City Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

So good afternoon and welcome to the Colorado Springs Historic Preservation Board meeting for August 3rd, 2026. The Historic Preservation Board is comprised of seven members appointed by City Council to administer the Historic Preservation Code. Historic Preservation Board members are community volunteers with expertise across a wide variety of disciplines. Each member acts independently, carefully assessing all the evidence presented to make their decision.

So item one, call to order and roll call.

Chair Loewenberg? Absent. Board Member Musick?

Absent.

Board Member Beerbaum? Here. Board Member McAulty?

Here.

Board Member Potter? Board Member Fitzsimmons?

Here.

And Board Member Wendt?

Here.

So Bill, are we having John step in?

Oh, we only need four. We have a quorum with four. We have Matt and Judy. And so I think we'll, that's only three, right?

Yes.

No, we have Chip, Matt, Judy. Don't have, oh, yeah, we'll need, I thought we had Sam Potter. I mean, Sarah. She said she was joining online, sorry. So yes, we need to make one of our alternates a voting member.

We have multiple alternates? We have all of our alternates here today, yes. Either online or here in person. So how, maybe Yong can advise on how, which alternate? We can essentially just have the chair choose one.

And since we have one individual here in person who is an alternate, I think that would make sense. Two in person. Oh, we have two in person. Okay. Chip, up to you. Ladies first. Shannon. Sorry.

You allow me a second to add. Shannon, right?

Oh my God.

It's all good. Okay, so Shannon will be our fourth voting member for the action items, the minutes and one project.

Yeah, somebody will have to help me with whether or not they can actually vote on minutes. Oh, they have to postpone them. Yeah, we may just have to postpone them. Young can weigh in on on that. That over there. I think of their written well. Grammar's right. I actually can understand them then.

We on the minutes right now? No, not yet. Still doing something.

I have Sharon right now on the list. So should we do again or are we good with the

I think if you're good then we're we're good.

We're good, thank you. So item number two changes to agenda postponements. So we are going to move 8A which is HIST-260006 which is the Griego residents front portico addition. We're going to move that. to 5A under consent when we get to there. So that is just a note for now, and then we will get to that in item five.

Chair McMillan, I would like to just add something to that. This item, the Grego Residence Front Portico Edition does qualify. and should have been on the consent calendar. It was determined in the review of this application that it complies with all the criteria for a report of acceptability. And this application received no public comment during its 30 day review period. And we did not get any notice from a board member that we wanted to pull TO PULL THAT OFF AND SO IT MEETS ALL OF THE BOARD'S KIND OF ADOPTED POLICIES FOR ALLOWING APPLICATIONS TO BE PLACED ON THE CONSENT CALENDAR.

NEW SPEAKER YOU'RE ASKING IF ANY BOARD MEMBER WOULD LIKE TO TAKE IT OFF?

NEW SPEAKER NO, WE'LL DO THAT ONCE WE GET TO 5. NEW SPEAKER DO I NEED TO REQUEST A MOTION? NEW SPEAKER THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. YOUNG, DO WE HAVE TO request a motion for that item to be moved to the consent calendar. We wanted to make sure you earned your money. I would like to know more about the materials.

Materials?

I don't think it was listed, the materials.

Yeah, it was in the It said it will use similar stuff, but that's as deep as I think it got.

Are you wanting to just see the material anyway? If Board Member Fitzsimmons has questions about it, then I say we just put it on YouTube. A very abbreviated discussion of it.

But it would actually be good for the new people to see what a presentation would be like, too.

Okay.

Just to clarify. Abbreviated.

Are you talking about the stuff that was on the email? All the different stuff? You saw it, though. I did. I got you. I was just making sure we were talking.

I was trying to find what's this made out of. It looks nice, but I don't know what it's made out of, quality materials or not.

Can I just ask Avery to provide that information to you?

If you're crunched for time, I'm willing to push that to the side. Just because it's on new business doesn't mean we need to spend 20 minutes on it. We can just very briefly read it into the record. Yeah, we can do that.

So why don't we just not move that and we'll keep it on new business? That's a whole lot easier. And now we don't have to ask Young any more questions, hopefully, for the rest of the meeting. So go to number three.

So we can go to number three. All right. So item number three, communications. Mr. Gray.

All right.

So I do have communications for the board this afternoon. And I guess number one, I guess I should just introduce myself for all of you that don't know. My name is Bill Gray. I'm a senior planner. I work in the urban planning division. I am also the designated preservation planner or liaison to the historic preservation board. I have been with the city now for almost six years. My boss is Ryan. Nice to meet you, Ryan. Ryan is right. He's here, usually attends the Historic Preservation Board meetings. You guys have not seen me since you have been appointed, so I am not a mystery man. I truly do exist, but I think we have postponed that. The meetings or Ryan has sat in for me due to things that were beyond my control over the last several months. And so I couldn't attend the meeting. So I think, but anyhow, you'll be seeing a lot of me as members of the Historic Preservation Board. Second, I would like you to introduce Sam Onstock. Right? I got your name, I think, on stock. I know Sam is from Texas, the great state of Texas. Lone star of the state. Sam started with us almost a month ago now? Two months ago now. Two months ago now. So she works in the administrative section of the city planning office. I know Sam has a strong interest in historic preservation. So we asked her to attend. So Sam, hopefully in the future, would possibly be able to assist in some historic preservation board functions, activities, or projects that we may be working on. And with that, and with no further ado, Sam Fonstock. And would you like to say anything about yourself, Sam?

Yeah, I guess the one thing was coming from Texas and from Austin. I worked in the historic preservation office there for two years. That's the interest. So I'd like to continue that historic preservation work here as long as possible. Thank you.

All right. Thanks, Sam. Thank you. All right. Next, let's see. I wanted to inform the board that We have been approached by the Historic Neighborhood Partnership. So the Historic Neighborhood Partnership is one of two of our active nonprofits that work directly in the area of historic preservation. So we have Historic Preservation Alliance and the Historic Neighborhood Partnership. They've approached us about... establishing a local landmark designation process into the city code. And so that's different than our historic preservation overlay. So as the board knows and, or doesn't, but you will learn that the only way for us to locally designate something right now is through our historic preservation overlay process, which is, really in fact a rezoning, very similar to if someone was to zone or rezone their property. So this is to establish a process within code that would more efficiently designate individual properties as local landmarks. And if we do those kinds of things, they can then take advantage of the incentive programs that are available through the state and the federal government. So so and we are going to meet with them on August 7th. So that's this Friday and I am assuming that in the near future we will need and we will be. Talking more with the Historic Preservation Board on on this item so. That's that. Number three. We are working with city council staff on appointments of alternates to actual voting members. So we will need at least two, possibly three of our alternates to be moved from their position as alternate to voting members. I'm just waiting to hear back from city council staff on the timing of all of that. But I do know the council um, appointed the alternates so that we would have people that could step in, uh, when it was needed. So just, um, be on the lookout from that. You may be getting an email from a city council staff on a future appointment appointment. Um, the fourth item I wanted to just bring, um, attention to the board is that, um, I guess, possible federal changes to the Section 106 rules. So if those rules would be adopted into effect, they could have some pretty big impacts on Section 106, which is a pretty important tool for historic preservation. So I would just ask board members to check that out. I mean, at this point in time, I would just ask you if upon seeing that and you wanted to participate in the public process, I believe the 30-day public comment period for the rulemaking has begun. Do you know that for sure, Lindsay?

