Affordable Housing and Community Equity Development Commission - Regular Meeting

and you're live. Okay. This is a meeting of the Affordable Housing and Community Equity Development Commission, our virtual meeting of April 24th, 2025. And I'd like to call the meeting to order. I'll do a roll call first. Uh Rich Halverson, present. Elijah her Blaine here. Terry Bond here. And that is it for our members at this point. I know Patrick is out of town so he can't be here. And I'm hoping that Karen does join us. Okay. Next item of business is the approval of the minutes for March 27th. I move we approve them as changed as modified. And is there a second? I'll second. All those in favor? I opposed. The minutes from March 27th have been approved. Okay. The next order of business is a presentation of the city of Annapolis's draft 5-year consolidated plan. I put down 2026 to 2030, but it really should be 2025. July, it should be July 2025 through Jul June 2030 um on the agenda. So, um, we'll make that correction once we if we need to. Um, and we have with us tonight an a member of the city of

Annapolis's planning and zoning staff, and I'm going to let Denise Ruffen introduce her to us. So, Alexis is one of the newest members of our staff. She's absolutely wonderful. Her along with John Hagglin and Eric Lejinski, they've been working on the city's 5-year plan and also incorporating this 5-year plan into um uh the city's 5-year plan. And she's just going to do a brief presentation on what they've been working on. And um I think you guys will really be impressed. Okay. Um, just wanted to say that um that we're really fortunate to have Alexis join us tonight and and this is going to serve as a public meeting on the HUDmandated 5-year consolidated plan. It's going to outline the the Annapolis Housing and Development priorities for the next five years. Um it's a public meeting as you know and so if there are those who are listening their input is going to be crucial to final to the final shape of this plan to ensure that it addresses all of Annapolis's needs including affordable housing, homelessness and economic opportunity. Um so we will open the meeting to public testimony to include the plan to to include in the plan and then and what that will mean is in the future

it after the after this meeting is over if there are any people listening at this point you'll be able to participate this evening in our discussion but after the after it has been presented you will also be able to um provide your comments to the office of of planning and zoning and I'm sure that Alexis will tell us exactly how that can be done. So right now I'm going to turn the meeting over to Alexis and she can go through her presentation of the draft that that exists right now. Alexis, thank you very much for being here. Thank you Nancy uh for allowing us this time today and this evening. Uh hello everybody. As uh Denise said, I'm a new employee with the city. I've been with the city about five months now, but I and the point of contact currently for the uh consolidated plans uh development. And so I want to just briefly go over what the five-year consolidated plan is. Um, and Nancy, you were right about the dates. Uh, the federal fiscal year and our local fiscal year kind of don't match up. So, for the federal fiscal year, it is uh 26 through 30, but for our local plan, it'll be July 2025 through June of 2030. And so to start, um, as Annapolis is an entitlement community under the Department of Housing and Urban Development's community block grant program, um, this money is provided through the uh, Department of HUD uh, and is used to develop viable urban communities uh, to

also provide decent housing and suitable living environment. Also expanding economic opportunities in particular for low and moderate income persons. Um we are in the process of developing the five-year consolidated plan. Uh so it's there is no draft currently. Uh but we are hope this public meeting is to uh solicit the needs from the community of what they would like to see included as related to um housing affordability, access, homelessness, um home ownership, um a few different things that can be captured within uh this funding. Um, this is something that's done every five years and so there was a previous one for 2021 to to now uh that's been wrapped up. Um, we produced our last caper which is the consolidated action plan evaluation report uh that you can find on the city's website currently. Um and then um as we move through this process, we are doing a few rounds of community engagement with different stakeholders in the housing and economic development communities of the city of Annapolis. Uh we are also reaching out to our neighbors within the county and um you know other agencies or uh organizations that handle the same

issues that may be funded through uh this through the CDBG or um identified as projects in the a consolidated plan. And so that is a very brief overview. Um just to emphasize the priorities established through the needs assessment for the consolidated plan will include housing, homelessness, special needs, community development, economic development, uh as well as the uh administration, planning and management of those kinds of programs. And so that is uh basically my presentation. Um I would love to open it up for questions or comments or if we have any attendees uh who would like to give uh feedback um or suggestions to So my first question is can you describe a little bit about what kinds of things you're going to be doing under the next in the next five years the kinds of priority goals and objectives that you have. Yeah. And to build on that, uh, Alexis, just to complement what what Nancy is asking is it's our understanding that the decisions been made to focus the CDBG funding on capital projects rather than on public service projects. And if that is the case, kind of tied into what Nancy is saying, how does then that decision overlay with the goals and strategies that are being outlined

