discussions, is there have there been any I'm just curious if in the upcoming session if there's going to be some um any changes made based on conversations, you know, is there, you know, I mean, we all know that legislation constantly changes once what's in it's enacted. I know it's really not enacted yet, but I'm just wondering if there's been any of those types of conversations.

It is enacted. Well, it's enacted, but nothing is But they haven't exactly. So, have they had an opportunity yet to determine we got to fix, you know, certain things that need to be fixed. Yeah. I mean, the last meeting I went to was a CCAPA and they put it on and planners from everywhere were there. So, because we have a lot of concern certain issues in the bill, but there they're little things that need to be cleaned up and clarified and definitions that they want one section something different. So I mean we can't do anything as we understand it. So we heard a lot of comments and um questions. So the folks from the state were there.

So hopefully that they will go back and and take that input and and make some suggested changes so we can understand right. I mean they don't even understand some that's what happens a lot with legislation. Yeah. that's, you know, you have unintended consequences like I've said before and so that's what I anticipate in the next session that being some I think they'll figure things out when they go to do the needs assessments are trying to figure out that developable land portion of it and the buildout that you know there's some challenges there that they're going to have to work right

that are very different across the piece that's you don't want another oneizefits-all situation which they're trying to address you can see that I'm not sure they're quite there yet, but we'll see. It's difficult, right? I mean, it's a difficult process. It is. Yeah. So, thanks. They have quite a timeline, so don't be. Yeah. Thank you. Anyone else? Not moving on. Agenda item nine, new business, a review and possible action on fire chief vehicle use category 3.

Uh, thank you. Um, so the the town of East Hampton has a an employee handbook that is a policy of the town council. It's a matter adopted by the town council and outlines the employment relationship we have with uh all employees of the town modified only by uh basically by contracts. Um it is it is the rule so to speak by which uh work gets done for the town. One piece of that uh outlines how village or rather town vehicles are used. Uh there are three categories that are outlined. One is the basic category that employees use vehicles while they're working. Right? This is the public cls employee who gets in a in a truck and uses it to do their work and then parks it at the shop and drives home in their own vehicle. [clears throat] No personal use effectively with those uh vehicles uh for the most part. Use category two includes uh the fire chief currently the fire marshal uh the joint facilities wastewater operator that's on duty uh the director of public works and the public works foreman who have vehicles uh assigned to them uh whether all the time or during the week that they're on call. and that vehicle is taken home by them to facilitate their speedy response uh to a scene or to an incident that may occur in town. They are allowed only really to use that vehicle for personal use on their way to and from the town. Otherwise, it gets parked uh and they use their personal vehicle, their own vehicle for other activities. And then there is the use category three which is identified as uh my position the public utilities administrator the facilities superintendent for the joint for joint facilities wastewater plant and the

chief of police currently and while I don't have a town vehicle I get a a stipen for my vehicle uh the others do get a vehicle and it is the expectation that from uh that they can use those for personal use with the understanding that from wherever they are they need to respond respond. Um the others would have to go home and get a vehicle to come in. They're expected from wherever they are to respond uh uh back to a scene. Uh the fire chief made a rec made a request uh of me and the uh fire commissioners uh to have his use of a vehicle reclassified to that use category 3. basically allowing him uh to take the vehicle that he is currently assigned and does take home and has limited nearby use uh as allowed by me under the under the regulations to have that available to him on a more broad basis understanding like I said that he would be expected to respond. Um that's the fundamental piece of the request. That's why uh he put it, you saw in the material. Uh the the request that came from the chief uh to us the um that matter was taken up by the by the um fire commission at its meeting in December. And at that point uh by vote of the members, they decided to recommend making that change. Uh so I'm bringing it to you as a request to amend uh effectively amend the policy of the town to move the fire chief from use category 2 that limited [snorts] uh assignment uh to use category 3 uh a vehicle available to him for personal use with the expectation of response in public safety incidents.