Sure, yeah. So last week, so it had been approved by the ACHP, Then last week it was in other federal offices with a weird acronym. And then it was moving over to OMB. Okay. And then the 30-day period starts.

I'll make sure I find out exactly when that starts. But I think it's probably important that you consider taking a stand and... may want to reach out to City Council to see if they might want to take a position.

I just know there was a really good article in yesterday's Gazette by Bob Levy, who talked all about that. And I'm like, oops, let me throw that at you. Okay, no problem. I thought it was a good summary on it. He actually had something to say at the very end about what to do with it. But it was a really nice, user-friendly breakdown of it. But maybe we can just share that with the board, a link from the Gazette or something.

But yeah, it's... I think I can do that. I think we have someone in our building here. If not, I'll download it and then I'll send you a copy. In fact, I'll just do that today. Okay, yeah, because I can tell you that we don't have a subscription that allows us, but the city does. It's just that we have to get you the right person.

We think you'd have connections. Anyhow. Let's see. I think I have one.

I have a couple more. That was a big one. The next thing I want to ask the board. So this is about our meeting time. Now I have been asked to ask you this question. Would you consider changing the meeting time from 4.30 to either an earlier time so that the board's business could be conducted earlier uh, nine to five, you know, just like the song. Um, and, um, I was going to let you know that the, our, our meeting time at four 30 is we're the only board and or commission in the city that meets, I guess this late in the day and our meetings extend past closing hours. So we've been asked, would we consider that? Um, and if so, what might work best for you? Um, And I don't know if we need an answer today, but we would like for you to think about that and maybe have that. When you say earlier, how much earlier do you mean? Like, for example, I think the Parks Board meets at 7.30 in the morning. Obviously, City Council starts at 9.

Planning Commission starts at 9. There is flexibility. As Bill said, Parks Board starts at 7.30. I just think, and council staff has relayed that this is the only entity that starts so late that almost every meeting has to go past business hours, past 5 p.m., where staff is here into the evening, potentially early evening. Again, I think I agree with Bill. No action today, but something to think about. And we can revisit this next month and see if first thing in the morning, or maybe it's even 4 p.m. I mean, even starting at 4 could help. I don't think many HPV meetings go longer than an hour, hour and a half. It's just something to think about.

No, we usually are fairly quick. We like to have discussions, but on occasion we do have things that take time to go through and as they should, and we want to make sure we are able to do that. But yeah, I would just say please consider the request and whether or not it would work. Into your daily lives because you all work. Um, sometimes getting here at four 30 is, um, tough because if you are a professional, if you also have a nine to five or eight to five job and, um, you know, uh, four 30 may be a very good and workable time for a lot of professionals or even may I say later, but, uh, but, um, the request is to, is, to possibly move it between 99 and fives or between those hours.

My schedule is flexible. Just let me know.

OK, and I'll be here.

Great. Alright, I think I should continue.

I should continue alright so. This is at the request of chair Lowenberg, Chair Loewenberg, since her time on the board, she is not here today, but she has always chaired the Historic Preservation Board and she has requested that she would like to step down this fall. She indicated as early as September. So at our September meeting, one of the things that we would be doing would be appointing a new chair, vice chair for the Historic Preservation Board. And then the last item that I have.

Can I just clarify one thing?

Yeah.

She wants to stay on the board and finish her term and just not be chair. So when Bill said step down, just step down as chair. I just wanted to make sure. I think she's got roughly a year left on her second term, I believe. And she's really busy, yes.

Yeah, she's really busy. Now, the last item is this is the city's webpage. So the city has a webpage. And the planning department has a web page. And the historic preservation board within all of that has a web page. And the web page is, it's in need of some help. And the city has decided that we actually are going to work on updating our web page and the city planning department put a team together to update the page so that would include the historic preservation page um and maybe judy will be happy this um so yes it's taking a long time but we um we are committed so one of the things i would like to ask of the board in next week it would be if you could please take a look at the city web page specifically related to historic preservation and just identify for me things that you think could improve that web page either resources organization um you know missing materials um that would um you know, help support what the purpose of the Historic Preservation Board is, the work that we do. There is one, I have looked at several web pages and maybe in Lindsay's presentation tonight or this afternoon, she might suggest one, but I will suggest one just to take a look at in terms of how the page appears initially and then where it takes you once you press six little tiles. And that's the City of Denver's historic preservation page. I think it functions really well. It takes you to the page. It has like eight tiles and it's pretty much everything that they do. And if you click one, you could see the applications that they're reviewing. If you can click another one, it takes you to all kinds of historic preservation resources and tools. And if we had something like that, it would go a long way to get people to find good information on historic preservation for the city. And so that would just be if you could. And then I would also ask if you could just you could individually just email me that you don't have. We don't have to set up a group email, but if you can take the time to do that, it would be very much appreciated. And. You could kind of poke around to see what the historic preservation program in the city is all about.

Can I make two quick comments? One, and I hear Young's voice in my head, never reply all. We don't want emails with everyone communicating on any item, even if something as benign as the websites. But I would say, Bill, maybe you could send an email out to the board with the link directly to our page, as well as to the Denver page, just so they have those resources. And to avoid confusion, there is a separate page for the Historic Preservation Board. I don't think that's what Bill's asking for guidance on. We want input on the Historic Preservation website, which is that page.

But you will find that those two pages make things confusing. So just a little very boring. Yes.

It's also like a mystery other page where you can see all the design guidelines and stuff. I saw it and then I couldn't figure out how to get back to it.

Right. If you don't know what you're looking for, just Google it and you'll find something about the historic preservation program that you didn't know we had. Judy?

I, yeah, I have a couple of comments. First of all, um, going back to our meeting time, I think you should send out, uh, something, uh, so that we can get this nailed down as soon as possible, but, uh, time change because, uh, we're going to, it would be important for anybody we would be recruiting to the board, uh, And also as we're dealing with this web page and everything else, we should just get that taken care of as quickly as possible. So that was, that's just what I, you know, how I felt. And the other thing is on the agenda, somehow it got lost. We started for a couple of times and then it stopped having a section for comments by board members. And I'd like that added back onto the agenda next month.

Yeah, it is on there, Judy. We just haven't.

I missed it then.

It's just after me and I just have continued to run on. Oh, okay.

I see it now. Okay. Thank you.

My apologies for that. So you give me a TV camera and I'll talk forever. So.

