City Council - Regular Meeting

Good morning. I'm Boston City Councilor Ed Flynn. Thank you for being here. I to acknowledge today's meeting is on docket number 0515. It's in order for a hearing to discuss the status of addressing potholes in the city of Boston.

We have administration officials that are here today with us including the chief of streets, Nick Gov, including the public works superintendent of street operations, highway division, Danny Nee, and Norman Parks, Public Works Department, Construction Management Division. I wanna say thank you to all of these exceptional city employees and wanna acknowledge Norman. Norman, you've been with the city for forty something years. Forty years. Years.

I wanna say thank you to you, Norman, for your commitment to the residents of Boston along along with Danny, along along with along with, the chief as well. This hearing is being recorded. It is being live streamed at boston.gov citycitycouncil-tv broadcast on xfinity channel eight r c n channel 82 fios channel nine sixty four. Written comments may be sent to the committee email at ccc.csit@boston.gov. Ccc@csitatboston.gov.

It will be made part of the record and available to all city councilors. Also, if any people in the public that are listening, they all can they also can email me directly, ed.flint@boston.gov. Public testimony will be taken at the end of the hearing. Individuals will be called on in order which they signed up and have two minutes. If you are interested in testifying in person, please add your name to the sign up sheet near the entrance of the chamber on the left.

If you, looking to testify virtually, please email our central staff liaison liaison, Shane Pack at shane,shane,.pack@boston.gov for the link. Your name will be added to the list. I wanna say thank you to Shane for being here, for the work you are doing. I wanna say thank you to Ethan that's in the television video room. Thank you to Ethan.

Thank you to Shane. As I mentioned, docket zero five one five, order for hearing, discuss potholes in the city of Boston. We're also joined by Boston City Councilor John Fitzgerald from from Dorchester. I'm gonna give opening remarks, I do want to give Councillor Fitzgerald the opportunity to go before me. Councillor Fitzgerald, would you like to give an opening statement?

Yeah. Please and thank you, chair. Folks, how are you? Thank you for being here today, all of you. I just wanna say how much I appreciate all that you do.

Last night, I was at the retirement party for Darlene Williams, and got to meet a lot of other people that are in that, you know, work on our streets, fill our potholes, take care of of the city services that people expect. There's a lot of things our government does that don't people don't necessarily expect, but the one thing they want in paying their taxes is just to make sure, hey, I just want my sidewalks okay, my streets okay, and delivering on those basic city services. So it was great to meet a lot of those folks last night and knowing the leadership team up here and and the great individuals that you are. I'm very proud of this department and and and the the camaraderie that you guys have amongst each other. I felt that last night at the retirement event and just the people talking about each other and the reason they stay thirty seven years.

And it's because of the people and it's because of the work they do for this city. Just want to thank you. You know, obviously we'll have some questions later on, but appreciate the time, Chair, and appreciate the panel being here today.

Thank you, Council Fitzgerald. My opening statement will be brief. These are the issues I like to focus on as the district city councilor from District 2, but also chair of this commit this committee. It's the nuts and bolts of city government that residents really want us to refocus our energy attention on, especially elected officials. I think they want elected officials to advocate for quality of life issues for basic city services.

The nuts and bolts of city government, whether it's potholes, whether it's water and sewer related issues, whether it's parks, whether it's clean streets and improving improving services. That's why that's why I that's why I became a city council, is really to to deal with these these issues. I'm here to learn more about how we fill potholes, the challenges we have ahead of us, how residents can get more engaged and active, but also listening, learning more from the administration team on these quality of life issues. Let me stop there. Let me ask the chief of streets if he'd like to give an opening presentation.

I I believe you you might have a slide slide presentation. Yes, counselor.

Thank you. Yep. Go ahead, Nick. All right. Good morning, everybody. Counselors, thank you for having us here to discuss potholes. You know, as mentioned, this is a critical basic city service, and it's something that we spend quite a bit of time on. We understand potholes are a very frustrating perennial issue in Boston and other cold climate cities. Public works has adopted and implemented standard operating procedures to address this roadway defect. But before we get into that, I I wanna start by providing some background on on what causes potholes.

Water infiltration is the primary cause of potholes. So rain or snow melt seeps through cracks in the asphalt that saturates the soil, and the aggregate base beneath the roadway softens and it causes it to weaken. During freeze thaw cycles, this water under the road freezes, it expands, creates a gap under the immediate roadway surface. And when that ice melts, the void that's left beneath collapses under under traffic load. Proper drainage in storm water infrastructure is a key factor in in helping manage potholes.

If water can't drain away from the roadway, it can pool at low spots around manhole castings and curb cuts, and this this contributes to that freestyle cycle problem. And then obviously, aging infrastructure. Old pavement, roads that have been compromised by utility repair trenches, roads with poor base compaction. These are all more susceptible to potholes than a street that is in good condition. Why are there more potholes in the spring?

Well, this is pothole season here in New England. Potholes form because that ground underneath that's been frozen all winter melts, and so that sub base gets soft and unstable. So this winter was, you know, we had significant snowfall, and we had a long duration period of subfreezing conditions. And that contributed to a fairly significant increase in the freeze thaw cycles. We saw 13% more than the average of the previous five years, with more than seventy days with high temperatures above freezing and low temperatures below freezing.

So the winter and then again this winter also saw over 60 inches of snow, which again represents more than twice the average of the five previous winters. So these factors all contributed to a particularly challenging pothole season this spring. But while while this spring three one one pothole request did increase sharply in March, like every spring, our concentrated effort and response helped reduce the volume of incoming requests. This eventually results in lower and more stable service requests outside of the spring pothole season. While repairing potholes is a critical basic city service, it's only one component of our larger roadway maintenance program.

