City Council - Regular Meeting

All right, it is 5:30. We'll we'll call this meeting to order and and get started. Grateful for everybody being here with us today. Um excited. Uh I got got to introduce to a a new group in town that's uh that that Ben Persia is going to to represent today and giving us the our opening prayer. He's with the Newman Club, which is a a Catholic uh organization for for youth. Um, right. So, we're excited to have you here. Thank you for for being here. And then we'll let you start with the the prayer and then we'll have uh Paul Bitman will lead us in the pledge. Hello. Okay, cool. In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen. Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us, and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. Amen. Name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Amen.

Amen. Amen. Thank you, Ben. Join me. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

With that, I'd make a motion that we approve the agenda as outlined. Second. Have a motion and a second. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Thanks for uh taking the lead there, Councilman Cox, and Councilman Phillips absence. I appreciate you stepping up, making sure that Yeah. So, thank you. Okay. Um we've got uh just right down to our business agenda it looks like tonight. So, um we'll start with our public hearing to consider an ordinance vacating a public utility easement at approximately 165 South,600 West. You got here just in time. He's done this a few times. He knows.

Thank you. Bob Platt here. Uh this is uh over on Yeah. 165 South 11 1600 West.

Yeah. There we go. So, let me get this. So, we're in the process of making four lots. Excuse me, two lots out of four. Right now, this is uh one, two, three, four lots. We're making this the new lot line between what will be two parcels. This and this. The request is on this uh plat, which is a minor subdivision, Doyle, Ipsson. Uh this 7 and a half foot strip right here is a platted as a public utilities along that lot line. Oh, up there. Okay. I'm looking at my screen over here and I'm like, why is it not showing up? Our techn is not that cool. He's got it up there. Yeah.

And uh obvious uh there's no utilities there. Uh the the myar will be signed by all the utility companies that they approve of this vacation. Where is this? I mean, I know the address, but Ethan Bunker lives right here, if you know. Yeah. It's between Ridge Road and 1600. That little road. And the utilities already go on the other side of the property, right? Yeah. They're in the front. Yeah. So, it's not there's no need to even have them run through there. Well, especially where it butts into another like what's it going to do? Where's it going to go? That's where we're at right now. Yeah. So, the the pee we're talking about is right here.

And we're requesting to vacate it from the rear lot line down to 10 ft from the front because in the front there is a pee that the city need, everyone needs. Correct. But that portion we're requesting to vacate. Okay. Yeah. Especially where it intersects mid lot on the lot behind it. It's like whatever. Okay. Go ahead. Okay. Any questions for Mr. Platt? Okay. Public hearing and we'll open the public hearing on this one. Anybody that would like to speak? Does it match the general plan? That's the holy grail. Hey. Hey. Good thing PUE aren't on the holy on the So, we'd really be Just kidding. Sometimes you have to let common sense prevail.

Okay. Okay. Anyone? No. No comment. We'll close the public hearing. Mayor, I just move that we put on action since it's an ordinance we got to. Okay. Motion. Second. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Great. Next item. Public hearing to consider approving a conditional use permit for concrete batch plant at approximately 3527 West 600 North. Mayor, I need to excuse myself for this one. Yep.

All right. Thank you, mayor, and members of the city council. So, the proposal before the council this evening is a conditional use permit or CUP for a concrete batch plant. Uh we don't do too many we don't do too many of these. So, I thought I'd start with, you know, what is a conditional use permit and why is there a conditional use permit required? Uh next slide. Can or do I have control of this?

Yeah, you can advance in there. Uh so per the city per the city's definition of a cup is a land use because of its unique characteristics of of potential for impact on the municipality surrounding neighbors or adjacent land uses may not be compatible in some areas or may be compatible only only if certain conditions are required that mitigate or eliminate the detrimental impacts. So as we go through these slides, it's the conditions associated with the mitigation as should be a key part of the discussion as we go forward. And the purpose per ordinance of a CUP is to allow the proper integration of uses which may be suitable only in certain locations in the city's zoning districts or only if such uses are designed and laid out in a particular manner. So essentially what a cup does, it's a process that balances the economic benefits uh with the potential uh negative impacts. And so we look for ways to try to mitigate those potential negative impacts associated with the use. So if you were to take a look at the city's use tables, and we were just debating this last week, what's allowed, what's not allowed, where, why, etc., etc. We don't require many cups. Uh, as an example, you'll see it for things like concrete plants in the INM1 zone, asphalt plant. Most uses, we don't. There's no need to. If it's a cabinet shop, welding shop, gas station, we're not too worried about things. These types of uses, there are certain things that we want to consider, especially if you're next to sensitive receptors like residential properties. Um, oh, I was going to say next slide. I've got control. So, here is the site plan. This is 800 north, uh, 600 north. This is 56 to the south.

You've got the Monte Vista subdivision out here to the west across 3,700 west. The general consideration for the conditional use permit is this batch plant operation that and you've got your aggregate stock piles you know circulation equipment lay down but is it is this component that is what we are really considering under this conditional use permit. Um go to the next slide. So this is kind more of a rendering but this gives you a schematic and I think the applicant will have some new ones to show you. Uh but this is the batch plant. You can see it's 100 ft tall. You've got your silos for storing materials. Aggregate mixes in this equipment. Drops it down to the truck and moves on to the next job site. This is the loader. So you would have equipment operating here all day long pushing aggregate, moving it up the conveyor. And if I made any mistakes here, I'm sure the Apple can will explain it better than I can. Um so when taking a look at a conditional use permit per city ordinance pertaining to cups there's certain findings that the council is supposed to consider. What what are we looking for? And those findings are number one that the proposed use of the particular location is necessary or desirable to provide a service or facility which will contribute to the general well-being of the neighborhood and the community. The proposed use will comply with regulations and conditions specified in the section for a CUP. It will conform to the intent of the general plan. And lastly, that such use will not under the circumstances of the particular case and conditions opposed be detrimental to the health, safety, and welfare of persons nor injurious to property and improvements in the community. but we com but will be compatible with and complementaryary to the existing

surrounding uses buildings structures when considering the various zones for which the cup is proposed. So generally speaking when we look at the findings and we look through the ordinance staff staff's concerns mainly boil down to traffic air quality noise water quality lighting and compatibility. So the first thing we took a look at is traffic. Um generally speaking we don't have significant concerns uh related to the batch plan operations as related to on-site vehicular circulation u or the number of trips impacting the whole transportation network. We do have a concern that with the number of trips per day, we don't want those going through the residential neighborhoods that we have existing to the west nor to the north. And this is where the conditions come into play, i.e. why we have a CUP as you saw in your staff report. So we've asked them that uh we preclude vehicle trips to the west and to the north and that they use 800 and get out to Lond. Uh certainly air quality in a batch plant is a concern. Um so fugitive dust can be a significant concern uh not just with the plant operations. We all know there's a there's piles of aggregate. We've got fly ash components uh and then we have off-road circulation with heavy vehicles. So there's a number of conditions. This is just a summary, but we're asking them to restrict some of their circulation patterns adjacent to those residential areas to the west. Uh and certainly they'll comply with all federal and state agencies. Uh we want on-site circulation that's not required to be hard surfaced by ordinance to be finished with a subbase andor crushed

asphalt. We want to minimize dust with the cement vehicles circulating out there day and night. Uh the cleaning of track out in our public rideways. Uh I didn't know this, but they do pre-wash the aggra materials. I think that's probably a big deal. Uh, of course they're going to water the site and then the fly ash systems are enclosed. There's more in the staff report, but that's the gist of it. Uh, so noise. Uh, the planning commission chewed on noise quite a bit. Uh at the city's request, we did receive a noise study um from a from a professional that uh they hired and the conclusion of that study was that we needed more mitigation. Uh we just received a study about an hour ago. The applicant is going to walk you through the conclusions of that. I haven't really had time to analyze it, but we want to make sure that uh we are not going to create a significant impact especially to those residential neighborhoods and we're going to have future neighbors there on the north side as well. Water quality. If you take a look at this slide, oops, sorry. This is generally the the batch plans move a little bit. Uh but this is the Monte Vista well. We have a big detention pond. We all know that one. Uh these are uh what they call uh well protection zones.

