Board of Zoning Appeals - Regular Meeting

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Okay, if I can have your attention, we'll uh call the meeting to order and have roll call. Chip Hill, John Kissinger here, Brooks Lango here, Leslie Robinson here, Nikki Venal here, Dennis Hornet here, Dan Bele here, Larry We here, Patrick Sigraph here. Uh Nathan, [clears throat] we have an introduction of a new member.

Yep. Um Tyler Brooks who fills his dad's seat. Uh John had to step down. last year due to health reasons. So Bruce was available uh and then step in. There's still one year left on the term. So be here for a year, give or take. So welcome. Maybe we'll see how tonight goes. [laughter] True.

Okay. Next item on the agenda is election of 2026 officers and appointments. This time we'll open up the nominations for president. Make a motion to reelect or to keep Patrick Zig as president. I'll second. Yes. Any any other nominations? I move the nominations be closed. Thank you.

Those in favor of reappointing me as president, raise your right hand. Those opposed, same sign. Carried. Vice president currently Nikki Venal. I'll make a motion that we keep Victor Keeper as vice president. Second job. She accept. I do. Okay. Any other nominations? I move the nominations be closed.

Okay. Those in favor of Nikki continuing as vice president, raise your right hand. Those opposed. Same sign. Motion carried. BCA representative currently is John Kissinger. And remember that the this member needs to be one of the two members from the ETJ. So your options are gone or I recommend that it remain John. A second. I'll accept. You have a choice. [laughter]

Those in favor of John continuing Raise your right hand. Those post same sign. Uh joint advisory board member was uh Don was our representative. Uh obviously that's open now. I nominate Larry Leuis. Second. Accept.

Any other nominations? Thank you, Larry. I'm sorry. Raise your right hand. Uh in favor those opposed, same sign. Motion carried. Technical review committee member uh Don, Dennis, and Larry that those meet in usually during the daytime, right?

Right. Uh typically uh 10 o'clock 11 o'clock on Tuesdays as needed. I think last year we met once probably for timber's edge section two. Um your presence is not absolutely critical for it. So we don't it's not that we need a quorum or anything. It's just we do need to have members who are on the committee um who are invited to come. I nominate Brooks Langlo to fill the vacant position and also Dennis Warick and myself. Second. Any other nominations?

I move the nominations be closed. Is there a second? Second. All right. Those in favor of Brooks, Dennis, and Larry continuing to serve on the technical review committee, signify by raising your right hand. Those opposed, same sign. Motion carried. Okay. Uh, previous meeting minutes. There's just What's that? October.

Make a motion to approve the minutes as written. Second. Motion second to approve October 6 meeting minutes. All those in favor signify by raising your right hand. Abstain. One extension. Two. Two abstensions.

So did any opposition? Okay. Next. Okay. Both the witnesses. First of all, thank you all for coming. Uh it's been a very very long time since we had uh this many people interested in in something that was going on. So uh if you want to make uh any kind of comments tonight, ask a question, voice your opinion, uh you'll need to stand, raise your right hand, and our attorney will swear you in. Okay. Remember,

is that it? No one else plans to make a comment. If you plan to make a comment, please stand, raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm under the penalties of perjury the testimony you are about to offer will be the truth? If so, say, "I do." Thank you. You may be seated. [clears throat] Oh, we will when it

uh new business 26- C-REZ-1 Thor Hodgeges and Landon Hodes R1 toGB properties located at 875 North State Road 109. Nathan.

Uh thank you, Mr. President. So going to the slides. Uh 26 CZ1 is located at 875 North Stay 109. Uh currently zoned R1 single family and GD general business. Uh the one parcel is split zoned. The other parcel is completely zoned R1 currently. Uh for reference, someone asked when it was originally zoned commercial uh was reszoned back in 1994 uh to B2. Uh this and the adjacent properties to the south were 1994. Uh total acreage being uh in the parcel uh is 11.34 acres. Again, portion of that is already zoned. Uh it's comprised of lot two wildflower ridge amended addition amended which was amended in 2017 to add on acreage uh to what was just the commercial area. had also shifted how the lots were split. Uh some of you may remember that uh the split zoning was a discussion point at the time and it was determined that for the purposes that uh the plat was being done and for the situation in 2017 zoning was not going to be an issue. We would deal with it later. So later has come. uh primarily triggered though by the additional unplatted acreage which dishers acquired uh last year uh which wraps around I'll show you here in a second. Uh the request then is to reszone the entire property to GB uh allows for the expansion of the existing business onto that additional acreage. uh petitioner can give you more details

as exactly what that may entail and if they have any other future uh plans beyond just the existing business. Um uh oh you can see on the table the surrounding zoning and land uses uh primarily residential to the north and to the east other than the adjacent zone property. To the south is R1. Uh basically have a 50 foot strip. Uh that's R1. Uh and then you go into a large area GB and to the west is R1 as well. [snorts] So subject property is highlighted in blue. 109 is here. Uh Plaza Drive, Walmart and so on is just off the uh view. Here you have Cambridge Crossing and Chesty Landing. uh and additional uh I apologize I don't remember the name of that subdivision uh but a older subdivision here as well.

A closer view of the subject property. So this is the additional acreage that we bought in 2025. Uh this is the one that was platted as lot two of Wildflower Ridge in 2017. This portion was added to that which was already in existence. So that was the amendment in 2017 to the flat oblique view which honestly is not much different than the previous view. Uh wide zoning map for reference. You can see again the existing GB that was done in 1994 GB to the south uh and then R1 and R3 um are the primary zonings surrounding us. Closer view again a future land use map. Uh show always show the overall view circled there in blue is the site. Uh a little closer view uh because someone uh had mentioned um exactly wanted to know exactly how the comp plan map lined up with the parcel map. I don't typically do that because the the comp plan is open for some interpretation. You still need to uh pay reasonable regard to it. But in this particular case, because you do have this uh little notch here, it it's a little intriguing what the thought was. So I did did do the overlay just again for everyone's reference and this is what it would come out to be. So roughly the comp plan is calling out a swath um along here north of where the existing GD zoning is. Uh this portion and red is for commercial purposes. This portion lines up with the existing uh commercial. Uh so about little over half

of the subject property maybe right about half uh is listed is designated for [snorts] commercial on the comprehensive plan map. Again open for interpretation on that uh but it I did this again just to try and show uh why that notch may have been there. Uh so going to the zone map amendment criteria, I just discussed the comprehensive plan. Um you guys can chew on uh how well this proposal fits into the comprehensive plan. Keep in mind that the text does generally support uh both residential activity and commercial activity. Uh so um reszoning it to commercial uh would be supportable by text, but leaving it residential as well.

[clears throat]

current conditions and character. Uh generally you have residential around you uh to the north and east. You do have the state road there uh buffering to the east. Uh to the south you have areas that are GB already and are designated and and likely to become uh developed for commercial uh or at least more intense uses uh in the near future. Um most desirable use for the land uh don't really have a lot to say here. It is located on State Road 109. So whenever you have property on a state road, there's usually some favorability, more desiraability for a more intense use like commercial. Uh but again, this is kind of tucked in around a couple other houses. So uh there may be um maybe some flexibility there. Petitioner is operating the landscape business, which is one of the more a lower end, lower intensity commercial uses as opposed to say a grocery store which has a lot more traffic for example. Uh so that may come into play in in your discussion as well. Uh conservation property values throughout the jurisdiction and that's important to focus that this isn't just on the immediate area. Uh property values when you have changes always fluctuate in the immediate area but throughout the jurisdiction it seems that uh this likely would not have a direct effect on the overall area. Generally development is a positive thing for uh for the overall jurisdiction there. Uh and then finally responsible growth and development. This is where we usually talk about uh infrastructure and other aspects uh that don't put into the other criteria. Uh utilities are nearby. I

don't believe that this property is currently served. Uh however uh as you look at as petitioner may be looking at development farther south over time. I know that's not his immediate proposal. Uh bringing utilities northward may be uh part of the overall picture and as development comes up from the south uh utilities may get there. Uh there is some um flood plane on the property but that is already on the far north end. doesn't really affect the overall developability uh of of the bulk of the property being requested to be reson [clears throat] whoever's present for you. State your name and your addresses, please.

My name is Thor Hodgees, 875 North, State Road 109, Columbia City, Indiana. This is my business partner, Landon Hodes. Um we're um again, tremendous job with the report as you always do, Nathan. Staff report is spot on. We bought this property in 2019 um with the um knowledge that it was zoned the way it was so we could uh operate our business off of it. Um when we had a chance to buy additional property and our needs have grown for our business, we decided that um you don't get too many chances to buy property next to you. So we took advantage of that. I think uh the zoning part of it, we're basically just connecting to areas that are already zoned GB. Um it certainly wouldn't um in my opinion be considered spot zoning whatsoever if it's comprehensive plan. Uh what we're doing is very I think in my opinion low impact on the community itself as far as uh being a disruption. We've got a lot of neighbors that appreciate, you know, how we have shaped the property, how we have improved the property, what we have done with it. Our uh imprint in the neighborhood is very minimal as far as noise or um any complaints that we've ever received from any of our neighbors. Our goal is to increase our business. Um we uh with Spring Creek going out of business and that service not being available to the community anymore. We were able to purchase the green houses from them and we want to set those green houses up. We've already started to set one up which would um still even if it's