You know, it's why we've invested heavily in roadway maintenance over the last several years. For example, you know, we resurfaced 50 miles of roadway last year, and we're planning to do another 45 this year. Roadway maintenance is it's a continual year round effort. Again, potholes is one component of it, but our engineers routinely assess and grade the condition of pavement on every block, on every street citywide, and we work with all the utility companies to make sure that they've done any necessary repairs and upgrades to their infrastructure before we go in and resurface a road. You know, once the utility company goes in, sometimes it's multiple, they go in, they complete the work, sign off, then we can schedule that street for resurfacing.

I'd also like to talk a little bit about the logistics of our pothole repair process. We pick up asphalt, bituminous concrete every morning when we're doing this work in Hyde Park. That way we're ensuring that we're getting a real high quality aggregate, which is going to hold longer and last longer in the in the defect. The three one one service requests that come in, we organize those by neighborhood, and then we assign them to the respective public works district yards. Crews then, you know, prioritize based on, you know, the most efficient way to to complete the work, but also they're not just doing the reported cases.

So if they get a case on a street and they show up and there's, you know, a half a dozen other potholes around, maybe there's a damaged utility casting, they're addressing those potholes as well. Since 2021, pothole repair closures have matched incoming demand across districts. Our average resolution time is eighteen hours, which we is pretty impressive. And over two thirds of all cases are completed within a twenty four hour period. Again, I think this demonstrates that we've put a lot of resources into addressing this issue.

Repair activity does fluctuate significantly seasonally. But you could see on the graph here, long term repair trends have remained stable. Early twenty twenty six trends are in line with previous years. We certainly did see an increase in early March. But you can see from the graph, there's been you can see that seasonal nature of the work on the left.

And then you can, you know, demonstrates that there's been really no slowdown in this activity. You know, while pothole repair activity does fluctuate seasonally, again, you could see on the right, you could see 2026 trends are in line with other years. So out of all the pothole cases opened so far in 2026, 74% have been closed by the district. 7% of those have gone to our construction inspection unit, and that is the team that works specifically with our utility partners to address defects around their infrastructure. And then the remaining 19% go to Norman and his team because they're part of, you know, part of roadways that are going to be either reconstructed or resurfaced.

Again, but that said, we always address something temporarily until that work happens. So, again, as I mentioned earlier, we do have this shared responsibility infrastructure maintenance within the public way. Utility companies are responsible for maintaining their own infrastructure. Many reported potholes are, in fact, defects around the And we're be that. To that.

With that, we welcome any And questions that you may have. We have our subject matter experts here from the team who can help us answer any questions. Thank you.

Thank you, chief. I'm gonna give each councillor maybe eight minutes and then I'll let you go first John and then I'll go after you. Maybe other councillors might be here. But I'll give us eight minutes and if we have to go to a second round, we'll do a second round.

Yep. Sounds like a plan. Thank you, Chair. And again, thank you, panel, for being here. I will start only because I'm sure as all of us coming into work every day and leaving, just looking at the timeline for state congress and the weaving in and out of that landmine filled of utilities that also seem pretty old. A lot of them see I've seen some broken ones and I know that's on the utility companies. But that's just that, you know, taking a right on the Congress every day out of this building, you're like, oh, boy, let's let's go. Right? What's what do we got for your timeline there?

So Congress Street was was milled. It was early last week. Last week. Yeah. And so, yeah, we've got a number of streets downtown right now that we've milled that we're working to complete, resurface, put down fresh pavement markings in advance of the first FIFA match and all the other events this summer. Great. You know, we prioritize Congress, state, bunch of these other streets, surface, Atlantic. So I think the first pavement's going down, I believe, what, Sunday night or Monday? Monday, Sunday night. Yeah. Sunday night, weather permitting. So all this stuff downtown that you've seen milled, the casting work is is done. Pavement will weather permitting will start going down this weekend.

And forgive my ignorance, but casting work means?

So, if you've got a utility, you know, you've got either a manhole or you've got a water box, something in the roadway, that casting sits up. And so, whenever we're doing this type of work, you know, if that casting, whatever it is, needs to be reset, repaired, replaced, you'll often see like, if you're out on Congress today, you'll see that, you know, it's been mounded around the casting because you want to make sure you get that set well, right, before you go in and put down that first binder coat.

From personal experience, earlier this year, or maybe it was in the fall, Neponset Ave was milled. And it looks great now. But the the the time I guess my question is about the time difference in between when it is, you know, scarified or milled into when it is paved. Sometimes it's a couple of weeks. So, you know, residents every day, myself included, just like out in congress, we're we're dodging and weaving, and for the most time, we're we're doing okay. And then one day, sniper. Boom. Boom. Two tires. Right? Right over. Know, either probably looking at my phone while I'm driving, doing things I shouldn't be. But and so I went, oh, man. And, you know, cost is significant. I was right next to Hannibal's auto repair, thankfully.

I was able to pull in, get it repaired. What is the what is the the typical timeline between when something is milled to when it is paved? Because people understand you gotta live through this stuff to to do it, but then, know, there's only so long you can do it before it's gonna get you. Right? Like it did to me. And so just what what is that typical time line?

Yeah. It's it well, when I I'll let Norman Norman answer that.

