County Council - Regular Meeting

Let's get Let's get ball rolling at 6:30. Good evening, everyone. Welcome to the April 28th meeting of Charleston County Council. I am Joe Wicken, representing Charleston County District 8 and currently serve as chairman of the Charleston County Council. I'm going to ask each of our council members and key staff to introduce themselves starting on my left with Mr. Waring. Rob Waring, representing District 3. Henry I mean Teddy Prior, District [laughter] 5. Brosky, District 2. Jenny Honeycutt, District 9. Bill Tuten, County Administrator. Kristen Salisbury, Clerk of Council. Herb Sass, District 1. Steve Skelton. I [clears throat] want to be sure y'all understand me. Thank you. District 4. Anna Middleton, District 6. Brantley Moody, District 7. Natalie Hamm, County Attorney. All right, we have two public hearings tonight. Madam Clerk. Yes, sir. A public hearing shall be held by the County Council of Charleston County on Tuesday, April 28th, 2026 before final approval of an ordinance authorizing the execution and delivery of a special source revenue credit agreement by and between Charleston County and Dogwood Propco, South Carolina 4 LP, including any related or affiliated entities and any sponsor affiliates. No No one's signed up to speak. Okay. Uh 1B. Notice is hereby given that Charleston County Council will hold a public hearing on Tuesday, April 28th, 2026 regarding an ordinance to amend the

portion of Charleston County Code of Ordinances Section 2-137, dealing with trade specific permits, fees, reinspection fees, and establishing a revision fee in the building inspection services department. All right. No one signed up for that, either. Okay. This time, we'll move into public comments. Uh we allow each speaker 2 minutes, and uh we ask that everybody please be mindful of the code of conduct you agreed to when you signed in. All right. [clears throat] We have six people signed up. The first person is George Freeman, then Wendy Helms, Lynn Vickery. Good evening. George Freeman, president of Cage Organization, 2347 North Highway 17. I spoke with you some time ago about the transportation sales tax survey. Uh unfortunately, it's my understanding that a lot of the comments to me, they did not get it in the new survey. The old survey and the new survey. But, I am more disappointed because our project should have been evaluated because we invited the people from the county out to hear our option before the survey was over. We invited our councilman out before the survey was over. And at no time did the project get me requested that would move traffic uh parallel to Highway 17 and go directly to the Park West community get in the system. It's unfortunate that this project will not get in because we feel that this project will solve a problem that has existed on Highway 17 at the intersection of 41 for quite some time. And even with the new changes that you're making now, we feel that we will still have a problem in this area. And

we are hoping that you do not come back and want to disrupt the Seven Mile community, to solve this problem in the future, because you have an opportunity now with a project that will not get in. I don't know if you still have time to bring it in. Uh I was told I was the only one making comments, so I am going back in the community and see how many people can show up at the next meeting to let you know that there is a concern about this road. Thank you. Thank you. Oh, one other thing. Uh we feel you should take the Mount Pleasant way out of that because it's destroying our community. Wendy Helms Lynn Vickery, Lewis Smith Good evening. My name is Wendy Helms. In full disclosure, I am a sitting member of Allendale Town Council. But I am speaking tonight as a concerned citizen regarding the agenda item East County Recreation Site Rural Greenbelt Project. I support the acquisition of the 80 acres of land for passive recreation. My concerns arise for the plans of 10 acres of active recreation. First and foremost is the safety of my community. Highway 17 and Garris Bridge Road has become one of the most dangerous intersections in Allendale. There are currently no plans to install a traffic light or traffic circle to make this intersection more safe for residents or fellow travelers. Secondly, I also have concerns [clears throat] for the additional stresses it will put on an already stretched emergency response team. They need more county funding for more staff in order to support our citizens. I'm also concerned about the impact on our natural resources. This facility will require a septic drain field since no sewer system is in Allendale.

Additionally, the light pollution will be in contrast to the efforts that we are taking to support a dark sky environment. Finally, I learned about this agenda item via news story. We would welcome the opportunity to work with the county to identify the wants and needs of the citizens of the eastern end of Charleston County. Thank you. Lynn Vickery, Lewis Smith, Emily Speck. My name is Lynn Vickery. I live at 8470 Dorr Road in Allendale, and I want to thank you for the opportunity to speak this evening. I learned about this project just yesterday through local news coverage. While I understand that this is a county project on county-owned land, it sits within the town of Allendale and directly affects our residents as well as everyone traveling through the area. The intersection of Guerins Bridge Road and Highway 17 North is already under significant strain. It serves the Shea Family Soccer Fields, the Guerins Bridge Fire Station, nearby residential construction, the Doll Farms event venue, and now 27 new luxury garage condominiums breaking ground. Traffic is already a serious concern. Preserving land through greenbelt funding is something I strongly support. However, there's a meaningful difference between preserving open space and developing an active recreation complex with tennis courts, pickleball, disc golf, and other amenities. These uses bring increased traffic, light pollution, maintenance costs, and environmental impacts. Right now, the priority should be securing the land and taking a pause to fully evaluate the broader impact. At a minimum, this intersection needs to be immediately safe needs immediate safety improvements such as reduced speed limit, and serious consideration of a roundabout. We must put public safety ahead of ahead of the pace and profit. First

responders operate out of a narrow and increasingly congested corridor. Their access should not be compromised. [clears throat]