Quick question about the web page. Are there a lot of funds to do a deep dive change, or is this just like a paint job? It's internal. Just like shift things around, kind of maybe a button here. Okay. So no big redesign.

You're right. You're right. We have to fit in. We're going to have to fit into the design of the web page that we have. Yeah. But I think we have some capabilities to do it differently because obviously we have tiles that work in other places. And I think we can organize it. But it is only going to be, I think, as fancy as what we do right now. I don't think it's a full-scale redesign. Don't dream big. Just make it. Yeah, how to make it better. How it could be better structured. what kinds of if we're if we are offering certain kinds of information materials um are those okay and or could those be improved i got the impression you were talking you said that the city had created a team to do all of this website stuff yeah i think there's um so they should probably know so um i can we'll we'll be learning more um as we go along because i don't know all of the details but i do know that in our department we have They've asked the department to perform a web team, and that's been done. And that web team is now reaching out to each of the divisions within our department to work on those specific areas of city planning, one of them being historic preservation. We're also doing urban planning. They're doing the land use review section. So at least we have that kind of structure. So to me, that means... We've got more commitment than we have had on making changes to the website to improve it so. And.

Sure, don't think I think that concludes. One last communication on behalf of salons. Just a reminder when you get the agenda to reply and confirm whether you are attending and whether you'll be in person or via teams. And that's a reply all? No, just reply to Solange. She'll be sending out the agenda and you can just hit reply to Solange so we can be sure we have a quorum. I think that's all the communications from staff.

Okay, so how about open it up to any board members? We already heard from Judith. If there's anybody, any other board members that would like to come? Judy, do you want to comment again?

Yeah, I just wanted to give you an update on historic Mesa Road. History Colorado denied our request to put it on the state and national register to fill out the application. So what we are going to do instead, we're going to stay active. And I was very happy to hear about the landmarks because I think that's what we're going to be mostly trying to do once that's taken care of is to get landmarks because we have at least 20 different situations of either people, places, or events that have taken place along Mesa Road, most of them more than 50 years ago. Thank you.

Okay, thank you, Judith. Any other board members? Could you go in a little more about the landmark thing? You said be written in the zoning code. Why would it be needed in the zoning code to have monuments or something if it doesn't impact the zoning?

Just so that's where we've placed all of the historic preservation ordinance information. It's been over the years been enveloped into the now into the uniform development code. It was all in Chapter 7. And since city planning and since the historic preservation board has been part of the land use and development code, at least at this point in time, that's where we think it should probably rest, but there has been no decisions about it. It could be a standalone historic preservation ordinance, but at this point in time, In discussion only at this point in time.

Probably wouldn't be in the overlay section like all our current HPV stuff is, but it would probably have to go somewhere in order to have the weight that I think everyone wants it to have.

What weight would it have just besides getting funding from federal or state, having it designated to get that? What other weight would it have at the city level?

Well, it alterations and changes could come to historic preservation board for, you know, if they wanted to add to, or they wanted to demo a landmark or, but we wouldn't have a say in it.

Yeah.

Yes.

Potentially. We amended our code. We're in early stages. They're doing, they've done lots of research. We need to meet with them. We need to meet with city attorney's office and figure out how to proceed.

I mean, I will just say it. I mean, it is something that's in the preservation plan. to look at having a landmarking component in our historic preservation ordinance. And then there's also in the comprehensive plan of the city. And then when we adopted the uniform, the unified development code, there was language or commitments that the city would look at revisions or updates to the historic preservation ordinance that we've had in place since like the 1980s now. So it's probably time to look at whether or not that ordinance could do a better job in promoting, supporting historic preservation in the city. Or incentivizing too. Yeah.

Any other board member comments? Okay, that concludes items for agenda three, item three. All right, move to item four, approval of the minutes. So item 4A, HPB 2321, approving the minutes for May 5th, 2026, historic preservation forward meeting. Will it matter if some of us weren't?

part of that. That's a good notion, city attorney's office. If you were not physically attending that meeting, then the minutes are four. You have to abstain. Physically attending, like not even including. Okay, if you attended the meeting. I just made sure. If you were not at the meeting, you would have to abstain. Yeah, okay. Judy?

I move we table these minutes until the next meeting.

Is there a second? Second. It's been moved and seconded to table the May 5th meetings. We just need a vote. All right. We need a vote.

Okay. All those in favor. Can it be a voice vote or is it a personal by person vote? Oh, God, you're right.

We'll do a roll call, please.

Board Member Beerbaum. Yes. Board Member McKinnell.

Aye.

Board Member Fitzsimmons.

Aye.

Board Member Baumgartner. Aye. Thank you. The motion passes.

Do I need to say anything? Nope. Okay. All right. So item four, BHPB 2322, approving the minutes for June 1st, 2026. Historic Preservation Board meeting. Do I have a motion to approve these minutes?

I so move that we table the minutes for the June 1st, 2026 meeting.

Is this so that we get certain people here? Because I was there. You were online, weren't you?

I have a question. Are there still enough members on the board that actually were at either of these meetings?

I think we've got four, including you, Judith, right?

That attended the meetings?

Yeah. Is that a quorum then? Four is our quorum? Four is our quorum. Okay. So then we can go ahead and vote on that? All right. Yeah.

So if Matt, Chip, and Judy were in attendance. And Shannon.

Is Shannon not on the board anymore?

Was a voting member that day? Or just yelled at? You're right. We figured it out.

We got it, lawyer. If she was in attendance and she has now been updated to a voting member for the purposes of this meeting to meet that quorum, you guys have enough to vote on the minutes. The quorum is your quorum, but you have three that will

We're in attendance.

Yeah, you could vote to approve these minutes if you would like. Okay. Is there a motion to vote to approve these minutes for June 1st, 2026? Second. Yes. Second. Yes. Okay. It's been moved and seconded to approve the minutes for June 1st, 2026.

And just to confirm, we got Board Member Fitzsimmons to motion and then Board Member Baumgartner, right? Second. Thank you.

So we're voting to approve now. Board Member Birbaum.

Yes. Board Member McKinnell.

Aye.

Board Member Fitzsimmons. Aye. And Board Member Bumgarner. Aye. Thank you. The motion passes.

May will never be approved. It seems that way.

All right. All right. That concludes item four. We're good? Okay. Moving on to agenda item five. This is the consent one which was so no consent calendar items. OK, so move pass. There are no consent calendar items, OK?

Alright, so items called off consent.

That's we skipping that too.

Yes, yes, thank you alright.

Okay, item number seven, unfinished business. There is no unfinished business. Is that still the case? Okay, moving on. Okay, eight, new business. Now we have 8A-HIST-26-0006. This is for the Griego Residence Front Portico Edition.

Does she read the whole thing? She can. So we'll have, oh, come on, read the item into the record. Okay. Thank you so much. If you hear the item.