within the consolidated plan? We we excuse Can I Can I answer him, Alexis? Sure, Denise. Um, they decided to do and I know we discussed this last year. I mean, last meeting, the city has decided to you utilize the CDBG funds for capital improvements um on projects in need. And then the city has offered the use of um I'm not certain which funding source, but they've offered the option of them applying for the funds through the city programs for the uh public service needs. one of one of our our accounts there within the city. I just can't tell you which one it is, but that's what the city has opted to do as far as the um the use of the CDBG funds, and they're going to offset it by offering funds through another source of the city's um So, it was in So, Denise, I don't mean to interrupt, but it was in the budget. I sent it out to the committee members. Um Right. Right. Yeah. and and it actually in the it was a budget committee I think that said exactly where that money was going to come from. It was really great was a great report. So I don't remember the name of the particular program but it was a great report. It might have been it might have been the city service something service I can look it up services it might be under community service. Right. Right. But it's one of the reasons that I'm this is important is that um the last in the thing that you sent in the script that you sent me or the report that you sent me, Alexis, it it talks about the key priority goals and

objectives from the the year 20 from the year 2023. and it talks about um assisting providers in the operation of housing and support services for the homeless um which obviously we're not going to do this this fiscal year or this program year I guess is really the best thing to call it not fiscal year um so I was just curious about and then there's another goal that talks about vital public services so obviously those goals are not going to be included in in our next plan or will they be? Um, since we're not going to do it this year and I don't anticipate over the next however many years, at least three, um, there probably won't be a lot of money coming to the city of Annapolis under the CDBG program. So is that going to alter is that going to alter how the the goals and priorities are established for the city? Well, I would I want to also say to start at this time we don't know our allocation. Um right but uh we do still want to plan um but as you say yes so like services um will not be included in this and more so um funding for like the rehabilitation or maintenance of affordable housing whether owned or rented. um including or you know capital improvement projects uh for public facility not necessarily public facilities but

um facilities for uh low and moderate income persons but um I also want to John is there anything else that you would add to that? Yeah um let let me John you want to identify yourself for everybody? Absolutely. My name is John Hagglin. Um, I work as a consultant with Urban Design Ventures. We're a firm that's located out of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Uh, I've worked previously with Terresa Wellman uh on the last plan for the city of Annapolis and the plan prior to that uh for the city of Annapapolis. Um, so um I we were engaged to assist the city as a consultant uh to assist Alexis and uh Denise and and the uh department of planning to put the plan together. Uh my job is really just sort of uh acting as a facilitator to do the uh consultations uh organize the um uh plan to meet what the HUD requirements are. Um if I could go back for a quick question there there was a question about public services. Uh HUD has a regulation that only 15% of your HUD allocate or your CDBG allocation can be used on public services. So, in and of itself, uh you can only do um you know, roughly speaking like about $30 to $40,000 based on what your allocation is. Um I do not know the exact funding source, but I understand that the city does have a fund um that is allocated aside for uh public services that's outside of the department of planning. Um and that will be uh what is being used for that. Um, going more specifically to the needs, um, like Alexis had said, uh, we're going to have the following priority needs. We had those before. They're housing. Uh, they are homeless. Uh, let me go back. So, uh, housing needs,

homeless needs, other special needs. That would include um things such as uh uh uh seniors uh individuals with disabilities, community development needs. Uh within our community development need, I I believe that we would have a actual goal uh that would allow us should you want to fund public services that we would include that. Um my reason to say that I would say we keep that in there is if um you know in the future possibly you wanted to fund public services which at this time my understanding is we're not intending to do that that you would have that ability to access that. Um the way that I would write the plan is to basically say a priority need would be either a high or a low priority and a high priority would be stated that we expect to fund it over the next five years and a low priority would be that we recognize the need. um we would support projects that are doing that, but we don't anticipate directly using CDBG funds for that. Um so we just want to have kind of a very open plan that allows us freedom to do things over the next five years. Um given obviously a lot of unknowns in terms of you know what your allocation will be this year, what it'll be over the next five years. Um and HUD allows us that freedom to do that. Um to to you know provide that framework of what I was saying, you know, high priority or a low priority. So, we recognize the priority, but we may not fund it within this five-year period. Um, does that make sense? Well, I don't know if you say you may not fund it. It what you probably need to say is that ability to fund it is dependent upon the amount of funds that we receive. You want to make it clear that if you could, you would. Yes. But you may not be able to. Sure. rather than say rather it you know you say it's a high priority but then you end up not funding it so it might be good in the