There is also important long-term questions. Will ongoing maintenance be funded by Greenbelt dollars? How will increased impervious surfaces and lighting affect an already stressed environment near the Francis Marion Forest, Cape Romain Wildlife Refuge, and the Wando watershed? Who will truly benefit from these amenities? Will they be accessible to all residents, including children who need opportunities like swim programs? OR PRIMARILY SERVE OUT OF TIME. Lewis Smith, Emily Speck, Barbara Goss Brown. Good evening. It's my pleasure to come before this distinguished council today. Also, I come my reasons for this twofold. The first reason, I want to thank y'all deeply for the four years y'all helped the Community Resource Center with the summer enrichment program. That program has grown to become almost institutionalized in Charleston County. We have seen growth from one end of the county to the other end of the county. We have partnered with Charleston County School District and several major industries throughout Charleston County. And Charleston County Council, y'all have done an amazing job at helping us help our community in the last four years. And we hope this year we can continue that endeavor with the STEM program, the programs in partnership with the Charleston County School District, going to the museums, visiting several major industries, and taking these students, not only giving them a hands-on experience, but give them an idea of

what it is all about, an educational and cultural experiment. As a result, the summer enrichment program in Charleston County has grown. And we expect this year between 150 to 200 students, plus the ones we take to the various um campsites various campsites we have, such as the museum, the different parks and recreation. And I want to thank y'all. We will be submitting the budget tomorrow, and I want to thank y'all, as usual, for stepping up the plate and putting the children and our youth first in our community. Thank you so much. Emily Speck, Barbara Goss Brown. Delson [clears throat] Gilliard, Emily Speck. Barbara Goss Brown. Good afternoon. My name is Barbara Goss Brown, and I'm here about the Dill Sanctuary. The Dill Sanctuary is right across from my home. This piece of land that's owned by the museum now, the city and the county is precious to us because that's a part of our heritage. A lot of our families lived on the plantation. As a matter of fact, my great-great-grandfather, who is a veteran, Civil War veteran, is buried there along with his sister, her brother, uncle, and niece, and aunt, everybody. This is Elphine Gilliard, I apologize. She is one of the neighbors. Her father was a worker on the Dill Plantation. And if you stop and you look right across the street in Ferguson Village, that's where most of the people that

lived and resided on the Dill Plantation has made their homes. The sad thing about it was that they had to leave abruptly with no place to go. I can say for myself, I love my island. I love the plantation because I have so much We have so much history there. And to do anything with it like big development or anything like that would take away from the natural beauty, the cultural aspect of a community that's dated back to the 17-1800s. Think about it. Give us consideration and know that belongs to us. We need that barrier to protect us from the storms. We need that barrier because of the beauty of it. I told my great-granddaughter the other day we just sat out on the back in the swing and I told her about the trees and how beautiful it was. Come to James Island and just sit there in Ferguson Village or um Middleton Place,

[bell]

you could see the beauty of what we're talking about. It's a beautiful place, guys. Save it for us, please. Thank you. Okay, well this time we'll open the County Council meeting with a prayer from Mr. Prior and the pledge from Mr. Sass. Let us pray. Our Father, we thank you and as always we invite your holy presence. We ask you to guide our thoughts and help us to make right decisions for our constituents and citizens of this great county, Charleston County. We ask you to bless each one of us individually as well as collectively. Continue to bless our staff and bless our servicemen and women who protect us around the world. Bless our first responders and we ask you to keep our civil as we debate. In your name we pray. Amen.

Amen. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Okay, uh Freedom of Information Act. In compliance In compliance with the Freedom of Information Act, notice of meeting was posted and agendas were distributed to news media and persons requesting notification. Uh item two, minutes

Move for approval. Second. All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed? Eyes have it. All right. Move to approve three. Okay. All in favor say aye. Opposed? Eyes have it. This time I'd like to invite Mr. Tolbert up. A resolution of Charleston County Council proclaiming the week of May 4th through 8th, 2026 as Small Business Week. Whereas small businesses are vital to the economic health of Charleston County and small business owners embody the spirit of entrepreneurship and strong work ethic that lie at the heart of the American dream. And whereas small businesses power our economy by creating over the past 19 years the majority of new private sector jobs in our country. And whereas Charleston County is proud of the relationships it holds with small businesses and for the key role they play in keeping our economy strong. Now, therefore, be it resolved Charleston County Council does hereby proclaim May 4th through 8th, 2026 as Small Business Week in Charleston County and hereby urges our citizens to join with us in this observance as we celebrate the accomplishments of small business owners and their employees and encourage the development of new small businesses. Charleston County Council, Joseph A. Boykin, Chairman, April 28th, 2026. Thank you, Kristin. Jared, I I want you to tell folks what what the county is doing this week, but anybody that knows me knows how special small business is to be, the employers, the risk takers, the the job creators. Um it's just backbone of our county and we need to do all we all we can to work with our partners in the municipalities to support small business. So, tell everybody what we're doing this week. Well, thank you, Councilman.

Sure. Thank you, Councilman. I thank all the council members and everybody out here. Small Business Week is very important. It's very important. It's something I've been doing for well over 10 years here in Charleston County. But, we have a number of programs coming up. We'll let Holly and the team talk tell you about the programs that are coming up. But, one of the things that we always make sure that we do here in Charleston County is help small businesses. As Councilman Moultrie said, people don't realize that small businesses hire most of the people here in Charleston County, not the large businesses, small businesses. And they play a very important role. They help a lot of people, especially a lot of the young people get their first job. I got my first job at a small business here 46 years ago and I always remember it and it's something I will take with me forever. So, we have a number of training classes, we have some programs coming up for them to meet each other so that they can grow their businesses and to also be a part of the economic system here in Charleston. So, Holly, can you tell them about what all the programs will be? Yes. So, Monday night we will have um a workshop on AI. Uh Tuesday, we have a growth and sustainability class. Wednesday is a banking and access to capital. And then Wednesday night we'll end with a networking mixer. So, anything that y'all are interested in, you can sign up online at CharlestonCounty.org um SB program. Thank you guys. Thank you.

