Housing Commission - Regular Meeting

Good morning.

Okay. I am calling this meeting of the housing commission to order it. It's 05:30PM on September 25. And I'm going to talk a little bit about the change in meeting structure, although we know it, but not everybody may know it, that we now are having Zoom style meetings out to the public as well as having the possibility of people meet in here as well. So and because of the number of agenda items tonight, public comments will, excuse me, be a maximum of ten minutes, usually three minutes apiece.

But if there are more than four, then it'll be two minutes apiece up until five, and then one minute after if we have 10 speakers that are are out there or who come later. So I would just say, prioritize your questions that need answers. Okay. And I wanted to note that there are two new commissioners for all of you who don't know. Our two new commissioners are Jasmine Joes and Ram Sripathy. Welcome. Welcome. Do you wanna say a couple of sentences about why you came to the commission or anything like that? Sure. You're good. My

name is Jasmine Jones. Thank you for the introduction. Mhmm. I'm excited to be here. I live in a cucumbertino and work in Fort Altoona Health, and I'm really excited to be part of the mission and to serve the community.

Yeah. Great. Thank you very much, Jess. Thank you for being here.

And Oh, my name is Ram Shaprati. I've been a co working resident for probably twenty plus years. Kids. I graduated three year, seen various schools. Seeing the change in COVID in the housing. So whole situation, I'd like to see that it goes on, and people like to live continue to like living and good.

Very good. Welcome along to the housing commission. And I don't know if you wanna say a couple of words, Anita or we should you had presented yourselves last time. Sure.

Yeah. My name is Usha Nalayan. I'm a resident of Cupertino and since 2000. And two boys who've graduated and are all working right now, and I'm a architect who's practicing in Palo Alto.

Thank you, Lida. I'm I'm Lida Gimli. I've been living in Cupertino and working for the most part of my life in Cupertino, also in Cupertino since 1997, which makes it twenty eight years. I raised two successful daughters and loving. They both went through Cupertino schools, attended to all the programs that the city offer. So that made it kind of kind of fun fun history to remember, but I said that as a single mother. Thank

you. Thank you all for your introductions,

and I'll just say a little bit about myself. Some of you may know me already. You too do. My name is Connie Cunningham. I'm a thirty eight year resident here in the city. Both of my stepchildren attended all the schools here and went to all all the various programs. Even back then, they moved out of town because of the high cost of living. So it's not something new to our area, and so it's something that this draw drew me sort of naturally to the housing commission. Although my original interest when I first came was in the homelessness of DeAnza students and finding some way to help them. So that's what drew me here, and now I'm here.

It's my seventh year. And so there you go. That's that's that's a little bit about me. I also wanted to say very well to. You didn't have the opportunity to meet her, unfortunately. You would have enjoyed meeting her very much. She res she resigned on July 15 speaking to the city council. She was unhappy to leave, but her rent had increased to the point that she could no longer stay in Cupertino. This is market rate housing. She spoke eloquently of her love Cupertino and being honored to serve on the commission.

She asked council to create a designated renter seat on the housing commission. Renters are 40% of the city and deserve to have this as well. Nguyen was active on the commission. She was elected as vice chair this year, earlier in the year. She brought the experiences of renters to expand our understanding of policies that we were discussing.

In an article on August 5, if you read the spotlight, entitled West Valley Rents Displace Young Adults in Local Government Service, it tells her story and that of other young adults who have to leave for the same reason. Excuse it. Prevents them from serving in their communities. So if you have an opportunity to read that, you can read the whole thing about that. So thank you. I don't know if she was able to join us this evening, but thank you, Yuyi, for your service. It was really fun to work with you, and we wish you the very best in your future.

So

now I think it's time for the roll call.

Commissioner Narayan? Yes. Present. Commissioner Jindi? Here. Commissioner Sripathi?

Here.

Commissioner Jose? Here. Chair Cunningham? Here. All present.

Thank you. And now the first agenda item is approval of the minutes, to approve the minutes of May 22 for the Housing Commission meeting. And so I would ask for comments from anyone. Did you have anything you wanted to say about them or corrections you wanna have made? Hearing none, then I oh, I have none either. So hearing none, then I would ask for a vote.

There's a motion.

Oh, I take a motion to approve the minutes?

No. I'll raise the motion. No.

And I will take a date. Second. Can we take the vote?

Commissioner Noreen?

Aye. Yes.

Commissioner Jandy? Yes. Commissioner Sripafy? Commissioner Jones. Yes. Chair Cunningham. Yes. The motion carries unanimously.

Okay. For new questions, by the way, when they do voting, you can say I may or abstain.

Because since you weren't here, you might want to abstain. Okay. Next, were there any postponements?

None.

None? Okay. And next is oral communication. Residents of the meeting, though, first. Am I seeing none? I would ask if there are residents on Zoom.

We have no speakers on Zoom.

You all have three minutes to speak. Anyway, so we have no oral communication, so I'm moving along to to do the second business item. No. Consent calendar. Do you have any items under consent calendar? None. Do we have any old business? Okay. Moving on to new business, agenda item two. The subject is to select the vice chair for from now until the end of this year.

So we will take one nomination at a time, and then we'll take we'll we'll make the nomination by the second in. The person nominated will give a short description of calls and interest and any comments that we may have, and then we'll take a vote. Okay. Does that sound reasonable? K. Do I hear any nominations?

Can I nominate myself?

You may.

You may? Yes. Okay. Do I hear a second?

Yes.

Okay. So I'm supposed to call you by commissioner and your last name. So sorry. I've been calling you by your first name. So Commissioner, Narelle, would you like to make a presentation?

Sure. I am a registered architect and been practicing for over thirty years. Mhmm. And I have a good grasp of planning, design

Mhmm.

For all kinds of clientel and stakeholders Okay. From diverse demographics. So I feel that I have a good grasp of the building codes. Mhmm. The any zoning regulations for most cities that we that I've done projects in. So I think I can get my professional background and make that an asset for our commission with my background. So that that's my case. Thank you. Yeah.

Do I hear a second? Hello? I

think we already had a second.

No. It's not a second. Okay. So any any comments? I

wanna say something. Okay. It's been great to know you're here. Like I said, we do have those incredible experiences to bring. But somehow, I feel like those apply more for the planning commission. I could be wrong. Of course, you know, you can also contribute to any decision that hasn't commissioned. Mhmm. And you've contributed an incredible. You. Thank you. Interesting.

Of course, I find myself in a difficulty. I was planning to place another name. So I would just say that I think you would do a very nice job. You. Thank you. But at this time, I'd probably not, yeah, have anything particular to say other than, yes, your qualifications are very good. Absolutely.

Yeah. And you too.

Referring to

the commission setup.

I understand. Thank you. And so now I think comments are finished. So we we take a vote.

Commissioner Ryan? Aye. Commissioner Jindi? Commissioner Srikanthi? Commissioner Jos? Aye. Chair Cunningham?

Aye.

The motion carries unanimously.

Okay. Sounds

good. We are

Is that what I do? Cap cap

each other.

Absolutely. Yeah.

Okay. Agenda item two has been closed, and congratulations Thank you. Thanks. To commissioner Narayan. Narayan. Thank you. I think it's saying commissioner first. Yeah. Whatever. So, anyway, we are now ready to go on to agenda item three. The informational presentation on the program year 2004, development block grants, CGBG consolidated annual performance and evaluation report, CAPER. The recommended action is to approve this submission to go to HUD. It is a report. It doesn't go to the council. Okay. We'll see. So I believe you have a presentation.

I do. Yes. Thank you. So good evening, and welcome, housing commissioners. I'll be the staff presenter for the items here tonight. Okay. The first item is, as the chair mentioned, the community development block grants consolidated annual performance and evaluation report. It's a lot of words that basically just means it's an annual report. So what it is is something that's required by us as staff to produce to Department of Housing and Urban Development once a year because they are the awarding agency for the community development block grant. Right?

They give it to the cities. We administer it on their behalf using our own local expertise to meet our low and local. Right? The consists of, first, a summary of all the CDBG funding that was distributed during the year, which activities it went to, and then the progress those activities made towards our long range CDBG goals that are made in our long term five year plan. Right?

That's the purpose of the CAPER, to see how well our spending towards activities is meeting our long term goal. So for clarity, program year 2024 activities took place between 07/01/2024 to June '25, meaning this is already finished. Right? This is a report on something that already happened last year. And I should mention that program year 2024 was year five of five over our last five year consolidated plan cycle.

Meaning, going forward next year, we'll have a new consolidated plan cycle with new priorities that we'll be meeting. One more caveat to note is that this year, the city underwent a voluntary grant reduction of the CDBG grant. This occurred because we underwent an environmental audit of HUD on a project that occurred back in 2018. It was a rehabilitation project. You that used CDBG funds.

Right? The city was required to return about half of our allocation this year back to HUD in order to solve the findings that they made in their audit. And so that artificially lowered our grant total this year from our expected allocation of about 301 half thousand dollars to about $170,000. So in other words, our grantees this year, we're working with about half of the extended funding. Something to know.

Right? So first, let's take a look at the consolidated plan priority needs. These are the needs that we are trying to meet through all these programs and activities. These are identified in our five year comp plan of the last cycle. So the first being affordable housing, second being to prevent and assist those who are experiencing homelessness, third is community services, fourth, fair housing.

For those of you who are new to the concept, that's basically fighting housing discrimination, and then finally, economic development. In the program year 2024, we funded four different subrecipients through the CDDG program. First was Live Oak adult day services. They have a senior adult day care program. We funded them for about 9 and a half thousand dollars. Next to West Valley Community Services, we funded the 80 access to resource and education program, also known as the care program. This is kind of a general low income assistance program. It's food. It's clothing. It's a case for it to help them get connected to other services.