plan to say we'd fund it if we could m makes sense absolutely I think we can for surely put our um discussion as to how that works in that framing for sure yeah okay so it's essentially you're you're going to continue to have the same goals and objectives as you've had in the past without a whole lot of modification and which I think I mean they're broad enough that they make sense um and it probably won't change much is that we we'll be slim correctly we'll be slimming it down a little bit um previously I would say that there were probably um maybe 20 goals that fit under six priorities priority needs. Um I think that we'll probably have five or six priority needs and then underneath those goals will be closer to probably 10 to 15 goals. So it'll it'll get a little smaller. Um you know that will show up when we are at the draft stage uh which right now I'm doing consultations uh that'll be wrapped up in a couple of weeks. uh then it'll be about a month of writing the plan and then we'll discuss it internally and then put that on public display at that point. Um so we'll be following the general same framework. Um but I would say that the goals and priorities may be reduced a little bit uh in light of of uncertainty in terms of funding. Okay. All right. So Denise and and Alexis and John, thanks for for all the information. So considering that there is a a level of a high level of continuity from the last plan into this five-year

plan, the shift being, you know, the limited amount of public service dollars that even could be allocated, you know, it's definitely been understood that, hey, it's so little. Why are we even segmenting it off? Let's just go ahead and keep it all in kind of a capital um availability. Are there projects that are in line for development for and would are in line for the for the use of these funds? Or is that kind of an ongoing discussion amongst staff and amongst the community about how to best use the limited capital dollars that even you get given that you know yes it's a participating jurisdiction but it's not a large one right so yeah I guess that's what I'm wondering because there are other capital needs that are out there as of course we all know. But it when I think about kind of the the categories of funding or the the the goals of the development of housing, the uh focus on homelessness, uh special needs populations, you know, there are some specific capital needs that we are aware of obviously particularly within this commission that we I personally would love to see kind of elevated beyond a conceptual conversation and moved into a very pragmatic, all right, how much money are we talking about? What needs to be done? Who else needs to be at the table? How do we move forward with doing that? So, I know that was a lot right there, but if any of you want to kind of take a take a shot at it. Well, well, we we've opened up the um application process and

we still are processing it the way we normally do. people have applied and there are some communities out there that have capital needs and and without being able to tell you who actually applied. Um some of the communities that we do assist is not just rental communities is also there are communities with special needs. Some of the applicants that have come through in the past. I just don't know. I can't really tell you who has applied yet. That would be presented in our next meeting. I don't know if it's top secret, but I don't want to just spill the beans without the details in front of me, but so we would be focused more on that. So, it would help at least some of the community, but I don't know if it will address homelessness um as part of that seems to be your concern lately, Elijah. And I don't know if any of the applicants address the homeless situation, but the capital needs would be used for communities that serve low to moderate um family, low to moderate income families. And so when is that application cycle for FY26 closing? It's already closed. We have the applications in there. Okay. We're trying to finish up this plan here before we make the decision on the funding. So, what's that broad kind of application timeline like? When does it generally, you know, this year it opened on this particular date, it closed on this particular date, but those kind of give you like broad bookends when you all do it? What are those broad bookends? Is it like early January? Well, we normally do it, but we've fallen into a quagmire. So with that being said, we are behind schedule, but

we do the application process closed. I can't give you that. I didn't come prepared to give you that information off the top of my head, but we do and we will be making a decision on those um projects um probably and do a presentation at next month's meeting. That was the plan. Next month's meeting. Okay. Right. We wanted to get through this 5-year plan before we did the presentation for the people applying for the funds. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And um what is your timeline for the for the plan for the consolidated plan? Do you have actually have a timeline for it? I know there are meetings going on in the next few weeks. Yeah, I I can take that one. Um, basically um next next couple next couple of weeks we'll be uh continuing with our uh consultations, speaking to stakeholders. Um engaging the public through the survey that's out there. Um the next process will be basically May me writing the plan. Um and then we're waiting for the HUD allocations. We expect uh I would say end of May um so probably beginning of June we will uh be able to understand what our budget is and expect to put that plan on a 30-day public display period uh at that time period. Okay. That is if if they actually provide you with an allocation but that's another story. Yeah, it's our understanding like um mid to end of May is when it's coming out. Yeah. Okay. I won't hold my breath for

