Planning Board - Regular Meeting

Go. Okay. Um, we'll bring a meeting to order. I'm Don Berubi, 135 River Road. Kim McDaniel, select board rep. Carrie Mcadin, community development director. Kristen Hayden, regular planning board member to Colonial Terrace. Uh, Casey Deco, alternate for Hopkilm Road. Levi Barry, alternate 19 Laurel Drive. Ben Davis, Ninewheeler Road. Michael Lton, three Asa Drive. Sandy Crystal, one Shore View Drive. I'd like to introduce our new land use assistant. Well, I'll let you introduce yourself actually. I am Don Pingo. Happy to be here with you tonight. Welcome. Great. Thank you.

We have a new alternate Leette. Thanks for joining us. Um, so we need two alternates, right? Me too. Yeah. Five regulars. And Ben will be voting. So Chris regular. So um Ben and Casey.

All right. Public hearings. Um application number 211-25. Daniel Tur Turbo. Um, change of use site plan application to add the use list and application to add the use listed and 5.1g motor vehicle sales and rentals located at 28 Ryan Road. That's you. I'm David Stewart. So, the landlord is Dan Teran. Okay. Yeah. Come on up to the Come on up, David. Sit first.

Yeah. Okay. And tell us Yeah. Just tell us what you want to do here and a little bit.

Yeah. Um Okay. So, I have um the repair shop or the repair facility there um now and um I'm just hoping to be able to basically add um you know vehicle sales and and whatnot. I'm primarily focusing on repair and stuff like that. I'm not trying to become like a big dealership. It's just I'd like to be able to get my dealer license and, you know, try to supplement that with, you know, maybe selling a few vehicles or what have you a month that um, you know, maybe going to the auction or, you know, I have customers asking, you know, do you know of any like, you know, trucks for sale or anything like that? So, it seems like it would be or make sense like be the next step um you know for the business or what have you.

Um and uh yeah, so that's basically what I'm trying to do. Okay. How many cars do you think you'd be selling at any one point?

Uh I'm not 100% positive, but what my goal is that, you know, to sell maybe, you know, five, maybe 10 at most per month if it's su successful, right? So, I don't uh anticipate that or I'm not trying to stockpile vehicles because like like I'm not trying to confuse and clutter or what have you where I am because I need to be able to have space to repair vehicles. So if I you know sell several vehicles a month or what have you then that's you know I guess what the option that I want to be able to have. And that was leading to my next question, like where do you plan to store the vehicles that are for sale?

Uh, so I have space basically in the front and in the back. So there's a dirt lot in the back that I have a pretty decent size of available like storage and parking and that kind of stuff. Um, so if I say like, you know, I want to be able to sell 10 cars a month, I don't necessarily want to have 10 vehicles there, you know what I mean? I just um Yeah. Like I mean, it's not a high visible visibility spot anyway because the same people drive by every day working in the neighborhood,

right? Yeah. I don't need, you know, to have 10 vehicles just sitting there for sale. It's more like, you know, I don't want to say, "Oh, well, I only want to sell one per month, but then I sell that and then can't get another one to sell." You know what I mean? Yeah. Um, so I just put up on the screen kind of what it looks like. So, you had proposed putting some of the vehicles for sale in, you can correct me if I'm wrong, but in this grass area between the parking lot and the road.

Yeah, exactly. So, I didn't I guess know if that was allowed or not, but I you know, basically right up there where that grass is, you know, that's kind of right along the road. So, if I had, you know, a vehicle or what have you for sale, if I could kind of like angle it there and, you know, say that it was for sale or what have you, that would be the really the only area that I guess you'd be able to see that there is a vehicle for sale from the road. I mean, aside from then, you know, put posting it online or or what have you. And you're saying on the parking lot side of that graph. So obviously you're not going to put it right on the road. Yeah. Exactly. Right. Where right up against the parking lot. Yeah. Right.

And you can see on the the site plan there is enough space on their property, not within the right of way um to place some vehicles there. And then the like an old tractor or something. There is. Yeah. There's a there's like two there's like a John Deere and there's like on like either side of it or what have you. So I was thinking like in the middle or what have you. Yeah. There's like a a decorative tractor. Decorative tractor. Yes, that's how I described it. Exactly. I'll make I'll make a motion to accept the application as complete. A second. Those in favor? I opposed.

So, is the marked area out front uh a certain size for a certain number of vehicles or uh I'm sorry, on the plan like so the grass spot that you're that you're at like or the one to you drew a box on the plan for us.

Yeah. Um, I mean, basically there's enough space that I could or maybe like several vehicles there, right? I mean, I'm not trying to like that's not what my goal is, but I guess I'm not like I I don't have the exact measurements. Like I didn't go up with a tape measure and but I guess like by eyeballing or what have you, you know what I mean? I you know, you can see that you'd be able to fit them or what? Yeah. And then the lot, there's obviously other uses on the lot. um he's a tenant, but there it does go back pretty far and there is a large area with various vehicles stored.

Yeah. So, I mean it doesn't exactly look like as much trash up against the building right now, but but yeah, exactly. So, there's a large lot in the back there that um you know, even like towards the back where Yeah, like there's the open section and then like the section in the back like I have space. Yeah, exactly. I have space back there kind of up against even where the trees are in the back and and that kind of stuff too. Um, so I mean there's a bunch of space there, right? So like even as far as like you know me parking or what have you, right? I'm not necessarily like I don't need to take up a space in the front because I can park like in the back, you know?

