City Commissioners - Regular Meeting

In the rain.

We'll call the meeting to order for the Ashland Board of the City Commission for our recessed meeting from last week. So I'll entertain a motion to receive and file the agenda as presented. So moved. Second. Any discussion of additions? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? Aye. All right. I think one of the greatest things to show, to demonstrate how the city is doing how the great workers we have is, we'll call it an incident, last week. And these gentlemen and the team of Ashland have demonstrated outstanding work. All the departments coming together. That's what it's all about, bringing everybody together, and you guys pulled it off. And we are so proud. We wanted you all to come in and to recognize you all. Individually, not just as a group, because it takes those individuals to make the team, to make it work. And you have the support of all the commission, all the different departments of making things work, which makes me proud, which makes the city proud of what you all do for them. They don't even know it. A lot of people didn't even know we had the raw water leak. And that's the beauty of it. We get it done. You all got it done. without all that hoopla. And that's what makes it all about. And I've asked Mr. Hall to come up, and if you have the names of the individuals, if you all would stand when he calls your name and let us recognize you.

Yeah, Mayor and Commissioners, too, I just wanted to mention, too, that most of these people that we brought in here today have done basically the hands-on portion of getting this leak repaired. Or, of course, Played a really vital role in it. There was also so many other people on the outside that were doing things. There was people in community, CED, there was finance people, elected officials.

Before you start, Mark, you might mention the second leak that we had in response to that. That was pretty critical too.

Yeah, definitely. So we did have a leak. The first one we're talking about started on May 14th. Our crews started working around the clock and it was eventually repaired. at about 10 p.m. on the 15th. Then we thought we were out of the woods at that point, and the second one wasn't as critical, but we still had another leak that we found a couple of days later that they just repaired yesterday on the same 24-inch raw water line. There's lines that run in parallel there and one that's out of service. There was also a leak on the old one next to it that's out of service. But it has evidently some water bleeding into it. So these guys repaired that too. Like I said, there was a lot of people that chipped into this to make this happen. And I just scribbled some things down here so I didn't forget. But I know for a fact there was people from APD, AFD, Finance, Engineering, Public Services, CED, all of our administrative assistants, PIO, legal, city manager, elected officials, and I'm sure I still left people out, and I apologize if I did, but that we're all involved in helping get this repair done. Ultimately, one of the things that really got this going was we contacted a contractor, Southern Ohio Trenching and Excavating, and they were able to bring a large excavator in here, much larger than we have, and they could move some serious dirt and get it out of the way so we could get this fixed in a more timely manner. We invited them to come in to be recognized, but guess what? They're working somewhere. They couldn't be here. Anyways, I'm going to mention those guys' names specifically to that crew. It was David Adkins, Jason Lambert, Timmy Adkins, sean wilds and jared casey and if you guys that were up there saw they were absolutely going at it up there to get this done so we appreciate everything they did um so i'm going to call off guys that are here right now i've got a whole list of people and some of the guys couldn't be here because they're putting out other fires right now but the ones that could are here so This is our wastewater collection bunch, which pitched in just like it was something in their division. So I want to mention these guys. Andrew Lawson, if you guys could just stand up. Okay, he's not here. Dave Pettit, Zachary, Stanley Harris, he's not in here. Joe Cox, he's not. Blake Giles, also working on that. Bruce Worthington. Bruce thought his name wouldn't be on here. Justin Royster. Matt Miller. And Braden Bevins. And then I just wanted to mention our water treatment plant personnel. And honestly, we got, what, 12 operators up there, 13 counting a seasonal or a part-time operator. These guys were... in and out, basically juggling, trying to fill the reservoir, or trying to fill the Board Hill tank, but also not depleting the reservoir, playing that juggling match, making sure that we didn't run out of water, which is not an easy task. So I'll just ask them to stand up too. Jeff Camp, Bill Stevens, Sam Nunley, Sam's not here, Dylan Coburn's not here, Austin Barker, not here, Mike Minyard, Not here. Drew Steele. Jeremy Coleman. Frank Worsley. I asked him, we should have just brought the cutout of Frank that we have up at the water plant. Yeah, he's at the plant. I said Frank and then also Austin Bruniger. And in water distribution, another thing to mention, we also had a valve that these guys had to repair at the same time. The valve broke in the process of shutting the water off to the reservoir, so they had to repair the valve to actually get everything back to normal. So the guys that were working on the valves were, the valve itself was William Guffey, Chad Abrams, Chad's not here, is he? Taylor Castro, Jesse Lee, Jesse, Dale White. Dale wasn't here. He's not here either. But the ones who were spending the majority of their time over there making the repairs on the leak, Jonathan Waddell, Dylan Barreras, Kevin Mayer, Jeff Burchett, Dylan Cross, Dominic Whitmore, Eric Boyle, Braxton Abrams, and Jonathan, you were so important, you're on this list twice. Justin Wolf, and Adam Wellman. I think I touched, is that all the guys that were in here? Did I get you, Eddie? I'm good. Eddie Reardon. Did I not get Jim? Okay, sorry, Jim. Blame that on your boss. But I... You know, truthfully, I hate to do lists like this because you are concerned about missing someone, but there's so many people. You know, there's public service people. I'm going to mention specifically people that were handing out water and those types of things that we didn't even see. That was all taken care of in the background. We didn't have to worry about that in utilities. but I know Sean gave me some names, Dave Travis, John Jenkins, Amber Berry, Chris Tucker, Dan Wright, Curtis McGraw, and Jesse Collins. So, I mean... Is that everybody? We appreciate it.