[applause] [laughter]

Thanks. Thank you. All right. All right. Uh third reading of ordinances uh 4A financial incentives for Dogwood Pop Propco SC. Can we Can we have a discussion on that? That's fine, Mr. Krawcheck. Go ahead. Thanks. Who should I address it to? I just have a a question on the This is the multi-county park. Which is the county that we're partnering with? Is this the Colleton County one? And this is not one that's giving incentives. Is this adding new parcels? Is that correct? That's how I understand it. What or what is the incentive? I'm trying to Uh sir, this incentive is related to a special source revenue credit for Dogwood Propco. Is that connected to Colleton County or adjacent to it or where is it located? Uh no, that's in Charleston County. This isn't an MCIP amendment ordinance. This is related to um SSRC. And what is the incentive that we're giving? I know I appreciate all the good things you're doing, but I tried to get a grid so that anybody listening would have an understanding of what the incentives are and the cost and the benefit, which I think is a good thing for people to hear whenever we do this. So, thank you. Sure. Happy to. I hope you can hear me. So, this is a special source revenue credit for Dogwood Propco. It is not to exceed 4.5 million. In the term of the 17-year agreement, the taxing entities will receive 29 million with the county receiving 3.4 million. All right, thank you. Any further discussion?

All right. Madam Clerk? Yes, sir. An ordinance authorizing the execution and delivery of a special source revenue credit agreement between Charleston County and Dogwood Propco SC 4 LP, formerly known as Project Bark, providing for the allocation of special source revenue credits to express the intent of Charleston County to maintain the project property in a multi-county park and to provide other matters relating thereto. Mr. Darby? Aye. Mrs. Honeycutt? Aye. Mr. Kubrosky? Nay. Mr. Middleton? Aye. Mr. Moody?

Aye. Mr. Prior? Aye. Mr. Sass? Aye. Mr. Warman? Aye. Mr. Boykin? Aye. Ordinance passes third reading with eight ayes and one nay. I'm moving to 4B, building inspections permit consolidation [clears throat] and fee adjustment proposal ordinance third reading. An ordinance amending those portions of the Charleston County code section 2-137 dealing with fees in the building inspections department. Mr. Darby? Aye. Mrs. Honeycutt?

Aye. Mr. Kubrosky? Aye. Mr. Middleton? Aye. Mr. Moody? Aye. Mr. Prior? Aye. Mr. Sass? Aye. Mr. Warman? Aye. Mr. Boykin? Aye. Ordinance passes third reading with nine ayes. Uh 4C, amendments to the Charleston County zoning and land development regulations ordinance. Madam Clerk? An ordinance amending the Charleston County Zoning and Land Development Regulations Ordinance number 1202 as amended to add notice requirements for the issuance of short-term rental property annual renewal and limited home rental short-term rental property zoning permits at the following document locations, Chapter 3 development review procedures and Chapter 6 use regulations. Mr. Darby. Aye. Mrs. Honeycutt.

Aye. Mr. Kubroski. Aye. Mr. Middleton. Aye. Mr. Moody. Aye. Mr. Prior. Aye. Mr. Sass. Aye. Mr. Warman. Aye. Mr. Boykin. Aye. Ordinance passes third reading with nine ayes. Okay. Uh item 5A second reading of ordinances financial incentives for attainable housing North Charleston MF1 LLC's Rivers Landing multi-family rental project. Just a brief discussion if I can this very brief again. Go ahead, Mr. Kubroski. Yeah, this is a brief question. This is also part of the multi-county park agreement we have with in Mr. Kubroski.

Okay. With Colleton County. Uh yes, sir. If approved, it would be added to the multi-county park. Is this property anywhere near Colleton County or what is the connection with Colleton County? Uh it is the legal structure that the state requires to set up a multi-county park. You have a smaller partner county that you partner with on that. And this is a I asked the question last time, but again it's a public meeting and when we give tax incentive, I always think it's prudent for the public to hear what we're incentivizing. This is again to a company that has assets of over 1.1 billion dollars. Am I correct in that? Uh I believe you you did say that last time, yes, sir. True fact, correct? I have not confirmed that, sir. And how many homes are are going to be built for this that wouldn't be built otherwise? Uh this would result in a total of 165 new units. But the tax incentive would give the reason we're giving it is for affordable housing, is that what I understand? Uh that's correct. 18 of those units would be affordable at 60% AMI. And the incentive that we're giving again or what is the tax break that they're getting?

[clears throat] [sighs] So they will It will be a 13 times multiple of the existing taxes on the property. And they will actually pay an average annual fee payment of 454,000, uh which is 59% of the PILOT, and they will be saving 41%. All right. Let me see if I can get that number for you, sir. For how many years? And then you've answered my question. It's a 15-year period. Um the value to the applicant is 4.7 million. All right, thank you very much.

You're welcome, Chairman. Yes, Moody. Mr. Moody. If I may. Um what what what is the county getting in tax revenue from that parcel right now? Uh we are currently receiving Sorry, give me 1 second. I got a lot of numbers on here. 35,503. 35,000 503 per year. Yes, sir. Would a developer of affordable housing come and do something like this without a tax incentive? Um our analysis says but for this incentive, the project would not have

land would probably remain at 35,000. What are we going to get annually once that project is up and stabilized? The average annual payment is 454,000. we're to net $420,000 a year over what we're getting right now. That's a tax That's a That's Okay. I'll take that deal. This one follow-up question. I'll take that deal. That's based on the entire project being built that what he's talking about the money we'll get not the 18 homes, right? I'm sorry. Could you What tax What are we getting from the addition of the 18 affordable homes? The money you're saying that we'll get is based on the entire project. Am I correct?

Correct. That's my point. Thank you. Any further discussion? Mr. Chairman, I'll be recusing myself. Yes, sir. Okay. Um Madam Clerk. Mr. Darby. Oh, I'm sorry. I have to read the ordinance. An ordinance authorizing the execution and delivery of a special source credit agreement by and between Charleston County, South Carolina and North Charleston MF1 LLC with respect to certain economic development property known as the Rivers Landing multi-family rental project located in the county whereby such property will receive certain special source credits and other matters related thereto. Mr. Darby. Aye. Mrs. Honeycutt.

Aye. Mr. Kubraouski. Nay. Mr. Middleton. Aye. Mr. Moody. Aye. Mr. Sass. Aye. Mr. Warman. Aye. Mr. Boykin. Aye. The ordinance passes second reading with seven ayes, one nay, and one abstention. Okay. We're going to move into our consent agenda. 6A through D. One moment, please. We need to remove item 6B from the agenda as the federal funding for this grant has been pulled. So, 6B is no longer 6 A, C, D. Second. All in favor. I'm sorry. Any discussion?