Yeah. Yeah. So, it doesn't seem like his vehicles for sale are going to take up parking spaces that would be used for customers otherwise. Yeah. And I mean, I'm sure you've talked to your landlord, the building owner. Have has the town actually talked to the building? Uh, he signed the application. Okay. So, I know we had one a little while ago from the truck stop that didn't realize what they were actually doing. So, but yeah, I did I did go and I talked to or have a conversation with them and let them know that I was trying to to, you know, to do that or what have you?

I um one question I have is I know that the parking lot isn't paved, but like how much of this lot is basically impervious? And I would consider the dirt parking lot is impervious because when you have trucks over it. So, I I just was wondering because you know, you start putting the vehicles on the grass, you're now impacting that by compacting the soil and stuff. So, yeah, there's not not much for green space on this lot.

So, yeah, the back lot is basically hard pack there, you know, so dirt. Um, and then the front lot is paved, but yeah. So, I was just basically seeing if I'd be able to put the for sale vehicle just past the paved in the Yeah. in the grass there because like essentially when you're coming down the road, that's really the only way you would, I guess, see that, you know? And you're in the grass, right? Yeah. I I understand. But I guess I I just want to we have what an 80%

coverage is supposed to be the the max impervious. So that's why I was kind of concerned about putting vehicles on the grass because that that makes that kind of compacts the soil and makes it more improve even if it sort of looks like grass. So, I I understand what you're looking for, but I guess um

I'm just Sandy, I appreciate what you're saying, but I'm not going to deny a business owner in my with my vote the right to do this over 100 square yards of grass. So, just so we're clear, that's my view. It's just like, yeah, I get what you're saying, but we're talking about maybe five or eight cars on some grass, which I

I frankly I I don't think five or eight cars is what's appropriate. I you know, if you go down and you see even a lot of the um you know, Manchester Street, you know, they may have a couple on the grass. Um, in fact, in in um in conquered, they've had them make like gravel pads for them to to kind of distinguish the area. Um, yeah. I mean, you don't look at setting up a used car dealer, you're a garage that wants to sell some vehicles and Yeah. trying to get permission to, right, to do it instead of just

Yeah. So, I mean, I agree. I think like eight f I mean even five cars there I think would be too much on the ground. I mean I'd say you know two cars and I mean ultimately I probably park one car there. I don't even know that I would park two cars there. You know be like diesel trucks or not like small cars. I mean I would like to get pickup trucks and Yeah, because they ask me if you do mostly diesel work, right? Yeah. And like fleet stuff too. So, I mean, we do actually a surprising amount of gas like work vans and stuff like that, but like

um like Mercedes Sprinter vans for example, you know, like I would like to be able to maybe get a used one of those because I mean if you're a plumber, an electrician or you want to build a camper, you know what I mean? There's kind of like a large market even like you know for something like that. Um I mean my point is just like the size of the vehicles. They're probably going to take up a little more space than your average sedan. Yeah. And then I would like realistically you're going to fit a couple vehicles up there like sprinter vans or

and I mean ultimately I would like to do maybe some cars as well and figure out I guess I don't know. I mean I guess whatever would make to me like vans or pickup trucks I think would make sense but yeah I guess wouldn't be opposed to like a sedan or something like that. And and you know that may even come in handy to be able to find one like that as an auction even to use as like a loaner vehicle or something like that, you know, like a sedan or what have you or I mean do we do we want to um specify more the size of the area

based on potential use so that we don't have to say one car or a truck or this or that and just say You can have X- size area and whatever fits on it. You know, if it's big, might just be one. If it's smaller, it could be two cars. So, I like the idea of defining the outdoor display lot because there's other areas in our ordinance that comes in like the banners and flags and type signs like like that. The number you get is based on the size of your outdoor. Can you zoom in a little bit more? Sure. This I want to see like the parking spots there. So there's one vehicle there. Yeah. Um so I mean it feels like you could fit like

I mean you're probably going to get maybe 20 ft deep into it. Um and really if you're I mean if you're going to divine a square footage, you know, 20 by 40 area 20 by and those lines don't forget those are not exact, right? You could say equivalent to two parking spaces, but but I would do dimensions. I'd probably do dimensions if we we don't have that's 20 by 40. So, but we can define we definitely don't want to make him come back for another night. Get measured. No, we can. Yeah.

So, that's 40 feet just as an example. See what we're talking about. And then 20 is probably about there. So when you do park them there, just make sure that you're not impeding upon the sight distance from your own driveway so that vehicles like when a car comes to pull out that they can see far enough up the road to be able to see what you're saying. Yeah, because the more you put along the rideway, the harder the edge of the road, the harder it, you know, uh there's trees there. Um it Yeah. So, I mean, basically I Yeah, kind of keep it back and even realistically to the left. So, when you're coming out of there, you

Oh, yeah. It would be better. And just just when you go to park it, just pay attention. Yeah. Yeah. And certainly make sure that you're not in the town's rideway that you're on the property. That would be important. Yeah. What? Yeah. Exactly. So, do we want to do we want to do 20 by 40 and just that work for you if we think that's plenty uh

um any other questions on the board before I open to the public? So, this is a public hearing. So if anybody in a public has any comments, this is the time. See some thumbs up. Seeing no comments, I'll close the public hearing. The record will note there was a thumbs up. Yeah, here we go. Made it to the recording anyway. Double thumbs. Um I'll make a motion. This does not have a regional impact. I'll go ahead. I'll second that. All those in favor?