Mark, you also need to thank Tim Ingle. Oh, absolutely. I don't even know how he did it, but the amount of water he was able to get access to in about 10 hours.

That's why I should have read what I actually prepared, Andrew. I'm sorry. But I had them in here, too. It was emergency management. But, yeah, thank you.

Well, your name and Barry Adkins ought to go on there, too, of course.

Well, I mean... I guess we assume that, right? In those instances, we just stay out of these guys' way. They're the ones that actually do the work, so we appreciate them a lot.

Thank you. Thank you guys very much, and we appreciate what you do. And I'm going to use this as a commercial. You probably just got an email out to do an employee survey. We actually read those. And we respond to them. If you've got ideas how to change something or make something better, we'll listen to you. But the only way we sometimes have that is through that employee survey. Don't worry. We can't tell who says what. I guarantee it. I've looked at it myself. I've tried. But you can't tell that. I mean, even the smaller departments, they're aggregated together with some of the other small departments. So You know, that if we had a legal department that we know it was Susan, you can't do it because it's all aggregated together. But please go on there and complete that survey because you guys are the boots on the ground to understand how things should work. And we can respond to that if we just know. So please take time out and do that survey. That's my little deal. All right, and you all can go if you need to. Thanks again, guys. Well, I mean, you know, if you look at the whole picture of the whole Team Ashland, if you will, I mean, all the different departments and the troubleshooting of meeting upstairs and with all the different departments, how can we work together? that's what made it work besides the guys that are out on, you know, where the where the break was. So that's what it takes. I mean, if we all can come together to do anything, you know, we're stronger by working together. But thanks to everybody, even if we forgot somebody. All right, let's move into our old business. I'm a Mr. Wheeler.

Second reading and final adoption of ordinance entitled an ordinance of the city of Ashland, Kentucky authorizing and directing the mayor to execute a contract with Lights Enterprises Inc. for the purchase of all labor, materials, equipment and services for the demolition and removal of all debris of 201 47th Street in the amount of $3,000 for the Department of Community and Economic Development to be paid from the general fund.

So moved. Second. Discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

item b second reading and final adoption contract with lights enterprises inc for the purchase of all labor materials equipment and services for the demolition and removal of all debris at 508 44th street any amount of twelve thousand dollars for the department of community and economic development to be paid from the general fund second uh how come when this one was so much more than the others and you all

I was trying to look numbers on there.

Oh, is that what it is?

Okay. All right. So all in favor say aye. All right. All opposed.

Item C. Second reading and final adoption of an ordinance entitled an ordinance of the city of Ashland, Kentucky, authorizing and directing the mayor to execute a contract with Price 8 Construction for the purchase of all labor, materials, equipment, and services for the demolition and removal of all debris at 1077 29th Street in the amount of $6,200 for the Department of Community and Economic Development to be paid from the general fund.

So moved.

Second. Discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Item D. Second reading and final adoption of an ordinance entitled an ordinance of the City of Ashland, Kentucky authorized by directing the mayor to execute a contract with Tri-State Construction for the purchase of all labor and materials, equipment, and services for the demolition and removal of all debris at 5337 Valley View Drive in the amount of $6,600 for the Department of Community and Economic Development to be paid from the general fund.

So moved. Second.

Discussion?

The asbestos abatement, $13,550. Does that come out of that total? It comes out of that fund.