Thank you. Well protection zones one, two, three, and four. Uh we want to make sure that what they do there does not impact the drinking water uh nor does it get into our storm drain. So there's quite a few uh mitigation measures in there. I think uh we're all in agreement uh with that uh these things need to be done. So obviously they're going to comply with state and storm water rags. Uh we want to make sure they're communicating with the well operators to see if we need additional BMP so we don't impact their drinking water quality. We want to look at their grading plans and we certainly want the applicant to certify hey that these operations are not going to impact these wells. Um and I think we're in agreement there. Uh next concern was lighting. They did provide us a photometric that is in your staff report. In general, it looks very good. Uh, basically almost zero foot canels at that western property line. So, we shouldn't see too many impacts. We did put this condition in there. Uh, we weren't quite sure, you know, uh, with a 100 foot 100 foot plant there, how much glare we might actually get off these towers. That's usually where our complaints come from is when they're just beaming right into someone's bedroom window. So, we'll just want that photometric to certify that that's not going to be an issue for us. And that's that's really a result of the height of that structure out there. Uh and lastly, uh is compatibility. Um there's a number of considerations that that we we touched on briefly. Uh but as indicated in your staff report, um the proposed one of the findings that we're supposed to make is that the proposed use will conform to the intent of the Cedar City General Plan with that plan indicating a couple things. I'll highlight in its description of the business business and light manufacturing area. Uh it indicates that residential buffers

are encouraged and in objective 0562 it indicates that commercial industrial developments will provide adequate buffering. Uh so this was a couple of suggestions from staff to try to meet that intent try to buffer you some pretty heavy duty operation away from those sensitive receptors. One was landscaping. Uh we had asked for a tree at every 30 feet uh along that Westley property line with reduced vegetation along the north and south. I know the applicant would like to speak to their concerns uh with that condition. And you'll see staff, we have a small rebuttal in the report. The we've asked for muted color tones. I don't think that's an issue. I don't think they're going to paint it fluorescent pink, but we did ask them not to do that. And uh lastly, there was a concern about signage. Staff had a concern that at a height of 100 ft. Um this would be the biggest billboard in town. Uh they would like to put some signage and they probably have some pictures similar to kind of what you see there in that image. Uh so we have suggested that they essentially kind of meet our sign ordinance at no more than 25% of one of these silos. no off-site signage and things of that nature. Uh and lastly, uh staff is suggesting a sight obscuring fence along the south property line and the protection of the underground infrastructure, which is the sewer line. You'll note on the site plan. Uh so that concludes my report. Unless you have questions from me, I'd like to open it up to the applicant.

Um did the tree uh requirement factor in the trees that are already there? There's a whole bunch of really big trees right near the tank and the and the well. Uh I did not know. And so I'm just That's already a natural buffer. I mean, and I think there's some there's fewer on the south side and there's some mature trees going to the north that I think provide some uh buffer that's already there. Okay. Just just off of memory. I I'm there. I I have no doubt. I did not consider. No, I just I was just wondering if they could lessen that up a little bit due to what's already there. Okay. So

So Don, I just have two questions. One is for the city. The other one kind of for you, but it'll also prepare the uh the applicant to answer the question. So I'm assuming it's not a big deal, but I mean this is fairly close to our runway. FAA, we're fine. I mean, having 104t tall tower that close to our airport is okay. Uh I know the applicant can answer that. And if I remember correctly, Tyler said that this height was okay, but they will have to clear that regardless. Okay, we don't have to condition that.

Okay. And then my other question is go back. Ken, could you go back to the four questions that it talks about? It was one of the very first slides. It was either the first or the second slide. Keep going. This one right here. So I mean as I sit here and look through this a conditional use permit shall not be authorized unless so really my question comes down to really it's question number one that the proposed use of the particular location is necessary or desirable to provide a service or facility which will contribute to the general well-being of the neighborhood or the community. How does this location provide a service or facility that's more well-being to our community than the current location they have? Like what does this do for our community? What's the well-being that our community gets out of them moving this location from their current location other than it's more desirable for them? What makes it more desirable for our community to have it there versus off a bulldog?

I don't have a good answer for that. That's the question for you. Well, I I would surmise that it's How about I have them answer the question? Well, I'm just saying it's less infill traffic. He said he didn't have an answer. Okay. Well, so that I was just saying I was surmising since he didn't have an answer. Um there's less infill traffic. You ride off 56. You have Lond which is a main road and Bulldog's not. And so to me that improves in my opinion. I guess my only thing is I would have loved the developer to say that not because now they have your answer. That's right. I I think I will. It's common sense. I think I will add when you look at it in totality to really the cup and ran you tell me if I get off base here, but it is under state code a permitted use.

Correct. And we, you know, we have our findings, but I I think that is why the conditions are key is we need to strive in my opinion to mitigate those impacts uh to a level that I would that we should consider as less than significant. That's that's how I would look at this in totality. And Randall, I don't know if you I guess and I'm with you. So, I I don't want you to read this backwards from what state law requires because if you're not careful, you can read this to say there's some big burden they have to reach before we even approve it. Okay?

State law, including case law, is pretty clear. You see a conditional use permit, you're hoping that thing passes, and we all want it to pass. You are trying to find reasonable mitigation measures to reduce, not even necessarily eliminate the impact on neighboring properties. There is a heavy heavy thumb on the scale for approving a conditional use permit. So, please don't read this to say it's the other way around that they have some big burden. If we're going to ever say no or put a burden that's just so exorbitant, it's the burden's on us. Um, so we start with you're wanting this to get through. And I think for the record, I mean, I think everything they've done and they've in some ways even over mitigated. So, that's not a it's just I didn't even know that these four questions I I guess maybe I'm taking too much out of my days on board of adjustments where it's like you have to be able to answer these questions. And I look at that first question and I'm like, so why are we even asking that question if there's not really I mean it says that it has to provide a contribute to the general well-being of the neighborhood. Well, does this contribute to the general well-being of the neighborhood?

Well, I and it doesn't maybe not, but does it actually and if you're getting really specific, this is one of those that if like if we got I'm just going to put it bluntly. If we if you grant this and I had to go through and show why this particular location is a good one, it'd be the same reasons why they picked the location, right? They're an industrial zone that generally allows these kind of uses. They're right next to a massive male a rail line that they now get to bring it in on.

Heck, I'm just looking at how many homes are in that immediate area and how much industrial is coming in that that cement's not going to have to go a mile before they're putting it down where we want it. Um, this is one of those that we even as staff we're I'm kind of ecstatic to be able to expand what they're doing. This is more concrete than what they do on Bulldog. So, if you're looking for a benefit for the city, we've been saying it all along. I was more worried you were going to say about the neighborhood. We're probably more mitigating than benefiting the neighborhood. But,

but the neighbors all said that they would prefer to have commercial there than residential when they did the zone change in that property. They were very outspoken about that and so and they said they wouldn't mind if it was a daytime mechanic shop that was rattling and whatever. So, so they they are fully aware that that was the risk of what they wanted when when Phil did that development. And I'm going to tell you, I probably pushed my luck a little bit on this. Back when that was going on, we were already told this was the likely plan. At least I was. And I remember telling some of those people very specifically, it could be, not that it will be, but it could be a concrete mixing plan. And they were like, fine, fine. We just don't want residential. We don't want traffic through our neighborhood.

So, to them that was in theory. I knew it was more fact, but they the ones I talked to were still in favor of it.

Just uh just for my own edification then, I think the four things that uh that are on the table that I'm not sure if you guys are satisfied with or not is air quality, noise, water, and lighting. uh all these four conditions over here I interpreted the neighborhood and the community to be at large you know the whole city as opposed to the locality community so I'm not too worried about that but I am I would like for them to define air quality noise and lighting and uh what they're doing to you know make it reasonably acceptable So do you have a confidence uh level on those four things as you've explained them over here you were just highlighting but I don't know that you have gotten any uh sense of

I uh in in the staff report Kent do you mind putting the conditions up in the staff report to summarize guys. Uh I think traffic we feel confident. Um so what part is it you want? All the way basically to the bottom of the dock. Last last few pages are the conditions there. Yeah, I read all of that and there were some minor changes there that I thought were very logical. Yep. So

I think I I feel very confident I my biggest concern uh without seeing the new noise study which they are going to speak to it would be noise. Okay. Everything else in your book based on the modifications and everything that they have presented. I still think are taken care of. Uh I didn't take the other trees into consideration but I I think that the vegetation in my mind is important. It it's it's not just aesthetics, but it's also an impression. You know, when you when you're hearing something, but you look across and you see something different, it does make a difference.

Um uh but they will want to speak to the the number of trees and and and the location. I think everything else we are very very close on. I feel confident we're doing the best job we can. I think noise is probably the biggest one you may want to Okay. Hear from the Apple.

Perfect. And if I could just add to that, I I will say that uh as we've been working with Suncor on this whole um project, I think at the beginning our ideas and their ideas were a ways apart. I think we were able to do a good job of of getting to where we had some some understanding between us and really worked through the issues and worked the issues out. I I feel comfortable with the process of what got us here to you tonight that we've really been able to address all the major issues. Okay, thank you. Okay, so is it going to have a crusher on site? So there's no crusher. Not not the plan now

because that's more noisy than probably most anything in the for sure. Plug it in. Let's put on the podium. There's I think the Ashdowns have a crusher that's just across the lawn and it doesn't make that much noise. All right, it's all you.