So typically with that, we're we're doing so there's just three phases to this. Right? There's a milling factor where we when we take out two inches, a milling, and we grind it down. Yep. Then we have to reset the castings. And that's the process with that. Then once we set the casting then we do the overlay. With that process inside the area depending on the length of street so the streets we're looking at like the downtown area, Deposit Deposit Street so forth, streets that are large like that it takes a little more like you said there's a lot of castings out there so there's a lot of repairs to to fix. Of course, if if the castings aren't fixed, that's when you get the tilting and you get the unleveled surfaces, so you wanna level those off. So the more castings you have out there, that takes more time to get those completed to then do the resurfacing.

Gotcha. And is it is it on the utilities to reset their castings? Or is that work that the city does?

The utility sets some castings, some castings set by some utilities, and the construction crew that's working out to set other

Is is that typical the longest time frame of that of that whole process?

Yes. So you usually with that Is that

on the utility companies?

Yeah. You asked the time inside that. It was like, you know, you usually it's it's three phases, like, two different phases, like, a week. Right?

Yep.

But but with with the time and the length of streets, that's a longer term. There were just more castings, more product you have to put down. Also considering the time of day where where we're working. Right? We're restricted nights for the downtown area. Sometimes there's in the residential areas, it's more days. And then it causes so much confusion or issues with traffic flow. So we have to keep a t and p a traffic management plan in place to allow cars to be the to traverse through the ads we're doing it.

And I was told that, you know, oh, reach out to the city for reimbursement. And so I I tried that, right, because it's an hefty price. And they they said, yeah. I never heard of you. And I said, that's fine. Most people in this building haven't. And they said, you're denied. Right? And I said, okay. Fair enough. Like, right? Not not not gonna fight city hall on this one. And I was just wondering what is the level of to which someone is reimbursed versus which they aren't? Just for the education of the public, right? Like, okay, I feel like I'm in the right. I can call City Hall and appeal to have a reimbursement for the damage done. Or why not?

Yeah, no, great question, Counselor. You know, essentially the appeals process is run through the city clerk's office. Yeah. And, you know, every appeal is or request for reimbursement is dealt with on a case by case basis depending upon, you know, what the circumstances of, you know, what the damage was and what the and what the roadway condition of sorry. I don't I don't know what the circumstances are.

No. No. No. That's that's fine. But is this something that was signed? They said something that was properly noted it's properly signed and notified and therefore, you know, indemnifies the city, so to speak. And is that so as long as the right signage is up, no matter how long the road is is milled or or not repaved at the moment, no matter how long. As long as signage is up, I think that is the that's what I was told. Does that sound correct?

Correct. And and and appreciate you bringing this up. This is you know, we always ask that people slow down slow down around active construction, obviously, but particularly when a roadway is milled, we really, really ask people to slow down, you know, not just for damage to their vehicle, but, you know, without pavement markings, right, the roadway can be confusing, particularly if it's not a street that you travel every day. So, yeah, we really do ask people to slow down when we're doing milling work.

I agree with that. Lastly, in terms of people reporting potholes when they see them, typically they go through three one one. Are you guys doing anything to sort of update that or are there new things that we can talk about? And you could teach us about that process that's going on and maybe what we're doing to improve it.

Sure. And I'm gonna I'll let kinda Danny answer the second half. But yeah. So, you know, the city has had the three one one system for for a long time. We are there is a larger effort ongoing right now to kind of update and upgrade that system.

But, you know, 70% of the three one one requests that come in in the city come into public works. So, you know, it is a tool that we rely on, not only for how we manage and dispatch our work, but it's also, you know, the basis of our kind of relationship and civic engagement with, you know, people who live and work here. Right? They trust the system. They know that if they put something in there, it's going to get addressed. And, you know, potholes is one of those examples. But I'll let Danny kind of answer some of the more specifics of that work.

Yep, absolutely. Thanks, Counselor. So, three eleven, like the back operating the back office operating system, excuse me, has been around just since the time the Red Sox won the World Series in 2004. So, it's aging. It's limited in what it can do, but it is effective.

We've grown accustomed to it and worked with it. As you can imagine, some twenty six twenty years later, twenty two years later, the advancements made in technology in computer systems and everything has grown, you know, a 100 fold. So, we are in the process now, Norman my team and Norman's team, of figuring out the process mapping and how we're going to handle these cases going forward. Some of our departments, our street lighting department and actually parks department, have already kind of moved over to the new system and they're seeing great results. So, we're excited about it.

We're, you know, having meetings almost daily now with DUET and the analysts up there. And they've done well the past year to really dive in with our crews, take rides hours with our patch crews and our supervisors throughout the city to kind of get a feel for what we do and making the system fit to what we need. Whereas we kind of made what we do, we made it to kind of fit to what the old three eleven system is. So three eleven is still the best way. A picture, it doesn't have to be a close-up picture, but just so we can get kind of perspective on where it is and correct addresses.

People, you know, a lot of times folks get confused because the GPS on their phone, if they're creating with the phone, could be off as much as like 100 yards. So, that's a big difference in a city, right? In the North End, that could be three streets over, right? So the new system, there's some things to address that, including contact details. We're not tracking you to charge you later. We just want a contact. So hey, I'm here at your case. I don't see it. Could you give me some more perspective on where it is? So it just opens up the communication.

So I'm really excited about the new system going forward. We'll be better internally the way we handle cases and pass cases off back and forth. So a lot of times a case will come in, the highway crews will go out, they'll put a small band aid on it knowing that, alright, needs to be a bigger issue, it needs more they refer it to Norman's engineering team and then they include it in a part of a program going forward. So it's making that communication way more easy.