It comes out of the general fund account for demolitions. You can see there's a lot of balance in that account.

Thanks. Any other questions? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Item E. Second reading and final adoption of an ordinance entitled an ordinance of the City of Ashland, Kentucky fixing the tax levy for the year 2026 payable in the year 2027. One, the bank deposits franchise tax for revenue purposes by the City of Ashton.

So moved. Second.

Discussion? All in favor say aye.

Aye. All opposed?

Item F. Second reading and final adoption of an ordinance entitled an ordinance of the City of Ashton, Kentucky fixing the regulatory license fee at 4% of the gross receipts from the sale of alcoholic beverages within said city during the fiscal year July 1, 2026 through June 30, 2027. as authorized and imposed by Section 24 of Ordinance Number 8, Series of 2021, as amended, known and cited as the Alcoholic Beverage Control Ordinance for the City of Ashland, such proceeds to be used to reimburse the City for expenses related to the sale of alcohol beverages therein.

So moved. A first and a second. Any discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

On G. Second reading and final adoption of an ordinance entitled an ordinance of the City of Ashland, Kentucky authorizing and directing the mayor to execute an agreement between the Commonwealth of Kentucky Transportation Cabinet and the City of Ashland for a federal grant in an amount up to $120,000 which will require a match in an amount up to $30,000 by the City of Ashland for the Mayo Plaza streetscape project planning study and preliminary engineering. So moved. Second. Discussion?

All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Item H. Second reading and final adoption of an ordinance entirely, an ordinance in the City of Ashland, Kentucky, adopted by reference, updated procurement regulations for the City of Ashland, Kentucky, July 2026, and repealing ordinance number 8.

Discussion?

This just brings the chairman up to what state code says now.

In line with him, right? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? Item I.

Second reading and final adoption of an ordinance entitled an ordinance of the city of Ashland, Kentucky approving the renewal with Anthem Blue Cross Blue Shield insurance companies for administrative fees to administer the city's health insurance coverage, vision insurance, and stop loss coverage for plan year July 1, 2026 through June 30, 2027.

Second. Discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? Our consent agenda.

A resolution of the City of Ashland, Kentucky, adopting, authorizing, and approving the course of action presented by the City Manager on the items appearing on the consent agenda for the recess meeting of the Board of City Commissioners on May 20, 2026.

So moved.

Second?

Second for discussion.

Yes, sir.

Item B on here, is that tied into the...

So is the money, would the money come out of the bond sale? It's, you know, talk about a FY26 budget adjustment.

Yeah, I will fund it probably. We've got some loan settlement proceeds for PBAS and save the whole $9 million for water bonds.

It's in the utility budget? Yes.

We've got about $2 million so far this year. We've got another $362 million and another $150 million this week.

So you say we're looking to fund this in Utah?

Yes, and save the whole bond for water lines.

That's good. That's really good.

And that's also true of C, right?

Yes.

What's this? Will it take a while to get those two pieces of equipment or are they...

February, they had it in stock. We just asked if the amounts were current this week. We didn't ask what they had in stock.

I'm not sure on that. I would venture to guess that it'll take a while to get it. There's usually, I can follow up and get a timeline for the mayor and commissioners, but I would figure it's three months at a minimum, probably more closer to six.

Mark, is the hydraulic excavator similar to what was used by Southern Ohio? Not quite that large.

I think it's the same size as the similar to the one in the city. The sewer department has. It's just more compact to be able to work in the streets easier. It has a smaller footprint.

Mark, out of the carbon study, how's that going?

So it's going good. We're getting close to having some results. We think within the next month that we'll have some results from the jar.

What the best means of action for actual treatment will be.

So yeah, we should be able to give you something on that in June or July, I would think.

Going back to BNC, we do have a trailer for the excavator.

uh i would say that there has to be we do have it we have one trailer for sure that'll move it yes but i mean we have we have we have a trailer that will move sewers excavator and it'll move this well it could move several of them i mean i see what you're getting out of that i don't want to be tied up you know well they take it drop it off and then go get the other one you know

Well, I think that once we actually start moving forward with the expedited replacement of water lines, you know, that crew may need a dedicated track. That's good. Correct. I can definitely come up with something because you may have that crew, the standard line crew that focuses on that only.

Well, I think with the recent breaks that we've had, We're talking about re-evaluating what the $10 million would be used for. The intake water line as opposed to the replacement of water service lines.

It may have rose in the air. Right, right.