Oh, good evening. Uh, my name is Craig Flint. I'm with Clyde Companies. I'm representing Suncor. I'm the real estate manager and it's my privilege to speak to you this evening and hopefully answer many of the questions you've already posed. I've put together about a 10 to maybe 15 minute presentation. Um, keep in mind kind of the questions that you already a asked there and hope I can answer some of those as we're going through the slides here essentially. So, um, also here just with me, we've got Ray Nelson and Jeremy. They are our local operators. So, if there's questions that I might not be able to answer, they can answer those. They're in the dayto-day on this. And as well as David Dobbins, who's works with me at Clyde Companies. So, So, um, just I mean we're we're about building a better community. That's our mission. That is what we do. You can see some of the projects that we've been involved with here in Cedar City. Um, and so that that's really what we believe in and we've taken a lot of steps to look at this site and keep that in mind as we're looking at the various things that we've discussed. So, just to kind of paint where this is, if this is helpful, you got Highway 56 right there, the airport. I've outlined the site there um uh in red, and we took a couple aerials just in case we need to see anything or take a different angle on that. Um, what I thought I'd do tonight, just to maybe answer some of the the air quality questions, um, and the lighting and that sort of thing, just kind of do I'm going to call batch plant 101 if that's if that's helpful. Um, I assume like most of you haven't been to a batch plant. Maybe you have, maybe you haven't, but um wanted to just kind of share what goes into the the batch plant, how it operates, that sort of thing, and how it

how we've set this one up to to mitigate some of those air quality concerns. So, um what we've got for the batch plant, there's basically five ingredients. We've got your aggregates, your your rock and sand, and yes, a question about the crusher. So what we do is at our other location, that's where we crush crush the crush

crush the stuff, crush the sand and and gravel. From there, it actually gets washed. And so that's a key key thing here where the uh all the fines are taken out of it. Basically, the the dust essentially, it's washed and then it's it'll be trucked over to this location. And so that's kind of a first step is like, hey, this is clean washed material, not raw material that's going there. So that helps mitigate the dust. just in that in that sense. The other ingredients are cement and fly ash and and a lot of times we bring those in on trucks and they're piped into the silos. That's what's in the silos that you see there. But usually they come in on trucks. But why this site was um attractive to us is another company that we have which is called Bridge Source supplies cement and fly ash. This is a property we have up in Ogden where that cement and flash is brought in on trains. It essentially drops down underneath in kind of that that casing area right there. And from there that cement flash, it's a closed system. So it gets put into a bucket into a um a bucket elevator into silos and then we will take that and pipe it over to the batch plant. So it's basically a closed system. So from an air quality perspective that is it's a great system to reduce exposure to the air if that makes sense. So and then we add in some ad mixtures that they're proprietary ones that get mixed in at for different combinations and those are added in to the barrel essentially with the aggregate the sand and we've enclosed this plant. So that's another way we're essentially protecting the air quality there. And then when you get it in the mixer this is different. There's kind of two types of plants. There's a dry batch and a wet batch. And the wet batch is what we're going to be putting at this location. And that's there's some of the piping there. Let me

just go back to that. It's essentially this this eerie strayer plant right here. And what that means is that the cement and the fly ash and the aggregates are mixed in a barrel with water and then dumped into the into the trucks. And then that's different from a uh that's so that's the wet batch. It's wet mix so there's less dust is what I'm trying to say there. That the dry mix they that's when they put all the stuff into the trucks and then they mix it there. You have to usually pull up and back out. Whereas in this one you just drive through. They dump it and they just drive on their way. Um and then we have dust collectors that are on there. That's what this which one's the pointer here. So right here we have a dust collector. And I'll talk about this with sound in just a minute. That that's a component of that where we will locate that as we've gone through discussions with the city. So in terms of air quality, we follow all the state regulations. We have a fugitive dust control plan that outlines how we mitigate the dust on site through watering, sweeping. There's a plan. We've already submitted it to the state at this point. So um it's already in their in their court. um hall routes. Um I know we talked touched on traffic. Everything goes east. We've we think that's great. Stay out of the community to the west. We'll put signage up. We'll teach our we'll educate our drivers. Hey, everything goes to the east in that direction. So, so that's really wanted to address just those first two things. I think you said the air quality. So, um just wanted to share those items. We've already shar shared the uh um architectural plans there. Um one of the things I wanted to touch on and this this ties in a little bit with the sound and I'll maybe come back

to this but I'm going to go down to our hours of operation. So in a 365 um day year, we generally operate about 250 days. And so what we did is we went back through 2025, looked at when in a 24-h hour period, how do we how much are we operating there? And so I'm going to kind of break this into three categories. Um there's kind of the normal operating hours. um typically starting around 4 am you can see the percentages there to about 100 pm and I can have Ray kind of detail more of the the specifics on that and that's amounts to about 230 days per year about that we're operating in that window right there are times and we do do this that we we have jobs where they say hey we need to pour early it's a big commercial job um and so we have I'll call them extended operating hours kind of early in the morning 2 am to 4:00 a.m. and then late afternoon 1 to 1 to three approximately oh 19 days per year. So and then there's occasional time when it's a midnight pour and and then we got to meet a U dot a U dot job where they're saying hey you got to go 24 like they they demand that that's what they want. They said hey here's your schedule you got to pour a night so you don't disrupt traffic and that sort of thing. So, just want to show that as kind of the hours of operation. Obviously, that plays into um the noise element of this as well. Maybe just one thing to touch on before I get there. I'll go back to the to the site plan. Um it was asked about the uh height right there. So, we started when we started this process, we've submitted to the FAA. there's an online portal you

can submit there and they came back and said the height the height there can be 150 ft. So we're under that obviously. So um we've got that letter. Um but that that's the height that they've given us and we verified that with them. So I want to just quickly address that. And the max that you have identified is 104 100 104 feet. Correct. Thank you.

Yes. So, let me just get my notes here. So, in terms of what we've done, a couple examples there, but the uh get down to the sound here. So, we have hired MD acoustics. Um, and I'll just kind of walk through what they've what they've done to date and they're online as well. if we have any further questions, but I'll try to at least explain the process of how we got to where we are and the changes we've made thus far with noise to help mitigate that. So, they went out there and took samples. They set a meter out there for 24 hours, took the samples. That's the table right there. They have a number of different categories that they look at and that they measure. So, they went out there and took those two samples at one and two. Apart from that, so that's just on-site sampling. Apart from that, they went to two different plants. They went to the hurricane plant that I showed earlier and then they went up to an Ogden plant that's fully enclosed or or mostly enclosed. And that's a big part of the sound. So, you can see on this map that we started with a site plan, they did some sound modeling. And you'll notice that as we go through the next slide, the the amount of changes that we've made to get to a number that's that's meets more of the state like other other city codes for noise. So, let me just go to that and I'll go kind of through a couple things. So, what they do is they have a couple different levels. They measure like an L. These are acronyms for how that noise is defined. And there's an an L90 and an L10. And I'm not an expert on the sound, but we do have the expert on. And what they've

said or what we learned from those other codes is that the L90 um is at 50 and the L10, which is the number on the right, is at 65 at night. So, what they've done is looked at the kind of the worst condition at night and compared it to the numbers that the the standard codes in Utah use. In terms of what we've done for noise on this site, we've done a couple things already. So, we originally had the plant the plant turned a little bit. We've turned that to do a couple things. Move it off the sewer, but also to as you turn it north and south, it um moved about 100 feet, 90 to 100 feet towards the east. Um, we've enclosed it. When we first started and and was in and talking with staff, it was it was an open plant. We've now enclosed that. And what that does is it encases a lot of the um a lot of the um sound inside the building. Let me see if I can get to that. So, here's a plant in in Ogden that I was referencing. Show the architectural plans there. We we've wrapped that with an insulated panel. puts a lot of the equipment inside, the sound inside and that sort of thing. And just one other thing I wanted to note on the site plan. So that dust collector which makes some sound, we've oriented that on the east side of the building which should which greatly so the building essentially acts as a buffer there on that building. So um and then we'll use the the white noise backup. We modified the site designs where the trucks come in. Originally, we had them coming in around there, coming down there and going back out that way. By moving them, I'm going

to say to the east side, they can stage right there, come in, and then leave. So, they're where they're sitting or idling waiting to get the concrete. It moves them through where the sound is further from the from the residence right there. Um, can I can I ask you a question with regards to the rail heads and what are you going to be bringing in with the rail uh carts? Yeah. So, for the for the batch plant, it's really those are the aggregates that get there, but what comes in on the rail is the cement and fly ash. Okay.

And so, we've got a couple the rails come over here to this terminal that will be a cement and fly ash terminal. And those are the ones that are covered and they'll drop into the enclosed system. They are they're silos essentially and they that that it does drop in from the rail cars on underground and then it's piped up into silos and then it's piped over to the batch plant. And the noise studies include the noise that those carts will be making as they come and leave. We only included the batch plant itself in that study as part of the conditional use permit. That would be so the the reason they didn't include the rail is you already permit rail in that area.

Okay. Rails a permitted use. So So the noise that they may make or not make are immaterial. Okay. Gotcha. They're pneumatic too, right? Those tanks, aren't they pneumatic? And they pull it out so it mitigates the dust as well. Yeah, that like I said that that system is a very closed system. Very I hate to say clean when I'm talking about dusty stuff, but it's clean it but it's contained, right? I mean contained is a good way to say that. So sorry to interrupt. Go ahead.

Um so yeah, the just wanted to point out those items there. Um we from the latest study that the the consultant sent over, we sent it to Dawn today. We're very like like I said, we're under the numbers for the one and we are like just right there with the other ones. I mean, two decibels when you really look at it. So, um they've done a fantastic job of working through this, working with us, working with staff, trying to understand the operations and how to how to make this work. So, um let's see. Was there any other ones there? Let me just get to my notes here. So, if I'm understanding you correctly, your new study says no trees are necessary.

