Airport Commission - Noise Abatement Subcommittee - Regular Meeting

Alright. We will call the meeting in Lakes And Watershed to order. And can we get roll call? Sure.

Supervisor Furman?

Here.

Dia Larson?

Here.

Allen Levin? Chen Wu? Here. Supervisor? Here. Bill Gabler? Here. Supervisor McArthur?

Here.

Steve Greff? Here. Supervisor Engelberger? Here. And David Clark? Excuse me. Okay. Yes. We do it before?

Okay. Perfect. Well, thanks, everybody, for coming. I apologize for the delay. And we will go ahead and move to the next item. It's consideration of minutes. Is there a motion? Motion to approve. Motion to approve by Engelberger. Seconded by Blazewitz. Is there discussion on the minutes? So you see nothing online or in the room. Is there all the all those in favor? Aye. Aye. I just forgot what to say for a second. Okay. And it's for what minutes are good. Alright. And we will move on to fund transfers.

We see none. Referrals, resolutions, and ordinance amendments. None. Item b, items requiring any action. Item f. Public comment on proposed amendments to chapter 71 regulations of ice bound inland waters. My question then is do we take the comments first?

That's up to you. I mean, if there's any questions, the commission can answer those. You're welcome.

It's however you wanna know. Okay.

Did the speakers have a preference if they'd rather speak before the committee chats? They'd like to speak first. Sure. And you are Jeff Rulan or Jim Casuda? We do. Jim Casuda? K. Do you wanna come on up? I'll make sure you have me just You

can stand right over here.

Okay. Just come up by Kyle.

Yeah. Anywhere we're doing fine.

Thanks for coming. Yep. Sure. So go ahead. Floor is yours.

Yeah. My name is James James Casuda, and I live in Madison. And I'm a real avid ice fisherman. I'm 68 years old.

I've been doing it for

a long time. So I've been around when the flotation ordinance was crafted in 1993. I worked at Engelhardt's. It's a motor sports dealer. We actually built and sold flotation that was in conjunction with the Sheriff's Lakes Rescue.

And it was corrugated drainage tubing, black, and it had two by twos screwed to the inside, top and bottom, then end caps screwed into the two by twos, and then it was on steel frames that had bands that bolted down to entrap the tubing, and then it had extendable for width and clamps that clamped on to the racks on a four wheeler. And so it was calibrated that they were sufficient. It rolled with the five cubic feet needed for ATVs because ATVs have tightest flotation in addition. So and then I was a guide at D And S Bay, and we ran the shacks and the shuttles out there for ice fishing perch fishermen, and we're going out to deep water 60 feet, you know, typically. And the thing is is that if I had gone through, which I didn't, the floats were down about midline of my wheels, so the tires would have

been in the water. The floats would have

hit the ice or the water. That would have been what I consider high and dry. I put my feet on the rack and waited for someone to come and assist me, like, get boards under the front wheels, winch me out or whatever, but I wouldn't be in danger. And there was a situation where it was the last day of guiding in the shacks, and I was out there with three men. And we were in a permanent shack catching fudge, and then at the end, I hauled them in with my otter sled.

And then Kevin Monk, was another one of the guys, was tasked with coming out and fetching the shack, big wooden ice house, and he drug it into the East Side Of Governors Island. And I was already in and, you know, done. And then I took off, was perch fishing way on the West Side over by the Commodore bar with someone. Anyways, the thing is is that Kevin, after he dragged the big shack in, that was the last thing at the end of the season, there was a heave off of Governor's Island where there typically is. Now a heave is two elements.

It could be ice that heaves up, and it could be ice that heaves down. But when ice heaves down, it goes underwater and actually dissolves, so to speak. And he was driving an ATV, but it was a three wheeler. It was a Honda Big Red. So that one tire in the front, that flotation on the front rack and the rear rack, it was inspected as they were back then.

And he was just, like, probably overjoyed that we're done with all that guiding and shack rental. And he said that he was going and he couldn't steer because the one tire wouldn't turn and he slid right into the hole of water. And because of his flotation and it being a three wheeler with the three wheels underwater and the floats on the racks, he was in essence, like, trapped sitting on the seat, like, waist deep in water. And, a couple people that were there came to assist him, but, actually, there was fire department rescue vehicles with them by DNS. And Jean actually called me and I thought, well, what am I gonna do?

Have first responders coming. And apparently, the story was that they weren't gonna come out and attempt a rescue because their thoughts were that because he broke through, the ice wasn't safe, which is incorrect. If they had come out on the ice, they would have seen the ice was solid up to the point of the hole where he was in. And it was a good sized hole. It was probably from here to that wall, and people knew why.