Sir any question or discussion

uh let's start with or the fire chief if he has to be a quad of town on personal use just say like there was a fire last night and he happened to be in I don't know waterberry or ganberry wherever ever. Um, do we really expect him to respond in a town vehicle from all over the state for something that is going to pass a very short life period to manage when there's already management on scene? That's one. But my primary concern with this is the W2 status of the employee because the IRS requires that you put in their W2 the the personal use for an employee provided vehicle. He's not an employee. And if he does become an employee, are we now going to a paid chief? And if we're going to go to a paid chief, are we going to then go out and sort out a request uh you know, put it out to the full application process? ever going to hire because you can't just make him a W2 employee and you know for or uh for the car. um he he is not a W2 employee and if we're going to treat him like a W2 employee then I do believe that we should really look deeper uh as to our uh fire services and whether we are going to go to a paid chief and along those same lines as we saw with the ambulance bringing someone up in the in the ranks that has um managed a volunteer

force to then put him into a paid position then did not work too well. So if we're going to make the chief a position who's going to be responsible for the hiring firing are we going to utilize the board of fire commissioners? Is it going to be uh a task of the town manager as the hiring and firing of the chief of police and and so forth? I think this is opening an entire can of worms when the reason that this is was brought up is because from my understanding um from the meetings was that if Rob is out at training and he goes to stop and shop on his way home, people commenting that you know he's using this the town vehicle for personal use. You know what? That has already been agreed to by the town manager. If he coming to and from um trainings, uh scenes, what have you, it is already in there. Um it is agreed upon by the town manager. Correct me if I'm wrong. And he also takes the vehicle to work since he works close by to be able to respond. Those are all concessions that are already made in the category 2. it does not jeopardize anything else when it comes to us. So I um do not support this in any way um at this time without further consideration of where we're going with the fire department.

I do think we need to clarify the IRS I can do that. It's my understanding that emergency services personnel are exempt from that particular rule. Um I can confirm that I have a company. I know a lot about this. Yeah. I know it's a problem. So I just want to make sure we clarify. whether volunteer fires across the city have category. This is something the town has. Rob, would you step forward?

I guess my question is why would you not want to have vehicle

good? So the the category ranking is something that the town came up with. Um so you guys have a fire commission who governs the fire department. It's in our bylaws as the fire department that they're the ones that govern it. Um my personal opinion is you take the volunteer out of the handbook uh and make the bylaws that we already have as a fire department. Uh have the commission be in charge of that. Um so that it can change because I could change. I could not be the chief next year. So having the the commission have a little more leeway, you guys wouldn't have to come back here and change this all the time. Um, but that's just my personal opinion on the matter. So there is a governing body that could change it rapidly.

Do you know whether other chiefs have vehicles that they have available to them for personal? Yeah, so um like myself, I uh I travel all across the state for meetings. Um so you never know where I might be. Uh tonight I would have been in Bloomfield if I wasn't here. Um so yeah, other fire departments do have chiefs that have take-h home cars. So um and they might not be in the same town. Uh Hatam has a chief that volunteers as a chief and he lives in the town next door because he's close to that town. So um there's a lot of dynamics when it comes to that type of stuff. Thanks.

But to my point, you were blue at training. would you how what is the response time for you to return from Bloomfield and who would be incident in command and isn't there any second in command a third in commit for that those reasons that if you are not there sure I think it would be the the chief's discretion on responding back or not with a priority response um just like I have discretion on on a fire scene of what the guys are doing I think uh I can use my brain to figure out if it's going to take an hour for me to get back that it's probably not the smartest thing to come lights and sirens back to town. So, I think it should fall back on the the fire chief to make that decision. So,

and this change has nothing to do with any of that. No.

So, yeah, it has just to do with the category of car. So, when you think about it, say Saturday I go to Ace Hardware, right? If I take the town car, I don't work Saturday. So technically I'm breaking the rules by using that car in town to go to Ace Hardware because it's personal use. So technically at that point I'm breaking that category too because that car is supposed to be used coming to and from when I have the car essentially. So if I'm not working or uh like I said if I'm trying to go somewhere I'm technically even breaking the rules by going to Ace Hardware if I'm doing that during the day. So, uh, I think it's a lot more proactive to have me in a car that's available to the town. Um, and fire scenes like last night, we were there for 4 hours. So, um, we've have in have had incidents where firefighters have gotten hurt. So, I've responded to the hospital instead of responding to the scene because our membership is the most important thing. So, um, keeping those people safe, all that documentation, all that paperwork that has to be done, uh, has to stay in line, too. So, uh, there's a lot of stuff that comes with being the fire chief. You got to do a lot more paperwork, uh, which is great, uh, sometimes, but, uh, yeah. So, there's a lot more that goes on with it. So, there's a dynamic.