No, let me Oh, Greg, you went right to my next comment right here. Somebody said that.

Let me just walk through our thoughts on the trees. So, this site is it's about 2,000 lineal feet from this point right here all the way up to the the new road up there. The way we've approached this is here's the batch plant right here. And what I had our engineer do is I said, "Hey, I want to see exactly the line of sight to those houses to this side over here." And so what I did, you can see this triangle right here, and I had them draw essentially a triangle of line of sight. And then we put the trees right along there, that the bigger trees essentially, the evergreens that that Don talked about. And that's kind of what we're proposing is I mean, that's a that's a long way. I don't think I've seen anywhere that's quite that long with with the trees. But we're saying, hey, to mitigate our visual impact, there's an area in that triangle that we should put the the trees in right there. So, that's our proposal and and why we we feel that way. Okay.

Is is there going to be any kind of fencing to separate uh the property from the from the streets that are uh Yeah. So So it was agreed during the annexation process that there will be an 8ft fence. Okay. Along that entire side and then there'll be a m or sorry a block block fence. Block fence. Block fence. Block fence. Yeah. Okay. So 8ft fence I I say it's the height of a volleyball. It's about how high I can reach. And then add those trees right there. there. I think that's a pretty nice buffer right there, at least from how we see it. So, okay. And that block wall is voluntarily done by the developer, by the way, and they they put that in because that's what the neighbors wanted.

Correct. Yes. So, we got air quality, noise, trees. I'm curious about the water. So, water, um, we will have our own on-site ponds. um they'll be lined with that's part of our state code right there. What we do is if there's anything that's right around the batch plant that is collected there, they'll grade it and and get it into the those ponds right there. Um the on-site ponds that won't go into the overall storm drain. If there's other

uh Yeah. Yep. Exactly. And so, but the other storm water there that it's it's just treated as normal storm water around there um can go into any other system and we'll work with our engineer to grade that the right way and that sort of thing. The other thing that we was mentioned was air or the the water quality. So, we put on the the map these two lines right there um showing the outer limits of those um those water zones. We're in zone four and what we've said is in the in that zone four you just you got to do best management practices. Anything that's in there will follow that. And what that can mean is like say it's like a a tank of some sort of upground storage tank secondary containment that will stop anything from going down or anything like that. That's just one example. But we will have best management practices in those areas to make sure that water is protected.

So I have a question engineering. So, is the water for this project and for this property specifically, does it come off that same line off of Lond? Yes. So, my question is, we already have a fire flow issue. We already have low fire flow in that entire area. We have plans to put the other line down 3900 West, but now we add this off that exact same line of water, that same pipe. We have one pipe that feeds hundreds of homes. And now this also, how does that affect that fire flow even that much more? How much water do you guys go through in a day? Can I defer over to our our people here? Do you know that, Ray?

And and this just so you know, this isn't necessarily something that's your problem, but it is a concern for us. We have everything north of of 5600 right there comes off of one pipe off a Lond. And we have plans to add another one, but we're not there yet. And now adding this, I just worry about our fire flow in that area. I'm I'm Ray Nelson. I'm the the uh area manager for over concrete here. Normally, it doesn't take an awful lot of water for concrete. That's good. Um 300 gallons or so for 10 yards of concrete and a truck holds Yeah. 10 10 yards. 10 yards

is about what we're putting in a truck. But we do use a lot of other water that we wash down with. And that's why we have these collection ponds is so that we can wash down and keep our facility clean. Yeah. And then as that evaporates out, we can haul and move the solids back over to the pits. But it's there. It's going to take water, you know. So, moving this project forward, what's the estimated timeline roughly for when this would be up and running? I could be honest and tell you what I think, but Okay. I I plan on retiring next year and I'll never see a rod go through it,

I guess. And the reason I asked that question, just so you know, the reason I asked that question is because we we we need to move quicker on this other pipeline that I've been talking about. And so I I just, you know, maybe we'll have our pipeline in by then, and this is a mute point, but I do worry about our fireflow already out there with houses going in and everything. And now we add something that's what I would consider a heavy water user. I mean, not the craziest of things, but it is something we relatively, but we're not I mean, we're not as heavy as you think. I'm going to address this water issue right now in front of our property. We have a Sorry. Who are you?

Phil, Phil, just one real thing. You um mentioned you were going to step down. No, no, no. First things first. Um let's make sure we actually disclose the conflict so that everybody at least knows what it is ahead of time. I'm I'm You're still not voting, but we want to make sure we

No, I own this property, but with the water question, I wanted to just clarify that in the front of this property on London Highway, we just had a fire flow test. We have 8,000 gallons a minute. Fire flow is about 1,500 gallons a minute. We could solve this problem in 30 days if we wanted to. Uh all we got to do is put a bypass line around the vault that's in front of uh Western or uh Wheeler. So it could be done within 30 days. That depends what the city wants to do and so forth. So I don't see the water being a problem here. As you go further down with the head loss and the water pressure, yes, you get less and less and less water.

My concern wasn't fire flow at your project. My concern was fire flow for everybody downstream. They already have the problem, but it could be fixed. And on this on this line, we actually have two lines that that loop and come through. So, I don't see this as causing a problem, but this the additional water with I've been talking about for a long time could be solved in 30 days. Yeah. And and maybe and I'll you know and I'll be everybody knows it's not like it's private information as the person who lives at the very end of that water line almost. So that's why I'm like hm it does make me wonder. one of the last people. Wouldn't Wouldn't you agree that this is an existing problem that we have to tackle?

No, I mean but I was just trying to figure out Yeah. But I was just I wanted to know timelines and if anything I wanted we can use this as pressure to get our thing moving. Clearly anything we develop puts pressure on the issue that it's outstanding already. Yeah. We've got to resolve that problem whether the plan comes in or not. I agree. But yeah, but if this was something that could for example open tomorrow, even though we know it can't, then I would just Well, how many months do you say before a rock is thrown in that? It's a while. By the time you order a plan and you capex the project, let's just call it two years. 18 months. 18 months.

Yeah. Okay. I think we can u figure out a way to tackle the fire issue. Okay. Sorry, we've interrupted you. Keep going. So, you said it was an evapor evaporative ponds, right? And that water will be deposited there. It evaporates. You will take the the slush out and take it back to where you recycle that at the

Yeah, they recycle and we have the concrete wash out in the pond there that's cleaned out. any impact on u on that exclusion zone um for the for the water usage the source protections. Yeah. So if we do like most of this operation will definitely be outside of that. Um everything you can see where the line is there. If we do do something up in this area, we'll just make sure that it meets all the standards that are typical for storm water and water protection, whether it's secondary containment or sometimes it's just putting a concrete pad below something to to make sure that there's a barrier between that. So,

okay. So, Kent, I guess this is for you. any issues that you have seen with the project as it is uh detailed at this point with regards to the safeguarding of that water exclusion area from from what I know about the source protection zones this complies I don't I don't think we have a concern perfect thank you another quick question I had on regards to the water and you guys would be able to know this are these types of ponds anything do they normally attract birds and all that kind of stuffers because of all the stuff that's in it. They stay away from it and it's not fresh water really by any means. I've seen one a bird in there

just again that comes down to the you know we don't like to have too many bodies of water close to the airport brings in the the birds and then we have that issue as well. So but if it's I wouldn't think that birds would want to land in it's going to be more like a puddle than a pond. So there's what it's Yeah, it's going to be more like a puddle than a pond. Yeah, that's what I mean the size of this thing is not very big, right? Yeah, they're small. Okay. So, we have a question from outside the room. Mr. Phillips would like to know uh about trees on the north boundary of the property to uh shield the future residents to the north of the property. Yeah. Let me go ahead and just address kind of our thoughts on that. Thank you.

So, we looked at kind of how far that was. I mean you from there to there I think it's about 1,200 ft right there. As part of this the kind of the FA I'm going to call phase one is the batch plant. We'd like to eventually put in a future shop and and an office move some of the other operations over here. Our thoughts were that at that point we start looking at the trees along that north side at that. Thank you. So, thank you.

So, I've gone through most all my presentation at this point. I think I was a little longer than 12 12 minutes. Is there anything else? Yeah, your speaking was less than 12 minutes. You're answering our questions. Can I can I just ask two questions? One, um can you go through the specifics on the lighting? Sure. And uh the second one is I guess um you you guys are going to put some kind of signage on one of the silos. Sure. Uh could you go through that for me please? Yeah. So we we hired a consultant to do a phototric study. Okay.

Um and the way that I asked them to do that right above let me see if I can get to a picture of the a batch plant here. So, this is this is where the trucks come through. Typically, we have lights shining down on both sides of that just so for safety as they're as they're coming through. And that's going to be on the east side of the plant, right? The the the throughput's on the south side, but yeah, it'll be kind of angled down. I don't know if I can go back. So, they'll go right underneath there. So those lights are are essentially down and at like 30 feet up looking down where the the trucks pass underneath that.