So, anyways, Kevin said finally it was two men and a woman. It's gonna be up to you guys. And he said they had a piece of rope that was the sariest piece of rope he'd ever seen, like some scraggly clothesline and a hand auger. And Kevin got off the machine. The machine, you know, probably got upset, but he got out on ice. And then as he's walking into the parking lot, the rescue personnel wanted to convey him to check him out. He was infuriated saying that, I don't need help now.

I needed help when I was in the water.

And that probably helped get his circulation back up. But regardless, I think that the flotation made a difference there. Now there was a incident that I'm not really fully aware of, but something happened at Mendota County Park because I saw on LakeLink, which is a online forum for fishing, that there is pictures of rescue lights at night, but it was unclear what happened. But since I had been going fishing there, I saw there was a hole right at the base of the boat landing, and there hadn't been up to that point because we'd all been driving our four wheelers around to the right because that was like a buckled up area. But when they launched, like, the rescue airboat, they have to launch it like a traditional boat.

So it was likely they did do some kind of rescue. And now my question is if those responders were interviewed, I assume that since it was on Lake Mendota, which there is a flotation department did that flotation, was it a positive thing in this situation? And then in 2023, there was a man on Waukesha, which I'm gonna once again assume that he didn't have flotation because it's not required on that leak that died on a ATV accident at night. And I'm gonna wonder, would a ATV flotation made a difference there? So my opinion, keep the flotation requirement, had it for over thirty years.

And if it saved any lives, maybe it'll save some in the future. I don't think that it's I I know that it's kinda strange because the county has to enforce, like, what is essentially a city type ordinance. It's the Madison Lakes. So it's weird, and it'd be easier to just make it all even. But in Madison, it's like, if there's anything that we can do to make these ice fishermen safer, and I think putting flotation and requiring it on machines does make it safer.

And the other thing about requiring PFD when you're riding a ATV for ice fishing or or anything, it's like most of the people that really require a PFD are those walking around, like, university shoreline or a city people, but not ice fishermen that are actually, you know, aware of the dangers that they're entailing. That ice fishing is dangerous. We all know that. So we're undertaking a sport that we like, I think, like the fact that we are regulated with our equipment. That's just my opinion.

Thank you very much. Okay. And, mister Willie?

Okay. Chair, point of order. I I have a point of order for the chair. Sure. I'm wondering if we should actually discuss what the current rules are and what the proposed rules are. That last gentleman, was unclear, I think, about, the rules. He had mentioned that certain leaks don't require flotation devices and others do. Obviously, that's not the case. And

part. That's that's

and then also, there wasn't any I'm not sure if he knew that, you know, the life preserver thing. So I don't know if we wanna take a pause and just talk about what, a quick very, very quick presentation on what the current rules are and what the suggested changes. So at least when people are testifying, they could at least be clear of what they're testifying to.

Well, and and he said he's clear on that. So I think we'll just go ahead with the agenda at this point, and we'll get into the discussions.

Okay. Thank you.

Yep. You bet. So are we done with public comment at this time? You did you didn't No comment. Okay. Yeah. Gotcha. Okay. Okay. So the next item then will be the proposed amendment to chapter 71, and Kyle will open that up and draft.

Do you have it in line, or would you rather have it as just the ordinance amendment as a resolution?

Yes. I don't have the preference. Do send one to the preference? Some of the committee members have it back to us, or are you going to

The explanation down here does a nice is basically the summary. If you want, I can read that.

Why why don't you go ahead, and then we'll go around and Sure. Entertain the discussion.

So the proposed amendment changes to chapter 71. Update 71 to allow for all terrain vehicles and snowmobiles to traverse the icebound lakes of Dane County regardless of weight. Other vehicles may still be operated on the lakes with the proper permit. This amendment makes chapter 71 consistent across all icebound lakes in Dane County, and it adds a requirement to wear a personal flotation device while operating the vehicle's employees.

Okay. So I guess I'll open it up for discussion at this point and to the committee. So comments?

I think you gotta stay home that I especially might have a lately that my flotation suits are not postcard approved. But that's a real trend in ice fishing outerwear to have a float suit. And so ice fishing men are getting these. I have one. A lot of people need to do. It's just good have a sense that they're not restless. Will not qualify as. And that is the, you know, important to know that the ice fishing community is trending towards flotation.

Thank you.

I just thought we'll start with.

Yes. Go ahead, supervisor.