Next, under the housing projects, category, we funded rebuilding together for low income housing repair and rehabilitation, the amount of $96,000. And then finally, we had our CDPG public infrastructure project, where we awarded about $50,000 to the Cupertino Senior Center for the, let's just say, HVAC replacement project. Now for the outcomes, keeping in mind, all these recipients are working with approximately half of the funding that they thought they were going to receive. Level of the day services was still able to serve 14 out of the 20 projected households. In other words, 70% of their senior services goal was met.

West Valley Community Services was able to serve 100 out of 100 households that low income households, with low income assistance. In other words, 100% of low income services goal. Building together, Silicon Valley was able to serve six out of seven of their low income rehab goals or, in other words, 85.71% of how the housing preservation goal met. The CooperTN Senior Center fire sprinkler replacement project is currently under construction right now. This is slightly outdated because this presentation was made a couple weeks ago, and it is expected to be completed by this December.

And then the next project, the Cupertino Center HVAC upgrade is expected to commence right after that. So, again, we take that and then we compare that to a larger consolidated plan goals, right, for the larger five year term. You see each of these cap these activities listed do correspond with some kind of long range goal that we are trying to meet. Right? We have a low homeowner rehabilitation that's rebuilding together Silicon Valley.

Rented unit rehabilitation that was addressed by the previous, project I mentioned at the, Vista Village. Frail and elderly services, that is the, Live Oak adult day care services. Services for low income families and homeless populations, that is the West Valley Community Services activity. Fair housing, this is actually funded outside of our CDPHE program through our EMR fund, to Project Sentinel. Right?

They do tenant landlord mediation as well as fair housing investigation and enforcement. And then finally, because this Kassali planning cycle also started in the middle of COVID, there was a an additional, goal added to address, communities for COVID nineteen response as well. And so not this year, but previously in previous years, there was actually a CDBG activity for economical business that were affected by the COVID pandemic. Important to note, this is not necessarily a CDBG grant activity, but these are other activities that we funded through local funds in order to help us further our our meeting of these, like, long range goals through local funds. Right?

They come from one, the BMR fund, but also from our general fund, right, from the city council. We call it the human services grant fund. We awarded five other organizations through local funds. First one that I mentioned was Project Sentinel for about $50,000. We also awarded Catholic Charities for ombudsman legal representation. This is investigating long term care facilities where seniors live to ensure that there's no elder abuse happening. My Tree, the domestic violence shelter, received about $25,000. They're domestic violence shelter and transitional housing program. Senior adult legal assistance, they as their names suggest, legal assistance for seniors. Right?

West Valley Community Services Haven to Home program. This is a housing specific case management program that tries to assist individuals at risk or experiencing homelessness to find their way back into housing. And, again, we note, all of these programs either were very close or even exceeded their annual goals that they sent to us. Project Sentinel was able to serve 77 of their projected 82 households or 93 94% of the fair housing goals met. Catholic Charities was able to serve 16 out of 16 households, which is 100% of their senior services goal met.

Was able to serve eight out of their eight households, 100% of the shelter goals being met. Senior adult legal assistance was able to serve 35 out of their goal of 20 households, so 175% of their senior service gains met. And then West Valley Community Services through their Havens Home program was able to write, I think, case management services to 80 households above their projected goal of 75, so a 107% of the unhealth services met. Some other accomplishments that are noted in the CAPER, they're not necessarily funded by CDBG, but they do further our CDBG goals that occurred in this past year that also happened with the assistance of the housing commission. We adopted our housing element last year.

We, held a study session and laid it up to city council for adoption of DMR anti displacement strategy. We were able to execute a memorandum of understanding for the West Valley shelter feasibility study, go teaming up with other cities in the West Valley to see our combined feasibility for essentially bringing more shelter services to other surrounding cities. We hosted our first annual housing resource fair for outreach to local organizations in relation to the housing element. This year, we focus on tenant services. And then finally, to this housing commission funding for both two for two affordable housing projects, the Mary Avenue, extremely low income and with households for IDD and intellectual disabled development, household, as well as the Wolf Road educator housing, was granted in the amounts of 3,000,000 and 1,000,000 from our BMR fund.

So, that is the end of the content, that I have to present that's in the CAPER. The next steps would be for us as staff to submit that CAPER by the deadline of 09/29/2025 to ensure that we are meeting our goals from. This would be the commission action, but first, I'd like to open it to the commission for any clarifying questions.

And do we hear any questions from the Mhmm. Is it commissioner?

When you reported, you said this is the accomplishment versus the goals. Were those goals communicated when they applied for the funds, or how do we know how those goals?

Great question. Yes. So, whenever someone applies to our funding NOFAs, right, for any contribution, they'll also typically put on their application how many households they plan to serve with that funding, and then the commission kinda weighs in a meeting typically in March, right, to see, like, you know, who where is the best use of our funding to meet, you know, our our housing goals. So that is part of the NOFA, and that's continued onto the contract.

It's just a part of commissioner. Thank you. Oh, come on. Clarification. Two meetings ago, we approved all of Sunday. Correct. So this is updated based on that? Or

Great question. What you guys awarded was the fiscal year 2025 funding for upcoming year.

Okay.

Yep. So we'll we'll be coming in here again next year with an update on those on that on that order funding. This is from the previous year. Okay.

Got it.

Let's see.

Commissioner Joe, do you have a question? Commissioner. I did have a

question. Sure.

You kinda clarified it a little bit there where you said this report is on the funding for PY 2024. So, basically, the year that's completely over with because and so you and you were explaining the funding availability and the problem that we had in that year. So the choices that we made this month, that HUD funding is still yet to be determined whether it's received or not.

True? True. Yes. We are still waiting on our final award from HUD.

Okay. Yes. Okay. Because the the year starts in July. Mhmm. But we don't necessarily get it in June.

Yep. HUD HUD likes to take its time when they send out that award.

Yeah. So what do our grantees do? They just hang out?

No. We we we create an estimate basically on our last three years of funding. Right? We create an average. Mhmm. And then we get kind of, like, a tentative, like, award generally sometime around the summer Mhmm. That where we we have our expected fund rate, and we base our contracts on that amount. But the actual final award letter from them, that typically comes in the fall.

Oh, does it? Yeah. Didn't realize. Yeah. Okay. That helps clarify it too. One of the difficulties with reading these c's sometimes for the two, you'll be one. Is that some of them are PY, which is

Program year.

Program year, and some of it is fiscal year, FY, and then there's and then there's calendar year. So, yeah, you just really have to pay close attention to what comes before the y. Mhmm. But okay. Thank you very much. That clarifies it for me. I don't have any other question. Thank you. I have. That's Sure. Commissioner.

Kinda stood out to me that somehow we lost half of the funding, and that's due to missing a report, I think. I'm like, how did we let that happen? Because we lost 176,201, which is about half of the funding that was initially granted to us, which means the nonprofits missed out on this valuable amount to provide the services. So how did it happen? Sure.

So every single year when CDBG funds are expended for different projects, there's a part of administration that goes into enacting these contracts called the NEPA review. It's the National Environmental Protection Act review where each project is kind of assessed for its environmental impacts. Right? Things like by its sound, traffic, endangered species, wetlands, all this stuff. Right?

That all kinda goes into the review, and that happens, generally speaking, in the summer. We underwent an an repo audit from Huddl where they went in and checked kinda all of our projects that we had been doing all the way back until the year 2018. And they had a finding that they said that a project done in 2018, the NEPA was done incorrectly by their finding. And so having already expended money for that project, they asked for that money to be sent back.

Yeah. So very

thorough. Yeah. Going forward, the way we prevent that is, of course, is being streamed being stricter on our NEPA. Right? Having more eyes, more checking, and strong understanding of the regulations of NEPA review, to ensure that it doesn't happen again.

Thanks, Nikki. And I've seen in some of the reports, it says, is there any any effect on environment? And the answer is no.

Yeah.

But is that part of our job to provide that to make sure

Great question. Yeah. So all of our staff reports, right, there's always, like, a a sequel analysis at the end, right, where it's like like, is there a sequel impact on what's going before the commission tonight? And so, usually, it says no because usually what we're voting on are various plans, right, various plans is it's an administrative action. Right? Voting yes or no on a plan generally has no secret impact. Things like construction do have a SQL impact. Right? And so those ones those ones who are would require environments will review typically of some kind. Yeah. No problem.

So I have one question. I have

a comment on question. So the the funding that was changed, so, like, from the 2018 set. Right?

Yeah.

So how much of an impact does it have for future funding?

Yeah.

And the other thing is just a comment that I was really glad to see that the funding that was allocated last year has been used more than, like, you know, like, whatever the goal that they said has been used, like, more than what they had set as a goal. So it is Yeah.

Very very positive. Yes. So good, actually. Yes. So we we've we've been penalized, right, already for for this environmental finding, and we had to return funds from the 2024 year. Going forward, it should not affect any future programs. Right? It it's been closed. Right? The funding's been closed with that with that action.

So we should not see any more impacts of funding, at least based on that audit. And you're right. It it is kinda heartening to see that despite this challenge, a lot of our subrecipients were still able to provide quality service to their subrecipients. Sometimes meeting their goals, sometimes coming very, very close to meeting the goals, right, even though they're working with essentially half. So it is it is hard. Yes.

Are there any other any comments? I have no further questions or comments. So at this time, we can get a motion for

Sorry. One more thing. Could we check to see if there's any people online that haven't.

Forget that part.

We have no comments on Zoom and no comments in person share.

Okay. Then we can close the comments from the public. Making a motion for this agenda item. Do I hear a motion?

Yeah. I motion to press.