So, right now, correct me if I'm wrong. Yep. No clue, but currently now, if it's Saturday and you're not working, the car is at your house. Yes. You can't use it. You're out at Ace Hardware. A call comes in. Rather than being able to respond immediately, you need to go home. Yes. get the the car and then go. So, you're saving my asset. That makes no sense to me why you don't have this. Yeah. So, just because I was just doing a quick thing. It said

in order to have the IRS exclusion, restricted personal use, any personal use other than commuting must be confined to the geographic area that the chief's is area of the chief's responsibility. So if you're outside the G cafeteria, you're still not going to be able to use the the town car for train if you're looking to take it out of the geographical area for personal unit. So you're traveling to a wedding with the car. No. So taking your wife out to dinner? No. So I gave an I gave an exclamation

car so his wife didn't have to ride in the car with contaminated equipment. So he said that that was the purpose of the new vehicle at the capital meeting. So you

So yes, the the new car. Yes, I would uh appreciate the new car as in a truck so that the cancer uh stuff stays in the back of the car. If you'd like to come outside after this meeting, we just had a fire last night. My car currently smells like a fire. So, um that's why we're trying to go to a pickup truck. Yes, I do take my wife uh in town to events. Uh my wife also goes to me uh with me to events like uh banquetss and stuff like that that other towns hold, other fire departments. Uh so my wife does go in the car. So, uh, just like all my firefighters, I would like a cancer-free household. I want to protect my family and and myself. [snorts]

The thing that he goes to the trainings and and and events sponsored by fire uh entities. That's all in the line of of his work. But, you know, there's I don't see the issue. What do you mean? Not even a little bit general. And we have a public utilities administrator uses their vehicle to person so that they can respond to public utility emergencies. I would argue that the fire chief needs to be there a lot faster than the public utilities administrator when there's an emergency. And he does have that access, but he needs to go home and have it.

No, he does not. He drives the He currently has it at work. He currently does have the vehicle. He already has those. It's going out of town and adding it 24/7. Right. [snorts] So, yes, I'm trying to make it so I have the car 24/7 so I'm available to the town even more than I am now. So,

Rob. Yes, sir. about how many more miles would you put on as a category versus category 2?

As of right now, I put about 3 to 4,000 miles on my car annually uh with using the town car. So, we're talking around $540 with the math of doing uh gas. Um so, it's about a $540 increase that the town could see. Um, I do go on vacations with my car and stuff like that. So, those things I usually go out of state, so that mileage wouldn't be counted towards this change. Yeah, it was Jack and I second it. Very good. Question.

Further further discussion on the question. If not, those in favor of the motion, please signify by saying I oppose. Nay. Motion is adopted. Thank you. Yes. You have approval. Thank you for your Yes. Great job last night. Is our next topic going to be walked? Mr. Chair, could I ask for a very brief recess? 15 or 20 minutes? No. two weeks. Can you Can you catch Yukon game for me and tell me what the score is?

This can be a pretty quick short one. I don't want Did they call for a beer That looks Thank you guys.

really just went up to the car and she did A couple who knows right here. They both roll the dice on that. I like the lights on there.

And they have that amazing ropes. Exactly.

Long. No, nobody really got what Elliot says. That's what Elliott says. just make it to the finals.

Just make the play. They don't have to win. He says a little bit over time. Wow. Whatever do that thing. someone with the red

just the chair. Oh, we got a vice chair. We can roll. It's the chair of the chair of vice. How's the How's the ice fish out there? I haven't seen anything. It's the warm weather. Yeah, but it will be hot. Well, we're talking about snowmobiles. Apparently snow. Is that right? Yeah. Right on top of the snow.

Stay on top of Keep moving. You have to push it down. If it's too powdery, you'll just sink in. Yeah. You have to kind of run through it a few times. No. Hey, I've seen this I've seen them more than once running on open water. Oh, yeah. That's right. When they fall in and rob people.

I don't know. I didn't go all the way down. I guess it was in somebody else. Nothing. He's waiting.