not reszoned fit into the zoning on how it is now, but we also want to build a new operations barn uh basically someplace to store our equipment. So to do that in the area that we're looking at um we would want it reszone to GB to um let us do the business part of the operation although it wouldn't be much different than um what we currently do now. We're not we're not looking at developing the property into a housing addition. We're not looking at adding any more than just a new operations barn to it. [clears throat] We bought the PE land from the people behind us. the levels. Um had long conversations with them before they would even sell us the property on what they would like to see us not do. Um and we made, you know, agreements with them in the purchase of the land that we're not going to build anything near them. We've agreed to build a uh dirt mound and plant our varieties or green giants or something on to help insulate them from anything that we would be doing. And they were comfortable obviously with that. and and sold the land to us. Another big issue that we have and we don't really see much of a way around it is just our entrance. We've had numerous numerous times where we've had accidents uh turning into our shop, our neighbors on both sides of the road. um it affects seven or eight properties through there because you you'll stop school bus stops. You'll stop people come over that hill and they're already doing the 55 miles an hour and there's been a lot of accident not a lot. There's been a half dozen accidents in the time that we've been there and there's been a lot of close calls. Um, by being able to purchase this land and get it reszoned, we're going to add a whole additional entrance on the south part of it that where we have land that

comes back out to 109 where it is on top of that hill and you can stop to turn in or you can see to turn out both directions far enough that it's going to take a lot of the hazard away from just coming in and off of our property. Uh, so we're excited about that. We're excited about it being safer. We're definitely excited about being able to develop our property, continue our storefront, uh, sell landscape materials to the public and be able to have that safety of that, uh, additional entrance added on to what we want to do. And of course, we'd have a driveway that would circle all the way around to uh, where the greenhouse would be. And the operations barn we're going to build wouldn't be open to the public. It would just be for our equipment, our mechanic, our storage. Um probably a wash bay and some different things like that. It's the only plans we have with the property. There's quite a bit there left. We talk about putting in a pumpkin patch. We're talking about maybe um in the northern part of it. Um there might end up being a pond because of harvesting enough clay and dirt to build the mound that we had promised the neighbors that we would build, which we've already started on too, getting that part done for them. Um, but that's that's what we're here to ask for. I think it fits into the comprehensive plan. I think it it makes sense as far as growth for this type of business in the area that it's in. It's low impact, low noise. Um, we enjoy where we're at. We love what we're doing and we just want to we want to continue to grow and offer some more services.

Will that South Drive line up with the drive across the street? Um, not exactly. Not exactly. It's going to be kind of caddyy corner, but the curb cut, um, so to speak, is already there. The culvert is already there. So, we're not inventing anything there. We're not even having to go to the state highway to get a in and out. It's already it's already there. And then Bel was designated some years ago. Well, and this being a Pastate Highway employee, they're looking for places to put a roundabout and that might be an ideal place for could be.

Thor, you had said that right now you would be able to put the green houses in that space without it even being reszoned. So, what would the need truly be to be so that it already meets the need of what you are looking to put on there. In order to we could use the green houses that we're currently putting up for personal use, but we couldn't have customers come up to that area. Um, which, you know, we could make it work, but it's not really ideal. Can you mention a storage barn, too?

It would be more of an operations bar. Yeah. Does that fit into R1? Fits into R1. Uh, the ops bar would not because that would definitely include employees and potentially customers depending on what exactly Any other questions for can you kind of show us kind of where your placement of that stuff is just for

so there's utility source right here which we've already with RMC they've already tunnled electricity to us from here to right here greenhouse we're setting up right now it's going to be right here is where that would be all this slopes down this area here is where it could possibly be a pond we're going to take the dirt from there all along here when we build our new uh barn it's probably right in this somewhere where that drive would wrap around and then the drive will come in

come in and wrap around would you use the would you use the drive still be using the drive that you have now then I wouldn't eliminate it but I would I would encourage it to be second drive only it's a lot safer it's going to be a lot is important too. So we can have people utilize this where it's going to be so much safer to come in and come and do their business. Thank you.

Anything else for Thor? Uh Thor, do you have you know we have Swayard Properties that's developed uh in development south of you there. If in the event at a future time, let's say another street comes in along that north edge and comes into their [clears throat] uh proposed project, you foresee that you possibly eliminate your access there beside the street and just come in off of that because I think like what Mr. War was talking about if that street would ever come into existence then I think at that point I could see the state considering that roundabout situation.

Yeah. And um L and I have talked a little bit. We wouldn't be opposed to that, but we're not the key holder for that decision because if you notice there's a 50-ft strip that the people the levels that we bought the property off of, they are required to maintain that 50 foot strip. So they're not technically landlocked. Even though they have deeded easement to the driveway to the north that they currently share with several people, they were still required to keep that 50 foot strip that you see right there. So that's right.

Yep. That would that would that would be a them question. Um but we certainly wouldn't stand them in the way if they were if they had interest in doing that. It's just it would have to be um obviously deed over to deed it over to the county or the city, whatever would be encapsulated as their property because they would have to be able to maintain their their frontage. So, however far back that road would go, they would have to have that frontage to it. Okay. But that's beyond beyond any decision making we would be able to make on our own.

Thank you. Anything else? Nathan, I have two questions for you. Uh, when was comprehensive plan written? What was that? What when was the comprehensive plan written? Uh, the current one was adopted in 2015. Uh, as you know, we have a pending comprehensive plan update. It's still the base 2015 plan with updates based upon what's changed. So, we have one pending as well. and Sweart Properties. Is that the red at the bottom? Uh let me

Yes, primarily it's all of this and then uh this area right here is Walmart's property. So Walmart itself is right there.

Can we just resone that to general business and and residential? Um general business the No, we haven't done anything with zoning on either property. It's been plat. Yeah, it's been a subdivision in anything else or Thor. Thank you. Thank you.

Anyone else wish to speak in favor of this project? And Nathan, would you explain the time limitations for and against? Um well I will uh once Amanda actually you've got the rules procedure at your fingertips sort of

um it we do have time limitations in the rules of procedure as you know I believe we have and this is the president's to modify if you fish. But per the rules, let's see here. Um, represent the representatives of groups uh receive a maximum of five minutes and then individuals would be two minutes. If you want to modify that prior to opening the hearing, you can. Um, but that's what's in the rules as is. Okay. So, we'll keep it at the two minutes from there.

Okay. Sir, if you state your name and address.

Uh, my name is Craig Roshan. I live at 1085 North Center Court in the development just north of the project. And, uh, I've talked with Thor a lot and they're adamant about doing this the right way. They don't want to harm the environment. They don't want to, you know, ruffle the feathers of too many people. And they're committed to doing this the right way. And uh I can't stress enough about what they said about the um the new entrance being safe. I come out of my development every day. And I can't tell you how many times I see people coming from the north south looking at their phone while they're doing 5560 right down that dip. And I see people get on the brakes hard all the time. somebody's trying to pull out slow and uh just the safety alone on this project is I think it it's worth it. I mean, we just had a big accident here today in town. People aren't paying attention like they used to. Um and and as far as what they're developing on the property, green houses and a barn, vehicles go in the barn, it cleans up, it looks nice here. It's going to be a very well-developed project. Um so I support Thor Lane.

Thank you. Thank you. Come on now.

How you doing? Good. My name is Tim Price. I live on West Center Drive just down the street from Craig. And I've been knowing the Hajes business family for I I guess six to eight years. They've always been respectable, uh, considerate, um, on time. So, they say they're going to do something, I believe. Um, I remember that property that they have right now, um, eight years ago, I looked and the considerable changes they made to make it look good now.

So, I'm for all I have to say. Thank you.

Thank you. I'm Maryanne Lowour from 1092 West Lawn Court in Deer Chase and I've known Thor and Landon. I've done business with them and I guess I don't have a whole lot to say except they're good people and I know they've wanted that land behind it for a long time. And Columbia City needs business. They need landscaping. You know, why let the people go to Fort Wayne when they don't have to? And they do good business. They do several different things. and I really support them getting the property and keeping it close.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Hi,

I'm Candy Baman and I live straight across the street at Oh, I can't even think of my address now. I'm so nervous. [laughter] I live straight across the street in the big yellow house on the hill. And um they have been wonderful neighbors. They are very kind and they follow through with what they're going to do. Um the man or the business that was there before it was nice. It looked nice, but when they came in, it took a whole new great looking place. And um I just really think that this would be a good thing for all of us in Columbia City. Thank you. Thank you.

Anyone else to speak in favor of the project? [snorts] I'm Matthew Kellogg. I live at 256 North Road. Uh, I pass this business just about every day on my way home and I can attest to the fact that moving the drive would absolutely help. I also drive bus for WCCS and I can also attest to the fact that not only do we have issues with bus routes and that drive and people slamming on brakes, we've also had several that have blown the stop signs on the sides of buses. Um, simply because they've not been paying attention in that area. So I do believe moving the drive, giving them this opportunity to expand their business would be absolutely brilliant and I think we should go for it.

Thank you. Thank you.

Anyone else speak in favor of the project? Okay. Anyone wishing to speak that is opposed to the project? Hi, my name is Isaac Renegger and I live at 10001 North State Road 109. I'm here to respectfully object to this resoning. My objection is not to business or to commercial expansion in general. The city's comprehensive plan anticipates limited northward commercial expansion in this area while intentionally designating surrounding residential land to function as a transition and buffer. The issue with this petition is that it goes beyond what the comprehensive plan envisions. One parcel included in this request is not shown at all within the commercial expansion area and the other is only partially included. Reszoning this entire acreage would extend commercial zoning into residential land the plan identifies as a transition. This transition is important because it protects low inensity residential character, provides a buffer between commercial areas and homes. Approving this resoning would remove that buffer, undermining the intent of the residential zoning designation and turning a policybased land use boundary into a sightspecific exemption which sets a president precedent for incremental encroachment of business uses into residential areas. The comprehensive plan and zoning ordinance together are meant to provide predictability for residents and businesses alike. As stated on the city's planning and building website, both public and private sector decisions affecting the location, design, quality of development are guided by this plan. These policies are relied upon throughout the city for long-term investment decisions. My family purchased our property in 2017 and made

subsequent investments in reliance on the existing residential zoning in the city's adopted plan. This request did not need to conflict with the future land use map. The applicants already own and operate on land zone general business. If the resoning request had been limited to the area envisioned for commercial expansion, it could have proceeded without encroaching into the residential transition area. Reszoning beyond the planned commercial expansion would permanently alter the character and intensity of use adjacent to residential homes, including my own. Commercial zoning allows structures, storage, and activity fundamentally different in scale and character from residential use, and once permitted, those impacts cannot be undone. The commercial expansion boundary was drawn intentionally and should be treated as a limit, not extended beyond what the plan anticipates. Approving this request despite its inconsistency with the future land use map would weaken public reliance on the comprehensive plan and as a meaningful planning tool

for these reasons. Interrupt sir. Okay.