I waver. So the condition that I'm hearing would be maybe only 20 by 40 ft and not impeding the sight lines of the driveway. There any other conditions people would like to attach to this? Do you want to limit the total number of cars for sale at any given time or do you just want to limit the number that the space bases what's going to be displayed which I think you know 20 by 40 four cars is going to be tight one six one. Yeah. Well, I mean, he has room in the back, so I mean, he could if he gets permission from the landlord, he could put 20 cars in the back, but

yeah, but I realistically need that space for repair and whatnot. Anyway, so yeah, you already have a bunch of trucks back there. Like there was Yeah, there's a bunch of that same use, you know, back there. So, I don't know if it really matters to me, but you're that successful. Do we

probably be trying to get more space at that point realistically, you know, which Yeah. Do we want to just put a condition and it's really not necessarily for this but related to the you know maximum that the fact that this is kind of pushing on the maximum coverage uh impervious coverage and that um you know further I don't know applications I don't There's not much more they can impact at this point. But if they come and they'll have to come back if they want to do more. Yeah, that's true.

That's the check on more than the 20 by 40 area, right? They didn't come back. So, okay. I'll make a motion to approve application 211-25 with the follow conditions. Report a sign notice of decision at the mouth county register of deeds. All original conditions for remain in effect. Um the total maximum area that will be used um will be 20 by 40 feet on the road on the frontage grass and that when it is used it does not impede the sight lines of the driveway. That's my motion. Do I need to mention anything about town right away or that's kind of goes

and to stay out of the town right away as as required in all instances. So, I'll second that. All right. All those in favor? I opposed. There you go. I'll make a motion. Very much. Thank you. I'll make a motion. The finding effects are that it is appropriate use for the area of zoning in that town and that it is a it helps to balance out the need of the business owner perhaps and um also as Sandy has raised the sort of the coverage area as well. So we're balancing out the impervious area and the car storage.

Actually we need that was a motion. We do need a second. All those in favor I I thank you very much. Thank you. Good luck.

All right, moving on. Application 212-25. Ali realy LLC change a use site plan application to add the use listed in 5.11C.3 indoor commercial recreational facility located at 27 Dunkey Road. Come on up and tell us tell us who you are and what you want to do. I'm Ron McLaren, Andrew McLaren,

and we are representing the owner. Um, and essentially what we we're looking to do uh uh is we have a tenant that would like to move in that is creative dance workshop. We we got the site plan approved. Um that was not one of the listed permitted uses, although it's zoned for it. So, um, we understand the parking requirements are a little bit different. Wanted to come back and see if we can get them in there. They would be our first tenant. Um, they would be occupying two bays as it shows in the site plan, the building, if you will. How many buildings you up there now?

Just one right now. We have a application in for the second building permit. I'll make a motion to accept the application as complete. Second. All those in favor. I opposed. In terms of parking, um, this is we're looking at building A, right, that's built. Yes. And it's unit three and four they want to move into. Correct.

So, um, right now at their existing facility, parking is a nightmare because they drive around. So, where do they enter the building? Obviously, there's parking on the front of the building where the natural entrance is, but can they access the building from the what on this map looks like the south side? I don't actually know what it's there are two um man doors, if you will, on the front of the building and two man doors on the back of the building for those units. So, there's equal amount of they can get in both sides. Correct. Okay. Y I assume that the dance studio would not allow that. Yeah. Can we ask further? Would the dance would it be set up so that people could actually use the back doors to enter? Enter.

That was a discussion we had with them and they Yes. Cuz right now they're in a facility with a back door where it's like back doors can open. You're just not allowed to go like the garage door. But it's like a garage door right there. That's true. So Okay. But yeah, you have a We do have a garage door as well, but there is a regular garage door. Are you asking for us to apply this to all proposed units or just unit A? Um, so we would like to come back to to not come back every every time.

We have to be here unfortunately. So um so I mean we do anticipate again these are going to be our first tenants. Uh we do anticipate tradesmen in different variety of uses, but we would like to be able to market to that um sport facility or dance studio studio. Not that the the sports, you know, like when you know, we used to have a soccer place that's gone. I mean, everybody would love to have one of those again. Um but the parking is that is hu I mean there's just so much traffic. Mhm. um you know when in cars come in

I would be willing to personally grant this for this one building but if it's going to be we don't I wouldn't want to grant it for every building because we don't know what's going in there and then parking does become an issue look I want to see you build this out and be hugely successful I just wouldn't want to hand a sort of blank check on the parking that isn't appropriate for the space yeah where I understand like if we the next three buildings Royal Sports. Yeah, that's where it becomes a problem, right?

And so I'm telegraphing where I stand. I think it's fine for this. I wouldn't want to go for all four at this at the same time. So I mean back to actually the you know front door back door because you have really no walkway between where the buildings will be to go from the backside to front side right now. Right. One of the things we talked about was a drop off pickup um front back kind of a thing. I don't know if they'll Oh they go in the front and then go out the back.

Exactly. I don't know if that will be implemented or not. Um but that was a topic of discussion. But right now you can't drive all the way around. I know. So that's right. Right now you you No, you won't be able to. Yeah. Right now. So you do have both driveways are there to access? Yes. Right. I mean do do you have a CEO for the building? Are they are you using it at all or No, not right now. You want to be we are finishing the Y. So we do have a inspection scheduled. So right now with this in there they won't be able to drive around. I mean is that

that's correct. They would either come in one the back side or the other side drive right there. What's that? Yeah. They're going to come in this driveway or they're going to come around. I mean the so the I guess I'm not really sure which is the front or the back. I assume the dance studio is going to be operating while other facilities are under construction. Other build separate building. Yes. So phase two would be the second building. We have a dividing wall through the center of building. So their side is done. Their side. Yeah. Would be isolated or I'm just picturing like the parking lot. So, how much of the parking lot is currently constructed? None of it.