Thank you, madam

chair. So my understanding is that this requires full attention device on the person as opposed to that device or a machine. I also understood that from previous testimony we had that the flotation devices for the vehicles really are no longer manufactured by by companies, and people are kind of makeshift doing them and that kind

of thing. Yep. There's also no more inspection by a marine and trail enforcement,

either a flotation. So with regard to the flotation device that's required, we just heard testimony about a suit that people are wearing. It's not supposedly not Like a boot. Postcard approved or whatever. We have a definition of what our personal flotation device required is? I mean, is it like a light preserver? Is it Yeah.

What is it? I I would probably defer,

if I could, to right. Settle time because during Christian Expo this weekend. Is a actual definition for Coast Guard approved by checking. They're specifically aggressive when we're talking about this previously. When we brought it up, I would prefer any.

So I'd like coast guard approved by those. Those can't be inflatable or, like, the best here in the.

So there are some that are made that are approvable and some that aren't.

So But the gentleman's referring to the flux suit. You have several of them in line. They're probably around the house. Well, they do float, but stop by that.

Right.

So does the language have to specify type two,

type three, or things that they like?

The languages are good enough.

They're looking for a type two

A type three is that low what count? Low. The square. The type two minus. So it sounds like that should be specified in the as opposed to a. And none of the type two.

And to your point about the availability of of the patient, DNS did for a long time. Sorry. Nobody

does the same in any business that

made a change to it for a lifetime, but the Nebulas was a little loud. Nebulas is now going out of business. So there is no device that

you can commercially buy. So we're we're faced with that, and we can never face that because in '93, people were ankle barrel flotation It went and then get inspected at the Detroit Sheriff's department. And Angler has decided it would be profitable to build a ready made one that was a quasi working. Was not

the only option out there. Everyone else, like, by exactly what we have. Still

see a variety of.

I'm I'm sorry, chair. Point of order. I I can't hear the people that that are just, deciding to speak. It's it's very difficult on Zoom to hear that. You know, we we obviously don't normally allow a public comment, during our discussion. If the board wants to suspend that, that's fine. But I'm struggling to hear what people are saying.

Right. Well, we did call on a listening expert. But I point taken. We'll have anyone that's speaking from the rest of the meeting to come up closer to my phone so folks online can hear. So okay. Are there other comments? Go ahead.

I had a couple questions. And, Kyle, could you scroll back down to the bottom where you had the explanation?

Before you do that,

I had brought this up before, but how does this impact snowmobilers that are just snowmobiling across the lake, not ice fishing or anything to do with it? I mean, there there's trails which lead to the lake, off the lake. I mean, they're not gonna stop and put on a life jacket.

They would be required to You'd be able to sit. Okay. Well, they'll post the life afterwards. Thank you.

They they would be required to on this. Part of the problem with trying to fix one thing is if you don't fix them all at once, then we're back here again. Snowmobiles are getting bigger and heavier, and it's the same concern as if with a four wheeler.

Can you identify yourself? I'm just Sorry.

I'm not in uniform tonight. Sergeant McNally with the day,

not sure if so. You.

Yeah. I just wondered whether that's problematic with I mean, I guess that means getting the word out beyond the fishing community. There are people that are recreating the way, right, to the snowmobile clubs or, you know, like, that TV. Like We have a

close relationship with snowmobile club. That would be a good

message in the past.

Do you think they're aware of this, or are they

It's been publicized pretty well. Okay. No snowmobilers approached me about it, but then again, snowmobile trails are only open for a week this year.

Yeah. It's about five days.

And, Kyle, what is the second my second question is other vehicles that might still be operated on the lakes with all the

So we write permission for people to go out. So yearly, there's the radar runs on Lake Movisa. We write them a permit to go out there and do maintenance on the track, kind of based on ice conditions. That can be a pickup truck. We've authorized some construction equipment along the shoreline before for projects, something like Vanilla.

It's all dependent upon what the exhibition is and what they'd like to do. But that makes people come to us so we're aware of what's going on and just kind of checks and balances so that they don't do something else then. Nice. To that point, say somebody's coming here and they have disabled passengers with them in a UTV, they can also approach us and ask us for a permit to operate with that. So we have made concessions to the. Thank you.

Do you have yeah. Go ahead.

Hi. I might have missed it in the conversation. That was hard to hear, but do we need a definition of a personal flotation device, or is that somewhere else in the statute?

Sergeant McDowell, I believe it's type two. I will get the proper verbiage to you and definition of it from the coast guard and get it happen.

So this will be amended to say type two coast guard, something like that?

Yes.

Okay. So I I I guess the question I had was, like, if somebody's wearing one of those suits that was discussed that have flotation within them, this definition, I wonder if it would include those or if those would be excluded.

They would have to be excluded if

we were requiring type two. Okay.

Thank you.

Yeah. Go ahead, Phil.