That's great. That's great to hear. I love the efficiency. Norman, Danny, thank you very much for all you do. And Nick, I don't know if people tell you enough, you're doing a fantastic job in the interim. And so please keep it up. Thank you, guys. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Councillor Fitzgerald. Again, wanna remind anyone in the audience, if you would like to testify, there's a sign in sheet right near the door on the left hand side, if you'd like to sign your name, and we'll call you probably right after me and then we'll go into public testimony if there is public testimony. But again, if anyone would like to testify, we would love to hear your opinion. Thank you Councillor Futero. Chief you mentioned I think at your beginning that work crews go in the morning to High Park to get asphalt or So tell me about that process.

What do they what do they get there and how do they pick it up? How do they distribute it distribute it to other locations?

Sure. Thanks, Consort. Yeah. So that is, you know, that's the closest place for us to pick up aggregate in the morning. So, you know, the crews are dispatched from the respective district district yard. It can be anywhere from like a two to four man crew, right, a couple of trucks. They're to base the amount of material that they pick up, right, based on the work plan for the day. They get loaded at the plant. There's generally a lot of other people there getting mixed for the day as well, not just for potholes, but, you know, maybe particularly during resurfacing season, right? So, they go, and then from there they go to their map of locations.

And again, you know, they're they may go with, you know, two three one one cases, but if they show up and there's additional work, they're gonna make those those repairs while they're there.

Okay. If a resident and I use this opportunity often especially for seniors that might be watching on television, they might not be familiar with the 311 system but if a resident is not using the 311 system and they want to call in a pothole, are they allowed to do that?

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. They could call, email, what it yes, absolutely.

What phone number would they use?

We'd still encourage them to use the 311 line that's staffed, you know, 20 But that said, you know, we have folks who contact either the BTD or Public Works office. We have people drop in sometimes, you know, if they're here, maybe paying a parking ticket or something else. So, yeah, we we're welcome and and encourage people. We encourage people to use 311, but, you know, if you're here and you're more comfortable having a a phone conversation, we we encourage

you you to to do do that. That.

Okay. And if if the public works team is out doing potholes that someone called in and they say there's a couple others in and around the area, maybe maybe a street over, Tell me about the process of does that have to be in the 311 system before they do it? Or if they see it, can they put can they go ahead and fill it in?

Yeah. Absolutely. And I think, you know, the nature of pothole work, right, like frankly a bunch of other work that we do, right, that work, people see us, will often prompt people like, Woah, well, you know, I could do some potholes here. And in some cases, you know, we're able to address that in real time, right? Because the individual district yards are managing their respective three eleven queue. So that's one of the reasons we do encourage people to use that, because that is the quickest way to get that information to those teams. So, some cases, yeah, we might have a crew working two streets over. They get a 03:11 case. They might get they might be able to jump over there that same day.

Counsel, I will say the reports we get each day from the patch crews, usually it's something like this. There's a couple of pictures associated with it, but they'll say we picked up two and a half tons of asphalt. We handled 13 CRMs, which is the case generated by three eleven. And then they'll say we did 46 other repairs. So those are typically smaller you know, small potholes or larger potholes, right, whatever We they see in the immediate typically don't count them for this data just because it's, you know, it's difficult to kind of go back and quantify, you know, as we go along.

So, just kind of stick to it for the data wise. It's just three eleven cases. But as these guys are out on the roadway, they're not going to drive by something that needs be fixed. It's also as soon as they get rid of the patch, you know, they go on break. You know, it's as it cools on the back of the truck, it becomes more difficult to work with. So they want to get it out of the truck. It's easier to work with. It's a better it's a better repair. The warmer it is as they go, which is why we only get like two, two and a half tons per day.

So when when the public works crew is putting down so it's is it asphalt that putting down? Correct. Yeah. Okay. So, they're putting down asphalt onto the road. What is the road? Is the road entirely asphalt?

Yeah. Potuminous concrete, yep.

Okay.

Yes. Yep.

It will be a different type of mix.

So, your

resurfacing, your repaving mix sturdier is mix. The pothole kind of the patching mix is smaller aggregate, a little bit more sticky sometimes to help with the repair.

Okay. Yeah, that was my question is, is it frequent that when you fill a pothole because it's because it's not entirely the same as what the road is already what the road road is. But is there likely the chance that that pothole will need to be refilled a couple years later?

Yeah. Unfortunately, and sometimes even shorter than that, kind sort of like. And it really depends upon what the underlying issue is with the defect, right? So if it's a pothole that's like next to a utility casting, and there's water infiltration getting into that manhole or whatever it is, you know, unfortunately that can repeatedly reopen. Same if it's a washout and there's water getting through the subbase, that can be a problem. And frankly, as some of the streets are just older, the condition of that sub base aggregate just gets to a point where it, you know, it it won't hold the material as as long.

Is is the asphalt that we you using, is that the most effective material that that's on the market?

It we find it the most effective and efficient to work with. You know, there are some other methods and products, you know, that are used for kind of real unique cases. So, example, next week is part of the GreenLine diversion out in Cleveland Circle. You've got the Green Line track in Cleveland Circle. There's some really bad, defective payment around that infrastructure, and the MBTA is going to be coming in, taking advantage of that temporary closure to use a different type of material and process.

It's a it's a thermal heated process around the track bed. And and generally, you know, that that pavement will that, you know, repair will hold a lot longer than a typical pothole.

Okay. I'm having a walk through of the South End in the Back Bay, mostly the Back Bay area next Friday, May 15 at 1PM. We're starting at the Marriott Copley. This is residents requested me to kind of do a walk through with them, which is 110 Huntington Avenue, but want to invite BTD transportation and DPW public works. If if you would like to join me, I believe police officer is joining us too.