Item 8A, HIST-26-0006, a report of acceptability for a new 60 square feet front portico addition at the primary entrance of the existing residence located at 10 West Buenaventura Street. And our presenter is Bill Gurney.

All right. Okay, so- Shrunken.

Shrunken, yeah, all right. This application, as Solange has stated, is the addition of a real portico to the front of elevation of an existing Georgian architectural home in the old north end. Let me just share my screen. All right, so here is, it's behind me. All right, so here, this is the existing hall. As you can see, the front entrance has a stoop and it has what I would interpret as kind of a faux portico. So like when they built this, they meant to have a portico, but they really didn't have one. The home, as you can see, it's mainly brick, and the main entrance is framed with wood, a wooden door, kind of a faux gable roof over the entryway, and the plans are to put an actual portico. The portico is around 60 square feet, so it is essentially the size of the landing of the front stoop. The portico is designed so that it really matches this portico here. So this faux portico, I'll say, is, you know, it's wood. They're are asphalt shaped shingles here that match the roof color. So it's the intent that this portico would incorporate the same wood materials in the column and the roof structure that exists today. So it would visually match what is there. This in staff's review of This application, we found that it met the criteria for approval of a report acceptability. It doesn't alter any significant feature, architectural feature of the existing home. I would say that it actually enhances the architecture. It adds a significant feature, architectural feature to this home that may have, should have been there to begin with. and it meets the design guidelines for the old North End. So we made a finding that it met all of the applicable criteria for the board's approval. And I guess I would just ask the applicant if you would like to make any additional comments comments specific to the question on the materials colors being used to make the front portico fit onto the front of this Georgian hole in the Old North End.

So as Bill said, we're using what we call cement board or wood to match the existing and we're painting it white to also match the existing big stoop that they have um and then we do have to add two uh structural walls on the sides so we're extending the porch a little bit um and we're trying to currently find a brick that matches the existing um where we have colors that match but the only problem right now is the texture of it because it's so old that they don't make it anymore wasn't this a 1985 house yeah yeah

Yeah, so I'm not... May I just say one thing? Avery, could you please introduce yourself? Excuse me.

My name is Avery Tomczyk. I work for Compass Architecture, and I'm representing the owners of the house. Yeah, so the contractor currently can't find a brick that matches the exact texture of it, but we have exact color match. But we can also try to use the current brick that's on the outside of the side faces of the current stoop.

borrow those bricks.

Yeah, yeah. So this is a little tricky. So we're going to try our best to at least match the color. And it looks like from the current porch that there was some alterations made. So somebody found brick at some point to match existing. So, yeah. But otherwise, yeah, it's just the white painted wood for the portico and then hopefully brick to match existing.

I was just... Made and presented. Because I'm worried about the, a lot of people do these things with bad quality materials and within five years that you see the wood peeling and paint peeling and you're like, they did not use the right materials. Right. And just wanted to make sure that that is being thought about.

Yes, definitely. And the contractor we're using has done quite a few houses in the Old North End, I think, and we're pretty confident that they'll be able to find good quality materials. Yeah. Fingers crossed.

Bill, since this is a 1985 non contributing structure. I feel it's a gray area that we have to approve something that's not contributing. Can you explain why would we do that? I know it's in the overlay.

Yeah, the only reason that we're doing it is because the home is in the overlay. And so we would apply the same Do we apply the criteria the same way to this home as we would one that was built in 1900? And we use the design guidelines to support that review and decision.

So if a house was built last year and they wanted something like this. Exactly.

So this would have been the same as when the board considered the construction of a brand new home. that was on Del Norte was a Tudor style home. But we utilize the same criteria for deciding the same criteria for deciding that home and use the design guidelines. And so we would have just, you know, in that case, it was is A Tudor style home and architectural style that's found in this historic district. It was does it have a negative negative or positive impact on or how does it affect the historic overall historic character of the historic district? And then we would have just used the design guidelines based on the section of. Section where it's located within the North. the north end to further our review and decision on that new home. So the same here, it's just, this is a Georgian style home. Those styles are predominant or there's many Georgian style homes in the old north end. And does this alteration have an impact on existing architectural features you know, of the home and then does it comply with the design guidelines? And so in this case, yeah, we found that it was a good fit. I agree. I think that's awesome. I just wanted to ask about the materials. Yeah, so just the, anything that's in a historic preservation overlay has to get a report that needs to be reviewed by the board. And if the board reviews it, its decision is done through what's called a report of acceptability. So is the improvement acceptable or not? And there's two main decision points about whether or not it comes to the board. Does it need a building permit? And is it visible from a public right away? And the public right away could be a street or an alley. So the board knows that we've taken a fairly conservative viewpoint on this. I mean, you can see it even if it's obscured through trees or if you can stand in the right-of-way, you can physically see that historical home on the property. We've been bringing all major and minor work to the board for a report of acceptability so we don't have to get into... The whole discussion of, well, you know, there's a seven-foot fence and a 30-foot tall tree and there are all of these other features. We've just tried to say, all right, if you're on a street or an alley and we can see that historic structure, then we've taken the position that it needs a report of acceptability because it kind of cuts out some potential nonsense. Interesting.

We need a motion.

Any other questions? Any other comments? Yeah, any other comments? Anybody online? Any public comments available?

I do not. The only person online right now is Judy and Nicole. Okay. All right.

Well, seeing none, hearing none.

Yeah.

Right, so the motion one is if the board finds that it meets the criteria, that's the motion for approval. If you feel differently, the motion to deny is the second motion. So do I don't. So someone's got to make that motion. Yes, you could just call.

OK, so you could just call for the motion. So I'm calling for the motion on approval or denial of HIST 260006.

After reviewing the plans, I think they were well done and well iterated throughout the plans. I make a motion to approve.

There's been a motion made to approve. Is there a second for that? Second. Second is so called. So now we'll vote on the motion to approve HIST 260006 for the Griego Residence Front Portico Edition. Do I need to say anything else? No, we could just ask Salon for a roll call vote.

Thank you, Salon.

I'm going to agree with them. Yes. Remember my county. I remember Fitzsimmons. I remember Baumgartner. Thank you. The motion passes unanimously.

And that closes. No.

Closes new business, but we're still in presentations updates because now we're so I'm just going to have you do one more thing is if you'll just read the appeal instructions for the record.

Okay, appeal instructions for the record. In accordance with the requirements of Section 7-5, excuse me, 7.5.415 of the City Unified Development Code, an affected party may appeal to the City Council any action of the Historic Preservation Board in relation to City Code where the action was averse to that person. Within 10 days from final action on the item being appealed, which is Thursday, August 13, 2026, The appellant must file notice of appeal and pay the $176 fee with the city clerk. The appeal letter should address specific city code requirements that were not adequately addressed by the Historic Preservation Board. City Council may elect to limit discussion at the appeal hearing to the specific matters set forth in the appeal letter.

I just recognized one, let's go back.

You could just recognize Lindsay. I could just add on.