And as a question that I asked Mr. Hall yesterday, or before yesterday, I said, hey, what would it look like, what would the cost be for us to install an additional raw water intake line, and Mr. Hall advised me that there is an additional line that needs some potential extensive repairs.

I have a little bit more information as of just maybe an hour or so ago. One of our engineers, and this is just a budgetary figure just based on, they did a previous project like this in Wisconsin in 2024. Same size, they were raw water lines. They relined them. Based on the information that they gave us there, this is probably somewhere between $500,000 to a million dollar project to do all of it.

Both lines?

Yeah. And they relined it. Did they have to dig them up to do that? But that's assuming that there's no major snafus, no anything like that. But if this went well, and keep in mind, who knows what it would actually be when it goes to bid. But that's a ballpark figure. to do something like that. We could possibly do both lines and valving the valves that need to be done to be able to make the changes. You know, obviously we dealt with the valve from the 50s that was causing us issues up there. Those are preliminary numbers, but I think whatever that number is, you're talking four or five times probably to open trench it. So

Could we potentially bid that project out and just get a number and see what that number is?

Yeah, we could do that, but we'll need to develop a scope, and it'll actually have to be designed because of the intricacies of how that works. Those two lines, at one point, you know, you could use either line to feed the reservoir.

One's basically been out.

to get more information before we could put a bit out there probably permitting to the state we need to go through some of that for sure with the camera too to see if you actually yeah that'll that'll be part of the project because they will have to go in there and actually run it you'd have to run the camera to determine the integrity of the line do we have anybody running cameras on the sewer lining project right now that might be able to run one on it while they're here that's a different wing of their of their company that does water, but we could check into that to see if it's... I don't know that it's that... It's not like sewer where you have easy access to the main. we'd have to go in there and you know cut it open and get into it and the old line we found out yesterday had water on it we believe it's just leaking into there but at a minimum it had pressure on it and uh my thought was if we could get it cambered and you can see how viable the lining options are i mean that's obviously a yeah really really good We could definitely look into that. I'm just saying it's not as simple as, like with a sewer, because if it's an active line, I don't know how they would, you know.

You're saying the old line, the one we're not using, has pressure on it?

It had some water in it yesterday, and it had pressure on it. So the only thing that we can figure out, which we haven't looked in, obviously we haven't looked into it extensively, is if there's some water. that there is some water, you know, leaking past the valve and it's slightly pressurized. And it could just be head pressure, you know, if the line's 20 foot higher at this point and it's pushing a little bit of water out. We don't really know, but it definitely had water in it. But I can get some more information on all that. If you went on the trailer. The trailer for sure.

All right, any other questions? We voted on this.

No, we haven't voted on it. But we had people that were willing to jump in their truck and pop truck and deliver pop to us from, you know, six hours away. So we were able to locate 900 feet of 24-inch water line.

Wow, that's good. What did we end up buying from Cincinnati?

One section, one joint of pop.

How big?

one uh the lengthwise yeah i think they're like 13 feet or something they're not real long they're so big which we have that obviously that's not the only 24 inch lines that we have so yeah we i mean you have phone calls from the county or you know what can we do to help you know um but yeah that i just wanted to mention that that that's something that While we didn't have to fall back on it, that was another safeguard that we had. We could have gotten materials and parts from those people.

Well, and that's true, and we always need to be on the lookout to reciprocate back to other cities and stuff to lend that aid to and our expertise. We're getting pretty good at this, sadly. I wish it wasn't through repetition. That's true. how true all right uh i'm gonna lend it to you um mr grubb on the budget i think at this point we've presented the budget and you have thank you just one one

first one is do some fees um this reflects that we have a contingency of 138 646 for aim and aky if they want to do any actual events they'll bring them to you all for approval that there is funding available to do a business and we also changed office of emergency management to what their board's budget was adopted because it changed

I don't see any, I don't think any of us had any objections. I cannot speak up.

What other than the 138, what was the second one?

Office of Emergency Management have adopted their budget since we did the budget. So I just changed it to what their board adopted.

Pretty close to the other one.

Yeah, it is.

They were just doing a little more different way they divided the...

They just approved that increase, what, a month or two ago?

A month or two ago, yes.

Yeah, I think my email was April 19th.

That's about right.

The second is the Community Development Block Grant. There was like a $12,000 change. Jacob got more money in than he anticipated. It was like $512,000 rather than $500,000. We wanted to show... Where is that?

That's this big one, I think.

I don't think anything changed to the projects. Robin, it was...

I see Safe Harbor.

He added it to demolitions and concrete.