it. Is there anybody left to actually make those allocations? Terry's gonna go down there and help him out, right, Terry? Oh, no. I'm staying away from that. I I'm not the most knowledgeable of about how the budgets work out, but there there is an allocation that went to HUD. Uh my understanding is that um it is um at the discretion of the secretary of HUD as to how that funding will be allocated. Um I mean I I have every expectation that you know a portion uh would would go to what the CDBG program has done. So there there would be an expectation uh for that. We're looking at at least at least the same amount. That's kind of how we set up our budget is based on last year's amount. And Teresa has this way of finding money from somewhere else. So, she's working on that. Good. Good. Elijah, is that your is that what you're thinking in terms of that align with that aligns with my understanding as well. I think the overall kind of point that I think is important for all of us to recognize is we're like we've always had to be judicious about how we use these funds and it's just going to get ever more um of a need to really f yeah ever ever more difficult to hone that in and that's where you know that's why I ask about the application cycle is because I think particularly knowing now that the FY26 cycle for applications is closed that we're likely in a best case scenario to see level funding from HUD for FY26 because the administration just kind of quote doesn't want to pick that battle right now and that they can pick

the battle at the outset with the FY27 cycle. I think that's where it would be nice. I think for us as a committee to have continued conversations with the staff about leading into FY27, what are the one honestly maybe two projects that can be the best center mass, middleofthe-art board, whatever analogy you want to torture um to to to fund. And I there's no shortage of of ideas, but I think that the shortage is around which are the most feasible and the most likely to get done with the least amount of lift, so to speak, that are kind of prepackaged, ready to go, you know, that sort of thing. So, I think that's where I would just encourage us to kind of start shifting our thinking as we enter into the FY27 cycle. Yeah. No, I think that makes sense. Yeah, absolutely. I couldn't agree more. And that is the logic. That's the logic I'm using with the plan as as well. Excuse me. Good. Got to find that lowhanging fruit that'll have some impact. Um, any other comments that anyone wants to a make or any questions that anyone has for Alexis or John? I don't know that there's anyone listening who wants to make comments now or [Music] would want to wait till after something is concretely published to so that they can make comments on dra on the draft that may

make the most sense for at least for people who may be listening. Um I just want to add that um so we are doing comments for this public meeting um that can be submitted through the city website. Um I can add that. I don't know if it'd be best to like add it to the chat or just send it to you separately to add in your agenda. Uh then there's also the resident survey that we are trying to get responses from that um you all as well as anyone who's watching or participating can uh fill out and and that's on the website. Yes, that's also survey is on the website. Okay. And um once the draft of the plan is written and open for display uh we'll do another public meeting uh during that display period for to take board comments. So that may be a July in July maybe you'll come back. Is that is that when it'll be ready? Yeah. if the plan should be ready maybe by the mid to late June. So yeah, we'll do the public meeting in July and you'll come back and go over the draft. So that Okay. Right. Right. Anyone else have any comments, questions, etc. Okay. I would like to thank Alexis and John from all the way from California um for being with us and helping us through this initial phase of the consolidated plan. Um and we look

forward to seeing the draft and working on that draft with you guys. So, thank you very much. You Okay, next item on the agenda is the homeless policy followup. We started talking about last month. Um, and I think the one thing to begin with is whether there is a draft of the letter that we thought we might send or if if not when we might expect that to be able to comment on that. Uh, I'll take a quick crack at that, Rich, if that's all right. Uh, right on. Um the letter is is um is in an initial draft stage. Rich uh thanks to Rich. Um we've been circulating it amongst uh other community partners um and have received positive feedback on that. Good. There there are some other community partners that have not had the opportunity to take a look at it quite yet. And so we're continuing to try and make that happen. I'm hopeful that will happen in the next week or so. Um and that I hope will be when kind of like the dominoes can start to kind of fall on some of this. Um with I think the um uh with with I think the bottom line goal being a letter that can be collectively signed on to. um and sent to both the city uh local elected officials as well as the county um to