Okay. We also just because I've seen it on some plants, we had them model it up at 100 ft and I had them put four lights up there and I said, "Hey, just show me what that does." And so I said, "But make sure it goes down and doesn't shine into the neighborhood." Right. And so they did that and and the photometric I think it's in your plan or in your packet. I sorry I omitted it from here. Okay. But the detail is by doing that and using those lights, it did not go over zero foot candles at the property line. And now we've even moved the plant like I said 90 to 100 feet that way. So from what they're the photometric showing is that it should be there and and that's using like I said at 100 ft light. So and sorry your other question

the signage. Oh the signage. So, let me just go to a picture kind of what we I would imagine it will be facing either south or east. There's no point in facing it. We're going to go to the west. So, no, you're right. So, we do like to put our logo on there. We were talking with Dawn just before this about that would what that would be like, but we feel like that's pretty close to about the size that that meets the city ordinance as it was written in that condition. The 25% and and that's not going to have a life shining on it that uh

I don't that we had hadn't even considered that so I guess not. So, no, I'm just, hey, listen. I I've done franchising all over the world, and I I want my logos to be seen, and I understand that, but if you put a line on that, then that just destroys your uh your photometrics and all of that stuff. So, I mean, we'll see it during the day, but in the middle of the night, there's nobody want to be looking at the silo. So, you're okay with no lighting, I'm assuming? I Yes, because I didn't know we were hadn't even considered it. Okay, good. Don't consider it. Just paint it.

So, you may or may not know the answer to this and it's probably completely unrelated, but how many new jobs will this create by having this? That was my last question. I'll let Ray answer that one. Yeah, he knows. This is where that number one question that you were concerned with, Carter. That's where my brain went to. How does it affect in a positive economic way the city? Thank you. Right. Right now we we have I think 23 drivers 23 mixer drivers and we could we could realistically within a year or two be 35 36 drivers at this location. Okay. Plus the plus the staff on site, right?

Yeah. Plus plus your dispatch people, your loader operators, your trucks bringing stuff back and forth. It's a little different than where we're at now in the pit where a loader can take care of us. So considering assuming zero today when this is up and running, what's the incremental jobs that uh that are going to be generated? 15 to 35ish. Is that what new jobs the delta between that? No, I would think I think that you're probably going to have probably 15 25 new jobs. Okay.

Okay, perfect. Thank you. One one thing that he didn't mention that if you've ever been out a concrete plant when they're loading they don't sit at idle. Trucks are wound up so that they can barrels can turn quickly and the material can go in it. Um, the good thing about moving that the the truck pointing west is that the back of the truck is facing back towards the east and that's where the noise is generated and as opposed to the coming in from the west. Sure.

And it would be going right back towards the residential areas and that that'll make a huge difference. Plus the we talked about before uh they were concerned about loaders and that sort of things running. Well, these big stock piles, they're going to be on the other sides of those stock piles. Yeah. Um to kind of help stop that quite a bit of that noise as well. Can I ask one uh about queuing? I noticed we put in there to require you to do a study for queuing. Um I I was one honestly I I'm I'm I feel like we we are asking that a lot of people and I'm not sure. Happy to

the need of that. So just talk to me about your curing queueing concerns and if that's something that we really should even worry about or not. Happy to address it because I think we can meet it. So what we did is we laid out how many trucks we think at a maximum would fit on the site and this is like saying everything and so that's why you see I think it's 14 trucks right there and then you could fit another like couple right there. So it basically all stays on site for the how they queue. So we assume that's kind of to address that say hey look that they can queue on site they're not going to back up onto the roadway because sometimes I this is just one of my personal ones is I some if we ask for studies it just adds costs right

and I' I'd like us to be able to look at that one with some degree of rationale thinking and just say is that really going to be a problem can we just put in something like this that says no queuing on the streets I think that fine and I hope we can illustrate that yes

yeah without having to make you pay for a study right like that Yeah, I wasn't too concerned about that, mayor. Um the one of the questions I asked myself when I went through the site is um when you get out to 56 and you either make a left or a right off of there that um you have the rail road that goes right through that intersection. It's almost a pretty narrow area. So, if you have some trucks backing up to make a lefthand turn, uh, that may make it a little bit tight in the future when things are up and running.

Well, I'm not thinking so much on the public road as the the like outside of the neighborhood right here out of the property. Yeah. If we just if we just put in there, say you can't queue on the public street, right? Y make that good enough. How long does it take to fill a cement truck with this plant? Two minutes. So you make I mean I don't think you could queue up you you would never have two cement trucks leaving at the same time anyways because it takes two minute I mean one's out and by the time he gets to the light the next one's barely even leaving. It'd be hard for two of them at most to ever. Oh okay.

Yeah. The only the only thing is this isn't the only industrial project we're going to have in that industrial zone and that street that interse but it doesn't impact in my mind what we're looking at right here. So another great U dot project we'll do sometime. Sure. Okay. Anything else council? If not, I will I don't have any more. How long how long is a conditional use permit good for in this situation? Forever. Forever. Okay. As long as they're there for as long as the use is there.

And does it doesn't go with the applicant. Goes with the property, right? So they could sell it to another company if they wanted to or anything. It would run with the land as long as it's continued to be used. If they go like we do with most of our grandfathering more than a year without a use or progress, then yeah, we would at that point have to redo it. And they're allowed to make changes to the property without I mean can they expand make do all that stuff without coming back or how does that work? Any any expansion of the uh conditional use. So again if they come in and bring in their lumber stuff and it's an approved use kind of thing doesn't matter. Yeah. But if they expand the conditional use part of this they would need to come back to you. They'd come back through. Okay. They had a second batch plan. Yeah. Or something like that.

I mean if there are minor modifications that's engineering, right? Engineering will deal with any minor stuff like that. But anything that potentially expands the impact on neighboring properties, we will bring it back to you. So Kent, I have a Is there any outstanding items that need to be cleared up on this or have they resolved all the concerns um that were presented to them in the thick Californiaesque uh requirements that we ask of them?

I think Don's probably better to answer that than me. He Don and and Greg uh met before this meeting going through some of those final details. Well, just a second before you answer that question. I' I'd like you to circle back uh now that you've seen the noise uh data and make a comment on that on your estimation if you wouldn't mind. That's that's exactly where I'm headed. Okay, perfect. Yeah, Don Maduro City Engineering get off or

uh Well, we don't have the noise Well, I don't we don't have the noise study in front of us. Well, I was just looking through this um as the discussion took place and in summary, this this is the conclusion is that the project plus ambient noise level will increase the existing ambient noise level by up to 15 dBA at the residential receptors. This level or these levels fall below the daytime 55 dBA L90 and 70dba L10 guidelines and the nighttime 65dba L10 guidelines. They're up to 2 dB above the nighttime 50dba L90. Um I'll be honest with you, some of this gets above my pay grade. So

do I do understand averages? Uh but so the L90 and the L10, if I told if I tried to explain it, I would completely butcher it. But we do have the noise consultant here and uh if if she was willing to kind of uh maybe explain this a little bit in layman's terms, this my suggestion would be for the council uh because the and and uh give her opinion that this meets the condition that we propose that this meets industry standards. That's I think that would be helpful council. Okay. I I would suggest where where is she online or Oh, she's online. Okay. Yeah, that'd be great. Explain that.

I'm not touching in a minute. What those numbers mean? Let her pic. Can you hear me? Okay, we can. Okay, good. Yeah, the this microphone's not my best. Um, so in in comparison, I I looked at just some local Utah codes. This is the most common one that I see repeated throughout the state. I've seen it in rural and in city areas. Hey, Claire. Um, essentially, yeah, can you hear me? Can you tell us who you are and what you do, please? Yeah, absolutely. Thank you. Um,

so my name is Claire Pincock. Um, I am an acoustical consultant and so this is pretty much all I do. I do environmental noise surveys. Um, our office is in Provo. And so we, you know, we did this study by, uh, taking measurements of the reference in Ogden. Um, calibrated this model to that plant and then added a few extra things like he's talked about like the wall. Um, and and that's how we got these numbers. And then I compared those numbers like I mentioned to that common Utah code that we see all over the state. So um L90 is basically the noise level that you would see exceeded for 90% of the time. So just sort of that baseline. This is the noise level that is always going on. This long-term noise L10 is more short-term. That's the noise level that would be exceeded 10% of the time. So more infrequent stuff like, you know, a backup beeper as opposed to something running constantly like an idling truck. Um, so when we're looking at that, they they meet the daytime levels um for for both that short term and that long term. Um, and for the nighttime, we are good for that short time. for for the long-term one. Um it's still two dB above. For reference, uh two dB is is not very much. I mean, that's that's really close, especially considering when we started it was more like in the 60s. Um so, you know, they they're still working with me and figuring out what more they can do. And so this is just from my talks with Greg. This is just

what they're they're currently looking at. Um for reference, uh like a two decibel difference is usually not noticeable. Um 10 dB would be like a perception of a doubling in noise level. Um and so yeah, I hope any other any other questions for Does does that uh model Claire include um any trees in it?

No. Um overall trees have to be pretty dense and there has to be quite a lot of them for it to make a difference. When it comes to noise, trees make the most difference psychologically. So, we're trying to get I apologize, but we're trying to get the city wants it to get down to 55. Is that the number that we're shooting for? 65 for the the She'll correct me. L10 and then 50 for the L90. Did I get that right, Claire, or did I say that backwards? Yes. Yeah, that that's what I talked about with the city and and with the um project.