All the entire entire phase. It goes right to like the edge of the building, right? So, like Y just the first everything in front of the building, right? So, you like So, you're going to basically do the parking as you do each unit. You're going to add those. Okay. So, I'm still I mean, when people are pulling in the front, basically to turn around, you got to pull into a parking spot and back out of it to go the other way. I know what happens at the current facility, what's going to happen is they're going to pull in here. They're going to drive around there. Yeah, this isn't here, though. Well, whatever it is, they're going to pull in front. That was my question. There is no driving around. You can't drive around right now.

So, this is all going to be under construction. Right now he's looking at this and there is no driving from here to there. Yeah. Okay. Which I think is just going to make it really tough for for them. I mean especially when everyone's all showing up at once. Yes. Pick up a drop off. It's it's tough now. Yeah. Yeah. Right. I mean the nice thing probably most of this stuff is more after hours but [Music] 23 They have 23 spots today and they're going to have 24 in the future. No, there's 23 designated here, but I don't Does it say how many? Do you know how many they have at their facility they're at today? Does anybody know?

That's I don't think there's that many. I don't think I mean most people stop building. There's only like 10 and then they park in the back on the back and the front. So on the side probably not more than 24 at a time I would think. So all of that.

So when we talk about parking, oftentimes in a situation like this, they have a lot of different uses and there can be some synergy kind of between different uses and um if every unit was at your studio, definitely wouldn't work. But um with a right balance of really some of your uses might be really low parking users. You're talking about some that are basically storage storage. um our the tradesman shop and stuff is very low usage and the dance studio I think is mostly after hours. Yeah. So there is it kind of works as a partnership there. Um

I that's the one thing that they have going for them in that regard. But I think looking forward down to the rest of the buildings that proper balance has to be maintained. We can't just say can't all be these types of facilities. Yeah. Yeah, they definitely just Yes. And then even as tenants come and go, I mean, you're building these buildings to be flexible and tenants probably aren't going to stay forever. Um, so just as each time a tenant comes and goes, you kind of have to look is the next one going to work for this for the balance to balance out the mix.

I mean, I, you know, because of even if it was, you know, once it's all built out, I think it would be you know, just one use. I don't know if that can work that way, but you're right. Just allowing use for not so much one you what for one building, but for one unit, one unit out of the on the the property and that could be that could be re-evaluated as the site gets built out, we see how how it's working. um it could be re-evaluated in the future, but yeah, but I think you know the parking is definitely going to be a nightmare.

So, how much how many parking spaces are technically required for so 24 um and so also and that's total for the building and there's two other units.

Yeah, that's for using half the building. So when we look at our parking requirements, the indoor commercial recreation is about spectator seating. So it doesn't work. Um so I so I was looking at other like child daycare, you know, it's the same kind of drop off pickup offices. Um most of those types of uses are one space per 200 square feet. So I basically applied that standard even or actually a gymnasium is one per 200 f feet too. Um, so it kind of fit that. Yeah, that's how I kind of Well, no, that's for the whole But there's two other units,

but they're saying the other unit doesn't require a lot of parking. Well, it depends. Yeah, right now. Right now. Yeah. We don't know what the tenants going to be in the other two units on yet. We don't know what they we don't have anybody on. The interest we've had is storage and say at the moment but

and I do believe there is room for additional parking if we were to get there. Um I don't know like just to talk about it now when no one's using it is kind of strange but um if it were to be you know down the road if we had another tenant that was required more parking than a tradesman. Um I I do feel like there is ample room in the paved area that we haven't have not designated parking that you know could be designated as parking if needed. Obviously we want you guys want to make sure the parking works in business. So we want to make sure the tenants are happy and stay there.

Yeah. Um, so, um, I'm gonna actually open this to the public just to get that part done. Not expecting a lot. Not even a thumbs up. Not even a thumbs up. Jesus. I move the motion. This is not have a regional impact. Second. All in favor? Opposed? question is really so the waiver they're requesting is the parking requirements. Yeah. Um that is the whole question. That is the whole question otherwise it's makes sense. Um

I will show you they did show on this plan um where they proposed potentially putting overflow parking in the this back area here. So obviously you still have to be able to access the property from this driveway. Is that whole area open and connected to the road? All pavement. It's all pavement. You missed that one. Yeah, I was talking to and to be fair once once once we pave the next phase shaded rectangles is impervious. I know. I know what it is. Yes. Curious to see how that's going to work. You definitely don't want vehicles turning.

Once we pave the next Once we pave the next phase at 30 feet in between buildings, we'll have two more additional spots. Three. Three. Oh, up up up in the top here. It's pavement the whole way down. So, and all the way to this area, too. Yeah. Got it. I think so. Is is the back side of the building paved now? Yes. So, if we make a motion to wave the parking requirements but only for unit A. Does that work? Um I don't know if unit A is the right term but um yeah to make it very specific to this this is the board be amendable to that. Yes.

Could we put like a conditional use like saying that depending on what the assuming that the the next tenant if it is something other than what they're anticipating that they have to come before the board again. I think we wouldn't or what we got approved originally was um an office space and storage at 500 square f feet. Carrie and yeah we are anticipating less than that. I think that was one of the more stringent things that we assumed would be right in the uh gymnasium kind of thing. But

yeah, the manufacturing is one per 500 ft. Warehousing is only one per thousand square feet. But yeah, I think you had the calculations they had put in a a small yeah 15 by30 office in the front of each one and then the back of it was they kind of did a combination of the approved uses and made it kind of an average and so they had enough overall. So, just a thought on here, you know, where that where you are paved to the road that's going in there. I mean, with some paint, you could have parking spots that went to the road. Yeah. And even even some directional parking because you can have cars that, you know, quite a few that stay, quite a few that drop off.