I'm sorry?

He added it to demolitions and concrete.

Okay.

Yes, sir.

I appreciate the work that's been done on those sidewalks throughout the community, and it's a pleasure to be an infrastructure investment. It's a great place to be in that federal land. So if you happen to be over on Ferry Street in other parts of the town, I encourage you to take a look at it.

It's a place where you're actually going to do it. And that's what the committee's decided to do next year, too, is we're funding projects that not help other people's infrastructure, but helps our own, too. Utility Fund Capital, this shows the last change where we changed two of the projects in the area only. The water line replacement for 24-inch is in the area, and that is a planet. And the 26th Street sewer, we changed that rehab and wastewater collection from $1.5 million to $250 million because Barry thought we could only get engineering done next year.

What was the first one you changed?

The water line replacement, it's in the basement of the water plant. All those lines haven't been changed, so we thought we would just get to engineering only next year.

That's in the 24-inch water line replacement?

Yes, but that's actually in the plant.

That's all the changes for?

Yes. And then the capital purchase improvement funds we allocated $150,000 for preliminary engineering or architectural work for the police station.

Chief, did you contact the architect at all on

Did they come up with this ballpark figure? Where did it come from? It was an estimation, sir.

whose estimation yeah i'm getting that i think i've got a an acronym for that estimation of construction it or the total cost it's about 20 of the total cost about 18 just gotcha i thought you were talking about the cost of the engineering or the drawings i have a question on the street portion of it and i might go for more of engineering

Culver box at 1110 Collard Road. We're not going to do that. Is that right there, right past Jamrock? Yes. I think at one time that was an ARPA project, wasn't it?

It was an ARPA project, but it didn't get engineered. Okay.

And that ties to the So the creek basically runs out of food land and all of that.

Can I just say, we're spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on new sidewalks and I'm all for it. I was just asking, Chief, would you please Have officers watch out for people parking on sidewalks that are not designed to be parked on. Thank you. They don't hold up well with cars parked on them.

All right. Anything else? last would be if you wanted to do a cost of living or some kind of increase for the employees yeah i think we left off the discussion between the the thousand dollar um across the board or the hybrid if you will which is two percent or a minimum of a thousand or the minimum of a thousand um And we'll discuss this again so both of us, all of us can get on the same page. I want us to be unanimous on that one way or the other. I've thought a little bit about that and I don't want to slight some employees over the others. That's why I'm kind of leaning toward the hybrid one because Some of the employees with the increase in retirements and that kind of thing, they're actually going to be losing money. Am I reading that wrong?

Yeah. They lose money.

Oh, okay.

There's 38 employees, I think, 44 that it affects. Kentucky retirement changed where you're going to have to pay the health insurance portion, and they went back and got a lot of Tier 1 employees that normally was not required to pay that. And a policeman or fireman that that applies to would be a 2% other salary, and a non-hazardous would be a 1% other salary.

I've gone back and forth. Other comments? I've just gone back and forth about this, and I think I favor the 2% now after talking to employees, talking to high end and low end. Right, right. That it would be the fairest for the 2% with 1,000 minimum.

What about you, Mr. Renfro? I haven't changed my mind. Okay. I mean, that's fine. Mr. Reimer?

I'm going to do some math up here real quick. Okay. Mr. Martin? I'll go with the majority, whatever. I mean, I'm not going to be left on the board, so I think it's more a decision of you four. But I'll join in at whatever it is. All right.

I know you explained your position last time, Mr. Renfro. You want to? just reiterate to make sure that I understand where you're at? I just don't like the gap that keeps widening from the top to the bottom.

That really bothers me. Okay.

All right. Mr. Raver is doing some high-powered math.

These specialized classes in school.

The inflationary is 2.7% this year. And last year was 2.9%.

So even with the hybrid, we're still not catching according to inflation?

No, you're not.

But we're doing something.

Yes.

What's the CPI? 2.7%.

that you were saving going the budget does balance because we balanced it with the higher cost option and the budget does balance without touching anything in the economic stabilization funds. So both all fund balance at that point.

Estimated revenues stayed the same.

Anticipated revenues. I mean, we go back three or four years ago and had former commissioners say those balance too. I don't necessarily agree with that.