And

do I hear a second? Thank you very much. It's been moved from seconding you that we approve the submission of the PY twenty twenty four CAPER to the to HUD. Okay. Can we take a roll? Can you take the vote, please?

Commissioner Jindi? Aye. Commissioner Sripathy?

Aye.

Commissioner Jos? Aye. Vice chair Naren? Aye. Chair Cunningham? Aye. The motion carries unanimously.

Chair Musei? Yes. Closes agenda item three. So moving along to agenda item four, the subject is an informational presentation. The recommended action is to receive a presentation and hold a study session on recently enacted executive orders on public camping bans and recent New Canton clearance.

Compare with neighboring jurisdictions that have recently enacted the local policies. And just to let you know what a difference is, holding a study session as opposed to needing to to vote at the end of it is that we will be, asking questions, deliberating along with the public, and all of that information will go to the city, and then they will be preparing an ordinance. We are not approving or disapproving an ordinance at this time. So that's that's a big difference between what you'll see on some other things where you're actually voting to approve what happened. So we'll start with the presentation. Are you getting the new the presentation, Nikki, or is there anyone else?

No. That's me. Okay.

Great. Thank you.

Great. Yes. Thank you, everyone. We're gonna move on to the next item, which is encampment adherence policies. This is in regarding homeless encampments. Right? So thousand commission, in addition to working with policy to produce affordable housing, preserve affordable housing, protect low income residents, that extends to the lowest income residents. Right? Unfortunately, do not have a place to maybe call their residents, but still call Cupertino their home. And so when it comes to addressing homelessness, the unhoused, there's two kind of sub disciplines.

Right? There's assisting the homeless that involves the programs, the policies, the services, the shelter. And then there's mitigating homelessness, right, which is making sure that the effects of homelessness are not are contained, right, and don't necessarily negatively impact the neighborhoods as well. Right? There's that public health aspect, the the hygiene, and there's public safety aspect. Right? Making sure that whoever's out there is being looked at, essentially, isn't in putting themselves in. This would be the second, right, mitigating homelessness. And so for purpose of this part of this presentation, we're not including things about, like, the containment of care, shelter, and any kind of programs and things like that. This is really kind of focusing on mitigating homelessness.

So first, let's go over the current protocol that the city uses when trying to address an encampment, right, and conducting clearance abatement. We use a six steps system. This was part of these manager memo. The six steps are, generally speaking, to summarize. First, we get a report from the community, either through co enforcement or the 311 Right?

So we become alerted that there is an impairment that may be becoming a nuisance. Next, we contact the county office of supportive housing to engage this individual, offer assisted services and shelter placement. Next, we contact the county sheriff's office to perform a wellness check on this individual, offer emergency medical services when necessary if they assess this person to find them not to be of. Right? Fourth is we coordinate with any, local nonprofit organizations that can do outreach to this person.

Typically, it's gonna be West Valley Community Services. Right? They they they have volunteers and outreach workers as part of their staff, and we, you know, contribute to the organization through through our various grants for these kinds of services. And then fifth, we document whether or not this individual is receptive to accepting assistance. If this person does accept assistance, we can go straightforward and move ahead to clearance abatement rate because we know they're gonna need help.

If they don't, still, we have to initiate the encampment resolution process to maintain public health and safety of the area. We typically involve co enforcement, right, to do a posting to make sure this person has ample time to know that this is gonna be coming in the next forty eight hours. Right? Seventy two forty eight to seventy two hours, and then we have someone go off to do cleanup, right, of the area. So within since I've taken on this duty, we've done three in in cabin abatements within the city of Cupertino.

We've listed their general location here, whether or not the person accepted acceptance, the date they completed, and the cost of the city. Right? And that every time we go out, we do have to pay someone to go out, assess the situation, clean up the area, and then hold on to the the belongings that they find for a certain amount of time before disposing them. So as you can see, we're generally speaking able to continue to do abatements pretty regularly under this protocol. It's about every two to three months.

And the cost to abatement, generally speaking, will be about 1 and a half thousand dollars for the smaller single person instances when there's multiple people and it becomes larger and there may be additional compounding factors, like, there's more equipment out there or something that needs to be handled and disposed of carefully, that will raise the price of that. But also important to note that in all three instances, the person who sorry. The individual that we did they even for did not accept assistance. So even though the the area was cleaned, it should be noted that this person is likely still out or somewhere. Right? And it's probably still needs help. So the reason why this is being brought now to the housing commission So

the accepted assistance means that we've gotta give them some

Excuse me.

Can we have questions until the end of the presentation? But please hold on to ensure

Thank thank you, though. Yeah. The, the reason why this is being brought to the commission now, right, is that this is kind of responding to two executive orders that were recently given, one from the president, one from the governor. Right? Both kind of urging local cities and counties to pursue their own local policy for abatement.

Right? The first being a presidential executive order. President Trump is essentially issuing a directive, right, to other federal agencies, this being HUD, Housing and Urban Development, we've which we've already mentioned, and then the health and human services. And his executive order essentially is trying to get them to study the legality of prioritizing their discretionary funding towards cities and counties that adhere to his kind of federal directive priorities. Right?

Then what is his federal directive priority? Well, the first would be for cities to enact some kind of local prohibition on urban camping, loitering, and squatting to enforce civil commitment for individuals that are on house that display some kind of mental illness, for cities to start mapping on house sexual offenders that have no fixed address, to ban safe consumption sites, and then finally, to discontinue the use of housing first intake policies for shelters. And for clarity, housing first intake policy is is is is not a development policy. Right? It is something that the COC uses when they assess individuals for taking them into housing programs.

Right? The idea being that you can have requirements for people, you know, in housing either to find employment or to get clean, right, stay off drugs, to submit to drug testing. But it's much easier to get these people to comply with these things if you get them into housing first as opposed to having them a requirement before you enter in housing. Right? That's that's what that is.

Next, on to the governor's executive order. Right? His was a directive to state agencies to develop a policy on the candidate clearance. And then similarly, to provide a simple policy to encourage cities and counties to kinda follow suit and adopt a similar policy on their end. So for his executive order, right, it actually provides a model ordinance.

It's a sample policy. Similarly, it bans urban camping, erecting permanent slash semi permanent structures for shelter, sleeping, lying, and sitting in the public right away. It also creates guidelines for how to conduct the abatements. Right? It says wants cities to initiate cleanup within forty hour store belongings, collected during abatement for up to ninety days and to force relocation of the individual that receives on the receiving end of the abatement from any posted notice, at least 200 feet.

So we did kind of a nexus study, right, of which cities that have recent in the Bay Area that recently enacted some kind of economic claims policies and the order of the contents of that policy. Right now, we noted seven different other cities on this graph here in the Bay Area. They either oppose, enacted, or kind of studying this issue right now. Antioch, Fremont, Berkeley, Cleveland City, San Mateo, and San Jose. Each of these policies kinda defines what exactly they are banning.

Right? Some of them, it's all public spaces. Some of them, it's it's only in the cases of when there's a demonstrated fire health or safety hazard. They differ greatly in their clearance management for their noticing. Some of them say seventy two hours, which is our current policy. Some of them go as quickly as twenty four hours. And for some of them, they involve offers of housing required, right, as something prior to claims management being enacted. So San so San Mateo requires two written notices. So River City request two written notices. River City and San Mateo both require shelter to be offered first.

San Jose requires three offers of housing at least in eighteen months prior to clearance management to be enacted. And then for enforcement, right, there's an enforcement component of all policies because you have to plan for what happens if someone does not comply, right, with the whole policy that you enact. It should be noted that Antioch, you know, they proposed a policy. They ended up not enacting their their policy. They found it was easier to just use their own protocol similar to what we kind of have currently.

And so their own only enforcement is to just do abatement. Right? Other city that did move forward with creating their own local policy, they have to define what the infraction is. Right? For most of them, they chose a misdemeanor that accompanied by a thousand dollar fine and or six months in jail. The only exception being Berkeley that went for an infraction, which is a lower violation and a $100 fine. Some other did a kind of like a mix. Right? Redwood City chose a misdemeanor and six months in jail, but only a $100 fine. San Mateo chose a sick $500 fine.

What's important to know with all these, right, is that none of them match the state proposed ordinance that was given by the governor, which is important because it means that for all of these cities that end up that ended up falling suit and enacting their own local policies, They found that for them, what worked best was to study it, it seems, and to choose choose pick and choose kind of, like, their own components that they thought would best fit their city. So knowing this, we have some staff analysis regarding, you know, each of these direct and how we should be responding to them. First is that the legality of the federal directive Trump's executive order is still to be decided. Right? It does seem that he will try to propose cuts to formula grants, through HUD to try to force compliance, right, by forcing dependence on discretionary funding.

But, also, it should be noted that that was, that for proposed congressional budgets in the upcoming year both to the house and the senate, funding for the CDBG program, which is our formula HUD grant, is expected to continue at similar levels. So the legality of what he's even proposing is kind of up in question. Right? Immediately responding to it as as if they are is seemingly a bit premature. Next, for the governor's executive orders, some cities appear to be taking initiative from the state order, but they're not utilizing the state ordinance from the state.

Right? But instead, they're tailoring it to their own preferences, which kinda indicates that, like, if this would be something that would want to be pursued, it would require a lot more further study to see what would be the components for our own local ordinance. What what works best. Right? Which kinda leads to this the third point, going back to this graph, all these ordinances were enacted maybe a couple months ago.

Right? Mostly July, June, February of this year. So there's not really any data yet available to really conclude that these ordinances have had the measurable effect that they wanted in clearance efficiency. Usually, for these kinds of things, you have to wait at least a year, right, to be able to compare it to a previous year to see if they had been effective. So knowing this, staff recommendation, no recommendation at this time, right, to respond in in any way positive or negatively to these federal directives federal or state directives.