My question is, as we discussed and I heard testimony on this, it seemed that the at home, do it yourself, and all the flotation that was added onto the ATVs have caused a sense caused more harm than good. That was the message that I was hearing. And then we heard some testimony today saying that there was a perceived safety improvement based on the flotation in a few instances. And I just wanted to get a little more context here because I don't know the the the data behind this and how many situations there have been where either the the flotation device was, you know, kind of looked to as if made things less safe, and if there's situations where it did make things more safe.

Every ATV I've responded to has been upside down, floating wheels up. If if there was a standard company making an engineer quotation for ATBs, we might be having a different conversation. But when you home make them, they're not float tested. They don't drive them in the

lake and see what happens to that machine.

Sometimes the way that they're attached, will it hold up if it if it goes through? So, also, he he had mentioned the gentleman that went through on Lake Wabiza. He he drove that machine into open water. There was no flotation or other circumstances that

would have jumped on that machine that the speed was doing. So

I think with people just putting together what they can, it leaves very little scientific data to discuss both the benefits of having. The first gentleman that spoke spoke about a very well put together product that's not available for commercial purchase.

I think so. To summarize then, I'm hearing that without a standard of how the flotation has to work, right, it's just kind of the Wild West, no regulations. You end up seeing ATVs that are upside down. If you're upside down on your ATV, the ATV floats, so it's not gonna sink to the bottom of the lake and cause that problem, but you need to float on your own. Right. Thanks.

Mhmm. I I would like to mention that

Hold on. I guess we're we're out of a public comment sort of thing. So Okay.

I'm just gonna state that the department just to figure inspection, but it

was always suspected incorrectly. So that's that's true. The sheriff's office used to do inspections. It was before my time. For whatever reason, they stopped doing the inspection. I don't know whether what the purpose of it was. But I can tell you that the inspections were done by our folks and then some even some people were just deputies. Like, here are the regulations. Here's the amount of foam needed per weight of the machine. There was no float test.

So I've seen wooden boxes on the back of a of a machine. I've seen PVC pipe randomly attached as long as they had enough foam, and they were sealed. So oftentimes, we're taking word of person making it. So, again, if there was a product that was easy to tell people, hey. Go get this product. You need to run around with it. Again, we might have a different conversation.

But the current ordinance has stayed solidly.

Alright. Is there any other do you have a comment? Yeah.

I I mean, I'm inclined to think here that it it's about what we are trying to keep safe. Right? So in in in lieu of a good product or a predictable or inspectable product that could go on the machines, what we care about are the people not going in. Right. Right?

And so, consequently, it makes the most sense to focus on the personal flotation device because unless we can inspect all of these, you know, machines out on the ice, we're just gonna have, like Paul said, the Wild West. Right? Like, there's gonna be there's it's just nonenforceable, which is, I think, a keyword that was used by the DNR and the sheriff's department that it's just not enforceable. I I think it is pretty important that we get some kind of definition of what a flotation device is and what is allowed and in what circumstances. But besides that, it seems like this it's almost unequivocally the safest route for

people. Right?

The the definition will will mirror that of a regular boat. So that will be an easy definition to to fall into the statutes.

Mhmm. But there is a data county website that describe all

of the things. Are in the.

So we're kind of at the public time. Thank you. Alright. Are there other questions, comments from committee members? Go ahead.

I'll just go back to you. Thank you. Just so our process right now, this we're not ready to vote on this at this meeting. Are we, or are we?

I don't know. I I feel like there's been a lot of questions raised, so I would move that up to the body at this point.

So, I mean, it looks to me like this needs to go through the process of actually becoming an ordinance. It isn't an ordinance yet. Correct. It's ordinance form yet.

Correct.

These are just comments or resolution that need to be introduced yet to the county board. That would be the next step.

What's the at what point are we going to recommend this or something like this to a meter as far as for them to take it and then run it through personnel and then through the. That's the process. So when when are we gonna vote on this this condition?

So I believe if we wanted to, we could vote on it tonight, make amendments to what we currently have on the floor. If folks think we need more time to look into more or be it a deeper dive, then someone could move to table it. Are we on any any kind of a time element? We can move to table it and, you know, do that deeper dive and get those other questions more thoroughly sanitized, for lack of a better word, and bring it back to the next meeting. So whatever folks are comfortable with. And I think we do have someone else has someone else has comment. Supervisor Fuhrman. But to to

your comment too, additional amendments could also occur during the actual resolution and amendment process. So

k. Why don't we go ahead to what was your next comment? Supervisor Fuhrman. Oh, Supervisor Fuhrman. Go ahead.