We'd like to recognize Lindsay Llewellyn, Preservation Planner of History, Colorado.

Thanks everybody for having me. I was last here in October and I think at that point there was some desire to have a training then and then when I was talking to Bill there were a lot of new members so it seemed like a really good time to come down and I do the training. So this is sort of a local preservation 101. And then I added a bunch of examples of like outreach and engagement type projects at the end to see if there are any that you guys might be interested in implementing, or I always think, you know, don't reinvent the wheel. So you can sort of copy other local governments if there's anything that seems appealing and then I can send over examples to build a share with you as well. So yeah, just starting off. What is historic preservation? It's the study, documentation, designation, protection, and physical preservation of buildings, structures, which are for non-human habitation, sites, generally archaeological sites, but it could be things like farms and ranches as well. Objects, those are things like statues. We've designated murals as objects before, so artworks, things like that. and then districts, which are collections of all of those different types of resources. Next. Why would you want to preserve? It really depends on what works best for your local community and what you're trying to achieve, but we find that it helps to increase community identity and pride. It can help to reduce landfill waste by reusing the building instead of building new. It helps to revitalize downtowns. and can lead to heritage tourism. It also generates jobs. So generally, if you're building or if you're rehabilitating a historic structure that has more skilled jobs that it takes than new construction, can help to increase property values in historic areas, support small businesses since they can use generally smaller spaces that already exist. and creates affordable housing because again, you're just reusing spaces that already exist. And often the square footage is a little smaller so that it helps to keep the cost down as well. So our federal historic preservation structure was set out by the National Historic Preservation Act in 1966. That created state historic preservation offices in every state and established the National Register of Historic Places It formally established the National Historic Landmark Program, but it actually existed since the 1930s in an informal way. And then also established a review of federal projects, which, like Bill was saying earlier, is the Section 106 process. And then the program or the National Historic Preservation Act was amended in 1980 to add the Certified Local Government Program so that we have a local level to our federal preservation structure. So here is what the structure looks like at the federal level. Our partners are the National Park Service. At the state level is the State Historic Preservation Office, which is History Colorado. And we also call it the Office of Archeology and Historic Preservation. All those things are the same thing. And then at the local level, you'll have your Municipal Historic Preservation Board. And then all of those levels also usually have a nonprofit that helps to advocate for historic preservation. So at the federal level, we have the National Trust for Historic Preservation. At the state level, we have Colorado Preservation Inc. And there's another statewide nonprofit, Colorado Historical Foundation. And then there's often local historical societies or local preservation advocacy groups. And I was going to say, so at the State Historic Preservation Office, we carry out federal programs at the state level. So the Certified Local Government Program, you know, there's like 49 others of me throughout the country. So every state has a CLG coordinator. And then you have the national and state register staff. You have staff members carrying out the federal and state tax credit programs. Then you have the Section 106 compliance team. They also carry out compliance with the State Register Act. And they are the ones that are being the liaisons with different federal agencies and also making sure that the state has its ability to comment on different federal projects. We have an information management team. They keep a very large database of all of the cultural resources that we know about throughout the state, the Office of the State Archaeologist, and then sort of adjacent to that like sort of federal program function, we have the State Historical Fund, which is just a really great resource that we're super lucky to have in Colorado. I think we'll touch on that in a few minutes too. So for the Certified Local Government Program, it's a local partnership program where the local government is partnering with the National Park Service at the federal level and the State Historic Preservation Office at the state level. And essentially your local preservation program is certified as meeting federal and state parameters for preservation programs overall. Colorado Springs has been a CLG since 1994, so pretty long time. There's currently 70 CLGs in Colorado. We added three in the past year, which was super exciting for me. But those are Rangeley, Silverton, and Inglewood. So very different from each other, which is pretty neat. And then there's about 2,100 nationwide. Our program is pretty robust for a state of our population size. The biggest benefits are specific certified local government grants. So our office gets funding from the Federal Historic Preservation Fund. And because we're carrying out federal programs at the state level, And 10% of those funds are required to be sub-granted to the CLGs. So we offer those as grants each year, usually due in January or February. We are able to offer no match grants to the CLGs and those cover things like preservation plans, surveys and survey plans, design guidelines, education and outreach projects, things that specifically benefit your local preservation program. So hopefully we'll have an application out for those in October or November. But we're, because of the federal granting landscape, kind of waiting to see what the timing looks like for the upcoming year. The National Park Service also offers specific historic preservation grants that CLGs are eligible to apply for. Those are offered periodically throughout the year. They just, in July, had all of their program grants due within like six weeks of each other. But I was told that more will be opened up this fall, but we'll see if their staff has the capacity to do even more grants. So keep an eye out for those. And then another big one is that your locally designated properties and any contributing properties in local historic districts are eligible for our state residential and commercial tax credits. So once you do have, well, if you have your local historic districts like the Old North End and the which I can't remember.

Parkside.

Yes, thank you. Parkside. So properties in those, if they aren't already on the National Register, would be eligible for state residential and commercial tax credits. But if you have your individual landmarks programmed, then they would be eligible for the tax credits as well.

And then, of course, yes, support from the State Historic Preservation Office.

So feel free to reach out to us anytime. And I Um, and happy to answer any questions or to connect you with the right people. Um, if I don't know the answer. Okay. So more, uh, sort of preservation one-on-one, but, uh, the most important part of your preservation program to know about is, uh, your own local preservation ordinance. So that's the backbone of your preservation program. Um, it's really important to know your ordinance and to have read through, um, the different sections of your code related to historic preservation. That tells you the powers and the duties of the CERT Preservation Board, and it outlines the relationship of your board with other groups in the city, like city council. So always encourage people if they haven't read it recently, it's really not that long. So it's great to be able to know what's in that, and then you'll know the proper procedures for different things, and also what power you actually have. Next, just talking a little bit about historic preservation for decision-making. So any bylaws that you have in place and your ordinance establish the role of the HPV and the processes and criteria for designation and design review. These documents should be the basis for all of your actions. Procedures should be clearly laid out to ensure consistency in your decision-making and so that everyone knows what to expect. So not only the staff and the board are on the same page, but any applicants and members of the public also know what's going to happen at your meetings. And that's why you have an attorney present to make sure you're like actually following the correct procedures. The actions that you take should be recorded for future reference and you should have a clear decision making record in your meeting minutes and your agenda packet. You should be making sure that meetings are open to the public and the public has a chance to participate and that you're following all applicable open meetings laws. And then the other things to keep in mind are ex parte communications, which is when you're potentially talking to applicants outside of the meeting. If you do that, it's obviously not recommended, but you should basically direct them to staff if they have questions about historic preservation. That way you're not indicating if you're going to give a decision one way or the other on a particular case. And then conflicts of interest should also be declared if you have especially a financial interest in a project and just making sure that you're transparent in any interactions that you've had with members of the public or the property owners over different projects. Your various guiding documents and the Secretary of the Interior's standards are the basis of how meetings are to be conducted and how decisions should be made. It's really important to stay within your own board's purview and not try to make decisions based on things that are outside of the purview. What I see the most is people on historic preservation commissions often are super curious about future use of the property. That's not really something that the historic preservation board has any decision-making power over. The only thing would be if the future use has some kind of impact on the exterior design of a property.