My name is David Han. I [clears throat] live at 999 North State Road 109. uh just north of this parcel. Um I agreed what was the comprehensive plan. You know, I I've lived here for 22 years now and I had no intentions having a commercial property anywhere any closer than what it was and the plan had never shown that until you know now this has come up. Um, I would say that as far as moving the drive, my drive is on top of that hill and I'm almost murdered weekly by people coming down 109. I don't know that the moving that drive is going to be that big of a benefit. People on 109 just like to drive like maniacs for the most part. Um, but you know, as far as I'm concerned, I have nothing against Hodes having their business there, but I don't want a bunch of buildings building being built up behind me. It takes away from our residential properties. It could possibly, you know, ruin the value of my home to a degree. I I just can't get behind that. So, and it's also going to bring the chance for possibility of, you know, city wanting to absorb more than they possibly this in utilities and I just put a well in that that many years ago and stuff. I'm really not interested in hooking up to the city. So, I guess that's what I have to say. Thank you. Anyone else?

You want to respond to any of that? Any comments? I would just again reiterate it's it's our business model to service the community to have good relationships to be good neighbors. Uh our dream is just to expand and be able to have more space with land use and the services that we want to provide kind of a easier place to do. So, I understand the concerns. I appreciate the support and we just leave it up to you as the commission. Thanks,

Nathan. Can you do me a favor? Can you put the map that you had, the comprehensive plan, the overlay? The overlay. Can you put that picture back up? And then Can you if I if I recall how you were placing things? So the the part that's in the comprehensive plan is where you would have your green houses in your building. Anything north of that is potential pond.

Well, right. So right now this is all this is this parking lot. This is all yard and this will always be yard because barn would be in the red area here. greenhouse pretty much right that right in the red area right here. It might be just a little bit over. It might be split in that line. I'm not real sure how that lies, but yeah. I mean, everything that we're planning on doing, everything we're talking about is going to be in this area. Thank you.

Anyone else? Nathan, I have a question in regards at this time, if I understand that map correctly, the parcel that exists as uh Haj's landscaping that is not part of the city within the city limits. Is that correct? Uh that's my understanding that correct neither of the two subject parcels are annex. Okay,

Mr. Chairman, if you're ready, I would recommend a favorable recommendation to the city council. I second.

Okay. Have a motion and a second for favorable recommendation to city council on 26- C-REZ-1. Uh Thor and Landon Hodgeges. Any further discussion? Those in favor of the motion raise your right hand. Real quick, you had said that you were willing to provide buffering and some sort of buffering of that property for north and the west or just to the west.

As of right now, we have of us of trees that's kind of in that basement they have 75 leaving that alone that faces a north and we wouldn't do a privacy and we're more than willing to work with other I I do have a question Nathan will this come as a site plan at a future time or since the buildings are considered temporary such as the green houses and that would be exempt.

Uh we will sort that out. The threshold for development plan is construction of additional primary structures. So the green houses function as accessory structures. The ops building I think probably would be considered a primary structure and trigger the need for development plan, but we'll sort that out as things come up. All right. Thank you. I have a legal question. Do we need to do anything since we started with a motion and then had questions? You had a motion, you had a second. You had actually started to take a vote. So, I think you just The question's already been called. I think you just need to call for the vote.

All right. Thank you. Those in favor of the motion, raise your right hand. Those opposed, same sign. Motion carried. Next order of business. 26- C-RE Z-2 Tony Johnson R1 to R3 1120 West Business 30.

Thank you, Mr. President. these slides. Uh, as you said, 26 CZ2 is uh at 1120 West Business 30. Uh, this property recently, until recently had a residence on it that was demolished in 2022. Uh, overall acreage is just over 10 acres. Currently zoned R1's as a family. Uh, also notably, uh, you may know this property as the one with the, uh, cemetery that's out front. I'm not sure exactly the history of it. I believe it's a family cemetery, petition room knows it's there and has said that they would, uh, either work with it or relocate it either, uh, in the course of development. Uh, could be. Um, so the request is to reszone to R3 multif family residential. Uh as you know R3 allows for single two and multif family uses so any type of residential development. Uh but as proposed the petitioner has stated that they desire to do multif family development uh in the form of apartments uh multi-story apartments and one-story apartments. Uh however subsequent uh discussions with petitioners and they've indicated that they're willing to um people out and make changes based upon what's discussed tonight. So, while that was the initial submitted proposal, uh be aware and be prepared for uh discussion about what may be appropriate uh um on this site with the commissioner. Uh the adjacent zoning and uses you can see there pretty much everything is our one surrounding to the northeast and

west. To the south you have R3. Uh we had a case two months ago uh that we similar to this just down the road. Uh R3 is on the south side of uh business 30 uh but R1 is primarily on the north side of business 30. Aerial view of the overall area. Uh business 30 here. Westgate, Gear Chase, um, Godwood Lane. Uh, the case that we had two months ago was located right here. That one, of course, as you recall, was just one lot, uh, as opposed to 10 acres. Um, you do have a steel tank fabrication down here as an industrial use kind of as an outlier. Closer view. Uh, Stickler Road for references right here as well. Oblique view. Overall zoning map, as I mentioned, R1 is the majority of the surrounding uses except for to the south three of R3. You do have some commercial farther east, the industrial and then add as you get farther into the um extr territorial jurisdictionary closer view. I did include the legal tile. There is a legal drain that runs through here uh that would potentially uh help to drain the site. I know drainage is a concern that has been mentioned in a few comment letters. Uh primarily the site drains basically from this point outward largely that the south petitioner during

development would need to take care of drainage. Uh whether it be multif family or a single family subdivision doesn't matter. We require uh drainage to be taken care of as part of the development process. Um, if there's existing off-site drainage issues, that's a different matter. But anything that would be uh any additional water flow that would be due to development is obligated to be taken care of. Comprehensive plans, future land use map. Again, uh this is from the 2015 comprehensive plan. We do have an update pending uh with some changes. Uh however, I don't believe that this is one that's pending. Um at least not right now. Uh so highlighted there in blue is the site. A little closer view. And as I said, the the comp plan in this case is fairly clear. You have uh medium density is the orange residential. Uh to the south, yellow is what it calls out as low density. uh to the north um comprehensive plan where it wasn't clear what the uh expectation and desire would be. Uh the comprehensive plan did rely heavily on what the existing zoning was uh to say, okay, if it's zoned R3, we're generally going to call it uh medium density residential. Uh it's not completely uh true uh throughout the city. For example, uh as you look up at um Cambridge Crossing and Chesapeake Landing, those are zoned R3. However, the comprehensive plan calls those out as low density residential. Uh and as you may recall, uh with Timber's Edge on the far east side of town here, uh that

too was called out as low density, but it was reszoned R3 uh with a zoning commitment not to include multif family. Uh so in interpreting the comprehensive plan map here and the comprehensive plan generally it's not so much location uh because I think that's fairly the intent there is pretty pretty straightforward. It's more of the interpretation of what is low density residential versus medium density residential. And I just gave you a couple examples and uh which are outlined there in the screen. Um, and then for reference, because I knew this would be a kind of a point uh to discuss uh or the point to discuss with comp plan, uh, if this was R3, if it was single family, uh, minimum lot area under R3 is 7,000 square ft. Minimum lot width is 50 feet. For a single family lot, that yields with a street ride ofway that yields about 8,500 square ft per unit if this was single family, which comes out to be a gross density of just over five units per acre. Net density is around four. uh when you figure in things like drainage and common areas, other things inefficiencies. If this was completely two family, which we don't have very many subdivisions that are completely two family, but if it were lot area again is 7,000 square ft minimum 50 foot lot width. uh then that uh becomes 8,500 but split between two units 4250 square ft per unit yielding a gross density maximum gross density of just over 10 units per acre and then multif family uh

maxing out the multif family under the code uh the code does require a minimum area of 3500 square ft of the overall development per unit. Uh, and doing that math gives you just under 12 and a half units per acre. All of which is gross. We don't have any developments that max out uh, for various reasons, but that does give you a sense as to um the gradation of the uses allowable in R3. And then if you apply those to what might be considered low density in the comprehensive plan definitely R1 probably R2 where's R3 fit into this and then how does the the uses fall into it if you start mixing uses of course the densities shift as well. Uh all that's for your information. Again, I knew comprehensive plan would be a question and particularly what is low density versus medium density was something that a couple people have asked. Um ultimately I don't know it's for your interition. Going back to what was submitted, this is the conceptual site plan that the petitioner had submitted. Uh north is to the up uh business 30 down here. Stickler road is over here. Uh but tenatively the sketch plan would be to have one-story uh multif family units along the west edge uh as well as the amenities uh the clubhouse pool um various active uh amenities here as well as buffering there and then four three-story buildings uh located more centrally on the site. Again, petitioners indicated this is subject to change and subject to discussion, but this was what was