Right? But instead for the housing commission to continue to study this issue as legal findings are made and more data comes available. With that, I'd like to open up to the commission for discussion. Oh, sorry. For first, for clarifying questions.

Question. That's alright. Yes. Why don't we start with you, commissioner Shibati, because you had one earlier.

So the because the one on where the assistance was provided. Right? Yes. So do we get all, like, kind of a place to stay or something, or do we get an alternative to

That's a great question. So when it comes to intake, to assistance, right, we, the city of Cupertino, are one of the many cities that are serviced by something called the Santa Clara County continuum of care. The idea being all the services, shelter programs in the county that address homelessness are kinda all funneled through a single kind of database and point of entry. This is because people who are unhoused, they don't typically have a fixed address. They move around, and it can be difficult to track.

Right? If someone, technically, like, say, moves between the border, between Cupertino and, say, Sunnyvale. Right? And then they can get lost to the system. So this was kind of, like, born out of the the attempt to try to create a more unified system for for a single stream of services. And so when it comes to offering someone assistance, the process typically is once they verbally agree to be assessed, they get something called the VISBRA. It's it's an assessment where a caseworker and a clinician. The caseworker will be usually from a nonprofit. The clinician usually from the county will go out and assess this person. They'll talk to this person, and they'll assess this person along something called acuity.

Right? This is a fancy word for what is their need. Right? That this is somebody who still technically has a job. Right? Pretty much of sound mind. Maybe they're sleeping in their car or they're bouncing from couch to couch. Right? This is someone with low acuity. Someone who probably speaking with maybe a little bit of case with management, a little bit of help can get back on their feet. That's what they would be assessed into, and that would be the kind of services that they receive. On the other hand, right, the other opposite spectrum, you might have someone who's been out there for years, and then you try to talk to them and they're not quite lucid. They display some behavioral issues, some maybe some substance abuse issues. They haven't had a job for a long time. This is not someone that we can just expect to get a job.

Right? It's it's not it's it's not realistic. This is someone who would score really high in acuity, and they would need quick placement into something like permanent supportive housing. Right? Quick interest into into the shelter system to get it to get off the street. And this would be independent of their ability to get a job or find their own income. Right? Like, they they need help. That's generally that that's a very short way to describe intake into the shelter system, but I hope I've answered that question. Yeah.

Okay. Go ahead.

It's up to them to agree or disagree.

Right. Absolutely. Right? Still they're still their own person, they can accept or not accept.

Yeah. That was a very good question. Are there any other questions in that vein? Because I do have one. And so yeah. Oh, Jane. Yeah. So go ahead.

So it's just a clarification between a person who is homeless, living in a car Mhmm. And who's already reaching out for service, like the, Housing, you know, to provide temporary housing. So that that's one category of a homeless person. So the way I understand this one, this is like an like like somebody who's occupying a public space.

Correct.

Right? Living in a public space and not really reaching out for assistance. This is a third person coming and saying, hey. You are in a public space.

Yeah.

And then we need to get you into the system kind of thing. Right? So that kind of clarification, I think we we need to understand how that will come into the you know, how we provide service for them. Of course, it's about doing it by themselves or somebody who's had to be told by somebody. You know?

That that's absolutely correct. This is this is an mechanic clearance policy. Right? So this is someone that is occupying a public space. Right? And and they're they're they're on the street. That's that's how we would say it in layman's terms. Yeah.

I mean, like, yeah, living in a car, is that defined as being in a public space?

It could be. Right? Some some places, they they they they have rules and laws regulating occupying the public right away and how long you can do it in your vehicle. We count on all all the above, right, as within, like, the the the kinda like the umbrella. But someone living in their car probably would not get abated. Right? They might be asked to move by, like, say, like, a property owner that wants some other space. But, no, we probably would not be sending out, you know, coenforcement too. Yeah. Okay.

I have a question. I thought I saw you raise your hand. When kind of a stolen question.

Oh, sorry. But still so I'm surprised that we offered service, and I didn't see any yes. So it seems like everybody said no, and I'm like, why? What is the problem there? How did we communicate with the service? What kind of service do we offer? And why do they say no? It seems like we're reaching out to better their situation and help them. And it's I imagine it's case by case. Yeah.

And I'm picturing somebody has a tent and sleeps on the street or the sidewalk. So it could be various factors that contribute to somebody saying no, but I'd say and I understand RCD is a challenge not having shelter in place here. So we have to reach out to surrounding communities or maybe the county to send somebody who sleeps on the sleep. They simply they don't know there is a shelter. Yeah.

They they don't know there is a place they could just walk in, have a good meal, and just be safe, you know, and have a roof over their head. So, like, I see the challenges that we have to communicate then. So I wonder if the city does not have the manpower to do it or not. I was wondering if we could create a team of volunteers that gets training and go and assess every single person because I believe a friendly approach should make those individuals more likely to say yes and not feeling threatened by the unknown or not understanding what their future could be. So I just delay for us to somehow work on maybe be that team volunteers that would spend more time, you know, to approaching those individuals.

I hate to see somebody's already in that situation becoming worse.

And are there any I did want to ask a question, but I'm likely each to be able to speak to you. Have a question? Yes. Commissioner Jones. With

respect to your one of your slides being discretionary funding provided that we follow the executive order, when you presented the presidential executive order and then the the state, know, state order, Is that aligned? Because I wasn't quite sure from what you presented if both of those are fully aligned or not.

It's an excellent question. No. That's that's the short answer. No. The the federal directive is a lot more far reaching in its policy prerogative, right, to to put it bluntly. Right? The governor's executive order is not asking, say, the county continue of care to discontinue the use of housing first intake policy. The governor's executive order is not asking, you know, county public health to ban safe consumption sites or to map sexual offenders with no fakes suggest. There's there's there's a lot more that the federal directive is trying to direct local cities and counties to take on, and to check not a lot of guidance on how to do it. Right?

It's do it in implying that there could be the promise of more money if you do. The legal programs that were not made for that purpose to do this is being decided, okay, right now. Meanwhile, the governor's executive order, pretty cut and clear, is very much just focused on the campaign finance policy, and they kind of provide us an example of one even. Right? Mhmm.

Now would they try to direct public funding, for that also comply with this potentially. Right? There was the proposition one that recently went out well on the ballot, and that may fall in line and become connected to this. It doesn't explicitly say that, though, but we we think maybe. Right? Yeah.

I have a question. Oh, sorry. Just a comment to that.

So the the state, the governor's office, whatever they have released, they are allowing each city to determine Mhmm. How they would approach this. Right? Because what works for city a will not work for city b. Mhmm. So that that is there. So it gives the city more power as to how they wanna address this issue. Correct?

That's correct. I I would make a note that, really, neither executive order can make us do anything. Right? They're they're directives that encourage us to direct people and and kind of play along, and they encourage us to. We're not we're not forced

to do anything. Oh, yeah.

I had a Yeah. I did I'm gonna have to ask my first question. Yeah. Was late. Like, reason she bought these, and I wanna get it out before we move on. But when he was asking about the question about do we offer housing? And you were talking about the country county, COC. Basically, they we have agreed all of our cities, and so any particular on house person in our city is not necessarily offered a housing area in Cupertino. It might be in Santa Clara or and all the cities. Right?

Anyway, so that can be a problem right there. If if they are not offered a place in they might just say, this is where my friends and everybody are. So no. That's why I wanted to clarify that because I didn't didn't realize that since we were in that meant that people who are unhoused in Cupertino don't necessarily get offered something. And as a piece of information that you may or may not know, in the consolidated report, it said specifically that Cupertino does not have any sheltered, unhoused people.

They're not sheltered at all. They're unhoused, like, in many different ways, but they we don't have a temporary shelter, and we don't have housing either. So it's just it was important to me to hear what you had to say that because probably because of that, there's no place in our city in which for us to ask this the county to put someone from our city. So I just think that's a very important

Yeah.

Point that I think all of us need to understand. So I'm I'm go ahead. Are you following up mine, Kashyir?

Yes. Following yours Okay. You're talking about Cupertino. So you said three cities are together, Santa Clara, San Diego, and Cupertino. Is that right? Or

The the continuum care service all of Santa Clara County.

Oh, all of the entire county. Okay.

All the way from Palo Alto down to Gilroy. Okay. And and and you're right. The reasons why people might refuse shelter are complicated and very personal. Sometimes, yeah, the physical distance of being at the lead, the community that you know, right, can be a barrier to some people. It's something that I've heard before, but it's very individualized. I I've heard from from female, like, announced people why surveyed why they didn't refuse shelter. Right? And they said they don't wanna be in the shelter with men. They don't know. Right? They don't wanna sleep around men. It's understandable. Right? Some people who have children, right, they'd say they would prefer, like, a noncongregate shelter, meaning, like, like, in a special room because they've got kids.

Right? It's it's not exactly safe to bring kids around, like, you know, adults they don't know. So it's it's very complicated. The reasons why some might refuse shelter, unfortunately, we actually don't have in house staff outreach workers. So we are actually barred from accessing the housing sorry. The how homeless management information system, HMIS system that kind of details all of this. Right? When someone was assessed, but when they're off shoveled by, they might refuse. So I can, like, provide the best guess, right, for these four. Yeah, so you just say that there's a lot of reasons why.

And stop calling.

Sure.

Well, just a second. You had a question I

before we started. I absolutely salute you for taking the time coming up with some policies and not rushing. But by all means, I can worry. I don't want to lose I have to lose fundings. So you have to be quite wise, meeting the needs and not losing any fundings.

So

It's just common. Right. Right.