Can I ask a question? Yeah. So does that pertain to mixed-use buildings as well?

Yes, yeah. So I think, you know, you can have a general idea of what the use would be, but there shouldn't be, like, a lot of questions about, like, exactly what they're going to be doing with the property as far as interior, like, use of the space.

So if they altered the interior, we're just concerned with the exterior then?

Yeah, well, you should follow your own design guidelines. So sometimes it's different for different local governments. Like once in a while in certain local governments, they'll say like if you can see into the first 10 feet of the storefront or something, then there might be guidelines for that. But generally speaking, it's just the exterior of the property.

All right, thank you.

Remember that the applicant is there to produce a desired result. So analyze their various assertions carefully. They want you to say yes to them. So you don't want to not take them at their word, but also make sure that they're being logical and make sense as far as your board's decision making. And then you should always be able to point to the applicable standards and guidelines for each decision that you're making. Next.

I was thinking about something else.

Next is procedural due process. So historic preservation commissions generally are quasi judicial boards. So their decisions and conducts have the landmarks of a court case. Essentially, what you're deciding is an issue of the law. You're determining if what the property owner proposes is within the bounds of the codes or guidelines that you've adopted. Due process includes the right to be notified, present an argument, have legal counsel, and cross-examine witnesses. In this context, it's important for the chair to always maintain control and decorum of the meeting, treat people equally, and allow relevant public comments. Decisions should be based on what happens in the hearing and evidence and testimony presented, not personal bias or outside conversations that you might have had about the particular case. Think about the precedents that you've had in your decision-making. In historic preservation, each building is really considered its own separate case, so you don't necessarily have to follow an exact precedent if it doesn't make sense for that particular building, but you should have a clear explanation and reasoning if you're differing from precedent that has taken place um so you know i think one thing that comes up is like how big of an addition is too big for a certain property but you know it's placement on the lot or if it's a corner lot versus a interior lot can really change how an addition is perceived so you can't say that like you know 30 of the square footage is always right every time stuff like that so make sure you're relating any findings of your decision of the case back to the code and apply that to the facts of the case and make sure any decisions are recorded. And I think, so the last point on there was avoid any appearance of being arbitrary or capricious. I had one, um, One example where a board member would say that they hated the color red whenever somebody wanted to paint something red. And I don't think that that really affected their actual decision on different projects, but it just makes it seem like they're making a decision based on personally hating the color red. So just be careful about your wording and being casual about how you're talking about different projects. So beyond that, after you get past the ordinance and how your meetings are structured and decision-making is structured, we have these different elements of local preservation programs. So survey is the ongoing process of locating and describing cultural resources. Designation is recognition and protection of historic properties through listing on the local register. Design review is a review of alterations, relocation, and demolition of properties. Incentives, those can be offered at local, state, and federal level. It could be financial incentives to go through rehabilitation or to preserve a property. And then there's also non-financial incentives as well that you can consider. And then advocacy and public education, that helps you really build a local preservation ethics so that people get excited about local history and appreciate the different parts of their local communities. So the first one is survey. Obviously you guys just went through the survey plan process, but this is a documentation of your cultural resources and the basis for all of your other preservation activities. Essentially, you have to know what you have in order to preserve what you have. There's different survey types. So reconnaissance is just sort of a very basic overview of the property and capturing what it looks like now. Intensive level forms go way more in depth onto the construction history, of the property. So like what changes have been made over time. And then also the history of the use of the property. So it'll talk about if it's a residential property, the consultant should be going in depth into who's lived there over time and looking at census records and, you know, did their name show up in the newspaper in the past, like doing different things in town, things like that. If it's a commercial property, you know, what different businesses were in there over time. So intensive level forms give you way more detail than reconnaissance forms. And then there's archaeological survey, which was previously stated. I can't really describe myself, but there's different levels of archaeological survey as well for more intensive or less intensive to more intensive. For different methodologies, there's comprehensive survey, which is when you're essentially surveying all the properties in a geographical area. Or you can do selective survey. Those can be based on Let's say you just want to survey all the properties that were constructed before 1900 or all of the schools in town or all the government buildings. So you're just like selecting based on particular criteria that you decide on. Along with survey, you'll have a historic context study, which you also had as part of your survey plan. But when you do an individual survey, it usually goes more in depth into that neighborhood's history or like if it's a school survey, it would go way more in depth onto the history of schools in the local area. And those are essentially tying the history of an area to the built environment. So, you know, this happened in this era and these were the properties that were constructed as sort of along with that or in response to that. Additional tools that a historic preservation could have are historic preservation plans and survey plans, both of which you guys have. So those are things to help guide your preservation program and to build on in the future and then Helpfully also use those for any grant applications. So it shows that you've already had public engagement on this. You've already gone through this big process with the preservation board. So definitely if you're applying for any grants, copy the applicable page into the grant application to show that the project already has support. Next is designation. So we have the National Register of Historic Places, State Register of Historic Properties, and then local designation. The only level that offers any regulatory aspects or level of protection is the local level. So that means that local preservation boards are super important in saving historic properties. If you get federal or state funding for different things, that can help. limit what people can do with the properties, but at the local levels where the regulatory aspect comes in, that's generally based on what works best for your local community and what level of regulation you have in place. Designation is generally based on significance and integrity, which I'll talk about in the next slide. The criteria are in your ordinance. And then for historic districts, usually you have buildings set out that are contributing or non-contributing. If you're going to create a new district, there's usually criteria in your ordinance for what percentage of owners have to agree to create the district or what percentage can't disagree. And then for certified local governments, opt-out isn't allowed. So that essentially means you're creating a district and then let the property owners decide if they want to participate, which is not allowed. As I was saying, the designation is based on significance, which is what makes the property important in history. Why are we recognizing this property? What happened there? Is it associated with different events or cultural trends? Is it associated with a specific important individual and their working life or whatever they were important for? And then is it important for its architecture or its engineering values? Is it important for its archaeological aspects? And then at the state register, we also have a geographic criteria. So is it like a major visual landmark that lets you know that you're in this town? Like the Palmer Lake stars on the state register and the Rabbit Ears Motel sign in Steamboat Springs that essentially lets you know you're in Steamboat Springs when you see it. And then integrity is the ability of the property to convey that significance so it you know, if you were somebody who was alive during the heyday of this property, would you still recognize it today in its current state? So it shouldn't be confused with condition of the property. You can have a property that's in terrible condition, but that often means it has better integrity because nobody changed it over time.