Mhm. you know, where your your yellow area, if you had, you know, with with paint, an entry area, an exit area would make the traffic in there flow and you could put enough parking spaces in between that they're going around that they would meet the parking requirement. Well, I guess that's the other and I think that's it is there if if we need it and that's the the thing. We just don't know who's moving into the the second half of the building yet. And even if if it is winter storage or whatever, we're essentially going to see no cars.

Yeah. I mean, and ideally, you know, if it ends up being, you know, the dance studio doesn't work out and it's all tradesman shop and you got some lines painted, they're going to go, you know, they're going to use it as a big open area and ignore the lines. But with a dance studio going in there and the drop off, an evening drop off, you know, having some flow to the parking lot and knowing I I just I think it would be good for the dance studio. It would be a safer thing and you wouldn't even need a a waiver for the parking.

Well, the well they need for the use. Right. Right. But they I mean I I I think there's space. I mean looking at that in the numbers I mean if you're paved out there you're how many parking spaces we got along the 12 building. Along the building 12. Yeah. You could have Yeah.

six parking spaces in the middle which you know three spots is plenty of of an entrance exit on either side of it. and then you're there. I mean I it's you know just an idea to make it work. I mean would you be a medal for that? I mean is that I mean if if that was the lynch pin of course um I would rather again it is there if we need it. Yeah. Um I wish I could say that the building was full and we know that we needed another whatever, you know. Um so

I mean for for this use and I can and I think that 24 spaces will get used in it. Seeing what happens up the street, you know, if you got you know and you're you're shy one. So adding and literally you could just a simple looking at what you have spaces you'd be adding five more than you would need which would probably make another tenant you know looking at it you know when they go there 4:30 to look at the place because they just got done working and say I ain't going to move in here because there's no place for me to get in and out because you have good and those parking spots are going against garage doors against the building right you said you got overhead doors on that So, if you do get a tenant, you know, which I really hope you do, now you you're you know, there's six spots that you don't have,

right? You know, and I I mean, I think it's going to be tough make it harder for you renting the other base if you have a dance studio in there and they have that parking lot eaten up. is a good point you make that they won't have access to their garage doors that that's the intended use that lead then you lose the three spots. That's a very good point.

So if you were to rent out when you rent out units one and two, um would you reserve these spots that are immediately up against their garage doors? Would those be reserved for those tenants or would you let the the people use them? They it depends on the use and I think what and what they have time and often and stuff. I mean they need to have access to their units. Yeah.

Um but at the same time if there's you know I I think uh the timing and stuff like that and as long as the dance studio I mean they aren't there from what they've written and stuff they aren't there an extended period of time. It's a kind of you know it is a pickup and a drop off. They're not leaving overnight. Have you already painted the lines? Um, okay. Not no not we have in the front with with the handicap and stuff like that, but Okay. But not the rest of them. I would personally I would prefer to see the spots put in now along that section. I think Don's correct.

And then we don't need a waiver. Need a waiver. Need to prove the use. How do we do that? We want to proceed. So you could condition that we I would make a condition that you approve the change of use with the addition of six. Is that six? I I mean six spots. Can you just where where you want so I can put it? Mark's not a plan for the yellow area. Yeah, basically I I think what they could do, you know, where you got six spots here. So yeah, I mean you could you could go here, you know, basically centering like this is private drive if you're looking at the access road there. Private drive.

Yeah. Six, you know, against. So you're would you be fine with that? So we don't have to issue the parking waiver if you agree to add six parking spots along the private drive. If the board agrees the board Yeah. or if that's the I don't like to get them in there. So, would the idea with those extra spots be that you would So, you'd drive in this private drive and then you'd pull straight into it and then you would back out and go. So, you would never actually drive. I I think you would you would do

what would you pull? I was picturing you'd pull into that. People most likely will pull straight in the way you're saying because it's continuous for they built it that So the truck so that there was a you'd have a solid line along the road along the private drive in the in the spots open back here towards the building. So basically you'd be creating a loop which you know and I don't know you know how the dance studio is going to you know then they really have to use the back door but that's where the parking is. Yeah. I mean,

okay. So, we'd have no waiverss, but the conditions would be for building A only where we granting this and it would be on condition of adding six spots along the private drive on the south side of the building. Just lines, nothing, no car. Yeah, just just adding parking spaces, which lines it's already. Any other question? Uh, does that impact your number of handicap spots? Do you know? You might need to look at that. What's Oh, well, there's a ratio one. You need one uh for every 25 spots. So, we might have to do a count and make sure every 25 spots. So, that's off the top of my head, but

we have two for the building right now. So, current. [Music] Any other conditions people would like? I'd like to ensure that the rear access doors are going to be actually used by the gear studio as like there. How do I define usage though? Um that it's going to be allowable entrance and exit as part of their operations. Okay, sounds good.

Any other conditions? All right. So, I will make a motion to approve application 212-25 with the following conditions. This applies to building A only as in the plans. That six additional parking spots are created on uh the private drive to the south of the building. and that for the proposed business um that there be allowable exit and entrance on that south side I think I'm saying south side of the building um as well to that parking so those are the west side

west side am I and that I missed the original ones the record assigned notice and decision at the Marmont County register of deeds and all other original conditions are of approval remain in act. Second. Leave me hanging there, guys. I have it. There we go. I would just say make sure you work with Carrie. It's somewhat complex there obviously. So, just make sure you work with and make sure it happens correctly.