No. That's that's that's very wise, and that's why we're we're not recommending either being, like, potentially for or against explicitly this way because saying you're against something also means something. Right? And in the broader context of, like, larger directives trying to push you in a certain direction. But continuing to study an issue as more data comes available, right, I think is a nice, middle ground.

Commissioner, Jones had said she wanted to see something. Oh, go ahead. Go ahead.

Where's the nearest thousand that

could be offered to them?

Sorry? Where's the nearest housing?

It's it's highly dependent on what their need is. Right? If if this person's a veteran, for example, right, a veteran homelessness person, the veterans housing unit is in Alam Rocky, San Jose. If this is a youth homeless person, the Wilson Center is south of Downtown San Jose. Right? It's it's highly highly dependent on who this person is, what their need is, how soon can they be introduced place before somebody else. You could be asking someone to go as far as Morgan Hill. Right? Yeah. Very dependent.

Okay. And okay. Just go ahead.

Question. Why doesn't Cupertino have a shelter? I know, like, Mountain View has I know, like, Sunnyvale has the Mountain View. Believe they even have, like, a women's shelter where they can have their children. San Jose has bunch of shelters. So surrounding cities have. Why doesn't Cupertino have?

Broader political trends, I think, that predate myself.

I can talk about that. I think prior prior to the leadership to have discussion about potential against the shelter and location in Cupertino. So that was part of the city's will program item, one of the projects. But I don't think that kinda carried through in itself for multiple reasons. Right?

When you have a shelter in in in a city Mhmm. How do you, for example, ensure that that a Cupertino individual is being serviced first or not? And and how do you what do you limit access to the shelter from individuals from other cities? So I think there's another broader scope of things. I think some of the cities that were looked at.

San Jose, for example, obviously, that's a little big. So they do have a lot of needs for that particular city as well as some other cities that have that. So when we really look at Cupertino, one, do we have new city properties, for example, that we can actually contract out and build something like this, which we don't. We don't have a lot of city properties. And then is there a private property that that may be up for sale? One or two, do something like this, and then we just have not been successful securing a level of interest for the potato. So multiple reasons.

I if I may just add, since I've been here such a long time, I read the consolidated reports for a long time that go to HUD. And at some point, it said we used to have one. And that but as of that date, which is 2017 or something Yeah. We didn't get anymore. And so we did have safe parking in churches and different kinds of activities that were utilized. But I'm thinking, and perhaps I'm wrong, that in our housing element, is there not something in the housing element for a shelter?

That's right.

I mean, I'm asking you to speak from memory. I'm sorry. But if you happen to remember

You're absolutely right. We we have two housing element policy commitments related to shelter. One for people technically, they're the the minimum requirement was to allow within our zoning areas for the development of emergency shelter, which is basically, like, people usually think of when they think of the homeless shelter, like the bunk beds, the big room. Right? Mhmm.

And then the other being navigation center, which is when you can combine shelter with the support of services that come directly in to kinda get people assessed and and assisted for things that they might complicate the homelessness, right, if they have, if they need medication, if they need counseling, if they need, you know, some kind of job training, things like that. Like, bring that into the shelter. That's a navigation center. We were committed by our housing element first to allow it by zoning, which was our minimum requirement. But, of course, we we further our ourselves beyond the minimum.

So, back in April, we took myself took to the city council, this memorandum of understanding for the city of Cupertino to join five other West Valley cities to study our kind of joint feasibility of bringing, additional shelter space and or other kind of services to the in house or facilities for the in house, to our area. Right? Because we're not alone and we're unique, right, in in this issue where we don't have any kind of shelter located near us. Right? It's us, Campbell, Saratoga, Los Gatos, Monte Sorrento combined.

Right? The results of that study are expected to come out fairly soon, and we are committed, to bring that back. Right? The results of that study to kinda guide our further kind of, goals for, like, how to address and assist the unhoused. Right? That first part, when I mentioned there's there's two disciplines within homeless policy, there's mitigating homelessness, and then there's actually addressing homelessness to bring that back for that first part for actually addressing homelessness. Right?

Thank you. Thank you very much. Yeah. I have to admit I'm looking for something because I have comments that go a little bit of a different direction, and I don't wanna close off this. So I will just continue to look for it and Just one more question.

Please. Access to the questions that they get asked for. Like you said, it's kind of agile with somebody else. So we don't know what questions are asked or because maybe there's some tuning they need to do to basically make it more comfortable with the bank. What you said, like, having a warranty or maybe helpful. Then I'm sure if asking the same question.

Are you talking about, like like, within the assessment themselves that they mentioned? Awesome. That's that's an interesting idea, like like, exploring what kind of language would make people feel more comfortable talking. I I personally don't know where are those questions because I I'm not trained in that, and, also, I'm not supposed to know. Right?

But I I will say that, like, there there are some things we can do at our level, this policy level that make people feel more comfortable working with the city or the county or for nonprofits. Right? When we when we take a very heavy approach, like, say, Fremont, right, the the greatest criticism that they found was that, like, when you scare people into not working with the city, they will hide. Right? And then it's now and then you can't find them and you can't help them. So being being wary of, like, how how us at the policy level can affect the way people want to work with us definitely plays a key role in in how we pursue policy. Right?

And, also, are there more homeless now in the city? Or

Yes. Yes. There are currently homeless there there's currently homelessness here. We we expect to see that number rise with the new count. My guys guys might have seen the news reports, right, from other cities. We're not different or we're

not unique. Yeah. Might be a little smaller because we're a smaller town.

Yeah.

But in the county, I thought I read recently 70,711 people

Right.

That are unhoused in Santa Clara County. 70,000. 711 people. So this is a huge issue, and you can see why it can get the attention that it does. And that's why I did find my questions, and they do take us in a slightly different direction. So I want to continue to allow you to pursue your questions because they're absolutely as important as these. I just this is what I kinda got focused on at the time. But, yeah, 70,000. And we have maybe 200 in our city.

Maybe The exact

I I

I am allowed to release this because it's been made public. The the count is currently 101 landhouse people in the city of Cupertino.

Okay. Yeah. So we have a 101 people that need some sort of assistance to get into housing, And so that's what we are struggling with. And, of course, it's just a subset. But, hopefully, being a smaller town, maybe we can have more trust built. It's hard to know, of course. Yeah. Has a 101. Okay. Okay. Are there any other moments, Christian?

Well, go k. Is that 101 individuals or Individuals. Individuals. Individuals.

With a caveat, right, this there the the there are some limitations to the data. Right? So the point in time count, the day that we actually go out and count people who are out there, This happens at around five in the morning ish. This is typically done because people aren't awake yet, so hopefully they're not going about moving so no one gets double counted. But that also means that, like, you you can't always clearly see someone. So if you see an individual, that person gets counted as an individual. Right? But other times, like, if you see, like, you know, like a vehicle, there'll be, a multiplier. Like like, okay. Maybe, like, 1.5.

We'll count that as 1.5 because some vehicles have two. But you see a tenth. Right? Maybe that'll be one point something. Right? And so there's a little bit of math involved. It's so it's not an exact science. Right? But it's the best approximation of the county in its methodology to give for this time.

Is there

a number that the residents of regional can call? Is that the 311 system to activate support for the individuals?

The 311 is is to kinda like all things reporting to the city. And so our second, third, and fourth step in our six step process, right, is essentially myself and whoever would be working in the housing division to try to coordinate assistance, right, essentially to this person either to the county or to the sheriff's office or to a nonprofit. And that's kind of currently our system to try to get assistance to that person. It's only after all three of other parties are engaged and we're not successful in getting this person any kind of assistance. Or or if we do, that'd be the best. Right? If we could could get them assistance, then we can just go in and clean up afterwards. But either way, right, we also have our other duty, which is to try to keep clean streets, keep clean areas for the neighborhood itself. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

It this this particular piece of paper did say contact, But then that'll probably sounds like Yeah. Now for the homeless and

disabled themselves, right, there is also, like, the county hotline. Right? And they can get assessed by the the the county hotline, run through a vote. We try to have, you know, assistance, or try to call someone to try to basically get themselves assessed as well.

Are there any other questions? Okay. I do want to bring up something that I think is important. We haven't touched on it yet, which is this enforcement. Okay? We're talking about enforcement. Antioch does abatement. Seventy two hour, let you notice. Then we jump oh, an infraction, okay, and a $100 fine. And then $1.02 $3.04 5.

Misdemeanor. Thousand dollar fine. Right? Someone who may or may not have a job, may or may not have a job. And so my concern was whether or not you could enforce things without being quite so dramatically heavy handed about it.

And, yeah, keep using my Oh, it's such as annoying. Well, I'll find it in a second here. Are there not other enforcements that are less harsh? Escorting people to a new location, probation, community service, classes, counseling, job offers by the city. There's any number of kinds of things that they come up under misdemeanor.

I looked at misdemeanor, and it says, one of the things down in a really fine print is that you get a record. You've been put in jail for a misdemeanor. We all think that sounds like this is a TV thing, but it does have an impact on the person who has been put in jail for a misdemeanor. And that one of them is that they made some of their a the right to public housing. Somebody they they put in a like, who knows?

Public housing comes up somewhere, they put in their application. Oh, you were thrown in jail. So so you've taken somebody who has no one, and you put them in a place where then they really are never gonna help them. You know, unless they can somehow find a lawyer to help them expunge their record.

I mean, none of this

is easy for somebody who owns the system or has some money or can have somebody help them. So I have to admit, I was just straightaway appalled straightaway appalled that all of these cities came up with right away. And I didn't know it was because they didn't understand exactly how hard that is to go through that system, and what six months in jail will mean if you are 8% in jail. For six months, woah, and it can actually go up to a year. But these people said six months. So okay. So other things about that.