really kind of identify um what exists, identify the gap in what exists, identify who might be able to operationally fill that gap and recognizing then that there is a capital gap. Um, and so to be very specific, it's it's where, right? That's we might know of an organization that could run uh more of a low barrier shelter that would expand the number of beds to the count available to the county and the city. Um, but the question is where? Um, and so that's really the motivation behind a lot of my questions just pre in the previous segment of our of our meeting here of what's available out there. Um, so yeah. Yeah, that's that's whereage at. Can you tell us who are some of the partners that you've been talking to? I've had conversations with Bless Tech Ministries. They are the organization that operates out of the Stanton Center. um when the shelter when the emergency shelter is open there um based on cold weather um and then there's hot weather um and so I think that's one of the points that kind of blessed tech makes is you know it's really hard to it's really hard to plan for that when you have like in the spring and in the fall just real variations in temperature from day to Okay. Um, and then there's also those times where just for conversational purposes, let's say it's when the temperature falls below 50 degrees, right? I don't know the actual uh degree, but uh let's say it's 51 and

raining, you know, and that is a very pragmatic component of all of this. That happens a lot. And so you run we run into these situations where it's 50 and not raining but it's 50 so the weather or it's 49 and not raining and so it opens up but then it's 51 and raining it feels even worse and it's not open and so where is where's kind of the logic there right and I think that's what kind of trying to identify is how can we um provide the resources that are necessary especially as evictions are increasing, funding cuts are in are increasing, rents are increasing, um and supply is continuing to not keep up with overall demand. Um, so I think there's there's this issue and then if I can I'm going to maybe try and segue us a bit. There's also just this broader issue that we all know about housing and we're coming into election season. So, how can we really, I think, also use the election as an opportunity to elevate what is consistently identified by people as being an issue that they are concerned about. But yet, you know, we consistently see the push back as well while also making a lot of progress. And I think we need to to really elevate that progress that's been made through the comprehensive plan process. There's been a lot of hard work done on that and there's been ordinances passed um so or ordinances con considered

so yeah I hear what you're saying um I guess the the question is how do we make ourselves a part of this discussion? And should we be part of a discussion that that that hinges on future elections and our participation in the elective process? Um or and if if we should be when should we be Um, I have to say in terms of homelessness, you know, when I when I used to work on the Hill, the Congress as a whole figured once they funded homelessness, provided assistance to the homeless population, they'd done their job, then they could go, "We did it. We funded the homeless account." And it it took a lot to to get them to realize it's more than just homelessness. Um, and I think, you know, that's sort of the broader agenda that we're that we look at on the commission. It's not just homelessness. Even though, you know, it there seems to be a demand right now for trying to expand what's available in the city of Annapolis. Um, there's still more we need to talk about in terms of affordable housing. So the question is what what role do we play and what role and when do we play it and I thought we were looking at also collaboration with the county you know because because you know we are surrounded by a very large jurisdiction that's got property on all the sides I mean it it could be just over the boundary and still serve the people of you know the Annapolis. So,

because we're land constrained, I I don't I I think it's I thought talking about more of a collaborative e effort to and I think you're right. I think they're absolutely right. We have to be. That's fair. And Nancy, I appreciate your point for us to get clarification on where um it's not only appropriate, but I think um maybe appropriate is the best word for us to engage. But to the extent that the election is an opportunity for more public discourse on um topics affecting uh people throughout the city and the county. Uh I think it's a it's something to be on our radar that we make sure these topics are included in the public discourse and people are given a chance to to uh discuss and share their opinions and if it's I think it would only benefit benefit um the purpose of our committee to have more public discourse on this topic. Good. I think I think that's true and I the question is when um I think how is you know I don't we don't get a lot of public attendance at our meetings they don't people don't come and watch us so but we could help provide but groups are doing this provide information provide background you know talk about what the city's doing and where the gaps are that could be part of you There's forums all the time and I think last time there may have been forums on affordable housing. So we just understand that it's not just housing, it's also you know housing the homeless and this and the services. It's it's a bigger thing than that. So more education outreach and then find out how the candidates feel about these things but we wouldn't do it I don't think we have to do it ourselves. We could work with the groups that are doing that.

Right. I think that's I think that's a good point. Um question is when does all this start and I I don't know the timing of that. Um I guess there's not going to be a primary that we can start and that we can be that we would have to have any input into because I don't think there is a is there a primary? Do we know? Anybody know? don't know that we can find out. Yeah. Yeah. Something we can find out list about the primaries but um yeah the question is whether there are any candidates that we Yeah. for a primary or whether the incumbents are all who are running will be um unopposed. Um, and and in terms of the mayor's race, the mayor's race, we know the one candidate, I don't know who his opposition will be. Does anybody have any clue about that? I don't No, there there is there are two people that have announced their candidacy for mayel. Oh. Um. Oh, yeah. Okay. Older the older woman. Older woman. Oh. What's her name? Um, Charles. No. Pendelle. Pendell. Yeah. Pendell Charles. I'm sorry. Charles. So, I was right. Okay. Pendal Charles. Yeah. So, she's announced her candidacy. So, I guess there will be Denise. Am I right? My memory is that that she announced it. Yeah. Yeah. So, there will be a primary. I think a young gentleman by the name of Jared. Young A young gentleman by the name of Jared. Yes. Did he pay you to tell you that? Say that.