Which one has been pulled, sir? Bravo. Six B? B as in boy. Okay. Okay. Any discussion? Uh all in favor say I. All right. Uh excuse me, I need to roll call on this one second. No, sir. Oh, don't go. I'm sorry. All right. Uh all opposed? Eyes have it. Can we take these one at a time? Mhm. Sure. You talking about seven? All right. Moving on to uh item 7A. Historic Store Creek Corner Rural Greenbelt project. Request to approve. Committee recommendation.

Second. Okay. Any discussion? All those in favor say I. I. Opposed? Eyes have it. Uh 7B East County Recreation Site Rural Greenbelt project.

Committee recommendation. Do I have a second? Second. Okay. I mean just just a quick question. I think Go ahead, Mr. Prior. I think the um young ladies that came from uh this is Allendale project. Yes, sir. They they have some concerns about traffic and they have some concerns about safety. So, are we going to address those as well, you know, with this project? Uh because I think they make good sense when you actually putting something out there that's going to increase traffic, it should be some type of provision, you know, to help alleviate that traffic. So, uh are we willing to, you know, have staff look at that and come back to us So,

before this is finalized. From Mayor respond, Mr. Prior, so what's your question?

Mr. Prior. So, I went and met with Mr. Bowie today and talked about this project. I also spoke with Mayor Crowley also about this. Uh in fact, we're going to send one of our staffers, Mr. Davis or one of his folks, along with Mr. Bowie, we're going to go to the next Allendale Town Council meeting to speak with y'all and answer your questions and uh hopefully allay some of the concerns. This project is basically two pieces of property. The uh the piece and the larger piece. The larger piece obviously is the greenbelt piece. We, Charleston County government, have no say over the small 10-acre piece because the the PRC is going to close on that property. They don't need us. They're spending their money. So, that's that's a in the books done situation. So, the portion of this is just going to be green space and nature trails that we deal with. I would presume that you know, they would have to get permitted for the building and all that stuff through the county and as part of our site review plan, they will should be taking that issues up and those concerns up. I would think.

Thank thank you so much for that explanation.

All right. All right. All right. Mr. Kubala. I would like to echo Councilman Prioleau's initial concerns. You know, this is in my district and often we defer to people whose district it is. And I thank you for your comments and what you did to reach out today, Chairman. That was great. But I also would think that they made um vital points that the this is in the town of Awendaw and all the issues that they raised. You know, I've been by there a million times and I concur with what their concerns that they have. I share those concerns. And I see no harm to put this off and and wait till the we address these issues first. I mean, we run into the issues with the 41. I mean, issue with, you know, having something that people have concerns about. I think we need to address this just like the town council of Mount Pleasant came to us in 41. I feel this is similar. I mean, it's the 10 acres I mean, the 80 acres is for the passive recreation is wonderful and I think that's great. But because the town officials and the mayor have expressed concern, I think we ought to meet them and this delay it to at least next meeting so we have a town a chance to have that meeting that you're talking about first. I see no harm by waiting and and hearing him out first. That would be my hope, being as it's in my district and people have a profound concern. I know there's the wonderful 80 acres there's concern about um what the other part will do and I I would hope we can defer it that the meet with them first. I think in the long run that would be good for everybody. Thank you. Yes, sir. And that would be my hope. Uh any other Mr. Sass. Um Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um Uh this this this area used to be in my my district as well and there have been a number of accidents at Highway 17 and Seewee Road.

Um and I imagine Summit Gardens Road and I've talked to Steve Sig Pen about it and Jim Armstrong before him and we tried to get the state to slow down the traffic right there and the state wouldn't do anything about it. We've tried several times to do something about that. Um There have been some accidents up there. There's no question about that. I I do think that that this is a I think this is a worthwhile project. I think there'll be a pool up there and all kinds of other activities for for people up there that don't have have uh access to some of these things and uh just like we have a pool down in Ravenel. Um I think it's probably probably a good idea but um I would like to point out that there have been there have been accidents there and uh we've tried to get the state to slow to slow traffic down right there but the state has refused to do it. So, I don't know if holding back one meeting is going to change anything. Um Any other comments? Mr. Moneycut. Mr. Boykin, I I'm not sure I understood what it was you were saying about the difference between these two. Is if we hold this up, does it change the outcome on the 10 acres? No, ma'am. Okay. Uh these are um and Mr. Davis, you had something you wanted to add.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a point of clarification. Um the most intensive uses will be on the 10 acres that are purchased without greenbelt funds. Although, in the application and what the greenbelt advisory board recommended, uh, PRC is still considering basketball courts, tennis courts, disc golf, and potentially athletic fields on part of the 80 acres as well. Um, but they said that would be done through a public input process like they typically do. Um, I I again I I I'll I'll go uh, saying that what we're taking action on has nothing to do with the complex, the community center, the pool, and and and what's going on with the 10 acres. That that they're going to close on that regardless of what action we take here tonight. Uh, the passive park portion of it I I mean I I understand there's always concern, but I I I don't see that as being uh, as much of a attractor of folks as the recreation complex that's going there which is going to occur whether we act on tonight or not. So, I don't share your position on that, but I appreciate your position. Can I make a motion on that or what is the procedure on that to defer it? There's already you already you would have had done it before the motion that we have at hand, so yes. I just make a comment. I I appreciate you meeting with the parks and the mayor up there. Um, you know, we have what several weeks between each reading, so that that I I think moving this along while those meetings take place is is probably prudent to keep the time frame. I'm assuming there's some kind of time frame to close this. Um, that we have routinely kept these things moving along while some of those things were worked out. Okay. Any If I if I need to move to approve and or amend up until third reading, I'm I'm happy to do that as well if you think that would make a difference. Just this one thing.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah, sorry. Sorry. Scratch that. All right. Any Anyone else? Okay. Um, I was thinking I'm sorry. Um, did you want to say something? Mr. I mean, is there a timeline on the closing here? Uh it's my understanding that the that the closing will happen within the next couple of months. I don't know. I'm I'm leaning towards Mr. Grabowski's point that it's always good to, you know, talk talk things out when when you can. I I will say this to that point. I can't imagine how it would change anything. I mean, it just doesn't seem to physically make any sense that this is doing anything, but I do think public engagement is important, so I'm I'm sympathetic to that point. Mr. Prior. And I think the chairman said in what you explained and kind of answered my question, whether we do something or not, PRC is going to go forward with the purchase of the land. And even if we vote this down, PRC is still going to do what they decided they wanted to do, and that's what's going to create all of the traffic. And the the 10 acres out there that they're trying to protect for a passive park, I get it, and um I would hope that PRC would go out in the community and talk to uh the Almond Dell Town Council and explain to them what they are proposing, and then maybe come up with some type of solution for the traffic. But um I understand what the chairman is saying. He met with them, and I'm comfortable with them saying that, you know, regardless of what we do, PRC is going to close on the property. So, thank you for doing that, sir. Mr. Wayman. Procedurally, Ms. Ham, if we vote no on this, does that kill it, or would that open the floor for Mr. Grabowski to make a motion to bring it back in 2 weeks, I guess, something like that? Well, if you vote no on the item, then that would kill it.