Thank you, chair. I, before I go to my comments, I just wanna at least say that, like, if we are going to not if we're going to ask for more work to be done on the side like us to just be in agreement what that is, to me, it just sounded like we wanted to get the exact definition of the flotation device, which is likely type two, based on the belief in the room, and my my quick Google search is probably type two. But if there are other things that we're looking for, I I definitely wanna make sure that we're clear leaving this. I am very grateful for the work that staff has done on this. I have been very conflicted about changing this ordinance.

You know, we're hearing about people fall through ICE throughout the state. Should we be changing our ordinance? What does it look like? And and, ultimately, through the discussions that we've had with the community, we've had at several of our meetings, through discussions that staff has done a great job of facilitating, it's very clear that our our current ordinance is inconsistent, unenforceable, and un unequitable. And and, you know, as other other people have said this evening, I mean, the goal is is to make sure that people are are safe.

Right. And, the definitions have of of these vehicles, the makeup of these vehicles have changed. Our ordinance has not kept up with it. And so, ultimately, I I am supportive of of of this change. I think it makes it much easier for enforcement.

I think it provides, important and necessary safety when it comes to these recreational vehicles. I don't think we need to necessarily be in a rush to to pass it tonight, because, you know, the season's just about over. But I do think, you know, as I said, I'd like to at least be clear what what, you know, what what what other questions we have before we go into our next meeting where we hopefully are actually approving, an ordinance and moving it forward. So thank you for those that came out this evening, and, again, thank you for staff for the work that they put into this.

Thank you. So what other questions might we have other than looking to, define the flotation versus Neptune?

Yep. Yeah. I'll I'll just second on context. We're just sort of done.

Okay. Go ahead. No problem.

Thanks. My only other question is one that might be clear to others, but it's not clear to me. On the recreational vehicle, the all train vehicle, is there some sort of designation that they have? Is that the type of license plate? Is it is there a if I have a Jeep, I say, well, I can drive my Jeep anywhere. Does that make it all terrain? Know? I just wanna make sure that's clear for everybody. I wasn't sure if that's any I

think it's under section. Yep.

All there it is. Recreational vehicles. The names of vehicles is either an all terrain vehicle, utility train vehicle, off highway motorcycles, snowmobile, with those terms having the meaning set forth in the Wisconsin statutes.

So so that's the DNR law that that defines those. When we were discussing, well, what are we gonna allow on the lakes?

Like, do we wanna go like, to go

over up north and people just drive their cars out there? There was a definite no by everybody we're speaking with. So to limit it to recreationally reg registered vehicles was an easy way to define them, and that's what that statute makes. Okay.

I just wanna make sure that they did govern it because yes, that's

not. Absolutely. Did you

have another question, supervisor? Yeah. To what degree might that open up this to what degree does the definition of recreational vehicle, if it's tied to the state statute or DNR restriction, to what degree could that open up this, ordinance amendment to no longer being effective if that definition expanded at some future date? Right? Like, what if all of a sudden they're 1,800 pounds in as part of the definition? I I don't may maybe that's totally, you know, nonsensical in the future, but

maybe it's not. I'm going to pass the question down to the you know, work here.

Okay. Could we get you to come in a little faster so close online?

So you're talking about if the weight limits?

I'm just trying to, like, you know, use my imagination to think, like, what could happen to the definition of recreational vehicle that would then make it so that this ordinance is no longer really good for Lakes Of Dane County. Right? Like, could I don't know. Could they have a bunch more wheels? Or, you know, I'd be way heavier to that change. Like a motor home? Because we're

like that.

Sure. We're tying it to a definition that, in theory, we don't have any control of. I guess with most of our definitions, we try to maintain a standard where they could still be on the roadway and then our trails too, that they don't exceed weights. They're not too wide to get through certain gates on some of our trails. So I really don't see too much of that changing.

We just increased our definition of weight for, I believe, UTX. But again, most of the stuff that we're seeing on the lake, so we're also seeing not just vehicles, but it's all these, ice shacks. This year, I think we had more ice shacks go through a lot of our lakes than wrecked vehicles. I can say maybe one or two ATBs and probably three to four ice shacks that went through with our ice conditions.

So And ice shacks are not implicated by this

ordinance. No.

You know, they could have a 5,000 pound ice shack, but there's no

So maybe we should look at that in the future.

Well, is that the is there a statute of deals? They're just their duration. Okay. Turation.

They have to be off by a certain day.

Which Handle this first. Yeah. Will take a look at that.

All the time, it's

not that it's not that they've

been taken out. It's in the soft coats, so we go. Get some pancakes. I don't wanna get it this big. Right.

Do we see anybody else online?

I have questions.

So any other questions online? K.

You're reading none. Oh, go ahead.