But life insurance is made upon this one. No. Welcome to look for I

Yeah. Yeah. Jack when you left was still great and she was looking And now is running across the parking lot.

Yeah. Hey Jeff living presidents. Reconvene. Reconvening.

Your next item is the is a quick little bit of an update. Uh not a lot to talk about at this point. It's just information for you. I put a little bit in the packets uh or put a little bit on the table for you tonight. As you know, we continue to look at the grand list uh and the changes that are coming up for the community in relation to that. As I've mentioned before, the shift that creates uh some interesting dynamics related to taxes uh and trying to understand that more. Uh so Jeff has been uh Jeff and the assessor uh Deborah Cop Jeff Jila finance director and Deborah Cop the assessor have been really kind of parsing that information uh trying to understand it as de as Deborah works towards finishing the grand list for submission to the state. As we know the intent is to have some discussions about uh whether the council wants to do anything uh to mitigate the changes. So, as a matter of information, and I'll just run through this very quickly. I'm going to focus on commercial or rather residential, although I gave you commercial as well. Um, what you see is a is a table that that takes the aggregate data and breaks it into a few various categories, ones that we've used before. Uh, and it shows you kind of the impact of various ways of looking at this. So, it's u you'll notice that of the 5,200 or so parcels that we have, the vast majority of them were valued at less than 300,000 in the previous grand list. And that's an important distinction. The previous grand list, the vast majority of our properties uh were um some 92% of our properties were valued at less than $300,000. what those columns represent. Then the the column that's called average group of change

or rather average change of the group is if you took all of them in that category of 0 to 100,000 as a group their value went up 82%. Okay, as a group. So, if I took the however many hundreds of thousands of dollars are all of those properties and I compared it to the thousands and hundreds of thousands of dollars in the new grand list, that difference is 82%. What's interesting about that group is that if you look at the individual changes, right, which is that next column. So, if Dave Cox's parcel went up uh 75% and Jack Solomon's parcel went up 100% and Karen Wanut's property went up 15%, you average all of those numbers together and you get that next column. The individual changes, what you notice there is they're different, fairly significantly different. That's because there are some outliers there. in this case, outliers to the high side. Really, what you're seeing there is uh about 16 vacant parcels that now have houses on them. So, you're seeing that kind of a jump. So, when you look to the next page, which we'll do in a moment, oh, don't go ahead yet. Which we'll do in a moment, you'll see some of those things. Okay. Uh before we leave this, you'll notice in the next column, the vast majority of our properties are in that less than $200,000 range. Um in terms of assessed value, this is not market value, assessed value. Um those numbers are very similar to each other. So you're seeing them all change at roughly the same rate. Uh there's not a lot of outliers. Uh and that's as the those numbers become farther apart, there are more outliers in in one direction or the other. Now we

can go to that second page. Um you'll see there the the 16 parcels that are represented on the bottom are very likely uh parcels that were developed and moved because you can see what this column shows or what this paper shows is what value grouping was it in in the 2024 grand list and what value grouping is that same property in in the 25 2025 grand list. So you see that, you know, of the 406 parcels that were valued between a hundred and zero and $100,000, um 16 of them have moved considerably out of that range, including one of them that moved all the way up to the $500 to $600,000 range. Clearly, new house was constructed. The value of the new house has been picked up. Now, that's a major change. But that also leads into is what was the natural growth of our our grand list as opposed to just the market growth, right? So what's the growth related to new things that weren't there before? And that's a distinction that we're trying to math out right now so that we can talk about that with you a little bit so that you understand uh that I do try to have that kind of information when we get to the budget. Typically that's around a percent uh to a percent and a half uh right now these these recent years. So what you're looking at is now the a further a further breakdown of those groupings. And um so what I wanted you to pull from this data in general uh is that you can see that the largest um value changes are in our least if you will least expensive houses. So, those houses that were uh in the in the less than $300,000