Didn't the test show that the current ambient sound is already higher than that anyways? sometimes. Yeah. Just the noise highway 56 and our airport. I mean, for people's reference, I just Googled it. A dishwasher is like 45 to 50 dB for I mean, if you buy a cheaper one, if you buy expensive one. So, it's like we're not talking a lot of sound here. So, for for reference, um at at 3:00 a.m. right now, the L90 level is about 40. And so, that's just currently what it is. But then you know when you get during some of the busier morning hours when you get that peak levels when the airport starts going when people start getting out yes you do go above that 50 we get above that 55 even.

So how can we as a city ask them to lower the ambient sound. So um when the ambient exceed that limit generally the goal of the project is to then meet the ambient. However, typically when I'm doing a noise study, the requirement is to meet um you you do want to look at that low level. So although yeah, during 6 a.m. it's not going to be louder than what's going on around them, but during 4:00 a.m. it will be. And so, you know, we kind of want to look at the high hours and the low hours. Fair enough. Okay. Thank you.

So, I have a question, too. So, does our code require trees for the noise if we're already going to meet the noise requirements or is that just something we're asking them to do? Do we have any backing for that? Ask is my question. I the trees are not for the noise. The trees are trying to make two incompatible uses compatible. is aesthetics is basically

that's what it is. So if you if you look in ordinance and I don't have it in front of me under the conditional use permit uh specifically related to industrial zones it ask a question that's in your staff report that specifically uh requests will landscape help basically. Uh so it is a consideration per ordinance in the conditional use permit. So, does the block wall not do that where it's going to be about six feet tall? I assume that makes a difference. Claire could probably certainly answer

because they're not going to be able to really see it in that neighborhood because the elevation drops off. I mean, and so anyway, I I'm not anti or protree. I'm just I'm I'm more along the line of are we asking for something that we can't support in our ordinances and and anything else? And is it an an ask? That's I'm going to make a comment to that. I had a boss that one told once told me when you're trying to sell something and the guy nods in the positive, move on. Yeah. Don't you did the triangle of view and you're willing to put trees on there and that would vote against the aesthetics if it didn't have trees. Scott will say no if it doesn't have trees. Move on. It's Well, but it's a fair question, Robert.

It is. But the thing is, if they don't have to, then then why? That's that's that's more of my concern is there's two sides of this and and we don't just represent one, you know, we're trying to bring something fill the tree full of birds that make a lot of noise at 4 or 5 in the morning and that's all people will hear is the birds in the trees. No, I I I I think it's important. Uh I think the ordinance supports it,

but I I think what we've been going through is uh more of a compromise, right? Uh and and all of our responses are in that staff report. I think when we get to the next meeting, staff will want good direction on which how you want these conditions specifically

written. Uh and if I may, Claire, I I just had a question and and I think it pertains to what you were asking, Carter. When we first started down the road of the noise study, I picked u because we have a lack of a noise ordinance uh EPA guidelines which are more of an average of every hour uh over the the whole 24hour period. This noise study and cla you can certainly tell me if I get off the rails here is more of looking what at what other cities require as opposed to that EPA standard with the 55dB that that you were looking at. That's that's the one that's in your staff report.

So I think by the time we get your next packet out, we'll have this next noise study in there. So So you guys can take a look at that. Rand, any any comment on that, Claire? Well, that's exactly it. We um we adjusted based on guidance from the city where we we first presented that EPA average standard. um the city felt like it it it wasn't properly addressing maybe the potential impact and so we shifted over to this other standard that we see throughout and compared it to these early morning hours and I think this is a much better representation of what actually will happen out here and how it would be experienced. Okay, thank you. I

I have a question for Randall. When it comes to conditional use permits, I mean I think we we do them so rarely. This is my first one in thank goodness for that

two and a half years and we have very few uses that even require them. Um but you compare that to other government bodies around us that I know are going through conditional use permit process right now. And so just explain to me really quick and to the public. So on theirs it seem for other government bodies it seems like they can kind of pick whatever conditions they want. We've kind of already I mean can we could we add a condition of trees to a conditional use permit or is that not our how we normally do them? Here's the conditions we need you to meet. Once you meet them, you're done. Anything else on that gravy or can we just be can we add things to this conditional use permit that we want to see?

So, you can add whatever you can state will mitigate any of the potential harms of what they're doing for the conditional use permit, not everything else to the neighboring communities. Okay? So, you can't just add trees because I like I like trees. But you can add trees if you go, you know what, this is gonna be a 100 foot tall tower here and that's going to take away from the beauty of the local areas. Um, we want to add more trees. So, we'll add a 12ft tree to cover the 100 foot tower.

Well, and again, you mentioned it earlier, right? So, if you have an 8 foot tall fence and you're at a distance, you can measure pretty quickly how tall the tower depending on how far away the viewer is and how tall they are. um you can measure that pretty quickly. You add you go from 8 feet to 12 feet to 16 feet, you can change that height and how far the distance is. But again, the goal here is mitigation, not complete elimination because otherwise we'd be like, okay, trees along the entire thing and they trees all have to touch each other. Yeah, we'd chase them off in a heartbeat. The cost would be so high they would take them 40 years to even make a dime. That we can't do. That's a lot of trees. Trust me, the cost for these, as we talked about it, even if we just did

the south, the west, and the top, what were we? We were in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, I think, for trees. Um, and that's 30 ft apart, a lot of trees. So, if you start cutting that to 10 feet apart, you're talking in the millions. Um, so that's why mitigation reasonable. That's what we're aiming for. So, like when we when you have Scott Phillips, for example, he has indicated he is in favor of having him along the north side, but it's sight reasons. He doesn't say that I am. Is will it impact the properties to the north? Well, the sound probably won't because now it's substantially further than the property to the west that we're kind of on the edge on.

Um, it's sight. What are they going to see when they look to the south? Do they still get to see the mountains or are they going to see a 100 foot tall tower um with perhaps an FA light on top of it blinking red, which we're all used to with cell phone towers anyway. Um, so that's what you're looking for. Don't please don't just add things because you can. No, I was just curious.

Well, and that's why I asked because it is an unreasonable ask. I mean, we need to not be in the in the business of asking for unreasonable things because we like them. Um, it needs to be reasonable and needs to be supported with code. And so, if they can go without the expense of the trees, even if they said they were going to do them, let's not have them do it. I mean, you know, this is they're in a business and they're trying to make money and it's an additional cost. And and I think just purely looking at a legal side, the triangle that they did, I think we could support pretty easily legally as a reasonable ask. You could probably extend that depending on elevations as they turn out for some of their concrete mixing trucks because they're going to be driving a little further than the north. So, one of the things we've told them is to make sure that those headlights stay below the 8 foot tall fence so it's not hitting across. Right. That could be a potential one as well if they can't pull that off. just keep

they might need to put something else. You get to the north end again the question comes down to probably more than anything because the properties there are not yet developed. Yeah. It would come down to a question of could they show a decrease in property value because that would be the harm now wouldn't be a harm to a resident there now because the residents will be moving into the potential nuisance. It's would it cause a decrease in property value to the properties to the north. I haven't seen anything showing that. And so, as much as I'd love to have him on the North right now, it's going to be a harder ask. That was going to be I probably need more information before I could say whether I could win or lose that one in a lawsuit.

No. And my question wasn't I'm not I have zero issues with what they want to do with the trees. It was more just conditional uses in general. Like, who sets these? Yeah. Are we the ones that set what we want the conditional uses or is there a list of them already and as long as they hit them, we're good? I don't So, the the ordinance the ordinance in it sets it in the direction of staff doing the heavy lifting for you, which I'm going to tell you right off the bat has been Don. Like 99% of the heavy lifting has been Don. So, if I could give a standing ovation to Don, I would.

Sorry, Don. You're probably embarrassed now. Um, and then we hand it to you. Much like Congress does with the president's budget, however, you can shred it if you want to. Um, I encourage you not to because to put it bluntly, the closest thing we have to at least a pretend expert right now is Don. Um, because he has spent the many, many hours to get there. So, I would ask you to give a lot. He almost called you an expert, Don. Almost. Almost. Said you were close. He doesn't quite meet the qualifications like in court, but he's as close as we have for this city right now. It's almost an insult. Almost a compliment. Um, a backhanded compliment.

Exactly. Um, I would encourage you to give a lot of weight to that. But again, I I think what Kent has said is also true. You see the red lines are kind of the final things we're talking about. Most of where we were has narrowed down to inches rather than miles in the difference between where they're at and where we're at. Yeah. No, I'm good. I was just

Randall. And I may if I I can assume then from what you're saying and everything that I've seen in the last week and and obviously from the presentations is that we have kind of funneled ourselves into an acceptable compromise from a business perspective as well as from a city and staff perspective. Yes. Other than that couple of things that were in the red lines, right? If you if you remember back in the packet, there were a few things that they didn't fully agree on, right? That's going to be us to be able to say which ones which way do we go.