Next is a design review.

we go so this is required for each CLG in Colorado so if you do put in a local a separate individual landmark process you still have to have some form of design review over those those properties that's based on your own local ordinance for CLGs even though you have to have design review compliance can be either mandatory or voluntary so you guys have a mandatory system right now where property owners have to listen to you and follow your decisions before they can get a building permit if they're designated. Some CLGs have a voluntary system where the property owner has to come to the Historic Preservation Board, but they can still get a building permit even if they don't listen to them, which can cause some issues, but it's really what works best for each local government. All design review has to be consistent with the Secretary of Interior Standards Generally, the standards for rehabilitation, but CLGs can also have their own design guidelines, which are usually way more specific and help you make decisions more easily and be more consistent. The standards for rehabilitation, there's only 10 standards, and those have to apply to every single type of property in the country. They're very general, so it's nice to have specific design guidelines. The next area for local preservation is incentives. Local governments can adopt their own incentives and there's a varied adoption across the state for different local governments, but I've listed a few here. Some of them are things you would have to adopt through the city budget, which I think is very difficult for cities currently across the state. Like I know a lot of our State local government grant programs are kind of paused right now because people are having so many issues with local budgets. But there are also things you can do that theoretically don't cost money against the state, against the local budget, like exemptions and variances in your zoning code or offering technical assistance and things like that. At the state and federal level, we have the state preservation tax credits, the state historical fund, both of which I'll talk about with a couple of examples in a second. There's also a revolving low interest loan fund that the Colorado Historical Foundation operates. And then there's the federal tax credits, which are for income generating properties on the national register. They're a 20% tax credit fund. Yeah, just going in to tax credits a little bit more. Our state residential tax credit is for private property owners who have their own private residence. It doesn't have to be their primary residence, but it can't be like a rented out property. The tax credit amount is 20% of the qualified rehabilitation expenditures with a cap of $100,000 back in credits. And then the big change is That's starting on January 1st of next year. Any projects that are completed after that date, the tax credit amount is just refundable to the taxpayer. So they'll get it back in a check at tax time, which is awesome. Way better than the previous system, which now you don't even need to know about. So that's great. So they could do their work on the property. If they meet the cap of $100,000, the state will write them a check for $100,000 in tax credits at tax time. And the minimum expenditure is only $5,000, which is basically any work that anybody does on their residential properties. The two examples here, the top one is in Fort Morgan. This is actually a property on the National Register. It's a little four-house historic district there, and they were able to get They did two phases of work and they were able to get, I think, $25,000 for stucco repair and rehabilitation on that property. And then the bottom one is in Louisville. It was actually a church conversion into a residence. So they were able to get tax credits to be able to upgrade the property to meet all the code requirements to turn a church into a residence. And the interior is amazing, like this big wooden ceiling and stuff that they're able to rehabilitate. as well and they did the maximum amount of those tax credits at the time on that property. There's a ton of great residential tax credit projects in Colorado Springs. So if anybody's wondering, I'm sure there's different people in the old North end and that would be great contacts. And then the commercial tax credits. So these are between 20 and 25% of their rehabilitation expenditures with the cap of a million dollars. they have to be income generating properties that are either owned by private owners or nonprofits and they can be sold. So if you don't have a million dollars in income tax liability, you can sell off the credits and get money back that way. Qualified rehabilitation expenditures can be fairly broad. So it can include exterior work, like work on the foundation, siding, roofing, windows, and then also interior work. As long as you're, you can change some things, but like keeping in mind the historic spaces of the property, but it also includes mechanical systems, plumbing and things like that as well. So making the property usable for the modern day. And this example is in Idaho Springs. So they did both interior and exterior work for tax credits on that property. And I had the next ones are some quick examples for the State Historical Fund. So they say we've got this great state tax credit program and then the State Historical Fund, they give out about $12 million in grants each year. Their first pool of money is for non-competitive grants that have these different categories that you can see in the presentation for up to $20,000. Um, some examples are archeological assessment. It's a picture of showing up the rock shelter and then, uh, um, construction documents for the handball court there in grand junction. Um, so those are non-competitive and just awarded on a rolling basis throughout the year. Um, but then their biggest amount of money is the next one. So that goes to competitive grants. They have, um, grants that cover construction. And then also planning documents for construction. They also cover anything that a CLG grant covers. So like for your local preservation commission, they could cover surveys, education outreach projects, design guidelines, updates, things like that. Archaeology projects and other education projects. So those are up to $250,000 and their deadlines are April 1st and October 1st each year. And the examples here are this building in Steamboat Springs that had a car run into it. So they actually got an emergency grant to stabilize that corner that the car ran into. And then got a general grant to be able to actually fix that part of the building, which they're doing currently. And then interpretive signage at the MACHE internment camp. So the last category is advocacy and public education. So I pulled a bunch of examples from other local governments here. So this slide, the theme is walking tours, but you can think about those in different ways. So you have your traditional walking tours that might help drive heritage tourism or just help people know more about the history of their local area. So the examples here, Loveland has that really cool sort of modern designed walking tour. I can't remember who the other one in the top corner is from. Those are kind of similar. And then the one on the bottom right is from Yuma. They actually do, um, the cloud walking tour, but they actually like, uh, drive people around in a tractor, like with the, uh, little, uh, trailer in the back, which I think is awesome. Um, and they pick a theme each year. So they've done like, um, well like downtown and we've done church buildings and, and, um, different themes each year where they go around and do presentations at, um, So they'll have like one person from the Historic Preservation Commission stationed at each building to give a little presentation about the building, which I think is really great. They get a lot of people for a town the size of Yuma to come out to these events. And then the one that sort of in the foreground there is from the city of golden, so what they were doing is not a traditional walking tour. They were actually targeting residents of different historic neighborhoods to find out what they value about their neighborhoods architecture and character. To help to inform their historic preservation planning process. And it actually works great. I mean, they said that they got 20 to 30 people at each of these walking tours, like just residents coming in. They only advertised it in that local neighborhood. So they weren't getting like random tourists who are interested. And they were able to go and look at the individual properties in the neighborhood and draw out the different architectural characteristics and other features of the neighborhood that are important to that community. And then also find out about like what people don't care about. So there's different ways you can use walking tours to basically help your preservation program. And some of them involve you being there in person and actively participating, and some are more like you produce a written document or a podcast, things like that, where you're not having to actively go out all the time. This next category is basically like printed materials. So different local governments have produced these over time. The one in the top left is a property owner outreach letter from Longmont. So they mailed this letter to every contributing property and individual landmark in the town to let them know about historic tax credits and state historical fund grants. And she said she got like five property owners responding, asking for tax credits. So I felt like that was pretty good from one mailing. but also just like letting people know that their property is historic, like reminding them that it's on the local register is really important. So that's great. The next one is a historic preservation toolkit from the town of Windsor. That also talks about like the local preservation commission's processes and, you know, how to landmark your property and then what incentives are available. Very similar to the birthed owner's manual that's next to that. And then Lions did this, trifold brochure. They're actually doing a CLG grant for printing and photos for that right now. So similar where they were just trying to get people interested in designation. And along with that, they also did door hangers for properties that they knew were of the correct age. So like 50 years or older, which actually worked super well. We did an outreach meeting up there that had a good attendance. And then the final card is from Denver. They send these out, I think, once a year to every designated property in town, which is quite a bit, just like reminding people that they're on the local register and that they need to follow the correct procedures if they're making any alterations to their property. then the final slide was sort of a wild card um different things that you could think about um i think uh one big thing that people do is um participating in different um town or city events um and thinking about like if you could have a historic preservation board table at different events um and really trying to capture the attention of people where they're already going so you don't have to necessarily like try to get people to come here to a historic preservation board meeting because like, who actually does that? But, you know, going to where people are and having some kind of hook to, like, draw them into your table, like having walking tour materials or, well, one thing, Bertha just did their historic preservation plan, and they had people, like, drop marbles in jars about what they felt like was most important about the historic character. or just the history overall of Berthoud. And apparently people just love to drop things and join. They had like 300 responses to these marble dropping activities. So I think people just like to do something. So coming up with ways for people to interact with your table is really great. But here's some other ideas. So Berthoud, I think, was copying Loveland and came up with these coasters that they've... They basically convinced all the breweries in town to have these coasters out at their tables. So on one side is a historic picture of the building. And then I think the current picture on the other side and a little history of it with their QR code. The sign is from Castle Rocks, their latest sign from Historic Preservation Month, which was in May. So they're just pointing out which historic buildings are around town, which is really great. You can also do workshops. That's a great use of CLG grant funding. So Adobe Workshop might not work in Colorado Springs, but you could do window workshops or siding repair or whatever you think might be useful for your property owners. You can hire a consultant to come in and do something like that. Another sort of popular thing for people to do are putting together coloring books of historic structures. And then this is actually a coloring contest in Buena Vista that they run every May for Historic Preservation Month in conjunction with the school there. And then Crested Butte puts on this cook-off from a historic cookbook that they had from like the 1920s. So they get people to cook different recipes from that each year and then have a historic preservation event associated with that. So I think there's just really great ideas out there thinking about what... what draws people out in your local community and, you know, just like fun or quirky things that you can celebrate as part of the local history. Yeah, and then the last slide is just my contact information. And I'm always happy to be a resource for you guys. And like I said, if something sounds interesting from another local government, no need to reinvent the wheel. I'm happy to send what they've done and you can see how it will work for your own program.