range now and are uh in the in more or less that same range, but maybe a bunch of them have jumped now into the $4 to $500,000 range. So, you can look at that information and kind of see how property values have moved, see where the most significant increases are. Um overall as you can see for residential value when you look at the group as a as a total in aggregate residential value goes up in detail by about 48%. If you look at the average of individual household changes it's about 53. So if you look at that anything anything below that break point anything below that average um that household will do fairly well in that regard. anything above that average, uh, households will pay a bigger share of the taxes. So, that's important for you to look at as we get into the future and start to try to parse this through and look at whether we're going to take any uh actions to to mitigate any of this or do it all in one shot. Again, nothing for you to decide on tonight. That was really just an update. Uh we hope to maybe by the 10th uh be able to really get into this a little bit more and perhaps have some some more clean recommendations for you to consider uh or at least concepts for you to consider on moving ahead whether that means uh phasing in the grand list. Uh coming back to the motor vehicle to the extent we can um other things like that with respect to motor vehicles since I just happened to bring it up. Um, as I mentioned to you before, that particular part of our value uh did go up this year, which means residents replaced their vehicles. Many of our residents replaced vehicles with newer ones. So, that particular part of our value went up. The other piece of this puzzle, and the puzzle that I'm referring to in this case is overall taxes and the mill rate. Uh, the other piece of this puzzle is

the personal property tax piece, which is still being worked on. That's a fairly significant chunk of the real estate tax uh for our uh mainly for businesses in town. So, we need to understand that a little bit better uh as we bring this forward. So, just a basic high level review of kind of get you familiar with what you're seeing in those tables. You can kind of look at them and chew on them. If you have questions, I'll take them now or you can certainly get a hold of Jeff or myself uh later on. doesn't seem to make sense to me. Okay.

On the second page, 0 to 100, you have from houses that are now 500 to 600. So, well, look at your second 200. You have to 500,000, but they only went up 167. If they were 100 to 200, if they were 200, 167% would be 150 days. So, how can you get to the 400 to 500?

Uh, I understand what you're saying. Um, we'll have to look at the data just again one to make sure that the mathing is is coming out right. Um, I didn't catch that, so thank you for that. Um, the ones that I did check worked out, so I was figuring that. So, we'll have to look at that because you're right. Even if it were a 200% uh well, no, a 100% increase would take that $200,000 house and make it 400,000. And so is the increase not

no 167 should be the percent of the previous is it 167 increase 167% since that's their average change. So that's the increase.

Mhm. We'll confirm, but yeah, that's their average change. Okay. Right. Okay. Thank you.

Quick rundown of that just so you have it uh and can digest it. Uh we shared that on screen uh for those that are hanging in with us here. uh and they'll be included uh in the packet as well uh for people to take a look at. Uh it's not the last time you'll probably see that data. So um need not worry. All right, moving on in the agenda if there's nothing further here. Agenda 9 C review and possible action on trademark licensing license agreement for America 250.

This is something I didn't even know existed, frankly. Um but the uh the local America 250 committee uh has asked the town to approve this sublicence agreement which basically gives us access legally uh to the logo that the America 250 the nationwide organization uh has created. Uh Belltown here in in town has that authority has already got that for its products. Uh the goal is to have the town's ability to use that on any publication material that it does. I did I did I say what did I say? Did I say Belltown? I do that all the time lately. Bevon. Yes, Bevon who makes bells in Belltown um has that license agreement already and does produce licensed material. But

they are producing bells that are going all over the country. Amazing success story. It is [laughter] definitely. So I move to authorize the

Any discussion questions? That would be something that you would sign. Yeah, I'll take care of that if it's approved. Nothing. We're saying I asked town manager report agendem 10. Um,

so I wanted to just highlight uh as always my uh my report is uh available on the town's website. Uh you all received a copy of it just uh the other day or perhaps it was earlier I think it was Monday. Um and I just wanted to highlight a couple of items. one uh council member Wad already mentioned uh POCD progressing uh along uh the um uh focus groups are coming up and uh as mentioned housing is coming up here uh later this week and uh the village center redevelopment is right now scheduled for uh Wednesday February 18th [clears throat] and others are coming uh will be scheduled shortly two more at least uh will be scheduled shortly for uh the community. Um in addition, I want to remind everybody that the uh that we have a installment of taxes coming up and uh don't forget that uh February 2, so Monday uh is the last day to pay those on time, avoiding any penalties. Uh don't forget you can pay online as an ACH with no fee. Credit card costs of course a little bit of money. And as we reminded everybody last time, make sure you get that handstamp uh for items that you're going to throw in the mail uh because we don't want you to be late for that particular reason. The last thing I do want to mention is that uh the town continues to try and take advantage of uh material and available services from the rivercog. Uh you'll some of you will recall that a few years ago when we last did an update to our uh natural hazard mitigation plan uh we worked through the Rivercog and did uh most of the basics of that plan are developed by them and worked with the and produced by their consultant. The research and the data related to that and then there's an annex that is specifically ours uh that was developed