That's my Yeah, that's my concern. All right. Well, is that all the discussion? Okay. Um all in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed? Grabowski and that's it. Okay. All right. Motion carries. Um 7C Willow Oak Track Expansion Rule Greenbelt Project request to approve. Motion. Move to approve or for committee recommendation on that. Second. Uh any discussion? All those in favor Say aye. Aye. Opposed? All right. Eyes have it. Um 7D Humbert Woods Rule Greenbelt Project request to approve. Move for committee recommendation.

Okay. All right. Uh any discussion? Yeah, uh these are one that the five affordable units are going to go on. They're adjacent to it. Yes, they are. So And I um Mr. Chairman and Mr. Davis and Mr. Moody brought up a good point during committee that all of a sudden now we're putting bricks and mortar on these uh greenbelt property that we are acquiring. So did we change the ordinance to allow this to happen? And if we did, when did we because I remember when this program first started, you know, you couldn't uh put sidewalks, you couldn't put You could put a walking trail or maybe a bathroom or water fountain. But it it seems now we're putting sidewalks, you know, homes adjacent. So [clears throat] did did I miss something or did we change something or Mr. Prior, the uh 5.88 acre portion for the affordable housing uh would not be funded through greenbelt. That would be an additional request that we anticipate coming your way. All right. But now these sidewalks and all that, uh uh do we allow concrete because I think when we wanted to preserve these properties, you know, that's one of the reason why you preserve it to keep the concrete down and it that would give a natural drain. But now it looks like every project we're getting is sidewalks, sidewalks. Uh we do. We have a standard impervious surface calculation for all passive greenbelt properties. Um and and this one uh it would apply to this one as well, which is 2.9 acres out of the total 97. Yeah, but I mean, okay, I get it, but did we change something in our policies for greenbelts to allow these sidewalks or is that just something that we bring it up without changes? Because, you know, when this project when this program first started, you weren't allowed to put down sidewalks. To my knowledge, we have put sidewalks down in a lot of greenbelt properties since since the beginning, yes, sir.

Well, well, between now and our next meeting, I'd like to get that information. So, you'll have something to look at. You can mail it out or email it out to all the council members as Yes, sir. well, too. The impervious surface limit was an attempt to put some some guardrails on that, yes, sir. make sure we protect the trees and everything. Thank you. Mr. Davis, real quickly, the money's for that for this particular project, they're all going to the purchase of the land, correct? Or is any portion going to what Mr. Price

that is correct. They're providing a $25,000 match for minor improvements. Any further questions? All right. Uh all in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed? The ayes have it. Uh all right, moving on. Mr. Chairman. Mr. Waring, go ahead. 7E, um I would move to approve with a condition, that condition being that the applicant come back to us 6 months from today and provide a comprehensive public access plan um as far as what they want to do with the property in terms of increasing the public access. Do we have a second? I'll second it. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um just to give some background here, you know, obviously we had a lot of discussion on this one on Thursday. Um I, you know, certainly had a number of folks reach out from the city, uh the city of Charleston certainly strongly supports this project and that carries some weight for sure. It is part of their allocation. And I think it does need to be said that as far as conservation easements, I mean it is good value. There's no There's really no question about that. Talking about 700 acres. Um you know, we're preserving I guess at 27 cents on the dollar basically and uh you know, the the museum is is given up a $15 million haircut on this whole thing. So, you know, I do think we can trust that that it is their goal that we share the goals of conservation here. I don't think anyone would dispute that it would be catastrophic if this ever got developed. Um think we got a little bit hung up on the public access piece and you know, from from what I can gather, we don't necessarily have the details of that worked out. I don't want to suggest that public access is always part of conservation easements, but you know, the strategic plan was mentioned. It's It's in the yellow sheet on some level. So,

given where we're at with that, this seems to me to be an opportunity to to zoom out and say, "Look, we've got a pretty unique relationship with the museum." I mean, we have the we have seats on their board. We've got sort of continuing support. So, I think we we've got sort of an infrastructure in place that we can trust them to in good faith to go out and and come up with a good plan. I think it'll be as robust as as it can be. Um I trust them to do that. I I like I said, I I trust that we share the same goals here and um I think that beyond the long history we've got with the museum, we're that's one good reason to trust them. We've also got again, they're going to be incentivized to to maintain that relationship. So, um you know, I've I've moved a bit on this one for those reasons and that's why I'm willing to support it with that condition in place. Mr. Waring, just a question for you or point of clarity. This condition does not is not tied to the money tonight. Well, I mean No, I would not say that the money can't go out. I mean, I would think with any condition, if it's not met, then we've got enforcement mechanisms. I don't anticipate that they wouldn't give us some sort of plan. Um So, but yeah, it would not be that the money has to wait 6 months. I don't I don't know what their closing timeline is, either, but I assume it's not 6 months. Okay. Any other discussion? Um Mr. Sass.