We

talked about the cost here. This cost of 9,000 or whatever it was, what what we have here in the city. Jailed homeless people, if they're in the awaiting trial section, that's $49 a day. A month would be $1,500. So compare that to what we're spending. $39 a day if they are jailed after trial. $7,254. That's for each and every person that gets put in jail. Right? And they're in the dormitory style or whatever.

So that was one question was, has anybody considered the cost of putting people in jail? Has anybody considered the impact? The person's civil rights not ever being able to go into public housing again. And then another question I had, are there enough county jail cells for the number of unhoused residents who are estimated to be arrested? Understand they're not all going to be arrested. California has been

jail

cells for years. Right? We had a great big whole lot of them, and we've been trying to get down the number of jail cells. And so do we have enough jail cells for the people who are already there that have committed other crimes besides sleeping on the street? Worse crimes, one would think, than sleeping on the street.

And will those arrested be those who are considered to be mentally ill or addicted? Is that separate from the 70,000 number? Do we have that number? Has anybody compared that to number of jails we have? Not to speak of. We don't have any housing for them or any shelters for them. The state's order says that ordinances can be tailored to each city's needs. It doesn't sound to me I was gonna ask this question, but it doesn't sound like they're being coordinated. You know, nobody's saying, oh, let's talk about this. Let's see let's see what might work. Some are going out fast, like Fremont who okay. I'll get to that in a second. Okay. Just wondering if there was coordination. These are these are my question part.

Fremont, specifically, there was an article in our paper this week, September 20, in the local section about Fremont's approach to these federal and state orders. A lawsuit forced Fremont to remove the part that would impose a fine or jail time for people helping on. I mean, all these things make my hair better. But, you know, I just somehow Fremont thought of that. Somehow they got their whole housing commission and city council to think that was a great idea. Yes,

sir. My take on that is probably they they don't want anybody in the city who's homeless. Yeah. And so it's not your problem that you don't even come into the city if you don't.

Absolutely. You've got the nail on my head. Fremont has done other bad things, in my opinion, for, affirming people who, have very few other options. That being said, they really took it outside the limit when they said, if you wanted to help a house homeless person and you did, you could get fined or thrown in jail. Oh, how often are you gonna help somebody if you're gonna get thrown in jail?

So, anyway, Fremont did take that out of their policy, but they thought of it, and they got it all approved. So that thing mean, it just it makes me concerned concerned about what we might be doing, and that's why I bring them up because I'm like, these are things I don't wanna see in ours. Right? And I'm hoping that commissioners don't wanna see them in ours either. For instance, another question besides Fremont.

San Jose has been making a variety of efforts to provide safe places for the own house, and I know they have. They've got tiny homes, and they've got safe places to park, and they've got a number of different things. However, there still aren't enough safe places in San Jose. I mean, it's a really little number compared I mean, they've been doing work on it, and there's still a little number compared to how many they need. So if they don't have safe places to offer the unhoused, why did they come up with a thousand dollar fine and 6,000 agenda?

Where do cities in Santa Clara County expect the unhoused to go? Is this like whack a mole? Okay. You can't stay here, say Fremont. Do we go next door then to whatever city is the course nearby? People don't usually like to go someplace real far away. But and so those are just my quest. And so I think I will draw a breath here. And I didn't expect you to answer all the questions, but I wanna put them out.

Can I get some links to public comment?

I haven't oh, yes. We do. We do have to go to public comment. Do we have any public commenters?

We have one hand raised on Zoom chair. Okay.

Something to your concern because I found some reference from the governor's letter.

Okay. And then we'll just take our public. Yeah. Thank you, public, for coming to our our our commission meeting on what I consider a very topic, and I think many people welcome. Okay. One moment.

Welcome, Sujata. Welcome, Sujata. Hear me?

Thank you so much. Can you hear me? Hello? Can you hear me?

We can hear you.

Thank you. This is Sujata Venkatraman, executive director, West Valley Community Services. I appreciate the housing commission, having these discussion. These are very critical questions you you asked. And, Nikki and I was it Ben I heard, answered some of them.

I just wanted to give some, perspective on the need versus the resources available. So we have in the in the point in time count, we have 10,000 unhoused individual in Santa Clara County. And out of that, more than 7,000 are unsheltered. And this is not because they have chosen to decline. There is a small percentage.

That's because we don't have enough resources, enough housing, enough shelter beds. So I just wanted to put things in perspective, that there is not enough for everyone. Hence, the the, the clients that we serve, we have about 150 unhoused individual who come to our Cupertino site on a regular basis, is because there is not much there or it is very temporary. So just wanted to put that perspective. Being in this field for eighteen years and working, with West Valley Community Services in the city of Cupertino, we used to have shelter.

We used to have transitional housing program. There is no funding for fed from the federal government for shelters because shelters are believed to be a Band Aid. Permanent housing is the solution because you can keep someone in shelter after ninety days, and what are you gonna do? If they cannot move into permanent housing, they're back on the street. So I want you to see shelters as a temporary Band Aid, and we don't even have enough of that.

And what my recommendation to the housing commission, and you all have asked wonderful question, is stay with the staff recommendation. Our abatement policies are working. We are working with the city of Cupertino with the staff. Nikki, my staff works very closely. And look at cities that are doing less restrictive policy, and don't be scared. There is there are many neighbors who are backing us up. There are many nonprofits like us who are backing. So let's not be scared by these executive orders and take actions, And let's wait. So thank you.

One more minute. Swing, she's our speaker.

Can I still stick with three minutes?

No. That's the I thought the I thought the thought the chair had some say. No. It's three minutes. Are you maybe to establish that in

advance? Are you Oh,

I'm sorry, Sujatha. I wish you could speak longer.

I'm done with my comments. I don't wanna take up too can you hear me?

Yes. We can hear you. And we understand that what you had to say, and we appreciate so much your coming to to speak to us tonight. Thank you, Sujatha.

Thank you.

There was a lot of questions being asked.

Can I add some thoughts?

That might help.

Yes.

On this point,

honey, what I took from your

study, you have done your own study, and you brought a lot of evidence. Yeah. It's your concern of people being punished criminally and facing fines. But I saw a kind of paragraph from the governor's letter, the one that was part of the attachment. It says, no person should face criminal punishment for outside when they have nowhere else to go.

Policies that prohibit individuals from sleeping outside anywhere in the jurisdictions without offering adequate indoor shelter, effectively vanishing homeless individuals from the jurisdictions. Borders are both inhumane and imposed external externalities on neighboring. So I don't know which must face the cause and challenges to an increased unsheltered homeless population. It's not like, you know, the governor is opposing the criminal or that's my understanding. What's the understanding your understanding of this crime?

I understand that. I I do you mind? Because I was asking that question, and I read that. And the thing it is it said, regardless of what he says here, six of these seven cities have said that you're gonna put them in jail. That's it that they are. Then what he says is no person shall face that. That's very nice. That's very swell and nice. The second one says, encampment policies must prioritize shelter and service. That's very, very nice too.

Thirdly, policies must not unduly limit local authority to clear encampments. Officials must be able to enforce common sense policies to protect and yada yada yada. To me, these policies have been shoehorned into number three, and they don't pay a dime's worth of attention to the first one, in my opinion. But thank you for reading that because that's precisely where I got my upset to start with was that we had a good we had a really good

apart.

So I I can actually respond to a few more questions. Right? Antioch, the one city on there that only has abatement as enforcement, unable to do so because they actually backed down from doing an ordinance. Right? They chose to rely on their own internal protocol similar to what we have.

Mhmm.

And so that's why they only have to just go forward and do a pain. The reality is any ordinance you do, right, that's a law. Right? And for someone to not comply with the law, you have to create a violation for that. Right? And so even though you can put down the words that sound very nice, that say certain things, The reality is if you do any kind of ordinance, if someone doesn't follow it, there's gotta be either an infraction or a misdemeanor or a felony. Right? Otherwise, it's not a law. Right? So that's why that's why it's in it's in there.

Right? All the people that end up do doing some kind of ordinance, there has to be some kind of consequence for not following through with it. And so if if you don't want to have to compel yourself

Mhmm.

To have this kind of system, there is incentive perhaps to rely on protocols, right, instead of an ordinance.

Okay. That explains it.

I have a comment.

Yeah.

So we, Chino City, we are doing this study session to understand what others have done and hear

Mhmm.

Ideas from people like Sujatha and going forward. Right? So, again, these are all not opportunities. I don't know how much our input would ever affect what they've done. Right? But they've come up with that plan with input from their own commission at Brazil. Right? So maybe if their city commission wants that to happen that way Mhmm. Today, as Cupertino residents, we have no say in what they do. It's a local ordinance, local rule.

I think we can just have our discussion on what we think is right for Cupertino residents. And I think I think that's what I think we should all do is to listen to people, like, other people who are offering the services to help the city residents. Right? Whether they're unhoused or housed. So Yeah.

This is a very good point to add add just for understanding. San Jose is the only one of these cities in Santa Clara County. San Jose has a million people. All the other cities are much smaller, and I know we may be the smallest in Santa Clara County, except for maybe

Maybe my Yeah.

Okay. Honest with me now. Yeah. But that being said, because these are different counties, like San Mateo County, and Antioch is out in Contra Costa County. Fremont's on the other side of the bay. So but the one that really matters, if you're thinking in terms of how things are done, they're within our community. And so that concerns me. Like, I don't know that we would ever get pressure that we have to match them or anything in this. Oh. But, anyway, that's just a concern.

Not an answer is not necessary because it's pretty clear that this is starting, but it's something that I I'm in agreement with with you as well that we should stick with what what your recommendation was, to do for our cities, for our city. Let me just see if there's anything else that I can add.