any of those look good yeah no they are i think well i asked lindsey to kind of focus on that because we always one of the things i feel like we always talk about what do we do other than uh approve reports of acceptability in the old north end sometimes it's you know you don't always get super excited about that and one of the purposes that in our Historic Preservation Code was advocacy education. So how do you get people excited about it? How do you create more an ethic that's alive and breathing in your community about historic preservation? And I think these are the ways to do it. And I thought it would just be helpful to see what others are doing from the simplest of ideas. you know, that, that just kind of do that without having to spend, you know, a lot of money and time. And I think those are always the other things we always talk about. It's, you know, we're volunteer board. Um, we don't have a full-time preservation department, uh, for the city. Um, so being able to kind of think out of the box and I think a lot of these, you know, smaller towns, um, cities, counties across the state probably have really great ideas because they face the same thing. And I think these are the kind of things that really do help with historic preservation. And I think the more you do them, probably they start to have a cumulative impact.

People know that you exist.

If they know we exist, maybe that leads us down the road to those bigger things. So I thought that this would help not just this presentation and help us get just a broad understanding of historic preservation, but also a way where we can support some of our other functions and purposes. And if you have any questions of Lindsay, she's here. I was going to add to this, but I was going to not because it's 10 after 6. And but I do have for the board our historic preservation ordinance, our preservation plan, our historic resources, surveying context plan, some rules and procedures. We have a bunch of design guidelines that may be applicable to different projects. And. I have that in a presentation, but I also have kind of a board booklet to send out to everyone. My question is, and I'm hopeful that you'll say you'll accept them electronically, or do you want hard copies of? And so my intent is I can just kind of take that. And so what Lindsay had provided to you in terms of your, you know, the seal, what it means to be a CLG, um, our historic preservation, um, ordinance, our design guidelines, the criteria we use to, um, you know, decide a report of acceptability. I can just give that to you electronically. You can have that kind of as your library and resource for being a historic preservation board member. And then if you have any questions, um, you can always just reach out to me directly. Uh, I'm glad to talk about historic preservation. But I would just intend to send them out electronically through OneDrive, so you'll get a link and it will allow you just to download all of those documents. So I think maybe a good place to start is just the historic preservation plan, which is historic COS. Become familiar with the historic preservation code that's within the UDC. and the other one to start would be to the the read on the historic resources and survey the historic resources survey and context plan um because one of the items that the board did um decide we wanted to try not let this sit on the shelf but really start to do some of that survey work, which is also a part of our responsibility as a CLG, and also it's part of the code that we have adopted. And survey work is what leads us to making good decisions on what might be appropriate to landmark, what might be a good local historic preservation district, or other things that might be important to do uh, as a historic preservation board and the program that we have. So, um, I think those would be just, yeah, those would be good places to start and we kind of just continue to build on that and learn from each other. And I guess the last thing I would say to you is that, um, the staff that you see sitting here with you today are here to support you in, um, your function. Uh, we, um, do the best that we can. I said that we're not a full-time historic preservation board. None of us dedicate a significant amount of hours to historic preservation board because we in our duties are also responsible for doing other things. But the one thing I would say is that we're always open to trying figuring out ways that best work for that scenario And maybe someday that would lead into, you know, how does the city better fund and manage and administrate a historic preservation program that is kind of, you know, more full-time, like what we might see in Denver or Boulder or, you know, Fort Collins or ingredients. I'm not sure that they're all 100%.

Yeah, Betsy and Greeley is only 50%. Yeah.

Those are the, you know, I would just say that's kind of where we're, that's where we're at. Sounds good. But, and then I guess the piece, the other, I'll just echo this one more time, but the piece on advocacy education is, would just say in past discussions with the board has been something they have been very much interested in. I think the more you could teach people about what's important in your city, the more excited they can get and the more people that we can get to actually promote or actually do historic preservation and keep parks keep that part of our culture alive as we, you know, change and grow and develop. So.

Okay. Sounds good. And that's all I got. Just to add from my point of view, like Colorado Springs has amazing historic resources. So you should feel confident about that. And that, you know, we're always happy to help if, if you hear about a property owner who wants to rehabilitate their property, even if they're not listed yet, you know, our office is happy to work with them to go through different, scenarios like local, state, or national register, or if tax credits make sense for that project, things like that. So feel free to point people to our office as well.

Do we do have a lot to close? No, you can just adjourn. There's no other comments then. I think we'll adjourn. Thanks, everybody.