I think that there is everybody on this commission, including the mayor, all four commissioners, we support our employees 110%. We want to give back to our employees any way we can. My concern, you know, I'm on the fence. I like the flat rate, but I also understand the 2% or or a minimum of $1,000 for folks making $50,000 or less. What I'm concerned about is when we do these percentage increases and when we look at this, we'll continue to create legacy costs and legacy expenditures with these positions. So if we do 2% this year, listen, I'd love to give everybody 10% we could afford. But if we could do a 2% this year and then a 3% next year and then a 3% and a 2%, that's a 10% increase over these wages. And their legacy costs are continuing to increase each and every year. The cost of living has went up. We all understand that. We're all burdened by that. I don't know if the W-2s across our community have went up, folks that pay our taxes in the community. I don't know if their wages have went up. I don't know if we've seen an increase in that. I mean, I'm on the fence, to be honest with you. I mean, I lean towards the 1,000 across the board.

But they have gone up, I think. You look at Walmart and Chick-fil-A, where they're starting people out at $15, $16 an hour. When you look at some of the people here, they have gone up.

We're starting right here. We're the lowest person in the city.

minimum of each grade is how the seasonals are paid but the minimum is fourteen don't quote me exactly but like fourteen eighty-three fourteen seventy-four I don't mean to put you on the spot.

I'm just trying to get an idea. Eighty percent of the employees fell from fifty thousand a month. So, yes. So, eighty percent of the employees

Yes.

I'll throw something else into it for the future, and we can discuss maybe not now but later. I'd love to go to a performance-based raises where, you know, the city manager has a goal. That filters down to his department heads. Those department heads filter it down to their employees, and then they're evaluated and mid-year to tell where they're at and at the end of year and if they the the triggers that we have set preset that if someone performs that you know a hundred percent you know they get a three percent race the people are at eighty percent of their goal gets two percent and the people that are 60%, get 1%. I'd love to see that discussed with it. I've used that before in the past.

And at the end of the day, throw the knives on the ground and it'll all be settled.

That may be true. But that's just a thought.

My only concern is we do have a lot of really highly paid employees here. And I'm not looking at anybody in particular, obviously. But when we add these percentages to the end of that, Why do we have to increase that pay scale? Why can't we give a raise, give a percentage, give 2% or whatever, and not, why do we have to adjust that scale? Is it because folks are at the top?

You adjust the scale for inflation. It keeps your compensation study relevant, because you'll get to a point where American Water will go after the people you have in this room if you're not adjusting the beginning wages of that, not keeping, basically, when you adjust the biflation you keep that compensation steady yes and then you also get to the point when you have highly licensed and educated employees you're keeping it current with the market with them so when you actually have those positions vacant you can actually attract people because you don't have the tier one retirement you used to have you have tier three with Kentucky retirement, which is basically a deferred comp plan. So it's not the job that it was when a lot of us started.

So I guess what I'm getting at is what says we have to adjust that scale to give a 2% increase?

The scale is actually proposed on here to be adjusted by inflation because what you're going to find yourself in is getting to a point in two or three years of not adjusting it and getting to the point where you have to do a comp study.

You have to do it. You would end up, we'll start losing employees with the expertise or engineers or whatever. If you don't keep up to the marketing rate, then another company is hired. They're going to go there. They're going to go where the money's at.

We've had to, even with the compensation study, we've had to with our water workers that are licensed and our sewer workers are licensed, we've had to go and even adjust it because they'll come in here and offer $6, $7 more an hour. And since there are people that are not in the Tier 1 or Tier 2 retirements, don't have no incentive to stay here.

How does the city finance that? We don't make anything. We make water. How do we keep up with that without cutting People are raising taxes.

How do we... You know, when salaries go up, your payroll tax automatically goes up. There's some built-in money there because as other people give raises, their payroll tax that they're paying us is more. As something you found with property taxes and other taxes, the value of the homes have went up. And as inflation has went up on different practices from employees too, it's just the cost of you know, what our people are buying. If you don't do it by inflation, you're not keeping their buying power the same.

Well, I think, you know, I mean, I'm on the fence with this. I could probably go either way at this point. But I think moving forward, I encourage that we look at the pay scale from new hires and see if these are realistic salaries for local government. our area i mean the city of huntington somebody reached out to me the other day about a position in the city of huntington as a communications director they're starting to rate 72 000 a year as a director of communications 72 000. i think we are if we had a communications director it'd probably be 110 000. So it probably is low to what we would have. But I think it's probably more realistic for wages in our area. You know, Ashland's a great place to work. We've got some of the best benefits. And especially, we have better benefits than most private sector. And folks, when they come here, they make a lot of money. But a lot of times, local government, you don't make a lot of money. And you're there for the benefits to raise the family to have a career. But I think that we need to be realistic, especially with, you know, we don't know how the economy's going to go under, we don't know how the economy's going to be, but I mean, our focus is economic development and building our community. But we also got to be cognizant of taxpayer dollars. I mean, that's... We are.