Mhmm. Before we continue

I'm never good at organizing.

Before we continue, I just wanted to ask. I know you wanted to call a question by 7PM. Is that something that you still wanna do?

Well, gee, I was Okay. In Georgia.

I'm not meeting that up.

I've talking all night, but that being said

I just wanted to check. Yeah.

I I've done things differently if we hadn't been told that we could, like, you know, talk for a while Because I think this is a particularly important topic, and I'm glad that the other topics went so quickly. Because this one is, well, new and more important. So let me just run through this, and maybe I'll just be let's see. I mean, yeah, the process we're using is a good one. I think we should continue with it. We don't have a big population, and we're thinking one has been successful to date. Jotha said that too. Okay. Great. I recommend that we do this, but you just sit.

So I said all these things already. Yeah. I said this already. Oh, I this is something that we haven't talked about at all, and I don't know how you wanna when you're working the issue is there are monetary benefits to the city to getting people into housing. However, because of slow progress on offering safe spaces, these benefits are not felt by the voters.

You know, they just don't see it. They see the encampments. You know, those are quick. Then this may be due to lack of outreach showing the progress that we have made. Since homelessness is a major issue with voters, governments should treat it as a major issue by showing the progress in dollars and cents, perhaps by something that people can see in the cost of living or opening up stores or less crime or something of that nature. This was really just off the top of my head. But thinking about that, people really think of homelessness, and they think of encampments. And they don't think as far as because they are. They can be all those things that have been said, they can be dangerous. Then let's see.

I already said that, and I already said that. So I'm finished with all of my comments, and we can wrap it up if everybody else is finished.

Just ask one question. When will this study be to the?

You're talking about the West Valley feasibility study? We're expecting by the end of fall, the latest. Yeah.

K. Yeah.

So can I have a motion to close the study?

Discussion. Yes.

Discussion. Discussion.

On the study?

Yes. So,

basically, we'll get involved on what's on the screen. Pardon me? I don't know.

Well, it's a study session. So there's there's there's really no recommended action right now. Right? There's nothing to vote yes or no on.

But Right. But it's to close the study set.

Close the study session. Yeah.

Before we close, so what is the timeline that they're looking for?

The timeline?

Yeah. To finish this discussions and then the study and then coming up.

So Got it. So when it comes to resting homelessness, right, and that means extending our actual capacity for things like shelter and housing things like that. We hope to do that after after the release of the West Valley feasibility set, but also cut in conjunction with, like, kind of, like, the broader county plan to end homelessness. Right? There's a broader countywide study that's going on right now.

We recently just ended the last five year of that. That was 2020 to 2025. They're doing another one for 2025 to 2030. All these things combined together tell us the full picture of how we can affect most effectively, you know, make a difference, essentially. Right? And when it comes to spending limited, you know, local funds, you wanna be smart with your spending. And so generally speaking, that's when we would wanna back. We think that counting one will be done sometime, hopefully, in the spring. Yeah. But, naturally, right, homeless policy is a part of housing policy. And that and anytime that development will

come back and we would need

to make a legislative decision, we would be bringing it back to the south commission. Right? Mhmm. Now as for mitigating homelessness, right, if for some reason, some things were found to be legal, say, in a federal directive, and we might need to act upon it, right, When that happens, that would also be processed condition for further study. Right? It's essentially as more data comes available. Yeah. Because right now, we we just don't really have enough data available yet to make any kind of decision.

You mentioned two time points. One in fall that the study would be completed, and then we also referenced spring.

Yeah. There's a regional study for kind of the collective, what, five West Valley cities on doing extended shelter. Right? Just us. And then there's also a countywide county plan to end homelessness that's going on simultaneously as looking at broader implications around the county. That one is looking more like spring. Yeah.

Okay. Are we ready to take a a vote just to close the discussion and move on?

So we could continue in the next meeting?

I think No. The next time it comes for.

Yeah. As as data comes available.

Yeah.

Yeah. I wouldn't I wouldn't wanna schedule it and be like, nothing report yet. You know? So, yeah, as as things comes available, and then we'd be talking about, like, putting things on the agenda.

Yeah. Better if you said it. He always says it better. So do you wanna close it somehow? I'm trying to close Do

we have a motion to close the discussion?

Shall move that we close the discussion?

Can hear?

Do we have a second?

I I said both.

Alright.

Okay. And shall we take a vote?

Go ahead.

Commissioner Jinvi? Aye. Commissioner Shri Pathi?

Aye.

Commissioner Jose? Vice Chair Nerayan? Aye. Chair Cunningham? Aye. The motion carries unanimously.

And that closes this particular agenda item. And we move on to the final closing of the agenda. Which will move, I think what's the next one? Staff. Staff

information reports.

Staff information reports. So I think first, usually, Nikki, you grow because I have this I do. Presentation.

Thank you. Sure. So recently, our three returning commissioners received an email from myself. I'm also gonna be sending it to our two new commissioners. Again, congratulations on your appointments. We are taking part of a countywide Santa Clara County displacement survey study. Right? Previously, to this housing commission, we brought before a proposed policy for to protect BMR tenants within our BMR programs that were, like Mhmm. Facing displacement due to their, units being expired. We were we were able to, put together a proposed policy, bring it to city council, and actually get part of it approved.

Right? Mhmm. Now going forward, we are looking at renters in general. Right? Renters that are outside of the BMR program, but in the open market that are also facing displacement for other reasons. Right? The first step, though, is to study that. What is the primary cause? Right? What are that are leading to them being you know, leaving their homes and leaving the area? And that is the survey. Right? So we're sharing a survey right now to be sent out to all renters. We hope we can reach as many renters as we can in the city of Cupertino, but also, you know, any homeowners as well. Right? Welcome to participate, basically, any any person living in Cupertino. So I'll be forwarding that study to you guys, and if you can disperse that through your networks, be much appreciated.

Is that going to the rise and all the BMR?

Absolutely. Yes. Those those people are running to this call. Yes. Yes. And it may return, right, once we get the results of the study as an agenda item for this commission as well. So

Was that the one that's due October 31?

Yes. That's right. It it's open from now, and it'll close on October 31. So, hopefully, we can get more all the responses we can until then.

One thing I thought I would mention to you guys is that when I filled it out, one of the things I put in is to say other. We're losing students in our school district because of a housing being so expensive. So if you feel like you wanna add that when you fill yours out, then I recommend you put that in. But, okay. Thank you. Did you have any other, staff reports, Nikki?

None for myself, so we can move on to commissioners.

Okay. Commissioners, do we have, many what's things you've been to that should be known here at the Housing Commission? No? No. I

on Monday, I attended the workshop, the workshop that the raised housing conducted, and I have to say the presentation was precise, was clear, concise. I thank Janani for presenting real well. They chill out because it's so concise, chill out plenty of time for people to ask questions and address all those questions, and still they're worried about maybe over twenty something minutes left more by the seventh. I suggested that the survey link that we got from Linky from from Mickey that the Rise House also distributes to all participants in the program because they do have everybody's emails. And from what we know, there are at least 144 residents that might lose the housing, not to mention others that are part of BMR that might not face that challenge.

And she agreed. She said, yes. We'll do it. Actually, now she did send the the email relay, which was. During the presentation, I noticed there were only 17 people, and to me, it was quite disappointing.

And I have to say that maybe four or five were either staff or people that represented organizations. So I can imagine maybe 12 people, individuals simply wanted to know about what's going on and what to expect. I would say partly was because the email notification to sign up was sent on the day of giving very little time to people to look through and not miss it. Ideally, I'd say, like, we received multiple presentation, another reminder that's coming an hour from now. So I felt if there was better plans and communicated, probably would have been larger.

Enough participation and more ideas would have been bounced. Another thing I noticed was that, yes, they did include the QR code, and they recommended them time to take a screenshot. And I'm thinking, many people are not very savvy to that technology. I just can't take advantage of that feature. But, again, after that, I suggested to send the link, and they did.

So that's awesome. One more thing. Would that be insane or beneficial? I find myself can talk forever, but I'm not so glad that writing and typing up and that feature was not provided. We could not say verbally share our feedback verbally, and maybe that would have encouraged more people to speak up.

So that's my observation. That's again, that's wonderful that they took the time. The webinar is available for anybody to see. One more recommendation I would make is for the survey link to also be included visibly on their website. So when people go, they can see, take a survey. Boom. So they click there, and they take it. Because the email that comes through might get buried. Not everybody sees. They forget. They might not find the link. So that's

Thank you. That's very helpful feedback. I'll I'll pass it on to Rosenthal. Yeah. Definitely.

Okay. Thank you very much. Sure. I appreciate that. Do you have any like to report back out? No. No? Okay. Then I will go ahead and report. As chair of the commission, I attend the mayor's meeting every Wednesday every month.

And this time, what we considered was the Crest Awards. And so those very difficult decisions were made, especially when it was perfect, one that had 12 applications. But that being said, they were all made, and the ceremony is going to be on October 25, the award ceremony. There are a few extra seats available, but that's also the commission appreciation dinner. So you're all gonna be there anyway because so but, anyway, so that was always fabulous to hear all of the volunteers that do so much fine work for our city.

She did mention, and you may have received your inboxes in your homes because it's not from the mail. This is an outlook. The mayor mentioned this specifically specifically because it's a newspaper that is coming out to your homes. They'll put it in some, excuse me, like a library and stuff like that too. It's published by Successful Aging Solutions and Community Counseling, which is SASCC, in cooperation with De Anza College.

And they they will ask for you know, if you have any letters or any articles you want, but it's got a lot of very interesting information. It's Cupertino only. So just so you know, don't just toss it out in your mail. You know, you have a new newspaper format for things that are happening in the city. And that is it. So I can close that estimate and if we wanna go on to future agenda.