We're just discussing quality of life issues, public safety, but wanna wanna extend the invitation to you. That's at the request of I represent a small part of the Back Bay down towards Saint Patolph Street near the Marriott near the Copley area. We appreciate the invite, counselor. Yes. We will be here. Okay. Thank you. So, chief, you mentioned already Congress Street and and State Street. And I know Norman is doing a good a good job, and I know Danny's doing a good job. And and I actually have a couple.

I have a resident, a friend of mine, Suzanne, that lives in the Wharf District, which is right down the road from State Street. But on Congress Street itself, and I know you spoke about it, but when the manhole cover is, say what is it about three or four inches higher now than like the road itself. Right? But you but I I see people when they're driving, as as John was mentioning, but I do see people when they're driving because the manhole, they almost take a shop left or a shop right to avoid the the manhole, but they're not putting their blinker on. Yeah.

Because they they see it at the last second. And I haven't seen any accidents to be honest with you, but it's a good place to get into an accident because if you're not paying attention and you're making a sharp jerk to the left or a sharp jerk to the right, is that something you factor into? Yeah. And a lot

of times you'll see us kind of do like spray paint around a casting because we're trying to grab people's attention. But, you know, for exactly the reason that you've described, that's really why we're asking people to slow down. You know, if they're going slow enough, they really shouldn't have to make that type of move. But, you know, if somebody's in a really low clearance vehicle or something and they don't want hit that, that, you know, people have time to be able to react to that.

Okay. I I know I'm out of time. I'm gonna give John another opportunity. But let me let me just ask one more question before I go to John. Probably my favorite street in in in Boston. I love State Street. I've always I've always loved State Street. I love the old the old buildings. How are we doing on State Street, whether it's potholes, whether it's just quality of life, whether it's cleanliness? But I always kind of think of that street as as kind of being the, you know, the the street of commerce or the the residential area as well.

But, you know, it leads up to Congress, it leads up to, you know, heading towards the Tremont Street to towards Boston Common in a way. But what do you what do you think about State Street?

Yeah. Counsel, yes. One of the oldest streets in the city. A lot of lot of history there. We we have milled it from surface road up to up to Court Street here behind us.

That is short term work. There is a larger reconstruction project for State Street that is is nearing completion of design that we are looking to move into construction in the next year or two. As part of this resurfacing project, we did this short term because the roadway was in really poor condition going into the summer. And to your point, we're going have a lot of visitors. Interesting things about State Street is State Street, while it certainly carries a high number of vehicles, it actually carries more pedestrians every day.

So in anticipation of that, of the visitors we're gonna to see this summer, we want to make sure that that roadway was in good condition. So this is a very temporary resurfacing work in advance of that larger project that we hope to move forward soon.

Okay. So I finished my questions for the first round. I do wanna take any public testimony if anyone would like to testify. Okay. Doesn't appear that anyone has signed up.

If you're watching on television, you still want to testify, you can certainly send us an email and it will get added into the record. I will make sure that all the So if you do want to testify and send in your written comments, please do. You can send it to shane pack. So it's shane, shane,.pak,pac,@boston.gov. And, Shane will make sure that city council has received the testimony.

But others all also can email me directly because I love reading these comments from residents. You can send it to me directly at ed. Flinnboston dot gov. I'm going to give Councillor Fitzgerald we'll do another eight minutes and and that might be it. Yeah. Councillor Fitzgerald, you have the floor.

Thank you. And I don't know if I'll take all eight. But one, first and foremost, just wanted to shout out Public Works District three yard. That is within District 3 council wise too, but Andre Cornegie, runs a tight ship, and does great work over there. And, actually, it was I wasn't even, elected a week, and I went over to visit, did a ride around with him, and it was awesome.

He really helped helped me understand and set the tone for the important work this city does and what I'm up here to advocate for. Two, we had some of you guys in front of us earlier this week for the BTD and public works budget. And I'm thinking about potholes specifically because Omar brought up, hey. When you guys are making amendments and you took away from us last year, we ran out of money to fill potholes that came out of that that that line item in the budget. And that that hit me because I'm like, oh, no.

Right? The the just the the the gravity of the decisions we have to make in order to fill, but the realistic impacts that come out of that of, hey. We ran out of money to buy patch to fill potholes, which is really one of, again, the most basic city services people wanna see. I I don't want that to occur again. And so do we feel like we did we we did run out? And when we do, what what what happens? Like, right? I mean, what are you guys left with? Because some of the decisions we have to make, what are the hard decisions and how do you stretch what you have? Or do you just have to say at times, We can't get to that pothole right now because we don't have the money?

So, I can take that one. So, yeah, what Omar was speaking about. So, use cold patch as well. So, the hot asphalt that we go to the plant to pick up every morning. We also were buying bags of cold patch, which is a bag material, comes up a 20 pound bag. Use that for like off hours, like let's say in the afternoon or overnight a big pothole comes in. That's a problem, right? It's not something that you can put a barrel on or a cone, depending on where it is. The off hour crews will use that cold patch to fill it. In the past ten years, the technology there has improved immensely.

However, It's a great it's very expensive. It's way more expensive. I would say probably a 20 pound bag is probably just as much as a ton of the regular stuff. So that's what he was speaking of that we couldn't purchase anymore. We've always had access to the plant asphalt.

Dennis Yeah. How often is the coal patch used in terms of or maybe how much do you go through typically? Like what is the year number that we budget to buy X amount, we could we needed it at all, we'd buy Y amount?

Great question. And if you asked Darlene last night, she would have told you we use it way too much. Yeah. She's the one in charge of keeping track of how much we spend. So, it's very expensive. The guys like the convenience of it. If they just get one pothole, say it's a Friday morning, they only have one pothole, they'll say, Let's use the cold patch, Right? And I try not to dissuade it, but dialing and keeping track of the money says, No, that waits until Monday. So, know, that's kind of the give and take of where we are.