submitted. Uh, and then conceptual building plans uh based upon what they had submitted. So, they can they can get into more of that discussion with that. I am recommending a couple different zoning commitments um if this is zoned R3 just to address uh some of the issues that I identify if this was multif family if or pretty much any use but definitely if the use is multif family uh we do need to have some sort of buffering along the west and north sides of the property uh specific to be refined um and you can maybe defer that to development plan if you wish to do so but having some sort of specifics or at least intention of what that looks like should be discussed. Uh do want to based upon what the petitioner had originally submitted number two would be that any buildings with 120 ft of west property line would be limited to one story in height. basically reduces the visual impact for those on the west that don't have as much of a screen existing screen uh tree screen buffer as those to the north. Those to the north have a pretty substantial uh tree screen that is on their property. It's not on this property as I understand where the property line lies. And then finally uh related to that also placing no parking areas within that western 120 feet as well for um again visual impact. You have the buildings themselves and parking are typically the largest two impact visually uh visual impacts uh when you have multif family development. All of that subject to further

discussion um as we go through this going to zone map criteria. I talked I've already talked extensive extensively [clears throat] about conference plan. Your interpretation of what is low versus medium density is going to be very critical here. Um, if you want to discuss whether it's appropriate to potentially have a comprehensive plan amendment, we've never really done that uh for a particular petitioner before, but we do have pending amendment. So maybe that might be part of that discussion. But uh essentially the density is going to be the largest piece of comp plan discussion there. uh conditions and character of the current structures and uses of the surrounding area. You do have single family to the northeast and west. Uh so going to something that would allow for a multif family use uh could have impacts on that. Uh but R3 also allows for single family. Uh, as mentioned, Timber's Edge had a zoning commitment not to uh allow multif family there and that was deemed acceptable. So I if that discussion goes that way are free as a district may be appropriate but with use restrictions. Uh most desirable use for the land just generally speaking uh residential definitely uh is desirable um for this. I don't think there's any real call for uh business in this area. However, in the staff report, I do state that we do have a lack of business development on the west side, which is somewhat problematic. Um it's not really subject

of tonight's proposal, but just putting it out there that uh as we look at the west side in future development uh having a m mixeduse development or even commercial by itself uh just so that we can have some place to be walked to or at least cut driving distances down would be awfully nice. um as a matter of planning conservation of property values. Uh again this is throughout the jurisdiction. Typically uh residential development and development generally does conserve uh property values over time throughout the jurisdiction. Impacts on the immediate area of course will vary uh and that could be and should be part of your discussion. Finally, responsible development and growth. I've already mentioned some of the development aspects. Uh this is served or could be served by water and sewer. Uh Chip before he went on vacation did give confirmation that there is capacity uh to serve any number of units that is that are proposed. Um, business 30 is a minor arterial, so traffic generation onto business 30 should not be an issue because the road uh is planned to be able to uh have capacity for that. Um, and then finally, keep in mind, as I mentioned, I provided three suggested or recommended uh zoning commitments. Uh, you can add to that list, subtract from what I uh suggested, and so on. So zoning commitments can be utilized to smooth over uh what you may feel are rough edges in a proposal if you feel that this is appropriate at all. So any questions for me?

What do we do with the graves? What can we do with the graves? What are we allowed to do?

Uh so the easiest thing is to work around them. Uh, I've personally worked with subdivisions that have had family graves that they wind up in the middle of a subdivision. Uh, this potentially being a apartment complex that would be a little bit unusual, but it could be part of an overall uh common area, for example. Uh, or there are processes to move cemeteries and You're going to ask what those processes are. I'm not that familiar, but petitioner if they want to go that route would become so

you had mentioned on the the [clears throat] drain. Do we know what condition that drain is in? Because I think that runs through Tanglewood too. Also,

it runs uh not sure if it's through Tanglewood specifically, but it runs that way. Correct. um that would need to be something that would be sorted out as part of development. Uh either they would need to knock down flows to accommodate whatever that uh drain tile can accommodate or they would need to go in and make sure that they repair it or whatever else needs to be done. They ultimately winds up being it is a legal pile. So they'd have to work with drainage board to make sure functions as they plan to design it.

I guess my I'm just going to wait to hear who the petitioner say. I got some questions. Anything else for Nathan? Not the petitioner or his representative. Please come to the podium and How are we doing today?

Well, my name is Tony Johnson and um I'm the one who's proposing this uh um future development and um it seems to me that there's a lot of misconceptions about what we're doing here and about what's going to happen. And also, I've had a lot of concerns from either emails that went through the homeowners association in the subdivision I live in, which is Dear Chase. So, I do live in the subdivision directly north of the property. And um also, I've built about six homes in this property. Not only my house, but the houses on both sides of myself, plus my son-in-law's house. So, to say that I have no concern about what happens in this subdivision would probably be an understatement. But first of all, I want to introduce people to who I am. And then after I introduce you to who I am, I want to introduce you to what my proposal is, if that's okay. So, my name is Tony Johnson. I've lived in Columbia City for the last eight years. I'm a home builder, have been a home builder for the last 25 years. Um, have been in the construction industry 10 years prior to that. And long story short, um I I guess I could say that I've been building in Fort Wayne, building in Columbia City, and building in Warsaw in this entire time frame. I build used to build high-end homes. Now I build homes anywhere from medium to highend homes. And I basically have uh tried to accommodate the needs of people um in the homes that I build that are more in a budget scenario because a lot of the high-end homes I built people would love. The problem was they couldn't afford them. And because the fact that they couldn't afford them, I decided to take those details and put them in more cost effective scenarios. And then that way when I would build a more affordable home comp, you know, comparable price to like a granite ridge home or an ideal suburban, you know, homes that you would recognize here in the Columbia City market, then I would be in the same price points just offer high-end

architecture and at the same price points. And that's kind of what I did in the residential construction side of things. my idea for what I'm in the process of proposing here. I listen to a lot of the people's understandings, complaints, um their um concerns. Some people have concerns that I I feel that probably aren't applicable. I'm going to address every single one of those concerns. And what I'm going to do right now, if it's okay, I'm going to read not necessarily verbatim the letters that came in to me and to the association. I'm going to present the concerns that people had concerning what their issues are with what we're in the process [clears throat] of doing. So, I'm going to start that off this way. People have a big concern about property values. Is this site that we're building going to diminish your property value? Again, like I said, I live in Deer Chase, and frankly, I'm very concerned about what the values of the property are going to be in Deer Chase. There's one person that said that they would be concerned about a diminished lifestyle. I'm not quite sure exactly what they mean by that, but um the next one said that there's apartments, they're going to be too close to Dear Chase subdivision. Now, I'm just reading all these off in a line item, and when I'm done, then I'm going to address these concerns. um they have limited facts and data on what we're trying to do. And the reason why we have limited facts and data on what we're trying to do is because it's not set in stone yet. I don't have a a stamp on the blueprint saying this is exactly what's going to happen. I anticipated us needing to have a conversation here today because frankly um I'm concerned about what your concerns are and I want to address those because I'm not here to make enemies out of anybody. But I am here as a

businessman and I've been in business my whole life and I see this as not only good for the community, good for Columbia City. Some have contributed the fact that I had some um misconduct concerning timing of this right here meeting today because I purposely uh did a snow job on people by the date that I set this meeting up with. Well, I've been in contact with Nathan um since the time I started doing this and um long story short is this was the first available meeting I could set. That's the main reason we're having this here today. So, for me to turn around and do something dishonest and try to hide it behind people's eyes and hold a wall over your head then um I'm sorry your misconception on that incorrect. Someone wanted to have a continuence on this meeting because they wanted to hire an attorney so they could try to help this process not happen. And I guess that's your full rights and your ability to do so. If you want to hire attorney to turn around and combat this process, feel free. But might I ask you, if you're so against me trying to do what I'm trying to do with this, the property is still for sale. You can buy it yourself. You want to pay 30 uh $32,000 an acre for it. If you do, go for it. I'm not stopping you. I'm not blocking anybody from buying this. The problem I'm having with this scenario is this. Many people have stated I should build single family homes in here. Let's face it, that's what I've done for 25 years. I'm a single family home builder. I am doing a good job at it. Matter of fact, I was the preferred builder in Warsaw for the last five years until I retired. Point is is this, at that price per acre, you can't build single family homes on that property because the value of the property is too expensive. By the time I bought that property, paid that

much for the property, developed the property, and put all the infrastructure into the property, I'd have to sell those lots at around $100,000 a piece. I'm not going to do that. And I can tell you something else. No other developer will either. I've been in the building industry a long time and I know a lot of developers and I know what they pay for grounds. They don't pay that much for property. At least I don't and the ones that I know don't. So the point is is there's no way feasible you can build a single family subdivision on that site and make it come to pass. The real question is is this is everybody if they come against what we're trying to do here and they shoot down what I'm trying to do. This property is still for sale. Somebody is going to purchase it. There's city water, city sewer here. Who's going to purchase it if I don't? What are they going to put there if I don't put something there myself? Maybe it's going to be worse than what you think I'm putting there. I don't know. People are afraid they said building apartments there. And most people that live in apartments don't maintain their properties very well and that turn out to be pretty trashy and they've got uh basically roof raft living there. Well, I have addressed this right here and I'll read it to you here in just a minute. It don't fit the area. Okay, I can understand your concern about the threetory buildings because frankly a question was asked to me and I took this question seriously. They said, "If your house backed up to this property, would you want a three-story building back behind your house?" And I had to be honest. No, I probably wouldn't, just to be candid with you. So, I really am listening to what you guys have to say, and it really does matter to me. I'm a Christian man, which means a little bit to very few people. But the point is is I am a man of integrity, no matter how much people question that. They said they didn't like the tall tall buildings, the traffic, and the bad

views out the back of their properties because they had lived in their properties for a while and didn't want an eyesore in the backyard. I understand. What am I going to do about this? What am I going to do to make everybody in here happy with the proposed plan that I'm trying to put together? First and foremost, I told you what I felt as far as a single family property is concerned. This property isn't conducive for a single family residential neighborhood. If it was, I built just telling you the truth because I've been doing that for 25 years.