No. No. Well, I just seen him once, so that's what he looked like to me. He's been around a while. I'm I'm sorry, Denise. He used to be on the housing committee with me when he was an alderman. So, I I I knew him many years ago now. Okay. So, quite a while. So, what are you trying to say, Nancy? He's not as young as I thought he was. Yeah, that's what I'm trying to say. Well, I only seen him one time, so and when I seen him, that's what he appeared to be to me. So, okay. He's back. Okay. He's younger than us. That's for sure. Younger than me and Nancy. Yes. Yes. So, there there will be a primary. So, that may be the time it when we find out when that will be. It's usually in September, I guess. I think that's right. Um, so the question is whether we engaged in this discussion ahead of that or not. I mean, what I I guess what I struggle with is like I wonder if we could write some type of an op-ed just about the whole kind of thing. I guess where I'm struggling with and I kind of hear all of us kind of struggling with this is what's the thing? What's the like you you can give the data, you can give the background, but like what's the what's the ask, right? Like what and I mean, yeah, it's acknowledge that this is a problem. Yeah, it's talk about this on the campaign, but like what's like the one that's what I'm struggling with and that's where I could use some help from others to really think about like if we

as a commission wanted to write a letter and say, hey, it's our role to advise the city on matters of housing and community development and the city has done X, Y, and Z. And the city continues to face challenges A, B, and C. There's then like a there's a one, two, but then what's the three? And that's what I guess I I need some help with is what is that one thing that we might want to say those that are running for mayor ought to do to substantively address this issue? Well, the first thing is acknowledging that it's that it is an issue. Um, and asking them to make it centerpiece of their campaign. That's one thing potentially. I think part of their campaign, I'm not sure centerpiece is the right, you know, there's a lot of issues. I mean, it's important, but um Okay. Yeah, I'll do that if you Well, I mean, semantics semantics aside, I I think Yeah, Nancy, I think that I I I see the point that you're making is maybe that it it's quote just asking them to a commit asking them maybe maybe the ask is quote simply make a commitment a public commitment to make ha uh to address housing in any and all public debates that may help over the course of the election and to address to address

housing comprehensively. I mean, it's how you know affordable, it's it's low income, it's you know, it's not just one thing and homelessness is part of that. I'm sorry, Rich, I think I interrupted to to the extent that we can at least um suggest or request that, you know, candidates consider stating their uh positions. It's also an opportunity to remind them that remind like just raise the awareness of these many issues and this is a time when folks are brainstorming and coming up with platforms. So it's an opportunity that while they they're investing their time and thinking about their vision and their campaign that that this issue may be one that they include and build around. Um not to say that we're it's not our role to push and like we're not a policy team for candidates. Um but we we are for a resource for the city. Uh we all have a vested interest in making sure the city is addressing this. I think encouraging them to consider where their candidacy falls in relation to these topics is is fair and up the middle. But you know to NY's point originally it's make sure we we know exactly where we sit and what what's appropriate and when before the midseptember primaries to give people an opportunity to incorporate this in their platforms. And I think I also want to be real clear that that in my mind's eye at least, we're talking about kind of two separate letters, right? Like there's there's this kind of broader housing is an issue that needs to be talked about in the election letter. But then there's a this other stuff that we're talking about more specifically around the need for increased amounts of low barrier shelter. Right. Okay. So I and that's at least me and I'm welcome I of course welcome any feedback and push back or push back from

others on that. But for me I feel like the ladder about the shelter is quickly going to get down like a rabbit hole. That's not really something that I think would benefit from trying to connect it to this broader housing issue. We know it is. So, so the the low barrier shelter issue is really a subject that we ought to be addressing to the current administration and the current the current city alderman. It's not and the the larger picture is to put in the public domain the whole notion of what the campaign one of the focus one of the items that candidates should focus on. That's the bigger picture that comes later. Does is that what you're saying, Elijah? Yeah, I think so. I think it's it yeah I think it's it it is more broadly what's needed in the course of the campaign is a discussion about housing. I I think that opens the door for a potential conversation around shelter needs. But I don't want those two issues. I don't want the shelter I I I I think we would risk having the shelter issue quickly overdominate the broader point that we're trying to make about housing rich uh at large and I don't want that to happen because there's lot which is why they are to be separate, right? Separate