Understood. Okay. In my previous job in taking care of the Marine Industrial Park, named after Ed's father, we used Gold Patch to fill the potholes on those roads, obviously, with all the trucks and stuff coming through, but I I don't think I was aware of and not nearly as much as you guys had. We don't have as many miles of roadway, of course, in a marine industrial park. But still, I don't think I was aware of, how far it's come and how expensive it is now.

Yeah. Probably back then, there was probably a pile of it in the yard somewhere. Right? A pile of coal patch that someone would have to go put some diesel and turn it over. Now it comes in a bag, and it comes out of the bag. It's yeah. Great.

Yep, great. And then I'll end with this. We don't have to spend that much time because it's a this is like a sports talk radio Friday, ask me anything, right? But in a are we ever thinking about different ways to set build our roads? And what I mean by that is can we is there the technology, the the different type of materials, the upgrades, where to get to the utilities, to open up the road, to repave, to not have potholes.

Is there anything in the future that's even shown a glimpse of hope, of a completely different way to create a road? And and what I guess would be your ideal road knowing the problems that that you run into every day where we gotta open up, we gotta dig, we gotta cut cut fill potholes. You know, we gotta we gotta mill. What does the ideal road look like that makes all that stuff a little bit easier? Right? And I I don't know. Right? I I just I I try to throw I'd love to throw out an example, but my expertise falls far short.

Yeah. I I think, you know, I think first and foremost, you know, again, because of the age of the city, you know, have utility infrastructure in the city that is, you know, almost a century old. So, in some cases, even longer, right? And so, you know, getting our and there is a the utilities are putting a big investment into upgrading infrastructure. And so, you know, over time, getting that infrastructure to the place that it needs to be.

You know, yeah, a perfect world, we would construct a roadway in concrete with perfect drainage and, you know, with you know, it but that unfortunately isn't, you know, realistic here. But, you know, I will say every time, right, and particularly now because we're investing so much in ramps, right, We are, as we're doing even roadway resurfacing, not full reconstruction, these opportunities when we're doing ramps gives us that extra ability to address, like, if you've got a defect where you've puddling near an intersection or a crosswalk, right, we're able to address some of that now to kind of improve that roadway condition for the future.

Great. So concrete would be the ideal I'm just right, is that the material that would be the best at this moment, given what we know what we have? Concrete rolled would be the best?

Male But frankly, I mean, not it's just like cost prohibitive. Yeah. No, I understand the impossibleness of Male But also, you know, in Northeast climates, cold weather climates has its own maintenance challenges in the winter. You know, not just not, unfortunately, the ideal aggregate for here.

Awesome. That concludes my questions. Chair, once again, you guys as always for all you do.

Thank you. You.

Thank you. You, counsel Fitzgerald. I also want to give myself eight minutes as well. Chief, I'm gonna ask a couple I'm gonna ask some random questions that constituents asked me but but but on the federal decree, so the and and this has been this has been much before your time. It's been going on for somewhat seven or eight years or so.

But are we are we required to put the ramp for for persons with disabilities in a wheelchair? Are we required to put the ramp inside the crosswalk? Is that is that what we're one of the things we're required to do?

Yes. The but I will say the actual location and grade of every ramp is different, right, depending upon where it falls either at, you know, a mid block crossing or an intersection. So what makes what makes this work so challenging is, you know, there isn't a there isn't a ramp template. Right? Every single ramp that we rebuild is its own mini design.

Right? It has to be you know, the grades have to be shot. We have to, you know, you know, make sure it gets poured correctly. So that is that is what makes this work so time consuming, but also expensive.

Okay. And I'm gonna bounce around from issue to issue, but and no particular order. But so if you if you're going down a street and this the the street is is is is going downhill in a kind of in a kind of levels out and and that's where a lot of water may end up. Does that water have an impact on opening up puddles?

Yes. Absolutely. If there is not appropriate storm water infrastructure to capture that and remove it, That example of pooling water, certainly at the base of the hill, is is a significant contributor to to these types of roadway defects.

Okay. And and so I I assume part of the process or part of the solution is working closely with water and sewer department?

Yes. Yep. They're one they're one of the utilities that, yeah, we work very closely with when we're doing both resurfacing and when we're doing, you know, full depth reconstruction of a roadway. That is when we're often trying to take advantage of, you know, if stormwater infrastructure needs to be relocated, maybe to capture water better, that's those are the exact type of improvements that we're looking to make.

Okay. You know that I represent Chinatown, and Chinatown is very dense neighborhood, Old Neighborhood. Old water and sewer pipes as you know, may maybe one of the oldest in the city. We have challenges with the with the pipes rupturing. But when when there when there is a a water main break, say say in Chinatown, the the water and sewer crew has to come in and and and fix it.

But then tell me what the procedure is in terms of public works working with water and sewer as it relates to addressing potholes and and and fixing the street.

Sure. And, you know, counselors, know, we've had we've had a number of water breaks this year. And, you know, Boston Water Sewer, when when when we have a water main break, you know, they have kind of site control. They take responsibility. They do a great job at this.

They always they're in close communication with us, letting us know where they're at schedule wise, plan for repair. We coordinate that work with them, you know, but they they're responsible for basically essentially restoring the the roadway to, you know, previous condition. But, obviously, you know, when we have a major issue like that, we're gonna go in and assess that, you know, after the event. And, you know, that that is an example of how a road may get reprioritized up on on the resurfacing list if we've had a had an issue like that.