Yeah. And I guess just appreciate that you've stayed in touch with making sure that the it all works out. Um and I just ask you continue to do that when you get new tenants. We'll make sure it's going to continue to work. Do you have a schedule for the rest of the buildings? Um the rest of the buildings. Uh so we're just waiting for permit actually for the second building. So we're moving on. Building inspector. Yeah. Where's the building? Um, so we're actively um looking for tenants under construction and looking for tenants. Right. Good luck. Anticipate doing a full loop road. I'm just curious like around the outside of the building. I mean that would be the final

the exactly because um I don't think can really be done until that all at least at minimum all the foundations are in. Um, but I think that is in our next year we would like to have all four of those buildings constructed. The dance studio is going to have to put a temp gravel drive. Yeah. You know, can you get some income? My prediction. They say, you know, hopefully that right now it's already a mess where they are. Awesome. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you very much.

The findings of facts. Um, basically, well, what we just talked about some, the parking, um, the parking is I mean, part of I mean, we're approving the use. I mean, the use fits the area. I mean, this right with the additional parking spaces. So, I'll make a motion for the fighting effects are that the use fits the area when we've added in the additional parking spaces to allow for um the flow of traffic.

And then I guess the other piece is that you've limited it to this one building and not the blanket approval for the whole development, not knowing what others will be there. So moved. Second. Second. All those in favor? All right. All right. All right. What do you have for us now?

The master plan steering committee has had a couple of meetings. We have several representatives on this board who have participated, which is wonderful. We've actually had really great level of participation. I know at our last meeting, Mike Tardiff said that they've had townwide visioning sessions with fewer people than we have at our steering committee meetings. So, I'm proud of that. Um, at your last meeting, you appointed eight members. There's of nine that were proposed. We actually have four people who are interested in that last seat. Um,

wow. So I we can pick someone. We can add alternates to give everyone a seat at the table. I would add alternates. The more people involved, the better. I would um Levi, your very own planning board alternate is one of those four. So if you had to choose a person to have the real seat, um the the regular member seat [Laughter] I would recommend choosing Levi for that one because he's on the planning board. Um because otherwise, how do you choose? They're all volunteering to serve and I think that's great.

Um whereas I don't have the other names in front of me right now. We have Jill Hathaway and somebody whose name I can't. Okay. Well, I'll find them while you guys look at the survey for a second. Is that a list of people? No, this is I'm going to pull it up in a second. This is the question survey. Does somebody who's on the master plan steering committee want to talk about the survey and where we're at on it for a second while I find the list of the other people? Sure. It's all you. So, we was last week and this was it was kind of the first official meeting.

Yeah. We went through a list of questions that they had and we kind of went through the issues that the planning group um felt were most advantageous for us to learn about the town's perspective on. I think transportation was a big piece of it and development were the two big things I think that came up and walkable communities and sidewalks was a big piece of it. So, we were trying to come up with questions that we thought people would respond to and give us that it would provide us the most information for creating our master plan. Um, I don't remember all I thought there was other questions that aren't on this list.

Well, there are since then I know. Oh, it's on the back. Never mind. I just This is like a big blank page here that goes on the back. Okay. I was like that was the one I was looking for. Sidewalks. Sidewalks. School. That's a That's I'm joking. I I agree with you. It's a land mine. It is. Yeah. But everybody I talked to wants them. So I don't know. But we also had talked about paths,

you know, like don't think we need these wide concrete things going down the sides of our street. Like you could formalize the path a little bit more between the high school that connects to the elementary and the middle school and make that a little bit more formalized so people use it more and kids have more options to walk to school if they want to and they're feel more comfortable walking down that path or even riding a mountain bike or something depending on the surface you know that type of thing. So those are the type of things we had talked about. Um, other things that really I think struck a core with everybody was tra congestion through the town during peak travel times. Obviously, we've all seen it. Oh, yeah. Especially this weekend. So,

I said that we were we went for a hike in town. We were just counting all the cars going by and there was some from Pennsylvania. The Georgia was the furthest one I saw, though. Well, actually, a a lot of the time, I know everybody talks about the peak stuff, but you know, you talk about the the traffic around the high school before and after. When I was working, I would go into work by 8:30 instead of 8 to just kind of miss the crazy congestion mostly at school at the um well parents dropping kids off you know at the um

uh Knox White Rock Hill Road um you know uh Bow Center Road intersection there because you know people will turn and not turning and so the goals Another accident there last week where a car almost ended up in someone's house. Where was this? Really? Oh dear. And what I called what I call Bow Center. I don't Everyone knows what you mean. There's a woman almost literally ended up like on the front step of the house there. We're roundabout. How does everybody feel about that word? Americans don't love roundabouts. Um but no, I I agree with you.

Work, but nobody who knows how to use it. the police chief. It's that is actually not a town road though. That's a state road. State road and the police chief has asked repeatedly because there's accidents all the time. Could we put a light in or something and it's going to have to come from the state? But yeah, but I think if you have the the intention is that if you have this master plan that has identified this as an issue and you have the crash data to back it up and you have you know it's a starting point. It's a starting point to have those conversations. At one time I think at one time there was also um some concern or some issue with the slope of the road and

um the um and a roundabout and that that was kind of uh steeper than usual or something like that. Yeah, at at one point there was a plan for a roundabout that was some drawings taking the Grey House that was there. And it was kind of funny cuz when I seen the plan, I forgot what meeting it was, but the person that lived in the Grey House was like, "Really?" They knew nothing about it. What happened to it? Um, it's been a rental is that the bow times came out against it and rallied rallied the troops against the roundabout. So is bow times gonna come out against our survey?