So, let's talk about a little bit. three-story buildings in this property, especially if your property backs up to this right here. Now, there's several people in this subdivision that are claiming that [snorts] uh you know, it's going to devalue your property, but we'll get to that in a second. If I had my house back up to this piece of ground and there was a three-story building in my backyard, would I like that? Probably not. So, here's what I propose to do. This right here, whole process is still fluid. Just so you know, I've decided the option for this property. We already determined, at least I've determined, you might not have, but I have determined the fact that we cannot put single family houses here. So, what can I do? Who's seen the yellow retirement homes over there by Walmart? Single story. Okay, this is my thought process. Right now, there is currently two to six month waiting period on those properties. Some people question the aspect, is there even a need for these? Just the fact that there's a two to a six-month waiting period shows that there's a need. So, I'm proposing to still do multi- family, but not threetory buildings, singlestory buildings. Also, the fact that their retirement style community is a 55 plus style community that I'm going to put in this area kind of solves the question about the riff raff and the the basically nuisance of the neighborhood back here. Because let's face it, if they're single story units and they're retirement style units, most of those people are our age. I mean, we're not still dealing drugs and turning our stereo. We might turn our shirt up every once in a while. But the point of the matter is is that, you know, we're not going to have the rip wrap that most people are concerned about. Do I have to put a certain quantity of units in this right here to make the price point feasible for what

we're doing? Yes, I do. But I looked at the zoning map where it said R3 with low, medium, or high density. I fit right in the medium density of it. 10 units per acre. That's where I'm going to be at in that scenario. So let me address a few of my these other questions that I have or that you had should I say. Um reduce property value. I uh looked online and I just wanted to see and we had a comment based on this earlier. This going to reduce the property values which they had stated it that this actually does not reduce property values. I got online. I wanted to look it up just to confirm what people were having to say. And here's what I put down. Excuse my reading glasses on. While some homeowners fear retirement communities decrease adjacent property values due to stigma or perceived changes, research shows well-designed, well-maintained senior living facilities often have neutral to even positive effects with some studies even find an appreciation in the properties. For what that's worth, I don't get to believe everything that's online. I don't necessarily. Even if it doesn't depreciate your property, but it just stays neutral. Maybe it increases it, maybe it don't. But even if your properties aren't devalued by what I'm building and they don't do any less than what they're currently at, then we haven't lost anything, unless someone else buys this property and puts a mobile home park in there. I don't know what could be done. There's a mobile I bought the church right down the street, not even few hundred yards down the street. There's a mobile home park right there across the street from my church. Yeah, I've been a pastor for the last year or so in ministry for several years. Point is is I'm trying to say is I'm trying to do what's right for the community. And not only that, I mean, I live in Deer Chase and several of my friends live in Dear Chase. Most of the

people that I built houses for still call me friends. That's kind of unheard of. It's because I respond to their needs. I respond when they have issues. I respond when they have call backs because I am a man of integrity. But the point is is this. I'm not going to build something in here, first of all, that I'm going to let look like trash because this is an investment for me. This is an investment that I'm doing to protect my resources as well. So why would I let it become devalued that way? Not only that, as far as traffic flow in and out of the property in space, a retirement community isn't going to see near the type of traffic that you're going to see in an apartment complex like section 8 style housing unit there. So, you're not going to have people traveling in and out, but in addition to that, I'm going to have two entrances and exits out of the property that's going to be conducive for traffic flow. Unlike Dear Chase, who lives in Deer Chase and tries to go somewhere on a Sunday morning, it's chaos. I mean, don't get me wrong, I love First Church. That's great. Praise the Lord that they're there. But if you try to get out and get back in again, it's a nightmare. I understand. That's why the people that would try to build that apartment complex or apartment building in the front chase, which was not me, by the way, they got it shot down because of the traffic issues. I don't know why they let the other subdivision with the other 15 or 16 houses get built in there because of the traffic problems we already have. But this right here doesn't even touch your chase traffic. This right here is on business 30. So that's not going to be a traffic issue or your chase at all.

Stickler Road now they're having issues from what I hear with water drainage problems.

Yeah, I I understand. I I had the church like I said 200 yards down the street. I bought the church. I owned the lot behind the church. The lot that I owned behind the church was the water dumping ground for the whole Dogwood subdivision. I'm like, what am I going to do about this? Well, I found a way to turn around and build the lot up so we could turn around and use it as a building lots on home build. But then the neighbor beside of it said, "Well, our uh our lot's flooding." I got in contact with the city and said, "We need to do something with the drainage here." and I stayed on it for eight months and we finally ended up getting drainage culverts put in three different locations on the property beside the church that I purchased and also beside the lots just on the west side of the church that I purchased as well which solve the drainage issue which is the drain that we're talking about that goes onto the property to solve the drainage issues from all the streets that we're going to put in on the property I'm going to be required to first of all retention pond in to overflow, you know, all the water overflow and drainage and stuff like this. Will that possibly touch that tile that's on my property? Well, there's one tile that goes from the farmer's field on my property that ties into that tile. And they said that I'm going to have to address that. So, I will. The point is is this is I don't believe that my pond that I'm going to put is going to affect any of the drainage off of my property. And not only that, if you've noticed that property, the back part of the property which is on the north is high. That's why the house is on Stickler Road flooding their backyards probably. I'm just guessing. I don't know, but I'm guessing that's what's happening because my property is higher than what your is. And because so water don't flow uphill. So when I develop this property, I'm going to turn around take the back part of the property and push a lot of that dirt towards the front part of the property. First of all, get more of a level surface for what I'm building. And two, what it's going to do is it's going to create an opportunity for the water

that might be in your backyard to help drain onto my property, whether through tiles or through um you know, retention or or swells in the property, drain it towards my pond and help alleviate the water issues on your property. I mean, these right here are just some of the things that I'm proposing right now to do. Will I need if I'm doing single stories to still create buffers between my property and yours? I don't think it's necessary to tell you the truth. I mean, a single family subdivision or a single family, you know, retirement community. I mean, they're only one story unit. It's not like you're looking at a three-story unit. Worst case scenario, if you don't want to look at them, a fence, single six foot fence would probably hide just about everything you're going to see. But with that being said, I think that addresses uh um probably most of the things that I have to say. I mean, I guess I'll let you guys have the microphone back and then however you want to take it from here. [clears throat]

Any questions for Mr. Council? Now, you're proposing all single family I mean all single story through there instead of threetory. Correct. No threetory units on there at all. And are they all senior apartments? That's the proposed plan was a senior 55 plus retirement community. Have you figured out yet what you do with the graveyard?

Yes, we're going to leave the graveyard in place and we're going to turn it to like a memorial. We're going to do I don't know if anybody's ever been to like Johnny Apple Seed Park in Fort Wayne and saw the grave site there. Something in that type of a a scenario. We're going to dress it up. We're going to make it look nice. Maybe plant some nice shrubs, some flowers in there and memorialize it and probably, you know, give homage to the people that are buried there. There are some headstones. Yes, there are. I have no idea if it's a family one or there several families. I don't know. So he's taught you respect gra. Yeah. Well, it's our plan to leave them there.

That drainage along the west property line. Um give you a little story about that. Um Mr. Brown who originally had the farm here um granted permission for a to run across these lots owned by Mr. Hollowway, Mr. Gross, and Couplers. Uh, if I mispronounce your name, I'm sorry. And they uh uh at that time was owned by um Jack Hinman and um Grosses that would have been Dennis and uh down here would have been Jack Kaiser would have been the last one, the southern one. And the proposal was connect the tile over to PhD branch 4. I had approached Mr. ground at the uh hospital towards the end of his life to get that permission. [snorts] Uh I had to do that in regards to pl to placing the original tile

early in order for me to sell one of those lots there to control that drainage. Now I know that since then there's been other modifications and improvements done with some of them tile sections which I'm sure over time they've had issue with soil filling or things like that was done to control uh some of that flooding that had taken place at that time. Sure.

And allow it was a contingency for the sale to be made. Um so uh and we had approached the uh drainage board informally at that time and they uh would not assume or accept that tile from where that stand pipe section is just up to that drive that would have gone back to the farmhouse. Uh they weren't going to uh accept that as a extension of of any kind of county drain. My thought process was what I could possibly do to help alleviate flooding over the sticker roadside would be to run a drainage tile on the west side of my property, soon to be property hopefully, and then basically I could direct that into where my retainage pond would be and then that way any type of water that would come into that scenario could hit over the retainage pond. Now, if the retainage pond itself by massive rainfalls or whatever became very very high, then it would probably end up following into the drainage tile. If the drainage tile is not sufficient at this moment in time, that's going to be need something that's going to need to be addressed and that's something I'm going to have to work with the city on to find a resolution for that.

Well, and Mr. McCoy, I'm sure he can give you an update that in the springtime, you know, we're talking about regular field ground here that does have certain absorption, but we've seen that ground, that water come up on his driveway and cover it over there into his property as the way it exists today.

Sure. Well, the drainage on the property currently is not very well. So that being the case, like I said, there's going to be a lot of modifications done to the topography of the ground to begin with, plus the retainers that we're going to need to put in place to accommodate the the groundwater that's going to come from the streets and stuff inside the on the proposed site. So this is all going to be done through state and they're going to dictate what we're going to need to do to accommodate these things. Like I said, the retainage pond that we're going to put in there is going to be sizable and with that being the case, it's going to take a lot of the ground water directly into the drainage pond. Um, will it accommodate everything all the time? Well, the drainage pond that was put into the other property right in Deer Chase is frankly it's always empty. So, will mine be always full? I seriously doubt it. Will it be able to accommodate a lot of groundwater that's coming off the property? I would say so. Will it always be able to accommodate 100% of it? I guess that's remain to be seen. And that's where we're going to have to determine what kind of condition that clay tile is that's on the property that goes through the Dogwood subdivision. If it needs to be reran, then it's going to have to be reran.