Okay. So so if that if that takes place, so water but public works would come in and take a look at the at the road or the street and see if there's any potholes in in and around the street, but also to ensure that the road looks as if nothing happened to it prior to the water main breakers. Yeah.

Yes. And as you know, you know, we we've had some water means this year that haven't just impacted roadway conditions. They buckled sidewalk and pushed curb up. So, yeah, we're we'll, you know, we go in and evaluate all of that.

Okay. Okay. Let me let me continue. And this is a resident resident Dodgester. I think John may have mentioned this. The stretch of Dodgester Avenue resurfaced from Freeport Street to Savon Hill Avenue. Hasn't had needs some work. Is that was that on your list too, that area? It's I don't represent it, but I just got an email from

What was the street again?

It's the stretch of Dorchester Avenue from Freeport Street to 7 Hill Avenue.

Yeah. So that so that corridor right now was being constructed by doing we're doing the ramps at that locations right now Yep. Up up the corridor there from 7 Hill Avenue all the way up to Freeport. I actually wear a Freeport as of right now. Okay. Constructing ramps. Once the ramps done, we then start to look to schedule to do a resurfacing.

Okay.

So I have to go I have to go back to the books to see where we're at with the resurfacing for this year for that particular section.

Okay. Thank you, Norman. That was from Donna from Dorchester. A constituent of mine, redesign of Washington Street in the Downtown Chinatown stretch. Any updates or insights would be appreciated.

Are you familiar with that? Washington Street in Downtown Boston and into Chinatown.

So Washington Street. So we're we're asking maybe resurfacing Washington Street from Neelyn up to Lafayette this year. It's gonna go in kinda like what is right now. A little bit of configuration changes inside not configurations. More changes to make more permanent fixes on it with the the flex posters are and we will take advantage of upgrading on that. But as far as resurfacing, we're coming right up Washington Street and and resurfacing that. We did Essex Street last year

Yeah.

And completing through as we're doing this year Chinatown Beach and Harrison. Right? We just milled out Beach Street last night.

Yeah. Okay. On oh, beach on beach in Chinatown. Town?

Yeah. Beach in China Town from from Harrison to Washington, and then we're gonna get the other piece from Tyler to to Harrison, and as well as Harrison.

Okay. No. That's that's excellent. You, Norman. The the Excuse me. The elderly people in Chinatown often ask me and I've I've I've requested this, but the the sidewalks on Beech Street are are in rough shape. That they did the sidewalks on Beech Street in the Leather District, which is just over just over the ways, but not not Chinatown. But what do you think about that, chief, in terms of Beach Street sidewalks?

Yeah. I I think I think we we we certainly have some short term sidewalk repairs in a few locations in in Chinatown. But in addition to that, we're also planning to kick off a a longer a larger and longer planning effort on how to upgrade all of the sidewalks in Chinatown, and that's something that we'll be out talking to the community about later this year.

Okay. Okay. I received a request a question really from David. He basically asked me or he suggested to make it a requirement that when utility companies or any entity that digs up the street, they must repave at least 50 feet in either direction of what was dug up using the same level of quality as the city does when it repaves the streets. What do you think about that?

Yeah. I mean, we, you know, what we require the utility to do varies kind of on a case by case basis. But, you know, for example, if they've had to, you know, go in and excavate something that's caused like significant damage to more than 50% of the roadway segment, yeah, we'll go in and make them resurface curb to curb.

Okay. And again, I have one other well, yeah, one other question. Tell us again, Nick, for the audience, when they see a pothole, tell us the procedure for getting the best, most effective way to get it done. What's the best way for residents to to do that?

Either three one one is the best way. Call, app, email, whatever your preference is, but you're always welcome to contact either the public works office or or transportation office upstairs as well.

So if someone puts in a 311 into the app about particular address, how fast would that get filled?

Our average case closure time is is eighteen hours right now. Okay. But in some cases, you know, but as I mentioned, I think two thirds of all cases are done within twenty four hours. So, it is, you know, generally a pothole is going to get done within a day or two at most.

Okay. And if it's longer than that, is there something that pops up on your system that that says it hasn't been done and we need to get it done? Is that how it

would work? Yes. As I sit in the queue, Counselor, it's either green, if it's under the SLA, which is kind of the internal shot clock that we have to fix it right now for it's just a standard

Service level agreement for

Yeah, Right now, so, you know, it's twenty four hours for a standard pothole for us to get it done. And it'll be a little green icon next to it. Once it goes over that SLA, it turns red. Okay. So, as they're looking at their list, you know, which might have, you know, 12 cases, they work back when they try to get the right ones first, obviously.

Okay. Maybe two other questions. Chief, I just had some constituents from my neighborhood in South Boston. I think Danny might be familiar with it, but do you know what MSN Auto is? Yes. Okay. We've had some issues there, ticketing and towing. I don't want to necessarily go into all the details, but could you I've sent I've sent a message to you on this, but could I follow-up with you after the meeting and see if there's anything we could we can do to support the residents?

Yeah. I'm happy to, counselor.

And and and part of it, I'm I I don't wanna get into it because it's it's a it's a different issue, but part of it is the seven nights per week residential park residential parking that's needed. But we can talk after. I don't I don't wanna I don't wanna mix the two. Okay? I do have a I do have a letter a letter of absence from one of my colleagues that I would like to read into the record.

So I'm City Council Henry Santana, dear Jeff Flynn, colleagues on the Committee of City Services. I regret to inform you that I am unable to attend today's hearing on docket zero five one five. Order for a hearing to discuss the status of addressing potholes in the city of Boston. I like to express my gratitude to chair Flynn for sponsoring holding this hearing on this very important topic. I look forward to reviewing the valuable insights and the discussion in the committee's report and recommended next steps.