Yeah, that's you don't have to agree with even the ones that we don't disagree on, but you're going to have to explain to us why that's different because what Don has put together for you in your packets is what I'm going to use if this ever went to court. Sure. Right. And so if you go different than that, think of that same standard. help me meet it to explain why we have some substantial evidence explaining why you're asking for something different. So at this point any actual things we need to discuss or we've gotten close enough now that all the red lines have been answered. What no in your packet there were a couple that they disagreed with the

what I'm hoping you will do because I think you have all the information from both parties as to why we want those slight differences by next week. Please look through those and see where you're at. You've got a lot to read through. If you can't sleep at night, this is it. Um, go through those and decide when you go to vote next week where you want those red lines to go and you can split them, you can throw them out, you can do whatever you think the evidence supports and that will help me if we ever get sued over this. So, at this stage, are we okay to open the public hearing? Yeah, I think so. Okay. Did you have anything else you wanted to sum with? Quick comment just on the the conditions essentially.

So, we've gone back and forth on that. There's red lines. I think there's really two that we're just like, "Hey, I think we Let me make sure I got that." Can Can you pull these up at the same time he's trying to um One is the trees that I just explained which is number I think he's got it in number page 21. Yeah. P. And so that's obviously I've shared our point of view on that. So that's probably the number one. That's number one is uh you want to get down to neighborhood compatibility number two, but it's really just the which page is that? Just really that comment right there. It's probably which one?

All at a minimum 10 feet tall with a two inch caliper at four feet above grade. Yeah. Then then along the north side, so it's just above three. Um that paragraph right there a minimum the one that starts with that oh the at a minimum staff suggestion the height of the proposed stockpile be provided along the west side and then on the north side and we've obviously shared our reasoning for the triangle essentially. So that'd be the one. And then just towards the very end there um we just feel that the last um this is in the very last pa very last page um

page 22 22 there's just some stuff about the the sewer and and we talked to Kent about this but it just didn't feel like it was like a conditional use thing. It's more of a site plan thing. So maybe taking that out. So, was it basically don't build on top of the sewer? Was that was it basically? No, just a storm offsite storm drain. Okay. It's it we feel like that's just it's just we don't see in a conditional use permit more in a site plan review. So, so Kent, you receive these comments.

Yeah. So what and what he was just talking about that uh the master plan storm line along the south side of this property. I mean that that doesn't relate directly to the conditional use. That relates to the site development um regardless of what was in that site development whether it was something that required a conditional use permit or not. So that's an issue we'll just deal with through the through the site plan process. So it's not that you're saying you don't want to put it in, you just don't want it to be part of this. It's like let's make it part of the construction process, not part of when they put asphalt down or buildings, then that's when that will come to play. One thing I do want to note, just make sure it's on the record. Um, is the conditional use permit cannot give them permission to violate our ordinances otherwise. Correct.

So, if that makes sense. So, a lot of these kind of things that do have to come through in engineering standards and building and all that kind of stuff would still apply. And I think that's why they're nervous on is that if we start creating duplicates in the conditional use permit as well as in our ordinance, what happens then? Okay. This is not a development agreement, so it doesn't give them statutory authority to go outside of our ordinance. Gotcha. Okay. Any other I double checking, but yeah, I think I've I've said on. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Okay. We'll open the public hearing.

Good evening, Tom Jet. As it uh I sit on the planning commission, we hashed this out for almost an hour and a half and probably 15 minutes at an hour and a half was discussing the trees and the planning commission unanimously agreed that their concept of where to place the trees was a a fair and reasonable idea to make this a successful project. So then a lot of thought, a lot of talk, a lot of discussion went into that just in that in that triangle that they portrayed that was that was well hashed out. Cool. Thank you. Thank you, Tom. Anybody else? Okay, seeing none, we'll close the public hearing, entertain a motion.

Mayor, I move that we put this on action for next week. Have a motion and a second. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Okay. Thank you. Thanks for your time and and uh being willing to help to still grow in our community. Okay, next one. Next week we'll have a tie vote. So uh consider a resolution approving the municipal water uh wastewater planning program. I don't either.

Jeff. Hi Jeff Leonard, the wastewater treatment plant superintendent. Um The MWPP, the municipal wastewater planning program is mandated by the state. It's a survey we have to do every year. Um, the purpose of it is to assist owners of municipal sewer collection systems and wastewater treatment works in evaluating the technical, operational, and financial conditions and future requirements for these facilities. So, Randy and I are going to go over just a brief overview. Um you have the whole survey. Um the treatment plant serves all of Cedar City. It serves all of Eno and 997 homes in the county. Uh we have six wastewater treatment operators, one laboratory director, uh and three in our pre-treatment program. And if the pre-treatment program all ha also has kind of a addendum in there for you u which shows what they do. They they inspect uh 293 restaurants and food trucks every year, 20 permitted commercial businesses. They have 51 slug control plants that they go out and monitor this stuff every year. They have to look at every every site. Uh 157 vehicle maintenance and car repair uh centers that they have to look at. Um all the commercial industry is permitted by them. So, they have to go out and do inspections there. Um, back to the treatment plant though, we had zero bypasses or overflows. Uh, we had zero exceedences of our Utah pollution discharge elimination system permit. So, we're doing pretty good. Our

average influent flow was 3.24 million gallons a day for 2025. Our current capacity were built out to 4.8 million gallons. Currently we are at 67% of capacity. Okay. Our average BOD loading BOD is biochemical oxygen demand is essentially um it's the food for the bacteria in our processes because it's a biological process. Hey Jeeoff, can I ask you a real quick question? You said we're at 67% capacity. Yes. What's the percentage we get to before we have to start designing the next add-on? I was going to get to that, but I'm sorry. We'll go right to it.

I had the same question in my mind's on that. So, there is no set guideline within state code, but I called our permit writer. He in turn called the state engineer and they said that the state would like us to be looking at upgrades at 70%. Now, in that 607% you said of flow. That's based off of the average number of 3 24 What about our peaks? So what are what's our peak? So we is the average. What's our peak? We're working off of the 4.8 which would be just be a constant flow. Our peaks I think can go to off the top of my head I think it's six. Okay.

So or 6.2 something like that. So in that world in the wastewater treatment world you just you always stay on averages. You don't worry about the peaks as much. Yeah. Okay. Because we get a peak every day. Okay. You know

that's fine. I just was curious. Um, so these three numbers I'm going to give you are the key ones that that are going to tell you that we're getting very close. So the BOD loading, uh, average influent is 300 milligrams a liter. Um, our effluent is 11 milligrams a liter. We are at 67% capacity of BOD. Um our total suspended solids, our influent uh average is 284 milligrams a liter. Our effluent going out is 8.5 milligrams a liter which these are good numbers going out. We are at 70% of design capacity for TSS loading. Um, a number of times this year we've had BOD samples of the water coming in that we've done in our lab that were 435 and last week it was 500 milligrams a liter. We can't treat the water if it continues to be that strong. So 70% is probably a good number to use to start thinking about it once we hit 78%. Now, if you if you look out in the industry, if you were to do a Google search on when we should do this or use AI or whatever, because I tried all those, it gives you 70 to 90% somewhere in that window, you should upgrade. But if you're building a lot of new homes, you have businesses coming in, you have businesses that are expanding, um, we need to start looking at it a lot sooner because when you get into that point where you are at 70%, 80%, 90%, it's very hard for us to maintain the balance of biology, being able to put the oxygen in, being able to treat the water. There's there's a lot of things that could happen that could push us out of compliance.

Well, and I think that's partly why uh Paul phrased it with looking at the design, right? Because once we get to that point, you don't also don't build the plant in in six months, right? So, you almost need to start looking at the design cost, getting that part done so that then when we get up over 70 and you're into the 80%, then we're starting to build before we reach the point where they got a quick question. Does this your information does that include the new stuff that the Western Dairy is putting into the system or is that is that still coming? That's still coming.

So the the dairy is expanding and their process um is going to give us more BOD and more water u significantly more um and we're kind of limited on what they can or what we can give them. In other words, what they can give us, what we allow them to give us. Exactly. So, um, that might become expensive for them to have to treat the water more, but that's only in the first phase. In their second phase, it's going to be even bigger.

So, are they the main trigger of the you said the BOD that got up to the 500. Are there other triggers that make that fluctuate? You said it was down at 400, then spikes at 550 or whatever. So, two of them, two of the spikes that we detected, we know where they came from, but I really don't want to say right now. Well, what what kind of thing is it that spikes those? It's not usually a residential place. It's more of a commercial industrial Absolutely. site.

Yeah. So is there a way to um based on what we know that we have already coming through plus the future that has been identified where we can model and say we have to pull the trigger on a study and moving forward with expansion at a particular stage. I'm not sure what you're asking. I think we're there. Yeah, we're there. I think the last time we talked about this, we were thinking 20 2030 would be the estimated time to start the engineering.

Um, but that's that's a that's not a firm line in the sand. It could be accelerated. It could go backwards. If we wait till 2030, we're going to put half the businesses that want to come here to Port 15, the dairy. We're going to put them out of business. Yeah. It doesn't sound like we sounds to me the engineering needs to get started. We're we're behind the ball actually right now. I think we're close. I think I think we need to get going. I think we probably should get going. Yeah, we should go out have a study done that says this is your best options.