So, when you're talking about your retention area, are you talking about the low area where the stand pipe is at today? No, the retention. Um, excuse me. One second. Let me go back and grab kind of a just a rough schematic of what I'm thinking on the single family. Okay. when you're looking at it. water. Maybe

I've heard that the person who developed that ground in the first place over in the dogwood subdivision put undersized tile in there and so they didn't create a large enough clay tile and it's clay and it's probably broke and tree growing through it the whole nine yards. So yeah, there's going to have to be something to deal with that. Um is that something I'm willing to work with the city on? I guess it still maintain any type of tile.

The other thing is you're changing I'm sure you'll be addressing this with John at the USDA. [clears throat] This uh you know you changed this from being absorption ground basically covered e in building are blacked out and not completely. This right here we got probably 10 15% of property up here. This right here is 30 foot all the way around the whole entire property. We got 50 foot 70 foot right here, you know. So there's this is street but right now what you're looking at is probably about close to 22%. That's probably it. It's the water of what you have today.

Correct. which is why the retention time. Mr. President, we have some concerns you're getting a little too into the development side and we're and it's turning into kind of a private conversation and then we're starting separate conversations out here and we're not hearing much of anything. So [clears throat] that's any any other questions for Mr. Johnson? So, so what you what you had presented the the buildings with three stories, you pretty much scrapped that whole thing, right?

Yes. From hearing the concerns of people that were involved in the scenario or most impacted by that scenario, it seemed to me like that was something that they uh really had a this case for. So, to accommodate their needs, I decided to go a different direction with this and um go with that single story. Now, as far as addressing the riff wrap issue and stuff like that, having seen a number of 55 plus year old people, I got to question that sometimes, but be careful. How many how many when you went to when you went to the single family single units, how many units are you actually planning on building? We're looking probably about 100 units,

which if you consider the units are only 28 foot wide, huge difference from a single family home, is that comparable to like

John, what was your question? Okay. No. Is that is that comparable to like to the retirement the 50 or the senior living if you if you've seen the yellow retirement homes over by Walmart? Right. Right. Somewhat comparable. Okay, Larry. Um, so would these be rentable at a at market rate or Yes. Okay.

We're looking depending on the scenario. First of all, like I said, I was a high-end home builder, so I'm going to do stuff in these units that most of the stuff out there don't have. Um, 9 foot standard ceilings, cathedral ceilings, tray ceilings in the bedrooms, granite countertops, probably custom cabinets, you know, stuff. When people walk into a rental property, they walk into it and they see the basic, you know, most something that someone can get away with building, stick somebody in to get a rent out. Well, I have a conception to feel in this the same way I did my house at Warsaw. When I first went into Warsaw, I had one of the biggest um real estate companies tell me, Tony, you build beautiful homes, but you don't need to do all this stuff. Why don't you just put a simple cathedral ceiling in there and call it a day? I'm like, but the architecture that I put into the houses is what makes me unique. And if I stop doing that, then how am I going to be different than anybody else? He said, well, I don't agree with him. So, I chose a different builder. And well, needless to say, when I was in Warsaw Building, I was the premier builder, not just in my own opinion, but in the home builders association's opinion as well. Because anytime they needed someone to build a home that they were seeking a builder, they always referred me. Why? Because I gave them better value, better price or comparable prices as a lot of the box builders do.

And I'm going to do the same concept with these right here. So people that are going to want to retire, let's face it, they don't want to go into something that's just basic. I mean, when you put your mom into a retirement home or a 55 senior plus home, you know, you want her to have just the basics or you want her to have something nice. And if I put my mom in one, I want her to live in a nice place. That's kind of the concept behind it. And I feel if people see what I have at very close to the same price as what's already here, one of two things will happen. They'll choose mine before they choose theirs. Or even if they're in one of theirs, they'll say, "I like his better. It's mine. So that's a question for Nathan.

Oh, um I was wondering about how how is the density at the yellow apartments fall as far as to the acreage because I know we're we're all pretty familiar to that scenario. I'll uh I'll pull it up and while the public hearing's going on, I'll do the calculations for you. Thank you. I did a calculation by the graph that you put on the board. It says medium density was 10.25 units per acre. I fall right at that 10 point 10 units per acre.

Well, just to be clear, that wasn't suggesting that was medium. That was for them to give them reference. And I would actually say that the five or so may be the freight rather than the 10, but again for their consideration. Any any other questions? Thank you. Yeah. Anyone anyone else wants to speak in favor of this? Anyone who wish to speak that's opposed. Okay. Yeah. I don't know. No. Yeah. You got to state your name.

Sworn in. Yes, sir. So, are you in favor of it or against Well, I'm very much against it. Sit down for a minute until we get down with people in favor. We didn't sit down for a minute until we get I did. He did. I said anyone that's in favor step forward. Nobody nobody nobody stepped forward. So I told him to come on up. Sorry.

So um as somebody that's that's new in this and partnering with Tony looking at this and looking at the needs uh looking at the demographic. Matthew Kell apologies. So looking at the demographic need again you've got a several month waiting list at the other retirement facilities in this area uh providing something that is of better value something that one is on a business 30 street uh you had mentioned earlier um that you you might be looking at business development uh farther to the west now as somebody that owns ground uh in the county. Uh would I much rather see a retirement village go in than an industrial plant? Absolutely. Um would I rather see a retirement village go in than most other businesses? Absolutely. Um and being a pastor that has quite a few senior citizens in my congregation and some of them yes will be looking for housing and some of them are on the waiting list for the other places. Uh I can absolutely say that this is needed and it would be something that I believe that if we do not do it would be a detriment to this community.

Thank you. Anyone else in favor? Come up. Anyone opposed? Sir, um before we get to the opposition, um to answer Larry's question, the yellow apartments have 33 units on 3 acres. So the math on that, it's not exactly three acres. Uh math comes out to be about 10.75 units per acre. Okay. Thank you. So, it's good and the zoning of that uh which I think will probably be somebody's next question is GB General Business.

Sir, you state your name and your address, please. Okay. My name is Randy Stanley, 1159 White Tale Drive. Come on up. Don't be bashful. I'm just standing on a swinging range. That's all. [laughter] Well, how about I stand in front of you? Okay. Now, 59 tail drop. Yes. My back b is your north bed. Yes.

Okay. Now, you know, you make this sound so glamorous. You say, "Well, our property won't go down and all this and that." I sit in my house and I count the deer out there in a field. There was 20 of them the other night. Now, if you build this, there's not going to be any deer out there. That's it. Okay. And occasionally, we see some fest. And we see turkey vultures and and all kinds of birds, hawks and

uh and then what really surprised me was, and I might be calling this a wrong name, I call it a stick bug. Are you going to do something to protect the stick bug? You're going to stick bug it. I probably really don't. Well, okay. I might be wrong the wrong thing, but Mr. President, in terms of Excuse me, sir. I don't mean to interrupt. We are really, really out of forum here. So, what I'm going to suggest is yes, if you could sit in the front row, and he is welcome to address you, too, but you are really addressing these folks here. These are the ones that are going to make the decisions. All right.

And so, I I just Okay, we hear you. The problem is it's Yeah. and and and you're welcome to talk with with the petitioner as well. He's sitting right there and I I'll let you continue. We stopped your timer, so you got almost another minute. Now, excuse me. I'm not I got I got Hold on a second. These deer you're talking about and all this wildlife you're talking about. Is that in your on your property or is that in this is that in this development area? Oh, both places. Okay. I've had as many 20 deer in my backyard. in my backyard. It's really small. Okay. Cuz cuz what happens on another piece of property, okay? But that that's if you want to control it, you have to buy the property.

If you if you like watching deer in somebody else's property and you want want to stay that way, then you need to buy that property. Okay? The deer on my property is not going to be there if they're not on his property. Well, there's deer running all over in around the fairgrounds through all those people. Let me just kind of I'm not a good spokesman.

I know that. But there's other people on the left side of me and the right side of me that enjoy watching the deer, the different animals, the birds, and the quietness. Very quiet. Very quiet. We have my own kids might come over say, "Oh, it's so quiet here. So nice." Well, if there's a bunch of them, now if they were all older homes, I really wouldn't like it, but it'd be a lot better. There wouldn't be all the kids. Sir, I'm sorry. Your time's up now. Okay.

Huh?

Your time is up. Hi, my name is Samira Jagger. I live at 1183 West Whitetail Drive. I took the petition around in opposition of reszoning this to R3. I mostly worked from your mailing list and was able to reach everyone but three homeowners. Everyone who signed the petition does not want this to be our three. We know something is going to have to be built on here and we're hoping to keep it as single family. Now, Mr. Johnson said it's too expensive for single family. He has to build these threestory apartments, but in a blink of an eye, now they're gone. So once this is reszoned, he can blink his eye again and there they are. My backyard is to the um at the back end of this. So with the threestory apartment building, they're going to be looking back into all of our backyard. You can't put a privacy fence like you said to block that from three stories up. My dining room, my bedroom, and my living room is all on that back end. So, additional parking lot lighting is going to be streaming into my windows all the time. You know, nobody I spoke to was for it. Um I'm just worried now. He He's a smooth talker. I'll give him

that. But his proposal he sent in was for four threestory apartments with 150 units. Now magically in an hour and a half, they're all singlestory. They're all retirement. You know, it once it gets reszoned, we won't have a say. There's no set proposal on what he wants to do. He's willy-nilly all over the place. 15 Thank you.

We have control what he builds.