Well, they don't get hees to it's your chance to voice your opinion in a productive manner. So hopefully like that's the goal. And the other thing that Millie Clunk had suggested which

we all liked was the idea of we now have an under 18 option on here because they're going to send it out to the high school students to get their input because they might be in the next 10 years they might be residents of Bow and so it would be nice to have their perspective. So, so we've been doing a bit of a road show with the survey questions. Um, Mike and I have visited the business development commission and the heritage commission and uh I think he went to the energy committee last night. Um, so trying to get as much feedback on the questions before they get sent out. And then um we're having a meeting next week on Tuesday the 21st and then hoping to finalize it and it out ASAP um the season kind of turns.

The goal is to hand it out at the trunk trunk or treat. That is the goal if it's possible to do postcards with QR codes. Here here's some candy. Here's a survey. parents take a survey or QR code and the kids get the candy, right? Good audience. Good audience. Good opportunity. Do you have our list of potential alternate steering committee members? So, my recommendation is that you appoint a motion on this. Yeah. Okay. Uh my recommendation is you appoint Levi to be the last regular seat on the steering committee and then Jill had Addison Hartman and

he told me to just call him Jay because I wouldn't Oh, that's right. He said next to me he said you can't pronounce it unless you speak Spanish. So he said he goes by Jay. Okay. Jamie Gray Leman. It looks okay, but that's not how he said it. I'll make a motion to appoint Levi Barry as the final member of the regular member of the planning the master plan committee and appoint Addison Hartman and Jamie Gary Leman as and Jill Hathaway as alternates. Why can't they all be regular members? Is it capital up to 12? I mean nobody in

Mike probably if you want to increase it it I don't see much difference in we're not going to be they're not going to be voting a lot. I think it's conversations and feedback. We just keep it at 9. That's my motion. I'll second. All those in favor? I opposed. Congratulations. He does not know what he's getting into right now. All right. All right. So, I should say I have to leave at 8:20 to relieve a babysitter. So, not saying that to be done by then, but

sounds good to me. Um, Don and I reviewed the RSA changes from last year that may affect our zoning and things we need to update. And I made a little summary for you all of the areas to focus on. We figured this was a good place to start for zoning amendments because they're the things we don't have a lot of choice about. Um, so we can start here and then if anyone else has topics or areas that they think we should work on for zoning amendments, you can propose them. Are these changes or are they changes that we know conflict with our looking local rules?

Yeah, I just pulled out the ones that are conflicting. Okay. Um, so HB 631 says that we have to allow multif family residential development on commercially zoned land. Um, but there's, you know, the asterisk is that there's adequate infrastructure, which has not been clearly defined by the legislature. So, I'm sure we'll see some court cases and then find out what we're supposed to do about that. I think a lot of these we're going to have there'll be court cases.

Well, we we do. It's interesting because we do define um what's um well I think we still do I don't know uh you know having the uh water and sewer for I mean that's what that's what I would take it as but water sewer electrical you know oh yeah yeah yeah I mean water right and then the other thing that the municipal association had pointed out. So, it means commercially zoned land, which doesn't necessarily mean industrially zoned land. Our commercial need to get my maps. I'm back up. But our commercial district's pretty small. Um,

where is it? Like around? No, it's mixed use. Okay. Um, I think it's more around like Robinson goes up, right? Is doesn't it change? Let me just put this up in here. paint all the walls to hold the maps down. I know. I need to get them back up. I need to buy the little things to hang them on, but haven't gotten to it. Well, can can we are Were you Is there going to be like a strip put up? Okay. Yeah, they're little metal things that you slide them into. I just haven't gotten around to ordering them. So this is

Yeah, you got a little section where Robinson goes out commercial. Yeah. So it's just this section here. Really? Yeah. Well, it's a little There's a little piece of Robinson, too. Isn't that funny and stuff like that? Oh, down here is what you're saying. Okay. Yeah. So, there's a chunk here around group Robinson and then this section up here. Well, there's a big residential. The yellow is the R1 district, right? It's kind of which residential that doesn't allow multif family. Yeah, that's the that's the one of it unlike the other residential areas in town where we also don't allow multif family. Yeah. Changed just because when the sewer went in. Yeah.

Or the water went in before it's the dry sewer. Um so I don't think that's going to have a huge impact on us at least right now. um especially with the lack of water. Um but I think we need to probably make the update in our zoning. I have to try to figure out

how to work that in. which some of that and why like we ended up with the R1 because the concern was you know that piece of residential that we ran water down and sewer um would have you know made it to where you could put a lot of housing in that area that would have gotten it was something that we didn't want.

Yeah. Um, and then the other piece of that is that if there's existing an existing building that's repurposed for adaptive reuse, you have to be flexible basically about the the setbacks and frontage and everything. Um, so some of these things are a little tricky to write code of life. Yeah. But Don and I will work on it.

Good luck. Um SB284 says that we can't require more than one residential parking space per unit. And this is actually it's in our site plan our parking requirements are in the site plan regs not the zoning ordinance but I still put it on this list. Um so we require we require two spaces for a single family home, two for a duplex, one and a half for multif family. Um, so we'll just change all those to one. Okay.