Um you know, I'm I'm adverse to putting a 6-month uh timeline on this. I think that's a really short timeline. This is a This is a big piece of property. They need to be able to find the right people to help them figure out the plan to do this property. And I think putting a 6-month timeline on it is is really tight. I think that's way too much. Way too short. Um I don't really like I mean, we've we've been partners with the Children's Museum. We are partners with them, and we we know them, we trust them. Uh I've been on Most of us have been on that board. Um we've worked with them. Uh I don't think there's I don't think they're going to do anything out there that that we wouldn't like or that they wouldn't like. They have a great board. They are very fiscally responsible. Um they manage their money well, what they do have. And um they were very fortunate to be given this piece of land. But they were given a piece of land, but they weren't given any money to manage it with. And so, they've been managing to take care of this property on on their other using their other funds to be able to manage this property over the last 20, 30 years, however long it's been. Um I just I don't want to I don't think putting a 6-month timeline on them is right. And um I I think that they'll come bring a plan to us that that will be acceptable. Um and if it isn't, we'll have to consider it and this this body will consider it. Thank you. Miss Hanika. Yeah, first off, this is in my district and I am very supportive of this project, but I too share great concerns with imposing any additional uh requirement. Look, the land trust is the one putting the conservation easement. We, to my knowledge, we have never conditioned um a parcel that was going to be under easement like this in

this particular way. And so, uh my concern is, okay, the deal goes through, we've given them the money, what if we don't like their plan? I mean, putting us in the middle of it creates just another layer of regulatory uh confusion, really, um that I that I don't think the museum needs in order to carry out its function. And also, three members of this serve as ex officio members of their board to oversee to ensure that we do have a say or a seat at the table in at least understanding and contemplating what it is that they plan to do. So, um for those reasons, I I just can't support that condition being put on it, but I support the project. Mr. Wehrman, would you be willing to amend your condition that just limit it to that they would provide us a 6-month update on what what they've done working towards this? No, Mr. Chairman. I mean, I would go to 9 months, but I do think like on some level we have to have some formalities in place. Uh and and you know, to the question and I think, you know, this is a pretty relaxed version of of that. Um and you know, if if we can't Listen, the thing that threw me off last time was the fact that I couldn't really get my hands around the the sort of details of of what this is going to look like. And so, you know, I'm trying to be flexible in that regard to say, well, I'll even let you tell me about it after you've closed the deal. Understanding that we have a, you know, a iterative relationship with with the museum. I mean, again, we provide continuing continuing support. Frankly, it comes up every budget cycle. And so, you know, 9 months is fine. Even 12 months would be before the next budget cycle, but if we want to be up front about it, I mean, that's the date that I have in mind because, you know, to Ms. Honeycutt's point, I don't think if they give us a plan we don't like, I don't I mean, you know, the condition is not that we like the plan. I think they would have satisfied the condition and that would be just fine. It's something I would certainly take into account going forward, but

um you know, that's kind of how I think that would work. Well, Mr. Weerman, I'm feeling the uh absence of support, I'm going to withdraw my second and uh open it back up for another motion. Fair enough. I move to approve the Dill Property Remodel project. I'll second.

Second. All right. Any discussion? For reasons stated at our committee meeting, I will be voting no on this because I still think it could be some type of way for a compromise using $6 million of taxpayers' money, you know, to say this could put an easement on the property when that could be done without taxpayers' funding. That's my concern. I mean, we did the same thing with Boone Hall. Yes, we did with Boone Hall, but when you call to get certain information, you can't get that information. They charge $35 per person to go in and wedding [clears throat] venues and all, but taxpayers has helped kept that in play. So, you know, nobody has anything against the museum. They have been a great partner with us for many, many years. We have supported them for many, many years. When it was time to remodel, we supported them. We supported them in their budget. So, I don't want anybody on this council to make it seem as if if you vote no, you're voting against the museum because that's not it. You're voting because you want to be sometime fiscally responsible with with taxpayers' dollars and that's the way I see it. And um and and that's why I'm voting no on this because I still didn't get an answer to my questions on Thursday night, and still haven't got it yet. Okay. Anything further, uh Mr. Sass? I have a question, um you know, I I look at it like um the money that they get will be kind of an endowment to help them run that property. They don't have money to run that property now or to do anything more than what they're doing. Um so, we can't make it more open. They don't have enough money to have a full-time person out there. Um just to pick up trash along the road. Um it's a lot of work. That's a big piece of property. You've got fields, you've got roads, there you got some other improvements out there. It's it costs a lot of money to maintain

that piece of property. The museum has been doing it cuz they're who they are. That's what they do. Um and I just think that I I I don't have a I don't have a a fear that they're going to put a carnival out there or do something crazy out there. Um and it is it is an it is an easement that's going to be managed by the Low Country Open Land Trust. They'll be they'll be checking it. They'll be making sure that what's going on out there is supposed to be going on and that they haven't built more impervious surfaces than they shouldn't or other things like that. Um I just think that I think that we need to to to pass this. I'm I'm in favor [clears throat] of it. I'm going to vote for it. Mr. Moody. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yeah, I I I support this and I and I will tonight. You know, it's been a good discussion, I think, [clears throat] frankly. And I I Mr. Waring, everybody's mentioned the trust factor with the museum. We have long partnership with them, and I I think they will do as they say. And you know, when I look at some of the scoring, you You the the greenbelt scores these things, I don't think I've ever seen a 94. Um most of them are in the 60s, 70s, or something like that with unanimous, I think City Council unanimously supported it. And how about that young lady that spoke here tonight? That's that kind of reaffirms what that she'll be a beneficiary of this thing. And that was a moving Those were moving comments. And uh I am going to support this. Thank you, sir.