with our local committee uh and approved by the town council. Uh that's where we identify issues that might come in East Hampton because of natural hazards. So for example, uh the project that we've talked about on and off about dealing with Hails Brook where it sir charges uh at the lake and floods the road and we have to deal with that a handful of times a year. Um is in that plan to be addressed. That's how we're able to access federal funds for that if we can ever get that uh finished. Uh so that plan is in place is is in process and staff is continuing to work on that. They've had a couple of meetings and you'll see that uh in the upcoming uh months as we finish up uh those uh that recommended plan. Um otherwise uh you'll see all the information and activities that are going on in the town in the in the report and I'll certainly answer any questions that anybody has. Questions? I just like to thank our public works department for working diligently through a very long storm and the police department, fire department and association keep it.

Pass it on. Moving on. Agenda item 11 appointments. Oh, good. Was last. Okay. Moving on. Agenda item 12, tax refunds. Jer, I would like to make a motion we turn five refunds totaling $60089 pennies that are right for owners.

Motion made and seconded. Any discussion? If not, those in favor signify by saying I. Oppose. Nay. So adopt. Agenda item 13, public remarks. Is there anyone relious to make wise move? What's another What's another three minutes at this point?

Well, if you want, I'll do it. What's another Cindy Craig Three Candlewood Drive? Most of you are old enough that maybe you remember when you opened your first AARP envelope and you looked at it and you went, "What? I'm too young. Not me. Um, that feeling happened to me uh when I was looking for a Tai Chi class and the only one I could find was here in town or locally was here in town at the senior center and I thought I'm not senior center material, but I went and it was a great class and I'm glad I did it. Um and then it continued over Zoom during CO and that was kind of a lifesaver considering that we were all isolated at that point in time. So the senior center did a fabulous job during co of providing various things over zoom so that the older adults in the community did not feel that isolation that happened during that that time that Tai Chi class resulted in me becoming more familiar with uh senior center operations. I ended up volunteering first for Meals on Wheels and then I ended up shopping for older adults who weren't um comfortable or didn't like shopping through the grocery stores. And the more I became involved, the more knowledgeable I became, the more I took advantage of um the classes and observed

the challenges that the director and her staff faced for during their jobs. When Joanne Ewing retired as the senior center director, um there were several months when the capable staff were challenged to do their best support uh the members to to do their best to support the members without without a leader. Um without an official leader, I felt there was no uh one defending the senior center budget when it came around. That's when I started attending town council meetings and board of finance meetings to see what could be done. I quickly learned that I should have been starting the year before to get prepared. There's a funny story about why this is all written on paper. If I were not uh if it were not for the senior center, I can assure you I would not have joined the commission on aging, gotten involved with a friend and collaborator, Kim Crab, visiting the nine surrounding senior centers to uh improve the fight for the better budget for the following year. The research from those nine senior senior centers helped bring about this the senior center and services task force. All of that led me to becoming a member of the POC steering committee. I am now a better informed and more involved older adult. It wouldn't have happened without my involvement in the senior center. I have lived in East Hampton since 1980. I love this little town and the community it provides. As you've heard before from the white paper and from

Kim's earlier presentation, 26% of our population is now over 65. And that number will be growing exponentially over the next decade. This is not hyperbole. It is fact. We need to be preparing now. Later it will be more difficult and cost a lot more money. Let's find um let's be proactive and let's find a way to make it work. Thank you. Thank you. Is there anyone else out there in the inter lane?

Dennis Robert. If not, moving on to agenda item 14, communications correspondence and announcements. You have a letter from Aquarium Water indicating they're seeking a rate increase and agenda item 15. Motion made to adjurnn. Those in favor signify by saying I. We are adjourned. Thank you.