City Council Henry Santana. Chief, my last question, guess, during this budget process, are you confident that you have enough funding in the FY twenty seven budget? And Danny, you too and Norman as well. Are you confident we have enough money for pothole repairs?

Yes. And I would say, not just pothole repairs, but I think we have sufficient funding to support a really strong pavement maintenance program next year.

Okay.

Counselor, if I have just one kind of general remark, if that's okay.

Yeah, that's yeah, of course.

I just I want to it would be wouldn't be appropriate to not take this minute and like recognize the people who actually do this work. You know, Norman and Danny provide incredible leadership here. But, you know, the work of actually going out and physically shoveling two and a half tons of hot mix is really labor intensive. It's hard. You're working in the street.

It can be dangerous work. And I just want to acknowledge and thank those folks who do that work for us every day. Oftentimes, you know, in the early spring, might be after a night they've been out doing snow and ice. So, I just want to recognize and appreciate their work and and ask people that when you see these teams doing that that work, please slow down. Be careful. You know, they're they're very vulnerable on the roadway.

No. That's a that's a good point, Nick. I I agree with you. I also wanna acknowledge the professional work, the workers do fixing and filling potholes. When they're filling potholes, how hot does it get? Especially in the summer time, is it how hot is that asphalt that they're working with?

Yeah. So it it cools slower in the summer. In the in the winter, as as Danny mentioned, you know, they're they're hustling to get that mix out of the truck because, you know, when it as it cools, it gets harder and harder to work with. In the summertime, you know, that mix can stay warmer. But, you know, I think when it's coming out, it's what, 01/1980? I was Yeah.

A 180 It popped into my head too.

And so so Nick and Danny, and and Norman, all the workers have to you know, safety is a is is something you you stress. But tell me about the safety aspect of what you provide. What are the guidelines for people that are for workers that are filling the puddles?

Sure. Yeah. So we've they give a boot allowance, right? So, you know, a nice pair sturdy boots. You'll see the pavers. So in each yard there's what we an employee who's the paver. It's a rating, right? It's a job description. It's what they do most of the time. They'll have their patch closed. So they'll have, know, in the yard they'll have their locker and it's you know, either coveralls or overalls or whatever they whatever they use. Gloves, right eye protection of high vis vests all provided by the city.

If a piece of that asphalt ever hit you hit your skin. It's going to burn, isn't it?

Not necessarily. Not by the time you start shoveling it, it cools considerably. Okay. Norman and I patched together for years. It's it's it's not com you don't wanna get it on you because it's it's dirty. It's difficult to wash off. Yeah. So you do you know, you get hit once and you learn a lesson very quickly, you know, to to cover everything as you go.

When you're breathing that in, that's a strong that's a strong odor. Is that still the case?

It is, but you're outdoors and as long as you're downwind, you know, it's not a confined space. Need it. You know, I might be a little strange. I actually enjoyed the smell. But yeah, it's not. As long as you're you're in a well ventilated area time. And

and the workers that are doing that, they have an opportunity after they complete it or even during during the work that they have an opportunity to take a break and have a glass of water off.

Oh, yeah.

Absolutely. Okay.

Do they do the workers put out orange cones when they're doing the work?

When needed, yeah. Yes. Okay. I mean, yes. Since usually whenever we can we have a follow-up. So on of the main drags, busy streets will follow vehicle with in both vehicles, patch truck and the follow vehicle will have emergency lights on it to kind of block traffic.

And they'll set that truck up to protect. Exactly. So, you'll have like the hot mix truck

in

front

Yeah.

That they're

they're Okay.

And and but the the truck behind will be kinda set up to protect them.

When we do roads like Rutherford Avenue, Largest Street, we'll we will get a police detail.

Yeah. Okay. But but the the street is not necessarily closed for vehicle traffic though, is

Very, very rarely.

Okay. Yeah. Is there a recommended speed limit when you're passing a truck? Or what is the what is the role of the vehicle of the driver that's passing the truck? What is the recommendation you would you would have?

You know, slow as possible.

Know, you

can, you know, if you're on a 25 mile an hour road, plea you know, please drop down 10 or 15.

Yeah.

It's space. Right? Don't we just ask people to, you know, give give them give them space to, you know, get try to get as far like, if we're in the if we're in the middle of the road, try to get as far to the, you know, one side or the other as

possible. Similar to when you're passing a a police vehicle on Exactly. On the right hand side, the law is you you are to move to the the next lane.

That's right.

So you're not what we our thoughts are what the state police state trooper that was just hit and I think it was Route 1 maybe, but our thoughts and prayers are what that state trooper. But I I think about other workers as well, but, you know, MBTA workers I see out there as well. But slow down. Try to go five miles an hour if you can. Move over.

Move over. And these are simple simple recommendations, but it is important to remind people about safety. Safety is really the most important aspect of it. Well, I don't have any further questions. I I wanna say thank you to Norman.

Thank you for your outstanding work and your your commitment to the residents of of the city for a long long period of time. I wanna say thank you as well, commissioner and to to Danny as well for his long time commitment to the residents of the city. So I'm gonna keep I'm gonna keep this hearing open and maybe six months from now we can we can kind of review and go back and have another discussion on this. But but on this docket, zero five one five oh, again, I want to say thank you to Shane and I want to say thank you to Ethan. But on this docket, five fifteen, order for a hearing to discuss the status of addressing potholes in the City Of Boston, this meeting is adjourned.

Thank you. Thank you.