Thank you. Anything further, Mr. Frasier? Just briefly, the Boone Hall thing came up and the benefit of that is I asked people to imagine if there wasn't a conservation easement and that was all development uh the homes, what that would mean to [clears throat] East Cooper. And this 725 acres is some of the most beautiful and pristine land not only in Charleston County uh but all of America. And to have that in a relative urban area is something remarkable. So, my vote in this is to help ensure that that never gets developed other than they said the 4 acres for a caretaker or something. But to be able to be part of something to preserve this forever for future generations. And especially that location in urban area is something that um I'm honored to be part of the opportunity to to preserve that forever for for future generations. That's the way I look at it. Anything further? You know, I was not going to say anything. But you know, I'm compelled at this point to say something. I was a docent at the museum. I grew up on the east side of Charleston back [clears throat] in the days when the museum partnered with schools in order to allow young, you know, urban inner-city uh children you know, hope through their exploration of history through the museum. Uh enjoyed that experience. I'm a big supporter of the Charleston Museum. I also, you know, when I hear the comment relative to Boone Hall, which I support Boone Hall and certainly go there and pick strawberries and anything else. But at the same token, when looking at uh Phillips community. 10 Mile, 4 Mile that doesn't even exist anymore. Hamlin, all of these other settlement communities and let's come on the other side of, you know, Charleston County and in all of those communities that we've done relatively void recent as it relates to historic preservation

commission and that sort of thing, but in those years did nothing, you know, to preserve them to in perpetuity protect them and they've been fighting Snowden still, you know, 50 years in the running, you know, just for sewer, you know, so they wouldn't have to be annexed into another municipality. And so I'm not supporting it, but I wanted to just be on the record that I do support the museum from as a child had it not been for the museum shaping my development, I probably would not be who I am right now. Bless you. But certainly when making these comments about, you know, how much this is worked for and and it maybe to some extent for Boone Hall and others, yes, and I wish that we would have done the same thing way back for Hamlin, Snowden, 4 Mile, 7 Mile, 10 Mile, Phillips and all of the other historic settlement communities that have been decimated because they had no protections. Okay. Anyone else? Mr. Darby. Everything is stuffed, isn't it? Um I'm just taking a panoramic trek to the past. Uh when Julius Caesar as he crossed the Rubicon into Italy in terms of the Roman Civil War the die has been cast. Uh there's no turning around now. Uh this will pass tonight. But I do have just three short points that I would like to make. Uh the museum, and of course as Mr. Pryor eloquently said, uh this is not anti-museum because we have supported each other in terms of partners. But the museum is seeking a $3 million grant

for a preservation easement for a tract which is already preserved. It's my first point. The question now begs, why is there a further commitment to a tract which is already preserved? No, that's the purpose of the easement uh of of of of the dollars to preserve. I guess my final point is, and I know I'm not the sharpest tool in the toolbox, but I'm very confused about how so many of us describes describe ourselves at this council as being fiscally conservative. Because it seems to me that this council evinces means of not reducing public spending. If there was a dire, urgent, critical need for the museum of the $3 million, I could understand, but I do not see that need. So if I'm not in error, Mr. Pryor, if you were telling that all it is a tract of land which is already preserved. Am I correct, sir? It's I think it ends after 35 years, but the board themselves can impose a conservation easement if they wanted to, even if the county said no, if the board was serious about protecting this. My My only Everybody says, and even Mr. Sasser said, "Well, the board needs money to to run. The board needs money." Well, it should have been stated that was one of the reasons why they came to us for this, not just to say a conservation easement.

Right. Now, if if this money is going to be put in escrow to only be used for, you know, the upkeep of this property for many, many years, that would be one thing. Different.

Different. But there is no stipulation the money can be put in a general budget and used for general funds. So, my Mr. Werhman, I think, made a great point. You know, had they come back, you know, with some type of plan, I mean, why not? I mean, we trust them, but why not have a plan? You know, you know, they trust and verify. And so, I I agree with you. Everybody up here supports the museum. They just want a plan, and they just want transparency. That's all. Thank you. All right. You couldn't say it any better, sir. Thank you, sir. Mr. Darby, um there's a little bit of irony here tonight. Um My constituent, Ms. Barbara Gauss, who's sitting right over there, who so eloquently spoke, lives in Ferguson Village, which is a settlement community, right across the street from this property. I can't get much closer than being in a settlement community than in than the width of a road. And I think she made very good points when she spoke, and uh I'm definitely going to support this. It is not under any conservation easement or other protection. Yes, they could get an easement for nothing. That's what they could do. But they don't have to. They have every right to sell it whenever they want to, because it was an endowment given to them uh by the Dill family, and they've been great stewards. Um we do it for everybody else. Just because they're a nonprofit, why would they be treated differently than any other person or entity? And so, with that, um you know, I'm in full support. Any further conversation?

Go ahead, Mr. Darby.

Chairman, this one question to build upon what I said. If we don't do this conservation easement, there's nothing to prevent future trustees of the museum to sell property off for development and um for money that they need to fund it. So, this is the clearest way and I'm asking if I'm right in this that we can preserve this forever, that it will never be developed. Otherwise, we have no control over what the the trustees do now or future ones who may see look at life much differently and want to sell part or some of it off or all of it or most of it. We would have no further no better way to ensure that this stays as it is forever than by what we're doing. Is that correct?

That's correct. At this time, I'll close discussion and ask Madam Clerk to call the roll. Call for question. Yes, sir. Mr. Darby. Mr. Darby. Nay. Mrs. Honeycutt. Aye. Mr. Grabowski. Aye. Mr. Middleton. Nay. Mr. Moody. Aye. Mr. Prior. No. Mr. Sass. Aye. Mr. Warman. No. Mr. Boykin. Aye. The motion passes with five ayes and four nays. Okay, moving on to the committee recommendations uh 8A. Chairman. Yes, sir.