And I know we have been. Yes, we've come to reducing personnel. We've had employees that we've gave additional duties to that are doing more than they were two years ago. Now, of any administration, you all and senior management, we look every day for cuts. We want to make sure that the employee that's working here that's actually working six or eight hours a day.

We're looking to become more efficient. It might be a better way to.

And when we go out and look at the jobs, not only Unfortunately, not everybody is just government, private sector. A lot of our utilities with American Water is a public company. When you look at some of your engineering and your accounting positions, you have to compare them to people out in private sector too. It took us three years to hire an accountant. We finally had to raise the pay. 20,000 more than it normally was to get an accountant. We went through five hiring processes. So we could not get anybody to take the accounting job.

I guess how often we do market studies. We probably do them all the time, maybe.

I think it used to, and Mr. Murray, or Ms. Maddox, but... You used to have them about every five years is what they recommended when it was with Paul Combs. And there was a stint where, Sean, was it seven or eight years had passed before Hannah Resource Group?

Yeah, there was a little longer stretch. Usually it's dictated by, is it still working?

So if it's not working, if you're certain... Well, when you can't hire somebody, you know, because of pay scale, you know something's got to be looked at, you know.

I think they recommend to go every month. Every three years, every five years, something like that. Five years max.

But if we don't do the percentage, then that is going to be more critical that we do that and make the adjustment. Somewhere along the line, we're going to have to pay to keep our expertise, keep the people that are certified... and qualified to do these jobs.

And I think we all agree. I mean, I think we all agree that we need fair votes, and I agree. But, you know, I want a more fair and equitable increase.

I understand.

And the minimum pay of our lowest employee is $16.73 an hour.

1673? 1673.

And then paying into Kentucky Retirement and then paying into your insurance and your benefits. It all comes off of that.

Wow. What's the current monthly single payment on the health insurance?

55.74 per pay.

And family?

That's just for a single. For a family, it's $111.

So double, basically.

Per pay.

Yeah. Per pay.

Per pay. Per pay.

Okay. Well, I think I'm still at the hybrid. Mr. Renfrow is on 1,000. You're at the hybrid. Hybrid. Reimer's on the fence. You want to chime in or you want to? No.

Thank you.

I knew you'd appreciate it. Where are you at there?

I'm at the hybrid myself.

I'm at the hybrid. I found myself begrudging The people on the higher end. That's how I felt. If I tried to equal out everything, I was favoring one and not the other. And I found myself begrudging I can't. I mean, they're highly trained people that I think make what they're worth.

And I don't disagree with you. I just think that moving forward, we need to look at new folks coming off the street. and rates of pay that are realistic for a community. But with that being said, I'll support the hybrid.

Okay.

Okay. Is that a motion?

I'll make that motion.

You want a second? I'll second.

What'd you say? The 2% are minimum. Oh, sorry. Thank you. Sorry.

And Mr. Goode seconded.

I thought you said 10. Okay. I didn't like that.

Yeah, 2% with 10,000.

All right, so we have a motion and a second on the floor for the hybrid on the pay. Any further discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

No.

Okay.

Is there any more questions on any areas of the budget?

I think we're... I don't want to speak for everybody. I'm good.

I appreciate your work on it.

Well, it's been a tough one, but I think it's been fair. I mean, we've allowed ourselves for good discussion.

I've got one request. Can we have those portable pickleball courts... Portable. Portable.

We've got a couple sets we have ordered. Those go up for like a high usage time. Yeah.

Good. Is there any kind of timeline maybe?

The field supervisor said it should take probably two more weeks.

That would be great because if we kill two birds with one stone that way we keep the tennis courts. Yeah. and then we can move the portables in when there's a big crowd there that need the other two.

Well, that's good. I didn't know there was an option.

I've got something, a public comment, or just a comment. I want to commend CED staff for their work on repair fare this year. Great job. You guys have done a great job. I want to thank Park Screws and Streaks Sanitation that came out to help with that event this year. Another successful year.

Yes, absolutely. A lot of positive comments. even on social media.

We'll go back to new business. as adopted by Ordinance Number 31, Series of 2023, as previously amended.

So moved.

Second. Did I hear a second?

No, second.

Okay. Discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? Item B.