Yeah, it needs to get started. So if we pushed it back on the commercial industries, it's probably quite an expense to have them treat the water before they release it or is that pretty common in this uh realm? Normally what we do is we give them a B bod limit and a TSS limit and and we permit them and then they are to monitor that and test it on a regular basis and give us those reports. It's not uncommon for our industrial users to do pre-treatment before they discharge into the publicly owned treatment works. It's it's very common for most of those guys to do a lot of pre-treatment.

I wonder if that just I'm not saying that we should buy time, but if that actually would mitigate the problem uh and buy us a little time if there if there's some big offenders. Yeah, I mean it it would, but we also have people coming in, new homes being built and what what we've seen is flow has not gone up as much as we would expect, but BOD and TSS are going up because of lowflow fixtures less water, right? Yeah. Yeah.

Well, that's all I have for you. I'll give you Uh, Randy Clo, Cedar City wastewater collections. Um, my part of this, um, we had zero sanitary sewer backups over the 20 25. Um, maintained over we maintained over 275 miles of sewer line and 4 uh 4,150 manholes. Um, last year we cleaned over 57 miles of sewer line. Um, we videoed 51 and a half miles of sewer line. Um, that sounds like a crappy job.

Yeah, it um we replaced 17 uh sewer lines um them. That was a lot of that was that 200 South project you guys

um seen that we were going through. Um totaling 2,43 ft of line replaced and uh four new manholes. Um we maintain four um active sewer lift stations. The biggest one right now is a 2.5 MGD. That's the Iron West one. This will kind of give you a little outlook on the plant. We are adding the 5 MGD lift station right now out at uh BZI at the inland port. So that's going to add a large area in there. Um

so 659 new residential um sewer connections in Cedar City and Iron County. Um 37 new commercial connections. Um 696 new people served. 9,898 effective residential connections in Cedar City and Iron County. 1924 commercial connections for Cedar City and Iron County totaling of 11,822 connections. So I have one question. You something you mentioned that new lift station out at BZI or out there at the whatever you want to call it 415 the depot. Yeah.

That I mean that thing is overbuilt for the future, right? It's not that they're not using anywhere near that much now. They're not going to be putting that much into the system. It's just it was built to supply what comes in the future. Yes. Okay. So that's Iron County, Cedar City. It's a joint. Yeah. Join bill. And that number it's What's the digit? I'm assuming it's millions. Yes. Gallons. What? MGD. So it's Yeah. So it's it's actually So it's bigger than our entire It's bigger than what our plant's actually designed for. So wow. It's big. But it's plan. Yeah. Okay. It's not online yet, but

No, but it's also built for what, 20 years of development? Well, I thought that, but I we put a lot of Well, Phil's put a lot of sewer lines in and stuff that we I never thought in my career that I'd ever see, but it's it's it's happened. So, Gotcha. Yeah, that 10 mile line running pretty full. Exactly. So, any more questions? Nope. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Randy. The resolutions have to go on action, Renon. Okay. Well, then, mayor, I would move that we put this uh agenda item on for action next week. I have a motion. Second and a second. All in favor? I. Any opposed?

Great. Next one. Consider bids for 4500 West sewer rehabilitation project.

Okay, I'll I'll talk to this and then Randy can jump in as as needed. So, we did open bids for this sewer rehabilitation project. Um the uh low bidder is Advanced Lining LLC. We do not have um they're they're actually from out of town as you might expect on a specialty project like this. That's pretty common. Um the the next closest I don't think Skyline Creations is within the city even if they were that's more than 5% above the low bid. So um there is no local preference issues associated with this particular bid award. Um the uh as we look at we did have a base bid and an alternate bid. This is and this project is Randy correct me if I'm wrong. This is entirely lining manholes. We don't have lines we're lining with this one. Just manholes. And uh if there's any questions about why we would do that, you get a lot of hydrogen sulfide gases in the sewer tends to eat those concrete manholes and concrete pipes. So, that's that's something we're looking at on that. The uh the when we look at the budget for this project, we um we do have with the the funding from last year that got carried over and the funding that was budgeted this year, we do have um enough money to do this project, the 608,000 along with um other uh commitments that have been made to those uh available funds. we we still have sufficient that 608 includes the additive alternate uh bid items as well. So we're recommending on this the award of the the total project base bid and alternate to uh advanced lining LLC.

Kent, so if we could buy 50 manholes for 273, is that an additional 62 manholes for the 343? So, are we getting 112 manholes? Yes. Yes. Okay. You meant 334, right? Yeah, that's exactly the number I uh So, what uh what manholes are you doing here? This is going all the way from 1600 north to the plant on the 4500 line. 4500 west trunk line. So, didn't we do those? No. So from 1600 to the south, they were done. But when we did the first two phases of that, we didn't line them.

We didn't line it. That was before we put that into our I wish we would have because it's went up a lot since then, but Oh, okay. So you're taking from there all the way to the plant. Yes. And this is why we're really want to push this, get it done now. We're putting that 5 MGD lift station in there. It's a 16inch force main. So, it's going to sit in there. If we don't put a lot of flow into that new lift station, it's going to turn septic. It's like three miles long. Yeah. So, it'll turn septic in there. By the time it's there on the 4500, it's going to be septic. There's going to be a lot of gases. We're going to have some because it's not super high flow. Not yet. Not yet. And so, that it'll sit there mostly.

Right. But what it does, it's good to store the gases up. We got a lot of uh new construction going out there through the county. So this gives us ability to put solid lids on to take care of all of our odor complaints and stuff. So this helps out. So is that 500,000 is that the total budget for the year that's adding the whole year's 500 or is that just part of the year's I mean how much do we budget yearly? So this year's budget and correct me if I'm wrong Randy is the 500,000 but we did have some carryover from last year. So we have sufficient funds to do the entire project as it was just bid. And when you say this year is you mean ending July 1, correct? Okay. So yeah,

during our current fiscal year. So starting July, if it's in the budget again, it would be a new 500 we put into the same pot, right? And so our intent would So we're pretty much already there timewise. So and our intent would be to complete this project before the end of this current fiscal year. If by some chance that didn't happen, then we would be asking to carry those over. I'm assuming we're so specialized. Randy, do we have any experience with any of these? You're fine with the choice that was. Yes, we've we've matter of fact, we've got numerous manholes in our system. Plus, they've done our grit chamber at the entrance of the plant where we when we bring in debris, they it's sitting out in the environment and it's held up very well. It's it's very the same company.

Yes. Yes. They we we pre-qualify these. We got burnt a few years back. So, we're very touchy who we approved let to do this because it's it's not about there's a lot of good product out there. It's not about the product, it's who's applying it. And so I, if you read in this bid package, we made sure that they're pre-qualified and they have they have certifications and that's why we named out certain products because they have to those products make them be certified applicators and they have to have somebody on site to warranty it. Sounds good. Okay. I think didn't we use advancement on the the name sounds familiar. I've used a couple of the others, but I thought we used advanced two before. We have. Yes.

Mayor, I move that we put this on consent. I have a motion. Second. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Fantastic. And just for the clarification, that is to go with Yeah. Advance the the recommended. Yep. Recommended. Okay. Uh, next one. Board appointments for Rapex and Recreation Board. reappoint Vicky Christian, Mark Johnson, Chad Westwood. How long have they been? Some of those have been in there for a while, haven't they? So, when we looked at it in general, um, yes, Vicki has particularly she's been the chair for a long time. No, no, Chad's the chair currently. Vicki is

No, Vickiy's been there for a long time and she has served as chair for a long time. Yeah. I don't know if she's the current chair, but she has served as chair for a I just remember in last year's meeting, I thought I came and Chad was the one chairing the meeting. Maybe she wasn't there. I think he wasn't there. Yeah. Um, so we talked through that. We we visited with uh with Ken Nilson and he he asked that I leave these people on this year and then next year we start cycling people off. So I You saying in July or you talking January?

Yes, this this one will be for this season, right? So, these will be reappointed to stay on the committee for this season, which is the um the meetings that will happen in June and July. And then by the time we get to this point next year, then we're going to get him on a good cycle and start start rotating them through. I know Vicki and Chad. Who's Mark? Should I know who Mark Johnson is? He's the He used to own uh I don't know if he still does. The print shop that was in the old pizza factory building, right? No, he just ran it. He doesn't own it anymore. He sold it, right? Yes. Yeah. Oh, okay. Okay. But that's where I know him from is is that business. I was just curious. He's a big baseball guy. Yeah. 30 some years ago he had a nice jump shot, but I'm not sure about now.

Well, I'm sure 30 years ago you had a nice jump shot and I'm sure you don't now. So, what um when do these meetings cuz I'm on that board. That's why I'm asking. Sorry. Moment of personal privilege. When do these when does the raptune? It's not till June. We we might throw one meeting at the end of May. We're still working on that cuz we have some available dates that we'll send out to the committee probably in the next couple weeks to see what you guys can do. That's fine. I was just curious. I knew it was coming. It's coming. Okay. Uh, mayor, with that, I would move that we put that on consent. I have a motion. Second. All in favor? I. Any opposed? Fantastic. Out of this.

Is there any public comments? If not, make a motion that we close this meeting and go into the reasonably imminent litigation. Uh, close session. Second. Second. He beat you. I tried. We got a We got a roll call because it's going to close session. Uh, Council Cox. I I I I thank you.