and timing is the the issue. That's correct. Because the the the the broader housing letter in my mind's eye is going to the is is going to the press, right? Trying to get something in the in the capital or or or else and or elsewhere in the in the banner or somewhere else, right? Um the the the the letter regarding the shelter is more an education and outreach effort at the pragmatic city and county level. Right. Right. It's it's it's not so much a public awareness thing. It's a it's an it's a policy thing and it's current. Correct. Okay. Um, anybody else have any comments about it? I guess seeing the letters would help. I I'm a little confused, but maybe that's just me because I'm it's like we're we're we work we work for the city. I mean, it's like we're not political. And so it it's more about education and and sharing with folks what we've learned and what we know and what we recommend. So I'm not sure that that's a letter to the banner or stuff. I don't know what it is, but you know, well, I I I think I think with respect to that, I think the second letter, the the letter about the let's make sure affordable housing is an issue in the election that it's addressed that it's Yeah. that it's Yeah. Right. Um that's kind of an open letter to to all candidates which we would make which we

would post in the capital or somewhere else. Okay. Um and that's like a later in the summer kind of thing. um before the primaries, well before the prime, well, probably I don't know when exactly, but I don't know what the timing would be exactly, but I think I think that's where the capital and the banner or whatever comes into play. It's kind of an open letter saying this is who we are. This is what we've been doing. This is how the progress we've made, but there's still gaps. and we're here to urge that any candidate should be including this subject as one of their issues. I I'm not these are not the right words, Nancy. I think that's exactly on point and that I do very much see that as a role of us as a commission. Our job is to elevate these issues not only within the elected officials and to consult with staff, but the elected officials and the staff are only able to do what they're able to do with the public's support. And so that comes back on us to really try and get out in front of the elected officials and urge them to go this direction and support the staff as they try and support the elected officials to go and address these issues. Well, I I actually think it's a good time to talk about the comprehensive plan that this has been in the comprehensive plan for a long time and we really need our new elected officials to take it forward because it's we're kind of stuck. We can say it diplomatically, but but you know people nice words in a plan, but if they're not implemented, they're just nice words in a plan. Absolutely. Speaking and speaking of that, Denise and Alexis, we were trying to get a copy of the plan of the of the printed plan and Eric said it

was in the works and I still would love it because I think there's a lot. I mean, I could go through online and look it all up, but I love having something that I can read because there's a lot of good stats in there about housing that we can use and what we do. So, be great to get a copy for the for the um for the commission if we can get that. I don't see a problem with that. I'm sorry. That's okay. Thank you. It's not your fault. No, no, just know that we're still interested. Um so, okay. If we think that this broad letter, the broad I'm going to call we got the narrow letter and the broad letter. The narrow letter comes first and then the broad letter. Those are sort of my that's the way I kind of look at this. Um, does that sound right to you, Elijah? Is that what you're thinking? Okay. So, the narrow letter um letter. I would anticipate being able to maybe circulate something that Rich has helped draft like there's the letter that's been drafted and Rich I don't want to kind of you're the author of it but it it has an element of kind of a one two and so I think you know based on the conversation it may be that Rich maybe we take a look at that draft and kind of isolate the one and isolate the two. Um, but I think we will be able to send something around maybe to this commission, I'd like to think in the next week or two. Um, okay. And that

that can then start kind of to have a little bit of a snowball effect. Um, and yeah, I think a lot of that might be able to be done on email that then maybe when we come back in June, we can or uh wait, it's only it's only April. Uh, sorry, I'm already jumping into May. Um, okay. uh when we come back in May that we can talk talk then and hopefully maybe even have that be a bit of a working session where we try and kind of think through a bit more logistically about how to do some of this and just a a real quick note on kind of where there was two efforts there. Um I think it's actually maybe fair to really limit to the issue and run with that. I've just been broadly thinking about the future and to the extent that there's speculation about increased economic hardship um fluctuations in the market like decreased supply as cost of building goes up I think we could be looking at a situation where this the issues that we are invested in addressing are ex exacerbated um over the next few years while federal federal funding is decreasing. U so I think it's just it may be an appropriate time to start being uh you know proactive and looking ahead and trying to get wheels turning wherever they can turn and thinking about how we how we may be responding to uh situations that degrade over the next couple years. I think you're absolutely right. um don't know exactly how to do that at this point, but I I I think maybe that's a working group uh to Elijah's point to