Hi, my name is Don Buke and I live at 777 West Dogwood. I hate talking in front of people, but there are absolutely some things that Thursday when I found out this was going on because I wasn't part of the 650 feet from the proposed site to get a notice. Um, but it came through the neighborhood. Um, I went and I looked at the cemetery. I was told there was a cemetery there. I did some research and yeah, there is. And the Browns were buried in like 1895. Okay. David and Mary are buried there. Then I went to look and see what our rights are with cemeteries. We can't touch them without DNR approval. We cannot touch them. We do. We're illegally touching them. You have to stay 100 ft away from a burial site. and especially with the um Indiana Historic Preservation and Arch Archeological Law saying that can't be touched. Okay. Um if you want this, I'll be glad to give it to whoever wants it. I'll give this to whoever wants it. There is only 9.06 acres according to the property card for Wheel County. There are not 10 acres. There's only 9.06 and this is your form. The other thing is there are monuments in there and we can't touch them. Wetlands, has anybody contacted IDM to ask them if we can even do anything? item is very much involved in wetlands and if we don't do Indiana Department of Environal Management this whole meeting is worthless. I came

from Fort Wayne a year and a half ago. I came from by Meyers on Illinois Road. I had in 10 years so many apartment complexes that I had to move out of there because I couldn't get out of my addition. 30. It times it. Okay. Thank you. And I understand their environmental issue.

My name is Glenn Evansson. I live at 90 North Westchester Drive. I also strongly oppose this petition. Um, I believe that the value of this particular property is 9 acres or 10 acres is set at that particular price point most likely because of the neighborhoods surrounding it. Um, I would like to keep that as R1 if the need for the city is to have a retirement home. I imagine there are properties that are less than 32,000 per acre for that particular purpose. Um, absolutely will uh lower our property values. I lived off of Illinois Road as well. I've only been here for three years. Um I got had to get away from apartments. I love the quiet of the neighborhood. Um having it zoned as R1. If the intention is single uh family, single level, leave it R1. That's the only way to guarantee that it stays seven. Thank you. Thank you. Good evening. I am Steve Holloway. Um, we live on 15 South Stick of the Road with my spouse, Lynette Ryder Holloway. Since I am representing more of a group, I'm hoping a lot of a few more minutes because I'm also representing my in-laws uh who are Richard and Elaine Ryder who live would be in the northeast corner of this project. We my wife and I live in the far northwest corner of this project or adjacent to it. Um for the record, I was one that requested a continuence of this meeting. Um for how Mr. Johnson described it. The timing was very questionable of the and not allowing much not allowing ample time for us to

really understand and get the data and consultations and perhaps legal counsel representation. But we're obviously going through with this hearing. Continuence was not considered. Um, I will speak to to the drainage problem if I have time left, but I want to get um into a little bit more that there just really doesn't seem to be a a bonafide proven basis for R3 housing um in within the city limits based on the fact that there there's the absence of a study that has been included or presented throughout in this record or any anywhere here tonight to prove that. So, I'm going to just read from the record that you already have in front of you to digest just to the benefit of the rest of the attendees tonight um who are clearly here to express their opposition. And I want to thank publicly Sam Jagger for her outstanding effort um to get this attendance here tonight and leading the petition. But the the basis for additional R3 housing. I've reviewed the project documentation at the building department and did not find included for reference substantiation. The project fulfills a public need for additional R3 housing within city limits which is customarily proven by professional review study and final reporting to support the to support the project. sub such substantiation would seem relevant and necessary for board consideration of the applicant's request to reszone a designated R1 property earmarked for low density population. Is there such a justification? It should be included within the record for public review in this matter and a continuence granted by the board for review by respondents and citizens of Columbia City. As it now stands, the application fails to show intent to fulfill a public need

and fails to justify any cause for the board to grant an exception on reszoning property to R3 that affected citizens by petition and appearance at this hearing tonight made clear is greatly undesirable, unpopular, and unnecessary to reszone. In addition to the issues raised above, dense population noise, outdoor lighting disruption, increased traffic noise and congestion, roadway safety, reduced privacy, reduced value of adjacent properties are all factors in focus as detrimental to the respondents, our neighbors, and surrounding neighborhoods. If reszoning this property of to R3 is approved, ample apartment and retirement housing availability exists as proven by anyone's cursory search online of local complexes near the applicant's acres. Despite there not being an apparent need for additional artery housing, there's nonetheless other acreage currently for sale within the county in such a in a setting much more suitable for the applicant's intent to build R3 housing. A cursory search online can locate that. Also, please do not grant this applicant's request for reszoning to R3 based on this appeal explaining it is unjustified, unreasonable, and unpopular to do so. Now, if I can speak briefly to the drainage issue, we have lived next to this problem for 24 years. My in-laws have lived next to it for 47 years. The key concern is the old clay tile flowing drainage water to the Philips

ditch from this applicant's acreage at this time can barely handle the current drainage even considering the remedies made by neighboring property owners at our own costs and being farm ground for optimal water absorption. It's an unreasonable expectation the old tile old clay tile will probably handle properly handle the largely increased volume of water expected to drain from acres of rooftops. Hard surfaces needed for car travel and car parking for this project. Flooding of neighboring properties would seem eminent without improved tiling the full distance to reach Philips Ditch. Now, the kicker is the Phillips ditch fund may not currently or in the future be able to fund the cost of that tile upgrade all the way from what's left from what the residents, the property owners in the souththeast corner did put in a few feet of improved tile, but there's a lot more footage of tile to reach the Phillips ditch. I might have time. Okay, thank you.

Excuse me. I yield my time to George 970 Westwood and I'd be more than happy to yield my time. Sure. Thank you. He was already given five minutes, so an additional two. Sure. Thank you.

Kicker, [clears throat] as I was saying, the the the quilt stitch fund in the future or now may not be able to fund that upgrade. um to adequately drain the applicant's acres to spare the respondents properties from further flooding. In the case of inadequate funding, it's probable and likely an additional Phillips dishes ditch assessment would fee would be unfairly charged to the affected property owners to fund the remaining footage of tile needed to reach the Phillips ditch to drain the applicant's flooding issues to be exasperated exacerbated by this project. The proposed remedy would be the applicant should fund any and all improved drainage needed to properly drain the project acres entirely to Philips ditch without increasing the Philips ditch assessment fee to affected property owners absent a signed agreement by him to do so as part of the reasoning view. The applicant should with should withdraw his application to reszone the property and or the board should deny the application for reszoning to Arthur. Thank you,

Mr. President, I have a question. Yes. I wish to address Mr. Waggle in regards to uh since this is now annexed within the city limits. Uh the Tony drainage assessments no longer apply to city residents. Is that correct? No. It goes into a drainage fund and basically we pay all the drainage assessments to the city through our assess. All of us pay into it. The electric or the utility?

Utility. We have a drainage account set up and we go ahead and we don't charge for every watershed because then it would be getting double taxed. So we go ahead and just pay through once a year. We get an assessment from the county and we pay whatever assessments within our jurisdiction will pay more. That way this residents get not get double tax. my issue with what's going on. With all due respect, sir, I don't question your integrity or character. I have the utmost respect for what you're saying, but at the same time, you're pumping more water into that fell ditch. I've been on council for this is my 18th year and I've been out in uh with Westgate in the area with drainage and more than anywhere else in in the city and especially I worked as a GIS coordinator in the drainage office and I so I listen to Philips Ditch that's like a four-letter word in my head to be honest that's just at all time you know so if we're going to be looking at more water going into that uh and then little filter down towards the 4H grounds which is already uh pushing the limits and it's always it seems like we're always upgrading in that area. Um so I have some real issues with uh uh a plan of uh with the drainage. I I questioned that right when I first saw this thing. And I know you keep saying, "Oh, we can upgrade. We can upgrade." Well, there's no plan for that. I don't see anything anywhere where, you know, how, you know, are we going to have to upsize that tile? And if you do, that's going to cross all the way across all these people's properties to make it bigger. And then we're still dumping it into the ditch down by the 4H grounds. Now, that's a problem. That's a problem. And so

that's answer your question. That's how that's I know I advanced it a little more than necessary.

Anyone else wish to speak in opposition?

This is probably not very nice, but I don't care about your success building all your homes or how wonderful they are. Did you say your name?

Vicki Zapoose, 165 South James Street. Um, we live there now for 20 years, which is directly across from the cemetery. Prior to that, we lived 15 years on Stickler. I can see our house there that we live. But I don't care about his success everywhere else. I care about our area. The sewers that you speak about. So true. We see the lake across the street from us. Even if you fix it, same with Westgate. I'm thrilled with everything they did in Westgate. We're not in Westgate, but we're on the corner where it starts in. We're paying for it. Do I mind paying taxes to help that and to help our sewers? No, I don't. But I don't want to do anymore either. As far as his apartments, oh, all of a sudden, as she said, they go to from three stories to some yellow senior apartments that are going to be much nicer. Senior citizens can't hardly afford the yellow ones, let alone his special fancy ones. I don't trust him. I don't trust once this zoning would change that it would be anything like it said. Once it changes, we don't have any more say about it. There is nobody that wants it. And I agree with the gentleman that said, as long as that property is that expensive, no, they probably won't be able to get single homes in there. And he could keep building all the homes he wants. But we do not want apartments across from us. We do not want more water problems. As far as traffic, I live directly in front of business 30. Your time's up.

It's busy. Anyone else?

Hello. Uh Weston Dorman. I live at 1200 West Business 30. Uh just a caddy corner in Zapus. Um, definitely like to have if if worst case scenario this does end up in R3, I want R1 just like everyone else. I'd love a Gordon T, too. It'd be great. Um, but I definitely need a wall, especially with the plans he had initially. You know, we're talking a pool, playground, that's all on my property, which Yeah, they were talking.

That's a lot of points. My wife, we moved in 2021. Thank you. Thank you. Anybody else?