So are we making

is it possible to make a motion? What's motion?

You can make a motion Supporting this amendment,

or I'm not sure what the language is

for this. You could do an amendment to include Right. The information that we talked about. If people still feel they want more time, we're not really at the time constraint. If we wanna try to do something, you know, further than than where this goes, then you just make a motion to table it until a later meeting. You know, those are options or assets. It is. But it doesn't sound like that's gonna be what happens.

Well, I would make a motion in support of this, whether that's the motion to forward this on to the common board. Is that

where this would go? Yeah. The

addition or amendment of the the the flotation device definition type type of device. Okay. And they're clarified within this amendment. So

that covers it? We'll take in. Have other items that was premature.

It doesn't matter what else discussed tonight. Okay.

Second.

Second. Okay. We have a first and a second. Is there further discussion? Go ahead.

Yeah. I guess I just I mean, we have heard a bunch of testimony on this. We've had hearings. There's been a outreach to other venues or the other you gotta you just said you had you really you just said you had a some show or something that Fisher some of this has talked about. Mhmm. Was there a bunch of discussion there about flotation devices on on the first person as it moves down the vehicles?

Yes. But it was positive, negative. It was positive. They were happy. They were happy about the ability to use other their other machines that they They put what they have. They weren't happy to also then have to wear a life vest. They're like, well, why the life vests? And I explained to them, well, if we're trying to if the argument is that machines should have them to keep people safe, well, then the argument should also be that people should have without g. They're like, oh, okay. So they wanted a whole they wanna go ahead and and do your thing with no restrictions. So

Right. They're gonna pull it to get there. Correct. Like, Right. I'll

just add to, like, some of our lakes, we do have life, jacket stations that we could possibly look at, you know, when this were to go through so that people could wear free EFTs if they're using a.

Oh, okay. So just can you do a scenario like we'd have the prices? Just pick one up at the

At the boat ladies. We have it during bowling season. We have a little kiosk where it's a little a life jacket. So people come in. They they get plenty of life jackets as they need for passengers in the boat, and then it's just one that they can use for the day.

Okay. Okay. Yeah. I mean, if it's, say

it back. So another thing is, I mean, we passed this if this becomes an ordinance, that doesn't preclude anybody from putting flotation devices on their vehicle. It's like, no. No. It could still be that. Okay. And and they may feel safer by doing that, but they're also required to have rotation device on the. Right. So I think we've about this enough, and we you know, I think it's a safety issue. The main objective is to keep people safe so they're not drowning out there and freezing in a frozen water. You know? So I'm I'm gonna recommend you to have every one the favorite kids.

K. Go ahead.

My my only question is if a float suit if a float suit the float suits that are out there, I know that they are not postcard approved type two. If there is a float suit, there I I don't I don't know how much points you provide. Don't know if

Mustang Mustang makes a type two float suit that would meet the requirement. Again, I'll get you the information regarding that, but it would be all you'd have to have in the definitions for this would be the type two requirement. And then people that are purchasing that would just

have to make sure that it's type two. So whether it's

a float suit or a life jacket, it would be

authorized as a type two and marked on the online.

Mhmm. And we have a lot of time for the course of the summer to make sure the work gets out and the media and whatnot to folks that are partaking the sports. So we have a motion on the floor to add the definition of the type two, into the resolution. And we have a second. And is there any further discussion? Okay. Hearing none, seeing no hands, we'll go ahead and take the vote. All those in favor?

Aye.

Aye. Opposed? Okay. Motion carries. Thank you, everybody.

Alright.

Budget discussion. Budget discussion. It's absolutely 2,600 folks. Five. Okay.

So our next item of business will be $20.25 $7.62 Lakes and Watershed Commission budget recommendations. Do you want him to just go ahead and pull it?

Yep.

We're gonna just have Kyle's gonna pull this up for us.

Yeah. So I sent this out, and with the notification for the meeting tonight just for folks to review in case they were curious what was in the budget last year. At the last meeting, I think all the supervisors were in agreement that they wanted to start having budget discussions sooner than later. So I threw this on as an agenda item, for you guys' request. And so here's the information. I'm happy to turn it over to you guys. I'm ready to have a discussion. Sure.

I'm kinda open as to how people would like to start talking about it. And just as a reminder to folks, next year, I noticed, but next month will be my last meeting. So Chris Budget's gonna be with all of you. So I'm happy to do input, but, you know, I would defer mostly to the rest of the committee.

And I don't know I don't know what the future 2027 budget guidelines are going to be or any conditions of what our future budget will look like. I I've heard anecdotally from, I think, some of you and just in talking that it it will be a tough budget cycle. But if anyone wants any supervisors wanna brief other members of the committee on what the prospect looks like

that might be helpful. Yeah.