I'll move for 8A through C. I think we were unanimous. Were we not? No, maybe not. Let's take them one at a time. Move for approval 8A. I'll second. I'll second it. Okay. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed? Nays have it. 8B. Committee recommendation to amend at the third reading. Properly moved and seconded. Any discussion? Hearing none, all in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? Aye. Nays are Mr. Middleton Mr. Moody. Okay. Um since council's uh voted to approve the proposed transportation sales tax program, I am going to direct the county attorney to draft ordinance language that reflects the approved program to bring back to the transportation sales tax special committee for approval on May 7th, 2026.

[clears throat] All right, moving to 8C, ARPA project funding reallocation committee recommendation. Second. All right. Uh, any discussion? Hearing none, all in favor say I. I. Opposed? Eyes have it. Uh, 8D recommendation

Second. All right, any discussion? All right, all in favor say I. I. All opposed? Is there a nay? All right, motion carries. Uh, committee recommendation on E. I'll second. All right, any discussion? All in favor say I. I. All opposed? Eyes have it. You want to go back? Council comments. Uh, since I picked on Mr. Wehrman, Mr. Mayor, would you like to start?

Fine. Uh, just a couple quick things. I wanted to thank staff for their work with the um, short-term rental ordinance and just continue, Mr. Tooten, to encourage you guys to look for weaknesses in that ordinance, um, where we can continue to tighten that up. I I think that's a great first start, so um, that's it. Thank you. Mr. Middleton. Nothing. Okay. Mr. Darby. Nothing, sir. Mr. Sass. Um, I think we had some pretty good discussion tonight about greenbelt projects and uh, especially um, good to see that the deal track is going to be protected. Um, personally I feel like uh, yes, the property is worth about $30 million and the easement's given up a lot of money and museum is going to get some money for giving up those those rights and I think that I think that it would have been I would feel like I was personally irresponsible to have not gotten something for giving up that property. And uh anyway, I just wanted to make that sure and I'm happy to happy to welcome Clara to the library board. Thank you all very much. Sure. Uh Ms. Honeycutt. Yeah, I also want to say thank you so much for approving the the Dill Sanctuary property. Um that is a huge asset. Um for those who haven't been, I really encourage you to to get a get an appointment with the museum to take you out there. This is waterfront on the Stono River. And just to elaborate on the cost of passive management, I know the museum's spent over $250,000 in the last couple years just shoring up the bank of a portion of the Stono River um because it needed it. And so, um this is of tremendous value. When you're talking 15, 20 million-dollar property um that we got for our investment being 3

million, I think it's an absolute bargain and it's it is a true benefit to the residents of Charleston County in particular James Island. So, thank you so much. Uh Mr. Kublaski. Um just wanted to [clears throat] thank you for indulging. I meant no disrespect for uh not wearing a coat and tie. I have some medical procedures, so I meant no disrespect by uh not dressing entirely right. But I want to say that the um I think in view of things that happened nationally and the vehemence, I mean, we had some strong disagreements, but I'm proud to be part of a council that, you know, disagreed respectfully. Nobody called each other names and we disagreed uh and put our feelings out there. So, I think that's a a good example to show the public how that can be done. Thank you. Mr. Prior. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. So, I'd like to propose and maybe ask Mr. Uh Davis a question. So, since we secured the rail track and the Furgeson community is right across, would it not be prudent to protect them as well, too? I mean, it would the Furgeson community. We protected the rail track and these people live directly right across from them. So, I don't want to protect the rail and then somebody comes up and buy the community. What can we do to go out and meet with these folks and see if they can, you know, put an easement on their property and be secured so, you know, it would be there in perpetuity for their family members. Uh Lowcountry Land Trust runs a community lands program. We funded several settlement community projects through that. I'm sure I can get with those folks and they'll go out

like for you to do that, sir, and then you know, come back to council with some kind of explanation because you know, you protected one. It's going to be a lot of pressure to get in that community. Yes, sir. Thank you. [applause]

Good point, Terry. That's a good idea. Um well, listen, I I you know, obviously uh lost that vote and and you know, we move on. I don't disagree. I think you know, I think I hope we made we conveyed that you know, I'm sure that the museum will do a great job with it and again, it it certainly is a positive that it's protected. It's maybe not the way that I would have gone about it, but um understand that there are certainly positives from that. Um I don't know that it bodes well to dwell on it too much more, but uh in any event, I don't have any other comments on that. Thank you. Mr. Administrator? No, sir. No, sir. I'm attorney. Well, just a couple of things. Um I'm so very proud of this council, uh the work that's been done uh here and by our staff and all those that have participated on the transportation sales tax. It has been quite the journey and uh you know, quite the uh uh comedy in some sense of the word uh playing itself out. Um great discussions, great debates. Uh I can't thank the public enough for their involvement, their participation. It means so very much to us to have their um involve you know, input. Um I'm very proud of what we have put together and where we are right now. You know, there's always room for improvement as it as it as with most things. But what we've got is a great compromise uh that puts feature projects across all of Charleston County uh from the South Santee down to the Edisto. Um it addresses urban and rural areas. It addresses uh safety, capacity, uh congestion, um preservation and uh protection of green space and uh and it it it it it infuses our transit system with extra funds that they need to you know, grow and uh maintain what they've got in the

Lowcountry Rapid Transit. Also providing a lot for bike ped. Um you know, this has just been a well thought out um [clears throat]

uh referendum. Um so I look forward to it moving forward. And uh secondly, uh on the Dill Tract, uh again, thank y'all for for for voting tonight to secure that property. Uh it actually it and Ferguson are in my district. Um yeah, I've been on that property when I was an ATF agent. I chased a a fellow that shot a police officer in the face that was apprehended um just off that property and got a a tour that I probably didn't ask for. Um but it's it's a spectacularly beautiful property. It is truly the Boone Hall of James Island. There's no property in comparison to it. We did the right thing tonight. Um I wish we could have accommodated everybody's concerns to get it done, but we did the best we could. And uh thank y'all and we're adjourned. Thank you.