Great. Thank you. Just having you guys gathered here, I wanted to kinda do a poll. Would you guys be open to doing a special meeting in December? Probably early December, like, the first week. Would we generally be available then? I don't wanna put it too late because I know we got holiday stuff going on. Yeah. You're not here? Okay.

Can you join Zoom? I'm

in Thailand.

That's Sorry.

Understood. That 20 '20 twentieth, December 20. So I I can be available. The

lab Excuse. Excuse me. You can be in Thailand.

Oh, no. Almost Thailand. Oh.

Like you from Thailand. You just have to advertise your location to all the places you will tell

and visit you. Depending on the time, though. Yeah. Depending on the time of day for a wedding, so I don't know if I'm gonna be in festivities or I'll I'll

just very briefly say the reason why this year is kinda unique. We have some some items that can't wait, essentially, that we we need to basically have either announced or or brought before public hearing. Right? It's the last year of our contract with our current VMR administrators, Rise Housing. And so we actually need to announce an RFP for a new VMR administrator. And so that's what that's one of the things. It would just be an RFP announcement. The other is, of course, the anti displacement survey results of that and the study, essentially, that we will be bringing towards the housing commission. So maybe not that first week. Well, actually, how long are you

I'm back the twentieth, December twentieth. So, Nikki, I

wonder if you could do it right after Thanksgiving.

Right after Thanksgiving?

Oh, I'm waiting then. Sorry. You know what?

I'm leaving Thanksgiving and coming back on the trend. Yeah. I'm You're giving. Promise.

Try to do maybe, like we'll send out an email and see when everyone is okay. Hold on.

Yeah. A I have a question about that. I'm not saying I mean, it'll be wonderful to have you here. However, if you're gonna be in Thailand and we need to have these meetings, can we do it with four people?

Technically, we're allowed to have it as long as we have three.

Yeah. So I'm just wondering.

Three is That's all we need.

Two. Yeah.

Say what?

Three is a quorum.

Three is a quorum. Three.

I follow the planning commissioners everyone will be

involved in. Understood. Yeah.

Because, it sounds like it would have to be the twenty first

or something like that.

No. That's too close to to Christmas for me to ask, anybody, really. Yeah. Yep. So we'll try

to the date.

Well, decide on the date. Yep. If I'm able, I'll join. Yeah.

We'll we'll we'll we'll workshop it, but it'll probably be either December. Right? Any somewhere between then. Right? Yeah.

Okay. Because we're having one in November, you're saying?

No. Not that. It's just that November has things getting, and then we kinda run into the same issue. And then

First week in November.

Well well, November is right after the survey closes. Oh. So I don't think the county would have that dated to me by then just judging by how long it takes them to

And and never mind.

That was a

bad bad question. Bad question. No.

No. That that's fine. Right? We have to allow the county some time to compile the results of that

survey

to. And then get it to me. And so, yeah. Yeah. About a month. That would be good, yeah, in between.

Okay. So okay. So we're just gonna set up a meeting in first or second.

Thank you. Lindsay will send out an email.

And then at some point, we have talked about agenda setting. Change to the HC charter our charter to add one renter position, and that we could maybe handle that in March next March.

Well, you have to propose first the condition. Right? If this is something everyone wants to hear together. Right?

Okay. Yes. You had recommended that we add a renter position as a permanent one. It's like business has a position that renters would have a position. The reason being there's 40% of the city that's renters, and so to have a guaranteed position that's renter. And then that way, we can always be trying to get somebody who's a renter. I think you're a renter now, and and so that works for now. But for future, it would be good to have someone someone position also.

Just like

Oh, you also. Okay.

Just like they recommend just like you advertise a business. Business. Yeah. Business has to be a residence. So it could be a specific category. Right? Right.

Right. And that was, I think, the point that that Yi was making, certainly. So great. Wonderful. So we have two renters and three homeowners then. Okay. So that means $60.40. Anyway, so but we would so we can discuss that. That that sounds like a good thing to add to the Yes. To our our charter as such as it is.

For the agenda, I have another position for that. Oh, okay.

We're just asking if you would like to see it come up in March. That's all. You don't have Is it just

an agenda item for next year?

Yeah. Just

Not agenda item for different

Sure. I think you're trying to to to assess with the commission Yeah. Whether the next in it. The interested items. Okay. It's not just today, so you can't really discuss the details.

Right. Yeah. Because we just wanna know if you would like to have it added. So, yes, sounds good.

Okay. Okay.

And the second because another one that we had talked about was, oh, request additional funding from council to replace HUD funds if necessary. That by that time, we may not.

Mhmm. Bye. So Connie had asked me a question at a different meeting before. Right? And it was basically about, like, going forward, if funding is to become less stable or less consistent, right, because Mhmm. Of the push to try to move cities into more formula sources. What what would we need to do as a city to respond to ensure that we are still providing adequate funding to our nonprofit service providers? Right?

Mhmm.

And if there is interest in that discussion, right, that would be something that is within the purview of the housing commission and something that could be added potentially bringing forth a request to council for an increased contribution, say, right, through the the human human services fund. Right? Though that's that's, like, the general fund contribution to our own products.

It's like you said.

Mhmm. So

if you think that's interesting, we can add it to a future agenda. Okay. And I'm not sure we discussed this, but Project Sentinel should be funded more. That's something that we have. We put in 50,000, but we discovered during the time when Yu Yu had to leave that it also handles market rate as well as BMR. We did not know that. Or and so she didn't think to call them, any of that stuff. But then now she's moved. She knows Sunnyvale and put a whole lot more money into it. And because of that, they get a whole lot more services, outreach to renters.

So that's something that I would like to talk about, and that also comes up with funding. So I was thinking about doing that sometimes. So if you think it's interesting, we can add it, and then we can just you can determine when it might work.

Oh, most likely. Right? Whenever you you wanna do an increase as a funding Mhmm. You wanna demonstrate a proportionate need. Right? So those those kinds of conversations go hand in hand. Right? You technically say there's a need that's being unmet. X y z organization could fill that for us. Here's how much money we need to do that. Let's ask for that money. So those kinds of those two things are real they're really one thing. Right? We ask together. So that that kind of request would go together. I will specify as staff, I don't advocate for any one particular organization getting more money. Right? I was just clarifying how such a thing would go go forth. Right? Unmutual. I

Well, I do absolutely understand. It was it was me that brought that up, and so I appreciate you fleshing it out Yeah. So that we understood it better.

Yeah.

But that definitely was my thought. So other than that, I didn't have any more thoughts for agenda setting for the future. And I don't if anybody else wanted to

Just wonder. You you included on your report about the success what we've done about to address the anti displacement. And like we all know, the council agreed or approved only one of the two strategies that we proposed and the one that the council and the media policies giving priority points to people who may lose their homes within twelve months. I wonder if there is any follow-up or any update as what we're doing, what we're working to to fully kind of address this issue that is going to touch many residents in our community. So I wonder if you can

That is a great question.

Put in doubt that we have a future agenda.

That will be a part of the the future anti displacement topic.

Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. So do do have some follow-up on that. Yes.

Another thing I wanted to add, and that kind of prompted from attending the BMR workshop, As they mentioned, that is going to be a long trip coming up. It's going to be open with the wait list from October 1 to October 31 for either people that want buy for a rental or purchase. I've identified numerous times for purchasing here. The feedback I got from other people, it seems like that somehow the lottery drawing is done kind of secretly. So I'd like for us to bring more transparency and just build the public trust by offering that they either rely all the applicants to attend in person

Mhmm.

Or maybe attend in via Zoom. So this way, there's no questioning that somebody was favored over somebody else. Because I felt other rumors that somehow could support this kind of rumor that, yes, maybe some part of our our community is favored more than the rest of community or increased. Somebody lost the connection in our research. So can we include this also in the future agenda?

So so I've attended the the lottery creation and waitlist placements. Rise Housing does that and by kind of their their contract. Right? As the amount of ministers, one city staff member is required to attend to ensure neutrality in the process. Mhmm.

And I will say that they assign every applicant a random number, so no names or personal details are shown during the lottery. And then for their actual placement, they're sorted only by the priority points that they can win on their application. So that's if you're a Cupertino resident, Cupertino worker, public complaint Cupertino, and now you have your special BMR displace group. That's the only thing that that separates you out. After that, you're you're assigned essentially a random number through the Excel number number generator, and it is and by then, it's it's it's completely, like, anonymous.

So so I'm I'm I'm physically present when they do it to make sure that there's no shenanigans happening. I don't know what are the rules about broadcasting it, but it is recorded. I I can check with, say, like, I don't know, say, attorney's team to see what we can do about maybe sharing that to, you know, massage any kind of concerns about favorability. I'll check I'll check to see. Yeah.

Yeah. Know that Yeah. Programs and Yeah. Especially not in our county and not in our state. In Boston, actually, that's how they do it.

Yeah.

They announce it. One of drawings is gonna be made. Public shows up. Everybody knows has a name, and they have their name on the ticket. So no names is displayed. The job is done, like you said, such and such number, and set number one, and such and such number, and set number two. So I I think we do have the technology to make that happen and bring that transparency to

We have a recording. So I'll I'll check with city attorney's office to see if what we can do about maybe maybe, like, putting that somewhere. Right? For Yeah.

Making it more transparent.

I think.

Good idea. And on that very good basis, I'm going to say that we will gavel the meeting closed and thank everyone for coming. Thank the staff very much for your time. And

Thank you, everybody.

Thank you. And I'm gonna give you this. This is my card.

You can

see that it's not real hard because they didn't give us this chunk. But I changed my thing on here. And on the back on the back, it has

my