Maryanne Low, 1092 West Court. My husband and I moved back to Columbia City uh from Fort Wayne because he has Parkinson's and I need to be where I'm close to things, hospitals, people to help him. So, we live we look right at the property and one thing he does enjoy is sitting on our front porch and watching the deer. And I know if I want it, all I got to do is come up with 300 and some thousand bucks and if I had it, I'd buy it. And that's why most people have bought it is to keep it from housing additions and everything, but everybody can't do that. At some point, it's going to get sold. Uh, one thing I don't want, I don't want a wall behind like Mike and Ry's house. If I want a wall around my property, I'll move to California, you know, or someplace where it's all brick walls. We love being out. Our addition is beautiful. My is nice. It's handicapville. We're very lucky to find that and the neighbors are great. But that's really all I have. Just I'm against it. I'm just against it.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Hello, my name is Joyce Hawkins. I live at 1323 Westwood Drive. I serve on our Dear Chase HOA board and I have for the past four years. Um, our neighbors are opposed to this. Um, we've been blindsided, I feel, uh, with the timing of this. Um, we didn't really have a lot of time to respond with this being a holiday period. So, uh, we were able to collect, um, a lot of signatures. As you can see, I spent four hours out, um, yesterday collecting signatures. No one is in favor of this. um feeling um a little bit blindsided again because now from 150 unit threetory apartments now suddenly it's oh retirement homes I think retirement homes would be great but if you approve this um zoning change um what guarantees do we have that he's not going to go back to those four buildings, 150 apartments. So, I know so many of these people and I represent them and I just urge you to vote no. The drainage issue, the property values, all those things that other people have mentioned, they matter to us at Dear Chase. And um we just urge you to vote now. Thank you.

Anyone else? My name is Rick Zapus and that's my wife. 165 South James Street. Okay. And I lived on Stickler 15 years here 20. And we we enjoy it. We love it. You know, it's peaceful and quiet. I know the drainage problems been a problem for years, but as for building apartments in there, this gonna I can say a whole bunch of bad words, but I'm not. I mean, it's plain aggravating. And there's reason why a lot of people live there because it's peaceful. And you add all this more structure, more structure, more structure. It's going to mess everything up and turn around and people's going to get, "Well, I ain't going to move to Columbia City because the stupidity they put into it." Yeah, I can understand it. This man here, all he wants is a dollar bill. Yeah, everybody does. If I hadn't had the money myself, I agree with you. this lady back here. I I would have bought it long time ago and keep it the way it is. That's where making a park there, too. We got a park down Morses Park. You got the YMCA down there by the roller rink. There's a park. We don't need another park. Swimming pool. I mean, it's about time

you people listen to most of these people here live instead of, well, he's just nobody. Yeah, that's nobody's pay your taxes and pay your wage, you know, but and I thank you for your time. Thank you. Thank you. Anyone else? Okay. You want to respond? You have the floor. Okay. You have five minutes.

Well, it seems like uh most people here are opposed to what we're trying to do, which I kind of knew up front. Most of them are trying to say, "Well, you know what? I opposed these threetory apartment buildings to begin with, and now I'm bait and switch and I'm going to put retirement homes there instead. What's to keep me from being dishonest and putting the threetory apartment buildings up there?" Well, I think we can probably dictate in this right here to state what the rules and regulations are going to be and guidelines are going to be to what's going to be available and what's going to be built on this property at the zoning. So, you could make mandates. This is not accessible for a three-unit building or threetory building. That answers that question. Drainage. You know, I don't have all the answers up front about all the drainage issues. I'll just be honest with you. One thing I do know is this. is that right now I've been working with the powers that be for infrastructure upgrades which I would assume drainage would probably be one of them due to the fact that if we're having water problems currently then those are going to be problems that are going to need to be addressed. So if we're having water problems we'll probably deal with that through some of the monies that we're going to be doing through infrastructure upgrades in the property. Um, as far as the fact I get it, everybody wants a corn field because you've had a corn field for the whole time. That's pretty sweet. It's not going to stay a corn field whether I buy it or not. It doesn't matter if I purchase this property. You don't understand this. What's going to matter is who purchases the property what they're going to do with it. Somebody's going to purchase this piece of property. They're asking 32,500 an acre. Unless there's only nine acres on this property, then it's probably closer to $35 to $37,000 an acre. Who wants to pay $37,000 an acre of a property? No one's going to to plant corn on it. Someone's going to develop this property. If it's not me, it's going to be somebody else. I'm just saying that's just a statistic.

Retirement homes are needed in this community. Why? The ones that are currently here have a three to six month waiting period on. It's not very long unless you're the person waiting six months. So, but the point is is this

is it's not just here. I've went to Warsaw as well. I also went to Fort Wayne as well. It's the same scenario everywhere. That goes to show you that there's a demand for why did I go from the three-story apartment buildings to the singlestory retirement communities? I wanted to build the three store unit buildings, three store buildings. Greater, you know, volume, greater, you know, rentability, more people, more income. Yeah, I'm going to make money. I'm a businessman who goes to work and does for free. I'm trying to make money. Absolutely I am. But I'm also listening to every one of your concerns. If I wasn't listening to your concerns, I'm going off every one of the things that you sent to me. But the point of the matter is is this is I'm trying to do everything I can accomodate your needs. Let's face it, there's some people that just aren't going to want anything but a quarantine. The problem is is this. It's too long to understand. This ain't always going to be a quarant. This is going to be something. Is it going to be a single family development? I seriously doubt it. Point is is this is I'm going to do the best thing I can to build nice properties here. Some people have questioned my integrity. Some people have questioned my faith. Some people have said a lot of nasty things to me on my emails. The point is is this though I'm going to do what I said I'm going to do and you guys can hold me to it because you can put it down in paper and make me stand by it. Real question that we think I have is the biggest scenario is the drainage ditch. I think we need to resolve this situation and I think because I've dealt with this drainage ditch when I built well when I revamped my church when I had my church it was an eyes sore. Most people that lived around that church were like this is terrible. We bought the building, completely renovated it, new roof, new windows, new parking areas, new everything, new sighting around the whole. When we was done with it, all the neighbors came to me and said, "Thank you so much for improving this. You really made this a

lot nicer property. The parsonage that was behind the church, it was a dump. There was rats in it. The floors floors were falling in. The roof was caving. I It was It was nasty. I paid $50,000 for this house. It was junk." When I was done with it, one of the realtors came in and insulted me and said, "I can't believe some idiot can come back here and build a brand new house with a onecar attach garage." The point is is this. I build quality products and I don't care if you don't like what I do or if you don't like what I do. It's it's okay. It don't matter to me. I don't do it for anybody else other than the people that are going to be renting from me and the value of the property. I want to keep the values there. I live in Dear Chase. I built the three most expensive houses in Dear Chase.

I'm just saying and I'm not saying that to brag. I'm saying that is I care about the property values. I care about what's happening. I don't want my property to be devalued, much less anybody else's. So, the point is is this. Your time's up. Okay. Well, I'll leave it at that, but that's my point. I mean, you know, people can question my integrity all they want, but you know, I'm going to do what I said I'm going to do. Thank you.

Thank you. At this time, I'll close the public input portion of this meeting and turn it over to the board. I guess for me, I watched uh when Deer Chase first came in, I got a lot of comments about uh they didn't want Deer Chase in from the neighboring eastern uh subdivision. They were concerned. They love to look at the field. They love to look at all that. And uh there was concerns about Dear Chase coming in, but uh one of the concerns I have with this whole thing is uh a plan. Um I don't live out there. You all do. And I have struggled with the I'm not so sure this is an actual place for this. Um will it be developed into something? Sure. Something's going to go on out there. So, what's best to go in out there? You know, is there a need for senior apartments? Absolutely. Trust me, I've been trying to get my mom into one. There's just too long. She'll probably gone before she has an opportunity to get into one. That's just being honest. So, is there a need? Absolutely. Is this the best location? I'm really struggling with that. And I listening and seeing the petition that's been drawn by people that live there. Um, I have to admit I'm struggling with that for one for lack of plan on how the drainage is going to happen. How uh you know one some one lady got up there and talked about so they could look right over the whether there's a fence there or not. They can look into my backyard. I'm already dealing with that in Brennan's edition where there people are looking into people's backyards just because the way it sets. Um, so yeah, it's a it's a struggle for me to under I mean I respect the petitioner, but at the same time there's a lot of stuff

that needs to be taken care of and I I personally think we need to listen to the people that live out there. I don't live there. So I I I'm leaning towards supporting the the people that live there. I mean, I'm all for development, don't get me wrong, as long as it's done in a controlled way and a proper location. And it's not a question of the integrity of Mr. Johnson. I can't say that he wouldn't do what he's saying he's going to do and I can't say that he will do what he's going to say. But what I can say is that looking at the comprehensive plan and the perfect example is the first petitioner that we had today, Thor Hajes. There's a part that has an overlay and he's talking about putting the development in the area of where the comprehensive plan regulates that. which is fantastic. And this it doesn't fit in with the comprehensive plan to me of being our one. Um and exactly like you said, Dan, I don't live there. You live there. But it really for me it is fully that comprehensive plan. And that is why I'm most likely meaning to it's not a favorable recommendation. So, you're making that motion.

I would love for everyone to finish doing what they will definitely make that motion. I second your motion. Okay, then I'll go ahead and make it now. If you guys don't, unless you would like to have more discussion. Okay, Mr. President, I'd like to make an unfavorable motion for 26- C RZ-2.

I second that. Good. Have a motion and a second on the floor for a unfavorable recommendation to city council 26- C-REZ-2 R1 R3 property located at 1120 West Business 30. Those in favor of the unfavorable recommendation, please signify by raising your right hand. Those opposed motion carries. [applause] Nathan, other business?

Uh, not that I can think of. Amanda, any other business? Are we going to go get cheese out there? No. We adjourn. Oh, yeah. We done. You I [music]

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