sit and kind of map out just some some some tactics um behind a broader strategy. And maybe it's it's in over the next, you know, 12 to 18 months. Here's the opportunities that we'll um maybe plan to go and and speak at city council meetings um engage some stakeholders throughout the city. people have to kind of think it through. But I I'd like not to be on our heels dealing with it, you know, without the benefit of 12 months head start at least on the ideation. Smart. Very smart. Okay. So, where we are right now is the the first thing we need to do is see the letter on homelessness and then figure out what to do with that. And then the after that's all done um and hopefully it gets some traction and we can start we'll have that to be to be working on. Um then we start thinking about our position as a um for the future in terms of the bigger picture. Um, and maybe I could do Nancy, I could I I'd be happy to maybe take take the lead on this is maybe just I mean I know it's pretty basic, but just start a Google doc where like I draft a letter or at least draft an outline with a couple of bullet points to kind of get get the thinking going and then share it with us as a commission and we can all just kind of collectively begin to kind of brain dump in there into that and And just it'll be just a a process of go from there. Yeah. of of shining it up and sorting it out and making it take some shape and Yeah. Like you're saying, we'll eventually kind of land somewhere where we think we might actually have

something. Glad you decided you you made that overture. Very glad. Um I because you know we're into the we're sort of into the next item on our agenda which is new business and that is that for the next certainly the next meeting and possibly into the next meeting but I think not. Um I'm not going to be here cuz I I'm having surgery in May. Um, so I'm going to have to have somebody who wants to take the lead to be leading the meeting in May. And I I won't even be able to participate in the meeting in May cuz the surgery will be earlier that Yeah, earlier that week. Um or the week before, I guess. So, I don't I don't think I'm going to be much much good in May. Um, and I'm going to be up in Pittsburgh for that surgery and and the recuperation time. It's back surgery, so it's going to be a while in June. I may still be in Pittsburgh, but I probably will be able to participate. So, do I have somebody to volunteer? I I didn't want to throw it on to Elijah because I mean, you've got your your job in in the real world. Um, Terry, are you interested? Well, I'm going to be doing some traveling in May. I'm just not sure what my schedule's going to be like. Ah, okay. My problem. Um, I'm on team Rich. Rich. Uh, if there's no one else, I'm also going to be on the road. It's not for the leisure, but um with enough uh for planning, I can try to make sure

we work it in. We had the dates. I think I had it um or may There's also there's Patrick, too. I mean, I don't know if he's going to be around, right? But he's on the haka board. Yeah, he's got a lot going on. Yeah, you're right. He's got a lot going on. Yeah. Yeah. It's the 22nd, right? I think that's probably right. Is that the fourth Thursday? It is. Yeah. Okay. So, yeah, my surgery is the 19th, so clearly I'm not going to be involved in the May. No, no, no, no, no, no. Um, it's last day of school. Let's uh catch up offline for Okay. All right. Yeah. And you can conclude me in the conversation. I'll And me as well. I mean, between the three of us, we will. Okay. Between the three, somebody will catch the ball. Okay. Thank you very much. Um All right. Any other new business? I if I can um when when you're putting together your um information um concerning um housing homeless needs um if if you're fine over the next two weeks I can put together some data some information that I can provide to Alexis and Denise that could be forwarded to you as a committee uh wonderful to have as consideration. Um so uh happy to do that. didn't want to interrupt, but you know, since this was open at this point, uh, happy to do that. You know, this is part of what the plan is is having that data. So, uh, that would be, you know, uh, silly not for me to provide that for you while you needed it at this moment. So, happy to do that. Um, so, thank you very much. We definitely appreciate. Sure. Definitely appreciate that. Two

weeks is okay with you guys. Sure. Perfect. Perfect. Perfect. Okay. Anything else we should talk about, guys? Nothing for me. And if nothing from anyone else, I would make a mo u a motion that we adjourn. Is there a second? I'll second it. Thank you all very much. Good luck, Nancy. And yeah, good luck. Oh, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Um I'm hopeful. I'm hopeful I'll be able to walk. That will be the good thing.