I mean, I can just kick it off a little bit, and then the other supervisors can chime in if they'd like. But we heard have heard the same thing that it may be a similar situation to last year's budget cycle, which would mean looking for either status quo and possibly cutting where we can. I know it's some pretty mean mean times, but we don't we don't know that for sure yet. But I would just anticipate a tough budget season. Maybe that's the best way to just say it.

And I think staff has done an excellent job with our budgets in the past and what they've written forward for us and then any input from anyone on the committee. I know, you know, PFAS, that situation continues. So, you know, that may be, you know, an item of interest for us here. And then anybody wanna chime in with any comments or ideas since we're Furman. Supervisor Furman, why don't you go ahead?

Thank you, chair. We supervisors got a memo last week that that showed, yes, we're gonna have a very tough year. There was media reports about that.

Mhmm.

I'm I'm I was I've been pushing for us to have this budget discussion earlier and get in the habit of having it earlier because I just think it helps us with process. You know, the good news is we just talked about these budget recommendations fairly recently, late last year. You know? And I mean, so I I personally don't have any changes there. I do think even when we were talking about it last year, we were keeping in mind that we knew last year wasn't gonna be great.

This year is probably even worse. I I personally don't have any changes to what we're suggesting. My suggestion is if people do, let's talk about that and then forward this along, to the appropriate departments at you know, as early as possible as part of the process. So even if it's, like, the day after, you know, the county executive comes out with her memo giving the actual instructions for the budget, explain to, you know, those departments, the, you know, the the relevant, departments, hey. We get it.

You know, you're likely not to add this. But if you do have, you know, a few extra bucks here and there, these these continue to be our priorities. We'd like you to be considering this early on. That's my thought on and and, reason why I've continued to push for us just to have this much earlier in the process than looking for scraps later on.

Thank you. Anything else?

I I would just more or less second everything that the supervisor Furman just said there. I I mean, we did just look at these. You know, these recommendations all not all that long ago. We know the prospect for any significant increases or even even holding steady is, you know, tenuous at best. Right? So I everything else I would everything else you said, would just say no. Okay. Pretty confident with these guys. Okay.

Just just a quick Sure. Question of what's the fiscal year? I deal in different years of, like, federal budget years and state budget years. So what's the fiscal year cycle here? I mean, when would we need to make these recommendations, or when does this money start?

So, I mean, generally, what happens is the county exec will put out their expectations or their directive to the department heads, and the department heads will based on that and just cut in here if I mess this up or anything. But, they'll go ahead and say that as a starting point to say, we're either gonna have to cut or we can only add or that status quo or whatever. And then they'll present that back to the different committees, the oversight committees. Eventually, it works its way through that process to the standing committees, and then there's amendments, and there's public input and hearings and all that. And then eventually, it gets down to where the county will have to vote on it, which is usually, what, in October.

First first part of the Oh, really? Right. And then January 1 is the

this one says calendar year.

Yeah. Year. They'll say. Yeah. And, I mean, we do it every single year. So it, you know, it almost feels like you're you've hardly got your feet wet with the new budget, and you're working on the next one. There's pros and cons to that. I mean, it you know, you're constantly working on it, but at the same time, you know, you can maybe incrementally change things without having some sort of itch in the head of a long time period goes bad. Right. Alright. Well, hearing no other comments, I guess, do you have any anything else you need, please? No. You

guys are good?

No. Won't be the last discussion budget. Would

you like me to just bring this up at the next meeting for you guys to approve it, change all the dates in there to reflect moving forward for 2027. That'd be the most efficient for the group. Yeah. Yeah. Bring that to the next meeting. Yeah.

Okay. I can do that. Yeah.

Because typically, we also look for a motion from you guys to approve those recommendations so that way they're ready to go. Or if you wanna wait until the budget guidelines come out in case something does change, you can always wait until that time too.

I I wait because I mean, you never know. You know what I mean? But that's just me again. I would defer to

I don't I don't see any reason to wait because we can amend it. It's not like we can't send another memo and be like, hey. We changed our mind. But I really yeah. I wanted just to be in in the front of their as much the front of the mind as possible when they're making up their budget. That's all. Understanding that we're likely not to get much this year if anything.

Sounds great. I will have have those changes made and have that available.

Okay. That sounds good.

I just have one question.

Sure. Go ahead.

I think the last time we talked a little bit about the process of of what the state statute says regarding commissions, this commission and and budgets Yes. Budget that you're supposed to present. I think you guys are gonna look at to talk to Counsel about that. Oh, court Laura's gonna follow-up with the authority council. Talk to the court about that yet.