Not much choice there. So, um, SB281 allows the issuance of building permits on class 6 roads without approval from the board of selectmen and uh, I went to a riveting uh, webinar was yesterday. Did you I sat Yeah, I sat through that. I nearly fell asleep. Um, it was at lunchtime, too. Um, but there are a few interesting points made there and one of them is that our ordinance can still require that you have to have frontage on a class five or better road. And our ordinance does require that

and that's that's how it's worded. Well, it's a not exactly like that, but um that I guess protects the town a little bit in that we can basically would still require a variance from the zoning board of adjustment. So, this select board doesn't get to weigh in, but at least a town body gets to weigh in on whether it is actually appropriate to build on a classics road. Huh. And there are there are other dynamics of that. There are a whole bunch of other requirements need class like how in what situation would you have class five road frontage and six so londary turn pikes

whereas a trail that's class right no I own a th00and ft of road frontage on that so there's like no concern with emergency so there's a requirement for a waiver to be signed and recorded and there's a insurability requirement you have to provide proof of insurability. I mean, there are a lot of things that it's like the concerns are obviously that regardless of the waiver, we all know that our fire are going to do whatever it takes to help people because that's their job. That's who they are. Um, and so that puts people and equipment at risk. So, the second point there kind of protects us a bit from the first point. It does.

Okay. A little bit. Um, so our definition of The requirement for frontage doesn't say that it has to be on a class five or better. But our definition of frontage is that it's the length of the lot bordering on a public street or non-instate highway categories categorized as class one, two, or five. So it I don't know if we want to change it so it is more like what was being said at the webinar, but it I think it does say the same thing. Better is better the class one or two? I mean, but it's a common term. I don't like it either because it's unclear which direction better goes,

but class five or better is a common planning term in New Hampshire. I'd say put as much as you can in there to protect us. That's my my in this situation. So, I mean, make it very clear. Don't let anybody It's just under the definition of frontage. I would if we're trying to make it stronger, I would also include it in the dimension table of dimensions requirements because you wouldn't necessarily think to go check the definition for frontage. You don't even And in fact, I didn't at first. I was like I was like I thought we had it. It said that and then I had to

and who's going to look up frontage? I mean like the definition of frontage like everybody's going to think they know what frontage is of all things like so we could potentially I can't right now in the dimensional regulations and there's a paragraph on what we have some properties that have no road frontage but they have rotted right we do down off you could get you get to them from the railroad tracks There's a couple camps down on the river that at least they used to be still there.

So we could look at trying to put it. So 6.02 is the section on minimum lot frontage. So we could kind of duplicate it there just to reinforce.

Um and then House Bill 577 says that we have to allow one accessory dwelling unit attached or detached. Um we previously required a conditional use permit for a detached. So we'll take off that requirement. Um our size requirement is still appropriate. And then the other piece of that is that we have to allow existing structures like like if there's a detached garage that is a non-conforming structure because it's in the setback, it's been there forever. Um we have to let them convert it to an ADU. Mhm. Is there any uptick in ADUs? Yes. Oh, yeah. Yes. We had approved several. We're getting a bunch.

I know we approved some, but like the attached because we don't see the attached one right now. We're getting a bunch and detached, too. Yeah, we're seeing a bunch. People are talking about it. Oh, I can make Yeah, we're seeing a bunch and people call and ask what they have to do. So, often just the parents or the parents or or just or the kids or the kids. we're seeing. This is probably a lot more for the kids. Both directions for generations. I'm sure I'll be doing it soon. So, those are those are the ones we have to do. Um I was curious if anyone has topics or sections that they would like to try to tackle this year.

Just all those things that we say we need to work on that. Yeah. Um that I was just I was going through some things and there's um this is kind of a question like what on the prime wetlands table on page 76 um it has tax map sheet number that 76. I think it really does mean tax. That is what it means though. That's what the tax map means. The map. Oh the map number is still relevant. We don't really use it, but it's still it's still there. Okay.

Um, Sandy, you and I had talked about the table of uses for the wetlands, right? Um, needs to be more explicit that you can't fill them. It doesn't actually say that more and more about like dumping yard waste and things like that. It becomes a little gray and it'd be nice to have it very clear, right?

Yeah. I have also some update regarding just that. um natural heritage bureau data check which has changed. Um is that in zoning or is it just in

it's in 12.04 H and I didn't know whether we want to move it someplace else because it's a standard of review. I mean, it's just kind of in a weird place. Like people don't Oops. Oh, there. It's like sort of like at the end, not

Yeah. I don't like that. Um the other thing I was also looking at is when we talk about the boundary of the um welton conservation district and um what folks are supposed to use and we talk about um uh if there's a discret discrepancy an applicant may retain such a scientist and you know another scient and I'm like we should be doing

what's do you know where that is

it's page 75 it's in 10.01B No one B because it should be an independent person. Unless we hear from others, I think we're going to mostly focus on these ones that we have to do because some changes of staffing and Don's getting acclimated. Scott, our Tenny, our building inspector, worked closely with me on zoning things and he is no longer with us. So, um I think

just focus on that. We'll focus on the the easy ones, the ones we have to do. And I think Sandy, you and I can probably put together a few things for the wetlands, okay, to tidy up. Um Okay. Unless anyone has any other burning issues they want to tackle. Okay. How about MS? I wasn't here, so I have to abstain from They look fine to me.

I spent so much time with You said they were fine. Was that a motion? Sure. Just, you know, I was, you know, I don't want anybody to say, "Oh, I have a question." Uh, yes. I move approval of the uh September 18, 2025 minutes. I'll second that. Here we go. All those in favor? Are you obaining? I'm abstaining. All right. I'll make a motion to adjurnn. All in favor?