First reading and approval of an ordinance entitled an ordinance of the city of Ashland, Kentucky adopting the amended authorizations authorized positions listing of the classification and compensation plan if adopted by ordinance number 31 series of 2023 as previously amended.

So moved. Second. Discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Item C. First reading and approval of an ordinance entitled an ordinance. I'm sorry. Yes. First reading and approval of ordinance entitled, A Series Bond Ordinance of the City of Ashland, Kentucky, authorizing the issuance of $10 million principal amount of water and sewer revenue bonds, Series 2026A, which amount may be increased by up to $100,000 or decreased by any amount, designating the paying agent and registrar in respect thereof, approving the preparation of a preliminary and final official statement in respect thereof, providing for the sale of such bonds to the lowest and best bidder, and authorizing the mayor and city clerk to execute documents on behalf of the city. So moved.

Second.

Discussion?

Yeah. I guess I'm okay with giving the first reading of this, but I really think we need to... firm up the direction we're going in in terms of the water intake line to know what kind of numbers we've got there and what would be left over for water line replacement.

I've got some more feelers out for other engineering groups. I can just give a kind of a overall estimate of this one said this, this one said that.

I think a

first reading and then we can maybe give a pause the second reading until we've got the numbers and then Mark can give us some information on that second reading I want to go back to Michelle and Tony on this one is there going do you foresee within I guess the second quarter a change in the rate increase or decrease in bond rate no higher the bond rates now

It was somewhere in the 3.9 to 4% range when I called it. I don't do so many things staying the same.

Probably 60 days.

Okay. I'll just say, I want to say that it shows this board because without our investment, this infrastructure You know, we're not going to go anywhere. And I see a really bright future for us.

It does. It starts here.

But I agree with Mr. Martin. You know, how much is that going to cost and take away from this? Right, right.

Well, and then long term, I mean, this is the first step. What do we project to be, you know, longer term costs and investment? of the line replacement. I mean, we're not going to do $10 million. We're talking about this being a three-year deal, but that's going to be affected by the water intake line.

And I appreciate the comment on here that this is going to be funded with funds and revenues from unaccounted water line usage, savings, and approximately an amount of $500,000 to $600,000 a year.

We're going to continue, the water loss team is going to continue to look at our water loss and find ways to reduce it. Then we'll be finding money with that in increased revenue or we'll be fixing leaks so we won't be losing money.

You know, that priority list is going to change year to year. It could change any time. I mean, it's not a static list.

It could change over the weekend. Exactly. I wanted to say also, too, just for your all's information, we hope to get some, you know, some of these engineers might come back and say, that's not a good idea. This needs to be open trenched, blah, blah, blah. We want to at least hear what they have to say. Obviously, we're not going to open trench under the, you know, through the tracks. We would want something to stay away from 23 in the tracks for sure. But it could be some hybrid version of what I'm saying. You know, that's That's why we're reaching out to them to get their ideas. So we'll have hopefully a range of things. If we did this, we're looking at this range of cost. If we did this, it would be something else.

And we'll administratively start the process on this staffing to have them on board about the same time. And we'll look at POPs because POPs are taking about 46 months.

Yeah, depending. I think it's gotten a little bit better on delivery. If we have a I can ask Davey tomorrow and just, we'll just say, well, it's 12 inch PVC, you know, the turnaround time, just something in the middle. And I can get that to you guys too.

I was concerned that I had was the cost of oil prices going up, you know, our cost for piping can go up, the cost for blacktopping can go up.

Yeah, they've both went up inflationary costs since COVID.

The staffing for this in-house first?

Yes.

All right. We have first and second on the first reading. All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Item D. First reading and approval of an ordinance entitled an ordinance in the city of Ashland, Kentucky authorizing and approving change order number one between the city of Ashland, Kentucky and Tri-State Construction and Enterprise LLC increasing the contract amount by $1,386 for the Ashland Fire Department shower installation project.

So moved. So moved. Second.

Second. Discussion?

The payment of expenses of the City of Ashland

for the 12-month period beginning July 1, 2026 and ending June 30, 2027, and repealing all ordinances and parts of ordinances in conflict with it.

Second.

Discussion?

Do we have a copy of that ordinance? I know it was...

Yes. Okay. We did two versions. You got the version with the higher amount. We all chose the $1,000, and that one was the... Huh?

Okay. All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? Aye. All right. Any other business? Good meeting. We stand adjourned.

About an hour. About an hour.

About an hour. A little over an hour.

I'm back.