I will connect with her

to see. Sorry. I did not have that available. Next next time also when we when we look at voting. Yep. That was the What what did say about it? Okay.

Okay. Future meeting items and dates, the fifteenth, I would say, for the next meeting.

Tentative schedule for April 15. April 15. So get your

taxes done. Did you get the I

don't know.

Okay. Oh, okay. Go ahead.

Just one quest question. I talked to Kyle a little bit about future agenda items, and we've talked about neonics. It was neonicotinoid. A class of pesticide, which is pretty nasty stuff where it's becoming somewhat controversial, not just in our state, but nationwide and in Europe too. And it's like a seed coating that burns seeds, and it's digging into waterways Oh. Impacting aquatic life, etcetera. So someone here at the county, I'm sorry. I'm forgetting his name, works in your office. Yes.

James Broadseller.

Right. Right. So maybe have him as a future speaker at one of our meetings.

That would be great.

I Mhmm. I'd already talked with him last fall. He'd he'd be more than willing to come to at least bring an awareness about this Sure. Emerging issue.

And I

and I know that there's also an individual at DNR that kind of specializes in that too. So he's been providing quite a few presentations. I think he actually lives

in Madison, so might go ahead and talk to you soon. He's actually

a Neo Nick Yeah.

Working room, you know, which through university, which is I could reach out to them too, and maybe they might have canned thoughts or be interested in talking to So I I could talk into them.

Yeah. If you got one, I think it'd be good. We can we can certainly try to go through that note. Sure. Thank you.

Okay. Anything else? Anything online? Alright. Any such other business as well

Actually, chair chair, one thing maybe at the next meeting, I don't I don't know if there's anything staff can decide if this is something that they can actually provide us.

I don't know if we can

get an update on lake levels. I will say from personal experience, I've never never seen my area of Mendota Lower. In fact, I don't have a lake outside anymore. So I'm just curious if there's anything that if there's anything I value to talk about. If staff just wants to talk about that offline with me, great. But, if there's anything notable, I I assume we're probably just not getting enough enough rain and burn

Okay.

You know, a drought. But, yeah, that that's a possible topic for our next meeting. And if staff decides that that's not worth that much of a discussion, that's okay as well.

Okay. So you're

gonna call me and and talk

to me anytime you provided for me. But isn't there a standing, like, twice a year, John normally gives a, like, level reward?

He gives quarterly as fuck.

Then completely disregard my request. Thank you.

But but feel free to call me,

and and I can tell you what I mean, we just closed Monona at the beginning of or Mendota at the beginning of the month, and we're switching back to summer levels now, but it is precipitation driven or lack of precipitation.

And the joint meeting on lake levels is scheduled for May 7. So

Awesome. Thank you.

Yep.

K. I have

a request also, if I can.

Sure. Go ahead, Dee.

Okay. Yeah. So I am very interested in having a speaker come and talk about the ice conditions in the winter. And I know professor Wu had a graduate student that might be able to come in and talk to the group. One of my concerns is the mouth of the Yahara as it goes into Lake Monona and how thin it's it is every winter now, and we're we're getting, I I'm just wondering if that's something that has to do with the increased velocity of water through the Yahara.

Or, in any event, whatever the reason, I feel like, some sort of, education for this commission and thinking about ways to, keep the community safe given the changing ice conditions is something that I'd be interested in hearing from somebody about.

Okay. Final answer on this.

Yeah. Dia, if if you know of any good speakers, I will try to just see if I can find someone. But please, either or Chen, if you have any recommendations, of academics that are I would welcome recommendations.

Yeah. I, I suggested three in what I was in the minutes from, two minis ago, I think.

Yep. I got those.

So those would be my suggestions, but, professor Wu might have another one.

I think that's that's good, though. Anything what what you can what we can do is they can invite them come and provide their perspective about what they see the current condition or what would they see the future condition would be, which is a little bit more projection. I think that's why you use dear, that's what you think about maybe a future condition might be more of concern. But I think any speaker, I would I would strongly support it. And to at least that I want to learn more about what the people in the climatologist, what they project and think might happen at this point.

Yeah. I know that Steve Vavris keep the state climatologist, he they they have tracked Mendota's ice on, ice off very closely.

He he will be a great speaker. I can see that he has updated. Even he is he has some exercising or some kind of race that to for people to predict when I saw what it happened this year. So he might be a great speaker for to invite him to give a talk.

Okay. Thank you.

Alright. Any such such other businesses law by law? Seeing none. Hearing no more. Item k adjournment of entertaining Motion to embrace the list and second. All in favor?

Aye. Aye.

Board rejections. Thanks, everybody.